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All Encompassing Case Keenum Thread

We've got too many other needs before we look to develop a high draft QB. If we don't draft high for OL/DL (especially a mobile "fat boy in the middle".........and don't give me the Wade line), it won't matter who is under center.

Kubiak and Philips won't be here next year so their specific needs will most certainly be trumped by the new regime picking the QB of the future.

A good QB will make a bad line look good. Moving to a 4-3 to better suit the current personnel will nullify the need for a space eater in the middle.

You never pick a RT,G or NT with a top 3 pick. If that is the target then you trade down and increase value.

If QB is even a slight need and you have a top pick you make that move. You can't rationalize going onto next season with Keenum and having him fail and then suffering through another 2-14 year when the only real QB prize is Winston and he may turn out to be a rapist.
 
The flaw in your logic always is the aples to oranges. Aikman,bradshaw,eli and others went to terrible talent teams. There is a reason aikman went #1 as did bradshaw and eli. Their teams were sorry enough to win 1 or 2 games. Keenum took over a team offensively that still has a top flight wr and a couple of probowl linemen. Even defensively,he hasn't had to score 30 pts to win.

Truth is,he's a limited,undrafted qb who has been exposed. I don't wanna hear how clutch he was at u of h or how he picked the blitz apart. This isn't college and we're not playing So Miss or SMU. He had a chance,one of the few chances a udfa get,and he blew it. If brady sucked like case, bledsoe would've gotten his job back. Brady played well enough and we know the story.

Pass pro ranks 26th.
http://mmqb.si.com/2013/11/27/robert-quinn-st-louis-rams-racks-up-pressure-points/

O-line ranks last overall.
http://wp.advancednflstats.com/teamOL.php

No. 1 TE and RB on the shelf.
No. 2 RB playing with broken ribs; No. 3 hardly knows the scheme.

Defense ranks 26th in scoring allowed.

Marciano and his unit is a joke.

Yeah, right.
Keenum has had a lot of help.
 
you can't compare different eras with different rules. You could manhandle wr's all over the field back then....maime qb's, head slap....no way eras are comparable so stuff like this is ridiculous. Bob Griesie won a SB and threw 6 passes - teams were designed differently.

So I went back and check the last ten years for QBs drafted in the first two rounds.
This includes Big Ben, Rivers, and Rodgers (the last two guys had more time on the bench to prepare than Keenum.
Not a single one of them had better numbers than Keenum through the first five games of their career.

Kaepernick, for example, had more yards, but also more INTs.
And he had a good O-line, a good running game, and a good defense to support him. I'm pretty sure his ST wasn't trash either.
 
Kubiak and Philips won't be here next year so their specific needs will most certainly be trumped by the new regime picking the QB of the future.

A good QB will make a bad line look good. Moving to a 4-3 to better suit the current personnel will nullify the need for a space eater in the middle.

You never pick a RT,G or NT with a top 3 pick. If that is the target then you trade down and increase value.

If QB is even a slight need and you have a top pick you make that move. You can't rationalize going onto next season with Keenum and having him fail and then suffering through another 2-14 year when the only real QB prize is Winston and he may turn out to be a rapist.

Then, if you have to, trade down a little later in the first round.

Casey Hampton
Vince Wilfork
Dontari Poe
Star Lotulelei
 
Pass pro ranks 26th.
http://mmqb.si.com/2013/11/27/robert-quinn-st-louis-rams-racks-up-pressure-points/

O-line ranks last overall.
http://wp.advancednflstats.com/teamOL.php

No. 1 TE and RB on the shelf.
No. 2 RB playing with broken ribs; No. 3 hardly knows the scheme.

Defense ranks 26th in scoring allowed.

Marciano and his unit is a joke.

Yeah, right.
Keenum has had a lot of help.

Russell Wilson is one of the most pressured qbs in the nfl period. I'm saying this,keenum took over a team talent wise was a lot better than those qbs you nmaed eons ago. The year before they got aikman,the boys were like 1-15. Qbs can't have perfect setups in this day and age. Anyone can have success if they have a top 5 run game,top 5 defense. We see this with the success of alex smith and mtt schaub. We also know when the elements are out of whack,they have a difficult time beating decent teams. Again,should Case finish the season out,probably,but if this was tj yates,we wouldn't be hearing or seeing the same excuses being made why he's playing terrible. As a lot of people on the radio has said,tj probably should be given a look as well to see if he can battle for the backup next year. Its obvious the qb needed for the texans isn't on the roster.

