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Who else thinks the Texans are going to crash and burn in 2015

TexansFight said:
you-cant-handle-the-truth-meme-generator-you-want-the-truth-you-can-t-handle-the-truth-9789dd.jpg
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LOL!! That's damn funny!!!
 
Funny thing about the gloom and doom people.. you're correct that your right for most of the time..only one winner at the end of the season with sports. 1 out of 32 for nfl. So odds are in your favor
Congrats

I guess that is what some want is a consistent pat on the back every week to reensure you superior knowledge that the team sucks
 
Wolf said:
Funny thing about the gloom and doom people.. you're correct that your right for most of the time..only one winner at the end of the season with sports. 1 out of 32 for nfl. So odds are in your favor
Congrats

I guess that is what some want is a consistent pat on the back every week to reensure you superior knowledge that the team sucks
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That and their total inability to listen to anyone else's viewpoint.

It's like talking to a brickwall.
 
Wolf said:
Funny thing about the gloom and doom people.. you're correct that your right for most of the time..only one winner at the end of the season with sports. 1 out of 32 for nfl. So odds are in your favor
Congrats

I guess that is what some want is a consistent pat on the back every week to reensure you superior knowledge that the team sucks
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Yep. This whole message board happiness because you're right and we sucked and you predicted it mentality is truly annoying. If you're happy we lost because it made you right, you're not a fan- plain and simple.
 
Phoenix said:
If we keep paying for mediocricy and accepting it (buying tickets,jerseys,over priced burgers & beer etc)....guess what we'll keep getting.....More Mediocricy!!!.....Now I'm guessing your next question will be....If I'm so smart then what's the solution?.....Stop Paying For Mediocricy!!!
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You know that's not how it happens in real life. The Jaguars tarped off several seats for several years so they could manipulate their % tickets sold to avoid the black out rule.... ie no one was buying tickets, jerseys, over priced burgers.... & they still sucked.

The Seahawks fans, on the other hand, became known as the 12th man through years of mediocrity, ie buying tickets, jerseys, over priced burgers... & they've been to the last two Super Bowls, winning one of them.
 
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thunderkyss said:
You know that's not how it happens in real life. The Jaguars tapered off several seats for several years so they could manipulate their % tickets sold to avoid the black put rule.... ie no one was buying tickets, jerseys, over priced burgers.... & they still sucked.

The Seahawks fans, on the other hand, became known as the 12th man through years of mediocrity, ie buying tickets, jerseys, over priced burgers... & they've been to the last two Super Bowls, winning one of them.
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I always marvel at the idiocy of people who take the stance of what phoenix says...as if the only people who are tired of this teams failures are the one's who pay for tickets..
 
DaJaVU Stupid coach - Brown U never produced anything - Hoyer goes out - Mallet comes in - Mallet tears other tit - JJ for QB - Bill O'Brown calls Case - Case will not return call - 2015 record will be better 3 & 13 - Owner fires Coach & GM and brings in Case to run team. A QB has to throw the ball to where the receiver will be not where he was. Poor Texan fans - They deserve better!
 
DaJaVU Stupid coach - Brown U never produced anything - Hoyer goes out - Mallet comes in - Mallet tears other tit - JJ for QB - Bill O'Brown calls Case - Case will not return call - 2015 record will be better 3 & 13 - Owner fires Coach & GM and brings in Case to run team. A QB has to throw the ball to where the receiver will be not where he was. Poor Texan fans - They deserve better!
 
Dondo said:
DaJaVU Stupid coach - Brown U never produced anything - Hoyer goes out - Mallet comes in - Mallet tears other tit - JJ for QB - Bill O'Brown calls Case - Case will not return call - 2015 record will be better 3 & 13 - Owner fires Coach & GM and brings in Case to run team. A QB has to throw the ball to where the receiver will be not where he was. Poor Texan fans - They deserve better!
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You've said this same thing 4 times in 3 threads.

Please do not repetitively post the same thing in multiple threads.
 
infantrycak said:
8th. As part of the deal to get Schaub we switched 1st rounders.
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Right; I just didn't remember our original draft slot.

On the old TT board, I was wanting Schaub after Texanmike mentioned him and I checked Schaub out.

