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What's your plan for QB next season?

TexansSeminole said:
Oh, he throws downfield. I'm not saying he only throws short, but it's a great percentage of what Tech does. People citing completion percentage need to check the tape, most throws are within a second or MAYBE two of the snap.

You see great arm talent. He can flick his wrist and make Aaron Rodgers throws, seriously, I give him that. You see some of these throws and they are wow impressive. I just don't see structure and I see a lot of warts that aren't on coaching.

Agree to disagree. When I see a guy that plays crap defense and shies away from throwing in tough situations, I'm afraid of that. If I thought it was a coachable issue, I'd be all for taking him 1st round. Probably would trade up for him. But there is a reason he isn't the top guy, because he has the top arm, no questions asked. And that's in a poor QB class. The top guy has one year under his belt.
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I think we'd all agree he has some warts .... that's why he's not going #1 overall.

Thing is , this team is picking #25 .... and the three prospects rated higher are more likely than not long gone.

Mahomes is the best Quarterback you have the opportunity to draft at #25 and because of that ability to make those Aaron Rodgers type throws with regularity , he has the most upside of the entire class.

If you can polish those warts you just solved your QB problems for the next decade or more. If he flops , he only cost you a draft pick .... not multiple years of cap issues.


What do we have to lose .... other than a draft choice. We've seen what a really solid team can accomplish with poor to mediocre quarterbacks the last 3 seasons and its not the desired result. Must find a solution at Quarterback to reach those desired results - :trophy:
 
If his issues are fixable and his work ethic/personality is on point, he has a WAY higher ceiling than the rest of the crop. I've no issue saying that.

I don't think Watson is long gone. He may require a slight trade up, or not, but the guy shows poise and he's beaten some damn good teams. What's the best defense that Mahomes has beaten?

Mahomes has shown some ability, but it's about consistency. It's about doing it time after time against good competition. It proves nothing to point to a couple throws here or there. When you look at his overall tendencies, they are poor.
 
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TexansSeminole said:
I don't really need to provide the links. They are there to be seen by anyone who chooses. When there is pressure he either evades and throws a prayer, throws off his back foot and throws a prayer, or throws it away. It doesn't help either that his entire schedule is that of teams that are terrible at defense. Did he play any team that had a top 20 defense? How many teams that have a top 50 defense? I'll answer it, zero in the top 50.

Tech was all about short quick stuff. They threw quick slants or quick tosses and relied on RAC 70+% of the time.
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Tech did have a lot of RAC. That is true. New England and the Falcons were 2nd and 3rd in RAC this past year.

https://www.sportingcharts.com/nfl/stats/team-yards-after-catch-statistics/2016/

A lot of the throws they make are short to intermediate passes, but placement and timing helps a lot with RAC. The thing about the deep ball is being able to hit it when you need to.

In regards to top 50 defenses, that doesn't mean a lot. Look at some of the schools on that list. A lot of that depends on who you play. There's some bad teams there that played other bad teams.

And there's some good qbs in the NFL now that didn't play top 50 defenses in college.

And the part about what he does when there's pressure is misleading because it's not all he does. There are plenty instances of him throwing the ball away or taking sacks to live another play.

My phone is about to die but when I get a chance I'll post the links because I just really want to go through it and see what you guys are seeing.
 
I'm not big on the chaos quarterbacks, nor 'high ceiling/low floor' potentials. The one I'm leaning towards is Peterman. I'd rather have Chad Pennington than Jamarcus Russell. Give me a smart, accurate leader. Arm is a lot less of a qualifier than it used to be. The only cannon I'd truly be interested in is Matthew Stafford and that's because ... dang thing is inhuman.
 
