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DW4 Traded to Cleveland

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Lucky said:
Do you have a quote?
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I could've swore I read this somewhere when Caserio was talking to the Panthers about Burns/Chinn. Said he wanted a couple of young players on their rookie contracts and three 1st rd picks. Might have been on Joe Ellis twitter.
 
Htown Legend said:
I think you’re on the right track- from what I interpreted from Aaron Wilson though, is that Deshaun hasn’t waived his no trade clause at all. But he’s willing to meet with these teams(NO, CAR, ATL, CLE). Each team has already put together a package of picks/players that Nick would be willing to accept. That was the requirement to allow Deshaun to meet with said teams. It’s ultimately Deshaun’s choice where he goes. But for each team he meets with, there’s the foundation of a trade already in place
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Yes I understand that Aaron got this from Ian Rapoport whom I heard on the radio today in a repeat of what he said earlier that supports your point of view. The radio host however were saying that they did not believe that Caserio would give the final choice on the team to Watson which is my belief.

Host " Saints, Deshaun wants to go to your team but Brown have made an extra round 2 available that I want you to match before I send DW to you. "

I am hopeful that our GM was able to forcefully say 'Watson we're not going to send you to a team you don't want to go to but we need the most back that we can get.'
 
The1ApplePie said:
Still kind of weird to see a fanbase being so hyped to trade the best QB in their history, and probably the 3rd or 4th best player in franchise history. Dude needs to go, obviously, but there was an undercurrent of that before all the sex stuff.
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Because he's not as good as some on this MB think he is. He's slightly above avg. Then you throw in the fact that he's a Sexual Predator and it's time for another team, (Sucker) to take him off of the Calhoun's hands.

If Caserio is able to hit on the majority of these picks the Calhoun's will be in a much better place than having Derrick and his albatross 156 mil contract.
 
Speedy said:
Well, that's all on Watson. Before the sex stuff, he's the one who said he wanted out, 4 months after signing a mega deal. He may be right in that the Texans were a horrible organization that he didn't want to work for, but if that's the case, he knew that before taking their money. Sucks for us fans, but **** him.
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It wont suck if Caserio makes a great trade and hits on these picks.
 
ArlingtonTexan said:
Everything in print has talked actual offers, versus kinda sort of offers. Either way, the Texans are not just playing the auction game with four teams.
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Yeah, that’s why I found it interesting. TBH it didn’t sound right to me that the Texans were looking at actual offers. Why would they not leave them fungible until they agree on something? So to me it sounds like they are playing the auction game and a little poker too. The parameters set the ante that they all agree to before the auction game begins.
 
cdollaz said:
Yeah, I would rather they sit, and pay him than to let him make a chump out of them. If he wants to screw the team over, then they can screw his career over and he can sit on his ass for the peak years of his career.
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Yep, if I couldn't get the trade I wanted, I would sit Derrick down and say, look this is a 3 yr rebuild at the least. I've got no problem paying you to do nothing for these 3 yrs. So either take the best trade for us, or be prepared to sit for the next 3 yrs. Calhoun's got the money to do this, it will really come down to how pizzed Calhoun is over this situation. The cap is the cap, so be holding onto him you really wont be losing any money. You will lose the ability to bring in FA's but that's a small price to pay to screw over Derrick/Mulaghetta/Avery and the rest of Derrick's crew.

This is what playing hardball looks like.
 
KA4Texan said:
Well, I liked the guy and was excited to see if he would live up to his potential.

Then he got sand in his vagina and cried like organization refused to give lower massages and tried to force their hand
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Forced their hand or their fingers?
 
Texian said:
IDK what was promised but Cal did apologize to DW4. I don't think he was apologizing for nothing.
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He was apologizing for being an idiot. Something Calhoun has vast experience being.

Calhoun should be apologizing to the fans for putting his team in this position. BTW, this upcoming trade will help decide whether I hold onto the tickets. Wife said she wants to start going to the games again.
 
