Brock Osweiler agrees to 4 year 72 million

[Shishkabob]

Schaub at his peak was a Top 15 QB, that's not to shabby. Clearly you're not familiar with the Atlanta trade for Julio Jones or Jacksonville trade for Derrick Harvey. #1 is not the target, No way Titans trade with division rival, #3 #4 or #6 would've been.o

I am well aware however moving up to 6 or 8 is a lot less expensive then moving up to #1. neither of those trades were dont with divisional rivals either. I think you can go back and see the RG3 as more of a base and that was only moving to #2 from #6. Or you can look at what Chip tried to give up just to move to number to to draft Mariota.

BTW Schuab at his peak was a perennial top 10 QB. There was a solid 4 or 5 year stretch with him being a top 10 QB with a couple seasons as a top 5. If we got our defense going sooner we might have a ring right now

 

[WolverineFan]

I dont think you can say Fisher constantly having a top 5 recruiting class means he has an elite eye for talent. They rank recruiting classes based on the player evaluations coming out of HS. Of course the teams that get the most 5 star and 4 star recruits will have the best recruiting class grade. That doesnt show an eye for talent as every college coach in the country knows how talented those players are and they make a push to get those kids.

FSU had 11 players drafted last year. They had 7 the year before that and 11 the year before that. 6 of those 29 players were 1st rounders. That's an average of 9 players drafted and 2 1st rounders per draft over the last 3 years. I'd say they were pretty talented.

 

[Shishkabob]

FSU had 11 players drafted last year. They had 7 the year before that and 11 the year before that. 6 of those 29 players were 1st rounders. That's an average of 9 players drafted and 2 1st rounders per draft over the last 3 years. I'd say they were pretty talented.

I never said FSU didnt have talented players. I said consistently having a top flight recruiting class isnt doesnt mean you have a keen eye for talent. Recruiting class grades are based on a national scouting system, so sure you can get a bunch of 5 star recruits doesnt mean you have an eye for talent even though you are bringing in talent

 

[Texian]

FSU had 11 players drafted last year. They had 7 the year before that and 11 the year before that. 6 of those 29 players were 1st rounders. That's an average of 9 players drafted and 2 1st rounders per draft over the last 3 years. I'd say they were pretty talented.

I would say Jimbo Fisher knows NFL talent.

 

[Mollywhopper]

Schaub at his peak was a Top 15 QB, that's not to shabby. Clearly you're not familiar with the Atlanta trade for Julio Jones or Jacksonville trade for Derrick Harvey. #1 is not the target, #3 #4 or #6 would've been. No way Titans trade with division rival. And if you miss out, how much better off are you with Osweiller than say Lynch or Cook.

I think considerably. Which is why, although I would have been happier to have pulled off the truckload deal to land one of Goff/Wentz, I'm perfectly content with the Os signing. And especially considering the makeup of the Os' contract.

 

[Shishkabob]

I would say Jimbo Fisher knows NFL talent.

you could say that about a lot of major programs then. As far as current NFL players go FSU is tied in 6th place with most being in the NFL

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap30...ams-with-the-most-alums-on-nfl-week-1-rosters

 

[WolverineFan]

I never said FSU didnt have talented players. I said consistently having a top flight recruiting class isnt doesnt mean you have a keen eye for talent. Recruiting class grades are based on a national scouting system, so sure you can get a bunch of 5 star recruits doesnt mean you have an eye for talent even though you are bringing in talent

Bjoern Werner (1st)
Xavier Rhodes (1st)
Cameron Erving (1st)
Menelik Watson (2nd)
Terrence Brooks (3rd)
Tre' Jackson (4th)
Bryan Stork (4th)

All of those are lower rated recruits who got drafted in the first 4 rounds under Fisher. Yes, he recruits highly rated guys that are basically NFL ready out of high school. He also takes lower rated guys, develops them, and gets them drafted high as well. Saban, Fisher, and Harbaugh are the masters of developing college players for the NFL. Yes, they rake in highly rated classes that are going to spit guys out into the draft no matter what, but they also develop a lot of under the radar recruits as well.