Scooter said:
I'm not big on the chaos quarterbacks, nogr 'high ceiling/low floor' potentials. The one I'm leaning towards is Peterman. I'd rather have Chad Pennington than Jamarcus Russell. Give me a smart, accurate leader. Arm is a lot less of a qualifier than it used to be. The only cannon I'd truly be interested in is Matthew Stafford and that's because ... dang thing is inhuman.
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We've been seeing 'low ceiling/low floor' for so long that that would be a nice improvement.

And Pennigton in OB's offense would be ideal. Heck, healthy Pennington or good Schaub would have been ideal
 
Corrosion said:
Yeah , his mechanics are sloppy .... he reminds me of Johnny Football in that regard , really loose with the ball in the pocket and out.

But damnit man , Kizer (My personal favorite of this group) , Trubisky (flawless mechanics) and Watson (Don't Want) .... are all likely to be long gone by the time the Texans are on the clock .... Mahomes is the next best guy and might be the best athlete and have the highest upside of them all.

If you can clean up his mechanics you have a guy who has all the tools .... Size , big arm , great athleticism , doesn't lock onto receivers , reads a defense pre and post snap , good pocket presence and a solid internal clock , knowing when to let it fly or move around.

The only knocks on the guy are mechanics that need to be cleaned up and coming from that spread system.

If he's on the board at 1:25 I'm picking the guy .... Romo or no Romo.
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The problem with sloppy mechanics is that it can be corrected but it also is most likely to be reverted to in times of pressure. That was Os' biggest issue last season and one of the reasons I like Savage as much as I do. Savage has naturally good mechanics and that allows him to stay in the pocket and deliver a good pass (well, good mechanics and a lack of mobility if we're being honest about it. HA!) while Os has less than good natural mechanics and a release that can be timed with a sun dial.

I'm being more open minded to spread QB's since I dogged Mariota coming out of college. Oops. It still does limit a QB to easy reads.
 
Corrosion said:
I think we'd all agree he has some warts .... that's why he's not going #1 overall.

Thing is , this team is picking #25 .... and the three prospects rated higher are more likely than not long gone.

Mahomes is the best Quarterback you have the opportunity to draft at #25 and because of that ability to make those Aaron Rodgers type throws with regularity , he has the most upside of the entire class.

If you can polish those warts you just solved your QB problems for the next decade or more. If he flops , he only cost you a draft pick .... not multiple years of cap issues.


What do we have to lose .... other than a draft choice. We've seen what a really solid team can accomplish with poor to mediocre quarterbacks the last 3 seasons and its not the desired result. Must find a solution at Quarterback to reach those desired results - :trophy:
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Do you reach for the 4th or 5 rated QB that has a round 2-3 slot on your board if the 2nd rated player, at a position of need, is there at 1.25? I'd gamble on the QB being there in the 2nd or later.
 
TexansSeminole said:
I don't think Watson is long gone. He may require a slight trade up, or not, but the guy shows poise and he's beaten some damn good teams. What's the best defense that Mahomes has beaten?
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What's the next best talent on Tech's roster that even comes close to comparing to the wealth of talent that Clemson has? I mean, you're aware of what an illegitimate argument that is, no? There are enough nits to pick about Mahomes' play without comparing apples to torque wrenches in his team's accomplishments and Watson's.
 
DocBar said:
The problem with sloppy mechanics is that it can be corrected
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Sorry I know I'm cutting off the rest of your post in order to steal a line as it wasn't intended. But, this is the common thought. 'Coaching can correct these things'.

What coach is going to be correcting these things? Kubiak? Shanahan? Belichick? Harbaugh? WHO??? Wait, the GURU O'Brien with no experience and no staff?

So, how does that change your opinion on our QB prospects?
 
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Scooter said:
Sorry I know I'm cutting off the rest of your post in order to steal a line as it wasn't intended. But, this is the common thought. 'Coaching can correct these things'.

What coach is going to be correcting these things? Kubiak? Shanahan? Belichick? Harbaugh? WHO??? Wait, the GURU O'Brien with no experience and no staff?

