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Bush to Texans... Young to Titans

I TOLD you Dan Reeves had fallen in love with Carr, and I TOLD you that Reeves was definitely the catalyst and orchestrator behind Carr calling the plays for a half of a game. The results of that situation sealed our fates.

This is so anti-climactic. I mean....unless this is just a HUGE smoke-screen, we're putting Bush in steel blue. And "Yes," we'll be seeing exactly what I also said: Young dutifully holding the clipboard and watching his mentor from the sidelines.

Ugghh.....me not feel so good....
 
A lineman would be a better pick than either Bush or Young. No point in getting a franchise player if you cant keep them off their butt.
 
rmartin65 said:
A lineman would be a better pick than either Bush or Young. No point in getting a franchise player if you cant keep them off their butt.
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no point in drafting a linemen with no franchise players to protect.:bomb:
 
^^^exactly Big B, players like Vince are a dime dozen, there will be plenty of linemen along the way.......God I have the worst feeling that Vince will turn out to be good, and be in a Titan's uniform :brickwall ................hopefully these reports are just rumours.
 
Everyone keeps worrying that if we pass on VY and he goes to TEN and destroys us year in and year out. Well, what if we trade Carr away, he goes somewhere and has a Hall of Fame career, then we draft Young, and he turns out to be a bust?? Either scenario COULD happen, and either road the Texans take will be second guessed.
 
corrosion said:
First of all Bush didnt have 250 yards against Texas .... 13/80 rushing and 6/94 passing . (If you add in the LESS THAN STELLAR kick returns 5/101 then sure he had 250+ but a 20.2 avg is just that ... AVERAGE) .... Throw in a bone headed turn over for good measure and you have a great game by the best player in college football .

http://www.sportsline.com/collegefootball/gamecenter/live/NCAAF_20060104_USC@TX

Second of all . Young has done this ALL YEAR . Did you watch Ohio St. vs UT earlier this year ? Oh by the way , Vince Young was the most efficient QB in college football THROWING the ball this season , not for just ONE game .
Young is 30-2 as a starter at UT playing in arguably the toughest conference in all of college football (Big 12 / SeC are a toss up) .... A National Champoinship , TWO Rose Bowl MVP's ....Yeah , thats ONE GAME .

Thirdly and probably most important .... Before the Rose Bowl Vince Young had stated MANY Times that he would return to UT for his senoir year .... There was NO DEBATING Bush / Young #1 prior to this date .



Thats exactly what we saw .... Bush wasnt even the best RB on his team much less the best in the nation ..... At least for that ONE GAME ....
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Vince was actually the 3rd most efficient passer this year, and if you configure those on an NFL rating system that drops him to about #8 just out of the top 10 (this was done in a post about a month ago). The Big 12 is far from the best conference in college football anymore, maybe two years ago. Last year the Big 12 South was decent but the North was terrible, and this year both werre terrible. The SEC and ACC are clearly better, the Big 10 is better, and the Pac-10 and Big East are even pushing the Big 12 this year. Vince has not been putting up that good of a game all year, you could just as easily point out his poor game against A&M as you could his good game against Ohio St. Reggie Bush has been performing all season long as well. That said, I'm a fan of trading down anyways as I don't see Bush being much of an upgrade over Davis as our main RB and I don't want to spend that much on him to be a part-time guy, and I don't see how Vince is supposed to come in and be an improvement over Carr whatsoever, plus I see many other teams wanting these guys and giving us nice trade offers to trade down and fill the holes that we have.
 
gpshafer_1976 said:
we are fans of the dumbest-operated NFL team in the league.
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As long as "Dumber" is still calling the shots I think that might be a good assumption. I just might have to redo my avatar with "Dumb and Dumberer", having Bob McNair being the "Dumberer" for keeping "Dumber" around.
 
what if we trade Carr away, he goes somewhere and has a Hall of Fame career,
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The only way David Carr has a hall of fame career is if another hall of fame QB dresses up in his uni with the name Carr on the back of his jersey..............David Carr = average.
 
The Dream said:
^^^exactly Big B, players like Vince are a dime dozen, there will be plenty of linemen along the way.......God I have the worst feeling that Vince will turn out to be good, and be in a Titan's uniform :brickwall ................hopefully these reports are just rumours.
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Thanx for the props Dream-

If Young stays in school and the Titans wind up with him before we gotta chance to get 'em then cool, but..........if we pass on him in this draft or the next, then piss on this team. I'll be dusting off my Titans apparel that hasn't seen the light of day for the past 4 years.
 