 

[Shishkabob]

Bjoern Werner (1st)
Xavier Rhodes (1st)
Cameron Erving (1st)
Menelik Watson (2nd)
Terrence Brooks (3rd)
Tre' Jackson (4th)
Bryan Stork (4th)

All of those are lower rated recruits who got drafted in the first 4 rounds under Fisher. Yes, he recruits highly rated guys that are basically NFL ready out of high school. He also takes lower rated guys, develops them, and gets them drafted high as well. Saban, Fisher, and Harbaugh are the masters of developing college players for the NFL. Yes, they rake in highly rated classes that are going to spit guys out into the draft no matter what, but they also develop a lot of under the radar recruits as well.

i understand this i was just saying using his recruiting classes rankings as a measure isnt the right way to go about it. The information you just posted would have been a lot better for him to use to make his argument.

 

[Texian]

you could say that about a lot of major programs then. As far as current NFL players go FSU is tied in 6th place with most being in the NFL

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap30...ams-with-the-most-alums-on-nfl-week-1-rosters

Your link is a bit misleading from a time frame and a coaches tenure stand point. Some schools had multiple coaches in that link. As Wolverrine noted, Fisher had 29 players drafted over the last 3 years, how does that compare to to others. When you get done with the math Fisher will in the top percentile. For example Georgia #s reflect Mark Picht as HC for 15 years; FSU Jimbo Fisher with only 6 years as HC.

 

[DBCooper]

I'm not really a fan of mediocrity or being average and ordinary. I'd prefer a higher commitment to excellence.

And your way is the only way

 

[Wolf]

Well in 2 years if the brock experiment doesn't work out and the Texans flop

.,maybe mcnair goes after wolf and Fisher because bob and rick should be gone

Who knows

 

[Texian]

And your way is the only way

No but I do disagree with the McNair's way of building this football team. He operates with a band aid panic mentality. After 2013 season almost every one here on this message board knew the Texans had a QB problem. McNair thought that Case Keenum was the answer. Last year he trusted O'Brien would fix the QB problem with Hoyer. This year....you know the story. McNair plans for the year/season at hand and not so much 3, 4, 5 and 10 years ahead.

 

[Shishkabob]

Your link is a bit misleading from a time frame and a coaches tenure stand point. Some schools had multiple coaches in that link. As Wolverrine noted, Fisher had 29 players drafted over the last 3 years, how does that compare to to others. When you get done with the math Fisher will in the top percentile. For example Georgia #s reflect Mark Picht as HC for 15 years; FSU Jimbo Fisher with only 6 years as HC.

I just mainly used the link to show that you could make the same argument for a lot of power house programs. The top school usually send the most NFL level talent. Now if you show me a list of a college coach getting lower recruits to the NFL then I could say thats having a keen eye for talent. Since those are players most didnt think highly of, but someone like Fisher or Saban saw something in and coached them up

 

[steelbtexan]

what exactly has AA done in his career to make you think he is a big upgrade? to me he is another depth/ competition guy that hopefully will work out but im not expecting him to as a starter

I'm not counting on him to be the starter due to coming off of injury. Before got injured he was a guy that could cover the Slot/TE for the Jets. He could also drop down and play the nickel/dime LB. Never an all star but a very solid player who didn't make alot of mistakes. Kinda like Glover Quin. Definitely an upgrade over Demps who is a serviceable SS.

 

[Texian]

I just mainly used the link to show that you could make the same argument for a lot of power house programs. The top school usually send the most NFL level talent. Now if you show me a list of a college coach getting lower recruits to the NFL then I could say thats having a keen eye for talent. Since those are players most didnt think highly of, but someone like Fisher or Saban saw something in and coached them up

You keep trying to explain your way out of this only to dig yourself a deeper hole. Stop digging.

 

[Double Barrel]

Casserly has a lot of cred here. I feel better than ever about the Osweiler signing.

haha! I saw Charlie say that on NFLN and thought the exact same thing!! It has that same sort of vibe as when John McClain says that something is certain and you can bank on the exact opposite being true.

I do have to give Charlie a little credit for admitting that he fubared the Texans when he was here. I guess enough time has passed to allow him to laugh about it now, so he can go **** himself.

When they want an expert opinion on shitty GMs, they go to Charlie Casserly.

 

[Shishkabob]

I'm not counting on him to be the starter due to coming off of injury. Before got injured he was a guy that could cover the Slot/TE for the Jets. He could also drop down and play the nickel/dime LB. Never an all star but a very solid player who didn't make alot of mistakes. Kinda like Glover Quin. Definitely an upgrade over Demps who is a serviceable SS.