So, how does that change your opinion on our QB prospects?
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You're only quoting a part of what I said. I'm on big on any QB in this draft, so it doesn't change my opinion much if at all. Having said that, the only one I'm dead set against is Watson and that's because he threw 30 INT's in two years against college defenses. NFL defenses will be considerably more challenging. That tells me he 1, takes too many risks or 2, he can't read a defense. His QB rating, completion % and yards per attempt went down every year that he played. His TD's went up but his INT's went up as well. More or less the opposite is true for Mahomes.
 
Is drafting former Red Raiders/Cal Qb Davis Webb worthy of a third round pick if available? I don't know much about him but he did well in the Senior Bowl and seems to have some support from draftniks as a late third round pick. Would it be too big of a gamble to pick him in the late third round?
 
I have to admit, I find it humorous when I hear, "We need a QB, and if Mahomes is the one we want, don't pick him at 1-25, wait and pick him at 2-25." :toropalm: Everyone needs to understand that if the Texans value Mahomes, you can bet that other teams value him, as well, and acknowledge that 24 of them will be picking/trading positions in the second round ahead of the Texans. As I recall, that same, FAILED "wait till the next round" logic was applied when the Texans wanted Jimmy G., but decided to wait...then watched the Pats trade up just ahead of the Texans to take him.

QB is just too important. If the Texan "brain trust" really wants a QB and one that they have highly rated is available, they need to draft him when they get the chance. If not, someone else will and the Texans will be back to considering how much money, #1 picks and starting players to part with to trade for that QB later (back to Jimmy G and the failure to take him when they had the chance).
 
OptimisticTexan said:
Maybe Brady is alluding behind the scenes that this season could be his last...allowing him to exit the game on top.
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Certainly can't just up and rule it completely out.

But while Brady's not so much as hinted that, while giving every possible indication the opposite, I'm inclined anyway to believe it not the case.
 
DocBar said:
Do you reach for the 4th or 5 rated QB that has a round 2-3 slot on your board if the 2nd rated player, at a position of need, is there at 1.25? I'd gamble on the QB being there in the 2nd or later.
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What happened the last time they got cute .... Minny snatched Bridgewater and the Pats jumped in front of them to take Jimmy G , both guys going one spot ahead of the Texans .... and we got to watch another season of the QB carousel.

Either you have a quarterback or you don't .... if you don't , you do everything you can to resolve that situation. If that means reaching a half a round (according to draftnics) so be it.


No player is going to affect the winning potential of a franchise greater than a competent quarterback.


No getting cute when he's the last of the top tier QB's available at 25 and Ricky Bob trades back and some other team sneaks in and takes him ahead of you .... leaving us to watch Os piss away opportunities for another season.
 
Mollywhopper said:
What's the next best talent on Tech's roster that even comes close to comparing to the wealth of talent that Clemson has? I mean, you're aware of what an illegitimate argument that is, no? There are enough nits to pick about Mahomes' play without comparing apples to torque wrenches in his team's accomplishments and Watson's.
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It's not a poor argument at all. Team defense overpowers individual talent. Just like a good offensive scheme can overcome a much more talented defense. Remember Boise State? You cannot simply compare individual talent.

Watson had great players and a great scheme and he beat defenses with great scheme and great players. He was regularly playing against top level defenses. His road was much more difficult, the level of play was significantly higher. There is no way that Clemson could have run Tech's offense against their schedule and put up the numbers that Tech did. Nor could Tech play Clemson's schedule and put up the numbers that they did.

Besides, you'd think Tech had some great receivers based on what you see on tape. You watch Tech and these Big 12 corners and safeties can't tackle. They're missing tackles on quick passes to WRs like 70% of the time. Tech throws a 1 yard pass and most likely they are getting a first down plus some. Certainly, you've seen this? But it's not the Tech players, it's just that the defense sucks. They're out of position and/or miss the tackle frequently.

Here's Tech vs Oklahoma State:


Oklahoma State was 2nd in the Big 12.

