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[ESPN] FB Vonta Leach eyes Texans return?

CloakNNNdagger said:
From THE NEW YORK DAILY NEWS:
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It should surprise nobody that the Giants have a serious interest in Vonta. In addition to their compelling need, this was the team who's offer the Texans matched way back when Vonta was a restricted FA. Granted, that's been six years ago, but Jerry Reese and Tom Coughlin are both around now, just as they were in 2007.

Still, I'm not liking the odds of him being either a Texan or a Giant in 2013. If I'm wrong, it will be far from the first (or last) time, but I'm thinking unless one of the two decide they want to free up some additional cap room for Vonta, he'll be a Dolphin by the end of the week. That just doesn't strike me as the Giants way of doing business, and while I love Vonta, I don't love him enough to want the Texans to push current cap dollars to future years in order to resign him.
 
Due to the Dolphins cap space, Leach is allowing a bidding war that the Texans don't need to engage in. He won't be coming to Houston.
 
IIRC, the Giants wanted him back in 06. I think they even signed him to an offer sheet before he re-signed with the Texans. It'd be nice if he shunned them again.
 
Some believe that the Ravens are waiting in the wings for if Leach finds that things out there in FA are not all that great.

Hello again, Vonta?

The Ravens are still quietly monitoring the situation with former fullback Vonta Leach. The Miami Dolphins appear to be the frontrunner for Leach, with the Houston Texans and Tennessee Titans also in contention.

But if the Dolphins were offering such an attractive package, Leach would have signed by now. The Ravens reportedly offered Leach a contact worth $2 million and loaded with incentives, but those close to Leach don't believe those incentives were realistic for him to reach.
Leach was expected to make $3 million this season before the Ravens recently cut him.
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http://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/ravens/bs-sp-preston-ravens-column-0622-20130621,0,7205386.column?page=2&track=rss#ixzz2X9864r47
 
srrono said:
I would perfer HOU to sign a vet LB or NT but if a signing had to be a ex Texan RT Winston would be my #1 target.
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As much as I've griped about Winston, I'd much rather see the Texans sign him than Leach. It would be money much better spent, imho. I can't think of an ILB that piques my interest as much.
 
DocBar said:
As much as I've griped about Winston, I'd much rather see the Texans sign him than Leach. It would be money much better spent, imho. I can't think of an ILB that piques my interest as much.
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I don't understand.

Just because the Texans signed Greg Jones, why couldn't they sign Leach and Winston???

If there is guaranteed money for Jones I would kinda get it, with regards to signing Leach. I didn't realize there was guaranteed money for him. If not, sign all three with modest contracts and cut 1, 2 or all three if necessary.

If there is no "guaranteed" money, the Texans aren't required to pay them a dime as it relates to the salary cap...

Winston and Leach both understand that they made way more than the market value for their worth (and I'm sure they both expected to come back to Earth) with modest contracts.
 
Texan_Bill said:
I don't understand.

Just because the Texans signed Greg Jones, why couldn't they sign Leach and Winston???

If there is guaranteed money for Jones I would kinda get it, with regards to signing Leach. I didn't realize there was guaranteed money for him. If not, sign all three with modest contracts and cut 1, 2 or all three if necessary.

If there is no "guaranteed" money, the Texans aren't required to pay them a dime as it relates to the salary cap...

Winston and Leach both understand that they made way more than the market value for their worth (and I'm sure they both expected to come back to Earth) with modest contracts.
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The Texans are less than $3 mil under the cap. There are still rookies left to sign. The Texans are in cap hell. Screw Leach and sign a more productive player, both in % of plays and overall ability to help the team right now.

Leach is a marginal upgrade over Clutts, not a clear cut better player. Winston is better than anyone that's healthy right now.

Personally I'd rather sign neither, especially Leach. If we have to burn cap space, RT is a much more pressing need than FB. FB might play 40% of the offensive snaps. Winston could come in and play 100% of the snaps and be a temporary upgrade that allows a newer player to adjust to the NFL.

Winston might actually be the easier player to sign to a short term, incentive-laden contract, also. His familiarity with the Texans' system also trumps Leach, imo.

Lastly, Leach still has a SB ring and Winston is coming off of a year with the Chiefs. where he got cut from a sad-sack, relatively unproductive, OL. Leverage.
 
DocBar said:
The Texans are less than $3 mil under the cap. There are still rookies left to sign. The Texans are in cap hell. Screw Leach and sign a more productive player, both in % of plays and overall ability to help the team right now.

Leach is a marginal upgrade over Clutts, not a clear cut better player. Winston is better than anyone that's healthy right now.

Personally I'd rather sign neither, especially Leach. If we have to burn cap space, RT is a much more pressing need than FB. FB might play 40% of the offensive snaps. Winston could come in and play 100% of the snaps and be a temporary upgrade that allows a newer player to adjust to the NFL.

