amazing80
Hall of Fame
I am not totally against Brian S.
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Texans Search Committee
- Thread starter Rich Schmidt
- Start date
I'm just telling you what Brady did to win championships.
It ain't what DW4 did.
The lost decade.
Do you find it odd that the only game McCarron started they scored on their 1st drive?
I'm saying since the cap was put in place 26 yrs ago 13.2 % of the cap was the most a SB winning QB got paid and that was the 1st yr of the cap.
In 2 yrs DW4 will probably be taking up 20% of the cap and there wont be enough $$$$ to put a good team around him. So no championships and a lost decade.
amazing80
Hall of Fame
False.
Brady's first extension after his rookie deal was actually pretty modest at 5 yrs for $30.52M, particularly coming off a SB win. For reference Drew Bledsoe had just been handed a 10 yr $103M deal from the same franchise just a year and a half prior.
Even his next deal in 2005, after two more SB wins and three total for his young career, was only for 6 yrs $60M. You can compare that to the deal Peyton Manning got the previous season for 7 yrs $98M, and his ringless fingers to that point.
He first really cashed in in 2010, with a 4 yr $72M extension, after an MVP and 16-0 regular season.
And after Gisele.
source
Now I'm not making a huge case for Watson to just up and take less money. I wouldn't make that case for anyone.
The point is merely that Brady is a complete outlier.
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
I don’t think you can make that assumption simply b/c even though they have the same agent, I doubt or can’t see that agent sharing the contract info of 1 of his clients with another.
the other part to this is I believe if Caserio himself felt like Easterby was trying to sabotage him for any reason, it probably would’ve come out some way somehow. We got nothing on that whole thing in the article despite them digging for months and calling staff, players and local media guys for months.
There’s just simply nothing to back all the hatred towards this dude other than some hurt feelings.
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
The talent gap is really about the same honestly, it’s just moved around a little to different areas of the team. In 2014 The defense had SOME talent with Watt, Jackson and Bouye ...Clowney selected in the draft that year. but everyone else was either on their last legs as players (Cush, Joseph, Wilfork) or just weren’t players at all really. Smith chose to retool the aging defense from 2011-12 and it gradually caught up to us as we kept missing on picks.
On offense we had Nuk, Brooks and Brown in 2014 with XSF selected in the draft. AJ and Foster were about done.
Currently we have DW4, Tunsil, Howard and Fuller...maybe...as players the new regime will be able to build around....
Defensively we have Reid, Johnson, Blacklock, Omenihu & Greenard for the new regime to build around with the status of McKinney and Cunningham in question. Everybody else is either done (Watt, Mercy) or just really not players.
It’s just the product of missing on high draft picks for too many years.
Clowney, XSF, Braxton Miller, Louis Nix Kevin Johnson.........Nick Martin and Cunningham below average starters...
Fuller & McKinney are the only round 1-3 picks we “hit” on in 3 damn years from 2014-2016. that’s pathetic for Both Smith and BoB as the chief talent selectors and developers in that time frame.
Probably.
In 2021 Watson will have a $15M cap hit.
Mahomes will have a $28M cap hit.
In 2022 Watson will have a $40M cap hit
Mahomes will have a $30M cap hit
in 2023 Watson will have a $42M cap hit
Mahomes $34M cap hit.
every time you talk about Watson’s contract you make it obvious you don’t understand what you’re saying.
Texansballer74
The Marine
Might want to search for a new football team after this embarrassment.
I understand Mahomes has 2 yrs to try to add to his SB trophy case. So does DW4.
If anybody can break the trend it will be Mahomes and that will be an anomaly. But you're right I'm not a cap guy although I do understand simple math.
I'm going to miss you.
Texansballer74
The Marine
Dude I’m talking in context of this thread. Move the team and bring in a new one
TxnsJuggernaut1
Veteran
I would love it if our Texans conferred with former Ravens GM Ozzie Newsome to pick our next GM. It would be better to have Ozzie himself be the GM but I doubt he would end retirement to take the job. Still with all the success he had he may very well have good judgement in regards to picking out the best candidate for the job!
Texian
Hall of Fame
So in 2 years, 2022 the projected salary cap is $200MM. 20% of $200MM is $40MM.
In 2023 the projected salary cap is $218MM. 20% of $218MM is $43.6MM (close enough for govt work and probably).
You are starting to recycle your material. Do you find it odd that you remember scoring a TD on the opening drive in a meaningless week 16 game and conveniently forget that they scored on the opening drive in the Chief's playoff game?