I just didn't like the deal.
I liked Schaub some, but I was thinking a second at the most.

I know if you like a guy enough (between the GM and the HC), you're willing to pay more, but not to the tune of two seconds, a switch down in draft spot, and a healthy contract (at the time for an unproven QB).

I'm thinking these GMs and HCs don't operate totally independent. Just like in any business, there are different circles.

(Like for a while, the Padres and the Astros used to make a lot of trades between themselves; in my thinking, it was like a shared pool.)

At any rate, it's hard to tell why Schaub garnered such a good deal while Mallett drew little interest.

There wasn't much tapes on Schaub, and what were there didn't scream out.

It makes me wonder some time what's going on behind closed doors.
 
76Texan said:
I know if you like a guy enough (between the GM and the HC), you're willing to pay more, but not to the tune of two seconds, a switch down in draft spot, and a healthy contract (at the time for an unproven QB).
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Schaub was well worth it.

At any rate, it's hard to tell why Schaub garnered such a good deal while Mallett drew little interest.

There wasn't much tapes on Schaub, and what were there didn't scream out.
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Schaub hadn't forcefully said he would not re-sign with Atlanta.

Schaub had a giant game against the defending SB champion Patriots on national TV.

Schaub had 161 attempts in regular season games. Mallett had 4.
 
thunderkyss said:
I think the point to be made here is that our starting QB looked exactly like we expected him to look... just like he finished in Cleveland.
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He looked a bit worse than his worse game in Cleveland; that's the problem.

Well, maybe about the same as in two game last year.

Couldn't get into a rythm, but also he played more part in a loss in this game than in any game I've watched.
 
infantrycak said:
Schaub was well worth it.



Schaub hadn't forcefully said he would not re-sign with Atlanta.

Schaub had a giant game against the defending SB champion Patriots on national TV.

Schaub had 161 attempts in regular season games. Mallett had 4.
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Something like that; otherwise I wouldn't have wanted Schaub.

Not much tapes still.
 
76Texan said:
He looked a bit worse than his worse game in Cleveland; that's the problem.

Well, maybe about the same as in two game last year.

Couldn't get into a rythm, but also he played more part in a loss in this game than in any game I've watched.
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He had 5 games in Cleveland last year with a worse passer rating than today.

The writing was on the wall. And the outside of the house. And the car in the garage.

There was writing everywhere.
 
Mollywhopper said:
He had 5 games in Cleveland last year with a worse passer rating than today.

The writing was on the wall. And the outside of the house. And the car in the garage.

There was writing everywhere.
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What I'm saying is that he probably played worse than any game he played last year.

Rating is based on numbers.

Numbers don't tell the whole story at times.
 
76Texan said:
What I'm saying is that he probably played worse than any game he played last year.

Rating is based on numbers.

Numbers don't tell the whole story at times.
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There were three games last year he couldn't hit 50% of his throws. There were three games last year he had at least two picks with zero td's. These games weren't even shared in the same three games. After he started looking ok early he was poo-poo'ing left and right.

You're right though, numbers don't tell the whole story. But what I watched of the guy last year jives with what I watched of him today, and it damn sure jives with those lousey numbers.

I actually like OB, but bringing Hoyer here to be anything less than explicitly a backup was wrong from jump.
 
Phoenix said:
Texans Win / Loss Record: 90 wins & 122 loses....Break that down & on average we win 4 out of 10 games. Are you good with that? Does that make you optimistic year after year? Don't you see that we (the fans) hold the power & the key to having a playoff contending team.....If the stadium seat ticket sales were 4 seats sold for every 10 seats for just 1 season don't you think that would have a serious impact & send a clear message to the men that own & run this organization?
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I believe your expectations for an organization with a 13 years history are a little excessive. But perhaps this calls for a spreadsheet and facts?
 
Marshall said:
I believe your expectations for an organization with a 13 years history are a little excessive. But perhaps this calls for a spreadsheet and facts?
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Perhaps this calls for putting this particular poster on ignore and stop feeding trolls.
 
Kubiak also said he could jump start that broken down car, gave him extension in fact, then took second mortgage on Schaub. That's the problem. It's the Texans historical process of assessing talent then spending on it.

