Vinny
shiny happy fan
Schaub being an elite QB is nonsense. Or even close to being "elite". He's a better than average guy and if you like average, you'll love Schaub.
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All Encompassing Matt Schaub Thread
- Thread starter mussop
- Start date
Yesterday
Waterboy
So if his arm strength is "elite" then he is in the top, say, 1/6th of the league in that category? So top 5 or 6? No chance. In no particular order, some QBs who have significantly better arm strength than Schaub (since there is no definitive metric for arm strength, lets just use the old "eye test") : Rodgers, Brady, Flacco, both Mannings, Brees, Cutler, Luck, RG3, Vick, Big Ben, Romo, Stafford, Freeman, Kaepernick, JaMarcus Russell (lol)...you get the point.
Just watch those players throw the deep ball, or short bullets. Then watch Schaub. If you actually think Schaub has "elite" arm strength, idk what to say. Having completions to a receiver that is wide-open for 40 yards, on an underthrown ball, doesn't mean you have good arm strength.
Yesterday
Waterboy
I disagree with him being above average. 32 starting QBs in the NFL, can you say you would rather have Schaub on your team for the future than 16 of them? He's 31 years old. Right now he may be average, but look at other QBs.
Rodgers (no debate)
Brady " "
Peyton " "
Brees " "
Eli " "
Big Ben " "
Matt Ryan " "
Andrew Luck - already better
Russell Wilson - arguably already better
RGIII - " "
Kaepernick - I think he's better
Romo - hate him, but he makes throws Schaub could only dream of.
Jay Cutler - certainly better physically. Had a horrible system, may be a douche, but I'd take him over Schaub.
Rivers - bad year this yr, but has had a better career than Schaub
Freeman - much more potential than Schaub.
That's 15 that I would definitely rather have on my team than Schaub. Maybe you can argue one or two of those, but Schaub is at best Mediocre.
No, he doesn't have elite arm strength, or elite mobility. Didn't mean to say that (I see where I did, just didn't mean to).
He's produced at an elite level, so arm strength & mobility is not an issue. He's found a way to make what he's got work for him.
He hasn't produced as much in the win column, but that's changing. He hasn't produced in the post season like the elites... but I think that will be changing in the near future as well.
Vinny
shiny happy fan
We're pretty much saying the same thing. Mediocre is average. Just because there are 15 good to plus QB's in the NFL doesn't mean that Schaub is an awful QB.....I just call him above average as in he's really not all that.
Yesterday
Waterboy
I hope you are right, and if he turns in a flacco-esque performance I will be the first to credit you.
Matt belongs in this group.
That's just silly. Take all of those guys, put them here in this system & there's no guarantee they will have a 5 year stretch comparable to what Schaub had.
It's a toss up & a gamble with each & every one of them. Physically, yeah, they're all more gifted than Schaub, but Romo, Cutler, Rivers, & Freeman have already shown not to have the snap Schaub has between the ears. Each one of those guys have had teams as talented as Schaub, only Rivers has achieved more.
HoustonFrog
Dallas Frog
What was there to fix?
You stated Ryan had a bad year and was far from a great QB. You were wrong. Stop just throwing out whatever and seeing if it sticks. 10 more TDs with only 2 more ints.
So Schaub was farther down the list. Right? What does that prove? It proves that his second half was really worse than it seems and that he has trouble with his arm and moving in the pocket. There is nothing really to argue. Flacco > Schaub. Ryan > Schaub right now. Not sure what your arguing. Players going up and players going down the last 2 years.
Vinny
shiny happy fan
Shaub hasn't won jack squat in 5 years. Garbage time stats or not.
Luv_ya_blue
Truth, Love, Faith & Obedience - Christianity 101
Bottom line for me is this...
Schaub can't make the throws that the far greater majority of NFL caliber QBs can. He's not accurate and has a noodle arm. He wouldn't have 1/2 the stats that he does on any given season if his WRs didn't pull rabbits out of the hat to make the catch. And NO, I don't think that the same can be said for other QBs as a general rule.
Schaub is gonna make a speedy check-down and if for some ungodly reason he's flushed from the pocket, he's looking to unload the ball and makes me nervous because he often barely has the arm strength to get the ball out of bounds.
As to the nature of the gripe that the defense & offense had problems as a whole as well...
