Duane Brown traded to Seahawks

[Double Barrel]

Already explained this in another post above. What it comes down to is trust. For as timid and blind of a runner Miller is, he’s a vet, surehanded and BoB trusts him. Foreman’s a rookie that had issues with ball security in college and has already fumbled once in a crucial situation this season.

You also don’t want to get in the habit of running your qb to pick up tough yardage. Passing the ball potentially stops the clock if it’s incomplete.

Yep. If he chooses pass and it's incomplete or intercepted, people will eat his lunch for calling a pass play in a run situation. If they had it off to Foreman and he fumbles, they ***** that he should have given it to the veteran Miller.

O'Brien accepted the blame. I'm okay with that, because he knows how it goes. Failure is on the head coach, success is on the players. He gets it. It's no sweat off his back if fans blame him for the loss, too. He's already beaten us to the punch.

Funny thing is if Brady had been intercepted and/or they had gotten a first down in Seattle, then O'Brien is getting praise.

 

[Mr teX]

Seattle had 3 timeouts and was instantly jumping them. In another context that argument might make sense but not this one.

And it still doesn't explain running up the middle.

U don’t want to be running lateral to the LOS on crucial 1st down attempts when the defense knows u want to run it...that’s the quickest way to get behind the sticks. Hand the ball off on a quick running play and attempt to push the pile. No quicker running play to the rb than straight up the middle. Furthermore I doubt BoB cared if it was up the middle or wherever as long as the Rb got north and south quickly.

Having said all this, I have zero doubt that BoB and the offense do it differently if this situation presents itself for a 3rd time. We’ll likely see one of those safe “pass” plays like we saw with Braxton Miller in the Cleveland game.

 

[Mollywhopper]

Maybe someone earlier in the thread has already said this, but given that I thought Brown was only worth a 3rd round pick, I think we made out like a bandit on this deal.

3rd and a 5th this year, plus a 2nd next year? Rick Smith should be able to turn all that into a 2nd for this year, if he wants to.

I think we give up a 5th this year. Seattle will likely pick late so I don't think we could quite use these assets to get into the 2nd.

With the 2019 2nd being conventionally thought to be worth roughly a 2018 3rd, means we basically traded Duane Brown and a 2018 5th for two 2018 3rd's in terms of ammo for next year's draft ... should we so choose to use it that way.

Assuming Seattle finishes in the final eight this year, and given a couple of different trade value charts (link1, link2), seems we could get anywhere from the 58th (late 2nd) to the 72nd (high 3rd) pick in trade for our new assets. And so, if the goal is to load up for a 2018 move upward, the final tally would be Duane Brown and a 2018 5th for a 2018 late 2nd-early 3rd.

Yes, given the very fluid amount of information at hand (where Seattle ends up, value of picks from one year to next, trade value chart accuracy, actual draft participants, etc) this isn't the most spot-on analysis of what we're looking at. Just trying to focus the lens to some degree for fan nerd sake nonetheless.

 

[Texansballer74]

Know your team....like........ know that you have a rookie qb and the future of your franchise at the helm and thus call plays to make someone else step up instead of needlessly putting your golden boy in harms way? Him and Watson put up 31 and 38 pts...most games that's enough to win. Furthermore, "knowing your defense won't come through?" You can't think like that as a head coach.

Again, all this you're speaking on is in hindsight. The real time decisions BoB made were very much justified. The patriots game we took the sure 3 to go up by 5 after the failed 3rd down conversion by Miller....That's a far better position to be in on the road...especially in Foxboro against THAT guy. Aside from that, the runs had a strategic advantage in that they were making NE use their timeouts. by the time Brady & co. got the ball back they only had 1 left with the 2 min warning. Still too much time left for him but hey, I'd rather make Brady drive the length of the field to score a TD to beat me than him just needing to drive his offense into FG range for a GW fg with mr. automatic Stephen Gostkowski If we fail on the 4th and 1 that you're so adamant BoB should've went for to win the game.