We can go on with the lovefest and we know from the multiple kareem jackson threads that you will blindly make excuses for poor play of a player you like. So carry on.
 
Russell Wilson is one of the most pressured qbs in the nfl period. I'm saying this,keenum took over a team talent wise was a lot better than those qbs you nmaed eons ago. The year before they got aikman,the boys were like 1-15. Qbs can't have perfect setups in this day and age. Anyone can have success if they have a top 5 run game,top 5 defense. We see this with the success of alex smith and mtt schaub. We also know when the elements are out of whack,they have a difficult time beating decent teams. Again,should Case finish the season out,probably,but if this was tj yates,we wouldn't be hearing or seeing the same excuses being made why he's playing terrible. As a lot of people on the radio has said,tj probably should be given a look as well to see if he can battle for the backup next year. Its obvious the qb needed for the texans isn't on the roster.

We can go on with the lovefest and we know from the multiple kareem jackson threads that you will blindly make excuses for poor play of a player you like. So carry on.
If you think Keenum is stepping in a good situation, I don't know what else to say.

Carry on. :)
 
Russell Wilson is one of the most pressured qbs in the nfl period. I'm saying this,keenum took over a team talent wise was a lot better than those qbs you nmaed eons ago. The year before they got aikman,the boys were like 1-15. Qbs can't have perfect setups in this day and age. Anyone can have success if they have a top 5 run game,top 5 defense. We see this with the success of alex smith and mtt schaub. We also know when the elements are out of whack,they have a difficult time beating decent teams. Again,should Case finish the season out,probably,but if this was tj yates,we wouldn't be hearing or seeing the same excuses being made why he's playing terrible. As a lot of people on the radio has said,tj probably should be given a look as well to see if he can battle for the backup next year. Its obvious the qb needed for the texans isn't on the roster.

We can go on with the lovefest and we know from the multiple kareem jackson threads that you will blindly make excuses for poor play of a player you like. So carry on.

While I agree with you about the QB not being on the roster, Keenum is probably alot better than you think he is.

I dont think the 2014 draft has any QB's that are appreciably better than Case. I nkow you're a big Bridgewater guy, but Keenum put up better numbers against the same type of competition.

2015 QB's, that's a whole different story, there are 3-4 potential franchise guys in that draft.
 
Keenum has found himself stepping in something..........but it isn't anything close to a "good situation.":mcnugget:

While it was reported that the Texans pass pro currently ranks 26th, we knew that it hasn't gotten worse.
I was trying to tally game by game number from Greg Bedard's weekly Pressure Point, but I lost track.
(And I hate to have to go back to split the Raiders game up; but we know for sure, Keenum was pressured more that game.)

I'm not sure Wilson is the most-pressured QB this year; if he is, it won't be by much more than Keenum.
But Wilson has a defense and a ST he can rely on.
In the mean time, the Texans' running game has been going downhill, reaching the 100-yd mark just once in the last 5 games.
 
While I agree with you about the QB not being on the roster, Keenum is probably alot better than you think he is.

I dont think the 2014 draft has any QB's that are appreciably better than Case. I nkow you're a big Bridgewater guy, but Keenum put up better numbers against the same type of competition.

2015 QB's, that's a whole different story, there are 3-4 potential franchise guys in that draft.

You can tell yourself that till you're blue or purple in the face. There are probably 8 or 9 qb alone who are a lot better than case talent wise. You keep saying wait till 2015, by my account and I've already looked forward,there is one and he facing a rape charge. Unless you think the texans are gonna finish 2-14 again,how do you think they can get winston.