O'Brian has used a different tact, developing QB's in numbers. Unfortunate it hasn't worked out going into year two.

Could be simple, bad Luck! One pick away from Bridgewater before Vikings trade up to select Teddy right in front of all Texan draft hopefuls. Spilled milk now, but did Texans learn anything?

Process, process, process.
 
76Texan said:
What I'm saying is that he probably played worse than any game he played last year.

Rating is based on numbers.

Numbers don't tell the whole story at times.
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I watched the story yesterday and I don't need numbers. I never want to see that guy playing QB for my team again. If I do I'll know something has gone horribly, horrible wrong.
 
Phoenix said:
Rick Smith is Obriens boss... He can draft whoever he wants to draft....Obrien ( nor any other coach) tells Rick Smith what to do....he has the authority to draft any player he believes will help the team....If your a manager where you work, do the people you manage tell you what to do or do you tell them what to do....I was self employed for over 30 yrs & I always ask my employees for their input and listened....but the decision was mine....and they had to accept it or go work somewhere else....that's how all businesses work
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You're dead wrong about the bolded. First, McNair is boss to both Smith and O'Brien. Smith didn't hire O'Brien, McNair did. And it was posted (from a Chronicle article, I think) back when O'Brien was initially hired that he (O'Brien) was granted - by McNair - principal control of the draft. So O'Brien has the last word on every pick.
And common sense should tell you that, even if you were right (you aren't) and Smith HAD drafted <fill in your fave QB prospect here> that, as head coach, O'Brien didn't have to start him or ever play him.

Finally, things over on Kirby Drive kind of work like your company except that, where personnel acquisitions are concerned, O'Brien is you. He listens to input from Smith and the scouting staff but O'Brien has the last word.
 
Phoenix said:
Oh my god!!!....We're being held hostage!! By the Texans owner!!...We better just keep paying for mediocricy or else....or else he'll move our team!! And we will lose our privilege to keep paying for mediocracy. Think about what your saying and what you believe......Your Not A Powerless
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You aren't powerless either. There are 31 other teams you can cheer for.
 
76Texan said:
What I'm saying is that he probably played worse than any game he played last year.

Rating is based on numbers.

Numbers don't tell the whole story at times.
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Dude, can't you just man up and admit you were wrong? That what you think you saw on film, and what is actually happening might be two entirely different things?
 
Texian said:
First there is not a a bigger fan based in reality than myself. I've been beating that drum for the last 4 years and I've been mostly right. I too have made a lot people angry with me because of it. Now there are a lot of kool aid drinking fans here who believe that the Texans front office can do no wrong and believe every word they say. I know I used to be one. Today is their day, start of the season. You and I should take our leave from Texans Talk and let them enjoy their parade. I always do and will today also. I'll return when it is apparent that another season is lost. I'll be mostly in the college/draft section until then.

On to Rick, your wrong about Rick Smith. Smith is a GM in name only. Smith came from Denver where he was an Asst. GM and the actual role he plays today for the Texans. You like reality that's the reality of the situation today. How do I know? I have followed every move, read every article, watched every interview and press conference. You can watch many of those, they are archived in Texans website. Smith came to Houston via Kubiak's recommendation to do in Houston what he was doing in Denver, be an assistant General Manager.

If you were attentive to the situation you would know that Smith reorganized, fired and replaced many in the College and Pro Scouting departments. There are news articles detailing this. If you read and watched every post draft interview you would know that Smith orchestrates the draft but doesn't pick the players. You would know that Alex Gibbs made the decision to draft Duane Brown but Smith advised that they could trade back in RD 1 and still get him. You would also know that Frank Bush was responsible for drafting Cushing and Wade for drafting JJ Watt and Mercilus. You would know that Kubiak promised Gibbs everything he needed to take the job because at the Time the Texans running game was abysmal. You would also know that Bob McNair promised Wade first RD picks to take the coordinator job to fix the abysmal defense. You would know that O'Brien/Crennel drafted Louis Nix and Smith advised they needed to move up to be sure.

