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All encompassing Bill O'Brien thread

CloakNNNdagger said:
Then you weren't listening too carefully. I wasn't the only one pointing out that the Oline looked terrible, that Watson was able to "neutralize" their play by his elusiveness, and that Watson being forced to [successfully] run for his life on many plays would eventually be injured when he could not avoid the rush or while in the act of carrying the ball. Just because Watson was successful, that success was in spite of the Oline's play...........not because of it.
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Exactly. This is why next years success is still questionable because there is no guarantee the OL gets fixed
 
TheKDog said:
Exactly. This is why next years success is still questionable because there is no guarantee the OL gets fixed
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2-3 years

Absolute disaster. It always does take around that long.

Not only have we wasted JJ Watts best years, we are about to waste Watson's too. Football start in trenches, was, will be.. until... FOREVER

No new GM is gonna succeed, if talent eval on the field is poor also. IF I was the coach and you tell me Lamm and Clark in my RT for sure and Duane is Holding out and both backs up might see action at the same time. I would say something and demand more movement in FA. BOB had have to have to approved the talent level even if RS was a poor GM.

Retention of BOB make me nervous, but one last chance I guess. I am all for it.
 
dwight pugoy said:
2-3 years

Absolute disaster. It always does take around that long.

Not only have we wasted JJ Watts best years, we are about to waste Watson's too. Football start in trenches, was, will be.. until... FOREVER

No new GM is gonna succeed, if talent eval on the field is poor also. IF I was the coach and you tell me Lamm and Clark in my RT for sure and Duane is Holding out and both backs up might see action at the same time. I would say something and demand more movement in FA. BOB had have to have to approved the talent level even if RS was a poor GM.

Retention of BOB make me nervous, but one last chance I guess. I am all for it.
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The new GM is going to need time.

I hope they don't hire the one who overpromises "sure we can fix the OL and contend in 1 year!" vs. the guy who is honest and correct that it will take time.
 
CND "Throw Mickey Mouse out there with a helmet, great heart and a chip on his shoulder...........and he will still look like Mickey Mouse with a helmet playing football."

Unfortunately, the bulk of the replacement talent the Texans had was more like Goofy with a helmet playing football...
 
steelbtexan said:
Yes they have

I think the McNair's are all about $$$$. They're not going to waste $$$$ on a GM search for an interim GM search. What in the McNair's past would make you think differently? Look at what happened in the past when they've used firms. Status quo = promoting Raye and not needing a search firm.
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Don't you really think Raye is just their Rooney-rule interviewee otherwise they would already be sitting down with him and dotting i and crossing ts since he's been there all year which surely makes him a known quantity by now.
 
IDEXAN said:
Don't you really think Raye is just their Rooney-rule interviewee otherwise they would already be sitting down with him and dotting i and crossing ts since he's been there all year which surely makes him a known quantity by now.
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Yea mclain said today Raye is getting an interview but it's basically a Rooney rule thing. Mcnairs told him they have 4 interviews lined up next week. Only w confirmed ones are Raye and Gaines. Mcnairs wouldn't tell him the others, no one has reported that the patriots or packers have granted us permission to interview their guys. so far it's being kept pretty tight lipped
 
TheKDog said:
Does it seem like the GM is gonna have more power than OBrien?

It even mentions that the GM could conduct a housecleaning next year.

If accurate, that does make me slightly more optimistic.
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The answer to your first question came from McNair's own mouth. The GM will NOT have power over the HC. The HC will not have power over the GM. They both answer to the owner.

If the new GM isn't happy with the scouts or the fitness/strength guy or any other thing on the personnel side, he's free to make those changes and bring in his hand-picked people.
But the new GM won't be making coaching staff changes or making O'Brien take an OC not of his own picking.
 