GanadoUHCoog said:
Lots of moving and shaking going on here it seems. My wild prediction - he picks the Falcons and the Falcons turn and trade Ryan to the Colts for a 2nd in 2022 (#42). That gives Atlanta #8, #42, #43, #58. We take #8, #42, #58, and their 2023 and 2024 1st round picks and CB AJ Terrell. No Kyle Pitts. In the 2022 NFL draft we'd have #3, #8, #37, #42, #58, #68. 6 picks in the top 68 plus 2 future 1s and a stud young CB that would have 3 years left on his rookie deal if we exercise his 5th year option. That should jump start us! The more I think about it, I feel Atlanta has the most to offer us besides Carolina. NO has the sorriest first round pick to give us in 2022 so that is inevitably what we will get because #Texans lol.
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I'm not sure that a clustering of picks in 1 Draft is such a good idea. In the end, all the rookie contracts ending at the same time could be a difficult road to navigate, potentially a huge detriment to the team's future salary cap. I believe Caserio will take that into consideration. You don't want all of your dozen plus players coming to the feeding table at the same time.
 
badboy said:
Yes I understand that Aaron got this from Ian Rapoport whom I heard on the radio today in a repeat of what he said earlier that supports your point of view. The radio host however were saying that they did not believe that Caserio would give the final choice on the team to Watson which is my belief.

Host " Saints, Deshaun wants to go to your team but Brown have made an extra round 2 available that I want you to match before I send DW to you. "

I am hopeful that our GM was able to forcefully say 'Watson we're not going to send you to a team you don't want to go to but we need the most back that we can get.'
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Be aware that most all of Wilson's "information" up to now has come strictly from Hardin/Watson. Let's not forget that Wilson was fired from the Houston Chronicle because he carried Watson's water to a ridiculous extent. Things have not changed. Beware of what you accept in his writings/speakings.
 
CloakNNNdagger said:
I'm not sure that a clustering of picks in 1 Draft is such a good idea. In the end, all the rookie contracts ending at the same time could be a difficult road to navigate, potentially a huge detriment to the team's future salary cap. I believe Caserio will take that into consideration. You don't want all of your dozen plus players coming to the feeding table at the same time.
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Well, the 1st round guys you will have 5th year options on, so they can be the last to be extended. Out of the other 4 picks, you just stagger their extensions. You decide which one or two are the best long term options, and you extend them in year 3. The others, you wait to see if they are going to be worth keeping, and extend them at the end of year 3 or sometime in their contract year.
 
vtech9 said:
Well, the 1st round guys you will have 5th year options on, so they can be the last to be extended. Out of the other 4 picks, you just stagger their extensions. You decide which one or two are the best long term options, and you extend them in year 3. The others, you wait to see if they are going to be worth keeping, and extend them at the end of year 3 or sometime in their contract year.
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It's those 1st round guys coming due all at once that's the concern.
 
The1ApplePie said:
Still kind of weird to see a fanbase being so hyped to trade the best QB in their history, and probably the 3rd or 4th best player in franchise history. Dude needs to go, obviously, but there was an undercurrent of that before all the sex stuff.
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Not to rehash history but there were some of us who did not think Watson was as good as the extended contract would cost Houston and this was before the contract was signed. I pushed for him to play his fourth contract year and then towards the end of it deciding whether to offer him the big bucks even going into the 5th Year if necessary. I think he is a very good quarterback but did not see him as top five.
 
Dejaview said:
According to NFL live today it doesn’t sound like the Texans are getting trade offers at this point. They only allow DW to talk to a team after they convey their trade parameters. The details are yet to be worked out.
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Yes. My opinion: in parameters only.
 
A team like Atlanta who would be basically going all in by trading for Watson might consider emptying the wallet and offering more if the Texans would part with Cooks as well.
I'm not familiar with Cooks contract, so it's possible that trading him would be a non starter.
 
GanadoUHCoog said:
Lots of moving and shaking going on here it seems. My wild prediction - he picks the Falcons and the Falcons turn and trade Ryan to the Colts for a 2nd in 2022 (#42). That gives Atlanta #8, #42, #43, #58. We take #8, #42, #58, and their 2023 and 2024 1st round picks and CB AJ Terrell. No Kyle Pitts. In the 2022 NFL draft we'd have #3, #8, #37, #42, #58, #68. 6 picks in the top 68 plus 2 future 1s and a stud young CB that would have 3 years left on his rookie deal if we exercise his 5th year option. That should jump start us! The more I think about it, I feel Atlanta has the most to offer us besides Carolina. NO has the sorriest first round pick to give us in 2022 so that is inevitably what we will get because #Texans lol.
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I liked where you were going with the trade until you allowed Atlanta to keep the extra round two.

8, 42, 43, 58 Atl round 1s 2023 and 24 plus Terrell is slightly less if Panthers offer Chinn and Burns. 43 and 44 would more than cover two spots up but two defensive starters to one CB? Not enough for me. Then considering where the future round ones fall.