I think we have another couple of guys like that on our roster in Ballentine and Clientt. Ballentine is a really big safety, but his measurements are crazy for a guy his size. Clientt was kind of that tweener LB/S and before he got hurt he was making a splash in camp. Hopefully they all can come back fully healthy and ready to compete

 

[Shishkabob]

You keep trying to explain your way out of this only to dig yourself a deeper hole. Stop digging.

not digging anything just explaining myself. I said using a top 5 recruiting class is not a good indication of a keen eye for talent since everyone knows they are talented, then the other poster used his players going to the NFL to say they are talented which i agreed to, but a lot of programs such as Bama and OSU send players to the NFL by the truckload. When he brought up his low recruit guys becoming NFL level players I admitted that was a good indication of having an eye for talent.

 

[Double Barrel]

I'm just the messenger here passing along Charley's tweet.

I believe it was McNair who made the final decision on Carr because Bob liked the idea and wanted David being the face of the franchise.

Imagine, if you can, that Charley is right about Lynch and if the Texans drafted Lynch at #22 it would cost them $9MM over 4 years instead of the $72MM they paid for Osweiller.

Charley has a definite bias here and an ax to grind with the Texans because they told him it was time for him to go, so take it for what it's worth.

Sean Jones confirmed it (and continues to confirm it) on his local radio show.

He was being interviewed to be Charlie's capologist and when asked who he'd pick no. 1, Jones said hands down Julius Peppers. Mentality was build a good defensive foundation, and start to build the offense over a couple of seasons so all you would need is a QB.

Jones said Carr was always penciled in as no. 1 because of the marketing angle, plain and simple. McNair thought he was a family man and looked good in a Texans uniform, and they were trying to sell this team to the city at the time. Of course, this city was so hungry for a football team that none of that was really needed, but that's what you get with a boardroom mentality that relies on focus groups to market products. That's why we are the Houston Texans and not something cool like the Texas Toros (IMO, of course).

Imagine when Brock takes us to the Super Bowl

You may say I'm a dreamer
But I'm not the only one
I hope someday you'll join us
And the world will be as one

So much of what you think you know is simply not true. Think of me as Texans fan in much the same way you think of the Chicago Cubs fans.

I have thought about your Chicago Cubs fan example for many years (as in this must be what it feels like to be a Chicago Cubs fan, but with the Texans).

Vinny used to take a lot of heat for being critical of the franchise, to the point that he changed his title to "Shiny Happy Fan" (which I think is still on his profile today). He never could tow the company line and eventually got tired of always being attacked anytime he was perceived as saying something critical or negative. Dude had some excellent football takes, too, but he no longer even visits Texans Talk after getting burned out by all of it.

He did leave us with his classic line "it's a marketing company with a football division", and I've used it for many years since then.

 

[Texian]

I have thought about your Chicago Cubs fan example for many years (as in this must be what it feels like to be a Chicago Cubs fan, but with the Texans).

Vinny used to take a lot of heat for being critical of the franchise, to the point that he changed his title to "Shiny Happy Fan" (which I think is still on his profile today). He never could tow the company line and eventually got tired of always being attacked anytime he was perceived as saying something critical or negative. Dude had some excellent football takes, too, but he no longer even visits Texans Talk after getting burned out by all of it.

He did leave us with his classic line "it's a marketing company with a football division", and I've used it for many years since then.

I miss Lord Bills, he was articulate and explained so well the Texans failed plan and ways of doing business. Sharp, smarter than you average bear.

 

[leebigeztx]

I would say Jimbo Fisher knows NFL talent.

So did Mack Brown, what does it really mean? Spurrier failed and so did Saban,but doesnt mean they dont know nfl talent. Can they coach it? Big difference.

 

[EllisUnit]

I miss Lord Bills, he was articulate and explained so well the Texans failed plan and ways of doing business. Sharp, smarter than you average bear.

I miss that guy like I miss an itch I can't reach....

 

[TexansSeminole]

I that guy like I miss an itch I can't reach....

He was one of the very worst ever in the history of this board, actually.

Articulate is a joke of a word to describe him.

Nothing against you Texian, I think you're getting a little more flak than you should over some of your opinions here. I respect your opinion on many things and I agree with them sometimes, but Lord Bills was obnoxious.

 

[Texian]

He was one of the very worst ever in the history of this board, actually.