ON THE SEASON:
Total Offense (YPG):
49ers
Falcons
Patriots
Seahawks
Texans
Passing (YPG):
Patriots
Falcons
Texans
Ravens
Broncos
Rushing (YPG):
49ers
Seahawks
Vikings
Colts
Ravens
Total Defense (YPG):
Seahawks
Vikings
Texans
Redskins
Patriots
Passing (YPG):
Redskins
Seahawks
Packers
Texans
Vikings
Rushing (YPG):
Vikings
49ers
Texans
Patriots
Seahawks
There's no doubt that we went into the postseason as cold as a cucumber...but that's just an excuse. All of the intangibles were there. No since crying over spilled milk at this juncture--but it doesn't change the fact that there are a whole boatload of us that don't believe that Schaubie baby and Wary Gary are gonna lead us to the promised land.
Schaub can't make the throws that the far greater majority of NFL caliber QBs can. He's not accurate and has a noodle arm. He wouldn't have 1/2 the stats that he does on any given season if his WRs didn't pull rabbits out of the hat to make the catch. And NO, I don't think that the same can be said for other QBs as a general rule.
Schaub is gonna make a speedy check-down and if for some ungodly reason he's flushed from the pocket, he's looking to unload the ball and makes me nervous because he often barely has the arm strength to get the ball out of bounds.
As to the nature of the gripe that the defense & offense had problems as a whole as well...
ON THE SEASON:
Total Offense (YPG):
49ers
Falcons
Patriots
Seahawks
Texans
Passing (YPG):
Patriots
Falcons
Texans
Ravens
Broncos
Rushing (YPG):
49ers
Seahawks
Vikings
Colts
Ravens
Total Defense (YPG):
Seahawks
Vikings
Texans
Redskins
Patriots
Passing (YPG):
Redskins
Seahawks
Packers
Texans
Vikings
Rushing (YPG):
Vikings
49ers
Texans
Patriots
Seahawks
There's no doubt that we went into the postseason as cold as a cucumber...but that's just an excuse. All of the intangibles were there. No since crying over spilled milk at this juncture--but it doesn't change the fact that there are a whole boatload of us that don't believe that Schaubie baby and Wary Gary are gonna lead us to the promised land.
Yesterday
Waterboy
So you would just as well have Schaub than Luck or Wilson or RG3 or Kap? Come on...
Cutler has achieved more than Schaub.
Schaub has Andre Johnson and had one of the best run games in the NFL. He also has arguably the best LT in the NFL.
I mean I hate to rip on the guy so much, but name ONE starting QB in the NFL who is less athletic than Schaub! Name one definitely has less arm strength than Schaub! There may be a couple, but not many.
For the love of God, could Schaub not modify his throwing mechanics / get in the weight room every once in awhile? He looks like an average Joe, not an elite athlete. Brady didn't have a cannon in '01, but he is constantly working on his throwing motion and has developed a rocket arm. Get to work Matt, because we are stuck with you.
Cutler has achieved more than Schaub.
Schaub has Andre Johnson and had one of the best run games in the NFL. He also has arguably the best LT in the NFL.
I mean I hate to rip on the guy so much, but name ONE starting QB in the NFL who is less athletic than Schaub! Name one definitely has less arm strength than Schaub! There may be a couple, but not many.
For the love of God, could Schaub not modify his throwing mechanics / get in the weight room every once in awhile? He looks like an average Joe, not an elite athlete. Brady didn't have a cannon in '01, but he is constantly working on his throwing motion and has developed a rocket arm. Get to work Matt, because we are stuck with you.
Vinny
shiny happy fan
weight room isn't going to increase his throwing mechanics or his deep ball. Arm strength pretty much is what it is. Brady doesn't have a big arm...he just anticipates better and hits guys on the run better. If I had to count the times where Andre has to stop and wait on the ball....
Vinny
shiny happy fan
The weight room isn't going to turn 30yo Shaub into Big Ben....the weight room won't turn middle aged guy more agile either. He is what he is.
Porky
Hall of Fame
Manning doesn't have a huge arm either - not even in his heyday. Joe Montana probably didn't have any better arm than Schaub. What the elite guys do that Schaub and medicore guys of his ilk can't do is lead guys and anticipate where to go with the ball down to which shoulder to throw too etc.