Look how often Tech players are wide open short and how often they either run for an extra 5+ without getting touched due to defensive scheme or due to missed tackles.

Mahomes made some nice throws. The Tech receivers are open, wide open most plays though and they're getting a ton of RAC.
 
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TexansSeminole said:
It's not a poor argument at all..
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The Tech scheme doesn't fall on Mahomes' shoulders, and frankly none of that makes up for the fact that he was quite obviously lacking in the Mike Williams', Wayne Gallmans', Jordan Leggetts', and Artavis Scotts' that Watson had to work with to do the jobs they did at Clemson.

It's just not a straight comparison to say that Watson had more good wins than Mahomes and that's that. Saying you know for a fact that Mahomes wouldn't have been as successful under center for that Clemson team, or that Watson would've won more at Tech, is just that ... it's just saying.
 
Mollywhopper said:
The Tech scheme doesn't fall on Mahomes' shoulders, and frankly none of that makes up for the fact that he was quite obviously lacking in the Mike Williams', Wayne Gallmans', Jordan Leggetts', and Artavis Scotts' that Watson had to work with to do the jobs they did at Clemson.

It's just not a straight comparison to say that Watson had more good wins than Mahomes and that's that. Saying you know for a fact that Mahomes wouldn't have been as successful under center for that Clemson team, or that Watson would've won more at Tech, is just that ... it's just saying.
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The point was, Tech didn't need those players. Their own receivers were getting open or left open often and they aren't all that good.

You only need to look how the defense is played against these teams to deduce that Clemson would destroy those Big 12 defenses. Tech was throwing all over those teams on mostly short little dinks and having their 3 star guys break tackles or run into wide open zones.

Eight of the league's 10 teams rank No. 77 or lower nationally in total defense as the yards and points come in bunches. Six rank No. 67 or lower in scoring allowed. Four of those — Oklahoma, Kansas, Texas Tech and Texas — all surrender more than 35 points or more per game.

And it could get worse.

Most of those ugly stats were built against non-conference opponents. The league's high-powered offenses are just getting warmed up as only Baylor and Oklahoma State have played more than one conference game.
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Link

Agree to disagree. Can't make the same arguments forever.
 
Scooter said:
Sorry I know I'm cutting off the rest of your post in order to steal a line as it wasn't intended. But, this is the common thought. 'Coaching can correct these things'.

What coach is going to be correcting these things? Kubiak? Shanahan? Belichick? Harbaugh? WHO??? Wait, the GURU O'Brien with no experience and no staff?

So, how does that change your opinion on our QB prospects?
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What....? You have no faith in Sean Ryan or Pat O'Hara? Ryan comes from teaching Eli in NY and O'Hara comes from the Arena Football League.
:)
 
DocBar said:
There has to be a will on both sides, though. What sense of urgency does Cousins have to come here, when he allegedly prefers SF and Baby Shanny? SF has more than enough cap space to do whatever they like.
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He can win in Houston, not so much in San Fran.
 
Mollywhopper said:
The Tech scheme doesn't fall on Mahomes' shoulders, and frankly none of that makes up for the fact that he was quite obviously lacking in the Mike Williams', Wayne Gallmans', Jordan Leggetts', and Artavis Scotts' that Watson had to work with to do the jobs they did at Clemson.

It's just not a straight comparison to say that Watson had more good wins than Mahomes and that's that. Saying you know for a fact that Mahomes wouldn't have been as successful under center for that Clemson team, or that Watson would've won more at Tech, is just that ... it's just saying.
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Fact is that Deshaun Watson went to the National Championship game two years running. He went to a bowl game every year he started.
Where did Mahomes take his team? Did they even finish with a winning record last season?

You say "well he had a better team around him". True. But he has to have something about him to be picked to lead that team every year he was on it.

Give me a guy who has been on the big stage, against top-flight competition, and WON over a guy with just a strong arm in a gimmick system.
 