The Seahawks game was damn near THE EXACT same scenario in that the seahawks had to drive the length of the field to score a TD to beat us after Miller's failed 3rd down conversion. In this scenario however, Seattle had NO TIMEOUTS and there was even LESS TIME than what Brady had to work with..1.49 to be exact. You say he should've called a TO or something when he realized his defense wasn't set....why would you do that and bail the seahawks out? Furthermore, the seahawks were already in the redzone when that happened on the TD to graham & it was a high probability that you would probably need those TO's to mount your own comeback drive to get your team in FG range to tie the game. The real killer in that situation was that bomb Richardson caught over Gilchrist to start that drive for Seattle.

BoB is constantly preaching complimentary football & In both these situations, BoB played the percentages..........which were at least even but more likely in his favor given what the opposition needed to do to beat us. Vrabel and his defense failed him in both those games. 28 out of 32 teams he faces, he likely comes out on top in these games. He just happened to face 2 of the very best in the game at it.

Mr. Tex let's get away from this rookie qb nonsense. This rookie is doing things unheard of. Also he ran the ball 8 times.



Therefore, you can best believe O'Brien is not thinking along your mindset of putting him in harms way. That point now is very irrelevant.

The main percentage here in 8 carries for 67 yards. The main ideal is to win the game, so how about putting the ball in the hands of your best players. Heck I quick slant to either Hopkins or Fuller would been suffice. Or hit your TE with a quick pass.

I see you are not thinking logical. Or you just didn't see that particular play. Clowney barley got to the line of scrimmage for starters. The secondary and linebackers we're not in sync. They were confused on who to cover. And finally, it's a smart move.

That is not bailing them out, it's getting your defense ready for the next play.

 

[steelbtexan]

Mr. Tex let's get away from this rookie qb nonsense. This rookie is doing things unheard of. Also he ran the ball 8 times.

View attachment 1873

Therefore, you can best believe O'Brien is not thinking along your mindset of putting him in harms way. That point now is very irrelevant.

The main percentage here in 8 carries for 67 yards. The main ideal is to win the game, so how about putting the ball in the hands of your best players. Heck I quick slant to either Hopkins or Fuller would been suffice. Or hit your TE with a quick pass.

I see you are not thinking logical. Or you just didn't see that particular play. Clowney barley got to the line of scrimmage for starters. The secondary and linebackers we're not in sync. They were confused on who to cover. And finally, it's a smart move.

That is not bailing them out, it's getting your defense ready for the next play.

Agreed with the Watson part of this post.

BOB needs to sink or swim with the ball in Watson's hands.

 

[thunderkyss]

That's not Rick's fault. If O'Brien makes the right calls against the Patriots and Seahawks we would be seated at 5-2. We would be considered as one of the top 10 teams in the NFL. Better yet, if we would've won those two games, we would be ranked in everyone's top 3.

Hell, if Fiedo & Fuller would have caught the TDs Osweiler threw, we'd have been in the AFCCG last year.

 

[Texansballer74]

Hell, if Fiedo & Fuller would have caught the TDs Osweiler threw, we'd have been in the AFCCG last year.

Haha can't argue against that.

 

[Mr teX]

Mr. Tex let's get away from this rookie qb nonsense. This rookie is doing things unheard of. Also he ran the ball 8 times.

View attachment 1873

Therefore, you can best believe O'Brien is not thinking along your mindset of putting him in harms way. That point now is very irrelevant.

The main percentage here in 8 carries for 67 yards. The main ideal is to win the game, so how about putting the ball in the hands of your best players. Heck I quick slant to either Hopkins or Fuller would been suffice. Or hit your TE with a quick pass.

I see you are not thinking logical. Or you just didn't see that particular play. Clowney barley got to the line of scrimmage for starters. The secondary and linebackers we're not in sync. They were confused on who to cover. And finally, it's a smart move.

That is not bailing them out, it's getting your defense ready for the next play.

Lol, now you’re just talking out of your ass. Most of those whole 8 carries for 67 yds were from Watson scrambling on broken pass plays dude. They had nothing to do with BoB. If I recall only 2 of those carries were designed plays for him to run....1 of which was in that final drive that Watson Converted on. Regardless, you don’t want your qb taking unnecessary shots....period....see Joe Flacco getting his bell rung this past week even though he slid and gave himself up like was supposed to do as to avoid being hit.

And I think it’s u whose thinking illogically. The only confusion was with Cunningham, another rookie, in not knowing who to cover on that last TD pass to graham. The rest of the defense wasn’t confused, THEY WERE GASSED. And again WHY would u stop the clock and call a timeout there for the Seahawks and give them time to regroup? The pressure to score is all on them.

