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30 is the new 20: Green Bay Packers

Mr teX said:
DW4 played fine...there’s just too many holes on this team for any 1 player to overcome no matter how well they perform. The biggest being on the side of the ball DW4 has nothing to do with.
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Overall I agree and I knew the defense would be a paper wall to Rodgers but nobody has any expectations for this defense and hopefully most will get replaced. Likewise I don’t think anyone ever said any 1 player was going to overcome this but if we are going to build the team around Watson then has got to improve because him and Tunsil, who also has to improve, are pretty much the only two players not on the chomping block.
 
29-39 300+ yards, 2 touchdowns, no interceptions. At least 6 drops from his receivers core. Only a few bad passes, a few mistakes on his behalf. And yet jokers on here expecting him to be perfect. Complaining about the few mistakes he made. But hey bump the drop passes, the piss pour blocking attempt by Fells, the holding penalty on Tunsil, and the holding penalty on Martin. All drive killers. And yet the focus is on Watson because of what this organization doomed he was worth.

Let’s not talk about all of the mistakes the defense made throughout this game either
 
maverick512000 said:
I was ok with the trade and when you break it down what it would have cost to get a Tunsil in the draft the trade was actually right on point. Of course at the time I still thought we would have Hopkins and I was praying Devlin would be gone so Tunsil could continue to improve but those are both in hindsight.
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How's this for hindsight.....one of those picks might possibly be the number one overall pick
 
Jadmakaveli said:
People who continue to harp on his contract don’t take the totality of the circumstances which is the problem here. You said oh he’s making this much money well he needs to play at an unrealistic level. Without even taking into account what he’s dealing with, he has no run game, clearly a offensive coordinator that’s in over his head, no support from defense. So people are asking Deshaun to do the impossible without stability/lacking ability from coaching/ management/teammates. I’m sorry but no QB has ever did that so you all will never be satisfied which problems means you should probably let it go because you’ll never be happy.
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Wrong

I don’t want him to play at an unrealistic level I want him to play at the level we are now paying him at which means to stop making the same mistakes over and over that he has made since his rookie year. I know Watson is not going to win games alone, I don’t expect him to but having a crap team is no excuse for his mistakes either.
 
thunderkyss said:
Getting better as a team is not going to start with Kenny Stills or Pharaoh Brown. It’s gotta start with Watson being smart. With Tunsil playing to the whistle. With Nick Martin blocking somebody.

People getting paid like the best players in the league need to start playing like the best players in the league.
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Some of the things Watson does that have us frustrated at times are the things that make him special. One of the announcers referenced “the second play”, but we’ve commonly heard it as keeping a play alive. That’s what he does and sometimes it works out and sometimes it doesn’t. Even with him “running in circles” and taking a sack, they’re not the 8+yards sacks that really bury an offense.

I’m okay with this version of DW4. The one that’s taken some sacks over the last couple games and hasn’t given the ball away while throwing 6TD’s with over 600 yards through the air. He’s used his legs in getting some important 1st downs.

I prefer this Deshaun over the one that was hesitant to run even a little and instead was forcing balls deep into double and triple coverage the first four weeks of the season.
 
DanielTx said:
Watson has no control over his receivers dropping tds or David Johnson fumbling the ball in crucial moments. I agree, he has to play better because he doesn’t have the luxury of being in a functional organization unlike the other star qbs. Watson is showing up. Respect your opinion but he’s been consistent this season.
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I know he’s the bees knees, but until he starts beating two deep zone, we’re fked.

He needs to figure out when to keep his eyes downfield & when to pick up some yards on his own.

I like to compare him to Russell Wilson & Aaron Rogers myself, but you know what I’ve seen those two do that Watson never does? Slide.
 
maverick512000 said:
Overall I agree and I knew the defense would be a paper wall to Rodgers but nobody has any expectations for this defense and hopefully most will get replaced. Likewise I don’t think anyone ever said any 1 player was going to overcome this but if we are going to build the team around Watson then has got to improve because him and Tunsil, who also has to improve, are pretty much the only two players not on the chomping block.
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I think you can only expect so much from your best players who are still only 2 of 11 on 1 side of the ball. I think that if DW4 and Tunsil had more help, they’d be even better than what they are.
 