We can start with bridgewater and make it to murray and those guys are more talented to than keenum from arm talent to size. Bridgewater,manziel,boyd,mariotto,mettenburger,carr,murray and even hundley if he stays in the draft with be drafted in the 1st 3 rds minimum. Now I'm not saying gms don't make mistakes and to a lot of them perception can be reality. When you're undrafted at qb,there is a perception of talent and ability vs a guy drafted in the 1st 3rds. There will not be a gm with the chance to add a guy with franchise qb ability is gonna pass for case keenum. Just like gradkoski and guys like that,their rope is shorter,but that don't mean that can't play in the league as backups. Ted thompson is viewed as a pretty good talent guy and he drafted 2 qb in the same draft when he already had rodgers and favre on the roster during favre waffling. The guy brohm,drafted in the 2nd rd was beat out early by the 7th rd guy in flynn. I'm pretty sure they had brohm rated a lot higher talent wise,but flynn beat him quickly. Think about that,favre,rodgers,brohm,and flynn all on the same roster and yet you want to wait till 2015 and suck balls in the process to have a shot at winston?

I use luck as an example a lot. He's not playing like peyton jr as many expected,but even so with a avg o line,run game and defense,his team is on pace to win 11 games again. The year before he got there with peyton out,they won 2 games. People talked about the same issues with the colts as they are the texans. A high end qb can mask a lot of problems on yur team. Thestruggling rg3 covered up one of the worse defenses in football last year. the elite qbs cover flaws on the team,they don't have the luxury of top 5 defenses,oline,run game to win games as people suggest. That being said,I wouldn't move up to get bridgewater,but I wouldn't move down either. There are some prospects who will be there in the early 2nd with talent. The same can be said about every other posistion too. For every so call safe matthews pick,there are several rt availible at the top of the 2nd and even early 3rd rd. The goal is to get impact players. Impact players impact the game offensively and defensively. Joe Thoams is a great lt,but look at his playoff record. Exactly! There is none because the browns have misevaluated the qb position since they've come back in 99. Couch,quinn,weeden have been 1st rd takes and all have failed. That's why they can't overcome pitts,baltimore,or even cincy. Steelers and ravens have been pretty consistent since they drafted flacco and big ben. Every team that has been consistent playoff teams have franchise qbs. If you don't have one and you get the chance,you better get one. I think brdgewater is one.
 
You can tell yourself that till you're blue or purple in the face. There are probably 8 or 9 qb alone who are a lot better than case talent wise. You keep saying wait till 2015, by my account and I've already looked forward,there is one and he facing a rape charge. Unless you think the texans are gonna finish 2-14 again,how do you think they can get winston.

We can start with bridgewater and make it to murray and those guys are more talented to than keenum from arm talent to size. Bridgewater,manziel,boyd,mariotto,mettenburger,carr,murray and even hundley if he stays in the draft with be drafted in the 1st 3 rds minimum. Now I'm not saying gms don't make mistakes and to a lot of them perception can be reality. When you're undrafted at qb,there is a perception of talent and ability vs a guy drafted in the 1st 3rds. There will not be a gm with the chance to add a guy with franchise qb ability is gonna pass for case keenum. Just like gradkoski and guys like that,their rope is shorter,but that don't mean that can't play in the league as backups. Ted thompson is viewed as a pretty good talent guy and he drafted 2 qb in the same draft when he already had rodgers and favre on the roster during favre waffling. The guy brohm,drafted in the 2nd rd was beat out early by the 7th rd guy in flynn. I'm pretty sure they had brohm rated a lot higher talent wise,but flynn beat him quickly. Think about that,favre,rodgers,brohm,and flynn all on the same roster and yet you want to wait till 2015 and suck balls in the process to have a shot at winston?

I use luck as an example a lot. He's not playing like peyton jr as many expected,but even so with a avg o line,run game and defense,his team is on pace to win 11 games again. The year before he got there with peyton out,they won 2 games. People talked about the same issues with the colts as they are the texans. A high end qb can mask a lot of problems on yur team. Thestruggling rg3 covered up one of the worse defenses in football last year. the elite qbs cover flaws on the team,they don't have the luxury of top 5 defenses,oline,run game to win games as people suggest. That being said,I wouldn't move up to get bridgewater,but I wouldn't move down either. There are some prospects who will be there in the early 2nd with talent. The same can be said about every other posistion too. For every so call safe matthews pick,there are several rt availible at the top of the 2nd and even early 3rd rd. The goal is to get impact players. Impact players impact the game offensively and defensively. Joe Thoams is a great lt,but look at his playoff record. Exactly! There is none because the browns have misevaluated the qb position since they've come back in 99. Couch,quinn,weeden have been 1st rd takes and all have failed. That's why they can't overcome pitts,baltimore,or even cincy. Steelers and ravens have been pretty consistent since they drafted flacco and big ben. Every team that has been consistent playoff teams have franchise qbs. If you don't have one and you get the chance,you better get one. I think brdgewater is one.