Don’t know what school of coaching u went to, but that it is most definitely NOT smart to stop the clock for your opposition when you’re ahead and they have no way to stop it other than running out of bounds or throwing incomplete passes or spiking it. Stopping the clock for them with a TO when you don’t have to is literally amongst the dumbest things you can do.

 

[Texansballer74]

Lol, now you’re just talking out of your ass. Most of those whole 8 carries for 67 yds were from Watson scrambling on broken pass plays dude. They had nothing to do with BoB. If I recall only 2 of those carries were designed plays for him to run....1 of which was in that final drive that Watson Converted on. Regardless, you don’t want your qb taking unnecessary shots....period....see Joe Flacco getting his bell rung this past week even though he slid and gave himself up like was supposed to do as to avoid being hit.

And I think it’s u whose thinking illogically. The only confusion was with Cunningham, another rookie, in not knowing who to cover on that last TD pass to graham. The rest of the defense wasn’t confused, THEY WERE GASSED. And again WHY would u stop the clock and call a timeout there for the Seahawks and give them time to regroup? The pressure to score is all on them.

Don’t know what school of coaching u went to, but that it is most definitely NOT smart to stop the clock for your opposition when you’re ahead and they have no way to stop it other than running out of bounds or throwing incomplete passes or spiking it. Stopping the clock for them with a TO when you don’t have to is literally amongst the dumbest things you can do.

In that situation when your damn defense is not set, yes you do. Every coach will make that call. Bill O'Brien has done it before.

Talking out my ass huh. Ok dude I see you're one of those know it all argumentative type people. You just have to be right. I guess none of those plays were designed runs. Every week we have members on here expressing their discomfort in those type plays.

What's crazy is , you're the 02. % who thinks Bill O'Brien is not at fault.

Oh well moving right along.


How about those Astros babbyyy!! World Series Champs. Love it

 

[Mr teX]

In that situation when your damn defense is not set, yes you do. Every coach will make that call. Bill O'Brien has done it before.

Talking out my ass huh. Ok dude I see you're one of those know it all argumentative type people. You just have to be right. I guess none of those plays were designed runs. Every week we have members on here expressing their discomfort in those type plays.

What's crazy is , you're the 02. % who thinks Bill O'Brien is not at fault.

Oh well moving right along.


How about those Astros babbyyy!! World Series Champs. Love it

Take it how you want to bro, all i'm saying, what I've been trying to say anyway is that I completely understand BoB's thought processes behind the things he did/didn't do in those 2 games and they were more than justified when you look at them in the context under which they were made. Simply stating that he screwed the pooch b/c he didn't do them is laughable. & if im part of the 0.2% who chooses to use his brain and see that, then so be it...don't be so sure about that it's just 0.2% though.

Take it from someone who has actually played the game...starts at 5:50

 

[OptimisticTexan]

Lol, now you’re just talking out of your ass. Most of those whole 8 carries for 67 yds were from Watson scrambling on broken pass plays dude. They had nothing to do with BoB. If I recall only 2 of those carries were designed plays for him to run....1 of which was in that final drive that Watson Converted on. Regardless, you don’t want your qb taking unnecessary shots....period....see Joe Flacco getting his bell rung this past week even though he slid and gave himself up like was supposed to do as to avoid being hit.

And I think it’s u whose thinking illogically. The only confusion was with Cunningham, another rookie, in not knowing who to cover on that last TD pass to graham. The rest of the defense wasn’t confused, THEY WERE GASSED. And again WHY would u stop the clock and call a timeout there for the Seahawks and give them time to regroup? The pressure to score is all on them.

Don’t know what school of coaching u went to, but that it is most definitely NOT smart to stop the clock for your opposition when you’re ahead and they have no way to stop it other than running out of bounds or throwing incomplete passes or spiking it. Stopping the clock for them with a TO when you don’t have to is literally amongst the dumbest things you can do.

Worse yet....is taking the same RB (Miller) and ramming him off-center on three consecutive attempts The best approach? If everyone hadn't seen this picture multiple times in the past and shall I mention with resounding failure, then it could've been forgiven as a first time attempt. That Seahawks defense knew better than O'Brien himself what he was going to do.....that's why they stacked the box with 8 players. They were daring O'Brien to do something different and he didn't!!!

