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The Johnny "Football" Manziel NFL thread

steelbtexan said:
Do you hate him because he's successful? Because he was born into wealth? Because he gets hot chicks? From A&M? This just in, there's a different set of rules in this country for wealthy people.

I dont hate or like JM. I just hope he gets the help he needs and is able to live a healthy productive life, regardless of football.

Hate on
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Good for him for having the success in HS and A&M. Good for him that he gets hot chicks good for him that his family is well off. All of the above does nothing to make him a good professional. Since when is stating the truth considered hating? Which one of my statement about your boy is not true? You can keep worshiping your boy and defend him at every turn but the outcome doesn't look good for him because he's still a child. He's gotten help and he thinks he's good to go. Obviously he isn't.


Fanboy on.

I like to all our TX players do well but it's not working out for him, VY, Kolb & RGIII. At some level they are responsible for why it doesn't work out.
 
chicagotexan2 said:
Good for him for having the success in HS and A&M. Good for him that he gets hot chicks good for him that his family is well off. All of the above does nothing to make him a good professional. Since when is stating the truth considered hating? Which one of my statement about your boy is not true? You can keep worshiping your boy and defend him at every turn but the outcome doesn't look good for him because he's still a child. He's gotten help and he thinks he's good to go. Obviously he isn't.


Fanboy on.

I like to all our TX players do well but it's not working out for him, VY, Kolb & RGIII. At some level they are responsible for why it doesn't work out.
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I'm no JM fanboy and said as much in my post. (Reading comprehension?)

I just hope things work out for JM on a personal basis and also on a professional basis. Just like I would for almost anybody in all walks of life.

I enjoy seeing people become successful in life. Obviously we differ in this regard.
 
steelbtexan said:
I'm no JM fanboy and said as much in my post. (Reading comprehension?)

I just hope things work out for JM on a personal basis and also on a professional basis. Just like I would for almost anybody in all walks of life.

I enjoy seeing people become successful in life. Obviously we differ in this regard.
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Ok I'll play along since you struggle with reality comprehension. Jonny Manziel is going to turn it around and grow up and be a professional football player. Even though his own actions say otherwise but it'll all work out in the end.

I enjoy people doing well too but I dont sugarcoat it when their own actions lead to a different ending. Feel better?
 
chicagotexan2 said:
Ok I'll play along since you struggle with reality comprehension. Jonny Manziel is going to turn it around and grow up and be a professional football player. Even though his own actions say otherwise but it'll all work out in the end.

I enjoy people doing well too but I dont sugarcoat it when their own actions lead to a different ending. Feel better?
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I dont feel anything.

I just look at things differently.
 
Unfortunately for this kid, by the time he "gets it" it'll be too late, no team will want anything to do with him and he'll be out of the NFL in 2 years after the now traditional Jerry Jones Cowboys stop in Dallas that all great college talent seems to take a stop at before exiting the NFL these days.

Ted Johnson said it best yesterday...After coming out of rehab, this guy should've seperated from all his old peeps and hangers on b/c usually more than a few of them are part of the problem. Sometimes it's easy to see who they are and sometimes its not. It sucks from a social standpoint, but when you're trying to kick a habit, your personal accountability and habits has to be reinforced with surrounding yourself with people who won't have you in bad situations and/or are more considerate of your situation.
 
chicagotexan2 said:
I think Jonny should lay off the alcohol and use weed instead.
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What , just replace one problem with another ? That's not how recovery works. It is an all or nothing proposition. You are either sober or flirting with disaster .... Manziel is flirting with disaster.
 
Corrosion said:
What , just replace one problem with another ? That's not how recovery works. It is an all or nothing proposition. You are either sober or flirting with disaster .... Manziel is flirting with disaster.
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Why does pot necessarily have to be a problem for someone just because they have a problem with drinking too much?
 
steelbtexan said:
Do you hate him because he's successful? Because he was born into wealth? Because he gets hot chicks? From A&M? This just in, there's a different set of rules in this country for wealthy people.

I dont hate or like JM. I just hope he gets the help he needs and is able to live a healthy productive life, regardless of football.

Hate on
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I do not think it has anything to do with hate.

Let me ask you: is Manziel the only player in the NFL dealing with addiction and making bad decisions right now?

Of course he's not.

