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What is Watson's value in a trade?

steelbtexan said:
He definitely has fetishes and is one sick bast**d. You can continue to live in denial.
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Having fetishes & being a sick bastid doesn’t disqualify him from the NFL. Look at Robert Kraft.

I’m most certainly not in denial. I readily admit I have no idea what did or didn’t happen between Watson & the people he paid to have sex with.

If the police can find something to lock him up for... no sweat off my back. If they can’t... why should the Texans take a moral stand? Got nothing to do with what happens on the field.


steelbtexan said:
I just hope this goes to trial so all of the dirty laundry comes out. Buzbee is just getting started.
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Again, if the AG/DA can convict him, they should. If they can’t? Then what?

I don’t care one way or the other. If he’s guilty, lock him up. If he’s not, leave him alone.

My stance, if he’s going to play in the NFL I’d rather he play for the Texans. Doesn’t mean I think he’s innocent. Doesn’t mean I think he’s guilty.

If he’s guilty I hope he gets life in prison.
 
thunderkyss said:
Having fetishes & being a sick bastid doesn’t disqualify him from the NFL. Look at Robert Kraft.

I’m most certainly not in denial. I readily admit I have no idea what did or didn’t happen between Watson & the people he paid to have sex with.

If the police can find something to lock him up for... no sweat off my back. If they can’t... why should the Texans take a moral stand? Got nothing to do with what happens on the field.



Again, if the AG/DA can convict him, they should. If they can’t? Then what?

I don’t care one way or the other. If he’s guilty, lock him up. If he’s not, leave him alone.

My stance, if he’s going to play in the NFL I’d rather he play for the Texans. Doesn’t mean I think he’s innocent. Doesn’t mean I think he’s guilty.

If he’s guilty I hope he gets life in prison.
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This is what I've been saying for yrs and have been castigated for my stance on bringing in talented but troubled players. You've changed your stance. Why? I find it odd that some of the very people that have said if you have to have Hill/Hunt etc... on the team they would rather not win. Yet they're ok with DW4 not only remaining on Kirby but are ok with him being the face of the franchise.

With this said, even I have my limits, I don't want a pervert at the very least and a sexual predator at worst to be the leader of this franchise.
 
steelbtexan said:
You've changed your stance. Why?
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I have not changed my stance. Remember I said I'm a Ray Lewis rooting MFer if he's wearing battle red or steel blue.




steelbtexan said:
I find it odd that some of the very people that have said if you have to have Hill/Hunt etc... on the team they would rather not win.
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Again, not me. I don't believe you have to have guys like that to win. But I'm not against them being on the team. Will Fuller injuries, Kareem Hunt domestic abuse same thing to me... it limits their availability. But if they're going to suit up, I've got no problem with them suiting up for me.

But I'm not going to get caught up in a bidding war for either of them.


steelbtexan said:
Yet they're ok with DW4 not only remaining on Kirby but are ok with him being the face of the franchise.
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At the moment I'm saying I don't know what he's guilty of & if the cops don't lock him up they can't prove anything criminal. I'm not going to take a moral stance on what joe public thinks he did.


steelbtexan said:
With this said, even I have my limits, I don't want a pervert at the very least and a sexual predator at worst to be the leader of this franchise.
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What's sad is if this wasn't DW you'd be advocating for due process.
 
thunderkyss said:
I have not changed my stance. Remember I said I'm a Ray Lewis rooting MFer if he's wearing battle red or steel blue.





Again, not me. I don't believe you have to have guys like that to win. But I'm not against them being on the team. Will Fuller injuries, Kareem Hunt domestic abuse same thing to me... it limits their availability. But if they're going to suit up, I've got no problem with them suiting up for me.

But I'm not going to get caught up in a bidding war for either of them.



At the moment I'm saying I don't know what he's guilty of & if the cops don't lock him up they can't prove anything criminal. I'm not going to take a moral stance on what joe public thinks he did.



What's sad is if this wasn't DW you'd be advocating for due process.
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I dont remember you backing my stance on adding talented but troubled players to the Texans roster. Hill/Hunt have been available for most games including all playoff games since they were drafted by the Chiefs and signed by the Browns. You wish they were wearing steel blue?


Have you read the 22 cases filed? It's rather sickening to see how DW4 used his power to do what he's already admitted to doing. (Prostitution) Now if you want to say prostitution should be legal that's another story. How about the girl who's not part of the suits that came out and corroborated much of what the 22 had stated happened this lady also?

Wrong if I thought any Texans player was a sexual predator (Which after reading through the filings I have little doubt atleast some of what they claimed is true) I wouldn't want them on the Texans. This isn't about me disliking DW4 so much that I would cut him for nothing. This is about taking out the trash.
 
steelbtexan said:
I dont remember you backing my stance on adding talented but troubled players to the Texans roster.
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Correct. I don't agree with your philosophy that it is necessary to troubled but talented players.

