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Bryce Young vs CJ Stroud

I would honestly be happy with either Young or Stroud. It depends on what the coaching staff and NC are searching for and how the draft process goes.

I don’t think Nick waits until next year. I think there’s too much on the line. There has to be some improvement next year or else there might be another GM search in ‘24.
 
This time last year they were saying the same thing about Stroud and Young.

Thanks for underscoring my point.

Last year QB class didn’t see a QB drafted until the 20th pick in the first round. How many of those QBs are showing franchise quality? Maybe Kenny Pickett. Maybe. Even then - work in progress.

That’s why everyone was saying next year the QB crop is better that year. And this year is the same story.
 
Greener grass syndrome.
Still, I think Stroud can be a good upgrade over Mills with a credible chance to improve under some competent coaching.
This is true of 95% of all rookies.

That competent coaching is the underlying problem. Mills regressed this year. With this coaching staff there isn’t a QB that has a chance for a bright future.

Yet people want to draft one? Cmon people.
 

starts @ 7:30 mark

Herd talks about Tua and Teddy injuries
Sean Payton: "Lets not draft small players in the first 15 picks of the draft anymore"

he later adds a caveat "Unless they can walk on water"
cites Aaron Glenn as an example of exceptions to the rule
 
It was true, last yrs QB class was awful

This yrs class is mediocre.

Kenny Picket (#22) would have made a bigger difference than Kenyon Green (#15). I don’t give a rats ass about being deep if it means nailing best of class.

so now let’s bump it up, one year later, and convince all of us, why not take best of class now?
 
Kenny Picket (#22) would have made a bigger difference than Kenyon Green (#15). I don’t give a rats ass about being deep if it means nailing best of class.

so now let’s bump it up, one year later, and convince all of us, why not take best of class now?

No.

Texans play calling sucked.

Pickett had mentor in Trubisky.

Better all around team to help him progress with Steelers.
 
Kenny Picket (#22) would have made a bigger difference than Kenyon Green (#15). I don’t give a rats ass about being deep if it means nailing best of class.

so now let’s bump it up, one year later, and convince all of us, why not take best of class now?

Who is the best of class now?

Nobody at the time thought Pickett would be as good as he's been. In fact they made fun of his tiny hands.

Let's wait for the last draft class to get healthy and see where this goes.
 
I don’t think we have to worry about picking a qb. This is the Texans we’re talking about. We’ll probably stick with Mills anyway. :hankpalm:
 
That competent coaching is the underlying problem. Mills regressed this year. With this coaching staff there isn’t a QB that has a chance for a bright future.

Yet people want to draft one? Cmon people.
no.. we want coaching staff gone and new ones in place that can draft well and train up.
 
Mentor and Trubiski in same breath sort of takes my breath away like -- a kick in the

Not everyone can be Tyrod Taylor.

To be a good mentor or even coach for that matter doesn’t mean you have to be the best player. The best players rarely turn into great coaches. Larry Bird is one of the few who immediately comes to mined that showed the ability to coach at a high level and still be one of the best to play at his position ever.

It’s a different skill set. Not saying Trubisky is even good, but having someone teach you what to do and what not to do is valuable.
 
"People" realize this franchise needs a QB to build around. Many of these "people" would prefer that to be with a new coaching staff.

The audio was horrible.

I understand. It comes down to building a team for a QB to be drafted or drafting a QB and then build the team around that person.

I just think from an investment stand point we are investing a lot into a position that is not set up for success. Whether it is Young or Stroud they both are more likely to flame out on this team as it stands today. The coaching and the team talent surrounding them isn’t good enough. It reminds me of Baker Mayfield in Cleveland. Or Tannehill in Miami.

I think it is all timing. Lovie and crew will get another year of except for maybe Pep but wouldn’t be surprised if he is back. The team could fill more holes in free agency and draft. Wait for better talent at the QB position next year. It lines up better IMHO. You could stand to get Williams or Maye. Or no one.

One thing is for sure - Mills, Pep, and Lovie have a good chance of getting us another top 3 pick.

It’s all opinion for everyone.
 
I understand. It comes down to building a team for a QB to be drafted or drafting a QB and then build the team around that person.

I just think from an investment stand point we are investing a lot into a position that is not set up for success. Whether it is Young or Stroud they both are more likely to flame out on this team as it stands today. The coaching and the team talent surrounding them isn’t good enough. It reminds me of Baker Mayfield in Cleveland. Or Tannehill in Miami.