Articulate is a joke of a word to describe him.

Nothing against you Texian, I think you're getting a little more flak than you should over some of your opinions here. I respect your opinion on many things and I agree with them sometimes, but Lord Bills was obnoxious.

So your not a fan of Lord Bills, well he did tell it like it is in a way that nobody could misunderstand exactly what he was saying.

 

[TexansSeminole]

So your not a fan of Lord Bills, well he did tell it like it is in a way that nobody could misunderstand exactly what he was saying.

Ah you were being sarcastic. I think? Need a sarc-o-meter.

 

[Fred]

I miss Lord Bills, he was articulate and explained so well the Texans failed plan and ways of doing business. Sharp, smarter than you average bear.

BAWWHAHAHAHA!!! That is either the most hilarious thing ever said on the internet, or you forget the sarcasm smilie. Without the smilie, whatever cred you had on this site is GONE!

Lord Bills was the worst ever; the stupidest, most ignorant, and obnoxious a#%hole who ever chanced across the World Wide Web. It would be pointless to have him around any more since we no longer have negative rep. A brillant poster (hey, I think it was me!) once said "I don't always give negative rep, but when I do, I prefer to give it to Lord Bills".

 

[Texian]

So did Mack Brown, what does it really mean? Spurrier failed and so did Saban,but doesnt mean they dont know nfl talent. Can they coach it? Big difference.

You do know that Mack Brown's last year the Longhorns did not have one player drafted and that hadn't happened since 1937 (The primary reason why he was fired). Spurrier quit (he didn't get fired) and forfeited a BIG time salary left on his multi year contract because he said he wasn't allowed to make any personnel decisions during his time in Washington (what have I told you about meddling owners) AND Saban has publicly stated that if the Miami medical staff had cleared Brees and given the OK to sign him, he (Saban) could still be coaching in Miami. Saban said he was fine with Dr. Andrews diagnosis and wanted to sign Brees but wasn't allowed to (remember, what have I told you about meddling owners). Saban was 9-7 his first year. Saban quit, (he didn't get fired) Spurrier and Saban both wanted out because they had no say so in the players on the teams they were coaching. It wasn't the coaches fail, it was the owners.

It's takes on a whole new meaning when you know the rest of the story.

 

[DBCooper]

I miss Lord Bills, he was articulate and explained so well the Texans failed plan and ways of doing business. Sharp, smarter than you average bear.

Hahahahaha

You would

 

[steelbtexan]

I think we have another couple of guys like that on our roster in Ballentine and Clientt. Ballentine is a really big safety, but his measurements are crazy for a guy his size. Clientt was kind of that tweener LB/S and before he got hurt he was making a splash in camp. Hopefully they all can come back fully healthy and ready to compete

Ballentine was looking like the answer at S. With his terrible injury who knows if he will ever make it back. I have high hopes for Cliett but who knows how good he is. I think Cliett will play the role Pleasant played on the defense last yr if he can stay healthy.

 

[Shishkabob]

You do know that Mack Brown's last year the Longhorns did not have one player drafted and that hadn't happened since 1937 (The primary reason why he was fired). Spurrier quit (he didn't get fired) and forfeited a BIG time salary left on his multi year contract because he said he wasn't allowed to make any personnel decisions during his time in Washington (what have I told you about meddling owners) AND Saban has publicly stated that if the Miami medical staff had cleared Brees and given the OK to sign him, he (Saban) could still be coaching in Miami. Saban said he was fine with Dr. Andrews diagnosis and wanted to sign Brees but wasn't allowed to (remember, what have I told you about meddling owners). Saban was 9-7 his first year. Saban quit, (he didn't get fired) Spurrier and Saban both wanted out because they had no say so in the players on the teams they were coaching. It wasn't the coaches fail, it was the owners.

It's takes on a whole new meaning when you know the rest of the story.

so what do you say about Chip Kelly?

 

[infantrycak]

Hahahahaha

You would

He misses an Indy fan. Go figure.

 

[DBCooper]

He misses an Indy fan. Go figure.

But he spoke da truff!

 

[Texian]

so what do you say about Chip Kelly?