I am just not at the take it before it disappears yet.
 
michaelm said:
A team like Atlanta who would be basically going all in by trading for Watson might consider emptying the wallet and offering more if the Texans would part with Cooks as well.
I'm not familiar with Cooks contract, so it's possible that trading him would be a non starter.
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His base salary would transfer to receiving team however said Team could and probably would renegotiate his deal to lower the cap hit. I would truly love to move Cook's however he is a good security blanket for Davis Mills.
 
A pre-Grand Jury decision interesting article written by the man who gave Michael Vick his "second chance."

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Joe Banner March 8, 2022
Deshaun Watson Is Most Likely To Land With This Team


In 2009, we signed Michael Vick after he was incarcerated for 21 months and suspended by the league. Prior to doing so, we had two criteria that needed to happen for us to be open to making a deal with Vick: First, he needed to have paid for crimes, which he did through serving time in federal prison and being suspended by the league. Second, we had to be confident that he would not commit future crimes or re-offend.

After speaking to Vick and numerous other people, we were comfortable that he had paid for his crimes, and we were confident that he would not be involved in further inappropriate behavior.

Deshaun Watson’s situation is different from Vick’s. First of all, the crimes he is accused of are even more egregious. Watson also has not faced any real retribution for what he did. Though he sat out all of the 2021 season, he was paid $10.54M by the Texans.

To be clear, the accusations against Watson are repugnant. From an ethical standpoint and based on team culture, I do not believe I would acquire Watson if I were sitting in the decision maker’s seat. But it’s hard to say that definitively without sitting in that seat and having all of the information. If guilty, no team in the NFL should engage in discussions to acquire him. And without confidence in the criminal charges being resolved, I would absolutely not trade for him.

For those in the league who don’t view the situation as I do, the purpose of this story is to discuss their thought process and where Watson may end up. I do believe Watson will be traded and will play in the NFL, but I don’t know what the league is going to do. The league could let it play out legally and then take further action based on that. At some point though, based on past precedent, Watson is going to be suspended. It is just a question of how long.

Here are four criteria that have to be met for any team to pursue the QB:
  1. Whether there’s a real chance of him going to jail has to be off the table.
  2. The team must feel confident that he didn’t do what he is accused of or they need reason to be positive it won’t happen again.
  3. The team has to be able to deal with the financial implications.
  4. The team has to be able to deal with the PR implications of acquiring him.

Under his current contract, the timing of Watson’s guaranteed money triggering on March 22nd presents a complication. That is, Watson’s $20M P5 Base Salary and his $17M Roster Bonus in 2023 both become fully guaranteed then. If he is not suspended, the acquiring team would be obligated to pay the $37M. If he is suspended, the guarantees in his contract would void, and either Houston or the team acquiring Watson would not be obligated to pay the $37M. Alternatively, in negotiating the trade, Houston could agree to pay part of the $37M (if it is still guaranteed by then).

This leads to all kinds of questions like can you get enough answers by March 22nd? Is Houston willing to pay part of the $37M and assume some of the risk? Will the $37M still be guaranteed when the trade takes place? Will teams negotiate a trade with less compensation but things added to it based on milestones?

Unless Houston can get multiple real bidders, the trade will likely involve conditional picks. To address the fact that we may not have all the answers to the questions about the criminal case, civil case, and league suspension, there is a possibility of a base trade with contingent compensation added based on the outcomes.

We also shouldn’t assume that the list of teams that he wouldn’t go to last year is the same as the list that he wouldn’t go to this year. There are multiple teams that are researching this; there are multiple teams using people directly and indirectly to try to recruit him. Even if those reports were true last year, that list has likely changed. There are different coaches, different qualities of rosters, and different things that may motivate him at this point. Or, he may just have to be more flexible to get out of Houston.

Let’s take a look at which teams need QBs and the likelihood they would be able to trade for Watson, starting with the teams that are unlikely…

Unlikely Suitors

Colts: They have the money and cap room (6th most, $42.48M). They have the need for a quarterback. They’re obviously willing to be aggressive, as they were with Wentz. However, they probably don’t have the draft ammunition and historically they don’t appear to have the personality to do something like this. It would appear that they would need to make trades, potentially including some of their top players, to acquire sufficient draft capital. Also, it’s unlikely Houston would trade Watson within the division.