When it's the only one in over a years worth of games you think you would remember it too. It sticks out like a sore thumb. Really not off at all. In fact I find it odd that you don't remember. Maybe you're trying to hard to forget.
maverick512000
Hall of Fame
I would say there are those on this MB that have blamed OB for years for things he may not have had anything to do with or very little to do with. The Osweiler contract and Clowney situation come to mind. Rather than just blaming OB or Smith or even Watson for the problems they clearly were to blame for, around here we try to find one person to shoulder all the blame. RS leaving was not the magic fix for the Texans, OB being fired was not the magic fix for the Texans and even if they replace Watson it will not be the magic fix for the Texans. Fundamental changes to the way Texans operate are needed and hopefully with a new GM and HC we will see those. Also this may not be a popular opinion but seeing Cal and how they have operated this season has given me hope. Ignoring the on field production, which was a lost cause this season anyway, the behind the scenes stuff sounds good so far. Cal is asking questions getting a lot of different view points and basically realizing what he knows and more importantly what he doesn't know. Ultimately he will make the decision but its nice to see that he isn't going the Jerry Jones route of being the smartest man in the building.
KoolAid Sipper
AFCEVET
Why bring in Korn Ferry in October vs a respected NFL front office guy (as a consultant) to assess current players. This would have aided them in understanding current talent, effects on the cap, etc before the trade deadline.
KoolAid Sipper
AFCEVET
Do you think Bob McNair would have fired OB when Cal did or sooner/later?
maverick512000
Hall of Fame
Defense yeah that's crap but the most important thing the new regime will inherit that OB didn't is a franchise QB. Also you can argue there is a decent line to protect that franchise QB, I know they aren't looking all that great but I think there is talent there just need a real line coach to bring it out. Franchise QB and a line to protect him, HCs have inherited far far worse.
maverick512000
Hall of Fame
Later, I think Bob would have waited till 2022 and then not renewed his contract. He might have brought in a person to be GM next off season but full on firing him no I don't see it.
maverick512000
Hall of Fame
You are correct in what you are saying but his 2005 deal was still a high dollar one
Brady finally agrees to long-awaited contract extension
Already established as one of the NFL's brightest stars by virtue of three Super Bowl victories, New England quarterback Tom Brady has further validated his spot in the league firmament, as ESPN.com has learned that the Patriots star has signed a lucrative new six-year contract through the 2010...
www.espn.com
Yes it was nothing compared to Manning but all deals were nothing compared to Manning at the time. I was actually about to post that same article when I saw you already had. Its good information but reading it in the modern NFL of 150+ million dollar contracts can make context a little difficult. Brady cut the Pats a major break to insure there was plenty for signing a good team but yes it was after he had made enough to be comfortable and really after he had married money.
As for Watson I think all pro athletes are paid way to much period but that being said yeah take the money and don't look back because you are one bad hit from your career being over.
Is Cal smart enough to do away with the Not Texans Worthy theme and let his GM acquire the best players possible without taking character concerns into account?
If the answer is no then you can expect more of the same things we've seen for the last 18 years.
Another reason they are a poorly run franchise.
Instead of bringing in a Reeves type guy, Cal relied on Easterby/DW4/ Watt to help him make his decisions.
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Mr teX
Hall of Fame
Its been my premise all along. 1st it was the qb, then it was the HC, then it was the GM.........then it became the HC again, then the GM again, then the OC then the HC/GM/OC...Now for some, its the "character coach"/owner.
& as much as the local sports media tries to make it seem like its an easy thing, its not easy to build a championship franchise or even a team that's a contender year in year out, if it were every team in the NFL would have a team capable of winning a championship every year. Fo I think we all know the basic ingredients of what to include (good qb, HC etc..) but noone really knows much more than that.
So i'm with you. Its definitely refreshing to know that Cal is leaving no stone unturned in the process & i look forward to seeing how he brings this all back together.
Chris
Waterboy
Maybe he's worth looking at
Should Texans look at Chiefs personnel executive Chris Shea as GM? (usatoday.com)
Should Texans look at Chiefs personnel executive Chris Shea as GM? (usatoday.com)
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
You try to look at everything as if its a black and white deal & its not.
Bringing in the Reeves type of guy landed us Rick Smith & Kubiak. Hiring seasoned football minds before that landed us Capers and Casserly. Both were failures so this idea that these "football minds" should be more trusted and valued over any other approach is laughable.
And there's no better people to tap for an opinion than those who are here & are as vested in the success of this organization as he is & his decision on who to bring in will affect those guys more than anyone. Cal would be a straight dumbass if he didn't get those guys' opinion. His method of operation is a tried and true method that has proven to improve organizational culture................as long as its done right. And thus far, I've seen nothing in the way that Cal is handling this to indicate that he's gonna bungle this. All the right moves are being made......but its still early in the process.
