Nobody wanted to pick him that high.
If anything, he would have gone to the Oakland Raiders once the Texans passed on him in the second round.
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Report: Brian Hoyer to be named Texans starting QB
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If anything, he would have gone to the Oakland Raiders once the Texans passed on him in the second round.
WolverineFan
Hall of Fame
Sorry he was "ripe for the picking". Do you feel better now? Or would you like to continue your insane rant for some other absurd reason.
WolverineFan
Hall of Fame
I really hope he didn't say that. Hoyer may be a really nice guy and hard worker, etc, etc. But he seems to lack the physical talent and mental toughness to be an NFL starter. I would hope that's just Pancakes being Pancakes.
I for sure hope this is not 100% true and it's just another McClain's "guesses".
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
By draft day yes. But WF is correct. Just look in our draft forum. As the college season ended TB was top QB and absolutely in discussion for #1 overall. Then the height, weight and shorts crowd got involved and by draft day he was generally considered a mid 1st pick.
WolverineFan
Hall of Fame
Yep. I remember after he torched Miami in their bowl game and Kiper and McShay were having daily discussions about the merit of him going #1 over Clowney (who to that point had been hyped as one of the best defensive line prospects ever). Then he had a poor Pro Day throwing without gloves and people nit-picked the hell out of him.
Vance87
All Pro
Mid first is different than what he said...which was that he was worthy of THE top pick or the second.
Nitrofish
Let The Big Fish Eat!
This was exactly what I was anticipating when TB fell. I thought they would trade up a few spots to make sure they got him because IMO he was way to tempting to take at the bottom of the 1st. Perhaps they were convinced TB would literally fall to them at the top of the 2nd and had planned for that. Once he didn't they went with plan B. If rumors are true --and we know how that goes-- then O'Brien was not interested because he did not have the measurable's. Which makes the Hoyer acquisition even more puzzling, unless it was only for a backup role, and a mentor for Savage. Once I heard QB competition, I knew we were screwed.
If scouts are "too good these days" then why are the QBS taken in the first and second round since 2010:
Bortles
Manziel
Bridgewater
Carr
Garoppolo
EJ Manuel
Geno Smith
Andrew Luck
Robert Griffin
Ryan Tannehill
Brandon Weeden
Brock Ossweiler
Cam Newton
Jake Locker
Gabbert
Ponder
Dalton
Kaepernick
Bradford
Tebow
Clausen
The two most sure things in that mix were Andrew Luck and RGIII.
Mike
Scooter
Funky
Yup yup. I among many others would've taken him #1 before the 'no gloves' nonsense. A large portion of us kept that stance, though there were plenty who bought into his pro-day performance.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
Distinction without merit. He personally still would have taken him #1. For the record, I would not but at that time said if OB liked a guy he should take him regardless of where he appeared on mocks.
But either way once 25 or so was passed he had become a value pick, falling into your lap, luck of the Irish, etc. whatever, he was there for the taking if you wanted to make it happen. The Texans didn't want him.
This isn't Winston or Mariota where you'd have to guess how many of your children's limbs it would have taken to move up. This was a real, simple, ordinary pass on making a deal.
Vance87
All Pro
You said that WF was correct because he was generally considered a mid first round pick, or at least "in the discussion" for us taking him at #1. WF said he was a "unanimous top-2 pick". Those are not the same thing, by a long shot.
On draft night I was like "Wow, we are going to get TB too, because the other teams in front of us aren't going to draft a QB!" And then the Vikings traded up right in front of us. Even then I wasn't sure what they were going to do. The Vikings obviously wanted him and knew that we would probably draft him if he was there so they purposefully moved in front of us.
Flyingfish
Waterboy
Wait, a revelation, I can now see the plan...
"There's a story by Mclain in particular, on one of his 610 appearances, he says while interviewing for another HC job he (OB) told his prospective employers, "If you really want to turn things around, you need to get Brian Hoyer... " or something along those lines."
The plan all along has been acquire Hoyer, open up that massive pit of suck, get a really good draft choice and draft the QB you really want.
Brilliant...genius...devious. Oh, the Hoodie would be so proud.
"There's a story by Mclain in particular, on one of his 610 appearances, he says while interviewing for another HC job he (OB) told his prospective employers, "If you really want to turn things around, you need to get Brian Hoyer... " or something along those lines."
The plan all along has been acquire Hoyer, open up that massive pit of suck, get a really good draft choice and draft the QB you really want.
Brilliant...genius...devious. Oh, the Hoodie would be so proud.
Brisco_County
Apples and roadmaps
Maybe --maybe-- there was some logic to believing that about Hoyer... But the key element missing from the evaluation was pass rush pressure.
