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AFC South Champions!!!

Playing the "what if" game. If the Texans had handled Atlanta and Carolina, as they should have, the Texans would be the #2 seed and playing Pittsburgh again. Beating Pittsburgh, in the post-season, would exorcise a few demons for me from the Oiler days.
 
Byrds Man said:
Would someone here make a meme with a tombstone reading S2 cognition test and have CJ standing on the grave?
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I think everyone knows that it's not going to get brought up once in this draft evaluation process unless it's in a completely mocking sort of way.

I'm still fully expecting them to try and make a recovery and say CJs grades weren't that bad and the leaks were false.
 
Sweech said:
I think everyone knows that it's not going to get brought up once in this draft evaluation process unless it's in a completely mocking sort of way.

I'm still fully expecting them to try and make a recovery and say CJs grades weren't that bad and the leaks were false.
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Jerry Rice ran 4.7 40 time, we still test the 40 and talk about results ad nauseum.

Dan Marino scored a 16 on the wonderlic 40 years ago and the test was a mainstay in the 4 decades after.

An outlier here or there doesn't necessarily negate the relevancy of an entire data point.
 
DocBar said:
I want a Sunday game for the extra 24 hours of healing.
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That too for sure. More rest is welcome. Looking at the potential wild card match ups, Cleveland at Houston in my eyes (slightly biased) seems like one of the more exciting match ups of next weekend.
 
Lucky said:
I believe that was alluded to by the S2 spokesman without actually saying CJ's name.
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It was. I just expect them to be much louder about it now.

They were quiet as mice when it was to cover CJ when everyone was slandering him but I expect them to be loud and outspoken now that it's to cover themselves.

Overall they made a bet on CJ's failure and lost.
 
Mollywhopper said:
Jerry Rice ran 4.7 40 time, we still test the 40 and talk about results ad nauseum.

Dan Marino scored a 16 on the wonderlic 40 years ago and the test was a mainstay in the 4 decades after.

An outlier here or there doesn't necessarily negate the relevancy of an entire data point.
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Very different situations though.

One is an athletic test that's a mainstay and something people "fail" from time to time.

The other was a completely fraudulent test but was heavily promoted by the NFL itself and there was nothing else really like it at the time. The fact bthey didn't adjust to the wonderlic being worthless is more on them and their lack of experience evaluating such tests and data.

The S2 has many competitors and their whole main calling card was "no one who fails makes it" that was the entire claim to fame for the test. That no longer exists. Not only that but the whole thing the S2 claims to measure is probably the thing CJ is best at.
 
Mollywhopper said:
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From worst to first
 
Sweech said:
Not only that but the whole thing the S2 claims to measure is probably the thing CJ is best at.
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Doesn't tell me the test was wrong. It's probable that Cj or his coaches noticed similar issues with his game & were able to identify drills & processes to help him improve. That's what coaches do.

I like to bring up Will Fuller as an example. His draft report was that he was a body catcher & had poor hands. But by the time the Combine came around he had soft hands. Didn't drop anything at the Combine, & very few in the NFL.
 
Sweech said:
Very different situations though.

One is an athletic test that's a mainstay and something people "fail" from time to time.

The other was a completely fraudulent test but was heavily promoted by the NFL itself and there was nothing else really like it at the time. The fact bthey didn't adjust to the wonderlic being worthless is more on them and their lack of experience evaluating such tests and data.

The S2 has many competitors and their whole main calling card was "no one who fails makes it" that was the entire claim to fame for the test. That no longer exists. Not only that but the whole thing the S2 claims to measure is probably the thing CJ is best at.
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I don't recall the creators of the S2 using 'no one fails makes it' as a calling card of theirs. I saw/read them say several things but I don't remember that. I remember outsiders using that as an argument to validate the test, but I don't remember them claiming so.

Nonetheless.. as simply data points they're all the same. The 40, the wonderlic, and the S2. Throw in the bench press, the white board, the vertical, arm length, hand size, whatever S2-adjacent test the Texans use, etc. They're all just data points. And they're all data points that have outliers. The problem with any one data point isn't the outlier, it's when they're treated like an end-all-be-all determining factor in a decision. That's the real fail, not the data.
 
thunderkyss said:
Doesn't tell me the test was wrong. It's probable that Cj or his coaches noticed similar issues with his game & were able to identify drills & processes to help him improve. That's what coaches do.

I like to bring up Will Fuller as an example. His draft report was that he was a body catcher & had poor hands. But by the time the Combine came around he had soft hands. Didn't drop anything at the Combine, & very few in the NFL.
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C'mon man do you think they had a couple weeks and taught him how to process a football game?