Let's just say for the record, if O'Brien is presented this same scenario for a third time and he ventures down the same path....then he's an idiot with no intestinal fortitude or better yet, sackless!!! If this situation were to come up again, O'Brien could get very creative since everyone....and I mean everyone....in the world would know he's going to run off-center so he could easily sneak in a PA with potentially devastating results in favor of the Texans.

 

[infantrycak]

Specifics v. generality is the difference. Mr. Tex is treating this like some generic football discussion. But it's not. It’s the Texans with Miller, this OL, Watson. Calls that might make sense for most teams are stupid for the Texans.

 

[Mr teX]

Worse yet....is taking the same RB (Miller) and ramming him off-center on three consecutive attempts. If everyone hadn't seen this picture multiple times in the past and shall I mention with resounding failure, then it could've been forgiven as a first time attempt. That Seahawks defense knew better than O'Brien himself what he was going to do.....that's why they stacked the box with 8 players. They were daring O'Brien to do something different and he didn't!!!

Let's just say for the record, if O'Brien is presented this same scenario for a third time and he ventures down the same path....then he's an idiot with no intestinal fortitude or better yet, sackless!!! If this situation were to come up again, O'Brien could get very creative since everyone....and I mean everyone....in the world would know he's going to run off-center so he could easily sneak in a PA with potentially devastating results in favor of the Texans.

Lol...ok. The seahawks stacked the box with 8 b/c of the situation. 99.999% of coaches are running the ball there. Whether it's off-center or whatever is truthfully just you guys as fans nitpicking b/c we lost the game. I'm sure you wouldn't care if it was "off-center" or whatever if it had been converted. To top all this off, There was a hole there to pick that 4 yards up! Miller just has TERRIBLE vision so its not like it was a bad call. Go back and look at that 3rd down play again. Seattle was also ready for the PA boot.

This isn't Madden.

1. You don't take chances going for it on 4th and 4 backed up in your own damn red zone.
2. You don't put your defense in precarious situations where they have to defend short fields on a quick flip of the field......against HOF caliber qb's no less. Kevin Gilbride got punched out by Buddy Ryan for doing that ****.
3. You don't play to your opponents strengths and needs when you're up, whether its by throwing the ball unnecessarily & risking a TO or by throwing an incomplete pass and stopping the clock.
4. You don't expose the future of your franchise to unnecessary risk unless you have to. You might very well win that game, but you could lose a whole helluva lot more in the long run...Again, see Schaub in 2011.

& i'm on record in saying that if this situation presents itself again, BoB will most definitely do things differently, but it won't be drastically different..it would probably be just a change in personnel..i.e. Blue/Foreman in for Miller, or it'll be some short, safe toss pass behind the LOS to Braxton Miller...That's about it.

 

[Mr teX]

Specifics v. generality is the difference. Mr. Tex is treating this like some generic football discussion. But it's not. It’s the Texans with Miller, this OL, Watson. Calls that might make sense for most teams are stupid for the Texans.

Specifics only matter when the alternative of what to do is obvious. These calls/non-calls aren't obvious they are matters of stratagem which obviously vary depending on how you want to see things. Only overzealous fans think that these decisions are made in a vacuum.

 

[infantrycak]

Specifics only matter when the alternative of what to do is obvious.

No. Specifics can easily rule out one course of action as stupid leaving many alternatives.

 

[cuppacoffee]

Lol, now you’re just talking out of your ass. Most of those whole 8 carries for 67 yds were from Watson scrambling on broken pass plays dude. They had nothing to do with BoB. If I recall only 2 of those carries were designed plays for him to run....1 of which was in that final drive that Watson Converted on. Regardless, you don’t want your qb taking unnecessary shots....period....see Joe Flacco getting his bell rung this past week even though he slid and gave himself up like was supposed to do as to avoid being hit.

And I think it’s u whose thinking illogically. The only confusion was with Cunningham, another rookie, in not knowing who to cover on that last TD pass to graham. The rest of the defense wasn’t confused, THEY WERE GASSED. And again WHY would u stop the clock and call a timeout there for the Seahawks and give them time to regroup? The pressure to score is all on them.