I think it is all timing. Lovie and crew will get another year of except for maybe Pep but wouldn’t be surprised if he is back. The team could fill more holes in free agency and draft. Wait for better talent at the QB position next year. It lines up better IMHO. You could stand to get Williams or Maye. Or no one.

One thing is for sure - Mills, Pep, and Lovie have a good chance of getting us another top 3 pick.

It’s all opinion for everyone.

a qb period is bound to flame out no matter what team they go to. Trubisky had a damn good team around him when he was drafted by the Bears...Still flamed out. Jared Goff, same deal.
 
a qb period is bound to flame out no matter what team they go to. Trubisky had a damn good team around him when he was drafted by the Bears...Still flamed out. Jared Goff, same deal.

It’s about playing the odds too.

A rookie QB needs the right system and team to succeed otherwise they will flame out. Tannehill and Geno are some case examples.

We don’t have a system to say a rookie QB would work here. We don’t have a team to compliment the rookie QB.

We are already behind the 8-ball.

If Lovie is fired and a whole new coaching staff is brought in that is half the problem solved.

Could we draft a QB, fill holes through FA and draft?
 
We don’t have a system to say a rookie QB would work here. We don’t have a team to compliment the rookie QB.

We are already behind the 8-ball.

This is something that a lot of people either don't understand, or refuse to understand. The basics of a football team aren't even here yet.

They'll probably be drafting 2nd, because I think Lovie is honest about wanting to beat Indy and not caring about the draft pick.
 
This is something that a lot of people either don't understand, or refuse to understand. The basics of a football team aren't even here yet.

They'll probably be drafting 2nd, because I think Lovie is honest about wanting to beat Indy and not caring about the draft pick.

I will be so pissed if that happens and Chicago gets a kings ransom for the first pick for a QB needy team to draft Young/Stroud.

Or how about this? What if we give up a draft pick to move up to first to get the first?
 
I will be so pissed if that happens and Chicago gets a kings ransom for the first pick for a QB needy team to draft Young/Stroud.

Or how about this? What if we give up a draft pick to move up to first to get the first?

If we end up with the 1st pick, I'm gonna say trade down. With the 2nd pick, I don't know. I haven't really started looking into who's the top folks in the draft next year yet, but I'm all in for another try at a "once in a lifetime generational" DL guy. We've used the numero uno on that twice already, and both were failures. Why not a 3rd whack at it?
 
It’s about playing the odds too.

A rookie QB needs the right system and team to succeed otherwise they will flame out. Tannehill and Geno are some case examples.

We don’t have a system to say a rookie QB would work here. We don’t have a team to compliment the rookie QB.

We are already behind the 8-ball.

If Lovie is fired and a whole new coaching staff is brought in that is half the problem solved.

Could we draft a QB, fill holes through FA and draft?

This is what I've been trying to say, in addition to thinking the 2024 QB class is better than the 2023 QB class. Cal wants a QB though and the 1-1 pick will be a QB. Hopefully Young. Gotta start to sell those tickets again.
 
C.J. Stroud.
LMAO

That would be a 1st

I was responding to the tweet, which was inaccurate at best.

So you're willing to bet that Stroud will be the 1st, given Day's recent track record of developing QB's?

Insanity
 
Not everyone can be Tyrod Taylor.

To be a good mentor or even coach for that matter doesn’t mean you have to be the best player. The best players rarely turn into great coaches. Larry Bird is one of the few who immediately comes to mined that showed the ability to coach at a high level and still be one of the best to play at his position ever.

It’s a different skill set. Not saying Trubisky is even good, but having someone teach you what to do and what not to do is valuable.
I am not against Certain people as mentors. I do not want trubisky Teaching anything to our players.
 
LMAO

That would be a 1st

I was responding to the tweet, which was inaccurate at best.

So you're willing to bet that Stroud will be the 1st, given Day's recent track record of developing QB's?

Insanity

QBs don’t stop developing when they sign a pro contract. I’m counting on the Texans finding a coach that can continue a young QBs development.
 