Doesn't mean I don't want them. We should have kicked the tires on Hunt.


steelbtexan said:
You wish they were wearing steel blue?
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No. But again I'm not against them wearing steel blue.


steelbtexan said:
Have you read the 22 cases filed? It's rather sickening to see how DW4 used his power to do what he's already admitted to doing
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They're all accusations. Nothing more. One does not corroborate the other.


steelbtexan said:
This isn't about me disliking DW4 so much that I would cut him for nothing.
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I have no doubt you believe that. Just kinda convenient is all I'm saying.
 
thunderkyss said:
Correct. I don't agree with your philosophy that it is necessary to troubled but talented players.

Doesn't mean I don't want them. We should have kicked the tires on Hunt.



No. But again I'm not against them wearing steel blue.



They're all accusations. Nothing more. One does not corroborate the other.



I have no doubt you believe that. Just kinda convenient is all I'm saying.
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So which is it do you want those types of guys on the Texans or not?

Like I said, he's already admitted to prostitution and why would a person who has given DW4 massages and doesn't want money corroborate the 22 girls stories?

DW4 and his actions have made it convenient.
 
steelbtexan said:
So which is it do you want those types of guys on the Texans or not?
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If they were on the team I’d have no problem with it. That’s not to say I think we should go after them. I don’t think we “have” to have them.


steelbtexan said:
Like I said, he's already admitted to prostitution and why would a person who has given DW4 massages and doesn't want money corroborate the 22 girls stories?
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I don’t understand what you are trying to say.
 
thunderkyss said:
If they were on the team I’d have no problem with it. That’s not to say I think we should go after them. I don’t think we “have” to have them.



I don’t understand what you are trying to say.
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If you want the most talented players on the team then you want 2 or 3 of those type guys.

He had sex with some of those girls and paid them. He's admitted to this.

1 girl who isn't part of the suit came out and said she had similar experiences with DW4 and his tricky towel. You can sit on it. LMAO
 
steelbtexan said:
If you want the most talented players on the team then you want 2 or 3 of those type guys.
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Right. That’s what I’m saying I don’t agree with.

steelbtexan said:
He had sex with some of those girls and paid them. He's admitted to this.
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He admitted he had sex with some of the girls. He has not admitted to paying them for sex.

steelbtexan said:
1 girl who isn't part of the suit came out and said she had similar experiences with DW4 and his tricky towel. You can sit on it.
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In the court of public opinion 1 accusation lends credence to another. But in a court of law, 1 accusation does not “prove” another.
 
thunderkyss said:
Right. That’s what I’m saying I don’t agree with.


He admitted he had sex with some of the girls. He has not admitted to paying them for sex.



In the court of public opinion 1 accusation lends credence to another. But in a court of law, 1 accusation does not “prove” another.
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1. But you have no problems with taking talented but troubled guys? Maybe you should go look at the teams in the SB last yr, then re-evaluate.

2. Did he pay them for the massage? How much did he pay them for the massage vs how much did he pay the girls that gave him a massage then supposedly had consensual sex? I cant wait for the entertainment when he gets these girl and,or DW4 on the stand. Remember DW4 1st said he didn't have sex with these girls, then he said he had consensual sex with these girls.

3.It's telling that a girl that had nothing to gain said she had similar experiences when she gave DW4 a massage. That speaks volumes IMHO. This wasn't an accusation from some gold digger.
 
Number19 said:
Ego? Not saying this is the case, but people can take a stand purely on principle. Sometimes people of principle are certainly willing to go to court, occasionally even jail, rather than to submit to something they do not believe in or to authoritarianism.

Admittedly, if violence was actually committed, this is an issue and needs to be proven in court; but with this exception, the complaints do not rise to this level and are a consequence of the modern, liberal, WOKE generation. At the core, these complaints are little more than hurt feelings.

Now Watson is young and has been fully indoctrinated in WOKISM, but it is totally conceivable he could be standing on the principle that what occurred in these sessions was not criminal.

Bottom line, if he maintains his position, this needs to be settled in court. But to the point, is it ego or principle?
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Allegations of forced oral sex is little more than hurt feelings ?
 
steelbtexan said:
Did he pay them for the massage? How much did he pay them for the massage vs how much did he pay the girls that gave him a massage then supposedly had consensual sex?
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Exactly. We don't know.


steelbtexan said:
Remember DW4 1st said he didn't have sex with these girls, then he said he had consensual sex with these girls.
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I don't remember him denying he had sex with them
 
thunderkyss said:
Exactly. We don't know.