And remember, McDaniels is the "QB guru" that used a first round pick on Tim Tebow.
Hard pass on any Belichick assistant.
Just to clarify, a McNair never made the "Texans worthy" statement. That was Matt Schaub.
I don’t have a problem with McDaniels coming here. I just don’t think he’s a QB guru.
TexansBull
Hall of Fame
I feel like this whole “recreate New England” formula has been done before.
When the chiefs hired Scott Pioli, Charlie Weiss, and Romeo Crennel. (Todd Haley being the outlier). Even adding Brady’s backup in Matt Cassel.
When the chiefs hired Scott Pioli, Charlie Weiss, and Romeo Crennel. (Todd Haley being the outlier). Even adding Brady’s backup in Matt Cassel.
Totally disagree, sometimes you need an outside pair of eyes to come in and evaluate your org including personnel. This helps give you a new view that's less likely to be agenda based.
I also liked the Kubiak hire at the time because I liked his offense and his work with QB's. His issue was he thought he was bringing in an ally to help him acquire talent and share his vision when he advocated for the hiring of RS. What he got for his trouble was more of a politician than a personnel guy and when things got tough he got thrown under the bus by RS.
Give me a guy that is well connected in NFL to evaluate the state of franchise rather than current players/newspaper guy/preacherman. These people all have agendas and that probably means failure because you're hearing what you want to hear not what you need to hear and the chance of a successful hire will mainly come down to blind luck,
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
You’re naive if you believe those connected football folks you’re speaking off don’t have agendas. For instance, is it any wonder that Reeves recommended and/or vouched for Kubiak, his former back up qb? A guy who himself spent over a decade coaching in the same organization that Reeves did who by coincidence(
, )also spent over a decade coaching in? What’s more, Kubiak turned around and poached another Bronco guy to be the GM.you can best believe that each of these “connected” football guys have favorites and/or guys they feel deserve a shot ....or deserve “another” shot for reasons that aren’t connected to their skills as a HC. It may not be the chief reason, but there will be a bias depending on which names come up.
I don't know about Brian S. It depends on if he implemented the philosophy of the HCs he was working for, but he has coordinated impressive offenses. Even with Seattle, fans have wanted to run a a better offense and "Let Russ Cook".
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I understand why you would think this way and I would look elsewhere for a GM/HC. However I also could see them becoming successful in McDaniel's 2nd time around just like Belichick was.
McNair may not have said the phrase, but that's how the Texans org has always worked since their inception. So Schaub may have coined the phrase Not Texans Worthy but the McNair's have lived it. Maybe Schaub was onto something?
You’re naive if you believe those connected football folks you’re speaking off don’t have agendas. For instance, is it any wonder that Reeves recommended and/or vouched for Kubiak, his former back up qb? A guy who himself spent over a decade coaching in the same organization that Reeves did who by coincidence(
you can best believe that each of these “connected” football guys have favorites and/or guys they feel deserve a shot ....or deserve “another” shot for reasons that aren’t connected to their skills as a HC. It may not be the chief reason, but there will be a bias depending on which names come up.
The same thing happened with the Pats guys, the same thing will happen with whoever the next HC is and the org he comes from. My question is would you rather trust say a Bill Polian to help find your next HC or a newspaper guy/Jed Hughes?
I don’t think Reeves had anything to do with Kubiak. The way I remember he was brought in while Capers was still here. He was supposed to help McNair decide if we had a coaching problem, or a talent problem, or both. Once Capers was fired, Reeves left.
Kubiak was brought in for a 2nd interview having interviewed the first time we were looking for a coach (before we hired Capers).
'eh, you can have him. His 11-17 record and decisions as HC are aspects that I'd rather avoid, not to mention his indecisive attitude about the Colts job. JMO.
There is a reason why O'Brien is the most "successful" branch of the Belichick tree. McDaniels is just another failed branch without his mentor calling the shots and a HoF QB running the offense.
Belichick's tenure with the Browns is what ultimately set up Ozzie Newsome and the Ravens for success. He left that franchise better than he found it. Which is something that cannot be said about ANY of his assistants that got head coaching gigs. We know this from firsthand experience in H-town.
btw, I don't disagree with you about the "Texans worthy" and the way the McNairs have used the mentality as a filter. I was just clarifying that it was never a McNair thing as a phrase. They are much more sly about their apparent high character requirements. It comes down to plausible deniability for the corporation.