IDEXAN said:
Don't you really think Raye is just their Rooney-rule interviewee otherwise they would already be sitting down with him and dotting i and crossing ts since he's been there all year which surely makes him a known quantity by now.
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Hopefully
 
steelbtexan said:
Yep,

Look at the OL, that was a really talented group.
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Of coarse there were weaknesses but to me it was obvious the team was not prepared or involved the last month of the season. It boils down to being competitive or not. Losing games is one thing but the way in which the team looked down the stretch of losses is another.
 
dwight pugoy said:
Football start in trenches, was, will be.. until... FOREVER
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Problem with that though, much like QB, linemen in college, particularly OL, aren't really learning to play NFL OL. Going by nothing but perception and assumption here, as I haven't done any research on it, the bust rate with them seems to be getting just as dicey as it is with QBs. And there seems to be as much of a drop off from starter to 2nd and 3rd string as it is with QBs. I mean, if the Texans are running guys out there that likely wouldn't even be playing in this league otherwise, speaks a lot to the depth at the position.

Could be totally off on that, but it just seems that way.

It seems there were more than a few bad O-lines in the NFL this year. I don't see how the NFL can keep some sort of developmental league out of the equation any more. Before you can even think about expanding to London or Mexico or where ever, you've got to teach guys how to play the damn game first.
 
ObsiWan said:
The answer to your first question came from McNair's own mouth. The GM will NOT have power over the HC. The HC will not have power over the GM. They both answer to the owner.

If the new GM isn't happy with the scouts or the fitness/strength guy or any other thing on the personnel side, he's free to make those changes and bring in his hand-picked people.
But the new GM won't be making coaching staff changes or making O'Brien take an OC not of his own picking.
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Not for the first year... he may want to bring in a few people he knows, but there will be no wholesale changes the first year according to something i read yesterday. Will try to find the link

No housecleaning yet

McNair said the new GM can hire people he wants to join him but won't be able to make wholesale changes this year. People in the personnel department who were hired by Smith are concerned about losing their jobs.

"He may have one or two key people he's worked with and are valuable members of his team, and he might want to bring them in," McNair said. "I think that's reasonable. It's also reasonable to ask that person to work with the people we have this year and see what he thinks.

"We're not going to have somebody come in and clean house and start firing everybody. After he's worked with them for a while, if he thinks they're not capable of doing the kind of job we expect, he can replace them."
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Link
 
Speedy said:
Problem with that though, much like QB, linemen in college, particularly OL, aren't really learning to play NFL OL. Going by nothing but perception and assumption here, as I haven't done any research on it, the bust rate with them seems to be getting just as dicey as it is with QBs. And there seems to be as much of a drop off from starter to 2nd and 3rd string as it is with QBs. I mean, if the Texans are running guys out there that likely wouldn't even be playing in this league otherwise, speaks a lot to the depth at the position.

Could be totally off on that, but it just seems that way.

It seems there were more than a few bad O-lines in the NFL this year. I don't see how the NFL can keep some sort of developmental league out of the equation any more. Before you can even think about expanding to London or Mexico or where ever, you've got to teach guys how to play the damn game first.
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Awesome observation and point. This overall OL situation may force NFL teams into a new philosophy on how college OL are developed. These same athletes had to be converted from HS OL to college OL in the majority of situations and from indications, they will need to be converted from college OL to NFL OL in the majority of cases. It may come to pass that only a handful of college OL will be plug-and-play ready while the rest could use a full season to get adjusted -from a strength and technique standpoint- to the NFL game. I don't think fans should view this in a negative light, it's just going to become a process of necessity if the teams desire is to see these young OL develop for the long haul.

Now, if NFL owners are not thrilled with the way the college game is developing their future players, then the time may be "now" to look into a developmental league where players can be nurtured along in preparation for the next step. I still think this could involve the HS players versus the college player. If a 17-18 year old enters an NFL Developmental League and the same type of athlete enters college, my guess would be, the NFLDL players would be much further along in their ability to be Day 1 contributors to their respective teams than the college athletes who might require a lot of re-training to become contributors.