Texansballer74 said:
29-39 300+ yards, 2 touchdowns, no interceptions. At least 6 drops from his receivers core. Only a few bad passes, a few mistakes on his behalf. And yet jokers on here expecting him to be perfect. Complaining about the few mistakes he made. But hey bump the drop passes, the piss pour blocking attempt by Fells, the holding penalty on Tunsil, and the holding penalty on Martin. All drive killers. And yet the focus is on Watson because of what this organization doomed he was worth.

Let’s not talk about all of the mistakes the defense made throughout this game either
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I like Watson. I'm not saying he has to be perfect. But he has been off this year. Why? Probably the coaching mess and the virus etc...
 
Texansballer74 said:
Dude just stop responding to me. Please let’s just ignore one another.
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You want to put me on ignore go ahead but as a rule I don’t just ignore someone if they disagree with me because in my mind that is very much what is wrong with people today. The mindset of “I don’t like what you have to say so I’m just going to make it so I never have to hear what you say.”
 
maverick512000 said:
You want to put me on ignore go ahead but as a rule I don’t just ignore someone if they disagree with me because in my mind that is very much what is wrong with people today. The mindset of “I don’t like what you have to say so I’m just going to make it so I never have to hear what you say.”
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Man move around and go have a conversation with someone else.
 
Jadmakaveli said:
People who continue to harp on his contract don’t take the totality of the circumstances which is the problem here. You said oh he’s making this much money well he needs to play at an unrealistic level. Without even taking into account what he’s dealing with, he has no run game, clearly a offensive coordinator that’s in over his head, no support from defense. So people are asking Deshaun to do the impossible without stability/lacking ability from coaching/ management/teammates. I’m sorry but no QB has ever did that so you all will never be satisfied which problems means you should probably let it go because you’ll never be happy.
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They just say no team has won a championship with their QB taking up more than 13.2 % and DW4 ain't gonna be the guy to break that trend.
 
steelbtexan said:
False

Like why did he let 30 seconds or more run off of the clock down 2 scores with 3 mins left in the game before he called a TO? Who's in charge of teaching him that? BOB couldn't teach him, Carl Smith couldn't teach him, Kelly cant teach him.

Again tell me who can teach him?
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You realize that the HC can call a timeout from the sideline, if he wants one, right?
 
The benefits of having a decent defense pays off greatly. Having an elite defense leads to great qbs having hof seasons. Your qb hits the field consistently maximizing his stats and chances to score. Giving him more opportunities to grow as a player. With that being said, Watson has had a bottom 5 defense the past 2-3 seasons since he came in the league. It’s hard to grow as a player and he’s probably had the most pressure on him mentally and physically as a player in the nfl. Still, a 2x pro bowler and could be 3x. He deserved the contract. Texans have much bigger problems than Watson. Finding the right gm, coach and trading players should be priority #1.
 
Mr teX said:
I think you can only expect so much from your best players who are still only 2 of 11 on 1 side of the ball. I think that if DW4 and Tunsil had more help, they’d be even better than what they are.
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Agreed, again I use the Marino example. I’m not expecting Watson or Tunsil to win a championship or even win a game. Just like playing the colts in the playoffs it’s hard for an offense to win when the defense lets the other side move up and down as they please. However like Marino it’s also no excuse for Watson and Tunsil to keep making the same mistakes. If Tunsil was still, getting penalties like he was last year we would rightfully burn him for it but for some reason Watson still not getting rid of it and thinking he can escape from anything isn’t his fault?
 
Texansballer74 said:
29-39 300+ yards, 2 touchdowns, no interceptions. At least 6 drops from his receivers core. Only a few bad passes, a few mistakes on his behalf. And yet jokers on here expecting him to be perfect. Complaining about the few mistakes he made. But hey bump the drop passes, the piss pour blocking attempt by Fells, the holding penalty on Tunsil, and the holding penalty on Martin. All drive killers. And yet the focus is on Watson because of what this organization doomed he was worth.