I would say that McDaniel's work with Jimmy G and Brisset, along with his work with a young Tom Brady, would be a major factor in calling him a guru. By comparison, Bill O'Brien has given the NFL Brian Hoyer and Christian Hackenberg, who was so awful that not even O'Brien, who recruited him to Penn State, would touch him at the pro level.
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
What kind of info does Bill Polian have/could get that any other person with reasonable intellect could not? The NFL generates a list of HC/GM candidates for these owners to rely on. That effectively washes out 1/2 of the skills a guy like Bill Polian could bring to the table, out. From there, its just a matter of interviewing the candidates and assessing which guy you feel would fit the best...All of which are qualified all of which talk the talk and walk the walk. Polian isn't making the decision for you, he's merely advising you.
Understand that selecting a HC is more about finding the right balance of coaching skills with personality skills to be able to deal with 53 rich individuals and other FO staff. All im saying is success has been shown to come out of a number of different approaches.
Kinda thinking out loud about Belichick's coaching tree: I wonder how much of an honorary title "assistant head coach" was for Belichick when he was with Parcells and how much, if at all, it helped him prepare to be an NFL head coach. I don't recall Belichick giving anyone that title who has worked for him. Parcells, btw, has to have one of the most successful coaching trees in NFL history.
Employed
| Name | Role |
|---|---|
| Bill Belichick | Asst. Head Coach/Defensive Backs, Asst. Head Coach/Defensive Coordinator, Defensive Coordinator, Linebackers/Special Teams |
| Todd Bowles | Secondary |
| Tom Coughlin | Wide Receivers |
| Romeo Crennel | Defensive Line, Special Teams |
| Ron Erhardt | Offensive Coordinator |
| Al Groh | Defensive Coordinator/Linebackers, Linebackers |
| Todd Haley | Offensive Assistant/Quality Control, Wide Receivers, Wide Receivers/Passing Game Coordinator |
| Ray Handley | Offensive Backfield |
| Dan Henning | Quarterbacks |
| Freddie Kitchens | Tight Ends |
| Anthony Lynn | Running Backs |
| Eric Mangini | Defensive Assistant/Quality Control |
| Chris Palmer | Quarterbacks, Wide Receivers |
| Sean Payton | Asst. Head Coach/Passing Game Coordinator, Asst. Head Coach/Quarterbacks |
| Ray Perkins | Offensive Coordinator |
| Tony Sparano | Offensive Line/Running Game Coordinator, Tight Ends |
| Mike Zimmer |
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
Right, but you don't think that Reeves was tapped for "his thoughts" on his former back up qb while he was here? You don't think that upon Reeves' thoughts about the Capers and Casserly regime that those thoughts didn't creep into McNair's head which eventually led to Kubiak being called back in for a 2nd interview? I don't remember us interviewing anyone else before or after Kubiak came in the 2nd go round....which we would've had to just to satisfy the Rooney Rule.
I think they only passed on him the 1st time b/c of the newness of the franchise, but the 2nd time he was brought back, there was no obvious reason not to hire him...especially with him likely having recieved a glowing recommendation from Reeves.
Tim. Tebow.
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
When hiring a new HC, that's all it ever is. recreate the flavor of the month team...which is usually the team that's on top at the particular time. a few years ago Sean McVay's success & Kyle Shanahan's subsequently after spurred the hiring of really young offensive-minded hot shot OC's the next few years like Lafleur, Kingsbury, Taylor..... NE is just the team that has had an abnormally large amount of attempts at creating its culture b/c they've been on top for so long. Before them it was 49ers everyone was trying to recreate hence that famous pic from the 90's with Reid, Gruden, Holmgren and Mariucci all on GB's 96 team. All of those guys have ties to those late 80's early 90's 49ers teams.
Just the nature of the business.
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maverick512000
Hall of Fame
In reality though has Jimmy G and Brisset been that much better? Yes Jimmy G went to a super bowl but how much was him and how much was that defense and pretty easy starting schedule because when they needed him to deliver the game he rarely did. As for Brisset the little ponies seemed to move on from him fast and even went out and signed the never was Rivers to a big deal.
Working with Brady was like working with Michael Jordan, you may can give them some tips and pointers but they were always going to be great no matter where they were or who they were coached by. So I don’t really give anyone in the NFL credit for him other than the single Pat scout that pounded the table for him that whole draft till BB finally drafted him just to shut his scout up. That guy belongs in the HoF as the greatest scout in NFL history.
michaelm
vox nihili
Brady won championships before he gave the Pats any discounts
True, and he kept on giving them discounts on every contract after his rookie deal so he could win more championships.