But because he and the media shoved his "brand" down everyone's throats from he point he showboated across the draft stage, every little thing he does becomes a lead story. People resent it. It's not hate, but burnout from overexpose to a "brand" that is now in the process of self-destructing.

I'm not denying that there's some schadenfreude involved with some folks, simply because Manziel comes across as an arrogant jackass. But for probably most others, we are just tired of hearing about a guy disrespecting golden goose chances with failed potential.
 
Corrosion said:
What , just replace one problem with another ? That's not how recovery works. It is an all or nothing proposition. You are either sober or flirting with disaster .... Manziel is flirting with disaster.
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Personally I think pot is far less destructive than alcohol. But you're right in that it would pose a problem for an nfl player to test positive for pot.
 
Double Barrel said:
I do not think it has anything to do with hate.

Let me ask you: is Manziel the only player in the NFL dealing with addiction and making bad decisions right now?

Of course he's not.

But because he and the media shoved his "brand" down everyone's throats from he point he showboated across the draft stage, every little thing he does becomes a lead story. People resent it. It's not hate, but burnout from overexpose to a "brand" that is now in the process of self-destructing.

I'm not denying that there's some schadenfreude involved with some folks, simply because Manziel comes across as an arrogant jackass. But for probably most others, we are just tired of hearing about a guy disrespecting golden goose chances with failed potential.
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I get this, but as a person whose family has had addiction issues I'm rooting for him to overcome them.
 
Mollywhopper said:
Why does pot necessarily have to be a problem for someone just because they have a problem with drinking too much?
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It's called SUBSTANCE ABUSE. The identity of the substance isn't the problem, though the illegal ones carry additional problems. Those prone to addiction rarely confine their addiction to any individual substance. It's tragic because it makes one a SLAVE to the next round of poison.
 
Marshall said:
It's called SUBSTANCE ABUSE. The identity of the substance isn't the problem, though the illegal ones carry additional problems. Those prone to addiction rarely confine their addiction to any individual substance. It's tragic because it makes one a SLAVE to the next round of poison.
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If he's prone to addiction then should he not have sex? There are sex addicts. Should he not eat tasty food? There are food addicts.
Should he not drink coffee? There are coffee addicts? Should he not shop? There are shopping addicts.

So go ahead and tell the guy who's had a drinking problem then what he should and should not do.

Fact is we haven't heard word one about him taking too many pills or smoking crack. Just booze. Lots of people drink too much and don't have issue one with any other substance. Just like lots of people smoke pot and don't feel the need to leap to any other substance. There is absolutely no reason to think, and certainly without meeting him, that pot couldn't be just the thing to ease Manziel out without him feeling the need to lean on his substance of issue.
 
steelbtexan said:
I get this, but as a person whose family has had addiction issues I'm rooting for him to overcome them.
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I have the same background and agree with you that I hope he can overcome his addiction as an individual. I don't wish that on anyone. He's young enough that it's not decades of habits, and he's got the money to go to the best treatment programs available. He just has to choose.

As an entertainer, I'd just prefer he fade away.
 
Double Barrel said:
I have the same background and agree with you that I hope he can overcome his addiction as an individual. I don't wish that on anyone. He's young enough that it's not decades of habits, and he's got the money to go to the best treatment programs available. He just has to choose.

As an entertainer, I'd just prefer he fade away.
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Me too. But if he can make it in the NFL that'd be great. He's shown flashes but he's inconsistent. I'm sure his behavior has put him in the doghouse with this HC and his career behind the eight ball.

He was a badass in college but having an addiction or lack of discipline/dedication is just the sort of weakness that that exposes players real quick.
 
Mollywhopper said:
If he's prone to addiction then should he not have sex? There are sex addicts. Should he not eat tasty food? There are food addicts.
Should he not drink coffee? There are coffee addicts? Should he not shop? There are shopping addicts.

So go ahead and tell the guy who's had a drinking problem then what he should and should not do.

Fact is we haven't heard word one about him taking too many pills or smoking crack. Just booze. Lots of people drink too much and don't have issue one with any other substance. Just like lots of people smoke pot and don't feel the need to leap to any other substance. There is absolutely no reason to think, and certainly without meeting him, that pot couldn't be just the thing to ease Manziel out without him feeling the need to lean on his substance of issue.
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I see rationalization has not gone out of style.
 