So Ryan Day has been with Ohio State since 2017,

QBs drafted

2019 Dwayne Haskins drafted #15 overall.
2021 Josh fields drafted #10 overall
2023 CJ Stroud projected as top 10 if not top 5

QBs through Ohio State

Joe Burrow 2015-2018 (actually graduated from OSU) draft #1 overall
Quinn Ewers 2021 transferred back University of Texas
 
Arguably the two biggest knocks on Ohio State quarterback C.J. Stroud had been that he wasn’t creating enough outside of structure and he didn’t threaten defenses with his legs (either by choice or as demanded by his coaches). He flipped both arguments against Georgia. At the risk of putting too much emphasis on one game, how significant was that showing to Stroud’s NFL outlook?

Dane Brugler:
NFL scouts focus on the body of work, not single-game performances. But when a prospect puts something new on tape (and not just any tape, but in the biggest game of his career), it forces a reevaluation. Against Georgia in the playoffs, Stroud played his best game in an Ohio State jersey. All of last season and through the 2022 regular season, Stroud proved he can be a surgical passer but was inconsistent when required to move the pocket, change throwing platforms or scramble. It’s not that he was incapable of those things — just that he didn’t appear comfortable. Against the Bulldogs, he showed impressive composure which allowed him to stay in rhythm from the pocket and when on the move.

In his first 27 games at Ohio State, Stroud forced one missed tackle; against Georgia, he forced three. Earlier this season, Stroud set a career high with three scrambles against Penn State; against Georgia, he had six. Again, teams grade prospects — especially quarterbacks — based on the body of work, but this was the type of performance that will increase a team’s comfort level in drafting Stroud early.

Nick Baumgardner: There is a part of me that wishes Stroud (with NIL money in his pocket, of course) could spend another year learning at Ohio State with Ryan Day and all those receivers because I really think the biggest critiques of his game — which are all fair — are time-on-task issues. The inability to consistently handle pressure, or even for a different coverage than expected or a wrong route, has been the issue.

As Dane wrote, though, it’s not that he hates to run or doesn’t know how to run. It’s about him being comfortable enough to slow his brain down to sort through his options. He’s only 21. He’s still growing into the player he’s going to become.

The Georgia game was a big step, but it’s also one (important) piece in a giant puzzle. If you were uncertain about why he’s had some of those issues, the playoff loss might have checked off a few boxes. However, I’m still concerned about where his confidence and comfortability will be next season if he’s drafted by a desperate franchise looking for immediate results. There’s so much to like about Stroud’s game, but he’s young and played in a very QB-friendly system in Columbus. It may take time.



Diante Lee: Dane made a similar point, but what matters most is that Stroud added a significant data point to his evaluation. It’s one thing to manage collapsing pockets and escape from unblocked pressure, but Stroud turning dead-to-rights sacks into explosive plays against Georgia will mean something in the greater evaluation of his college career.

I was astounded by how effectively Stroud managed plays as things broke down, his balance and mechanics when throwing on the run and the handful of times he recognized he could tuck and run. On the other hand, I now have to go back to reevaluate how and why he’d had such an issue managing pressure before that game. I know the Ohio State offense to be more vertical in the passing game than others, and it asks its quarterback to hold the ball as receivers work to open grass. But that means that the quarterback has to use his legs as his own checkdown, a frustration many had with Justin Fields when he played for Day.

Stroud is still learning and growing as a player. If he can commit more often to punishing defenses with his legs, there’s still reason to believe he can be the best quarterback in this draft class. For the most optimistic front office, this was a peek into Stroud’s ceiling. That kind of creation out of structure wins tough games on Sundays.

 
Any coach in particular that you have in mind?
There are many OCs that I think deserve a chance. I would consider a defensive minded coach that could bring in a good OC.

Shane Steichen - Eagles
Kellen Moore - Cowboys
Mike Kafka - Giants
Wes Phillips - Vikings
Shane Waldron - Seahawks
Ben Johnson - Lions
Byron Leftwich - Bucs
Ken Dorsey - Bills
Brian Callahan - Bengals

Joe Brady - Bills as an OC
 
LMAO

That would be a 1st

I was responding to the tweet, which was inaccurate at best.

So you're willing to bet that Stroud will be the 1st, given Day's recent track record of developing QB's?

Insanity
Who did Kingsbury and Jeff Tedford develop before Mahomes and Rodgers?
 
This is what I've been trying to say, in addition to thinking the 2024 QB class is better than the 2023 QB class. Cal wants a QB though and the 1-1 pick will be a QB. Hopefully Young. Gotta start to sell those tickets again.
I haven’t heard Cal say anything about a QB or nothing. Has he spoken in the last 4 weeks?
 
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