Don’t know what school of coaching u went to, but that it is most definitely NOT smart to stop the clock for your opposition when you’re ahead and they have no way to stop it other than running out of bounds or throwing incomplete passes or spiking it. Stopping the clock for them with a TO when you don’t have to is literally amongst the dumbest things you can do.

Maybe to give your defense time to catch their breath and regroup?

They didn't stop the clock and they still lost. Not all coaching clichés are correct 100% of the time.

 

[TexansBull]

Duane Brown traded. Astros win world series. Coincidence? No. Not at all.

 

[Mr teX]

Maybe to give your defense time to catch their breath and regroup?

They didn't stop the clock and they still lost. Not all coaching clichés are correct 100% of the time.

Never said it was, just trying to disspell this 100% certainty that fans seem to believe about BoB failing in those circumstances b/c he didn't channel his inner Playstation Madden '17 football self .& go for it in the shadow of his own goal post. I can only imagine the meltdown here.

 

[cuppacoffee]

Never said it was, just trying to disspell this 100% certainty that fans seem to believe about BoB failing in those circumstances b/c he didn't channel his inner Playstation Madden '17 football self .& go for it in the shadow of his own goal post. I can only imagine the meltdown here.

OBrien called the correct play.

Still think he should have called TO to line up his D and let them catch their breat.

 

[BYDS]

We got more than a bag of chips to get rid ofthat team cancer. Good riddance, he went to a team where he will fit right in.

With the 2019 2nd being conventionally thought to be worth roughly a 2018 3rd, means we basically traded Duane Brown and a 2018 5th for two 2018 3rd's in terms of ammo for next year's draft ... should we so choose to use it that way.

Assuming Seattle finishes in the final eight this year, and given a couple of different trade value charts (link1, link2), seems we could get anywhere from the 58th (late 2nd) to the 72nd (high 3rd) pick in trade for our new assets. And so, if the goal is to load up for a 2018 move upward, the final tally would be Duane Brown and a 2018 5th for a 2018 late 2nd-early 3rd.

Yes, given the very fluid amount of information at hand (where Seattle ends up, value of picks from one year to next, trade value chart accuracy, actual draft participants, etc) this isn't the most spot-on analysis of what we're looking at. Just trying to focus the lens to some degree for fan nerd sake nonetheless.

Quit conflating that a second round pick in 2019 being only worth a 3rd round pick. This if NOT fantasy football.

Your looking at present value like a financial transaction, this is not applicable to draft picks, a 2nd round pick in 2019 is still worth a 2nd round pick in 2019. Draft picks are not subject to inflation or delfation, a 2nd round pick will not increase in value to be a better draft pick or turn into multiple additional draft picks in the future.

The main reason future draft picks are devalued is because the general manager who trades this year’s pick cannot be sure he will be around next year to make the draft pick. For a general manager with job stability, when the opportunity arises, a smart strategy is to trade out of a draft by flipping a lower pick in the current year’s draft for a superior pick in a future year’s draft."

Look at the Patriots, they do it all the time.

 

[OptimisticTexan]

Lol...ok. The seahawks stacked the box with 8 b/c of the situation. 99.999% of coaches are running the ball there. Whether it's off-center or whatever is truthfully just you guys as fans nitpicking b/c we lost the game. I'm sure you wouldn't care if it was "off-center" or whatever if it had been converted. To top all this off, There was a hole there to pick that 4 yards up! Miller just has TERRIBLE vision so its not like it was a bad call. Go back and look at that 3rd down play again. Seattle was also ready for the PA boot.

This isn't Madden.

1. You don't take chances going for it on 4th and 4 backed up in your own damn red zone.
2. You don't put your defense in precarious situations where they have to defend short fields on a quick flip of the field......against HOF caliber qb's no less. Kevin Gilbride got punched out by Buddy Ryan for doing that ****.
3. You don't play to your opponents strengths and needs when you're up, whether its by throwing the ball unnecessarily & risking a TO or by throwing an incomplete pass and stopping the clock.
4. You don't expose the future of your franchise to unnecessary risk unless you have to. You might very well win that game, but you could lose a whole helluva lot more in the long run...Again, see Schaub in 2011.