Look at Manning and Brady and how they set up their guy to get major YAC in abundance. I can't even imagine the stats that AJ would have right now if he had been drafted by NE in 2003 instead of Houston. My God. How many times does AJ have to wait on the freaking ball while slow as a slug Matt and his slow release gets wound up so he can under-throw the ball.
I've thought up until the 2nd half of this year Matt was flirting with top 10 but maybe just on the outside looking in. No longer. The guy has regressed, and has now proven he can't play on the big stage. I would put him closer to #20 than #10 now, and you aren't going to win big with that kind of guy with any real consistency. I think Hasselbeck is the perfect comparison.
And here is another issue. How many games have Brady, Manning, and the other more elite QB's missed in their career. Let's face it, Schaub is brittle. It's just a matter of time before he misses a lot of games again.
Look at Manning and Brady and how they set up their guy to get major YAC in abundance. I can't even imagine the stats that AJ would have right now if he had been drafted by NE in 2003 instead of Houston. My God. How many times does AJ have to wait on the freaking ball while slow as a slug Matt and his slow release gets wound up so he can under-throw the ball.
I've thought up until the 2nd half of this year Matt was flirting with top 10 but maybe just on the outside looking in. No longer. The guy has regressed, and has now proven he can't play on the big stage. I would put him closer to #20 than #10 now, and you aren't going to win big with that kind of guy with any real consistency. I think Hasselbeck is the perfect comparison.
And here is another issue. How many games have Brady, Manning, and the other more elite QB's missed in their career. Let's face it, Schaub is brittle. It's just a matter of time before he misses a lot of games again.
I said before this years play offs, Ryan, Flacco, & Schaub were in the same boat. They were all eh..... nothing special. If the Falcons/Ravens defense/running game/receivers didn't step up those guys would be thought of the same as Schaub..... eh, nothing special.
Ryan was thought to not be able to win in the post season. That obviously changed.
He also had a great play off run & is squarely ahead of Schaub because of it. Flacco has been off the chart for two post seasons in a row so yes he's definitely ahead of Schaub as well.
My point, was they were thought of about the same 6 weeks ago. Matt & his team did not step up their game like they did. We'll see what happens next year when Matt & the Texans get to the post season again.
This was neither the Ravens' or the Falcons' first trip to the play offs. They failed multiple times same as the Texans, so it's not the end of the world for the Texans or Matt Schaub. It would have been nice if the Texans could have gone all the way to the championship game or beyond like Aaron Rogers & the Packers (#2 defense took it to another level) or Sean Peyton & the Saints (Colston went off), or Harbaugh & his 49ers (Alex Smith stepped it up), or Sanchez & the Jets (#2 running game showed up, #2 defense showed up)...... but we didn't. Our QB didn't show up, our running game didn't show up, our defense didn't show up.
But for some reason everyone wants to replace the QB.
All I'm saying, is that it isn't time to close the book on Schaub.
Porky
Hall of Fame
Not gonna happen. Mcnair is as Milquetoast and patient and calm and steady as it gets. He will not make a bold move because bold moves have the potential to backfire. He is steady as she goes.
In short if Bob Mcnair were captain of the Titanic, the result would have been the same. No panic. I know that might be an iceberg ahead, just make a subtle move port side. Don't turn hard. We don't want to upset the passengers in steerage with the waves.
Both the Mannings have helluvarm..... that's the only thing I disagree with in this post. I have absolutely no problem with this kind of criticism, because it is spot on.
Matt's arm is not the problem, his mobility is not the problem. Guys with big arms & extra mobility are a dime a dozen & will come & go before guys like Schaub are out of the league.
Matt's anticipation is no better today than it was in 2007. If his chemistry with Andre is any better, I find it hard to see evidence of it. His placement skills are way below where it should be (I think) for a guy who's played as long as he has with the guys that he's been throwing to (he's been throwing to Andre, OD, & Walter since 2007). & of course there are questions about his leadership. I don't necessarily need to see him yelling at people or making an a55 of himself on TV. But I'd like to see him talking to a receiver (WR, TE, FB, RB..... don't matter) from time to time on the sideline talking about what went wrong, what went right & seeing them get on the same page later in the game.
Complaining about his arm strength or his mobility is just begging him to be somebody we know he won't ever be. To me you're just saying, "Man I really like what these unproven QBs, playing a style that has proven to be a dead end, bring to the table. No one has ever won a Super Bowl playing like that but I'd love to waste the next 5 years trying."