Let’s not talk about all of the mistakes the defense made throughout this game either
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For some reason, the vibe in this thread appears to be an opportunity to take shots at Watson after a loss. Some of the same posters were quiet last week. It's like watching pigs in slop. I'm out. Have a good evening folks.
 
maverick512000 said:
You want to put me on ignore go ahead but as a rule I don’t just ignore someone if they disagree with me because in my mind that is very much what is wrong with people today. The mindset of “I don’t like what you have to say so I’m just going to make it so I never have to hear what you say.”
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Yep, of course you saw his weakazz reply.
 
Texansballer74 said:
29-39 300+ yards, 2 touchdowns, no interceptions. At least 6 drops from his receivers core. Only a few bad passes, a few mistakes on his behalf.
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Now we’re getting into David Carr arguments. 2 TDs ain’t sht when you trailed by three scores all day. It’s like a MLB leading the team in tackles. It doesn’t mean what you think it means.

300 yards on 40 throws doesn’t mean what you think it means.

74% completion at 8 ypa doesn’t mean what you think it means.

Texansballer74 said:
And yet jokers on here expecting him to be perfect.
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Joker? My man I’m as pro Watson as the next guy & im not trying to blame him for everything. But if you keep complaining about me complaining about Watson it’s going to keep coming. There’s plenty there to talk about. Not just a few mistakes.


Texansballer74 said:
Complaining about the few mistakes he made.
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For me it’s not about the few mistakes. It’s about his thought process, the way he approaches the game.
 
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Mr teX said:
Lol so what would you have paid DW4?
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Watson’s price was on post and to be expected because that is the going price for even average QBs these days and that’s an NFL as a whole problem not a Texans or a Watson problem. If Texans hasn’t paid him some other team would have and that’s a fact.

But also those big contracts are albatrosses to teams and hamstring their ability to but the team as a whole and that’s also a fact. We’ve seen it with packers, Steelers, lions and pretty much any other team with a franchise QB that got paid.

Again it’s not a Texans problem it’s an NFL problem and until they either hard cap league wide QB salary or put a Byrd type rule in it will stay a problem.
 
maverick512000 said:
Agreed, again I use the Marino example. I’m not expecting Watson or Tunsil to win a championship or even win a game. Just like playing the colts in the playoffs it’s hard for an offense to win when the defense lets the other side move up and down as they please. However like Marino it’s also no excuse for Watson and Tunsil to keep making the same mistakes. If Tunsil was still, getting penalties like he was last year we would rightfully burn him for it but for some reason Watson still not getting rid of it and thinking he can escape from anything isn’t his fault?
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Right...but every QB does this to an extent. What you can’t have is your qb doing that and either turning over the ball and/or taking unnecessary sacks...which is what he was doing early in this year and why I was critical of him. These last 3 games, he has cleaned that aspect of it up and as a result (in conjunction with some other things) his play has greatly improved and so has the offenses. Today was the 1st time since those 1st 4 games where he wasn’t as sharp..& he still threw from 300 yds and 2 TDS. He needs help....from his defense...from his run game...from his o-lined

Furthermore ask yourself, how much would him getting rid of the ball faster have REALLY helped today? The defense couldn’t stop a nosebleed.
 
thunderkyss said:
Now we’re getting into David Carr arguments. 2 TDs ain’t shy when you trailed by three scores all day. It’s like a MLB leading the team in tackles. It doesn’t mean what you think it means.

300 yards on 40 throws doesn’t mean what you think it means.

74% completion at 8 ypa doesn’t mean what you think it means.



Joker? My man I’m as pro Watson as the next guy & im not trying to blame him for everything. But if you keep complaining about me complaining about Watson it’s going to keep coming. There’s plenty there to talk about. Not just a few mistakes.




For me it’s not about the few mistakes. It’s about his thought process, the way he approaches the game.
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And yet if balls are not being dropped, terrible holding penalties by two of the highest paid offensive linemen (at the prospect positions) at very bad times. The game could’ve been in reach.

Again 6 drops, his receiver catches those, his numbers goes up correct?
 
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Decim8 said:
How's this for hindsight.....one of those picks might possibly be the number one overall pick
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That would have gotten us the best LT in a draft two years too late.

Granted, the way the last two seasons played out, we’d have been better off. But they call it swinging & missing for a reason.

I agree with everyone of you. Our offensive masterminds were the biggest problem on our offense. Without changing that, we get what we got.