Vinny said:
I think you forget that Young started in all the Texas wins...not just the Rose Bowl. he was the first EVER QB to throw for 2500 yards and run for 1000 in NCAA HISTORY. EVERY single QB to EVER play has never done this in the long long history of College football.
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How many games did VY play all 4 quarters? And what were the ranks of each of the defenses he played against?
 
LoneStarState said:
How many games did VY play all 4 quarters? And what were the ranks of each of the defenses he played against?
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I donno, but College football has been around longer than we have been alive...and I'm 41. I'd call his accomplishment..."historic"
 
Vinny said:
:lol: most hilarious post of the day!

:homer:
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Ok, hall of fame was obviously going overboard, but he could have a very successfull career somewhere else.

Question: How am I labeled a homer? At least Im not one of the ones doing backflips for Vince Young just because he's from Houston. How come nobody is suggesting that the Texans draft Matt Leinart? Know why, because we don't need to draft a QB.
 
If you have been a Houston fan for a while then deep down you have to be gringing at this scenerio...even if you don't want VY. If VY becomes a Titan then with our luck him winning rings for Tenn. is almost a certainty. "The curse of VY". I've been a Houston fan for along time and it would only make since this plays out.

Steve McNair took VY under his wing and became a mentor/father figure for a while now. He could keep mentoring him his 1st couple of years as a Titan...a great situation for VY.

Bob McNair might as well pack up the franchise and change the name to the Los Angeles Califorians if this happens to play out over the years...
 
Vinny said:
I donno, but College football has been around longer than we have been alive...and I'm 41. I'd call his accomplishment..."historic"
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Maybe... Some think Ryan Leaf had "historic" games, too. And before all the crap gets flung my way... I AM NOT COMPARING VY TO RYAN LEAF.

I was talking to an orangeblood about the game and they kept saying "but we beat the number 1 team." I told them USC was #1 because of their offense. They didn't know that USC had the 39th ranked defense... a defense that gave up 40+ pts to Fresno State. Once realizing that - they laid off the kool-aid a little.

Before VY is deemed the be-all end-all - I would just like to know more about the games he played the past 2 years and the defenses he played against.
 
Does everyone remember the good old days when there was only two factions - Carr Lovers vs Carr Haters? Such a simpler time. Anybody gotta scoop of Blue Bell?
 
MorKnolle said:
That said, I'm a fan of trading down anyways as I don't see Bush being much of an upgrade over Davis as our main RB and I don't want to spend that much on him to be a part-time guy, and I don't see how Vince is supposed to come in and be an improvement over Carr whatsoever, plus I see many other teams wanting these guys and giving us nice trade offers to trade down and fill the holes that we have.
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Neither would be in Immediate upgrade . Bush would not see 25 touches a game splitting time w/ DD ..... Young wouldnt see the field for at least a year ..... probably two .

The trade value of this first pick could prove to be a franchise builder ....


Prior to the USC / UT game I had been on the fence about trading down or taking Bush (Young wasnt in the equasion) .... He didnt show me enough to warrant taking him #1 ....


No , Vince didnt have a great game Vs T A&M ..... but didnt they play @ A&M and isnt that one of the biggest rivalry games in college football ? I would expect a close game ... Also the defense was designed to stop Young and force someone else to beat them (Ramonce Taylor 15/102 2 TDs).Youngs passing stats werent Horrible in that game but were quite ordinary . 13/24 162 w/ 1td and 1int.

http://www.sportsline.com/collegefootball/gamecenter/live/NCAAF_20051125_TX@TXAM
 
Kaiser Toro said:
Does everyone remember the good old days when there was only two factions - Carr Lovers vs Carr Haters? Such a simpler time. Anybody gotta scoop of Blue Bell?
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And I never had fun because I was always so apathetic about Carr. Now he's getting in the way, so my patience with him is has worn very thin very quickly.
 
I know that those wanting VY will support the Texans after he is drafted, but you still support the team if he is drafted and in 2 years, the Texans are 2-14? A 2-14 season under VY is just a likely as it is that he will be the best pro player in the history of the game...
 
RTP2110 said:
Ok, hall of fame was obviously going overboard, but he could have a very successfull career somewhere else.

Question: How am I labeled a homer? At least Im not one of the ones doing backflips for Vince Young just because he's from Houston. How come nobody is suggesting that the Texans draft Matt Leinart? Know why, because we don't need to draft a QB.
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Only a true homer would think that Carr is on any sort of HOF track after 60 NFL starts. He has never thrown for a combined 2+TD's plus 201 yards in a win...ever. Not once....its half a decade next year...year FIVE.
 
