BADBOY'S most recent & still changing...

[badboy]

Man, the Texans really impressed me with their off season with only 'nonmove' that I wanted was Kendrik Lewis not coming back. I know he wanted to start but I thought he would be better off here as Texans often use 3 safeties. I think Ballentine takes leap forward this season and Swearinger better get it together or will lose his starter role. Couple of things first, I spilled a bit of water on laptop & it dried but some keys not working or doing silly..a comma types '[' and backspace results in a 'k'. I catch some but please overlook and don't go Nazi on me.

Also I will not be listing draftscout rankings on my players as I usually do or giving much info or stats. If necessary, I will do that when answering any comments or questions.

1.16 WR Jalen Strong: barring a hoped for trade down, he or Brown only ones I want #16. I changed from Brown as I bring a DE in round 4. Best WR left.

2. 51 WR/slot: Tony Lippett a true slot but not a return guy (I get that later and cheaper). Probably a reach this high but allows me to get what I want in filling the needs and close to BPA. WR goes from Nuk only to a strength. Short 3 I like but these three get me to PO. If Shorts, Posey and Martin earn a roster spot..so be it but tired of waiting. Still stunned D Johnson got million let alone returned.

3. 82 CB Eric Rowe: IMO could be best corner coming out after one season of Texans coaching and deepens the gene pool after Joseph leaves.

4.115 DE Henry Anderson: I've watched this guy for over a year and mocked him this spot when he was rated a 6th by ESPN. Recently saw John Harris say he rated Anderson higher than most but 'the guy was never stopped by OTs' in after regular season events. So I have this guy rated equal to Malcom but the latter can play NT.

5.152 LB Jake Ryan: I seem to be the only recognizing this kid except an eval from John Harris who seems to agree. Ryan was an OLB that in 2013 was blowing up the opposition until he got hurt. Harris compared him to Vonn Miller. I am not saying that but Ryan looked real good. In 2014 returning in less than 6 months IIRC Ryan was moved to MLB where he ruled. This kid has motor with only one speed 'attack'. He should be a 2-3rd rounder.

5. 174 S/Cb Adrian Amos: I mocked since beginning of season but kept taking Prewitt in 2nd. Raheem Moore resolved that but if Amos still around he could be a steal. I am starting to see others moving him up boards. Amos can & has played both spots very well. Teams disagree over where he is best. I have him at S.

6.194 OT/OG Andrew Donnal: BPA and fills need of restocking if Clabo goes as I hope.

6.211 RB John Crockett: I just cannot ignore this guy but seems most can.

6.216 Return/WR Kaelin Clay: TBH never heard of him until recently but when I decided to bypass Tre McBride and Lockett in third, I went researching and was stunned at film. Here are stats :

5'10 193 KR= 22/548 @ 25 avg 3 TDs, PR = 23/346 @ 15 avg 1 TD; WR 43/523 @ 12.16 avg 4 TDs. Not a burner but eats up yards and has a higher gear when needed. Very smart runner that sees the field and adjusts to trajectory of would be tacklers.

7.235 OLB: Edmond Robinson. Who? wait and see this guy will grow into his legs and arms. 6'3 245 (can add bulk if needed) 4.61 (wow) arms 34, hands 10 1/4, was one of only two small school (Newberry) LBs invited to combine and was top 10 of all LBs in all drills. May have highest ceiling of any player

I have Simon starting until Clowney ready. Do not count out Tarpinian or a move by Mercilus if JD returns. We might prefer two OLB that can get to QB rather than a Reed type that can only occasionally slow a run.

 

[JB]

Nice mock! Good job

Only questions I have is I don't know that Lippett will be best WR available for us at 51 and I'm not sure that Rowe makes it to 82. He seems to be climbing fast.

 

[Number19]

Man, the Texans really impressed me with their off season with only 'nonmove' that I wanted was Kendrik Lewis not coming back. I know he wanted to start but I thought he would be better off here as Texans often use 3 safeties. I think Ballentine takes leap forward this season and Swearinger better get it together or will lose his starter role. Couple of things first, I spilled a bit of water on laptop & it dried but some keys not working or doing silly..a comma types '[' and backspace results in a 'k'. I catch some but please overlook and don't go Nazi on me.

Also I will not be listing draftscout rankings on my players as I usually do or giving much info or stats. If necessary, I will do that when answering any comments or questions.

1.16 WR Jalen Strong: barring a hoped for trade down, he or Brown only ones I want #16. I changed from Brown as I bring a DE in round 4. Best WR left.

2. 51 WR/slot: Tony Lippett a true slot but not a return guy (I get that later and cheaper). Probably a reach this high but allows me to get what I want in filling the needs and close to BPA. WR goes from Nuk only to a strength. Short 3 I like but these three get me to PO. If Shorts, Posey and Martin earn a roster spot..so be it but tired of waiting. Still stunned D Johnson got million let alone returned.

