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Early impressions - 2022 Texans.

Double Barrel said:
This franchise will never be a long term dynasty. They say never say never, but I feel pretty confident that the Texans are the exception to that rule.

All we can hope for as fans is the occasional blind squirrel finding a nut to get a playoff spot and choke out by the 2nd round. It's what we live for in H-town. :popcorn:
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If Cal can just be patient it can happen. I'm real impressed that Caserio added three 10 yr starters in the last draft and potentially much more. Can't wait to see Harris make a difference. But I certainly get where you're coming from. Remember I was the original Bob McNair sucks as an owner and only cares about the bottom line poster, back in 2010.

Maybe Cal is just dumb enough to let Caserio do his job. I gotta admit with the HC situation this is not off to a promising start.
 
Texansballer74 said:
Again our fanbase acts just like the darn team. We’re not in position to draft a quarterback because the team isn’t paraphrasing loaded with talent. The dang Colts wasn’t loaded with talent when they drafted Peyton Manning. They built that team up around him. James was drafted in 1999, Wayne was 2001, and Peyton in 1998. But our big time fan base wants to build the team up beforehand.
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That was a different time. Now, if your QB isn't successful relatively soon, you get into all other kinds of issues, mainly with the salary cap.

I think we're too far away. But you don't have to agree with that. That's ok.

We can't run the ball. We can't stop the run. We can't win football games & right now it doesn't look like it matters who the QB is. 4-12 with Watson, 4-13 with Tyrod/Mills. At the end of the season, if we're 9-8, 7-10 even, I may not feel this way. If we've got a top 15 defense, I might not feel this way. But today, this is how I feel. We're not ready to open a 5 year window.
 
djohn2oo8 said:
Do you not remember Allen was overthrowing his receivers in year 2 and didn’t really really progress until year 3?

And tell me how Herbert looks with his team right now.
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Herbert is injured what are you talking about? Dude you’re missing the freaking point. Question is why. Herbert is actually going through his got darn reads. Herbert is top 4 in passing. Mills isn’t even in the top 20. Josh is leading the freaking league in passing. My point is dude , the Texans wouldn’t be 0-2-1. Mills is playing incompetent and that’s the bottom line. I don’t care that it’s only year 2 for him. He’s not performing like he did in the last five games of last season.
 
Texansballer74 said:
Again our fanbase acts just like the darn team. We’re not in position to draft a quarterback because the team isn’t paraphrasing loaded with talent.
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It’s not that “we aren’t loaded with talent” it’s that “we don’t have any talent”.

They are two very different things.

I could see making a case to draft a QB if this team was somewhere in between those two data points, but we aren’t.

People keep giving examples of the Colts prior to Manning, the Bills, the Chiefs, etc.

Every team I have seen as a comparison has been better than the state of the 2022 Texans expansion team.
 
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thunderkyss said:
That was a different time. Now, if your QB isn't successful relatively soon, you get into all other kinds of issues, mainly with the salary cap.

I think we're too far away. But you don't have to agree with that. That's ok.

We can't run the ball. We can't stop the run. We can't win football games & right now it doesn't look like it matters who the QB is. 4-12 with Watson, 4-13 with Tyrod/Mills. At the end of the season, if we're 9-8, 7-10 even, I may not feel this way. If we've got a top 15 defense, I might not feel this way. But today, this is how I feel. We're not ready to open a 5 year window.
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I do agree about us being far away. My thing is we have to get consistency from Mills. I understand it when you keep bringing up a new offense. But imo the accuracy issue has nothing to do with a new offense.
 
Texansballer74 said:
I do agree about us being far away. My thing is we have to get consistency from Mills. I understand it when you keep bringing up a new offense. But imo the accuracy issue has nothing to do with a new offense.
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I don't think anyone is saying that Mills is doing alright. A few are saying he should be graded on a curve and be given the rest of the year. The argument is replacing him with a high first round QB next year.
 
TexansBull said:
It’s not that “we aren’t loaded with talent” it’s that “we don’t have any talent”.

They are two very different things.

I could see making a case to draft a QB if this team was somewhere in between those two data points, but we aren’t.