That's the way it is boys and girls - draft is a c-shoot at times and Bush, Young, Leinhart will go to Texans, Saints, Titans.... not necessariliy in that same order and assuming no trade down and Young declares.

I just find it amusing that before the Rosebowl there might have been 3 or 4 posters that were pro-Young with the rest divided among Bush and trade down camps. Most of the radio talk and talking heads was Bush was the savior and defintely the first pick. Guess Young is the one in the HOF now.

Understandable, all are fans and want what's best for the team - but to note that if the Texans don't pick the player you want, you're jumping ship... well, here's your life-preserver... have fun.

I'm personally in the 4th camp - bring in a quality HC and coordinators, we'll work on GM later if need be. Bob has gotten a little smarter, Reeves is consulting, Casserly's on a shorter leash - we'll see what happens.

The Texans will get a quality player with the first pick, hopefully to save some "fandom" - they get the one that applies to you this day... week... month? Assuming Casserly pulls better players in rounds 2 and 3 as well to contradict his previous performance.

If Young goes to the Titans, good luck to him. He most likely will be comfortable there with McNair his camp leader.... better get his track shoes on though to shoot out from the shotgun formation, don't recall McNair having many people to throw too last year.
 
barzilla said:
Everyone is talking about how much this is a simple decision. This is based on one football game folks. One football game. It's a football game where Bush had more than 250 all-purpose yards I'll add. If you can sit there and honestly tell me you would have favored Young over Bush BEFORE the game then I'll respect that opinion, but people were torching that USC defense all year. Heck, let's draft Brady Quinn since he torched USC. Come on folks, as amazing as Young's performance was we need some perspective here. If Young weren't from Houston some of you would be still thinking Bush. Geography shouldn't have anything to do with it. Let's go out and get the best football player.
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I've favored most players over reggie bush, i've been consistent in the fact i think he will be an absolute bust.
 
RTP2110 said:
At least Im not one of the ones doing backflips for Vince Young just because he's from Houston.
.
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Me either.

I'm doing backflips because the Texans have a shot at a QB who is a game chnger, a rare athlete with outstanding leadership skills who will win at the next level - it's in his makeup. But the fact that he's one of our own makes it even more special - and more devastating if we lose him.
 
I just find it amusing that before the Rosebowl there might have been 3 or 4 posters that were pro-Young with the rest divided among Bush and trade down camps. Most of the radio talk and talking heads was Bush was the savior and defintely the first pick. Guess Young is the one in the HOF now.
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I've been wanting VY, but he kept saying he was gonna stay another year, so he was out of the pic......but he is hinting he wants to come out now, so yes I want dude in a texans uni.
 
The Dream said:
I've been wanting VY, but he kept saying he was gonna stay another year, so he was out of the pic......but he is hinting he wants to come out now, so yes I want dude in a texans uni.
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He is hinting that he wants to be a Texan, all the more special.
 
A4toZ said:
I just find it amusing that before the Rosebowl there might have been 3 or 4 posters that were pro-Young with the rest divided among Bush and trade down camps. Most of the radio talk and talking heads was Bush was the savior and defintely the first pick. Guess Young is the one in the HOF now.
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That's because he said I'm coming back to school. Then after the game he said I gotta talk with the Family etc... Excuse the doo-doo out of us for believing him. Have you never changed your mind?
 
VY said he was gonna go back to school and it looked like he really was going to and he still might, but the situation has changed and we'll know about his final decision in a few days. Everyone in Houston who is a football fan is a fan of VY it's not an overnight thing that just happened. There was always that possibility lurking in every Texan's fans mind and now it might just come true. We'll just have to wait and see...
 
You people have lost your damn minds. Before the Rose Bowl Reggie Bush was GOD on this board. True, Vince Young had an amazing performance, but it was one game against a weak defense. I'm sorry aj, but Vince has not "dominated" for the past two years. Last year, NFL scouts wanted to turn him in to a WR. Remember? It wasn't until the Rose Bowl last year that VY broke out.

What almost every one of you is forgetting is that Bush was the BEST PLAYER IN COLLEGE FOOTBALL for the whole year. Sorry but, one game doesn't change that. Plus he had a pretty damn good performance against a STRONG Texas defense. 13 carries for 80 yards is over 6 yards per carry. 6 receptions for 90 something yards is over 15 per reception.

Get a grip people. For some of you to say Bush had a "subpar" performance is down right RETARDED. Bush looked electric turning the corner and in the open field in that game. I can't wait to see this guy in a Texans uni.