Like I mentioned in my Mock 1.0 Draft...I'd go heavy on OL b/c of necessity and unfortunately, many of them would be playing in 2018, either as starters or back-ups if they make the roster. I would probably reserve at least 2 more spots in the 2019 draft as a way to stock the shelves. The team could certainly hit on a Day 1 starter, which would be awesome but keeping the team covers full is going to be just as important b/c of the way a team can be ravaged by injuries.
 
austins23 said:
And I believe you pointed it out that Watson was injured during the Patriots game. And if I remember correctly it was ol Breno that whiffed on the edge rusher and allowed the guy to roll up on Watson.
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Giacomini whiffed and Lamar Miller couldn't control the DE Frank Clark, who hit Watson's knee in the Seattle game before the Thursday practice which his knee totally gave. :tiphat:
 
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JB said:
Not for the first year... he may want to bring in a few people he knows, but there will be no wholesale changes the first year according to something i read yesterday. Will try to find the link

Link
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Yeah, I saw that quote from McNair in the article (from John McClain) that Cloak posted. McNair specifically said he'd ask the new GM to try and work with who was already here and not just come in chopping heads. But after that year he would be free to make changes.

I wonder if that's McNair's way of telling the new guy, "*I* think these people are good at their jobs so don't come in here making changes for the sake of making changes. That won't impress me. You need to work with these people and then be able to explain to me why you think they need to be replaced. Oh and tell me who you're replacing them with and why those people will be better."

The preceding was pure speculation on my part. But this is a msg board; it's what we do.
 
ObsiWan said:
Yeah, I saw that quote from McNair in the article (from John McClain) that Cloak posted. McNair specifically said he'd ask the new GM to try and work with who was already here and not just come in chopping heads. But after that year he would be free to make changes.

I wonder if that's McNair's way of telling the new guy, "*I* think these people are good at their jobs so don't come in here making changes for the sake of making changes. That won't impress me. You need to work with these people and then be able to explain to me why you think they need to be replaced. Oh and tell me who you're replacing them with and why those people will be better."

The preceding was pure speculation on my part. But this is a msg board; it's what we do.
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Speculation on my part is

McNair is telling the new GM that these guys have done draft prep work all yr and lets use their work for this rs draft. If you dont like the direction of this yrs draft and want to make changes before next yrs draft then I'm OK with you making whatever moves in the scouting dept that you see fit.
 
CloakNNNdagger said:
Giacomini whiffed and Lamar Miller couldn't control the DE Frank Clark, who hit Watson's knee in the Seattle game before the Thursday practice which his knee totally gave. :tiphat:
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People keep say
ObsiWan said:
Yeah, I saw that quote from McNair in the article (from John McClain) that Cloak posted. McNair specifically said he'd ask the new GM to try and work with who was already here and not just come in chopping heads. But after that year he would be free to make changes.

I wonder if that's McNair's way of telling the new guy, "*I* think these people are good at their jobs so don't come in here making changes for the sake of making changes. That won't impress me. You need to work with these people and then be able to explain to me why you think they need to be replaced. Oh and tell me who you're replacing them with and why those people will be better."

The preceding was pure speculation on my part. But this is a msg board; it's what we do.
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Yep sure sounds like conditions on getting hired.

But why?

There is plenty of time to get ready for free agency and draft.
 
ObsiWan said:
Yeah, I saw that quote from McNair in the article (from John McClain) that Cloak posted. McNair specifically said he'd ask the new GM to try and work with who was already here and not just come in chopping heads. But after that year he would be free to make changes.

I wonder if that's McNair's way of telling the new guy, "*I* think these people are good at their jobs so don't come in here making changes for the sake of making changes. That won't impress me. You need to work with these people and then be able to explain to me why you think they need to be replaced. Oh and tell me who you're replacing them with and why those people will be better."

The preceding was pure speculation on my part. But this is a msg board; it's what we do.
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This is what traditional GM power structures do. Come in, clean house, and install their own cronies.

With corporations, not so much. Hire a new GM, but expect him to evaluate existing personnel, maybe bring in 1-2 of his own, but do not disrupt the company at the expense of the immediate future (i.e. 2018 season). And those that do get pink slips in the future will need to be approved by the big boss and maybe even the board of directors.
 
May be taking the boardroom analogy a bit far or over-generalized. Let's remember, McNair is a billionaire because he kept his company private...in his control.
 
Double Barrel said:
This is what traditional GM power structures do. Come in, clean house, and install their own cronies.