People keep giving examples of the Colts prior to Manning, the Bills, the Chiefs, etc.

Every team I have seen as a comparison has been better than the state of the 2022 Texans expansion team.
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Going 3-13 is not good. But the point is they went and got their franchise quarterback. They didn’t wait like you guys want the Texans to do. Like I said if Stroud is that guy wtf are you passing on him. You guys reason just doesn’t make any sense.
 
JB said:
I don't think anyone is saying that Mills is doing alright. A few are saying he should be graded on a curve and be given the rest of the year. The argument is replacing him with a high first round QB next year.
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Where did I say anyone was saying that?
 
Texansballer74 said:
My thing is we have to get consistency from Mills. I understand it when you keep bringing up a new offense. But imo the accuracy issue has nothing to do with a new offense.
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I remember you bringing up Brady last season as example of everybody makes bad throws. I’ll use that here.

For the most part Mills has been accurate, good ball placement, & poised throughout his career. Yes, there have been pockets of bad play. We’re just trying to figure out who the real Mills is.

It was pretty clear, last year, on the road was one of the common factors. We also saw he didn’t play well at the beginning of the year.

Well, two of the three games Mills didn’t play well in were on the road & all three were early in the season.

If you didn’t see any change in Mills’ play in Chicago vs the Colts & Denver I don’t know what to say. He was more comfortable, more accurate, better placement & actually throwing more than 10 yards down the field.

imo we’re going to see that guy we were hoping to see pretty soon.

Texansballer74 said:
Like I said if Stroud is that guy wtf are you passing on him. You
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I don’t know anyone said that. Most question if he is that guy & Caserio/Lovie has to believe he’s that guy. Some people thought Jared Goff was that guy.

My main point is we still have 14 games to find out who Mills is. & the team is in no position to start QB roulette again. But I’ve also said if Caserio/Lovie see a guy worth trading up for (not that they’ll have to, but if they feel that way about a guy) then they have to get him.

But if the guy is Daniel Jones, good, not good enough, I’d pass.
 
Texansballer74 said:
Herbert is injured what are you talking about? Dude you’re missing the freaking point. Question is why. Herbert is actually going through his got darn reads. Herbert is top 4 in passing. Mills isn’t even in the top 20. Josh is leading the freaking league in passing. My point is dude , the Texans wouldn’t be 0-2-1. Mills is playing incompetent and that’s the bottom line. I don’t care that it’s only year 2 for him. He’s not performing like he did in the last five games of last season.
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Even if they were 3-0 they would still be a bad football team. I forget who posted the stats? Most rushing yds given up by a good margin. 0 wr tds and leading the league in drops. Yeah, there's a problem. How can a young QB gain confidence with that lack of production from his receivers and Burkhead sucks as a 3rd down RB. No QB is going to look like we want them too, with trash like that to work with. BTW, I'm beginning to question whether Mills is the future, but still don't want to force a QB pick next draft.
 
thunderkyss said:
I remember you bringing up Brady last season as example of everybody makes bad throws. I’ll use that here.

For the most part Mills has been accurate, good ball placement, & poised throughout his career. Yes, there have been pockets of bad play. We’re just trying to figure out who the real Mills is.

It was pretty clear, last year, on the road was one of the common factors. We also saw he didn’t play well at the beginning of the year.

Well, two of the three games Mills didn’t play well in were on the road & all three were early in the season.

If you didn’t see any change in Mills’ play in Chicago vs the Colts & Denver I don’t know what to say. He was more comfortable, more accurate, better placement & actually throwing more than 10 yards down the field.

imo we’re going to see that guy we were hoping to see pretty soon.



I don’t know anyone said that. Most question if he is that guy & Caserio/Lovie has to believe he’s that guy. Some people thought Jared Goff was that guy.

My main point is we still have 14 games to find out who Mills is. & the team is in no position to start QB roulette again. But I’ve also said if Caserio/Lovie see a guy worth trading up for (not that they’ll have to, but if they feel that way about a guy) then they have to get him.