Vince is a much bigger risk than Bush for a couple of reasons:

-He not close to the passer that Carr is, just doesn't have the arm strength.
-He won't be able to scramble like he does in college.
-He will be coming to play behind the same horrible pass blocking line that Carr played behind.

Let's fix the line, get a new coach, and not give up on our first pick in the draft 4 years ago. Many of you forget Carr was progressing nicely before this last season. And then lets get the best player in College. REGGIE BUSH!!!!
 
I see you made good on your idea to switch avatars, hook 'em. Nice.

Yeah, why does VY have to flirt with Houston during all this? Totally frustrated by this situation. :confused:

You'd think that if he was going to turn pro...he would have done it by now. Which makes me think he's not exactly liking his prospects with the top few teams. In short: He wants the Texans, but they don't want him. He wants the Titans, but the Saints stand in the way at number 2 and he sure doesn't want to play for New Orleans if he's as smart and legendary as he's being made out to be. BTW, Saints are in a horrible spot because NOBODY wants to go there.

Oh well, I guess the only source of pleasure I get from all this is that Leinart The Arrogant (by virtue of staying "one more year") is pretty much going to New Orleans and you know he's barfing over THAT. Tee-hee-hee....
 
Nope, never hcnaged my mind Big B. No need for the calling out - even though I don't think I directed the opinion at you.

Besides, if he does come here - great, love to have him. But I'll leave it up to those that get paid for the decision to make it and won't result in me heading to another team if they don't.

My point I guess, was that we'll end up with one of the "3 players" that will help the team unless we do trade down - so I'm not to worried about other teams picking up the other 2.
 
pskinny said:
What almost every one of you is forgetting is that Bush was the BEST PLAYER IN COLLEGE FOOTBALL for the whole year. Sorry but, one game doesn't change that.
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Only according to ESPN and the the foolish Heisman voters who look dumb at this point. Funny how all the VY bashers point to "ONE GAME" when UT averaged 50 points a game and Young set historic records...one game at a time.
 
Vinny said:
Only according to ESPN and the the foolish Heisman voters who look dumb at this point. Funny how all the VY bashers point to "ONE GAME" when UT averaged 50 points a game and Young set historic records...one game at a time.
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I'm not a hater, just don't think we should give up on Carr. I'd like to see him mentored by a offensive minded coach like Kubiak. I love the idea of having Carr, AJ, Bush, and DD on the field at the same time. I love the idea of finding a coach that can find creative ways to use Bush whether if it's lining up in the backfield, or in the slot. I also think RB is a huge need for this team being that DD can't stay healthy.

Bush averaged 8.9 yards per carry on the year, and 30 yards per touch down, scoring 19. I just feel like he's the game breaker we need.
 
pskinny said:
Bush averaged 8.9 yards per carry on the year, and 30 yards per touch down, scoring 19. I just feel like he's the game breaker we need.
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Bush didn't have any more impressive stats than JJ Arrington last year, and Denny Green is looking for another back this year...Also, Desmond Howard was the last great Heisman winning open field runner (ie slash/kick returner) that was unstoppable in College....Casserly drafted him too. We may be getting the Desmond Howard of Running backs....when backs are a dime a dozen around the NFL. We have a chance to change our fortunes with a Franchise QB....and they are hard to come by. I'd love us to take a chance on greatness instead of pouring good money after bad...but thats just me.
 
Vinny you used to be the voice of reason on this board. While every body as having knee jerk reactions, you would try to right the ship, calm everybody down.

Well that's exactly what is happening here. Before the Rose Bowl it was all Bush, nobody was talkin VY. After ONE GAME, all that has changed.

What happened man?
 
The most surprising thing about Young's performance vs. Texas A&M isn't that we held him to 162 yards passing, it was that we held him to 19 yards rushing on 11 attempts..... our self-admittedly pathetic defense smothered Vince Young through the air and on the ground, ruining his chances at the Heisman. He looked horribly mediocre that game.

Everyone's buying into the VY hype right now, just as everyone was buying into the Bush hype in recent weeks. I see Vince Young turning into Steve McNair in the NFL, the quarterback who's a great leader and a special playmaker because he's nearly impossible to bring down. I would probably be happier drafting Young over Bush at this point, but I won't crestfallen if we pass on Young. Like many have stated, the draft is somewhat of a crapshoot, how many "sure things" have ended up being busts? Too many to count, and you can say that Vince Young will be successful in the NFL all you want but you're going to have to wait years before declaring who's right on the issue. I think Young'll be special, but there's still plenty of quarterbacks I'd much rather have. It's easy to be critical of the front office no matter who they choose in these situations, so I'm preaching patience and to be reasonable in your criticism. It's not like we won't be having a very similar argument, just with new names, every year for the rest of the franchise's lifetime.
 