With corporations, not so much. Hire a new GM, but expect him to evaluate existing personnel, maybe bring in 1-2 of his own, but do not disrupt the company at the expense of the immediate future (i.e. 2018 season). And those that do get pink slips in the future will need to be approved by the big boss and maybe even the board of directors.
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Sounds like you've been watching the McNairs and how they operate from the franchise inception
 
infantrycak said:
May be taking the boardroom analogy a bit far or over-generalized. Let's remember, McNair is a billionaire because he kept his company private...in his control.
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Maybe, but I figure the boardroom thing is like a pyramid with Bob McNair at the top. He wants everyone below him on equal footing but obviously he's not an equal. I have seen this type of structure with several large corporations as our clients. Decisions by committee and presenting a sales call to a board is nerve-racking.
 
Goes with the pattern of behavior for sure. McNair made Kubiak work with Carr for 1 year before he could be ditched.
 
Double Barrel said:
Maybe, but I figure the boardroom thing is like a pyramid with Bob McNair at the top. He wants everyone below him on equal footing but obviously he's not an equal. I have seen this type of structure with several large corporations as our clients. Decisions by committee and presenting a sales call to a board is nerve-racking.
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I'm generally in agreement. Was only suggesting McNair is no mamby pamby who will always defer to the group although he encourages the discussion and consensus among them.
 
infantrycak said:
I'm generally in agreement. Was only suggesting McNair is no mamby pamby who will always defer to the group although he encourages the discussion and consensus among them.
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I don't think McNair is weak at all. Personally, I think he wields a lot more power than we realize. His recent comments about the new GM are telling in that regard. He's not a Jerrah-type owner, but I do not perceive him to be a pushover, either. The new GM ultimately answers to him, just like the HC does, and just like any good chairman / CEO does in the corporate world.
 
steelbtexan said:
Speculation on my part is

McNair is telling the new GM that these guys have done draft prep work all yr and lets use their work for this rs draft. If you dont like the direction of this yrs draft and want to make changes before next yrs draft then I'm OK with you making whatever moves in the scouting dept that you see fit.
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I agree totally. And that's all part of "see how these guys work before you come in making wholesale changes" thing I was talking about.
 
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Now that Gruden is signing with the Raiders for $100 million over 10 years, wonder what that does to the potential future salaries of new coach contracts including O'Brien's.
 
Double Barrel said:
Maybe, but I figure the boardroom thing is like a pyramid with Bob McNair at the top. He wants everyone below him on equal footing but obviously he's not an equal. I have seen this type of structure with several large corporations as our clients. Decisions by committee and presenting a sales call to a board is nerve-racking.
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I think you mean reverse funnel system.
 
CloakNNNdagger said:
Now that Gruden is signing with the Raiders for $100 million over 10 years, wonder what that does to the potential future salaries of new coach contracts including O'Brien's.
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Gruden got one over on the Raiders but O'Brien will not get the same chance until he has secured a Super Bowl victory.
 
CloakNNNdagger said:
Now that Gruden is signing with the Raiders for $100 million over 10 years, wonder what that does to the potential future salaries of new coach contracts including O'Brien's.
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Apparently the Raiders have been trying to get Gruden back on their sidelines for years

Gruden has been the primary target for Raiders owner Mark Davis as his head coach since shortly after patriarch Al Davis passed away. He has made numerous attempts to land Gruden -- who previously coached the Raiders and then beat them in the Super Bowl following his blockbuster trade to Tampa Bay -- in the past, including several instances where he believed he was getting him, only for Gruden to remain in the broadcast booth. While a return to the Raiders always had a unique appeal for Gruden, in the past ownership did not have a path to the revenue streams others teams enjoy via their state-of-the-art stadiums. Now, with the move to Las Vegas already approved, this franchise can reap those same financial rewards and be as competitive as Gruden would like from a fiscal standpoint.​

LINK

dang if I understand why...

...a TEN YEAR contract?!? Wow.
 
ObsiWan said:
Apparently the Raiders have been trying to get Gruden back on their sidelines for years

​
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I was already looking forward to todays PO game between the Chiefs & Titans and now according to the ABC promos Gruden is doing the game so that's gonna make it even more of an attraction with him on today to hear his comments immediately after he scored that huge deal with the Raiders just days ago.
 
steelbtexan said:
Because Ricky didn't fix the Ol and knew that is prized QB pick wouldn't be protected properly. It was part of Ricky's power play to get rid of BOB. Luckily the plan backfired on Ricky. # Dysfunction is the word most commonly used.