But if the guy is Daniel Jones, good, not good enough, I’d pass.
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Yes veterans make bad throws too. But that is not the point. Mills is doing so much wrong right now. He’s not stepping up in the pocket. Something he said he has to improve in after week one. He’s not going through his progressions, something he spoke on after the lose to the Broncos. Dude is actually sounding just like Brock Ostrash.
 
steelbtexan said:
Even if they were 3-0 they would still be a bad football team. I forget who posted the stats? Most rushing yds given up by a good margin. 0 wr tds and leading the league in drops. Yeah, there's a problem. How can a young QB gain confidence with that lack of production from his receivers and Burkhead sucks as a 3rd down RB. No QB is going to look like we want them too, with trash like that to work with. BTW, I'm beginning to question whether Mills is the future, but still don't want to force a QB pick next draft.
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So fuzzzbn what. They would be leading this bad division so freaking what. Damn., you guys are are not thinking long term in a Fn positive way. Build people, building people Fn building people. The following year you can build off that got darn positive. Especially since you have the freaking draft capital to do so. Why y’all don’t understand that simple **** is beyond me. It’s like y’all are programmed to like crap
 
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Texansballer74 said:
You would never know if you don’t try. So why are y’all acting so scared
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We have tried though. Two different times. And it doesn’t end well. We are speaking from first hand experience.

Also - it is not about being scared. It is about playing the odds. The odds of experiencing failure by drafting a QB with this team is much higher than drafting a QB and having them succeed like Manning, Rodgers, Rothlesberger, Mahomes, or Wilson.

This is what you aren’t understanding. If I could draw you a picture I would.
 
Texansballer74 said:
Yes veterans make bad throws too. But that is not the point. Mills is doing so much wrong right now. He’s not stepping up in the pocket. Something he said he has to improve in after week one. He’s not going through his progressions, something he spoke on after the lose to the Broncos. Dude is actually sounding just like Brock Ostrash.
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Oswald was on his 2nd contract.

This guy is 14 starts in. I think he's getting better. Pep says he's getting better. Let the season play out. Can't do anything until after the season any way.
 
Texansballer74 said:
So fuzzzbn what. They would be leading this bad division so freaking what. Damn., you guys are are not thinking long term in a Fn positive way. Build people, building people Fn building people. The following year you can build off that got darn positive. Especially since you have the freaking draft capital to do so. Why y’all don’t understand that simple **** is beyond me. It’s like y’all are programmed to like crap
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What are you building off of?
 
Not speaking for baller...but I don't think anyone is outright insisting but count me in on his general thoughts.

None of these guys come with a guaranteed can't miss label on them. That doesn't exist. Payton wasn't Payton until he was Payton. Anyone remember the guy taken in front of Peyton? A guy named Ryan Leaf was first overall. Manning was 2nd.

That just highlights the imperfect science this is. That's even more reason to take as many bites of the apple as you can. I don't get the mindset of well, this team isn't playoff ready so why draft a QB. Hey folks, I've got news for you. Most of the QB's drafted over the decades went to teams not yet playoff worthy. That's how the team got a high enough draft pick to take the guy in the first place.
 
TexansBull said:
We have tried though. Two different times. And it doesn’t end well. We are speaking from first hand experience.

Also - it is not about being scared. It is about playing the odds. The odds of experiencing failure by drafting a QB with this team is much higher than drafting a QB and having them succeed like Manning, Rodgers, Rothlesberger, Mahomes, or Wilson.

This is what you aren’t understanding. If I could draw you a picture I would.
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Yep, you build the team and then draft the QB. This way gives you a 6-7 yr window to win a championship. The other way is you draft the QB 1st and if you're lucky and dont have an agent like the Trash Derrick had representing him, then if you're lucky you spend 2-3 building a team around the QB and you have a 3-4 yr window at best to try to win championships before the cap starts to catch up with you.
 
Porky said:
Not speaking for baller...but I don't think anyone is outright insisting but count me in on his general thoughts.

None of these guys come with a guaranteed can't miss label on them. That doesn't exist. Payton wasn't Payton until he was Payton. Anyone remember the guy taken in front of Peyton? A guy named Ryan Leaf was first overall. Manning was 2nd.