ObsiWan said:
Fact is that Deshaun Watson went to the National Championship game two years running. He went to a bowl game every year he started.
Where did Mahomes take his team? Did they even finish with a winning record last season?

You say "well he had a better team around him". True. But he has to have something about him to be picked to lead that team every year he was on it.

Give me a guy who has been on the big stage, against top-flight competition, and WON over a guy with just a strong arm in a gimmick system.
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I'm not trying to make a giant argument against Watson here. Just that comparing team accomplishments across the two QB's doesn't take place in a vacuum. Alabama QB's have been winning tons of games against top-flight competition for over a decade. Ok.
 
Bill O'Brien on QB position, coaching: 'You look in the mirror'
Published 3:48 pm, Wednesday, March 1, 2017


INDIANAPOLIS -- Frequently derided as a popular target for criticism, embattled Texans quarterback Brock Osweiler didn't absorb any shots from his coach Wednesday.

Texans coach Bill O'Brien didn't single out the towering $72 million experiment who failed to create any stability under center last season as he threw 15 touchdowns and 19 interceptions and was benched once late in the season.

Instead, O'Brien struck a theme of general improvement being needed in all areas on offense. He extended those shortcomings to the coaching position, taking accountability for what transpired last season.

"I've said it since the end of the season there's a lot of areas of improvement that have to take place," O'Brien said Wednesday at the NFL scouting combine. "The first place you look is the coaching. You look in the mirror. So we're working hard to improve the coaching. I know the players are out there working hard to improve themselves. I'm not going to get into each position on the field. When you look at our offense, there's a lot of areas that need to improve.

"It's not just one position. It's protection. It's run blocking. It's route-running, it's throwing the ball. All those things, it all goes together. It's not just one thing. We're working hard to get it better. That's what the offseason is all about."

O'Brien was noncommittal on any quarterback draft prospects, emphasizing that it's early in the evaluation process. Texans owner Bob McNair said during the Super Bowl that the quarterback play must get better and that he expected Osweiler and Tom Savage to compete for the job and for the team to draft a rookie quarterback to add to the mix.


"Mr. McNair is the boss," O'Brien said. "We're going to do what he wants us to do. We're early in the draft process, especially as it relates to me. I've just really started looking at these guys.

"Those are the first guys I've started studying. How the board is stacked, what we think is best for our team, it's really early for our team right now."
 
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ObsiWan said:
What....? You have no faith in Sean Ryan or Pat O'Hara? Ryan comes from teaching Eli in NY and O'Hara comes from the Arena Football League.
:)
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Sean Ryan was the WR coach, then the QB coach & back to WR coach.

Either they had a need for him at WR or he wasn't a very good QBs coach.

I'm sure there are other possibilities, but I think those are the main ones.
 
I'm a little late on the conversation about Mahomes, but I just had a chance to study film of him for the first time this evening. I may have missed others making this comparison -- so apologies in advance if that is the case, but the player I think he most resembles is Matt Stafford. What made me think of Stafford is how they both very quickly release the ball when they see their man and many times at odd arm angles or their feet aren't set properly. My initial impression of his footwork wasn't as much that he was being lazy as he was being overly confident -- bordering on cocky. It appears to me that he's so confident in his arm that throwing it w/ proper technique bores him -- kind of like receivers making one handed catches when they could have used both hands. So off the back foot it comes out, or across his body or side arm or however he feels like at the moment to showcase his arm.