Because Ricky's gone that should tell you how things were going on behind the scenes. McNair basically gave the godfather of his grandkids the boot. (Gracefully) Either way is doesn't matter Ricky's gone. (Good riddance)

BTW, using Cak's logic, how do we know Savage wasn't Ricky's pick.
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Makes no sense at all. Are you telling me viewing the profile at which Smith had been drafting for Kubiak was the same as OBrien? You cant be that dense. Fido,XSF, nor Savage fit the Kubiak mold. How do I know? Open your eyes! XSF was more power blocker, Fido wasn't a x-qb, and savage never played in any kind of west coast/movement type of offense. So this deal with you saying coach and gm on same page is ridiculous.
 
leebigeztx said:
Makes no sense at all. Are you telling me viewing the profile at which Smith had been drafting for Kubiak was the same as OBrien? You cant be that dense. Fido,XSF, nor Savage fit the Kubiak mold. How do I know? Open your eyes! XSF was more power blocker, Fido wasn't a x-qb, and savage never played in any kind of west coast/movement type of offense. So this deal with you saying coach and gm on same page is ridiculous.
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So you're saying Ricky/BOB were on the same page after all that's gone on since last yrs playoffs? You cant be that dense.

McNair must agree with me because Ricky's on leave and he's hiring a NEW GM. If he wanted Ricky back he would keep the seat warm for Ricky.

Either way I dont care, I'm just glad Ricky's gone.
 
steelbtexan said:
So you're saying Ricky/BOB were on the same page after all that's gone on since last yrs playoffs? You cant be that dense.

McNair must agree with me because Ricky's on leave and he's hiring a NEW GM. If he wanted Ricky back he would keep the seat warm for Ricky.

Either way I dont care, I'm just glad Ricky's gone.
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The purpose of the gm is to get the players that fit the profile of the coach. Smith has been the gm for 2 offensive minded coaches. Casserly drafted players based on Kubiak profile. Owen Daniels, Eric Winston, and Spencer all fit Kubiak offensive profile. The next yr, Smith comes in and Matt Schaub was recognized as the qb. Myers was recognized as the center, Duane Brown was recognized as the franchise it. Fast forward to O'Brien coming from the big,slow, big ten. His first words were get bigger and stronger. What were the 1st moves based on his profile? Go get Fitzpatrick vs trying to fix Schaub or transition with Keenum or Yates. What about the draft? XSF, Fido, and Savage. None of those guys would've fit Kubes model. What about Mallet or Is? When was the last time a kubiak/shannahan guy signed a running back vs drafting a guy?

I get it, you have your opinion, you don't want to look at the history. Thing is, I don't have a problem with Smith or Obrien. I understand the gm/coach relationship. Ozzie is a great gm in your opinion and I agree, but Ozzie doesn't just draft players. Speaking of, he has 2 rings in 22 yrs. Not to mention, look at the team post Superbowl both times,they've been garbage. Did Ozzie forget how to build a roster? While you're at it, look at the misses at wr. What about rb?
 
leebigeztx said:
The purpose of the gm is to get the players that fit the profile of the coach. Smith has been the gm for 2 offensive minded coaches. Casserly drafted players based on Kubiak profile. Owen Daniels, Eric Winston, and Spencer all fit Kubiak offensive profile. The next yr, Smith comes in and Matt Schaub was recognized as the qb. Myers was recognized as the center, Duane Brown was recognized as the franchise it. Fast forward to O'Brien coming from the big,slow, big ten. His first words were get bigger and stronger. What were the 1st moves based on his profile? Go get Fitzpatrick vs trying to fix Schaub or transition with Keenum or Yates. What about the draft? XSF, Fido, and Savage. None of those guys would've fit Kubes model. What about Mallet or Is? When was the last time a kubiak/shannahan guy signed a running back vs drafting a guy?