Long read

Agree with some of it, disagree with other parts of it (Winston/Petty/Hogan) but you are right about Joe Thomas and the Browns.

Where we disagree is you think Bridgewater can be Luck. I see him as Andy Dalton. So we will have to agree to disagree on this one. Although I really enjoy going back and forth with you on the draft talk.
 
whens the draft

I've had a crawfish boil for the last 5 yrs on the last Saturday in April. God'ell ruined the Draft crawfish boil by moving the 1st rd of the draft to Thursday night. But we had the party anyway.

Now God'ell has moved the draft starting on the 1st Thursday in May. I'm not moving the crawfish boil. People have gotten used to showing up in April.

Thanks Rog God'ell
 
I've had a crawfish boil for the last 5 yrs on the last Saturday in April. God'ell ruined the Draft crawfish boil by moving the 1st rd of the draft to Thursday night. But we had the party anyway.

Now God'ell has moved the draft starting on the 1st Thursday in May. I'm not moving the crawfish boil. People have gotten used to showing up in April.

Thanks Rog God'ell

Roger's all about fixing things that aren't broken and making changes hardly anyone is asking for. Worst thing to happen to the NFL in my lifetime is that SOB getting the gig as Commissioner.
 
Long read

Agree with some of it, disagree with other parts of it (Winston/Petty/Hogan) but you are right about Joe Thomas and the Browns.

Where we disagree is you think Bridgewater can be Luck. I see him as Andy Dalton. So we will have to agree to disagree on this one. Although I really enjoy going back and forth with you on the draft talk.

Well , I've never heard that one. Bridgewater=Dalton? Oh well, its a 1st for everything. Bridgewater is probably a better prospect than winston. Hogan isn't even in bridgewaters class.
 
Scratch UCLA's Brett Hundley from the QB derby in the upcoming draft.

Some teammate let it out after beating USC tonight that Hundley will return for his senior year.
 
You can tell yourself that till you're blue or purple in the face. There are probably 8 or 9 qb alone who are a lot better than case talent wise. You keep saying wait till 2015, by my account and I've already looked forward,there is one and he facing a rape charge. Unless you think the texans are gonna finish 2-14 again,how do you think they can get winston.

We can start with bridgewater and make it to murray and those guys are more talented to than keenum from arm talent to size. Bridgewater,manziel,boyd,mariotto,mettenburger,carr,murray and even hundley if he stays in the draft with be drafted in the 1st 3 rds minimum. Now I'm not saying gms don't make mistakes and to a lot of them perception can be reality. When you're undrafted at qb,there is a perception of talent and ability vs a guy drafted in the 1st 3rds. There will not be a gm with the chance to add a guy with franchise qb ability is gonna pass for case keenum. Just like gradkoski and guys like that,their rope is shorter,but that don't mean that can't play in the league as backups. Ted thompson is viewed as a pretty good talent guy and he drafted 2 qb in the same draft when he already had rodgers and favre on the roster during favre waffling. The guy brohm,drafted in the 2nd rd was beat out early by the 7th rd guy in flynn. I'm pretty sure they had brohm rated a lot higher talent wise,but flynn beat him quickly. Think about that,favre,rodgers,brohm,and flynn all on the same roster and yet you want to wait till 2015 and suck balls in the process to have a shot at winston?