Kelly certainly didn't have Jimbo Fisher's resume. What a lot of people don't understand about Fisher is he was on Nick Saban's staff as Offensive Coordinator for many years. The first thing he did when becoming FSU Head Coach is put together a defensive staff that could run a defense like Saban's defense he practiced against everyday at LSU. Saban is a Bill Belichick assistant. Saban learned the Belichick system of how run an offense, to how to run a defense, to how coach every position, to how every position should be played, to how to write up scouting reports exactly as Belichick would write them. No stone was left upturned. Belichick learned from Parcels, Saban learned it from Belichick and Fisher learned it from Saban. Fisher learned it well from Saban. One thing they all have in common is complete control in every phase of the game in X and Os and scouting and personnel. They know how to win more games than most others. This is why Parcels, Belichick, Saban and Fisher have been extremely successful in their own right.

 

[thunderkyss]

You want us to trade up for Wentz, but i could easily argue there is no way we could put together a package lucrative enough to move up from 22 to 1 to obtain him. So to me the argument is do you think higher of Brock, Cook, or Lynch as those are the guys I saw being in our trade/draft range being available. All you can ask is for the team to take a chance, they did if it works it works if not we get another regime change.

If I thought like that, "at least they took a chance" I'd just as soon see them throw Savage out there with, "This was the plan the whole time" song & dance.

I'd prefer they trade up to get a QB, just as a sign that they targeted a guy & went & got him.

However, clearing the cap space necessary to go get Brock, sign him, Miller, Allen, & Bergstrum all on the first day... that works for me.

They see in Brock what Texian sees in Wentz. Just imagine we trade up for a top three OT, where in FA the best we could do is never played 16 games, can't get guaranteed money on his latest contract Okung.

Like you... & like Texian, I'm not sold on Osweiler. I'm sold on the Texans being sold.

 

[TexansSeminole]

Kelly certainly didn't have Jimbo Fisher's resume. What a lot of people don't understand about Fisher is he was Nick Saban's staff as Offensive Coordinator for many years. The first thing he did when becoming FSU Head Coach is put together a defensive staff that could run a defense like Saban's defense he practiced against everyday at LSU. Saban is a Bill Belichick assistant. Saban learned the Belichick system of how run an offense, to how to run a defense, to how coach every position, to how every position should be played, to how to write up scouting reports exactly as Belichick would write them. No stone was left upturned. Belichick learned from Parcels, Saban learned it from Belichick and Fisher learned it from Saban. Fisher learned it well from Saban. One thing they all have in common is complete control in every phase of the game in X and Os and scouting and personnel. The know how to win more games than most others. This is why Parcels, Belichick, Saban and Fisher have been extremely successful in their own right.

I'm not really feeling this idea of taking away the coach of my college team, although I don't disagree with your desire.

 

[thunderkyss]

FSU had 11 players drafted last year. They had 7 the year before that and 11 the year before that. 6 of those 29 players were 1st rounders. That's an average of 9 players drafted and 2 1st rounders per draft over the last 3 years. I'd say they were pretty talented.

Had Texian said that, his argument would've made his point.

 

[DBCooper]

I wonder if Oz passes Lord Bills full head of hair test?

Because balding QB's suck and full flowing locks win Superb Owls!

 

[Texian]

so what do you say about Chip Kelly?

more on Kelly, Belloti left him a team that was loaded, when Kelly was coming in, the PAC-12 was self destructing, Pete Carroll was leaving and USC was sanctioned, Neuhisel arrived in UCLA and was a disaster, Sarkisian could barely go .500 at Washington. The saying that it's better to be Lucky than Good certainly applied to Kelly's tenure at Oregon. Kelly's learning tutleage is fairly limited and not very deep. Kelly was not well schooled in all phases of the game. Kelly's better football knowledge is pretty much limited to an up temp fast spread offense.

 

[Shishkabob]

Kelly certainly didn't have Jimbo Fisher's resume. What a lot of people don't understand about Fisher is he was Nick Saban's staff as Offensive Coordinator for many years. The first thing he did when becoming FSU Head Coach is put together a defensive staff that could run a defense like Saban's defense he practiced against everyday at LSU. Saban is a Bill Belichick assistant. Saban learned the Belichick system of how run an offense, to how to run a defense, to how coach every position, to how every position should be played, to how to write up scouting reports exactly as Belichick would write them. No stone was left upturned. Belichick learned from Parcels, Saban learned it from Belichick and Fisher learned it from Saban. Fisher learned it well from Saban. One thing they all have in common is complete control in every phase of the game in X and Os and scouting and personnel. The know how to win more games than most others. This is why Parcels, Belichick, Saban and Fisher have been extremely successful in their own right.