3. 82 CB Eric Rowe: IMO could be best corner coming out after one season of Texans coaching and deepens the gene pool after Joseph leaves.

4.115 DE Henry Anderson: I've watched this guy for over a year and mocked him this spot when he was rated a 6th by ESPN. Recently saw John Harris say he rated Anderson higher than most but 'the guy was never stopped by OTs' in after regular season events. So I have this guy rated equal to Malcom but the latter can play NT.

5.152 LB Jake Ryan: I seem to be the only recognizing this kid except an eval from John Harris who seems to agree. Ryan was an OLB that in 2013 was blowing up the opposition until he got hurt. Harris compared him to Vonn Miller. I am not saying that but Ryan looked real good. In 2014 returning in less than 6 months IIRC Ryan was moved to MLB where he ruled. This kid has motor with only one speed 'attack'. He should be a 2-3rd rounder.

5. 174 S/Cb Adrian Amos: I mocked since beginning of season but kept taking Prewitt in 2nd. Raheem Moore resolved that but if Amos still around he could be a steal. I am starting to see others moving him up boards. Amos can & has played both spots very well. Teams disagree over where he is best. I have him at S.

6.194 OT/OG Andrew Donnal: BPA and fills need of restocking if Clabo goes as I hope.

6.211 RB John Crockett: I just cannot ignore this guy but seems most can.

6.216 Return/WR Kaelin Clay: TBH never heard of him until recently but when I decided to bypass Tre McBride and Lockett in third, I went researching and was stunned at film. Here are stats :

5'10 193 KR= 22/548 @ 25 avg 3 TDs, PR = 23/346 @ 15 avg 1 TD; WR 43/523 @ 12.16 avg 4 TDs. Not a burner but eats up yards and has a higher gear when needed. Very smart runner that sees the field and adjusts to trajectory of would be tacklers.

7.235 OLB: Edmond Robinson. Who? wait and see this guy will grow into his legs and arms. 6'3 245 (can add bulk if needed) 4.61 (wow) arms 34, hands 10 1/4, was one of only two small school (Newberry) LBs invited to combine and was top 10 of all LBs in all drills. May have highest ceiling of any player

I have Simon starting until Clowney ready. Do not count out Tarpinian or a move by Mercilus if JD returns. We might prefer two OLB that can get to QB rather than a Reed type that can only occasionally slow a run.

A thumbs up on your selections. Of course I have to like Strong, Crockett and Robinson - I have them in my second, most current, mock. I like Rowe in the third. I rejected Ryan because he's already had an ACL injury and I'm trying to stay away from old, serious, injury histories. You didn't address OC, but we only have so many picks. We'd have to address this in free agency before camp starts. The one I have the most problem with is Anderson, since I don't consider this a need at this point with Pagan as a backup. But Crick is a free agent next year so this may make sense. He would likely beat out Keith Browner for a roster spot as Watt's backup.

Good work.

 

[badboy]

Nice mock! Good job

Only questions I have is I don't know that Lippett will be best WR available for us at 51 and I'm not sure that Rowe makes it to 82. He seems to be climbing fast.

First apologies for posting in wrong thread, I was so focused on getting the keyboard errors fixed I did not notice the wrong forum. Thanks to whomever moved it], I do know better.

I have watched Lippett all season and then many hours of film since. The kid is good and initially moved me away from Perriman, Coates, Green and others. He does not seem to play with 4.4 speed but just sucks in the ball. I think he really helped Connor Cook by coming back to rescue him. He excels at slants/posts/incuts and work the DB like a master. He was evaluated by ESPN as 'one of the most improved players (not just WR)in the country. He has the radar eye of a hungry raptor and finds ball quickly adjusting his path on the fly. He is actually 6'2 5/8s. He has been reviewed as a corner by some and one scout said he had 'ball hawk awareness'.

Following the workout, Michigan State head coach Mark Dantonio had this to say about his versatile pass-catcher. "I heard one scout say [Lippett] has hawk awareness. He can pick the ball up at the blink of an eye and determine where it's going and pick it. I really think today opened a lot of people's eyes." - Rob Rang, NFLDraftScout.com

so yes I like him.

You could be right on Rowe but I am sticking to #82 as we don't have to have a CB and would be BPA.

 

[thunderkyss]

Did we ever use Tarpinian on the outside? I thought he, Tuggle, Dent, & Mohammad all played inside.

Anyway. CB. I think we all like Kj, Jjo, Bouye, & Morris..... leaving Rolle & Hal

I know Rolle's been around the league for a while, but we just drafted Hal. 7th round maybe, but are we ready to shuck him already?

I'm all for strengthening a strength, but with the CBs you're targeting, it looks like we're strengthening depth at a position of strength.