Marshall said:
It's called SUBSTANCE ABUSE. The identity of the substance isn't the problem, though the illegal ones carry additional problems. Those prone to addiction rarely confine their addiction to any individual substance. It's tragic because it makes one a SLAVE to the next round of poison.
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Do you realize that sugar is one of the most addicting drugs on the planet? Should he stop that too, since he has this addictive personality that you are describing? One drug doesn't necessarily have to do with another.

I can guarantee you that a ton of NFL players have alcohol problems that you never hear about or will ever know about. They're responsible people that don't get into problems or create havoc for themselves like Manziel always seems to. Manziel's biggest problem seems to be his ego and his lack of fear or ruining his career and his star status. He has had a sense of entitlement for a long time. Alcohol just seems to exacerbate his behavior.
 
chicagotexan2 said:
Me too. But if he can make it in the NFL that'd be great. He's shown flashes but he's inconsistent. I'm sure his behavior has put him in the doghouse with this HC and his career behind the eight ball.

He was a badass in college but having an addiction or lack of discipline/dedication is just the sort of weakness that that exposes players real quick.
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Agreed,

Even though he has shown flashes I dont think he will ever amount to much in the NFL. Too short and an avg arm. It would take a HC like Carroll to make JM a viable NFL QB and even at that I dont think he would amount to much more than a backup QB. Tyrod Taylor type
 
steelbtexan said:
Agreed,

Even though he has shown flashes I dont think he will ever amount to much in the NFL. Too short and an avg arm. It would take a HC like Carroll to make JM a viable NFL QB and even at that I dont think he would amount to much more than a backup QB. Tyrod Taylor type
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That's nothing to be ashamed about. I'd take that gig in a heartbeat.
 
Jason La Canfora
CBS Sports NFL Insider

Johnny Manziel's troubles began again after return to backup role
October 25, 2015 7:50 am ET
While Browns quarterback Johnny Manziel had been earning rave reviews for his behavior on and off the field in the early part of the season, he began to take a turn for the worse after losing his brief grip on the starting quarterback job, sources said, culminating in his questioning by police in his car a week ago. Some in the Browns organization were bracing for an incident of some sort, with his attitude and demeanor changing slightly after one week running the offense with veteran Josh McCown injured.

Concern began at that point that Manziel might not be as focused and diligent both at the team's facility and in his free time, and during the past two weeks there were small signs that he was not quite as dedicated to his craft, sources said, as it became apparent that he was going to be in a backup role for the foreseeable future. Manziel flashed well in his lone start of the season, with McCown recovering from a concussion, but has not seen the field since. The fact that he was drinking at 2 p.m. on Monday, prior to the incident with his girlfriend, has been a major point of concern.

"This kid is such a competitor and he got a taste for it and made some plays and started a game and I think he thought he got the job back," said one team source. "So you had a bad feeling something might be coming and he might slip. I'm not sure he's wired to be a backup and he had really won people over, but I can't say it's a surprise that something like this happened after he ended up back on the bench."

Manziel was not arrested and faces no charges from a heated argument with his girlfriend, Colleen Crowley, although he did admit to police he was drinking earlier that day. Police were looking into the nature of marks on Crowley's arms and witness accounts of a domestic incident (the couple was allowed to leave the scene together). While the NFL would not indicate it was reviewing the incident last weekend, once a dash-cam video was released during which Crowley claimed she was hit "a couple of times," the league then stated it was reviewing the matter.

There have been concerns about the sometimes turbulent nature of that relationship within the Browns hierarchy, sources said, and some have been hoping there would be separation for quite some time. Crowley is a college student who has been living with Manziel this season. Manziel was not disciplined by the team and has remained McCown's primary backup, dressing for games as he normally would.
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bah007 said:
The mere ownership of an alarm clock seems enough to earn a paycheck..
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I know a lot of people who OWN an alarm clock and still can't get anywhere on time. But I admit those people are skewed toward women. Many seem to think an appointment time is when you think about heading out the door to meet someone at least thirty minutes away.
 
SEOjaQP.gif
 
Mike Pettine: Johnny Manziel 'inconsistent' in start vs. Bengals
5h -
  • Pat McManamon, ESPN Staff Writer

CINCINNATI -- Johnny Manziel "absolutely" wants to keep the starting quarterback job for the Cleveland Browns, but coach Mike Pettine was noncommital following the 31-10 loss to the Cincinnati Bengals on Thursday night.
  • The Browns quarterback, making his second start of the season, was solid in the first half but struggled in the second half.
"When we get in and get back from this time off, we will assess what pool of players are available and go ahead and make those decisions from there," Pettine said. "This will be a good time to step away and reassess where we are moving forward."