Over the years after reading and watching all things Texans you would know that Cal and Rick became BFFs. When Andre Johnson held out and Smith made a mess of things you saw how Bob McNair put Smith on the sidelines and handled the Andre situation himself. The decisions on early and extended contracts, were Bob McNair decisions, Rick was just carrying out what McNair had decided. The years of re-negotiated contracts and living in salary cap hell were all Bob McNair decisions, Smith was just carrying out orders. You knew this because you'd heard McNair say earlier, "we have the money and we're going to spend it."

Like Kubiak, O'Brien has final say on player personnel. What that means is the Texans head coach makes the decision on all player transactions on who gets signed and who doesn't. Rick Smith's official title is Exec VP, GM and Cal's BFF, in REALITY his true job description is ASSISTANT General Manager. So now you want to know who is the real GM? Bob McNair, of course. That's why McNair goes to the office early every day, 10 to 12 hours a day. What do you think McNair does all day long? Twiddle his thumbs or engages staff in a game of tiddly winks?
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2n00e8w.gif

You, my good man, have been paying attention.
We should pin this post prominently for all who wonder who actually runs things over on Kirby Drive.
 
beerlover said:
Kubiak also said he could jump start that broken down car, gave him extension in fact, then took second mortgage on Schaub. That's the problem. It's the Texans historical process of assessing talent then spending on it.

O'Brian has used a different tact, developing QB's in numbers. Unfortunate it hasn't worked out going into year two.

Could be simple, bad Luck! One pick away from Bridgewater before Vikings trade up to select Teddy right in front of all Texan draft hopefuls. Spilled milk now, but did Texans learn anything?

Process, process, process.
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I'm thinking that's what you get when you hire a QB whisperer . They think they can fix anything by installing their wisdom into an average player and spend high picks on the defense ( this is not an absolute rule ) . I think defensive minded head coaches spend a high pick on a QB because that's not his strength .
 
Honoring Earl 34 said:
I'm thinking that's what you get when you hire a QB whisperer . They think they can fix anything by installing their wisdom into an average player and spend high picks on the defense ( this is not an absolute rule ) . I think defensive minded head coaches spend a high pick on a QB because that's not his strength .
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& I think this is what you get when your team doesn't draft a QB in the first round.

But look at what Bortles & JFF did last season & yesterday. We'd probably be in the same position as those teams, but OB would have been less likely to yank him in the first game of the season.

Fans think that all your problems are solved if you take a QB in the first round. There have been more first round busts in the last 5 years, than 1st round studs.
 
thunderkyss said:
& I think this is what you get when your team doesn't draft a QB in the first round.

But look at what Bortles & JFF did last season & yesterday. We'd probably be in the same position as those teams, but OB would have been less likely to yank him in the first game of the season.

Fans think that all your problems are solved if you take a QB in the first round. There have been more first round busts in the last 5 years, than 1st round studs.
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Finding a franchise QB is one of the hardest things in sports and drafting one high increases your odds but is far from guaranteed . I think 20% of his success is related to the team he ends on . If the young QB endures the beating and losing and still has his wits you may have something if the team can successfully build around him . There's nine QBs who were #1 overall picks , five more who were top 10 overall picks , three that went later in the 1st round , and four second rounders .