Winston might actually be the easier player to sign to a short term, incentive-laden contract, also. His familiarity with the Texans' system also trumps Leach, imo.

Lastly, Leach still has a SB ring and Winston is coming off of a year with the Chiefs. where he got cut from a sad-sack, relatively unproductive, OL. Leverage.
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You're missing my point. OR Maybe I have it wrong.

As long as a contract doesn't have guaranteed money, you can sign anyone you want, irrespective of the cap. Then you can cut or make any roster moves you need to make "rookies" signed including those with no guaranteed money.

Apparently I have that all wrong and will defer to you.
 
Texan_Bill said:
You're missing my point. OR Maybe I have it wrong.

As long as a contract doesn't have guaranteed money, you can sign anyone you want, irrespective of the cap. Then you can cut or make any roster moves you need to make "rookies" signed including those with no guaranteed money.

Apparently I have that all wrong and will defer to you.
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As far as I know, signing a player affects the cap. The way it's structured affects how much it affects the cap and when, including guaranteed money(which is due if you cut the player and affects the cap the most). I do not, in any way, shape or form, pretend to even remotely understand the salary cap.

I do not think that either Leach or Winston would sign anything, at all, that had no guarantees in it. It's mho that Winston would be the wiser signing of the two, regardless of how much I've griped about Winston's play at RT.
 
DocBar said:
The Texans are in cap hell.
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This is NOT cap hell.

If we need space to sign someone, we can make more room. Extending Antonio Smith is an example. We can't afford to sign someone to a BIG contract, but we've got enough room to play.

And just signing someone doesn't count against the cap in the preseason. Only the top 50* contracts count. Signing one player may push another player out of the top 50 and so you just add the DIFFERENCE in their contracts to our cap number, you don't add that person's whole salary. And if they're not in the top 50, you don't count them at all.

* I believe it's 50. If it's not 50, it's close to 50.

There are 4 or 5 teams with less cap money than we have at this point.
 
The Pencil Neck said:
This is NOT cap hell.

If we need space to sign someone, we can make more room. Extending Antonio Smith is an example. We can't afford to sign someone to a BIG contract, but we've got enough room to play.

And just signing someone doesn't count against the cap in the preseason. Only the top 50* contracts count. Signing one player may push another player out of the top 50 and so you just add the DIFFERENCE in their contracts to our cap number, you don't add that person's whole salary. And if they're not in the top 50, you don't count them at all.

* I believe it's 50. If it's not 50, it's close to 50.

There are 4 or 5 teams with less cap money than we have at this point.
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Good post! Only one small revision..........it's The Top 51 Rule.
 
I had a dream that we signed Leach and he got hurt....

No real meaning to it I guess, but I figured this was a good place to share...
 
Rey said:
I had a dream that we signed Leach and he got hurt....

No real meaning to it I guess, but I figured this was a good place to share...
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You, my friend, are ready for some football lol. Maybe the fact this thread is nine pages about a FB we really don't need has crept into your subconscience, heh.
 
DocBar said:
The Texans are less than $3 mil under the cap. There are still rookies left to sign. The Texans are in cap hell. Screw Leach and sign a more productive player, both in % of plays and overall ability to help the team right now.

Leach is a marginal upgrade over Clutts, not a clear cut better player. Winston is better than anyone that's healthy right now.

Personally I'd rather sign neither, especially Leach. If we have to burn cap space, RT is a much more pressing need than FB. FB might play 40% of the offensive snaps. Winston could come in and play 100% of the snaps and be a temporary upgrade that allows a newer player to adjust to the NFL.

Winston might actually be the easier player to sign to a short term, incentive-laden contract, also. His familiarity with the Texans' system also trumps Leach, imo.

Lastly, Leach still has a SB ring and Winston is coming off of a year with the Chiefs. where he got cut from a sad-sack, relatively unproductive, OL. Leverage.
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Toward first bolded comment, I think it is would Winston be better than anyone on roster in September not now. Last year's starter is supposedly going to be ready by game one. Williams also healthy could be equal to Winston quickly, he is that good. I will go on a limb & say Quessenbury could be better than Winston by end of season so I am in no hurry to sign anyone. Barring injuries later, no team appears to be in a panic to sign him.

Bolded comment #2 if Winston was willing to sign a short term, incentive laden contract, why has he not said so?

OBTW, if Eric is familiar with system, would not Leach be also? Forgot to bold that one.
 
DocBar said:
The Texans are less than $3 mil under the cap. There are still rookies left to sign. The Texans are in cap hell. Screw Leach and sign a more productive player, both in % of plays and overall ability to help the team right now.

