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Bush to Texans... Young to Titans
- Thread starter Hookem Horns
- Start date
Mcnair has a 50 million dollar bonus coming up. We can pay 1 million to void his contract, then sign him to a new deal without taking a hit from what is left from his old deal. At least that is how I understand it. To me either us somehow getting Bush or us getting VY and him sitting behind Mac for a couple of years is perfect.
Hervoyel
BUENO!
Tulip said:
No you're not the only one. The idea that angering Longhorn fans could possibly even matter in the slightest amount though is inherintly a "blind orange" sentiment. Longhorn fans should be thrilled to have themselves another national title (took them long enough) but to think that how they feel about a decision that any NFL team makes is unbelievable arrogance.
The Texans are probably just as concerned with upsetting the UTEP fanbase if the truth be told. They spend exactly as much time worrying about whether Eastern Illinois alumni are satisfied with the players they've chosen.
I was cheering for UT the other night and generally have no real NCAA "passion" aside from following it to see who's coming to the NFL (Ok, I tend to root for all Texas teams come Bowl season and against the rest of the country unless they're playing Alabama) but a few days of reading these *****ic posts about what Longhorn fans think has me sick to death of them.
I'm at the point now where I want to see Vince Young in black and gold playing in the Superdome with rats running across the field. Anything to end the constant drone of demands, whines, and threats of the Longhorn fans.
Kaiser Toro
Native Mod
Wow, I have not really noticed many Longhorn posters as I have seen a group talking about one Longhorn poster. Lots of barking, lots of chatter. Threads dead baby, threads dead.
Vince Young is great, and will make a great Pro, but we should pick Bush. He is a special player and won't need a few years to make a difference. And all of you that have given up on Carr, will realize over the next couple of years that you are wrong and he is a franchise QB.
Texans_Chick
Utopian Dreamer
Just got a message from someone who knows me too well:
If Jerry Jones could manage that, and VY was the successful QB that I think he will be, well, I can't even contemplate what that would do to me. Any time I even try to think of that scenario, I get nauseated and woozy and think my brain might splode.
I would have a hard time dealing.
If Jerry Jones could manage that, and VY was the successful QB that I think he will be, well, I can't even contemplate what that would do to me. Any time I even try to think of that scenario, I get nauseated and woozy and think my brain might splode.
I would have a hard time dealing.
CowboysTexansFan
Waterboy
I was greatly impressed with VY's performance in the Rose Bowl and think he will eventually be a fantastic NFL player. Legitimate, reasonable arguments can be made that we should dump Carr and take VY with the first pick, though I don't believe we should do that.
Like some of the other posters, however, I'm put off with the crybaby attitude of some in the UT crowd
, who are threatening to pick up their marbles and go home if the Texans don't draft their little Vincy-poo.
Grow up! Not every Texans fan bleeds burnt orange, and the team will have overwhelming support in this city if it starts winning, Vince or no Vince.
Like some of the other posters, however, I'm put off with the crybaby attitude of some in the UT crowd
, who are threatening to pick up their marbles and go home if the Texans don't draft their little Vincy-poo. Grow up! Not every Texans fan bleeds burnt orange, and the team will have overwhelming support in this city if it starts winning, Vince or no Vince.
LoneStarState
Waterboy
CowboysTexansFan said:I'm put off with the crybaby attitude of some in the UT crowd
Grow up! Not every Texans fan bleeds burnt orange, and the team will have overwhelming support in this city if it starts winning, Vince or no Vince.
Couldn't have said it better myself...
kbourda
Veteran
barzilla said:
I'll say this. You can go back as far as you like on me. I said before the college season started that I would take Young over Leinart, period. I have always been a Young supporter. I think he is a victim of a stigma placed on "scrambling" QB's. It's funny you mention Brady Quinn, cause he would be the only other QB who has made a huge leap from their Sophmore season to Junior season. It's funny how Quinn, who throws in a controlled passing game (you know 10 yds here, 5yds there, maybe 20 yds later), is just the greatest thing since buttered bread. Absolutely amazing!
Wow... just wow. My head hurts just flipping through all of this debate. I'm happy to see that every is amped and has an opinion on who we should take with this number one pick, and I think that we have a few options that can be really beneficial.
1.)Draft Bush - He's a special player, you can't argue it. Okay, so thirty die-hard UT fans think he'll be a bust versus the thousands of sports analysts and scouts that are calling him the next coming of Gale Sayers. Who do you think is more likely to be right? He'd be "the best player available," and I'd love to see him in Houston. Think Shaun Alexander or LT, Bush could have a huge impact here.