 

[JB]

I have watched Lippett all season and then many hours of film since. The kid is good and initially moved me away from Perriman, Coates, Green and others. He does not seem to play with 4.4 speed but just sucks in the ball. I think he really helped Connor Cook by coming back to rescue him. He excels at slants/posts/incuts and work the DB like a master. He was evaluated by ESPN as 'one of the most improved players (not just WR)in the country. He has the radar eye of a hungry raptor and finds ball quickly adjusting his path on the fly. He is actually 6'2 5/8s. He has been reviewed as a corner by some and one scout said he had 'ball hawk awareness'.
so yes I like him.

I get that you like him, but in my opinion 2nd is too high for him. Didn't he run a 4.61?

I think we can do better in round 2. I want to either had a quick slot guy or someone like Conley in the 3rd or 4th

 

[badboy]

A thumbs up on your selections. Of course I have to like Strong, Crockett and Robinson - I have them in my second, most current, mock. I like Rowe in the third. I rejected Ryan because he's already had an ACL injury and I'm trying to stay away from old, serious, injury histories. You didn't address OC, but we only have so many picks. We'd have to address this in free agency before camp starts. The one I have the most problem with is Anderson, since I don't consider this a need at this point with Pagan as a backup. But Crick is a free agent next year so this may make sense. He would likely beat out Keith Browner for a roster spot as Watt's backup.

Good work.

thanks for your comments. Ryan's injury as you said is old and he had great season after recovering in a very quick time period. i could not find one negative iota about his health so am going to go with that although I get your concerns. OC: I am not too concerned and OBrien has said he is seeking depth for Oline so he probably bring in a vet. Also sticking to my trade down with Dallas hope], we get Erving and maybe their second which makes me drool.

You answered your own question about Anderson and the kid is just good. I like Pagan but want to see a boost from him but we can carry Crick/Watt/Pagan and Anderson. If Crick explodes he could resign but prob to another team for $

 

[JB]

The rest of your quote about Lippett

03/22/2015 - Five Takeaways from this week's Pro Day workouts: Michigan State much more than "just" Trae Waynes...Similarly, wideout Tony Lippett enjoyed a strong performance during positional drills, showing off impressive fluidity for his 6-foot-2 (and 5/8"), 191 frame and also catching the ball well. Lippett is a solid second-tier receiver prospect but some clubs see him projecting even better at cornerback, where he played occasionally for the Spartans. Following the workout, Michigan State head coach Mark Dantonio had this to say about his versatile pass-catcher. "I heard one scout say [Lippett] has hawk awareness. He can pick the ball up at the blink of an eye and determine where it's going and pick it. I really think today opened a lot of people's eyes." - Rob Rang, NFLDraftScout.com

 

[badboy]

Did we ever use Tarpinian on the outside? I thought he, Tuggle, Dent, & Mohammad all played inside.

Anyway. CB. I think we all like Kj, Jjo, Bouye, & Morris..... leaving Rolle & Hal

I know Rolle's been around the league for a while, but we just drafted Hal. 7th round maybe, but are we ready to shuck him already?

I'm all for strengthening a strength, but with the CBs you're targeting, it looks like we're strengthening depth at a position of strength.

definitely understand on corners as I love what we have but as said Rowe is BPA and I see Joseph gone. I also could see Hal a big guy at safety and Bouye did have surgery on shoulder.

On LB], Dent was a little known commodity who did well. Tarp came from a history of injuries and had to prove he was healthy and IIRC did not get many snaps inside due to Mohamed's play. I have advocated moving
M to OLB also if Clowney can't return timely.

 

[infantrycak]

Anyway. CB. I think we all like Kj, Jjo, Bouye, & Morris..... leaving Rolle & Hal

I know Rolle's been around the league for a while, but we just drafted Hal. 7th round maybe, but are we ready to shuck him already?

I thought Rolle played better than Bouye and Morris both.

I get that you like him, but in my opinion 2nd is too high for him. Didn't he run a 4.61?

I think we can do better in round 2. I want to either had a quick slot guy or someone like Conley in the 3rd or 4th

The rest of your quote about Lippett

4.57 at his pro day, don't know about combine.

He doesn't look special even in college to me as a WR but the one thing that stood out goes to the bold comment - he is good at getting the ball in traffic. It would be real dangerous to throw jump/contested balls around him ... playing CB. 2nd seem high.

 

[badboy]

I get that you like him, but in my opinion 2nd is too high for him. Didn't he run a 4.61?

I think we can do better in round 2. I want to either had a quick slot guy or someone like Conley in the 3rd or 4th

Yep but his 4.61 was combine and I heard he had a pull muscle. The 4.4 is solid from Pro day and he also ran a 4.45. As other players have said they were up until midnight and were awakened at 5 am to run at combine.

How quick a slot do you want? Lippett is much better routes and hands than Lockett or my guy McBride. Lockett looks like a cheerleader can break him into pieces even at his increased weight which i doubt he maintains. Conley was a secret until OB visited and he might be there in 3-4th but do you risk it? I decided not to. Why do you think Lippett not worth 51? That is what I kept asking myself and don't just refer to others ranking; study his film then answer.

