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Derek Stingley vs. Sauce Gardner

Mr teX

Hall of Fame
thats fair statement, except for not trusting speed reason for being handsy. 6’3” plus is more about physics, stopping on a dime and changing directions, no matter how good the feet or loose the hips there is a built in delay. So he does try to minimize that separation in space by grabbing too much at times. Learning to trust his make-up speed (looks elite, catches nearly everybody with that length) and reading the receiver’s body language gets him close enough to position for break-up, often times w/o turning to look for ball. Usually that (turning to look for ball) typically bails out 99% of corners, it’s his length that bails Gardner out.

From here not sure how much hype affects officiating? Certainly possible, he gets calls because of his reputation, the great ones, regardless of position get those calls or no calls. Dion Sanders and Darrell Revis are two I remember getting favorable treatment.
Deion and Revis had that short area quickness and technique...Deion in particular would bait qbs by giving them that college look of "open" by laying off 2-3 yards. The minute the ball was in the air he could close so damn quick & intercept, it would look like the qb was throwing to him instead of the WR. Revis would just smother guys to death with his flawless technique.

Agree about the reach advantage that bails him out & the calls great ones get..but they're usually more established guys at that point. Still disagree about the speed thing tho.. regardless of how long he is, still gotta have that base level of speed and quickness. height can be a limiting factor for some guys...i just don't think that's the case here. For 1, We see guys with his size and speed & bigger in the NFL all the time stopping on dimes and changing directions quickly with no delays..They're called WR's...Andre Johnson, Cooper Kupp.......Jordy Nelson all say hi.. There's just a difference between being fast and being quick. that's why so much emphasis is put on CB's to at least be able to clock a 4.4 at the combines; that implies a minimal level of quickness. So while Sauce's top speed can reach 4.47 as evidenced by his 2nd run at the combine (1st was 4.52) it was a struggle for him to get...which tells me he's closer to a 4.5 guy & that he doesn't really have the short area quicks to begin with that's so coveted in the NFL for cbs.....so in that regard it ain't his height. i'm sure he knows that that long stride struggle 4.4 speed can only be deployed........... if he can get his hands on guys to slow them up a bit........... & the pass rush he has aids him moreso than alot of other cbs who are quicker & can close.....That's why i don't think he'd be playing as well here if we'd drafted him (0 pass rush).

Like i said to me his instincts are the best thing about his game & those types of guys are best utilized at safety..As good as he's playing at cb..there's a bit of smoke and mirrors to it. At safety i think he'd probably be playing better..where he could let his instincts take over and there's less emphasis on his speed and quickness &......potential holding...Hell that's basically the thing that goy Kye Hamilton drafted top 15 despite a trash 40 lol....& he's playing damn well now.
 
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Mr teX

Hall of Fame

beerlover

Hall of Fame
Deion and Revis had that short area quickness and technique...Deion in particular would bait qbs by giving them that college look of "open" by laying off 2-3 yards. The minute the ball was in the air he could close so damn quick & intercept, it would look like the qb was throwing to him instead of the WR. Revis would just smother guys to death with his flawless technique.

Agree about the reach advantage that bails him out & the calls great ones get..but they're usually more established guys at that point. Still disagree about the speed thing tho.. regardless of how long he is, still gotta have that base level of speed and quickness. height can be a limiting factor for some guys...i just don't think that's the case here. For 1, We see guys with his size and speed & bigger in the NFL all the time stopping on dimes and changing directions quickly with no delays..They're called WR's...Andre Johnson, Cooper Kupp.......Jordy Nelson all say hi.. There's just a difference between being fast and being quick. that's why so much emphasis is put on CB's to at least be able to clock a 4.4 at the combines; that implies a minimal level of quickness. So while Sauce's top speed can reach 4.47 as evidenced by his 2nd run at the combine (1st was 4.52) it was a struggle for him to get...which tells me he's closer to a 4.5 guy & that he doesn't really have the short area quicks to begin with that's so coveted in the NFL for cbs.....so in that regard it ain't his height. i'm sure he knows that that long stride struggle 4.4 speed can only be deployed........... if he can get his hands on guys to slow them up a bit........... & the pass rush he has aids him moreso than alot of other cbs who are quicker & can close.....That's why i don't think he'd be playing as well here if we'd drafted him (0 pass rush).

Like i said to me his instincts are the best thing about his game & those types of guys are best utilized at safety..As good as he's playing at cb..there's a bit of smoke and mirrors to it. At safety i think he'd probably be playing better..where he could let his instincts take over and there's less emphasis on his speed and quickness &......potential holding...Hell that's basically the thing that goy Kye Hamilton drafted top 15 despite a trash 40 lol....& he's playing damn well now.
Lot more folks here were talking up Hamilton as the 3rd overall pick before Gardner or Stingley, until his pro-day pedestrian 4.70/4.74 forty. https://jetsxfactor.com/2022/03/31/ny-jets-draft-prospects-testing-numbers/amp/

Both Hamilton and Stingley had medical red flags as well, which impeded their testing numbers, granted. Gardner was I’d call a clean prospect, no red flags. Is there a weakness with his stop & start time given his size, naturally yes, but his fluid hips, weight transfer to feet and length more than make up for that.
https://jetsxfactor.com/2022/05/02/sauce-gardner-analysis-great-improve/amp/

In the end, football players are all in their own developmental process that evolves over time. Sauce Gardner has the advantage because of the system and coaching assessment of his skill sets & how to maximize those assets. But sure doesn’t hurt to have elite traits to be used as more of a weapon. Jets need to figure out how to implement them when teams don’t throw his side of field, if that requires slipping into zone coverage or safety position so be it. He should not be constrained to CB position only.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
I agree to an extent.

Texans have to make sure they get what they need and not be Garrapolo’ed like the Patriots did to us.

They are in that much need, which we both agree.

We can’t look at the draft picks and think we could have gotten someone at the same place.

This is the first real draft by Caserio. It will take some time to really get a feel for how he drafts and if he drafts well.
Last draft was the 1st real draft and although Caserio went in a different direction than I would have, I thought he did a good job. He likes guys that are battle tested particularly from the SEC. I agree with this philosophy.
 


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