I get it, you have your opinion, you don't want to look at the history. Thing is, I don't have a problem with Smith or Obrien. I understand the gm/coach relationship. Ozzie is a great gm in your opinion and I agree, but Ozzie doesn't just draft players. Speaking of, he has 2 rings in 22 yrs. Not to mention, look at the team post Superbowl both times,they've been garbage. Did Ozzie forget how to build a roster? While you're at it, look at the misses at wr. What about rb?
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If you're right then thru 2 totally different kinds of HC's/scheme's Ricky hasn't been good enough at evaluating talent to fit either of the HC's schemes to put a contender on the field. Hence he gone.

Ozzie drafted Jamal Lewis- Pro Bowler and transitioned Rice- Pro Bowler, Since Rice unexpectedly got suspended Ozzie has picked up guys like West and now Collins off of the WW to handle the RB duties. The only WR that Ozzie has drafted high (Perriman) busted. (it happens) Ozzie mainly gets his WR's in FA and drafts slot guys like Campanaro late.

What Ozzie focuses his drafts on is the OL, which withstood many injuries this yr and defense. It's about time for Ozzie to start looking for a new QB though. Flacco is about done. This may be the yr Ozzie trades up for a guy like Allen, he seems to like small school guys with big arms and this describes Allen to a tee.
 
steelbtexan said:
If you're right then thru 2 totally different kinds of HC's/scheme's Ricky hasn't been good enough at evaluating talent to fit either of the HC's schemes to put a contender on the field. Hence he gone.

Ozzie drafted Jamal Lewis- Pro Bowler and transitioned Rice- Pro Bowler, Since Rice unexpectedly got suspended Ozzie has picked up guys like West and now Collins off of the WW to handle the RB duties. The only WR that Ozzie has drafted high (Perriman) busted. (it happens) Ozzie mainly gets his WR's in FA and drafts slot guys like Campanaro late.

What Ozzie focuses his drafts on is the OL, which withstood many injuries this yr and defense. It's about time for Ozzie to start looking for a new QB though. Flacco is about done. This may be the yr Ozzie trades up for a guy like Allen, he seems to like small school guys with big arms and this describes Allen to a tee.
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Does Smith or Kubiak get the credit for Arian Foster, JJ, Nuke, Winston, Brown, Myers and guys like that? What about the ex qb turned tight end Owen Daniels? See, as I stated, Ozzie, Decosta,and Savage didn t all of a sudden forget what talented players looked like . Remember Travis Taylor at wide wr? How do you classify him? As long as you hit on the most important position, qb, everything else can be recycled. That's how it works in the salary cap age. Once that qb cashes in, it takes your coaching staff to develop the other younger players.
 
leebigeztx said:
Does Smith or Kubiak get the credit for Arian Foster, JJ, Nuke, Winston, Brown, Myers and guys like that? What about the ex qb turned tight end Owen Daniels? See, as I stated, Ozzie, Decosta,and Savage didn t all of a sudden forget what talented players looked like . Remember Travis Taylor at wide wr? How do you classify him? As long as you hit on the most important position, qb, everything else can be recycled. That's how it works in the salary cap age. Once that qb cashes in, it takes your coaching staff to develop the other younger players.
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I considered Taylor to be avg. You're right about finding your QB. But like I said Ricky got Schaub and failed to produce a winner. Then spent yrs not even looking for a QB. Bottom line is Ricky was here for 11 yrs and didn't produce a contender.

Comparing Qzzie's tenure to Ricky's in the draft is laughable.
 
steelbtexan said:
If you're right then thru 2 totally different kinds of HC's/scheme's Ricky hasn't been good enough at evaluating talent to fit either of the HC's schemes to put a contender on the field. Hence he gone.

Ozzie drafted Jamal Lewis- Pro Bowler and transitioned Rice- Pro Bowler, Since Rice unexpectedly got suspended Ozzie has picked up guys like West and now Collins off of the WW to handle the RB duties. The only WR that Ozzie has drafted high (Perriman) busted. (it happens) Ozzie mainly gets his WR's in FA and drafts slot guys like Campanaro late.