That just highlights the imperfect science this is. That's even more reason to take as many bites of the apple as you can. I don't get the mindset of well, this team isn't playoff ready so why draft a QB. Hey folks, I've got news for you. Most of the QB's drafted over the decades went to teams not yet playoff worthy. That's how the team got a high enough draft pick to take the guy in the first place.
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I got news for you - Ryan Leaf was the second pick behind Manning.

en.m.wikipedia.org

Ryan Leaf - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org en.m.wikipedia.org

en.m.wikipedia.org

Peyton Manning - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org en.m.wikipedia.org

en.m.wikipedia.org

1998 NFL Draft - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org en.m.wikipedia.org
 
Porky said:
Not speaking for baller...but I don't think anyone is outright insisting but count me in on his general thoughts.

None of these guys come with a guaranteed can't miss label on them. That doesn't exist. Payton wasn't Payton until he was Payton. Anyone remember the guy taken in front of Peyton? A guy named Ryan Leaf was first overall. Manning was 2nd.

That just highlights the imperfect science this is. That's even more reason to take as many bites of the apple as you can. I don't get the mindset of well, this team isn't playoff ready so why draft a QB. Hey folks, I've got news for you. Most of the QB's drafted over the decades went to teams not yet playoff worthy. That's how the team got a high enough draft pick to take the guy in the first place.
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BTW -

Steelers were pretty good prior to drafting Rothlesberger.

Chiefs were pretty good prior to drafting Mahomes.

Greenbay was pretty good prior to drafting Rodgers.

You know who has drafted a lot of QBs - The Browns.

And we know the end of that story…
 
Porky said:
I stand corrected. My memory was Leaf at 1 and Manning at 2. Doesn’t change my point though. It’s a crapshoot. If we are playing darts I would rather have as many darts as I can to hit the bullseye.
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Are you sure you are playing darts and not bowling because you didn’t know Manning went number 1 so you may be confused what game you are playing.

Kidding. I have to give you a hard time.
 
TexansBull said:
The one who quit on us because he didn’t want to be part of the rebuilding process?

Yea - Let’s go through that again.
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Kind reminder, the Texans all-time passing leader is still Matt Schaub. So far, the Texans have had minimal luck drafting quarterbacks (anywhere in the draft) or trading for one (Schaub cost two second round picks and became a punch line and had a sandwich named after him - The Pick 6).

I just feel like when you don't have a starting caliber QB, you've got to at least try and find one, and it would be much less painful to draft a prospect early (every year, if they have to, until they do find the guy) than be in a position like the Browns were. Besides that, the Texans spent the third overall pick on a CB with a terrible injury history, but they shouldn't spend the 1 or 2 on a QB? When they have another 1st round pick? I really don't want to see more Hoyer's, Fitzpatrick's and Mallett's shuttling in and out of Houston ad nauseam. That wasn't fun.
 
banned1976 said:
Kind reminder, the Texans all-time passing leader is still Matt Schaub. So far, the Texans have had minimal luck drafting quarterbacks (anywhere in the draft) or trading for one (Schaub cost two second round picks and became a punch line and had a sandwich named after him - The Pick 6).

I just feel like when you don't have a starting caliber QB, you've got to at least try and find one, and it would be much less painful to draft a prospect early (every year, if they have to, until they do find the guy) than be in a position like the Browns were. Besides that, the Texans spent the third overall pick on a CB with a terrible injury history, but they shouldn't spend the 1 or 2 on a QB? When they have another 1st round pick? I really don't want to see more Hoyer's, Fitzpatrick's and Mallett's shuttling in and out of Houston ad nauseam. That wasn't fun.
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Like the Browns? If you love a guy in 23,then draft him. If not, build the team and draft in 24. Don't draft a QB in 23 just because you can.
 
Porky said:
Not speaking for baller...but I don't think anyone is outright insisting but count me in on his general thoughts.

None of these guys come with a guaranteed can't miss label on them. That doesn't exist. Payton wasn't Payton until he was Payton. Anyone remember the guy taken in front of Peyton? A guy named Ryan Leaf was first overall. Manning was 2nd.