Marshall
Not pretty, but ALIVE!
There is a difference between "not every QB can run my offense" and "I can make any QB successful in my offense." But you'd never know it from what some posters say. In fact, they are really mutually exclusive, but any position seems to be gripe worthy, contradictory or not.
OBs QB requirement for a high football IQ seems to be the crux of the angst among favored QBs we refuse to break the bank for. You can be highly successful in today's college game without ever understanding the offense, but merely carrying out the plays from the sideline. OB's style seems to rely on quick reads by almost the entire team who also have to read them the same way. Presnap - pre motion - Presnap post motion - post snap hot - post snap adjust, etc. Each read results in a different route tree. Then if the ball isn't delivered in 3 seconds, it's school yard football.
Porky
Hall of Fame
It's pretty obvious the Texans didn't even rate Teddy as a low first rounder or high second rounder - if they did, he would be wearing deep steel blue right now. No question about it because of the premium on QB's.
Instead they drafted a guard. A freaking guard. Even if X did/will pan out and be a 10 yr rock, is that a better decision then getting TB when they actually had the chance. This notion that oh golly gee he wasn't there at 33 so too bad is BS. If they wanted TB, he'd be here. Period.
I think the drafting of X over TB will be the defining moment for this regime. If Bridgewater pans out to even be a "good" NFL starter, and X continues on his path to nowhere, combined with the kind of play we see now at QB... that's a failure of epic proportions, and Smith and OB need to be shoved out the door. It's still not decided yet - too soon, but that's the way it's heading and McNair needs to stop settling for mediocrity and the path of least resistance. 99% of their decisions reek of mediocrity.
Instead they drafted a guard. A freaking guard. Even if X did/will pan out and be a 10 yr rock, is that a better decision then getting TB when they actually had the chance. This notion that oh golly gee he wasn't there at 33 so too bad is BS. If they wanted TB, he'd be here. Period.
I think the drafting of X over TB will be the defining moment for this regime. If Bridgewater pans out to even be a "good" NFL starter, and X continues on his path to nowhere, combined with the kind of play we see now at QB... that's a failure of epic proportions, and Smith and OB need to be shoved out the door. It's still not decided yet - too soon, but that's the way it's heading and McNair needs to stop settling for mediocrity and the path of least resistance. 99% of their decisions reek of mediocrity.
Vance87
All Pro
There is a lot of crap here...
But really, it's this - I think they would have taken him at 33, for sure. We didn't like him enough to move up and get him. If he would of...*ahem*...fallen into our laps, we would have taken him. But he didn't, so that's that.
The fact that you can't see the future (can you?) makes the latter half of your post just plain worthless.
BTW Teddy sure put on a show last night. At least Hoylet was able to score 9.
Honoring Earl 34
Something Witty !
That's what's amusing in all the anger , which I understand . Do we really think the teams that selected the following ( and the rounds of the top of my head ) , knew what they were getting when they picked them . This is where the Texans come under scrutiny they don't draft a QB high when they have an incumbent .
Brady ... 6th
Montana ..3rd
Wilson ... 3rd
Romo UDFA
Foles ... 3rd
Brees ... 2nd
Starr ... 15th
Honoring Earl 34
Something Witty !
He and Mr. Mittens could do some Vaudeville .
We should be upset about settling for mediocrity if Bridgewater turns out to be mediocre........ gotcha
Marshall
Not pretty, but ALIVE!
Poor guys can't even get mediocre fans posting on the forums.
Texan_fan_13
Needed: OL now that we have a QB worth it
There are threads from very early on that the Texans wanted Mallett. Way before the draft. I think that is the reason we didn't draft a QB.
I also wonder what Mallett is doing that is rubbing OB the wrong way. Because there is no explicable reason OB is picking Hoyer over Mallett. Even a non football person can see this.
dalemurphy
Hall of Fame
My best guess is the following:
Mallett consistently makes good pre-snap reads and relies on that read almost 100% of the time (explaining his consistency getting rid of the ball so quickly). Therefore, once he has made that read, everything he does subsequently is with the determined intention to throw the ball to that primary read (including looking off the defense, etc..) This process can be quite successful in high school and some college systems, but if he has predetermined where the ball will go pre-snap, and he is not able to move to 2nd and 3rd progressions, the NFL will expose him. Perhaps his poor performance vs. Cincinnati was the result of the Bengal coaches have a week to prepare for him after the Cleveland game (and not simply due to an injured pectoral muscle).