Commanders: I think Washington would be extremely interested, but it’s hard to picture how a team under the eye of the federal government for the way it has treated women can engage in trading for Deshaun Watson. And they now supposedly have the wife of the owner basically running the day-to-day operation. Making a major move like this would make it look like they’re not learning from their mistakes. There literally could be legal consequences and ownership consequences to the investigations regarding Washington.

Dolphins: Miami appears to have taken themselves out of contention, which I think is a mistake on their part.

Giants: New York has said they will give Daniel Jones this season to prove himself under new HC Brian Daboll. They’re not going to make a move for another QB; they’re going to try to put Jones in a position to succeed.

Buccaneers: Tampa Bay is unlikely because of the cap situation and because of how many UFAs they will try to bring back. They’re also clinging onto hope Brady won’t retire.

Seahawks: Although the Russell Wilson trade has given Seattle the ammunition to trade for Watson, the fact that they traded a high-quality QB and are a run-first team makes it unlikely they will end up trading for Deshaun.

Vikings: Minnesota has the need, but they are not in great financial shape (projected $15M over the cap, which is 4th worst). New HC Kevin O’Connell worked with Cousins in Washington for one year, and he has been very positive about Kirk.

Browns: They’re a possibility, in spite of their public comments about Baker Mayfield. It is reasonable to assume they are looking to upgrade the position if an opportunity would present itself. They could be a sleeper in this situation.

Texans: The irony is that the team that needs him the most is Houston. I would not be surprised at all if Lovie Smith is doing the best he can to convince Watson it’s a new era in Houston. I would imagine Lovie is making a pitch to Deshaun to stay for at least one more year and give them another chance.

Real Possibilities

This leaves us with two teams that have the need and the resources. Both of these teams appear to be willing to take on the risks that are associated with acquiring Watson.

Panthers: Carolina is the second most likely team. We know they had conversations last year, and we know there was interest. They need a QB, and they have money available (even with Sam Darnold’s Fifth-Year Option of $18.858M). Obviously, even though they haven’t made good decisions, their actions indicate that they’re putting a huge premium on getting a really good quarterback. Fitterer has also been aggressive in the trade market.

The Panthers have some valuable weapons, including McCaffrey, Anderson, Moore, and Marshall. Although they have major needs on the offensive line, they seem to know that. They probably think they’re closer to winning than I think they would be with Watson. Ultimately though, they could come up a little short on the necessary draft capital.

Eagles: This leaves us with the Philadelphia Eagles, who are the most likely landing spot for Watson. Philly has three first-round picks this year: their own pick, Miami’s first from the trade-up for Waddle, and the Colts first from the Wentz trade. They can create the cap room—perhaps not as easily as other teams, but they have the capital to do it. They will, however, want to restructure Watson’s deal a little bit, so the short-term cap numbers are a little bit lower.

The Eagles are clearly a team that recognizes if you’re going to win big, you need to have a great quarterback. They selected Donovan McNabb with the second pick in 1999. They signed Michael Vick. They traded and later re-signed Carson Wentz. They even took Jalen Hurts with a second-round pick. Their team-building philosophy fits. There are teams that will do whatever it takes to get a great QB, and there are others that will not acquiesce if the QB costs too much. The Eagles fall into the former category. They will be aggressive. They have the capital to do it and an owner who’s shown over time the willingness to spend the money if it matters enough. Plus, by the time Watson realizes how few options he actually has given the circumstances, he will think of Philly as more desirable than he thought a year ago.

The Eagles’ effusiveness and the degree of their enthusiasm about Hurts at the Combine could be an indicator that the team is trying to maximize the trade value of the player. I do not believe the Eagles would trade Hurts under other circumstances, unless it was for a high-quality QB. With Watson, they’d be getting a top 5 to top 7 QB for $34M APY. If he were up for an extension right now, he’d get at least $45-47M. I can’t think of an example of a player of this caliber being traded.

Again, I am not advocating that a team should trade for Watson. I am merely presenting what teams may be doing to evaluate this situation and who is most likely to acquire him.
 