That just highlights the imperfect science this is. That's even more reason to take as many bites of the apple as you can. I don't get the mindset of well, this team isn't playoff ready so why draft a QB. Hey folks, I've got news for you. Most of the QB's drafted over the decades went to teams not yet playoff worthy. That's how the team got a high enough draft pick to take the guy in the first place.
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Wrong Peyton was drafted 1st.

This really comes down to do you think this QB class has an elite QB in it. I don't, so if I was Caserio I wouldn't draft a QB in this class. Even though I will admit I haven't seen much of Levis
 
TexansBull said:
BTW -

Steelers were pretty good prior to drafting Rothlesberger.

Chiefs were pretty good prior to drafting Mahomes.

Greenbay was pretty good prior to drafting Rodgers.

You know who has drafted a lot of QBs - The Browns.

And we know the end of that story…
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Add to the list:

The Chargers were pretty good prior to drafting Herbert.

The Ravens were pretty good prior to drafting Lamar Jackson.

The Seahawks were pretty good prior to drafting Wilson.

The Cowboys are supposed to go to the Super Bowl every year so you know they were pretty good prior to drafting Dak.

Who didn’t have a good roster prior to drafting their QB?

I can’t recall about NYG and Eli. They were two years removed from losing in the Wildcard.
 
banned1976 said:
Kind reminder, the Texans all-time passing leader is still Matt Schaub. So far, the Texans have had minimal luck drafting quarterbacks (anywhere in the draft) or trading for one (Schaub cost two second round picks and became a punch line and had a sandwich named after him - The Pick 6).

I just feel like when you don't have a starting caliber QB, you've got to at least try and find one, and it would be much less painful to draft a prospect early (every year, if they have to, until they do find the guy) than be in a position like the Browns were. Besides that, the Texans spent the third overall pick on a CB with a terrible injury history, but they shouldn't spend the 1 or 2 on a QB? When they have another 1st round pick? I really don't want to see more Hoyer's, Fitzpatrick's and Mallett's shuttling in and out of Houston ad nauseam. That wasn't fun.
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I can understand your point of view. That was painful. And this is just opinions.

I look at what Miami did prior to drafting Tua. They had Fitzpatrick for two years and then drafted their QB. I would do the same thing. After drafting Tua they were only a few players/playmakers away for being playoff contenders. That’s the process we should follow.

The problem with Miami is that they selected the wrong QB. If they had selected Herbert they would be a real force right now.

Where is our Fitzpatrick or bridge QB?

Davis Mills, Gardner Minshew, Garrapolo, and Mayfield to name a few.
 
TexansBull said:
Get your facts straight before you go putting words in mouth or saying I said something I didn’t.

I never said the Bills shouldn’t have drafted Allen. I said the Texans aren’t in a position to draft Allen because our current team is worse. Allen wouldn’t be the player he is today if drafted by the Texans.

The Texans have too many holes to fill to make a player like Allen grow.

The Bills in your example had a good defense, a proven RB - and I will stop there because our defense couldn’t stop running water. Do we have a RB? We don’t know.

There - the Bills are already in a better position. That’s the point.

Now I haven’t brought up if our coaches can improve a player like Allen compared to what the Bills had.
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So you're saying Mills has ZERO chance, right?
I want to make sure I understand what you're really saying.
 
TexansBull said:
Add to the list:

The Chargers were pretty good prior to drafting Herbert.

The Ravens were pretty good prior to drafting Lamar Jackson.

The Seahawks were pretty good prior to drafting Wilson.

The Cowboys are supposed to go to the Super Bowl every year so you know they were pretty good prior to drafting Dak.

Who didn’t have a good roster prior to drafting their QB?

I can’t recall about NYG and Eli. They were two years removed from losing in the Wildcard.
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…….Texans on multiple occasions. David Carr (No OL), Deshaun Watson (No OL), and Davis Mills (No OL) b/c that’s been the main issue for any new Texans QB. I only noted the “No OL” but in all reality, every one of those teams teams sucked badly when they chose their QB’s. Texans have mastered the art of tossing the cart before the horses and it’s damm near backfired each and every time. It’s like explaining the definition of “insanity” 3 times and noticing that it still hasn’t sunk in.
 
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