Therefore, having success in relief of Hoyer (KC gameplanned for Hoyer) makes sense. Also, OBrien wanting to keep this week's starter secret would also fit into this theory.
If this is the case (and I hope it isn't), he can look very good against certain teams and in short stints. However, once teams have tape on him and begin game planning for him, they will take serious advantage of him.
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Mr teX
Hall of Fame
Perhaps its what he's not doing. Regardless, all the conspiracy theories about why this or why that as it relates to Mallet as a starter are getting to the point of absurdity..I've read everything on here from teacher's pet theories to guys questioning OB's will to want to win....I'm just about ready to apply Occam's razor to it all...Mallet ain't starting for OB at qb............b/c OB just don't think he's that good...end of story.
EllisUnit
Vote RED!!!
Well its hard to really know how teams would adult against him and how he would adjust given he hasn't had enough playing playing time to see either.
Then OB shouldn't have agreed to sign him. So the blame still falls on OB for bringing him back.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
Sure everyone associated with the Pats was rumored to the Texans plus Mallett had said he would not re-sign with the Pats. If you want to investigate threads you'll find steelbtexan and I (yes, the odd couple) were banging Mallett's drum even before OB was hired.
Yeah, those sailed passes were a result of their prep.
I have never doubted OB's desire to win. Mallett as a piece of the equation I have come to doubt his personnel decisions especially QB. Real simple, no conspiracy - OB f'ked up.
Adams at LG is on par with the stupidity of Victor Riley at LT.
dalemurphy
Hall of Fame
He was among the best available free agent options, signed for very little, and he is a relatively young QB with talent and upside potential. It is hard to argue the Mallett signing was ill-advised... much easier to criticize the Hoyer deal at this point, I think.
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
Well that's a silly way of looking at it...If he brought him back on premium coin then i'd agree with you...but he didn't....But just b/c he agreed to bring him back doesn't mean he agreed to start him..Oh by the way, its wasn't a 1 way street either, Mallet agreed to come back on his own as well.
dalemurphy
Hall of Fame
It is only a theory... having said that, I do recall him appearing confused and/or indecisive vs. Cincinnati, which could support the theory. I am not convinced the theory is accurate... it is my current best guess on why the QB situation has unfolded the way it has- starting with the lack of aggressiveness in trading for Mallett last year, the lack of aggressiveness signing Mallett this off-season, the Hoyer signing, and Hoyer winning the job this preseason- combined with the positives we have seen from him when he has been on the field.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
Or much less complex - OB loves Hoyer to the point of bias.
We all have biases. Maybe Mallett just rubs OB the wrong way. Whigger, reads comic books and OB reads von Clauswitz, chuckles in class, whatever.
We all have biases. Maybe Mallett just rubs OB the wrong way. Whigger, reads comic books and OB reads von Clauswitz, chuckles in class, whatever.
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
There's next to nothing to say that his personnel decisions are any worse than any other HC's & If anything, you can say his personnel decisions at qb are in the green based on what he was able to do with Fitz and Keenum last year. The fact that he even made the trade for the guy y'all are clamoring for to start can only be looked at as a positive move...He could've just not even entertained the trade for Mallet and went at it with Fitz, Savage and some freakin' bum like Tim Tebow last year placing the premium on his system instead of exploring the best possible talent he could get on short notice.
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
If that were the case, he doesn't even entertain bringing the kid back...
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
Did I say OB sucked compared to other head coaches? Go to Texian and steelb for those kinds of broad statements. I don't agree with a couple of his specific personnel decisions for the Texans.
The world's not binary. I can dislike someone and still want him on my team. For example since I had to type that obvious point - my 60 gunner was a kid I hated personally, would never promote, and frankly didn't fit the role (went 125 lbs on a heavy day) but the little beotch was an artist in that one role.
I would look confused and indecisive if I were trying to play quarterback with half my chest hanging off too.
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
Doesn't fit OB's style imo...We're talking about a guy who released/traded a guy at least in part b/c he popped off about his draft status making him exempt from playing ST...a guy who sat down and told the greatest WR the texans have ever had with a straight face that he was only going to see 40 catches this year. That's no nonsense stuff there & OB doesn't come off as a guy who would tolerate having a guy on his team that he didn't like for any reason..Honestly i don't think any coach would. If he disliked the kid that much Mallet would've been demoted permanently to 3rd string the minute he walked into practice late on that episode of Hard Knocks.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
OR it's a guy with a script and doesn't want anyone off script. System over AJ - we don't need star WRs.
System over Mallett feeding Nuk - we don't need star QBs or WRs. "That play was designed to go to Mumphery damn it."