 

[badboy]

The rest of your quote about Lippett

Yep I agree with your bold but trying to eliminate some of my typing on a partially fried computer. He is a second tier WR but so is Strong.

 

[infantrycak]

Yep but his 4.61 was combine and I heard he had a pull muscle. The 4.4 is solid from Pro day and he also ran a 4.45. As other players have said they were up until midnight and were awakened at 5 am to run at combine.

Where are you seeing that? From nfl.com "PRO DAY RESULTS 40-yard dash: 4.59 and 4.57 seconds."

How quick a slot do you want?

Well are we talking quick or fast? In either case Lippett doesn't look particularly either. Edelman/Welker are/were quick as hell.

Why do you think Lippett not worth 51? That is what I kept asking myself and don't just refer to others ranking; study his film then answer.

I don't see a WR who's even blowing away college competition.

 

[JB]

Why do you think Lippett not worth 51? .

Even CBS that you seem to put a lot of stock into has him rated as the 16th best wr going in the 3-4 range. I haven't seen anything from him that stands out and separates him from the pack and says mid 2nd. Sorry

 

[badboy]

more input on Lippett (not trying to sell just support) and I agree 2nd is high but better than other Wr options and allow me to take BPA in 3rd and get a great DE option in 4th.

After starting five games at cornerback in 2011 -- during which he broke up five passes and made 18 tackles -- Lippett said he can watch an opposing cornerback approach the line of scrimmage and make a good guess about what routes he hopes to take away based on his alignment.

“It helped me just know how a corner thinks and what he tries to eliminate,” Lippett said. “Before the snap, what he’s already eliminated in his head by alignment or leverage or anything like that. It just kind of helps me out.”

And while being a former quarterback -- Lippett played the position in high school before playing it on Michigan State’s scout team in 2010 -- doesn’t help as much as being a former cornerback, it does provide him with a better overall understanding of defenses.

“It helps in some phases as far as reading defenses and knowing that if somebody blitzes or something like that then somebody has to replace

http://www.mlive.com/spartans/index.ssf/2014/09/time_at_cornerback_quarterback.html

On top of his greater understanding of the game and of cornerbacks, Lippett said he also has more confidence and is more aggressive. He added five pounds of muscle to his upper body in the offseason and was timed at a 4.4 40-yard dash in the spring.

same link

short video comment from coach http://www.lansingstatejournal.com/...ichigan-state-spartans-tony-lippett/16570367/

 

[infantrycak]

more input on Lippett (not trying to sell just support) and I agree 2nd is high but better than other Wr options and allow me to take BPA in 3rd and get a great DE option in 4th.

What WRs are you projecting gone when 51 hits?

 

[steelbtexan]

I get that you like him, but in my opinion 2nd is too high for him. Didn't he run a 4.61?

I think we can do better in round 2. I want to either had a quick slot guy or someone like Conley in the 3rd or 4th

^^^^
This

I like McBride in the 3rd more than I like Lippett in the 3rd. 2nd Rrd is optimistic for Lippett. But hey if you want him I'm sure he will be there.

BTW, I like Rowe in the 2nd but would rather have a Brooks Reed replacement in the 2nd. Nate Orchard/Shaq Thompson type. Thompson is the type of versatile guy that would be great in this defense. Deon Buchanon like the Cards use the hybrid S/in the box LB that Quin used to play.

 

[badboy]

What WRs are you projecting gone when 51 hits?

Cooper;White; Parker; Strong and DG-B. I have Lippett tied with Devin Smith but like Lippett better. I could be wrong on Perriman but think he needs longer to develop.

I say again Lippett might be had later but I don't want to lose him.

 

[infantrycak]

I could be wrong on Perriman but think he needs longer to develop.

Who do you think will be the better WR in year 4 or 5?

 

[steelbtexan]

Who do you think will be the better WR in year 4 or 5?

Give me Perriman and I'm not a Perriman fan. But you cant coach up 4.22.

 

[JB]

Who do you think will be the better WR in year 4 or 5?

Give me Perriman and I'm not a Perriman fan. But you cant coach up 4.22.

4 or 5 years down the road Periman won't be running 4.2, but looking 4 or 5 years down the road he might be best in class

 

[infantrycak]

Give me Perriman and I'm not a Perriman fan. But you cant coach up 4.22.

And you know I am not a speed obsessed person like you but I'd easily take Perriman first. I see nothing except traffic hands to differentiate this guy. 4th round or down, OK.

Edit: and folks forget these distinctions and history, AJ was a long striding crude route running WR who ran an unofficial 4.27 coming out of college. He twice went up in the "fastest man in the nfl" competition and came in 2nd at 40 and would have won at 100.

All of which goes to AJ was raw as hell and learned routes to become one of the best. His slow is faster than some folks' starting point (Lippett) but you have to look at the dedication too.

I'm going to repeat one poi.t for emphasis - AJ's slow at 34 is what some of y'all are finding acceptable at 23.