I don't remember him denying he had sex with them
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We do know that he paid them, we dont know how much or how much he paid the girls that he had sex with vs the girls he didn't have sex with. I'm sure this is something Buzbee at the civil trial or the DA at the criminal trial will ask those questions. Like I said before I hope this goes to trial. It will be very entertaining.
 
steelbtexan said:
We do know that he paid them, we dont know how much or how much he paid the girls that he had sex with vs the girls he didn't have sex with. I'm sure this is something Buzbee at the civil trial or the DA at the criminal trial will ask those questions. Like I said before I hope this goes to trial. It will be very entertaining.
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If Watson proves he did nothing wrong, will you still be entertained?
 
amazing80 said:
If Watson proves he did nothing wrong, will you still be entertained?
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Of course I will be.

There's going to be so much entertaining stuff coming out of this trial that I will be entertained whether he's convicted/found guilty or not.

The Oily Watson is just a slippery slope.
 
"Alleged" only matters in a court of law, be it criminal or civil.

"Alleged" does not necessarily pertain to a court of public opinion, whose collective perspectives have no bearing on the actual outcomes of these cases.

"Alleged" did not seem to matter to Watson's corporate sponsors. They have already tried him based on allegations. Their ruling was to no longer do business with him.

And "alleged" seems irrelevant to 31 other NFL teams that no longer want Watson at this point. These franchises are also making judgement calls based on allegations. Obviously, that will eventually change, but I would not be surprised if the attitudes of local fan bases play a part in the decisions of individual teams.

And Roger Goodell will still most likely suspend him based on those allegations regardless of the trial outcomes.
 
powda said:
So he's guilty?
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Well I am not 100% sure but I think it is pretty safe to assume that he did something to at least a few of them. Who are we kidding? We can hope he is but he was using Instagram... Instagram. He could have used the yellow pages or Google. So let's break it down.

1- GF (is she former now?) is some type of Instagram "famous".

2- Texans would have given him a personal massage therapist if he had asked. On call 24/7 365. He never asked seeing the team has not said anything about him requesting.

3- Covid as an excuse to use Instagram to find a massage therapist is about as good as closing your eyes and saying you can't see. Reference #2 on the list.

4- Multiple people who are listed as massage therapists are not legal. More than that many are strippers.

5- You Don't need 20+ massage therapists.

Adding that up, it's a safe bet that he has some type of mental condition or is a straight up pervert. If he is cleared, I would apologise to his face. However, I see it more likely that he will have to get lucky to avoid jail. Let alone pay anyone.
 
badboy said:
Watson trade value:

Dolphins fielding calls for No. 6 pick, considering a third swap in first round of 2021 NFL Draft, per report

www.cbssports.com

Did Miami take on that pesky BADBOY draft philosophy? Dolphins may be thinking of another trade in round one. How Maddenesque!!
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I can still see the Dolphins go for Watson if he is able to play this year. Tua could be kept as we have seen 2 good QBs is a problem many teams would kill for. I can also see Nick C taking a bit less if needed to get a deal done. Maybe 2 1sts, a 3rd and some kind of conditional pick. Plus a player. If it happens, I would like to see the 1st traded by the Texans for a later 1st and a few other picks this year. Adding our ability to get building blocks. As a bonus, we can play the guys we have and really let the rookies learn.
 
SnakeEyes said:
I can still see the Dolphins go for Watson if he is able to play this year. Tua could be kept as we have seen 2 good QBs is a problem many teams would kill for. I can also see Nick C taking a bit less if needed to get a deal done. Maybe 2 1sts, a 3rd and some kind of conditional pick. Plus a player. If it happens, I would like to see the 1st traded by the Texans for a later 1st and a few other picks this year. Adding our ability to get building blocks. As a bonus, we can play the guys we have and really let the rookies learn.
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The only part of OTA's that is mandatory is the 3-day June mini-camp. Will he, or won't he, show up? If he really wants to be traded, he should show. Another question, if he doesn't show, is he subject to fines?
 
SnakeEyes said:
I can still see the Dolphins go for Watson if he is able to play this year. Tua could be kept as we have seen 2 good QBs is a problem many teams would kill for. I can also see Nick C taking a bit less if needed to get a deal done. Maybe 2 1sts, a 3rd and some kind of conditional pick. Plus a player. If it happens, I would like to see the 1st traded by the Texans for a later 1st and a few other picks this year. Adding our ability to get building blocks. As a bonus, we can play the guys we have and really let the rookies learn.
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I am working on two proposals one each from Miami and Philly. Dolphins Proposal with focus on current draft more so than Philly who would concentrate more on 2022.

Reflecting on the movement to attain a quarterback, yeah I can see Caserio taking Miami's 1.6 + trading down to Panthers at 1.8. They would not get much for trading down but could still get a quality player at number 8 such as wide receiver or cornerback.
 