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_NFL_starting_quarterbacks

Division: Team (starting quarterbacks list): Current starting quarterback: College drafted from: Year drafted (pick): Starter since: Ref:
Carson Palmer USC 2003 (1) September 13, 2015
Matt Ryan Boston College 2008 (3) December 20, 2009 [9]
Joe Flacco Delaware 2008 (18) September 7, 2008 [10]
Tyrod Taylor Virginia Tech 2011 (180) September 13, 2015 [11]
Cam Newton Auburn 2011 (1) December 21, 2014 [12]
Jay Cutler Vanderbilt 2006 (11) December 28, 2014 [13]
Andy Dalton TCU 2011 (35) September 11, 2011 [14]
Josh McCown Sam Houston State 2002 (81) September 13, 2015 [15]
Tony Romo Eastern Illinois 2003 (Undrafted) November 9, 2014 [16]
Peyton Manning Tennessee 1998 (1) September 9, 2012 [17]
Matthew Stafford Georgia 2009 (1) September 11, 2011 [18]
Aaron Rodgers Cal 2005 (24) December 29, 2013 [19]
Brian Hoyer Michigan State 2009 (Undrafted) September 13, 2015 [20]
Andrew Luck Stanford 2012 (1) September 9, 2012 [21]
Blake Bortles UCF 2014 (3) September 28, 2014 [22]
Alex Smith Utah 2005 (1) September 13, 2015 [23]
Ryan Tannehill Texas A&M 2012 (8) September 9, 2012 [24]
Teddy Bridgewater Louisville 2014 (32) October 12, 2014 [25]
Tom Brady University of Michigan 2000 (199) September 14, 2009 [26]
Drew Brees Purdue 2001 (32) September 9, 2010 [27]
Eli Manning Ole Miss 2004 (1) November 21, 2004 [7]
Ryan Fitzpatrick Harvard 2005 (250) September 13, 2015 [28]
Derek Carr Fresno State 2014 (36) September 7, 2014 [29]
Sam Bradford Oklahoma 2010 (1) September 14, 2015 [30]
Ben Roethlisberger Miami (Ohio) 2004 (11) December 9, 2012 [31]
Philip Rivers NC State 2004 (4) September 11, 2006 [32]
Colin Kaepernick Nevada 2011 (36) November 19, 2012 [33]
Russell Wilson Wisconsin 2012 (75) September 9, 2012 [34]
Nick Foles Arizona 2012 (88) September 13, 2015 [35]
Jameis Winston Florida State 2015 (1) September 13, 2015 [36]
Marcus Mariota Oregon 2015 (2) September 13, 2015 [37]
Kirk Cousins Michigan State 2012 (102) September 13, 2015 [38]
 
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Honoring Earl 34 said:
Finding a franchise QB is one of the hardest things in sports and drafting one high increases your odds but is far from guaranteed . I think 20% of his success is related to the team he ends on . If the young QB endures the beating and losing and still has his wits you may have something if the team can successfully build around him . There's nine QBs who were #1 overall picks , five more who were top 10 overall picks , three that went later in the 1st round , and four second rounders .

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_NFL_starting_quarterbacks

Division: Team (starting quarterbacks list): Current starting quarterback: College drafted from: Year drafted (pick): Starter since: Ref:
Carson Palmer USC 2003 (1) September 13, 2015
Matt Ryan Boston College 2008 (3) December 20, 2009 [9]
Joe Flacco Delaware 2008 (18) September 7, 2008 [10]
Tyrod Taylor Virginia Tech 2011 (180) September 13, 2015 [11]
Cam Newton Auburn 2011 (1) December 21, 2014 [12]
Jay Cutler Vanderbilt 2006 (11) December 28, 2014 [13]
Andy Dalton TCU 2011 (35) September 11, 2011 [14]
Josh McCown Sam Houston State 2002 (81) September 13, 2015 [15]
Tony Romo Eastern Illinois 2003 (Undrafted) November 9, 2014 [16]
Peyton Manning Tennessee 1998 (1) September 9, 2012 [17]
Matthew Stafford Georgia 2009 (1) September 11, 2011 [18]
Aaron Rodgers Cal 2005 (24) December 29, 2013 [19]
Brian Hoyer Michigan State 2009 (Undrafted) September 13, 2015 [20]
Andrew Luck Stanford 2012 (1) September 9, 2012 [21]
Blake Bortles UCF 2014 (3) September 28, 2014 [22]
Alex Smith Utah 2005 (1) September 13, 2015 [23]
Ryan Tannehill Texas A&M 2012 (8) September 9, 2012 [24]
Teddy Bridgewater Louisville 2014 (32) October 12, 2014 [25]
Tom Brady University of Michigan 2000 (199) September 14, 2009 [26]
Drew Brees Purdue 2001 (32) September 9, 2010 [27]
Eli Manning Ole Miss 2004 (1) November 21, 2004 [7]
Ryan Fitzpatrick Harvard 2005 (250) September 13, 2015 [28]
Derek Carr Fresno State 2014 (36) September 7, 2014 [29]
Sam Bradford Oklahoma 2010 (1) September 14, 2015 [30]
Ben Roethlisberger Miami (Ohio) 2004 (11) December 9, 2012 [31]
Philip Rivers NC State 2004 (4) September 11, 2006 [32]
Colin Kaepernick Nevada 2011 (36) November 19, 2012 [33]
Russell Wilson Wisconsin 2012 (75) September 9, 2012 [34]
Nick Foles Arizona 2012 (88) September 13, 2015 [35]
Jameis Winston Florida State 2015 (1) September 13, 2015 [36]
Marcus Mariota Oregon 2015 (2) September 13, 2015 [37]
Kirk Cousins Michigan State 2012 (102) September 13, 2015 [38]
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Interesting that of the nine 1:1 picks, four of them are not playing for the team that drafted them.
 