I never liked Kelly coming out of college but sometimes complete control doesnt work. Fisher learned from Saban who learned from Belichik, and OB learned from Belichik directly. Im sure all guys are well versed in the Parcell's/ Belichik ways. I know OB doesnt have this complete control that you are saying is a reason why they have been successful, but in the pros unlike the college game you have to earn getting complete control. you normally dont get it right off the bat like you do in college.

Also not trying to just argue with you just trying to get in your head some. You want Fisher as a coach, and from this post you want him to have complete control over scouting, personnel etc. Then how would you expect to get a GM like Elliot Wolf here? Surely if he took a GM job he wouldnt want it to just be a job title, but he would want to have a pivotal role in the shaping of the franchise like Newsome in Baltimore. I dont see him wanting to work with a coach who has to control everything. I think we have a good HC personally who I think it handicapped by a subpar GM, and an owner who likes to put his touch on things.

 

[chenjy9]

With the talk about hair, I vaguely recall some sort of stupidity revolving around Carr's hair...

 

[Texian]

I'm not really feeling this idea of taking away the coach of my college team, although I don't disagree with your desire.

I think your college coach will be around for another year maybe two. You almost lost him to LSU this year. Some serious flirtation there. Why LSU waited so late renew Miles. To often to many NFL teams recycle old and bad habits. Fisher is definitely outside the box thinking and someone needs to take a chance on him much like Jerry Jones did on Jimmy Johnson. (The last great decision made by Jones).

 

[JB]

Also not trying to just argue with you just trying to get in your head some. You want Fisher as a coach, and from this post you want him to have complete control over scouting, personnel etc. Then how would you expect to get a GM like Elliot Wolf here? Surely if he took a GM job he wouldnt want it to just be a job title, but he would want to have a pivotal role in the shaping of the franchise like Newsome in Baltimore. I dont see him wanting to work with a coach who has to control everything. I think we have a good HC personally who I think it handicapped by a subpar GM, and an owner who likes to put his touch on things.

To be fair, he did use an OR gate not an AND gate

 

[Shishkabob]

If I thought like that, "at least they took a chance" I'd just as soon see them throw Savage out there with, "This was the plan the whole time" song & dance.

I'd prefer they trade up to get a QB, just as a sign that they targeted a guy & went & got him.

However, clearing the cap space necessary to go get Brock, sign him, Miller, Allen, & Bergstrum all on the first day... that works for me.

They see in Brock what Texian sees in Wentz. Just imagine we trade up for a top three OT, where in FA the best we could do is never played 16 games, can't get guaranteed money on his latest contract Okung.

Like you... & like Texian, I'm not sold on Osweiler. I'm sold on the Texans being sold.

Honestly who wouldnt rather their team pick their own guy in the draft, and build a legacy with him? But I can get behind their thinking if they think Brock is that much better then who they think will be available for them. Like I said im just happy they are finally deciding to go full force with a guy, the outcome remains to be seen

 

[Texian]

I'm not really feeling this idea of taking away the coach of my college team, although I don't disagree with your desire.

I think your college coach will be around for another year maybe two. You almost lost him to LSU this year. Some serious flirtation there. Why LSU waited so late renew Miles. To often to many NFL teams recycle old and bad habits. Fisher is definitely outside the box thinking and a breath of fresh air. Someone needs to take a chance on him much like Jerry Jones did on Jimmy Johnson. (The last great decision made by Jones).

 

[TexansSeminole]

I think your college coach will be around for another year maybe two. You almost lost him to LSU this year. Some serious flirtation there. Why LSU waited so late renew Miles. To often to many NFL teams recycle old and bad habits. Fisher is definitely outside the box thinking and someone needs to take a chance on him much like Jerry Jones did on Jimmy Johnson. (The last great decision made by Jones).

We won't lose him to another university, I can guarantee that. He has an extremely beneficial recruiting advantage at FSU. Not to beat my chest about FSU athletics but a good majority of these guys grew up fantasizing about putting on the Nole uniform. FSU is also in a prime position to take advantage of huge pipelines that they've been tapping into for years. South Florida, Georgia, the Carolinas, even Louisiana and Texas. Pipelines that were all established prior to his entrance at FSU. Granted, he's bolstered it but it'd be tough to find a school with such a recruiting advantage, honestly. He's also the Man in Tallahassee.