Leach is a marginal upgrade over Clutts, not a clear cut better player. Winston is better than anyone that's healthy right now.

Personally I'd rather sign neither, especially Leach. If we have to burn cap space, RT is a much more pressing need than FB. FB might play 40% of the offensive snaps. Winston could come in and play 100% of the snaps and be a temporary upgrade that allows a newer player to adjust to the NFL.

Winston might actually be the easier player to sign to a short term, incentive-laden contract, also. His familiarity with the Texans' system also trumps Leach, imo.

Lastly, Leach still has a SB ring and Winston is coming off of a year with the Chiefs. where he got cut from a sad-sack, relatively unproductive, OL. Leverage.
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The Texans are nowhere near "cap hell". That is a term generally used for teams that owe a lot of dead money on players no longer on the roster. Are they in great shape, obviously not, but "cap hell" is an exaggeration.

Leach is an All-Pro. Clutts is a journeyman. They are not close in terms of talent.

If Winston had anything left someone would have already signed him. His pass blocking abilities were declining drastically while he was still in Houston and there's a good reason why he was cut from one of the NFL's worst teams.

Neither one of these guys will be back. Both are too proud to take a vet min. contract which is about all the Texans are looking for at this point, if anything. Barring a major injury the opening day players are already on the roster.
 
Just had to post this, just for his quote at the end if nothing more.

"Rowland is my home, Rowland always will be my home, it's always a really special place in my heart," said Leach.

And he couldn't be more excited to hold his first fundraiser in North Carolina in the county where he grew up. More than 300 people turned out in Lumberton Friday evening for a casino night at the Southeastern North Carolina Agricultural Center. All proceeds from the event went to the Vonta Leach Foundation, which was started by Leach in 2006. The foundation provides scholarships for local students and other youth activities.

Leach also invited more than 20 other pro football players to mingle with guests, so they could see how they're all just everyday guys. Joe Flacco, Michael Oher, and Ray Rice were just a few among the star-studded guest list.

"Just for people to interact with the guys, without helmets on, just to see what kind of person that they are, seeing that football players are just normal everyday guys, just to mingle with them and just have a conversation," he said.

And because he considers himself an everyday guy, Leach makes sure he helps others get to the top as well.

"If I don't help somebody else get to the next level, then it didn't do me any good just to be where I am today," said Leach. "You have to lift somebody as you climb; as I go higher up, I have to reach back and lift somebody up, for the cycle to continue."
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link

This is the type of player that is what we would like to believe "Texans prototype."
 
Leach still isn't signed holding out for a multi-year contract.

Now today, the Cowboys have released Vickers. It's important to know that Vickers is coming off of back surgery this offseason.
 
CloakNNNdagger said:
Leach still isn't signed holding out for a multi-year contract.

Now today, the Cowboys have released Vickers. It's important to know that Vickers is coming off of back surgery this offseason.
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So Leach wears a star now. Don't think the K'boys can afford him, can they?
 
drs23 said:
So Leach wears a star now. Don't think the K'boys can afford him, can they?
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Even though the Girls don't have a FB on the roster, I think they've spent their wad on promising TEs to go with Witten...........a 2nd rounder, a 2nd year vet FA and another vet FA (don't remember their names). They're probably going to go the route of the failed Casey experiment.
 
CloakNNNdagger said:
Even though the Girls don't have a FB on the roster, I think they've spent their wad on promising TEs to go with Witten...........a 2nd rounder, a 2nd year vet FA and another vet FA (don't remember their names). They're probably going to go the route of the failed Casey experiment.
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Gavin Escobar, San Diego State. He was considered the 3rd/4th best TE talent in the 13 class. In the end he will be Witten's replacement, nearly 6'6" 257 with frame to tack on another 10 easy can run like the wind, shift on the line (which Cowboys embrace) with huge catching radius. To go with Terrance Williams both I had rated higher than Frederick but what difference does that make now or what order they got them all in first three rounds. Plus they bolstered secondary with an excellent safety prospect in Wilcox then a fav of mine @ CB BW Webb. Adding Joseph was a steal. Overall too much focus on their #1 overall selection.

Vonta would help OL protection for Romo, good pick up if true.
 
drs23 said:
So Leach wears a star now. Don't think the K'boys can afford him, can they?
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They're about $10MM under the cap this year, so they could afford him for one year if they wanted to, but they're already about $20MM over the projected cap next year. Plus, as has already been mentioned, they want to use their TE's more and probably don't need an expensive FB like Leach.
 
ESPN

The Ravens released Leach last month when the sides couldn't come to terms on reducing his $3 million salary this year. But the Ravens reportedly have a standing offer of $2 million plus incentives.
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I guess the free market wasn't as kindly paying as Vonta thought it would be.

Shame would have loved to see him a Texan again.
 
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