 

[steelbtexan]

4 or 5 years down the road Periman won't be running 4.2, but looking 4 or 5 years down the road he might be best in class

Hopefully he will be running a 4.4 and the complete route tree.

 

[badboy]

Even CBS that you seem to put a lot of stock into has him rated as the 16th best wr going in the 3-4 range. I haven't seen anything from him that stands out and separates him from the pack and says mid 2nd. Sorry

That is one of several sources I use because they one of few that do a ranking system for all players including some small schools with info to support even if they don't update lower rounds often. I am actually moving him up only one full round over that. Why is that shocking? I had Tre McBride at #82 long time as he can slot and return and Stephone Anthony # 51 which continues to intrigue me. I imagine that Rowe will start climbing and eliminate him for me; as I said earlier a CB is not needed but he is going to be very good.

 

[badboy]

^^^^
This

I like McBride in the 3rd more than I like Lippett in the 3rd. 2nd Rrd is optimistic for Lippett. But hey if you want him I'm sure he will be there.

BTW, I like Rowe in the 2nd but would rather have a Brooks Reed replacement in the 2nd. Nate Orchard/Shaq Thompson type. Thompson is the type of versatile guy that would be great in this defense. Deon Buchanon like the Cards use the hybrid S/in the box LB that Quin used to play.

I just don't see an OLB in second I want. Did plug Hunter in for about a week but he is too much a project for me and we don't do well drafting OLBs.

 

[JB]

And you know I am not a speed obsessed person like you but I'd easily take Perriman first. I see nothing except traffic hands to differentiate this guy. 4th round or down, OK.

Edit: and folks forget these distinctions and history, AJ was a long striding crude route running WR who ran an unofficial 4.27 coming out of college. He twice went up in the "fastest man in the nfl" competition and came in 2nd at 40 and would have won at 100.

All of which goes to AJ was raw as hell and learned routes to become one of the best. His slow is faster than some folks' starting point (Lippett) but you have to look at the dedication too.

That's what it boils down to. You have to get the guy that not only has the tools, but has the love of the game, the will to win and the heart to put it all on the line every play. Look at JJ

 

[JB]

That is one of several sources I use because they one of few that do a ranking system for all players including some small schools with info to support even if they don't update lower rounds often. I am actually moving him up only one full round over that. Why is that shocking? I had Tre McBride at #82 long time as he can slot and return and Stephone Anthony # 51 which continues to intrigue me. I imagine that Rowe will start climbing and eliminate him for me; as I said earlier a CB is not needed but he is going to be very good.

I have no problem with the player, just where selected. I think there will be too many other quality players with a higher grade to reach for a deep position. And I doubt he would be my highest rated at that position for that selection. Just my opinion, you have yours

 

[badboy]

Who do you think will be the better WR in year 4 or 5?

Very good question and I just cannot project Perriman that far ahead. If he improves his understanding of coverage he could be very good. I just want less risk at this position.


I watched Lippett a lot and he just goes and gets the ball with DBs all over him. In that he reminds me of AJ.

 

[steelbtexan]

Give me 4.48 Shipley with great hands and routes in the 6th over 4.49 Lippett great hands/routes in the 2nd. IMHO Although I do think Lippett is a 5-7 yr player in the NFL.

 

[Lucky]

First, I like this draft as a whole. It consists of good college football players who have produced. It's important for the Texans to get some immediate production out of this class. I would never criticize going production over measurables. And Strong has both, with a ton of upside.

Next, I think some are focusing too much on where the player is taken. Switch Lippett and Rowes's draft position and most wouldn't blink. Or Lippett and Anderson's. I'm just looking at the overall group and what it would provide to the Texans.

I look at the edge rushers/3-4 OLB prospects in the class, and continue to come away unimpressed after the initial 4-5 guys. Either they have the measurables, but lack the production. Or produce, but seem to be missing the quickness or strength to project to the NFL. Maybe the best thing is to take a late round flyer (as you have) and try to coach the guy up.

6.216 Return/WR Kaelin Clay: TBH never heard of him until recently but when I decided to bypass Tre McBride and Lockett in third, I went researching and was stunned at film. Here are stats :

5'10 193 KR= 22/548 @ 25 avg 3 TDs, PR = 23/346 @ 15 avg 1 TD; WR 43/523 @ 12.16 avg 4 TDs. Not a burner but eats up yards and has a higher gear when needed. Very smart runner that sees the field and adjusts to trajectory of would be tacklers.

I was looking at Clay just yesterday, as O'Brien mentioned on the NFL Network that he was looking to improve the return game. I hope that's not just lip service, as we had with Kubiak. I don't think Clay could make the team as a receiver, now. But I think returner is a starting position in of itself. And I'm tired of seeing mediocre backups forced into the role just because they can "play" a position on offense or defense.