& i'm on record in saying that if this situation presents itself again, BoB will most definitely do things differently, but it won't be drastically different..it would probably be just a change in personnel..i.e. Blue/Foreman in for Miller, or it'll be some short, safe toss pass behind the LOS to Braxton Miller...That's about it.

Ok, you're in O'Brien's shoes...do you take the same personnel and run the same 3 plays, especially having prior knowledge and film study showing the results have been less than stellar?

Or, do you take the hottest QB in the NFL and utilize his talents in getting what became the all important elusive first down? In this scenario, and I was O'Brien's shoes I would've been working with Watson for weeks on how to come to the line and read the box (aka Warren Moon) and then execute the proper audible options (should be a couple of options weekly based on film) so the offense has its best opportunity at success.

 

[Mollywhopper]

We got more than a bag of chips to get rid ofthat team cancer. Good riddance, he went to a team where he will fit right in.

Quit conflating that a second round pick in 2019 being only worth a 3rd round pick. This if NOT fantasy football.

Your looking at present value like a financial transaction, this is not applicable to draft picks, a 2nd round pick in 2019 is still worth a 2nd round pick in 2019. Draft picks are not subject to inflation or delfation, a 2nd round pick will not increase in value to be a better draft pick or turn into multiple additional draft picks in the future.

The main reason future draft picks are devalued is because the general manager who trades this year’s pick cannot be sure he will be around next year to make the draft pick. For a general manager with job stability, when the opportunity arises, a smart strategy is to trade out of a draft by flipping a lower pick in the current year’s draft for a superior pick in a future year’s draft."

Look at the Patriots, they do it all the time.

The f*ck are you going on about? Cause I didn't say anything about a pick in 2019 being worth less all of a sudden in 2019. I said if we wanted to trade a 2019 pick for assets in 2018 it would be valued less, which is entirely true historically in practice.

 

[BYDS]

The f*ck are you going on about? Cause I didn't say anything about a pick in 2019 being worth less all of a sudden in 2019. I said if we wanted to trade a 2019 pick for assets in 2018 it would be valued less, which is entirely true historically in practice.

Because you are wrong.

 

[Mollywhopper]

Because you are wrong.

No, I'm not. No one is trading equal value round-wise for a pick from one year to the next.

Why would any team just essentially punt on a pick?

 

[Texansballer74]

Never said it was, just trying to disspell this 100% certainty that fans seem to believe about BoB failing in those circumstances b/c he didn't channel his inner Playstation Madden '17 football self .& go for it in the shadow of his own goal post. I can only imagine the meltdown here.

Again you are reading into things the wrong way. Nobody said O'Brien foot 100% of the blame. But he does foot a nice size chunk of it.

 

[Mr teX]

Ok, you're in O'Brien's shoes...do you take the same personnel and run the same 3 plays, especially having prior knowledge and film study showing the results have been less than stellar?

Or, do you take the hottest QB in the NFL and utilize his talents in getting what became the all important elusive first down? In this scenario, and I was O'Brien's shoes I would've been working with Watson for weeks on how to come to the line and read the box (aka Warren Moon) and then execute the proper audible options (should be a couple of options weekly based on film) so the offense has its best opportunity at success.

To answer the 1st part of your post...I probably run the same plays but I go to Blue on 3rd down after giving Miller a crack at the 1st 2 downs b/c Blue runs much harder and pushes the pile. Watson's only an option to carry the ball for me in that situation if its 4th & inches. Regardless though, whether it's yours, mines or anyone else's different decisions...it don't guarantee we pick up the 1st down like you guys are assuming is a foregone conclusion.

As to the 2nd part of your post....how do you know that didn't happen? After that play, Watson and Ob were shown on the sideline and both seemed to be fairly distressed about what had just happened. Ob in particular looked like something went wrong there in terms of the playcall/audible. Watson could've been getting in Ob's ass as to why Ob should've let him take it..............or He could've been explaining to Ob what he saw/thought & how he fucked up on the playcall. We'll never know.

 

[infantrycak]

Quit conflating that a second round pick in 2019 being only worth a 3rd round pick. This if NOT fantasy football.

Your looking at present value like a financial transaction, this is not applicable to draft picks, a 2nd round pick in 2019 is still worth a 2nd round pick in 2019. Draft picks are not subject to inflation or delfation, a 2nd round pick will not increase in value to be a better draft pick or turn into multiple additional draft picks in the future.