Players will be off through the weekend. The Browns don't return until early next week, when they start to prepare to play in Pittsburgh on Nov. 15.

Incumbent starter Josh McCown said Tuesday he had trouble breathing and sleeping because of a painful rib injury that hampered him in Sunday's game. The team hoped he'd be able to play, but the short week prevented McCown, who has 1,897 passing yards and 11 touchdowns against four interceptions, from being ready for Thursday night. His absence opened the door for Manziel to start.

Manziel was asked whether he wants to remain the starter.

"Yes, absolutely," he said. "We get a few days off now to refresh and get a break ... come back, watch the film and then get ready to go for the following week."

Manziel had an effective first half, throwing for a touchdown and 128 yards. But in the second half, he was just 4-of-15 for 40 yards and was sacked three times. He said the second half was "eerily familiar" to the disastrous first start of his rookie season, a 30-0 loss to the Bengals.

Pettine said Manziel was "inconsistent."

"I thought he did some good things, but I just thought in the second half, especially after we fell behind, he was just trying to make too many big plays instead of just taking completions," he said.

Said Manziel: "I think there were some good things done in the first half, but there's two halves for a reason. I did some good things tonight and some things I wish I could have back."

Manziel said he is confident he can do the job if he remains the starter.

"Yes," he said. "I think things slowed down a little bit."
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??????????????
 
Pettine should start him the rest of the year. McCown isn't the future and you might as well see what you have in Manziel. Putting him in for a game at a time (and a road start vs Cinci? are you kidding me) is not the way to evaluate him.
 
I only got to watch the 1st half and I thought he looked pretty good although the Cincy defense was doing him a huge favor by allowing him to consistently break out of the pocket.

Looked at the stats after the game though and it looked like things fell apart in the 2nd half.
 
htownfan32 said:
Pettine should start him the rest of the year. McCown isn't the future and you might as well see what you have in Manziel. Putting him in for a game at a time (and a road start vs Cinci? are you kidding me) is not the way to evaluate him.
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Well, he only played due to McCown's injury. He's the backup getting a spot start. McCown is still the starter and it's not like Manziel demonstrated enough to take the job away from him. If the Browns want to win this year then they will go back to McCown, because he is clearly the better QB at this point in time.

But if they are honest with themselves they should see that their season is over. They are 2-7. And if they want to find out more about what they have in Manziel then they need to let him finish the year. It all comes down to whether or not they think Manziel is ready for that shot.
 
WolverineFan said:
I only got to watch the 1st half and I thought he looked pretty good although the Cincy defense was doing him a huge favor by allowing him to consistently break out of the pocket.

Looked at the stats after the game though and it looked like things fell apart in the 2nd half.
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He was safe with the ball and he had one good drive at the end of the first half. Other than that he was pretty much as expected. Only 7/17 targeting WRs.

He was as easy to defend as always, although Cincy didn't defend him correctly to start. The easiest way to defend Manziel is to basically play as vanilla as possible. He thrives on broken plays, so instead, just keep him contained and force him to take only what you want him to have. Mix up your zone looks, sit back in coverage, and push the pocket from the inside but set your ends to contain instead of rush upfield.

When the pressure comes from the middle he wants to leave the pocket immediately. If your ends rush upfield he has room to leave and improvise. If they only set the edge then he can't go anywhere and has to make a play in the pocket, which is something he is capable of but definitely not his strength.