 

[badboy]

I have no problem with the player, just where selected. I think there will be too many other quality players with a higher grade to reach for a deep position. And I doubt he would be my highest rated at that position for that selection. Just my opinion, you have yours

Not attacking your opinion but you have not said what WR you like at #51 over Lippett. You said a slot but not whom and Conley in third IIRC.

 

[badboy]

Give me 4.48 Shipley with great hands and routes in the 6th over 4.49 Lippett great hands/routes in the 2nd. IMHO Although I do think Lippett is a 5-7 yr player in the NFL.

Jaxon Shipley? You are kidding right? He will be fortunate to be drafted..at all.

 

[JB]

Not attacking your opinion but you have not said what WR you like at #51 over Lippett. You said a slot but not whom and Conley in third IIRC.

I would take Agholor, Perriman, probably Coates, Smith or maybe even Greene

Though I'm not sure about the last two cuz I haven't seen enough

 

[badboy]

First, I like this draft as a whole. It consists of good college football players who have produced. It's important for the Texans to get some immediate production out of this class. I would never criticize going production over measurables. And Strong has both, with a ton of upside.

Next, I think some are focusing too much on where the player is taken. Switch Lippett and Rowes's draft position and most wouldn't blink. Or Lippett and Anderson's. I'm just looking at the overall group and what it would provide to the Texans.

I look at the edge rushers/3-4 OLB prospects in the class, and continue to come away unimpressed after the initial 4-5 guys. Either they have the measurables, but lack the production. Or produce, but seem to be missing the quickness or strength to project to the NFL. Maybe the best thing is to take a late round flyer (as you have) and try to coach the guy up.



I was looking at Clay just yesterday, as O'Brien mentioned on the NFL Network that he was looking to improve the return game. I hope that's not just lip service, as we had with Kubiak. I don't think Clay could make the team as a receiver, now. But I think returner is a starting position in of itself. And I'm tired of seeing mediocre backups forced into the role just because they can "play" a position on offense or defense.

Wow you just nailed my entire thought process. I also see Clay as Return only but could service as WR if demanded ala Martin.

 

[JB]

First, I like this draft as a whole. It consists of good college football players who have produced. It's important for the Texans to get some immediate production out of this class. I would never criticize going production over measurables. And Strong has both, with a ton of upside.

Next, I think some are focusing too much on where the player is taken. Switch Lippett and Rowes's draft position and most wouldn't blink. Or Lippett and Anderson's. I'm just looking at the overall group and what it would provide to the Texans.

I look at the edge rushers/3-4 OLB prospects in the class, and continue to come away unimpressed after the initial 4-5 guys. Either they have the measurables, but lack the production. Or produce, but seem to be missing the quickness or strength to project to the NFL. Maybe the best thing is to take a late round flyer (as you have) and try to coach the guy up.



I was looking at Clay just yesterday, as O'Brien mentioned on the NFL Network that he was looking to improve the return game. I hope that's not just lip service, as we had with Kubiak. I don't think Clay could make the team as a receiver, now. But I think returner is a starting position in of itself. And I'm tired of seeing mediocre backups forced into the role just because they can "play" a position on offense or defense.

You're probably right

 

[badboy]

I would take Agholor, Perriman, probably Coates, Smith or maybe even Greene

Though I'm not sure about the last two cuz I haven't seen enough

Ok now I have better idea. Next question and being respectful not to offend but have you watched any of these players including Lippett or are you just using stats and eval of others? Still trying to understand why you think as you do about them.

 

[steelbtexan]

First, I like this draft as a whole. It consists of good college football players who have produced. It's important for the Texans to get some immediate production out of this class. I would never criticize going production over measurables. And Strong has both, with a ton of upside.

Next, I think some are focusing too much on where the player is taken. Switch Lippett and Rowes's draft position and most wouldn't blink. Or Lippett and Anderson's. I'm just looking at the overall group and what it would provide to the Texans.

I look at the edge rushers/3-4 OLB prospects in the class, and continue to come away unimpressed after the initial 4-5 guys. Either they have the measurables, but lack the production. Or produce, but seem to be missing the quickness or strength to project to the NFL. Maybe the best thing is to take a late round flyer (as you have) and try to coach the guy up.



I was looking at Clay just yesterday, as O'Brien mentioned on the NFL Network that he was looking to improve the return game. I hope that's not just lip service, as we had with Kubiak. I don't think Clay could make the team as a receiver, now. But I think returner is a starting position in of itself. And I'm tired of seeing mediocre backups forced into the role just because they can "play" a position on offense or defense.

I really like SAM Nate Orchard. He worked out DB drills in his Texans workout and supposedly looked good. Wouldn't it be nice to have a LB that could cover the TE?

Shipley is a very good PR and he would upgrade the slot. I don't put as much value in KR since the rules changes. For instance, If McAfee kicks off 10 times in 2 games there may be 2 kick returns.

 

[Lucky]

I really like SAM Nate Orchard. He worked out DB drills in his Texans workout and supposedly looked good. Wouldn't it be nice to have a LB that could cover the TE?