Vinny said:
We may be getting the Desmond Howard of Running backs.....
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.....Or the Andre Ware of Quarter Backs.....I hardly think that Bush is comparable to JJ Arrington.
 
pskinny said:
Vinny you used to be the voice of reason on this board. While every body as having knee jerk reactions, you would try to right the ship, calm everybody down.

Well that's exactly what is happening here. Before the Rose Bowl it was all Bush, nobody was talkin VY. After ONE GAME, all that has changed.

What happened man?
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I just give football opinion and I don't agree with you. That's what happened. If you search my history you will see that I have called Vince Young a "future NFL superstar" for well over a year. Everyone knows I am not high on David Carr to boot...this is nothing new for me. We are now in position to take him....and I will let the Texans know how I feel as a fan. Simple.
 
BREAZE said:
Steve McNair took VY under his wing and became a mentor/father figure for a while now. He could keep mentoring him his 1st couple of years as a Titan...a great situation for VY.
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I think McNair is about to be due a $50 million roster bonus. Obviously, they would have to renegotiate that in order to keep Steve. But, McNair would still want to be paid and I don't think many teams can afford to keep 2 high priced QBs on their roster. Especially not the cap-strapped Titans. Look for Billy Volek to do the mentoring if Tennessee selects Vince.
 
pskinny said:
Vinny you used to be the voice of reason on this board. While every body as having knee jerk reactions, you would try to right the ship, calm everybody down.

Well that's exactly what is happening here. Before the Rose Bowl it was all Bush, nobody was talkin VY. After ONE GAME, all that has changed.

What happened man?
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Just so you know, me and Vinny have been the drivers of the VY bandwagon forever. It's just we didnt think he would come out.
 
Vinny said:
I just give football opinion and I don't agree with you. That's what happened. If you search my history you will see that I have called Vince Young a "future NFL superstar" for well over a year. Everyone knows I am not high on David Carr to boot...this is nothing new for me. We are now in position to take him....and I will let the Texans know how I feel as a fan. Simple.
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Fair enough.
 
pskinny said:
.....Or the Andre Ware of Quarter Backs.....I hardly think that Bush is comparable to JJ Arrington.
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You are the one that threw out the stats...I just mentioned a back from the last draft that had the same stat line.
 
Vinny said:
You are the one that threw out the stats...I just mentioned a back from the last draft that had the same stat line.
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I don't remeber JJ's stats in college, but I'll take your word for it. Regardless, a weak comparison.
 
This is the smart decision. Take Bush or trade down. I don't give a crap if Vince Young is from Houston, he's not the answer to the Texans problems. Bush isn't either and I'd rather have them trade down, but I'll take Bush over Vince.
 
A4toZ said:
I just find it amusing that before the Rosebowl there might have been 3 or 4 posters that were pro-Young with the rest divided among Bush and trade down camps. Most of the radio talk and talking heads was Bush was the savior and defintely the first pick. Guess Young is the one in the HOF now.
.
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Before the Rose Bowl, Vince had yet to drive home the fact that he is the best player in college football. He knew it. His teammates knew it. Some of his fans knew it. But on that night, he made sure that millions more would know it. Chief Osceola couldn't have driven it home any better.

Great players have signature games where you look at them differently after as compared to before. I think it's more an evolution of knowledge or awareness in this case, and not so much hype as you infer.
 
Fiddy said:
Just so you know, me and Vinny have been the drivers of the VY bandwagon forever. It's just we didnt think he would come out.
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Thank you.
If we knew that there would be a chance of VY coming out this year AND having the first pick there might have been some Battle Orange days at Reliant this year. Everyone liked BUSH because we he was the best player that we knew would be there. Now that Vince may come out, he is the best player out there because he is just better than Reggie. And I will say that unless something drastic happens like the return of Chris Palmer or something, VY will produce more than Bush. Where ever he goes. And everything will return to normal in Houston as we watch yet another one get away....
 
Fiddy said:
Just so you know, me and Vinny have been the drivers of the VY bandwagon forever. It's just we didnt think he would come out.
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NOBODY DID!!! This debate and point is way old and stupid. Had VY said at the start of 2005 it would be his last year at UT this board would have been flooded with VY talk.

I'm beginning to think some of you making this dumb aurgument saw VY for the 1st time Wed...
 
Maybe we think that by stating early that we're gonna take Bush, Vince will think more about staying, giving us a shot at him next year.
 
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