Honoring Earl 34 said:
Finding a franchise QB is one of the hardest things in sports and drafting one high increases your odds but is far from guaranteed . I think 20% of his success is related to the team he ends on . If the young QB endures the beating and losing and still has his wits you may have something if the team can successfully build around him .
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I agree with you. That doesn't mean that we should have drafted a QB in the first round in the last two drafts. Sooner or later, we will have to. If that means we need to make a ridiculous trade to do it, then so be it. But I'd rather do that, than just take a guy I don't think can be a pro bowl, franchise QB because someone else is going to be desperate enough to take him in the 1st round.

That doesn't mean I think we should have waited for Bridgewater to drop to the second round to take him. I would have traded up to get him (unless I thought a trade with Mallett was close). We ended up with Mallett, so I don't have a problem with the way that draft played out.

Some folks aren't as high on Mallett as I was. I understand. My only frustration now, is I don't think OB sees Mallett as I do/did.
 
Ok some of the fans around here want us to be "realistic" and tout their prognostication abilities. Fine, lets be real and honest about this team.

First, QB is a problem. Nobody is saying it isn't a problem. We don't know what we have in Mallet or Savage for that matter and we don't have a permanent solution yet. Gotcha. But QBs don't grow on trees. How many of the people that have been calling for a QB "forever" would have wanted us to take Luck if we had a shot to get him? My guess is it would have been universal approval. I'm fairly certain that you'd have jumped for joy if we drafted RG3, Kirk Cousins, Gabbert or just about any of the other QBs taken early in the draft. The problem is you would have been wrong close to 85% of the time. Anybody remember the calls to draft Kolb? I sure as hell do.

I'm going to go out on a limb and say that I think taking a QB early in the draft is probably one of the most risky things you can do. Look at Jacksonville, the tinbreds, Tampa, hell even Carolina. Remember the hype surrounding Cam Newton? As a passer he's pretty average. 230ish yards, 1.25 td to turnover ratio. Yeah, he adds a running dynamic to the game and he bumps the ratio up to 1.75 - 1. They've won 6,7,12 and 7 games respectively since he got there.

So lets look at how the top QBs in the last several years got to their teams.

Manning - Drafted 1,1 and played like it almost from day 1
Brady - Drafted 6th round, got his shot when Bledsoe got hurt
Brees - Basically the Chargers gave up on him, got Rivers and traded him to the Saints
Rodgers - Drafted late first round, sat several years, became a star
Luck - Drafted 1,1 has played good from day 1
Matt Ryan - Drafted 1,3 looked great the first couple of years but the team around him has let him down. Has won a combined 10 games in the last two years.
Big Ben - He was drafted 11th overall has played well

Out of curiosity, do you think that these teams are just better run than anybody else? Look at the list of names of guys that were playing QB before these guys. Rodgers and Luck are the only guys that followed perennial pro-bowlers. Look at the list of failures in the league other than that. Hell, Houston was probably set at QB if it wasn't for Fat Albert landing on Schaub's foot.