Orchard was a guy I looked at, because he had the production. I like his relentlessness. But, I don't think he can cover, or has a lot of quickness off the edge. I see him as a 4-3 RDE. I think Orchard would be best served to just add weight and forget playing OLB.

 

[JB]

Ok now I have better idea. Next question and being respectful not to offend but have you watched any of these players including Lippett or are you just using stats and eval of others? Still trying to understand why you think as you do about them.

I haven't watched Lippett enough yet, I have watched plenty of Agholor and Perriman, a bit of others. I'll watch more film yet, it's early. But right now I don't have Lippett with a 2-3 round grade

 

[badboy]

Orchard was a guy I looked at, because he had the production. I like his relentlessness. But, I don't think he can cover, or has a lot of quickness off the edge. I see him as a 4-3 RDE. I think Orchard would be best served to just add weight and forget playing OLB.

my thought on Orchard also. 4-3 guy..now watch them draft him.

 

[badboy]

I haven't watched Lippett enough yet, I have watched plenty of Agholor and Perriman, a bit of others. I'll watch more film yet, it's early. But right now I don't have Lippett with a 2-3 round grade

I have not watched much on Agholor as when I did he seemed to drop or bobble too many passes; I ruled him out early.

 

[JB]

I have not watched much on Agholor as when I did he seemed to drop or bobble too many passes; I ruled him out early.

Fair enough... I still want to watch more on Lippett, as well as Hardy, Dorsett and Ty Montgomery

 

[steelbtexan]

Montgomery is being very underrated. His 40 time lies. He doesn't lose speed wearing pads. A poor mans Percy Harvin. I've got Montgomery/Lippett in the same range and think both could be productive. Rds 3-5

 

[rmartin65]

Man, the Texans really impressed me with their off season with only 'nonmove' that I wanted was Kendrik Lewis not coming back. I know he wanted to start but I thought he would be better off here as Texans often use 3 safeties. I think Ballentine takes leap forward this season and Swearinger better get it together or will lose his starter role. Couple of things first, I spilled a bit of water on laptop & it dried but some keys not working or doing silly..a comma types '[' and backspace results in a 'k'. I catch some but please overlook and don't go Nazi on me.

Also I will not be listing draftscout rankings on my players as I usually do or giving much info or stats. If necessary, I will do that when answering any comments or questions.

1.16 WR Jalen Strong: barring a hoped for trade down, he or Brown only ones I want #16. I changed from Brown as I bring a DE in round 4. Best WR left.

2. 51 WR/slot: Tony Lippett a true slot but not a return guy (I get that later and cheaper). Probably a reach this high but allows me to get what I want in filling the needs and close to BPA. WR goes from Nuk only to a strength. Short 3 I like but these three get me to PO. If Shorts, Posey and Martin earn a roster spot..so be it but tired of waiting. Still stunned D Johnson got million let alone returned.

3. 82 CB Eric Rowe: IMO could be best corner coming out after one season of Texans coaching and deepens the gene pool after Joseph leaves.

4.115 DE Henry Anderson: I've watched this guy for over a year and mocked him this spot when he was rated a 6th by ESPN. Recently saw John Harris say he rated Anderson higher than most but 'the guy was never stopped by OTs' in after regular season events. So I have this guy rated equal to Malcom but the latter can play NT.

5.152 LB Jake Ryan: I seem to be the only recognizing this kid except an eval from John Harris who seems to agree. Ryan was an OLB that in 2013 was blowing up the opposition until he got hurt. Harris compared him to Vonn Miller. I am not saying that but Ryan looked real good. In 2014 returning in less than 6 months IIRC Ryan was moved to MLB where he ruled. This kid has motor with only one speed 'attack'. He should be a 2-3rd rounder.

5. 174 S/Cb Adrian Amos: I mocked since beginning of season but kept taking Prewitt in 2nd. Raheem Moore resolved that but if Amos still around he could be a steal. I am starting to see others moving him up boards. Amos can & has played both spots very well. Teams disagree over where he is best. I have him at S.

6.194 OT/OG Andrew Donnal: BPA and fills need of restocking if Clabo goes as I hope.

6.211 RB John Crockett: I just cannot ignore this guy but seems most can.

6.216 Return/WR Kaelin Clay: TBH never heard of him until recently but when I decided to bypass Tre McBride and Lockett in third, I went researching and was stunned at film. Here are stats :

5'10 193 KR= 22/548 @ 25 avg 3 TDs, PR = 23/346 @ 15 avg 1 TD; WR 43/523 @ 12.16 avg 4 TDs. Not a burner but eats up yards and has a higher gear when needed. Very smart runner that sees the field and adjusts to trajectory of would be tacklers.