The main reason future draft picks are devalued is because the general manager who trades this year’s pick cannot be sure he will be around next year to make the draft pick. For a general manager with job stability, when the opportunity arises, a smart strategy is to trade out of a draft by flipping a lower pick in the current year’s draft for a superior pick in a future year’s draft."

Look at the Patriots, they do it all the time.

Because you are wrong.

No you are dead wrong. NFL practice is to drop a round for each year delayed. It’s easily verified in examining the trades made.

And hilarious you then admit the devaluation you just denied. It has nothing to do with fearful GMs. You don't get the player for a year. That's obviously worth less than getting a player now.

 

[Mr teX]

Again you are reading into things the wrong way. Nobody said O'Brien foot 100% of the blame. But he does foot a nice size chunk of it.

As does...The defense......as does Miller...........As does Watson....You guys are only harping on BoB though as if his sole decision(s) were the reason(s) we lost both those games. The tendency is to give good players passes b/c they're out there making the exciting plays we see.....especially Watson, but at the end of the day the players are most responsible for the execution and when looked at in that context.....................

The defense gave up the game winning TD drives

Miller's not a punishing enough back to push the pile

Watson's gotta take better care of the ball...

BoB's decision/non decisions play very little to all those things.

 

[infantrycak]

Other missed opportunities do not negate another missed opportunity.

All this insistence on 'normal' play calling is silly. It’s like knowing you normally eat salad with a fork and so continuing with that plan when you have:

 

[Mr teX]

Other missed opportunities do not negate another missed opportunity.

All this insistence on 'normal' play calling is silly. It’s like knowing you normally eat salad with a fork and so continuing with that plan when you have:

You don’t get overly cute either

 

[Texansballer74]

As does...The defense......as does Miller...........As does Watson....You guys are only harping on BoB though as if his sole decision(s) were the reason(s) we lost both those games. The tendency is to give good players passes b/c they're out there making the exciting plays we see.....especially Watson, but at the end of the day the players are most responsible for the execution and when looked at in that context.....................

The defense gave up the game winning TD drives

Miller's not a punishing enough back to push the pile

Watson's gotta take better care of the ball...

BoB's decision/non decisions play very little to all those things.

If Bill O'Brien's calls a better call to get the first down, we wouldn't be having this discussion right now. You wouldn't be on here defending him either. We would've been on here given him praise.

 

[Mr teX]

If Bill O'Brien's calls a better call to get the first down, we wouldn't be having this discussion right now. You wouldn't be on here defending him either. We would've been on here given him praise.

& if Watson doesn't chunk a pick 6, we wouldn't be on here talking about it either...see how that works?

 

[Texansballer74]

Watson also threw 4 TD's and had 400+ yards. You're reaching now dude.

 

[infantrycak]

& if Watson doesn't chunk a pick 6, we wouldn't be on here talking about it either...see how that works?

And the mistakes don't cancel each other.

 

[Double Barrel]

Take it from someone who has actually played the game...starts at 5:50

Carter nailed it. The defense blew its cover 2 assignments and should have jammed Graham and covered him up the middle when the Seahawks had to get a TD.

 

[mussop]

Because you are wrong.

No he’s actually right. Often in the draft teams will trade next years first for a second now.

 

[infantrycak]

Carter nailed it. The defense blew its cover 2 assignments and should have jammed Graham and covered him up the middle when the Seahawks had to get a TD.

Yes that was also an error.

 

[Mr teX]

And the mistakes don't cancel each other.

Here's the difference. Ob's decision/non decision isn't necessarily a mistake...its a difference of opinion on strategy. It can easily be justified as to why he did what he did though. Watson's pick 6 is clearly a mistake. If this 1 mistake is eliminated, we win....period. Cunningham's botched coverage? clearly a mistake.

 

[zshawn10]

Isn't it funny how things work out.

We trade Osweiler + a 2nd round pick away to the Browns to make cap space for Romo.

Romo retires to become a media analyst.

Texans trade their first and a future 1st to the Browns in exchange for the 12th pick which they use to take Watson.

I didn't think I'd ever say this...

Thank you, Tony Romo.