There are two ways to go about it. You can either bet the house on top QBs every year (ask tampa, jacksonville, tenn et al.) how that's worked for them or you can build a team put the pieces in place and have everything ready to support a good young QB. Of the names on that list only Manning has ever really "carried" his team. Big Ben had an outstanding defense, Matt Ryan has put up numbers but his team is a perennial disappointment, Luck has looked good so far but hasn't really "carried" his team, Rodgers has more talent at wide out than some divisions do. Brady has won a bunch, sure, but he did it with a team that allowed Cassel to win 10 games and Brees? How many superstars can you fit on one offense? Teams bet on a bunch of other "Franchise" QBs. RG3, Gabbert, Bradford, Locker, Ponder, Sanchez, Freeman, JaMarcus Hustle, Brady Quinn, Young (and you know a few of you wanted him) Lienart... that list is getting long.

I think the better way to build the team is to build a team with a core of players that allow a young "good" QB to be successful. I think we've got a lot of pieces in place. Sure we have some needs along the Oline, we're going to need some youth at WR and RB but overall this is a team that if they get average play out of the QB should win 10 games. Look at the list of QBs in the league today:

Brees,
Ryan,
Luck,
Roethlisberger,
Stafford,
Eli,
Peyton,
Brady,
Rivers,
Cutler,
Flacco,
Rodgers,
Dalton,
Kaepernick,
Smith,
Wilson,
Newton,
Romo,
Palmer

That's 19 QBs. I think any of those 19 could get us to the playoffs and most of them could take us past the first or second round. There are a lot of teams that could get a top flight QB and wouldn't be able to do anything with him. The question here is can Mallet (or Hoyer, I guess) be that guy. Can he be essentially a top 20 QB? I think we saw yesterday that if Hoyer is what he was yesterday (and I don't see any reason to believe that he isn't anything but that) then we can't win. If Mallet can be what he was yesterday, this team is going to win some games. Probably still has a shot to win 10 games.

That's it. That's the truth. No sunshine pumping, no gloom and doom, your hopes rest on the shoulders of the QB. If you want to piss and moan about it, so be it. Were you around in the 09-10 years? Anyone remember having a QB throw for 4k yards and not be able to win a game because the defense was historically bad? Year after year... We're not there.

Is everything rosy? Hell no. Am I happy we lost? Obviously not. Is the season lost? Not even close. Is it a sure thing? Nope. Why not take a wait and see approach? Lets see where we're at at the quarter mark of the season instead of trying to act as if we can really tell from week 1.



Mike
 
If you don't have a Franchise QB, then you must, I repeat you must make every effort to find one. If you don't then you're only delaying the inevitable....as you can plainly see.
 
thunderkyss said:
I agree with you. That doesn't mean that we should have drafted a QB in the first round in the last two drafts. Sooner or later, we will have to. If that means we need to make a ridiculous trade to do it, then so be it. But I'd rather do that, than just take a guy I don't think can be a pro bowl, franchise QB because someone else is going to be desperate enough to take him in the 1st round.

That doesn't mean I think we should have waited for Bridgewater to drop to the second round to take him. I would have traded up to get him (unless I thought a trade with Mallett was close). We ended up with Mallett, so I don't have a problem with the way that draft played out.

Some folks aren't as high on Mallett as I was. I understand. My only frustration now, is I don't think OB sees Mallett as I do/did.
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I liked Teddy and thought he should be taken #1 until all the poking and prodding happened . At that point it was Clowney because of the high ceiling and missing on a high pick means you'll have several more shots in the near future .
 
I think I'm changing my prediction. If we keep starting Hoyer I'm going to have to start siding with the doom and gloom crowd.
 
Texanmike02 said:
Ok some of the fans around here want us to be "realistic" and tout their prognostication abilities. Fine, lets be real and honest about this team.

First, QB is a problem. Nobody is saying it isn't a problem. We don't know what we have in Mallet or Savage for that matter and we don't have a permanent solution yet. Gotcha. But QBs don't grow on trees. How many of the people that have been calling for a QB "forever" would have wanted us to take Luck if we had a shot to get him? My guess is it would have been universal approval. I'm fairly certain that you'd have jumped for joy if we drafted RG3, Kirk Cousins, Gabbert or just about any of the other QBs taken early in the draft. The problem is you would have been wrong close to 85% of the time. Anybody remember the calls to draft Kolb? I sure as hell do.