& I'm not down with that. Sorry.
Oh, & I don't agree that Matt has proven that he can't take us to the Super Bowl either.
Yesterday
Waterboy
Thought of about the same 6 weeks ago by who? So you are basing your entire opinion of a QB based on 2 games? Maybe they were in similar boats based solely on accomplishments. But skill wise, it isn't, and has never been, close.
Vinny
shiny happy fan
Name some of them. Name some guys with big arms and mobility that are starting currently that will be out of the league long before Schaub.
Also, find an account and post from one account. This is getting ridiculous.
Texan_Bill
Hall of Fame
I agree with you about Matt's arm. Plenty of QB's haven't "big" arms but I really disagree with the mobility part of your post. Matt Schaub makes Drew Bledsoe look like a world class sprinter in comparison.
*EDIT*
Two examples just came to mind.
A) Ken Stabler. He wasn't known for a rocket arm, but he sure was mobile which allowed him to extend plays.
B) Fran Tarkenton (see A)
Jules Winnfield
BMF
there's always an excuse when it comes to schaub. His repugnant apologists want every condition in schaub's favor until they hold him accountable.
schau doesnt have strong arm and is not very athletic so you would think you can depend on his smarts, decision making, leadership, calmness to compensate for his physical liabilities.
The problem with schaub is he's not very good at those either.
So what do we have with schaub?
A guy who is not mobile at all, has a weak arm, no leadership skills, not very calm in the pocket when it breaks down, and has horrible decision making skills.
IF you dont have it physically, you should have it mentally.
Schaub has neither yet the front office and some texan fans still dont want to give up on him and feel like its such an arduous task to find a replacement whose better.
Texan_Bill
Hall of Fame
Kaepernick & Wilson
I'll even go retro, Jason Campbell, David Carr, Michael Vick (the second time), Tim Tebow, Kevin Kolb, Chad Henne, Derek Anderson, Vince Young, Bruce Gradkowski,
just because you say it, doesn't make it so.
Jules Winnfield
BMF
Jules Winnfield
BMF
so you think matt is a great leader who makes great decisions, has a lot of moxie, and is very cagey in the pocket who is a beast physically?
Texecutioner
Hall of Fame
Yeah, well show someone where the players feel that way?? Stop making stuff up and prove this for a change. The other 52 players are always giving Schaub support and displaying confidence in him and have for years. You may see it that way, but the players don't. And why aren't you throwing a hissy fit over the players being disrespected over the lack of WR's on this team or the average kicker that we have? If you'd actually analyze all aspects of this team instead of one player that you seem to be obsessed with, people might actually take you seriously.
Key free agents will go where they can get paid and where they have a chance to win. The Texans being in the playoffs for two straight seasons helps that a lot, and all season long there were a lot of players around the league giving the Texans a lot of props and saying great things about this organization. You're way off with this statement above.
Well, you might as well not pay attention for a few years then, because the Texans aren't doing anything with Schaub for a while. And while you're talking about failure here, I guess every other team in the league failed the same way as the Texans did including the 49ers. God, those Niner fans sure as hell shouldn't accept the failure they got this season and neither should the Falcons. Lol!
THe Texans had a pretty strong run this season and made it to the 2nd round of the playoffs. They had a pretty successful season.
Until the team finds a suitable replacement for Schaub they won't be finding a guy "that can win" according to your standards. Schaub won a lot of games this season, but it seems like the only way that you're happy is if they're 16-0 or a SB winner. Anything else is total and utter failure. It must suck to be you as far as being a fan goes then, because under those standards most fans would only be happy every 20 years or so.
Jules Winnfield
BMF
you must be the biggest matt schaub stan in this entire site.
"His teammates support him"
smdh are you seriously gonna use that line? What else are they suppose to say?
We'll see.
No. Matt needs to take his game to the next level. But he's got a lot more than what you're giving him credit for. There's no way he could have done what he's done if you're correct.
Texan_Bill
Hall of Fame
No... Actually he is not the biggest "Matt Schaub stan on this entire site" but for you to suggest that Schaub's "teamates support him" as an untruth is completely and utterly ludicrous. It's well known and well documented that his teamates totally trust him, respect him and consider him a leader.
Texan_Bill
Hall of Fame
Period??? Why???? Because you say so?? Asinine!!!
What??? Are you "that guy" that knows "a guy" in the locker room"?