2.)Draft VY - Okay, this works from a marketing point of view, but when we go 2-14 the next four years and are in cap Hell, how does this help the franchise? We have thousands of holes to fill, and a franchise QB is NOT one of them, no matter how much everyone loves VY. He's going to be benchwarmer for two or three years in the NFL anyways, and needs a lot of work to be a pro quarterback. Vick aside (he's a mediocre passer at best), VY-types don't do very well in the NFL. NFL defenses are exponentially faster than in college, and VY won't be able to run like that in the pro's, it's a fact.
3.)Trade down and take D'Brickishaw Ferguson! - Why has nobody thought about this possibility? I know we're blinded by the media and the UT love here, but c'mon now. We're all Texans fans, and we know what needs the most help, our O-LINE! Think Pace or Ogden, they're huge now. This pick is worth so much, why not trade down to spot 2 or 3 or maybe even 4 and take a great LT, and get some extra picks to fill more holes. OLs aren't exciting, but we need it.
I vote Bush or D'Brickishaw... but that's just from a fan who wants his TEAM to get better, and not to just make himself happy by taking a hometown hero. Call me nuts.
Oh, and for those that are threatening to boycott... there's the door. Have fun.
1.)Draft Bush - He's a special player, you can't argue it. Okay, so thirty die-hard UT fans think he'll be a bust versus the thousands of sports analysts and scouts that are calling him the next coming of Gale Sayers. Who do you think is more likely to be right? He'd be "the best player available," and I'd love to see him in Houston. Think Shaun Alexander or LT, Bush could have a huge impact here.
2.)Draft VY - Okay, this works from a marketing point of view, but when we go 2-14 the next four years and are in cap Hell, how does this help the franchise? We have thousands of holes to fill, and a franchise QB is NOT one of them, no matter how much everyone loves VY. He's going to be benchwarmer for two or three years in the NFL anyways, and needs a lot of work to be a pro quarterback. Vick aside (he's a mediocre passer at best), VY-types don't do very well in the NFL. NFL defenses are exponentially faster than in college, and VY won't be able to run like that in the pro's, it's a fact.
3.)Trade down and take D'Brickishaw Ferguson! - Why has nobody thought about this possibility? I know we're blinded by the media and the UT love here, but c'mon now. We're all Texans fans, and we know what needs the most help, our O-LINE! Think Pace or Ogden, they're huge now. This pick is worth so much, why not trade down to spot 2 or 3 or maybe even 4 and take a great LT, and get some extra picks to fill more holes. OLs aren't exciting, but we need it.
I vote Bush or D'Brickishaw... but that's just from a fan who wants his TEAM to get better, and not to just make himself happy by taking a hometown hero. Call me nuts.
Oh, and for those that are threatening to boycott... there's the door. Have fun.
Texans_Chick
Utopian Dreamer
CowboysTexansFan said:
QB or RB or whatever, of course, the team will have support if it wins. But that might take a while.
VY gets you some instant good will that might carry over until the winning really begins.
Our team lacks depth, the kind of depth that takes drafts a long time to fix because rookies make mistakes.
Teams with the first pick are usually not terribly good teams. Not really making much of a point with this, but it is interesting to look at this:
All of the RB's that were the number one pick since the unified draft:
1969 Buffalo O.J. Simpson, RB, USC
1977 Tampa Bay Ricky Bell, RB, USC
1978 Houston Earl Campbell, RB, Texas
1980 Detroit Billy Sims, RB, Oklahoma
1981 New Orleans George Rogers, RB, South Carolina
1986 Tampa Bay Bo Jackson, RB, Auburn
1995 Cincinnati Ki-Jana Carter, RB, Penn State
Teams that picked a QB #1:
1970 Pittsburgh Terry Bradshaw, QB, Louisiana Tech
1971 New England Jim Plunkett, QB, Stanford
1975 Atlanta Steve Bartkowski, QB, California
1983 Baltimore John Elway, QB, Stanford
1987 Tampa Bay Vinny Testaverde, QB, Miami-FL
1989 Dallas Troy Aikman, QB, UCLA
1990 Indianapolis Jeff George, QB, Illinois
1993 New England Drew Bledsoe, QB, Washington State
1998 Indianapolis Peyton Manning, QB, Tennessee
1999 Cleveland Tim Couch, QB, Kentucky
2001 Atlanta Michael Vick, QB, Virginia Tech
2002 Houston David Carr, QB, Fresno State
2003 Cincinnati Carson Palmer, QB, USC
2004 San Diego Eli Manning, QB, Mississippi
I think 2 of those teams won a Super Bowl with that quarterback. Pittsburgh won it 5 years after drafting Bradshaw and Dallas won it 4 years after drafting Aikman. Drew Bledsoe did not appear in the Super Bowl when New England won its first.