I use luck as an example a lot. He's not playing like peyton jr as many expected,but even so with a avg o line,run game and defense,his team is on pace to win 11 games again. The year before he got there with peyton out,they won 2 games. People talked about the same issues with the colts as they are the texans. A high end qb can mask a lot of problems on yur team. Thestruggling rg3 covered up one of the worse defenses in football last year. the elite qbs cover flaws on the team,they don't have the luxury of top 5 defenses,oline,run game to win games as people suggest. That being said,I wouldn't move up to get bridgewater,but I wouldn't move down either. There are some prospects who will be there in the early 2nd with talent. The same can be said about every other posistion too. For every so call safe matthews pick,there are several rt availible at the top of the 2nd and even early 3rd rd. The goal is to get impact players. Impact players impact the game offensively and defensively. Joe Thoams is a great lt,but look at his playoff record. Exactly! There is none because the browns have misevaluated the qb position since they've come back in 99. Couch,quinn,weeden have been 1st rd takes and all have failed. That's why they can't overcome pitts,baltimore,or even cincy. Steelers and ravens have been pretty consistent since they drafted flacco and big ben. Every team that has been consistent playoff teams have franchise qbs. If you don't have one and you get the chance,you better get one. I think brdgewater is one.

I'm LMAO.

I double LMAO.
 
Sorry, Leebigz, I don't see how a defender of Geno Smith can even have a conversation here, the way he shoots down Keenum.

It blows my mind.
 
Then, if you have to, trade down a little later in the first round.

Casey Hampton
Vince Wilfork
Dontari Poe
Star Lotulelei


Doc, perhaps you can expound on the situations of Quisenberry and kid from N.Carolina, name slips my mind. Reason being is that I feel you could have the line shored up with young internal CHEAP higher round picks or use some of the 8 Ms or so before restructures to bring in a veteran.

With a top pick in a loaded draft you have to maximize the return in first 3 rounds, all selections being immediate starters IMO and you can't give up one of those coveted spots to grab an interior lineman. You can't pass up on a 275 lb sub 4.5 pass rusher to nab a RT, and by all accounts it would be Matthews who I feel has had a mediocre season at best.

Best talent available, if you draft for need you usually make mistakes.
 
Doc, perhaps you can expound on the situations of Quisenberry and kid from N.Carolina, name slips my mind. Reason being is that I feel you could have the line shored up with young internal CHEAP higher round picks or use some of the 8 Ms or so before restructures to bring in a veteran.

With a top pick in a loaded draft you have to maximize the return in first 3 rounds, all selections being immediate starters IMO and you can't give up one of those coveted spots to grab an interior lineman. You can't pass up on a 275 lb sub 4.5 pass rusher to nab a RT, and by all accounts it would be Matthews who I feel has had a mediocre season at best.

Best talent available, if you draft for need you usually make mistakes.

Quisenberry suffered a foot fracture which the Texans did not characterize, nor have they identified whether it required surgery or not. If it was a simple metatarsal fracture without ligament injury, he has at least 90% chance of return without loss of overall performance. If it involves multiple fractures, ankle involvement or significant ligament damage, it could be a long term problem which may put both his performance and longevity in question.

Brennan Williams' health was always been an issue for Williams at North Carolina and it came to Houston in another form. The fact that he had microfracture surgery means that injury was not secondary to a recent preseason injury..........it was a chronic injury which had to be sustained at least back in his college years. It guarantees that there is already significant cartilage loss and boney arthritis in that knee. I would be very guarded as to his ability to return to anything close to pre-surgery expectations.
 
Sorry, Leebigz, I don't see how a defender of Geno Smith can even have a conversation here, the way he shoots down Keenum.

It blows my mind.

Geno smith has measurables and a tangible skill set which gives him a better chance for NFL success... I know that doesn't decide the issue. I would not want to me a Jet fans, hoping Geno Smith works out well.

I think a lot of Keenum, but he has a lot of hurdles to overcome and I don't want to gamble that he will do it. I have no problem with a genuine QB competition next year. A top five pick only makes around $5 million per year. So, add that number to Keenums salary and it comes to.....$5 million. I want the problem of too much QB talent. That is a good problem to have! If keenum loses the job, he gets traded or signed as a RfA or UFA in two years, with the Texans gaining compensation either way. If he wins the job, we have a talented and developmental QB backup, who has trade value as well as creating depth... Until it is time to re-sign Keenum to a bigger deal, at
East.
 