Company line my ass. Ask any of them in person, if you're a good judge of "company line" or genuine respect. Aren't we (or you) at a place where we can tell "company line" from sincere thoughts? I feel sorry for so many people that cyniscm rules their lives.
Sad really!
Honoring Earl 34
Something Witty !
Period??? Why???? Because you say so?? Asinine!!!
What??? Are you "that guy" that knows "a guy" in the locker room"?
Company line my ass. Ask any of them in person, if you're a good judge of "company line" or genuine respect. Aren't we (or you) at a place where we can tell "company line" from sincere thoughts? I feel sorry for so many people that cyniscm rules their lives.
Sad really!
The only thing that can be said about Schaub is , has he hit his ceiling .
Wolf
100% Texan
Agreed
Are you saying, "He has hit his ceiling"?
Or are you asking, "Has he hit his ceiling"?
I don't know that he has hit his ceiling. I don't know that Andre has hit his ceiling, or that Antonio has hit his ceiling, or that Myers has hit his. They all needed to step up their game in the play offs & did not.
We'll see if they've grown as players & leaders in 2013, then again in the play-offs.
Texecutioner
Hall of Fame
Well yes I am when the statement I'm refuting is that the Texans organization is disrespecting the rest of the team by keeping Schaub on this team. When his teammates regularly talk highly of Schaub and express full confidence in him, it's hard to call them "disrespected." Is it completely impossible to believe that some if not a lot of Schaub's teammates might actually want him on this team? They haven't ever said otherwise like when we have seen in other cases with different teams.
Texan_Bill
Hall of Fame
Jup!! No argument from me... That said all these arguments pro or con for the guy, these people are stupid for arguing over him because they're stuck with him for at least a couple/few years over his deal... Whether they like it or not..
I'm not sure why the hatred goes towards Matt himself and NOT the FO that signed him to the extension. WTF???
I'm not sure why the hatred goes towards Matt Schaub and the fact that he hasn't really had any new weapons..
.......................
Whatever... Put everything on Schaub if that completes your short-sighted thought of this Texans past season.. Perhaps those of you that think that way should revisit the defense and special teams......
Of course many of you are way to mentally limited to put ALL THINGS into perspective!
Texan_Bill
Hall of Fame
I specifically asked for where Texan players towed the "company line" about Schaub being a "leader" as "the company line"......... I got nothing.
Hervoyel
BUENO!
Wait, you mean to say that all the time we spend here going back and forth over players is wasted because no matter what we say or think the team is going to do what it wants to do with no regard for our opinions?
No ****?
Well thanks Bill. Glad you could clear that up for us. Last one out turn off the lights because there's no point in any of this. Can't believe I spent ten ****ing years talking about a football team and they aren't even listening. Damn!
Well, I know it's "stupid" to bother with this but I just can't help myself. Call it habit at this point. I think all these people you're not understanding know good and well that the FO that signed him to the extension is to blame for doing it. We just all know that they're not going anywhere either. Once the bitching starts (justified or not) then it's going to focus on certain key areas. QB is at the top of the list. It comes with the territory. If you want to be a QB in the NFL some people are going to ***** about you damn near every year. If you're nothing special then you'll hear more of it and that's Matt Schaub's situation in a nutshell.
Matt's got weapons. People who say Matt doesn't have weapons need to look again. He's had weapons for years. He's got Arian Foster and Andre Johnson. They're weapons. He has Owen Daniels and he's a weapon. Joel Dreeson was enough of a weapon that the Bronco's went out and signed him for Manning. Jacoby Jones who I hate with the heat of 10,000 suns was a weapon obviously in hindsight. Schaub has and has had weapons. It doesn't change much in the long run. Add some weapons, take away some weapons, Matt stays Matt.
But that's not why the hate goes to Matt. The hate goes to him because he's the QB and he gets more of it because he's not good enough.
I was under the impression that calling other posters names was frowned upon. My mistake I guess. Just my limitations getting in my way again.
Well, we did get Jacoby Jones run out of here.
Damn....... if only Matt had been healthy when we had that team, with Jacoby Jones & Eric Winston & Mike Briesel & Arian Foster breaking 20-40 yards gains at will & Ben Tate doing the same off the bench.
Ahh.... what could have been.