What Ozzie focuses his drafts on is the OL, which withstood many injuries this yr and defense. It's about time for Ozzie to start looking for a new QB though. Flacco is about done. This may be the yr Ozzie trades up for a guy like Allen, he seems to like small school guys with big arms and this describes Allen to a tee.
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Does Smith or Kubiak get the credit for Arian Foster, JJ, Nuke, Winston, Brown, Myers and guys like that? What about the ex qb turned tight end Owen Daniels? See, as I stated, Ozzie, Decosta,and Savage didn t all of a sudden forget what talented players looked like . Remember Travis Taylor at wide wr? How do you classify him? As long as you hit on the most important position, qb, everything else can be recycled. That's how it works in the salary cap age. Once that qb cashes in, it takes your coaching staff to develop the other younger players.
steelbtexan said:
I considered Taylor to be avg. You're right about finding your QB. But like I said Ricky got Schaub and failed to produce a winner. Then spent yrs not even looking for a QB. Bottom line is Ricky was here for 11 yrs and didn't produce a contender.

Comparing Qzzie's tenure to Ricky's in the draft is laughable.
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I didn't compare Ozzie to Smith. I thought they should've drafted a qb the year Schaub got hurt. I thought they should've pushed all the chips in when Peyton came free, but you heard the owner in regards to that situation. That is unless you're going to say Smith should've overruled his owner.
 
infantrycak said:
2013 on Ozzie has taken 1 OL before the 4th out of 8 total. The Texans have taken 3 before the 4th out of 7 total.

Maybe the Ravens coaches get more out of players.
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Exactly! Which comes back to coaching. Who has gotten better under Obrien offensively? Nuke? When is Miller,Irvin,XSF going to get better?
 
infantrycak said:
2013 on Ozzie has taken 1 OL before the 4th out of 8 total. The Texans have taken 3 before the 4th out of 7 total.

Maybe the Ravens coaches get more out of players.
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He drafted Stanley in the 1st/I dont know what rd he drafted Yanda/Hurst in, he's also drafted Ogden etc... thoughout his tenure. Yes he's picked up starters later in the draft , maybe just maybe a HOF'er like Ozzie has a better eye for talent than Ricky had.
 
steelbtexan said:
He drafted Stanley in the 1st/I dont know what rd he drafted Yanda/Hurst in, he's also drafted Ogden etc... thoughout his tenure. Yes he's picked up starters later in the draft , maybe just maybe a HOF'er like Ozzie has a better eye for talent than Ricky had.
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Could be, but Ozzie did have 2 1st rd picks his 1st year. It's not like it was an expansion team. Bottom line, it's a results business and it's about Superbowl. Whatever perceived success they had, it's not enough. The Seahawks and Bucs came in as expansion teams in 76. It took them 20 plus years to get a Superbowl. The NFL didn t want the Jags and Panthers to suck that long, so they front loaded the team for them. The browns sux, Texans are avg. At least the Texans no longer have to compete with a all time great and they have their qb.
 
leebigeztx said:
Could be, but Ozzie did have 2 1st rd picks his 1st year. It's not like it was an expansion team. Bottom line, it's a results business and it's about Superbowl. Whatever perceived success they had, it's not enough. The Seahawks and Bucs came in as expansion teams in 76. It took them 20 plus years to get a Superbowl. The NFL didn t want the Jags and Panthers to suck that long, so they front loaded the team for them. The browns sux, Texans are avg. At least the Texans no longer have to compete with a all time great and they have their qb.
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The Bucs made the NFC championship game in 1979.
 
steelbtexan said:
What Ozzie focuses his drafts on is the OL, which withstood many injuries this yr and defense. It's about time for Ozzie to start looking for a new QB though. Flacco is about done. This may be the yr Ozzie trades up for a guy like Allen, he seems to like small school guys with big arms and this describes Allen to a tee.
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The word is that big, bad John Elway likes Allen and since he's pikin a lot higher than the Ravens so look for Josh Allen to be the Broncos top pic this year.
 
IDEXAN said:
The word is that big, bad John Elway likes Allen and since he's pikin a lot higher than the Ravens so look for Josh Allen to be the Broncos top pic this year.
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That tells Ozzie who he needs to trade in front of to pick Allen.
 
IDEXAN said:
The word is that big, bad John Elway likes Allen and since he's pikin a lot higher than the Ravens so look for Josh Allen to be the Broncos top pic this year.
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I wouldn't believe a single thing about which team likes which player. Smokescreen time for these guys.
 
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