RB's 0/7. QB's 2/14 (so far)
You could do this with almost every position. Mostly teams that get the #1 pick don't win the Super Bowl. Heck, mostly teams don't win the Super Bowl. 7 teams have won 26 of the 39.
Anyhow, I don't see us having an above .500 season next year no matter who we draft. It would be a real stretch. So, finding ways to win AND preserve good will with the fans ain't a bad idea.
Texans_Chick
Utopian Dreamer
Tulip said:
Yeah, but are more Crypokes fans around Houston. And most of them are already insufferable. VY in those colors would be an affront to all that is holy.
Kaiser Toro
Native Mod
Texans_Chick said:
The only thing I would add is that you have to take into consideration the institution of the Salary Cap in 1993 if you are building any models off of historical data.
bigTEXan8
Rookie
Sorry if this has already been posterd, but I just saw it this morning:
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2283797
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2283797
Jack Bauer
Rookie
aj. said:
This is ridiculous. If anyone on this board can honestly say that could "overlook" how Bud screwed the city and become Titans fans, I say go for it. I would rather not have you (speaking to all in this camp) as a Texans fan. It is insulting to me as a Texans fan to have people like this as part of my fan family.
If we do NOT select Vince and he goes on to a remarkable HOF career, I will be happy for him, but I will still remain a loyal Texans fan. The draft, even at the top, is a crapshoot. Just because the fan base is clamoring for a player does NOT mean it is in the best interest of the organization to choose him. We tend to become emotional about players. It is the organization's responsibility to take the emotion out of the decision. NO good business decision is made on emotions.
I am NOT saying that VY is NOT the right choice for the Texans, I haven't decided yet. But, I have gotten over the emotional high of the Rose Bowl. I want to look at more of VY's game before I make a decision.
beerlover
Hall of Fame
Zephyr said:
why have you not ALREADY watched more Vince Young games? how do you think he got the scholarship to Texas in the 1st place? if you had paid attention you would know by now that Vince has dazzeled and amazed with every new challege & while past performance is no quarantee of future performace his game should transcend to the next level as well as anyone elses who has ever come out of College and stepped onto a football field.
Jack Bauer
Rookie
beerlover said:
I have watched his games. It does NOT mean I have focused specifically on him. I want to go back and look at the games he has played and see if I see anything different from another perspective. He has looked great this year, but that does NOT translate into the NFL necessarily. He has a lot going for him. His leadership and competitive spirit to say the least.
However, I would NOT say his 200 yards rushing would "transcend to the next level" by any means.
I am not saying I would not want to take him, but the thought of fans in this city abandoning our team for BUD????? :brickwall
bigTEXan8
Rookie
I've said this before and I'll say it again: I don't think VY is going to be any better than Vick. If Houstonians want to have Mike Vick on their team, then trade for VY in Madden 2007. VY does nothing but zone-read, which does not translate well into the NFL. I have more faith in Chris Mortenson and his contacts saying that most QBs in the NFL today are better than VY ever will be than what I saw against a lousy USC D during the Rose Bowl.
beerlover
Hall of Fame
frankly I don't give a damn how many yards he rushes or pass'es for, all that really matters is winning. Vince Young will provide whichever team he plays for in the NFL a better probability to win its that simple, its not just singular abilties its also the positive affect he instill's in his teamates, they play inspired & feel they WILL WIN GAMES BECAUSE VINCE YOUNG GIVES THEM THAT CONFIDENCE and this is not coming from a 
the winning % does not lie.
the winning % does not lie.I guess I need to go buy some Titans gear! I don't think Reggie will live up to the HYPE he has been given in the press. He is too small, and will not be able to carry the ball 25 times per game. Where will he fit in with the Texans? We already have the fastest guy in the NFL returning kicks/punts, so his speed there won't matter. We actually have a pretty decent running game (even behind the "terrible" o-line.......hmmmm, maybe it's not the line after all.......maybe it's an incompetent QB with absolutely NO confidence or poise in the pocket.) I really think that drafting Bush will alienate the players in the two good areas the Texans actually have. Regardless of VY, Bush will be a bust in the NFL. We saw what a little speed on defence can do to his game. In the NFL, that will be magnified greatly. I will hate to see the Texans waste the first overall draft pick to take a return man when we already have one of the best in the league.