Case put some doubt in my mind today. That's what he needs to continue to do. Make the team make a hard decision.
 
He's the QB the rest of the way this year. I think he's earned a spot in the QB competition next year, but he has not earned anything more than that.
 
Do people realize that Dre would have a career year if we pro-rate his six games with Keenum?

Even if you disregard the catches from Schaub in the Raiders' game.
 
Imagine if you can find a QB better than that.
Except there isn't a sure thing out there.

Give me a guy that can do that for AJ, I'll take him and root hard for him.
 
Imagine if you can find a QB better than that.
Except there isn't a sure thing out there.

Give me a guy that can do that for AJ, I'll take him and root hard for him.

I'm more concerned with how the qb helps the entire offense. Not just AJ.
 
Imagine if you can find a QB better than that.
Except there isn't a sure thing out there.

Give me a guy that can do that for AJ, I'll take him and root hard for him.

1.) How do you judge whether a guy is a sure thing or not?

2.) Would you consider Keenum a sure thing as a NFL QB?
 
Get Case help early. Pick a QB later. I keep hearing how deep the QB draft is.

If you draft a QB early, you still need to get HIM help. Only you're doing it in the later rounds.

It would be different if there was an Andrew Luck in the draft, but there isn't. There is a lot of solid talent, but no one is that sure thing.

That being said, there are a few more games to add data into that decision. If Case regresses again then you have to make a different decision.
 
1.) How do you judge whether a guy is a sure thing or not?

2.) Would you consider Keenum a sure thing as a NFL QB?


1. I am pretty much at the mercy of draft analyst. I don't know enough or see enough to have much of my own opinion when it comes to all the players available.

But there have been a lot of consensus sure things out there. Most of them have been right with a couple stumbles.

2. Keenum is promising but NOT a sure-thing. Which is why I think you take advantage of the QB depth in the draft and use 1 for the O-Line and get a QB somewhere between rounds 2-3.
 
1.) How do you judge whether a guy is a sure thing or not?

2.) Would you consider Keenum a sure thing as a NFL QB?

You can't know right now...and that answers both of your questions.

Personally, I don't think the Keenum Kultists nor the Keenum Killers have any way of knowing what the hell to think at the moment, because this team is in such a state of flux. It's going to remain in a state of flux, too, with a coaching change and all of that, we won't know where we stand until roughly this time next year.

If anything in this coming draft I would be looking at.

Rd 1. DE/LB/QB
Rd 2. QB/DE/LB
Rd 3. OT/OT/OT

Because remember, we have more promising young linemen on IR than we've ever had. It was just the luck of the draw this year that we didn't have them at hand to insert them. That sucks...but, in theory, at least, we should be deep in O-linemen.
 
You can't know right now...and that answers both of your questions.

Personally, I don't think the Keenum Kultists nor the Keenum Killers have any way of knowing what the hell to think at the moment, because this team is in such a state of flux. It's going to remain in a state of flux, too, with a coaching change and all of that, we won't know where we stand until roughly this time next year.

If anything in this coming draft I would be looking at.

Rd 1. DE/LB/QB
Rd 2. QB/DE/LB
Rd 3. OT/OT/OT

Because remember, we have more promising young linemen on IR than we've ever had in a long time. It was just the luck of the draw this year that we didn't have them at hand to insert them. That sucks...but, in theory, at least, we should be deep in O-linemen.

Not if we start going away from the zbs, plus A NEW coaching staff won't necessarily like our young guys......
 
You can't know right now...and that answers both of your questions.

Personally, I don't think the Keenum Kultists nor the Keenum Killers have any way of knowing what the hell to think at the moment, because this team is in such a state of flux. .

actually we do know. every game keenum has played has been winnable but the team hasn't been able to close out games. there are areas which he needs to improve as well.

31pts on the patriots today? lol felt better than getting blown out last year.
 
In the Internet age, the hype machine cranks up early and goes full blast on all sorts of things, QB potential included.

In the end, if more than a couple of the 2014 crop turn out to be first-rate NFL QBs, it will be quite an accomplishment.
 
That post was more than 3,000 characters.