Cincy started the game trying to attack and confuse him. In the second half they just sat back and let Cleveland try to run their offense. I believe Cleveland gained less than 40 yards in the half. Manziel doesn't have the patience or mental acumen to pick you apart on script.
 
htownfan32 said:
Pettine should start him the rest of the year. McCown isn't the future and you might as well see what you have in Manziel. Putting him in for a game at a time (and a road start vs Cinci? are you kidding me) is not the way to evaluate him.
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I agree. How else are you going to know and show everyone else if he can be your qb or try again with do robe else?
 
bah007 said:
But if they are honest with themselves they should see that their season is over. They are 2-7. And if they want to find out more about what they have in Manziel then they need to let him finish the year. It all comes down to whether or not they think Manziel is ready for that shot.
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Except that's likely not good for us and the Browns will be in the market....AGAIN....for a QB.
 
htownfan32 said:
Pettine should start him the rest of the year. McCown isn't the future and you might as well see what you have in Manziel. Putting him in for a game at a time (and a road start vs Cinci? are you kidding me) is not the way to evaluate him.
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I think they should either cut Manziel or fire Pettine. Keep whoever the organization is more committed to because Pettine clearly doesn't believe in him.
 
bah007 said:
He was safe with the ball and he had one good drive at the end of the first half. Other than that he was pretty much as expected. Only 7/17 targeting WRs.

He was as easy to defend as always, although Cincy didn't defend him correctly to start. The easiest way to defend Manziel is to basically play as vanilla as possible. He thrives on broken plays, so instead, just keep him contained and force him to take only what you want him to have. Mix up your zone looks, sit back in coverage, and push the pocket from the inside but set your ends to contain instead of rush upfield.

When the pressure comes from the middle he wants to leave the pocket immediately. If your ends rush upfield he has room to leave and improvise. If they only set the edge then he can't go anywhere and has to make a play in the pocket, which is something he is capable of but definitely not his strength.

Cincy started the game trying to attack and confuse him. In the second half they just sat back and let Cleveland try to run their offense. I believe Cleveland gained less than 40 yards in the half. Manziel doesn't have the patience or mental acumen to pick you apart on script.
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Bottom line, the Bengals in the 2nd half did something that Manziel so far has never been able to do............adjust.
 
xtruroyaltyx said:
No I don't. But someone in that front office still wants him around.

Doesn't seem like it's going to work out there for one or the other or both.
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The Browns are likely going to have a new head coach next year unless something drastic happens......and a new head coach is unlikely to keep baby sitting Manziel along............so Manziel becomes a permanent clip board fixture or finds himself out of Cleveland.
 
CloakNNNdagger said:
The Browns are likely going to have a new head coach next year unless something drastic happens......and a new head coach is unlikely to keep baby sitting Manziel along............so Manziel becomes a permanent clip board fixture or finds himself out of Cleveland.
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As royalty alluded, I believe that there is someone higher up than the HC that wants Manziel in Cleveland. The baby sitting isn't coming from the head coach.
 
CloakNNNdagger said:
And this is why JF will probably always be relegated mostly to the bench and clipboard . A detailed analysis by retired NFL DE Stephen White:
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A little off topic, but during the preseason you see several people going crazy over what they see from their pet favorite at the time. This usually involves a lot of improvising, moving out of the pocket & making big plays to wide open receivers.

And it's exciting to watch, but guys who can consistently make those plays in real game after real game are extremely rare. & if that's the extent of that guys game, he won't be successful long term. It's like playing one on 11.

Instead, I like to see QBs make good, sound, quick decisions from the pocket. Within the design of the offense. Three step drops, five, seven. & I'd just as soon he throws it away than "make something happen" because in a real game, I'd rather he throws it away than throw a poorly thought out pass & turn the ball over.

Now, if I'm confident in his ability to make the right decision in a real game, then I'll tell him to let it rip, but only when I'm testing his 2 minute sensibilities... the "We're down, but we need to do whatever it takes to get a score here" kind of sensibilities.
 
thunderkyss said:
A little off topic, but during the preseason you see several people going crazy over what they see from their pet favorite at the time. This usually involves a lot of improvising, moving out of the pocket & making big plays to wide open receivers.

And it's exciting to watch, but guys who can consistently make those plays in real game after real game are extremely rare. & if that's the extent of that guys game, he won't be successful long term. It's like playing one on 11.

Instead, I like to see QBs make good, sound, quick decisions from the pocket. Within the design of the offense. Three step drops, five, seven. & I'd just as soon he throws it away than "make something happen" because in a real game, I'd rather he throws it away than throw a poorly thought out pass & turn the ball over.

Now, if I'm confident in his ability to make the right decision in a real game, then I'll tell him to let it rip, but only when I'm testing his 2 minute sensibilities... the "We're down, but we need to do whatever it takes to get a score here" kind of sensibilities.
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This guy wouldn't have played Roger Staubach or Fran Tarkington because of their style.
 
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