The Chronicle has Young coming out. PC today.
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/3573146.html
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/3573146.html
Vinny
shiny happy fan
I don't see any deleted posts from your account....perhaps it was merged since we have a billion threads on the same topic. The only thing mega-lame is people wanting their own thread every time they want to comment or share a link. It could have been moved to the draft forum too...Young isn't our property yet...we are tying to keep this forum less about the draft and more about the Texans.T_Guru said:
pv1999
Waterboy
There is only 15 NFL QBs that I would take over Vince
Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, Carson Palmer, Eli Manning, Drew Brees, Trent Green, Brett Favre, Kerry Collins, Matt Hasselbeck, Ben Whataburger, Brad Johnson, Marc Bulger, Donovan McNabb, Steve McNair, Michael Vick
That leaves IMO 16 "NFL" QB's that I would not take before Vince
J.P. Losman, Chris Simms, Jake Delohomme, Jake Plummer, Kyle Orton (not yet), Mark Brunnell, david carr, Drew Bledsoe, Joey Harrington, Aaron Brooks, Alex Smith, Jeff Garcia, Kurt Warner, Gus Ferrotte, Trent Dilfer and Byron Leftwich
There are non playoff QB's that I would take before VY and there are guys still playing that I would drop in a heartbeat for VY. His upside is that good. When he learns to read defenses, it's over.
Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, Carson Palmer, Eli Manning, Drew Brees, Trent Green, Brett Favre, Kerry Collins, Matt Hasselbeck, Ben Whataburger, Brad Johnson, Marc Bulger, Donovan McNabb, Steve McNair, Michael Vick
That leaves IMO 16 "NFL" QB's that I would not take before Vince
J.P. Losman, Chris Simms, Jake Delohomme, Jake Plummer, Kyle Orton (not yet), Mark Brunnell, david carr, Drew Bledsoe, Joey Harrington, Aaron Brooks, Alex Smith, Jeff Garcia, Kurt Warner, Gus Ferrotte, Trent Dilfer and Byron Leftwich
There are non playoff QB's that I would take before VY and there are guys still playing that I would drop in a heartbeat for VY. His upside is that good. When he learns to read defenses, it's over.
Vinny
shiny happy fan
I didn't do that...we have about 8 mods you know. I've been pretty supportive of you over the years...I've told you as much. I just can't be here 24\7. Our forum will have 1000 posts on a given day....I don't see everything anymore like I could when we were slower.Bongo59 said:
Bongo59
Waterboy
my apologies then..............I posted here yesterday McNair was told by VY he was declaring in Austin and his agent would be Cook...................he relayed that info to Reese..............and that news spread around BSP like wild fire.................I thought i'd drop it here.............and it was deleted.
Vinny
shiny happy fan
I see it now that I look for it. Sorry we moved it...but some of our mods are not aware you have a long history on these boards and on various Titan boards...or your past association with the Titans.
Our MB has been very active since new year, plus we have been short a few mods due to the Holidays. We are trying to move some of the goofy rumors and you got swept under in the madness...
posts per day since new year:
January 01, 2006 1612
January 02, 2006 1343
January 03, 2006 1239
January 04, 2006 1128
January 05, 2006 1792
January 06, 2006 1489
January 07, 2006 1276
Our MB has been very active since new year, plus we have been short a few mods due to the Holidays. We are trying to move some of the goofy rumors and you got swept under in the madness...
posts per day since new year:
January 01, 2006 1612
January 02, 2006 1343
January 03, 2006 1239
January 04, 2006 1128
January 05, 2006 1792
January 06, 2006 1489
January 07, 2006 1276
The Dream
All Pro
I've said this before and I'll say it again, David Carr is average....the man has had 4 years and has yet to do squat, and it's not like he has a bunch of garbage around him.....he's just flat out average.....I keep hearing people telling Longhorn fans to take their burnt orange glasses off, well you David Carr fans need to take your glasses off also.......I have nothing against David, because he's a class act, but the dude as a starting NFL QB is average......as I said before Young has a much more upside than Carr and about 50% of the QB's in the NFL......David Carrs are easy to come by, VY's aren't.