7.235 OLB: Edmond Robinson. Who? wait and see this guy will grow into his legs and arms. 6'3 245 (can add bulk if needed) 4.61 (wow) arms 34, hands 10 1/4, was one of only two small school (Newberry) LBs invited to combine and was top 10 of all LBs in all drills. May have highest ceiling of any player

I have Simon starting until Clowney ready. Do not count out Tarpinian or a move by Mercilus if JD returns. We might prefer two OLB that can get to QB rather than a Reed type that can only occasionally slow a run.

Strong (no pun intended) mock, as one would expect coming from you.

I am glad you like Strong as well. Good player, really goes after the ball.

But while I like Lippett, the second round is just too high in my opinion. He is a 3rd-5th round prospect, since he does not have any particular dominant skill, and did not dominate his competition. I think he has an NFL future, but I fear that it may be as a 4th receiver and reserve corner, as well as as a ST guy.

I like Rowe as well, but this may be late for him. Perhaps switch him and Lippett?

I dont like Anderson though. I see a JAG- good college player, but I dont think he does anything in the pros.

Aside from Amos (who I like), I dont know much about your other picks, but they seem solid, with the exception of taking yet another WR.

 

[badboy]

Strong (no pun intended) mock, as one would expect coming from you.

I am glad you like Strong as well. Good player, really goes after the ball.

But while I like Lippett, the second round is just too high in my opinion. He is a 3rd-5th round prospect, since he does not have any particular dominant skill, and did not dominate his competition. I think he has an NFL future, but I fear that it may be as a 4th receiver and reserve corner, as well as as a ST guy.

I like Rowe as well, but this may be late for him. Perhaps switch him and Lippett?

I dont like Anderson though. I see a JAG- good college player, but I dont think he does anything in the pros.

Aside from Amos (who I like), I dont know much about your other picks, but they seem solid, with the exception of taking yet another WR.

Thanks 65], I can see switching Rowe and Lippett but really want a very good slot and concern Lippett gone by 83. I am going to get some sleep then start researching Tre McBride again. Doesn't have size I want but speed and returns are great.

 

[mussop]

Not a fan of taking two WRs with top two picks. JMO! Have to ask, if you're going slot in the second round why not draft one with return abilities?

 

[badboy]

Not a fan of taking two WRs with top two picks. JMO! Have to ask, if you're going slot in the second round why not draft one with return abilities?

Actually had WR then ILB Anthony then McBride in 3rd as he can do it all. Lockett is intriguing and overwhelmed in college but he is so frail..this is a draft I don't want to risk a 1-3 rounder on. Then I discovered Clay and went wow! As Lucky said, I don't see him yet at WR but he is extremely good returning everything. I like Lippett after watching him amaze me all season and prefer him over most in his ranking level. If I knew I could get Conley in 4th, I would pass on Strong.

To answer your question no slot is better than Lippett with his size and a KR/PR
in 6th eliminates both Martin and Manning. If you are just looking at Lippett's stats and not all of his film, you are not going to understand the player. If you are able to watch entire games; Lippett made Cook & other receivers look better. He uses his knowledge of the game and field to mke others successful and that is what I want in a WR.

 

[mussop]

Actually had WR then ILB Anthony then McBride in 3rd as he can do it all. Lockett is intriguing and overwhelmed in college but he is so frail..this is a draft I don't want to risk a 1-3 rounder on. Then I discovered Clay and went wow! As Lucky said, I don't see him yet at WR but he is extremely good returning everything. I like Lippett after watching him amaze me all season and prefer him over most in his ranking level. If I knew I could get Conley in 4th, I would pass on Strong.

To answer your question no slot is better than Lippett with his size and a KR/PR
in 6th eliminates both Martin and Manning. If you are just looking at Lippett's stats and not all of his film, you are not going to understand the player. If you are able to watch entire games; Lippett made Cook & other receivers look better. He uses his knowledge of the game and field to mke others successful and that is what I want in a WR.

Tony Lippet michigan st., Rashad Greene Florida st, Tyler Lockett Kansas st all look the part and all are good returners to boot.

3.) I'm with you here big time. I thinking the 3rd round is a good place to find our Wes Welker. Love Greene, Lockett, Lippet, Crowder and Hardy. I'm hoping for a starting slot WR hopefully with return abilities out of this draft. If I go this early he will have to have return abilities. Not worried about speed as much as a guy with really good hands that has the ability to get open quickly.

I also mocked Lockett in the 5th. I love him as a slot WR. You forgot to mention he is also a very good punt returner. His talent is better than a 5th but I'm hoping his small frame will drop him there.

Also like Lippet a lot. Lippet, Lockett, Hardy and Greene are all guys I would love to see replace our slot WR.

I know all about him.

 

[badboy]

I know all about him.

The reason I asked is IIRC he never returned a punt or KO. Not saying he cannot just did not.

http://www.msuspartans.com/sports/m-footbl/mtt/tony_lippett_716692.html

http://www.cfbstats.com/2014/player/416/1032668/index.html

 

[Blake]

I know all about him.

What is his favorite candy?