My master's thesis was shorter.

Any chance of a twitter-like limit on this board?

No. Nor should there be. If you don't want to read a long post then skip it.

I disagree with most of what he said but the length of the post was not a problem.
 
I think he had 2 batted/tipped passes (not counting the hit he took that led to his INT).

His second one came on the last play of the game as he tried to throw a prayer as he was going down and another defender just mutumbo'd it.
 
Not if we start going away from the zbs, plus A NEW coaching staff won't necessarily like our young guys......

This is true. MSR. My point is, since the game is won and lost in the trenches, somewhere in those first 3 draft picks I would only assume that the Texans would draft DL/OL/QB in whatever order they see fit. The fact is, our trenches suck, and we have no idea about he future of our QB.

It really is difficult one to pin down. A strong argument could be made for Clowney on the other side of Watt. A very strong argument can be made for Jake Matthews with our first pick (my personal fave actually, because history shows us that pass rushers can be found in the 2nd and 3rd rounds, not so much starting O-linemen who aren't projects).

As far as QBs, I'm going 2nd or 3rd round with Carr, Hogan, Mettenberger...maybe Boyd, maybe even Fales.
 
I look at Keenum's starts and I don't necessarily see them as pass/fail dependent on wins and losses. I just watch the game and come away from it thinking either that he showed me something or he didn't. Took a step forward or he didn't. So far I grade them like this

Kansas City - Well done, regardless of the outcome. "A" in my book
Indianapolis - Another strong showing. "B" this time around.
Arizona - About a "C" performance. Did some good things, did some bad things.
Oakland - Not so great. Definitely some cracks showing. I'd call this one a solid "D"
Jacksonville - Dismal performance. His first outright "F"
New England - Strong game. I'd call it a "B" Clear improvement.

With Jacksonville, Indianapolis, Denver, Tennessee to go I'm hoping that today's performance means we're looking at an upcoming stretch of solid play out of Keenum. If I think his performance merits a "pass" in three of the next four games I'd roll with Keenum in 2014 in a new system under a new HC. I realize that probably won't happen though. New HC will want to use his shiny new Top-5 draft pick on his new QB whether he needs one or not. that's his call and so be it.

Today though, Keenum did just fine. When your defense gives up TD's on damn near every drive in the second half that's tough for a QB to correct.
 
Let's keep in mind that the Pats were starting 5 rookies on defense because of injuries. This wasn't your average Pats defense.

That said, Keenum played pretty good for the majority of the game. He was off on that last drive though and has struggled on every game ending drive opportunity this year.
 
Let's keep in mind that the Pats were starting 5 rookies on defense because of injuries. This wasn't your average Pats defense.

That said, Keenum played pretty good for the majority of the game. He was off on that last drive though and has struggled on every game ending drive opportunity this year.

Keenum wasn't really off on that last drive. He had two guys drop passes they could have caught.

Unless I'm thinking about a different drive.
 
I look at Keenum's starts and I don't necessarily see them as pass/fail dependent on wins and losses. I just watch the game and come away from it thinking either that he showed me something or he didn't. Took a step forward or he didn't. So far I grade them like this

Kansas City - Well done, regardless of the outcome. "A" in my book
Indianapolis - Another strong showing. "B" this time around.
Arizona - About a "C" performance. Did some good things, did some bad things.
Oakland - Not so great. Definitely some cracks showing. I'd call this one a solid "D"
Jacksonville - Dismal performance. His first outright "F"
New England - Strong game. I'd call it a "B" Clear improvement.

With Jacksonville, Indianapolis, Denver, Tennessee to go I'm hoping that today's performance means we're looking at an upcoming stretch of solid play out of Keenum. If I think his performance merits a "pass" in three of the next four games I'd roll with Keenum in 2014 in a new system under a new HC. I realize that probably won't happen though. New HC will want to use his shiny new Top-5 draft pick on his new QB whether he needs one or not. that's his call and so be it.

Today though, Keenum did just fine. When your defense gives up TD's on damn near every drive in the second half that's tough for a QB to correct.

I agree with this 100%. If you didn't see a clear improvement with this game, youre blind or a hater.....
 
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