Unfortunately it took Cal way too long to wade through the BS, but hopefully he’ll be better prepared to see the next wave coming
 
This season just needs to end without anyone getting seriously hurt. This won't be the same offense as next year. Or the same defense. Or the same coaches. Or trainers. Or ball boys. We aren't going to learn anything, unless Crennel starts playing the younger players.

I'll be in the GM and HC threads.
 
banned1976 said:
Some of the things Watson does that have us frustrated at times are the things that make him special. One of the announcers referenced “the second play”, but we’ve commonly heard it as keeping a play alive.
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That’s only kind off what I’m talking about.

Once he’s decided the play is dead, I want him to make up his mind and do it. We’re watching him go down on the third or fourth play after the play.
 
Texansballer74 said:
Dude just stop responding to me. Please let’s just ignore one another.
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maverick512000 said:
Good grief, please explain to me what the defense has to do with him not getting rid of the ball and missing the short pass game.
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He cant explain this because there's no explanation.

He's the guy that wants to hold onto all of the WR's instead of picking up what they can in draft picks and cap space.

Sad really, because he's a DW4 fan way more than he's a Texans fan. But I guess that's to be expected.
 
Mr teX said:
Right...but every QB does this to an extent. What you can’t have is your qb doing that and either turning over the ball and/or taking unnecessary sacks...which is what he was doing early in this year and why I was critical of him. These last 3 games, he has cleaned that aspect of it up and as a result (in conjunction with some other things) his play has greatly improved and so has the offenses. Today was the 1st time since those 1st 4 games where he wasn’t as sharp..& he still threw from 300 yds and 2 TDS. He needs help....from his defense...from his run game...from his o-lined

Furthermore ask yourself, how much would him getting rid of the ball faster have REALLY helped today? The defense couldn’t stop a nosebleed.
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Oh absolutely this was going to be a butt kicking even if Watson was literally Superman and the only people that didn’t see that were either Texan fans with their heads in the clouds or packer fans scared of a trap game.

But as TK pointed out the stats are very misleading and I’m honestly not sure how much has been him improving from the first games and how much has been the quality of the other teams. He looked bad against 3 playoff level teams, whole team was bad against the Viking and OB was rightfully fired for it, good against a scrub team and decent against a team that may or may not be real and then as soon as he plays a playoff team again he looks bad.

I said before packers would show how much improvement from the first 3 games there really has been and the results are not encouraging.
 
steelbtexan said:
I would've been fine with that.

BTW, Dalton looks so bad because Dallas has lost 4 of their 5 starting OL.
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Agreed, about why Dallas is bad on offense...but not the reason Dalton is bad. I doubt he would’ve been playing better or even at the same level as Dak before he went out...even with all their starters. Dalton’s just done & with each passing game he and their now 3rd string qb stink it up, the cash register keeps ringing for Dak...whether that’s for Dallas or someone else.


& if Dallas somehow winds up with the #1 overall pick, I don’t think they could afford to take Lawrence b/c their defense might be the only defense in the NFL that’s worse than ours.
 
Mr teX said:
I see Russ do this all the time....
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And he usually wins those matchups and games anyway. Independent of the Ds, when Watson's W/L record (26/21) matches up closer to Wilson's record (100/47), maybe we can have a more reasonable comparison conversation...............especially when considering a QB driven stat of INTs.............Russell 70 INTs in 147 games............to Watson's 34 INTs in 47 games, many of which occur when running around in the backfield. It all has to do with decision-making and timing of throws and knowing when to throw the ball away, especially while trying to perform a Houdini impersonation.
 
Mr teX said:
Agreed, about why Dallas is bad on offense...but not the reason Dalton is bad. I doubt he would’ve been playing better or even at the same level as Dak before he went out...even with all their starters. Dalton’s just done & with each passing game he and their now 3rd string qb stink it up, the cash register keeps ringing for Dak...whether that’s for Dallas or someone else.


& if Dallas somehow winds up with the #1 overall pick, I don’t think they could afford to take Lawrence b/c their defense might be the only defense in the NFL that’s worse than ours.
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I don’t see Dallas getting the number 1 pick. Pretty sure Jets will start running the ball in for safeties if it looks they might accidentally win a game.
 
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