And no nonsense doesn't mean no bias. It's naive to think it does.
xtruroyaltyx
Hall of Fame
OB is becoming a caricature of himself.
Now I know how Raiders fans felt when they got Schaub from us. WTF. Only they didn't have to put up with him actually starting the season because they drafted Carr.
We actually have to see Hoyer start for us. Is Hoyer much different from Schaub when we got rid of him? Not much of an arm, no confidence, replaced by an unproven QB.....
A big part of the problem is you have one man making the decisions. I watched hard knocks and I think whatever BOB decided Rick would go along with. Oh yeah and the man making the decisions is not too good so far. Look at our drafts. Again you don't get better unless you improve in the draft and that means making the right choices in the draft, not just doing a good job on undrafted players.
BOB thinks Hoyer is less likely to turn the ball over than Mallett. He might have been right if Hoyaub had confidence but it sure looks as though he is a basket case like Matt.
With GoodMallett/BadMallett that is what you get. Mallett though may make plays while Hoyaub is Hoyaub.
I think if Texans lose turnover battle they more than likely lose the game unless Foster returns healthy and 100%.
We actually have to see Hoyer start for us. Is Hoyer much different from Schaub when we got rid of him? Not much of an arm, no confidence, replaced by an unproven QB.....
A big part of the problem is you have one man making the decisions. I watched hard knocks and I think whatever BOB decided Rick would go along with. Oh yeah and the man making the decisions is not too good so far. Look at our drafts. Again you don't get better unless you improve in the draft and that means making the right choices in the draft, not just doing a good job on undrafted players.
BOB thinks Hoyer is less likely to turn the ball over than Mallett. He might have been right if Hoyaub had confidence but it sure looks as though he is a basket case like Matt.
With GoodMallett/BadMallett that is what you get. Mallett though may make plays while Hoyaub is Hoyaub.
I think if Texans lose turnover battle they more than likely lose the game unless Foster returns healthy and 100%.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
Hoyer has never been a pimple on Schaub's ass.
Every team loses when they lose turnovers. It's the single most predictable indicator in football.
Every team loses when they lose turnovers. It's the single most predictable indicator in football.
The Pencil Neck
Hall of Fame
I think I've said almost exactly the same thing somewhere or other.
You can even kinda see an example of it in Brett Kollman's breakdown of the Brown's game. Kollman thought it was a good play, but in that 40 yard completion to Nuk, Mallett made the first, pre-snap read and then went with it, not taking into account that the Browns were disguising their coverage, a coverage designed to take away exactly the pass that Mallett made. He only got bailed out because the safety was slow getting back in coverage. Kollman thought that Mallett read that the guy wasn't going to be able to make it back, but I think that's giving Mallett too much credit... like that play where the official blocked the linebacker who would have at least deflected the pass to Graham. Mallett got lucky and those two throws worked, but you can't count on luck all the time.
However, if I've got a choice between Hoyer and Mallett, I'm taking Mallett and then trying to get him to only do that superfast release off his first read in certain circumstances.
I think if we switch to Mallett, we've got a chance to win more games this year than we do if we go with Hoyer.
Nitrofish
Let The Big Fish Eat!
Great podcast with Matt Hammond.
http://houston.cbslocal.com/2015/09...hip-kelly-fourth-down-field-goal-parkey-miss/
http://houston.cbslocal.com/2015/09...hip-kelly-fourth-down-field-goal-parkey-miss/
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
I agree, Mallett is an arrogant I can stick it in there guy. But the thing is he does have more. Carr had a huge arm. Can you think of a single moment in 5 freaking years you looked at a play and said "well hell yeah, use that rocket." Mallett came out and in minutes drilled a TD that left the DBs going "you see where he went?" "Where'd who go?"
I posted Kurgen last night. Mallett is Nuke Lalouche.
I seriously doubt that is the case. Did you watch the Bill O'Brien coaching clinic video?
The things OB talked about in that video is why I think Mallett gets rid of the ball quickly. Part of the play is designed to breakdown zone coverage, the other side is designed against man. The prenatal read just tells him where he'll start his progression.
I don't think Mallett has been hitting his primary every time.
Maybe Sunday, I haven't gotten around to watching that game again. But against Cleveland, you could see his progression was in perfect sync with his drops.
He's a rhythm passer. Does a really good job.
If this is true then this is a 6-10 team at best this yr.
Oh joy, but hey, we're on the right track.
This post is one of the reasons I respect you as much as I do.
Agreed on all points.
Honoring Earl 34
Something Witty !
Not to interrupt the flirting but I think y'all were saying throw a 2nd or 3rd to the Pats for Mallett instead of picking a QB #1 overall .