I'm going to go out on a limb and say that I think taking a QB early in the draft is probably one of the most risky things you can do. Look at Jacksonville, the tinbreds, Tampa, hell even Carolina. Remember the hype surrounding Cam Newton? As a passer he's pretty average. 230ish yards, 1.25 td to turnover ratio. Yeah, he adds a running dynamic to the game and he bumps the ratio up to 1.75 - 1. They've won 6,7,12 and 7 games respectively since he got there.

So lets look at how the top QBs in the last several years got to their teams.

Manning - Drafted 1,1 and played like it almost from day 1
Brady - Drafted 6th round, got his shot when Bledsoe got hurt
Brees - Basically the Chargers gave up on him, got Rivers and traded him to the Saints
Rodgers - Drafted late first round, sat several years, became a star
Luck - Drafted 1,1 has played good from day 1
Matt Ryan - Drafted 1,3 looked great the first couple of years but the team around him has let him down. Has won a combined 10 games in the last two years.
Big Ben - He was drafted 11th overall has played well

Out of curiosity, do you think that these teams are just better run than anybody else? Look at the list of names of guys that were playing QB before these guys. Rodgers and Luck are the only guys that followed perennial pro-bowlers. Look at the list of failures in the league other than that. Hell, Houston was probably set at QB if it wasn't for Fat Albert landing on Schaub's foot.

There are two ways to go about it. You can either bet the house on top QBs every year (ask tampa, jacksonville, tenn et al.) how that's worked for them or you can build a team put the pieces in place and have everything ready to support a good young QB. Of the names on that list only Manning has ever really "carried" his team. Big Ben had an outstanding defense, Matt Ryan has put up numbers but his team is a perennial disappointment, Luck has looked good so far but hasn't really "carried" his team, Rodgers has more talent at wide out than some divisions do. Brady has won a bunch, sure, but he did it with a team that allowed Cassel to win 10 games and Brees? How many superstars can you fit on one offense? Teams bet on a bunch of other "Franchise" QBs. RG3, Gabbert, Bradford, Locker, Ponder, Sanchez, Freeman, JaMarcus Hustle, Brady Quinn, Young (and you know a few of you wanted him) Lienart... that list is getting long.

I think the better way to build the team is to build a team with a core of players that allow a young "good" QB to be successful. I think we've got a lot of pieces in place. Sure we have some needs along the Oline, we're going to need some youth at WR and RB but overall this is a team that if they get average play out of the QB should win 10 games. Look at the list of QBs in the league today:

Brees,
Ryan,
Luck,
Roethlisberger,
Stafford,
Eli,
Peyton,
Brady,
Rivers,
Cutler,
Flacco,
Rodgers,
Dalton,
Kaepernick,
Smith,
Wilson,
Newton,
Romo,
Palmer

That's 19 QBs. I think any of those 19 could get us to the playoffs and most of them could take us past the first or second round. There are a lot of teams that could get a top flight QB and wouldn't be able to do anything with him. The question here is can Mallet (or Hoyer, I guess) be that guy. Can he be essentially a top 20 QB? I think we saw yesterday that if Hoyer is what he was yesterday (and I don't see any reason to believe that he isn't anything but that) then we can't win. If Mallet can be what he was yesterday, this team is going to win some games. Probably still has a shot to win 10 games.

That's it. That's the truth. No sunshine pumping, no gloom and doom, your hopes rest on the shoulders of the QB. If you want to piss and moan about it, so be it. Were you around in the 09-10 years? Anyone remember having a QB throw for 4k yards and not be able to win a game because the defense was historically bad? Year after year... We're not there.

Is everything rosy? Hell no. Am I happy we lost? Obviously not. Is the season lost? Not even close. Is it a sure thing? Nope. Why not take a wait and see approach? Lets see where we're at at the quarter mark of the season instead of trying to act as if we can really tell from week 1.



Mike
Click to expand...

All of that reading and here's what I got out of this post.

Luck hasn't carried his team? Really

I don't need a qtr of the season to know that Hoyer is a turnover waiting to happen and that the Texans will do well to win 6 games with him as the starting QB. I mean he spotted a good Chiefs team 14 pts with the turnovers. That's the #1 receipe for costing your team a game and we've seen Hoyers act before with the Browns. Oh well atleast Hoyer knows the offense.
 
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