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CloakNNNdagger said:
Be aware that most all of Wilson's "information" up to now has come strictly from Hardin/Watson. Let's not forget that Wilson was fired from the Houston Chronicle because he carried Watson's water to a ridiculous extent. Things have not changed. Beware of what you accept in his writings/speakings.
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Totally agree but I consider all the other sources in the same light. Something to read but not necessarily sink money into.
Edit and as I did say Wilson as I understood it got his information from nfl.com Ian Rapoport.
 
vtech9 said:
Well, the 1st round guys you will have 5th year options on, so they can be the last to be extended. Out of the other 4 picks, you just stagger their extensions. You decide which one or two are the best long term options, and you extend them in year 3. The others, you wait to see if they are going to be worth keeping, and extend them at the end of year 3 or sometime in their contract year.
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Exactly give me 32 first-round picks and I'll worry about how I pay for it.
 
michaelm said:
A team like Atlanta who would be basically going all in by trading for Watson might consider emptying the wallet and offering more if the Texans would part with Cooks as well.
I'm not familiar with Cooks contract, so it's possible that trading him would be a non starter.
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I don't know if the contract would be a problem. It would put more dead money on the books ($7.5 million), but still save $8.7 million on the cap. The problem is that Cooks has stated that he doesn't want to be traded, and has threatened retirement if traded without his consent.

Brandin on the Block? Could Houston Texans Trade Their Best Player in WR Cooks? - Sports Illustrated Houston Texans News, Analysis and More
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"Cooks said at the close of last season that he didn’t want to be traded unless it’s with his approval and involvement. And Cooks emphasized that he doesn’t want to be traded.

“I said I won't be traded if I'm not involved,” Cooks said. “I'm all-in on this thing. It would be pretty special to be a part of something that's turned around. How that looks, I don't know. I've got to trust that."
 
GanadoUHCoog said:
Lots of moving and shaking going on here it seems. My wild prediction - he picks the Falcons and the Falcons turn and trade Ryan to the Colts for a 2nd in 2022 (#42). That gives Atlanta #8, #42, #43, #58. We take #8, #42, #58, and their 2023 and 2024 1st round picks and CB AJ Terrell. No Kyle Pitts. In the 2022 NFL draft we'd have #3, #8, #37, #42, #58, #68. 6 picks in the top 68 plus 2 future 1s and a stud young CB that would have 3 years left on his rookie deal if we exercise his 5th year option. That should jump start us! The more I think about it, I feel Atlanta has the most to offer us besides Carolina. NO has the sorriest first round pick to give us in 2022 so that is inevitably what we will get because #Texans lol.
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This is how I see it. Plus, as I mentioned earlier, Watson tends to make decisions based on emotion. He'll want to play for his home team and be near his mother, which would be a needed contrast to the hostile environment he's leaving. He was already on good terms with the ownership.
 
Texian said:
IDK what was promised but Cal did apologize to DW4. I don't think he was apologizing for nothing.
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Aaron Wilson, as we found out later Watson's waterboy, put out that story, and others ran with it. He never specified that he apologized for not letting him choose the GM or HC. Wilson wrote, "McNair reached out to quarterback Deshaun Watson privately and apologized for the uneasiness that has transpired this early in the offseason. "

Watson definitely had "input" to the HC (Bieniemy), but he chose to walk away before the final decision. Tepper offered him opportunity to choose the next HC. That's crazy on its surface alone. But no owner in his right mind would allow a player to choose his own GM. The apology was generic for the mess that was going on, and strictly an attempt to pacify Watson and cool the fire that was burning out of hand.............a fire that Watson created all by his lonesome.
 
michaelm said:
A team like Atlanta who would be basically going all in by trading for Watson might consider emptying the wallet and offering more if the Texans would part with Cooks as well.
I'm not familiar with Cooks contract, so it's possible that trading him would be a non starter.
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It'd be foolish to get rid of Cooks. He's part of the solution and is exactly the kind of player we want.
 
badboy said:
Totally agree but I consider all the other sources in the same light. Something to read but not necessarily sink money into.
Edit and as I did say Wilson as I understood it got his information from nfl.com Ian Rapoport.
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And where do you think most of the pro Watson deals are ultimately coming from?
 
Lucky said:
I don't know if the contract would be a problem. It would put more dead money on the books ($7.5 million), but still save $8.7 million on the cap. The problem is that Cooks has stated that he doesn't want to be traded, and has threatened retirement if traded without his consent.



"Cooks said at the close of last season that he didn’t want to be traded unless it’s with his approval and involvement. And Cooks emphasized that he doesn’t want to be traded.

“I said I won't be traded if I'm not involved,” Cooks said. “I'm all-in on this thing. It would be pretty special to be a part of something that's turned around. How that looks, I don't know. I've got to trust that."
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I could see him following Watson who would prolong Cook's career
 
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