Texecutioner
Hall of Fame
Well it's one thing to criticize Schaub as how you think he plays, but to suggest that his teammates are being done wrong and disrespected simply doesn't add up. His teammates have always expressed belief in Schaub.
Matt has his teammates respect.
The Texans will never win a SB with Matt as the QB and for that matter probably with Gary as HC.
Whoever made the decision to extend Matt for 4 yrs should be fired. If that kind of wisdom is permeating the Texans FO then this team is in serious trouble. Look at the way the Ravens handled the Flacco situation as a template. But that's not the Texans way (Taking risks) and they are stuck with a QB that's not good enough and according to a certain Doc will not be able to improve his deficiencies due to his injury situation. (I do believe the injury has led Matt to becoming a proverbial sitting duck and has caused his accuracy prblems to become more pronounced.
The Texans will never win a SB with Matt as the QB and for that matter probably with Gary as HC.
Whoever made the decision to extend Matt for 4 yrs should be fired. If that kind of wisdom is permeating the Texans FO then this team is in serious trouble. Look at the way the Ravens handled the Flacco situation as a template. But that's not the Texans way (Taking risks) and they are stuck with a QB that's not good enough and according to a certain Doc will not be able to improve his deficiencies due to his injury situation. (I do believe the injury has led Matt to becoming a proverbial sitting duck and has caused his accuracy prblems to become more pronounced.
Vinny
shiny happy fan
The Ravens had a better long term prospect in Flacco at that. I see it as the Ravens made Flacco go out and prove it, but the Texans handed out juice boxes and rice crispy treats, patted Matt on the head and made sure not to use red ink on his contract as they made sure he was loved, respected and well liked so they wouldn't have to bid against the Jaguars and Raiders for Matt's 2013 services.
HTown2ATX
TexansMetalhead
Good posts as usual here lately Herv, me and many others are on the same side of the fence right now. Maybe not exact same on everything but close enough.
I was wondering, to alleviate some of the Texans fan on fan $hitting on each other, and also I think it would be fun to a degree, I sometimes wonder if it would be a good idea to have a thread specifically for the care bears and sunshine pumpers and one for the "haters" and realists where people from the other side don't interfere so both sides can either glorify the season despite the tailspin end of the season or complain about it and stroke each other's POV's in general.
The rest of the threads would be open season as usual but there would be a "home base" if you will for both sides. Don't get me wrong, I love the chaos and I get a good laugh but I'm weird like that. It does get old though, and I know it will never happen, but I thought it was an idea worth mentioning.
Anyway....on with the show...
GP
Go Texans!
Rep your way. LOL.
buddyboy
Rookie
Matt's shown what he can do with weapons in previous years. These past couple years, (and let me caps lock this so no one can misinterpret this) HE HAS NOT PLAYED WELL ENOUGH.
To the posters (not necessarily Herv) who have taken this past year's failure and applied it to all years (what have you done for me lately I guess), it's completely false that Schaub hasn't been comparable to the QB class of Flacco/Ryan/etc. Maybe he's regressed while they've picked up their game. But it's clear he CAN play at a high level, the question is has he lost it?
As far as weapons go, Foster and AJ are clearly top tier weapons. Looking at the teams who've had success this year, however, it's clear that in today's league, you need SEVERAL weapons. OD is a weapon, but I'm beginning to realize that other than hands, OD is mostly a run-of-the-mill TE. Nearly every team has a TE on their roster that could do his job in the Texans' system.
Dreesen was a weapon...last year. When Schaub was injured. Jacoby Jones is a weapon now. It's obvious the change of scenery and scheme has helped him tremendously. The Jacoby that Schaub had is a different Jacoby than the one who just won a Superbowl.
You're right he's had weapons, and we've seen what he can do with weapons. We've had TOP TIER offenses. The question is not "does Schaub have it". It should be "can Schaub get it back".
GP
Go Texans!
Wes Mantooth: "Hey Ron, I heard you boys got a new momma down there at the station. I hear she wipes the dribble from your bubbling lips, and rubs vaseline on your butt and tells you how it's special and better than everyone else's."
- Anchorman
Best line. Ever.
Agreed.
& to the bolded. The guys saying he never had it, just never liked Schaub to begin with & aren't being objective about the situation.
If you're one of the guys who is saying Schaub lost it.... that's great, that's an understandable position.
But to say he never had it... I don't like Schaub, but I give credit where credit is due.