 

[Wolf]

With the talk about hair, I vaguely recall some sort of stupidity revolving around Carr's hair...

There was a deal about carr going to the barber
...looking back it was much worse than the letterman jackets

 

[Texian]

I never liked Kelly coming out of college but sometimes complete control doesnt work. Fisher learned from Saban who learned from Belichik, and OB learned from Belichik directly. Im sure all guys are well versed in the Parcell's/ Belichik ways. I know OB doesnt have this complete control that you are saying is a reason why they have been successful, but in the pros unlike the college game you have to earn getting complete control. you normally dont get it right off the bat like you do in college.

Also not trying to just argue with you just trying to get in your head some. You want Fisher as a coach, and from this post you want him to have complete control over scouting, personnel etc. Then how would you expect to get a GM like Elliot Wolf here? Surely if he took a GM job he wouldnt want it to just be a job title, but he would want to have a pivotal role in the shaping of the franchise like Newsome in Baltimore. I dont see him wanting to work with a coach who has to control everything. I think we have a good HC personally who I think it handicapped by a subpar GM, and an owner who likes to put his touch on things.

I'm not sure that OB learned Belichicks entire system, he was only the OC for 1 year before Kraft and Belichick shipped him off to Penn St. OB strongest influence and tutelage comes from George O'Leary. When OB arrived in NE he was an O assistant learning the Belichick offense that was already installed and being run for years. One of the reasons so many Belichick assistants fail is because they are not well versed in all phases of football operations. Their knowledge is pretty much limited to a single phase of the game and that can be limited in scope too. The reason so many Belichick front office personnel fail (Pioli, Dimitrioff) is because Belichick taught them how to write scouting reports exactly as he wanted them written. From those scouting reports Belichick sets his draft board. When it comes to actually scouting it is Belichick at the pro days, 2' from players, setting up bags and directing the drills. Belichick scouts are very good at talking and writing the talk but not so much walking the walk. In essence Belichick assistants are analyst and not so much managers and that's why they fail.

JB answered paragraph two. It was an OR. My wish list is Plan A Hire Fisher IF that doesn't work out go to Plan B, Hire Wolf.

 

[JB]

I'm not sure that OB learned Belichicks entire system, he was only the OC for 1 year before Kraft and Belichick shipped him off to Penn St. OB strongest influence and tutelage comes from George O'Leary.

Shipped him off... hahaha that's rich. The O'Leary statement is true

 

[Texian]

Shipped him off... hahaha that's rich. The O'Leary statement is true

Yeah shipped him off, he really didn't have the credentials to be a head coach at a MAJOR University and after the late season blow up and verbal attack on Brady it made sense to separate the two, to permanently keep it from happening again.

 

[leebigeztx]

I would say Jimbo Fisher knows NFL talent.

So did Mack Brown, what does it really mean? Spurrier failed and so did Saban,but doesnt mean they dont know nfl talent. Can they coach it? Big difference.

You do know that Mack Brown's last year the Longhorns did not have one player drafted and that hadn't happened since 1937 (The primary reason why he was fired). Spurrier quit (he didn't get fired) and forfeited a BIG time salary left on his multi year contract because he said he wasn't allowed to make any personnel decisions during his time in Washington (what have I told you about meddling owners) AND Saban has publicly stated that if the Miami medical staff had cleared Brees and given the OK to sign him, he (Saban) could still be coaching in Miami. Saban said he was fine with Dr. Andrews diagnosis and wanted to sign Brees but wasn't allowed to (remember, what have I told you about meddling owners). Saban was 9-7 his first year. Saban quit, (he didn't get fired) Spurrier and Saban both wanted out because they had no say so in the players on the teams they were coaching. It wasn't the coaches fail, it was the owners.

It's takes on a whole new meaning when you know the rest of the story.

You used recruiting as a tool to know nfl talent which makes no sense. When spurrier was killing the sec at florida, he had tons of players drafted. When he tried to coach in nfl,he failed. Mack Brown has recruited alot of so called nfl talent, doesnt mean he can coach them. Its a totally different dynamic when you are the face of the program in college vs millionaire men. I'm not debating young Wolf, I'm debating Fisher knowing nfl talent. Not only that, good nfl talent. Who was the last pro bowl player from fsu since fisher have been evaluating this nfl player you speak of?