Seeing Denver in competition with us for Romo and not getting him either and laughing at us for the Oz debacle...feels good

 

[TexansBull]

Seeing Denver in competition with us for Romo and not getting him either and laughing at us for the Oz debacle...feels good

It's funny too because Oz played for us, is back at Denver, and the Browns are paying the bill.

But Denver can't laugh at us. They have Paxton Lynch, who they traded up for, and we ended up with DW.

We win. Times infinity. Squared.

 

[FuzzyLogic]

Here's the difference. Ob's decision/non decision isn't necessarily a mistake...its a difference of opinion on strategy. It can easily be justified as to why he did what he did though. Watson's pick 6 is clearly a mistake. If this 1 mistake is eliminated, we win....period. Cunningham's botched coverage? clearly a mistake.

The bold text is just a fallacy - not just trying to defend Watson here, the pick was clearly a mistake... however not throwing that pick 6 in no way makes it "we win...period" next play could have been a fumble, or Seattle stops us in some other way and their offence drives for a TD, etc. etc. etc.

 

[austins23]

To answer the 1st part of your post...I probably run the same plays but I go to Blue on 3rd down after giving Miller a crack at the 1st 2 downs b/c Blue runs much harder and pushes the pile. Watson's only an option to carry the ball for me in that situation if its 4th & inches. Regardless though, whether it's yours, mines or anyone else's different decisions...it don't guarantee we pick up the 1st down like you guys are assuming is a foregone conclusion.

As to the 2nd part of your post....how do you know that didn't happen? After that play, Watson and Ob were shown on the sideline and both seemed to be fairly distressed about what had just happened. Ob in particular looked like something went wrong there in terms of the playcall/audible. Watson could've been getting in Ob's ass as to why Ob should've let him take it..............or He could've been explaining to Ob what he saw/thought & how he fucked up on the playcall. We'll never know.

Or they could have been bitching to one another about how SuaFilo completely whiffed his block, allowed penetration and that the guy he (X) was responsible for blew that play up. Good chance that play makes it close to the yardage to gain if SuaFilo makes his block.

Not defending the play call, just pointing out what could have been....

And the D gives up a TD in 3 plays? 80 yards, 3 plays??? smh

 

[Double Barrel]

Yes that was also an error.

I get it. But 38 points should be enough to win just about any game. The defense needed to show up just once in that game, especially if it is alleged that 'defense wins championships'. Instead, we now have a defense that is so pathetic that they need the offense to drain every single second off the clock for the team to have a chance to win a 38 point game.

O'Brien should have called different plays in 20/20 hindsight. The defense needed to show up and just do their damn jobs.

 

[Wolf]

I thought they looked disorganized and tired after the 2nd play ..i told my gf why are thet not calling timeout? .

Then Seattle got to last TD

Think we had 2 left

 

[Double Barrel]

Good thing we have a great LT to protect our now starting QB statue. . .oh wait. . .

 

[Wolf]

Well guess we get to find out how our 2nd string is...

 

[Texansballer74]

I get it. But 38 points should be enough to win just about any game. The defense needed to show up just once in that game, especially if it is alleged that 'defense wins championships'. Instead, we now have a defense that is so pathetic that they need the offense to drain every single second off the clock for the team to have a chance to win a 38 point game.

O'Brien should have called different plays in 20/20 hindsight. The defense needed to show up and just do their damn jobs.

They showed up on that interceptions. It was then on Bill O'Brien and that offense to get the job done.

 

[Double Barrel]

They showed up on that interceptions. It was then on Bill O'Brien and that offense to get the job done.

Mute point now. This team has no chance without Watson. Offense is going to be as bad as the defense. They will be lucky to compete with the hapless Colts this week.

 

[Texansballer74]

Or they could have been bitching to one another about how SuaFilo completely whiffed his block, allowed penetration and that the guy he (X) was responsible for blew that play up. Good chance that play makes it close to the yardage to gain if SuaFilo makes his block.

Not defending the play call, just pointing out what could have been....

And the D gives up a TD in 3 plays? 80 yards, 3 plays??? smh

That's why you run something different. The first time we gained 5 yards, second time 1 yard and then 0. We're talking about the same damn play.

 

[Texansballer74]

Mute point now. This team has no chance without Watson. Offense is going to be as bad as the defense. They will be lucky to compete with the hapless Colts this week.

Agreed we are toast now.