Not only that but he looks like the guy we saw in college. Especially against Georgia. He doesn't at all look like someone who was re-invented especially from a cognition standpoint.

You can defend the test all you want, but it's getting a little silly now.
 
thunderkyss said:
Doesn't tell me the test was wrong. It's probable that Cj or his coaches noticed similar issues with his game & were able to identify drills & processes to help him improve. That's what coaches do.

I like to bring up Will Fuller as an example. His draft report was that he was a body catcher & had poor hands. But by the time the Combine came around he had soft hands. Didn't drop anything at the Combine, & very few in the NFL.
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Interestingly enough if you read a bit about the S2 test you can see how it's often used less like a 'test' and more like a training exercise. The S2 is used by many, many organizations not for drafting/hiring purposes but by organizations that already have established teams in place and to build on the kind of cognition aspects that the S2 tests for. They take it as a baseline and train to grow the results in subsequent tests.

It's a data point, a tool.. not a pass/fail.
 
Mollywhopper said:
I don't recall the creators of the S2 using 'no one fails makes it' as a calling card of theirs. I saw/read them say several things but I don't remember that. I remember outsiders using that as an argument to validate the test, but I don't remember them claiming so.

Nonetheless.. as simply data points they're all the same. The 40, the wonderlic, and the S2. Throw in the bench press, the white board, the vertical, arm length, hand size, whatever S2-adjacent test the Texans use, etc. They're all just data points. And they're all data points that have outliers. The problem with any one data point isn't the outlier, it's when they're treated like an end-all-be-all determining factor in a decision. That's the real fail, not the data.
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I understand what you're getting at but there's things like the wonderlic that calling it a data point like everything else is a disservice to everything else. It has no validity or correlation attached to it.

Like I get your overall point and agree, but not everything is in the same basket.

Also as I mentioned during the draft a major issue with the S2 was an overall lack of data. Its so new that using it's data especially to ding someone like Stroud was nonsensical.
 
thunderkyss said:
Doesn't tell me the test was wrong. It's probable that Cj or his coaches noticed similar issues with his game & were able to identify drills & processes to help him improve. That's what coaches do.

I like to bring up Will Fuller as an example. His draft report was that he was a body catcher & had poor hands. But by the time the Combine came around he had soft hands. Didn't drop anything at the Combine, & very few in the NFL.
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Honest question: Do we know when the test was taken in relation to the Combine? Your comment could read that Meco and Slowick fixed him, but I don't think that is what you are trying to say.
 
Just some thoughts:

1. What if Nico was a WR1?
2. What if CJ could overcome pressure?
3. What if Laremy could run block?
4. Is Lovie nursing a bruised toe from kicking TV?
5. Is David Culley yelling at his TV saying "I could do that with CJ and Will"?
5. Is Bill saying "I created that!"
6. Is Hannah doing cartwheels?
7. Did Cal break his jaw smiling?
8. Is Jack Easterby crying and singing "I had it all just like Bogey and Bacall"?
9. We have one more rebuilding year?
10. Is it too early to start talking about trades?

Happy New Year!

Much happier Texans wise than 12 months ago.
 
Sweech said:
I understand what you're getting at but there's things like the wonderlic that calling it a data point like everything else is a disservice to everything else. It has no validity or correlation attached to it.

Like I get your overall point and agree, but not everything is in the same basket.

Also as I mentioned during the draft a major issue with the S2 was an overall lack of data. It's so new that using it's data especially to ding someone like Stroud was nonsensical.
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I've no issue with criticizing the S2, it's not above reproach. But I wouldn't expect it to be completely discounted moving forward just because of one outlier, like you suggested earlier. I had some of the same thoughts on it's lack of overall sample size when it was being discussed pre/post-draft.

And like you said I wouldn't outright knock a player out of consideration off of any one data point, like Stroud and the S2, but I wouldn't ignore the data point altogether. I'd take it like any other and try and couple it with the several others, like game tape, measurements, etc.
 
Mollywhopper said:
I've no issue with criticizing the S2, it's not above reproach. But I wouldn't expect it to be completely discounted moving forward just because of one outlier, like you suggested earlier. I had some of the same thoughts on it's lack of overall sample size when it was being discussed pre/post-draft.

And like you said I wouldn't outright knock a player out of consideration off of any one data point, like Stroud and the S2, but I wouldn't ignore the data point altogether. I'd take it like any other and try and couple it with the several others, like game tape, measurements, etc.
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I think the honest question to this point is: what is it telling us?