Texian said:
Yep DW4 had a complex, he could've easily gone to prostitutes but by going the massage therapist route made it morally OK in his mind.
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A lot of sex is based upon control. Prostitutes maintain control and with a masseuse in this case Deshaun would have the control. Maybe that is what he needed? That could be the excitement to use these women and not other masseuse he hired.
 
badboy said:
I am working on two proposals one each from Miami and Philly. Dolphins Proposal with focus on current draft more so than Philly who would concentrate more on 2022.

Reflecting on the movement to attain a quarterback, yeah I can see Caserio taking Miami's 1.6 + trading down to Panthers at 1.8. They would not get much for trading down but could still get a quality player at number 8 such as wide receiver or cornerback.
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Post June 1st trade allows time for the claims against Watson to be resolved.
Eagles get Watson and Greenard.

Texans get DE/Lb Derek Bennett. His year 5 base gives Eagles $10 m cap that cancels Deshaun's 2021 base salary...even swap financially and Houston spreads dead over two years rather than one. Greenard offers a possibility of replacing Bennett.

Eagles draft rounds one and two for Houston.

Texans get Philly's three round ones which are valued as if 2021 round twos.

My suggestions:
1.12 CB Patrick Surtian if there but Dallas expected to get him. Next choice WR Jaylen Waddle arguably the best receiver in draft.

2.47 if Waddell taken at 12 I go with cornerback Kelvin Joseph. If we somehow get Surtian at 12, I hope for either Javonte Williams or wide receiver Terrace Marshall.

2022:

1.1 ours QB Tyler Shough (pronounced Shuck)

1.5 Eagle's own CB Derek Stingley

1.20 Eagle's from Colts
Safety Jordan Battle

1.22 from Dolphins

LB Christian Harris.

In summary, in 2021 terms Philly gets DW and Greenard.
Houston gets Bennett+ 1st and 2nd with three 2022 firsts equating to round twos.

A first and four seconds plus decent upside over Greenard.
 
badboy said:
Post June 1st trade allows time for the claims against Watson to be resolved.
Eagles get Watson and Greenard.

Texans get DE/Lb Derek Bennett. His year 5 base gives Eagles $10 m cap that cancels Deshaun's 2021 base salary...even swap financially and Houston spreads dead over two years rather than one. Greenard offers a possibility of replacing Bennett.

Eagles draft rounds one and two for Houston.

Texans get Philly's three round ones which are valued as if 2021 round twos.

My suggestions:
1.12 CB Patrick Surtian if there but Dallas expected to get him. Next choice WR Jaylen Waddle arguably the best receiver in draft.

2.47 if Waddell taken at 12 I go with cornerback Kelvin Joseph. If we somehow get Surtian at 12, I hope for either Javonte Williams or wide receiver Terrace Marshall.

2022:

1.1 ours QB Tyler Shough (pronounced Shuck)

1.5 Eagle's own CB Derek Stingley

1.20 Eagle's from Colts
Safety Jordan Battle

1.22 from Dolphins

LB Christian Harris.

In summary, in 2021 terms Philly gets DW and Greenard.
Houston gets Bennett+ 1st and 2nd with three 2022 firsts equating to round twos.

A first and four seconds plus decent upside over Greenard.
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Nobody is giving that much up for a pervert. Caserio will be lucky to get the equivalent of two 1sts starting in 2022 for DW4.

I like your picks though, unless this gets resolved before the draft there will be no 2021 draft picks.
 
Number19 said:
The only part of OTA's that is mandatory is the 3-day June mini-camp. Will he, or won't he, show up? If he really wants to be traded, he should show. Another question, if he doesn't show, is he subject to fines?
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If he is not on any exempt lists...he can
/will be fined. Dollar amount for TC is up to 30K per day. However, I found a different number so I don't know if the 30k or 15k is the new CBA rule.

Anyone who decides to skip out on the required practice can be hit with a hefty fine: Under the terms of the collective bargaining agreement, a player can be fined up to $14,775 for skipping the first day of minicamp
 
SnakeEyes said:
If he is not on any exempt lists...he can
/will be fined. Dollar amount for TC is up to 30K per day. However, I found a different number so I don't know if the 30k or 15k is the new CBA rule.

Anyone who decides to skip out on the required practice can be hit with a hefty fine: Under the terms of the collective bargaining agreement, a player can be fined up to $14,775 for skipping the first day of minicamp
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I wonder how much it cost to retain Hardin? Couple that with fines and the Texans might be able to wait him out.
 
SnakeEyes said:
If he is not on any exempt lists...he can
/will be fined. Dollar amount for TC is up to 30K per day. However, I found a different number so I don't know if the 30k or 15k is the new CBA rule.

Anyone who decides to skip out on the required practice can be hit with a hefty fine: Under the terms of the collective bargaining agreement, a player can be fined up to $14,775 for skipping the first day of minicamp
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Do the Texans want Watson to show up for training camp?
 
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