Does anyone know?

So it's a data point. For what then exactly?
 
Lucky said:
From 3 wins to a home playoff game? How did we get here? The joy on DeMeco's face at his hiring announcement. How happy Stroud and Anderson were on draft night. We wanted to believe what we were seeing. The turnaround of a franchise. But this soon?

This is real. And for those who think the Texans will be one and done, think about this: If someone told you prior to the season that the Texans would have a home game versus a Joe Flacco led Browns team in the Wild Card round, you'd ask "Who do we play in the divisional round?" It's magic.
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You are spot on Lucky!
 
Lucky said:
From 3 wins to a home playoff game? How did we get here? The joy on DeMeco's face at his hiring announcement. How happy Stroud and Anderson were on draft night. We wanted to believe what we were seeing. The turnaround of a franchise. But this soon?

This is real. And for those who think the Texans will be one and done, think about this: If someone told you prior to the season that the Texans would have a home game versus a Joe Flacco led Browns team in the Wild Card round, you'd ask "Who do we play in the divisional round?" It's magic.
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Still gonna stay a negative Nancy for the good of my team.
 
Sweech said:
C'mon man do you think they had a couple weeks and taught him how to process a football game?
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Where do you get a couple of weeks from? He took the test somewhere around the Combine. He worked all off season with & without the team. He looked pretty bad against pressure in the preseason marginally better the first couple of weeks of the season.

& I'm not sayingit was a mechanical issue. Most likelyitwas about reading defenses. Maybe Slowick/Jerrod was able to connect with him they just couldn't at Ohio State.
Sweech said:
Not only that but he looks like the guy we saw in college. Especially against Georgia
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Right. At Ohio State his OL was so good, his receivers were so good he rarely saw pressure.
Sweech said:
You can defend the test all you want, but it's getting a little silly now.
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I'm not defending the test. I'm just saying Stroud’s success doesn't negate the test results.
 
I have been smiling all day. Watching every video from the game, locker room, post game interviews, etc. and every time I see them I get choked up.
I ain’t too proud to say that I shed a tear or five last night.
Will Anderson’s locker room interview was epic! “Man, I’m so pumped up!”

That tells me that these guys love Demeco and love playing for him. CJ is just a great kid. The defense really has no huge names, but they play their ass off for Demeco! And can you imagine this offense right now with Tank? Wow…

And I love how excited Demeco gets when the D makes a great play!
This team/franchise is on the way up and it’s just a good feeling.
 
sandman said:
Honest question: Do we know when the test was taken in relation to the Combine? Your comment could read that Meco and Slowick fixed him, but I don't think that is what you are trying to say.
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I have no idea, but I don't mean Meco & Slowick particularly. Could have been Avery or whoever his personal trainer is. I'm just throwing out an alternative to the narrative & if anything I credit his desire to be great more than any particular coach.
 
thunderkyss said:
Doesn't tell me the test was wrong. It's probable that Cj or his coaches noticed similar issues with his game & were able to identify drills & processes to help him improve. That's what coaches do.

I like to bring up Will Fuller as an example. His draft report was that he was a body catcher & had poor hands. But by the time the Combine came around he had soft hands. Didn't drop anything at the Combine, & very few in the NFL.
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That test was 100% wrong. Can we move on from that nonsense. We just went from last to first in a year after three years of swinging in Trashville. And we’re back to attempting to validate some video game test some nerds came up with. Come on let’s enjoy what just happened with our favorite team. That S2 stuff was a joke.
 
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Mollywhopper said:
I've no issue with criticizing the S2, it's not above reproach. But I wouldn't expect it to be completely discounted moving forward just because of one outlier, like you suggested earlier. I had some of the same thoughts on it's lack of overall sample size when it was being discussed pre/post-draft.

And like you said I wouldn't outright knock a player out of consideration off of any one data point, like Stroud and the S2, but I wouldn't ignore the data point altogether. I'd take it like any other and try and couple it with the several others, like game tape, measurements, etc.
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The one person that absolutely bought into the S2 test results hook line and sinker, was David Tepper. The man that always knows that he is the smartest guy in the room.

Tepper and his ego, hands down, has to be one of the best things that ever happened to the Texans organization.

Way to go David, you sir are an absolute genius. (SLOW CLAPPING!!!)
 
now the question is can we finally win the superbowl ...????

and since this fast turn around next year should we splurge on Free agents and make a run ..????

crazy to think tho this could been watson coming back for a playoff game in houston
 
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