I googled comparisons to Stafford to see if anyone else was seeing this and found the following article which talks about Staffords footwork/mechanics and how he's evolved over the years. I'm linking the video of the younger Stafford first in case you don't feel like reading through the article to find it. To me, it looks a lot like what many of Mahomes passes look like. Mahomes won't get away with a lot of these 'fancy throws' at the next level and the question mark is if he can play in a more disciplined manner. I see a kid w/ a lightning quick release, huge arm talent and who is overly confident in his arm and it's going to get him in some trouble early in his career -- but I love it. I would be tickled pink if we got what I think is a young Matt Stafford in this years draft.

https://cdn0.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/Rc...ile/7893359/Matthew_Stafford_off_platform.gif

http://www.behindthesteelcurtain.co...ort-patrick-mahomes-ii-the-double-edged-sword
 
xtruroyaltyx said:
I like Keemun as a back up qb to have, but going in with him Savage and two rookies is pretty much flushing the season.

I think you have to at least put forth a solid effort. This group of guys aren't getting any younger.
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What do you consider a solid effort?
 
Scooter said:
Sorry I know I'm cutting off the rest of your post in order to steal a line as it wasn't intended. But, this is the common thought. 'Coaching can correct these things'.

What coach is going to be correcting these things? Kubiak? Shanahan? Belichick? Harbaugh? WHO??? Wait, the GURU O'Brien with no experience and no staff?

So, how does that change your opinion on our QB prospects?
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You're only quoting a part of what I said. I'm on big on any QB in this draft, so it doesn't change my opinion much if at all. Having said that, the only one I'm dead set against is Watson and that's because he threw 30 INT's in two years against college defenses. NFL defenses will be considerably more challenging. That tells me he 1, takes too many risks or 2, he can't read a defense. His QB rating, completion % and yards per attempt went down every year that he played. His TD's went up but his INT's went up as well. More or less the opposite is true for Mahomes.
Corrosion said:
What happened the last time they got cute .... Minny snatched Bridgewater and the Pats jumped in front of them to take Jimmy G , both guys going one spot ahead of the Texans .... and we got to watch another season of the QB carousel.

Either you have a quarterback or you don't .... if you don't , you do everything you can to resolve that situation. If that means reaching a half a round (according to draftnics) so be it.


No player is going to affect the winning potential of a franchise greater than a competent quarterback.


No getting cute when he's the last of the top tier QB's available at 25 and Ricky Bob trades back and some other team sneaks in and takes him ahead of you .... leaving us to watch Os piss away opportunities for another season.
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At QB it's more about how good is your crystal ball. It's all a guess. If the Texans guess Mahomes at 1.25, I wont :firehair: if they do.
 
If it happens in the draft then I'm going with Chad Kelly if he's on the board in RD5. He will be a safe high risk/reward project that represents the best QB available that could sit for a season on the PS while he learns O'Brien's system and grows up. Should be an humbling experience that hopefully takes, since this guy has the tools to be an NFL starting QB. Getting a season with him on the PS will allow the Texans to carry the 3 QB's already under contract for 2017 while giving each of them a chance to play for a future with the Texans. Meanwhile, Kelly has a season to learn as he prepares to join the competition in 2018.
 
xtruroyaltyx said:
Big risk potential big reward.

Go for it.

If not then they are just going to stay on this hamster cycle.
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There are at least two ways to go about it.
You implied that you don't want to throw the season away.
In order to do that, I suggest a veteran in Keenum who already know the system. With another TC, he will be better prepared than Osweiler when he first got here last year.
Keenum also know many players on the team already. His chemistry with Hopkins has always been good.
Keenum has always played better than Osweiler with less help from his team.

One can thoroughly check out Savage's health situation and his progress in TC and even through the pre-season.

In the same time, the rookies are always there to be developed.

Also since you don't have to pay Keenum much (as opposed to Cutler, Romo, or maybe even Glennon), you can use that extra cap space to acquire an OT in FA. There might be enough to acquire another player like a RB or returner.

What specific big risk/reward idea are you talking about that qualifies?
Romo, for example, is a gamble, not a calculated risk.
 
If it happens in the draft then I'm going with Chad Kelly if he's on the board in RD5. He will be a safe high risk/reward project that represents the best QB available that could safely sit for a season on the PS while he learns O'Brien's system and grows up. Should be an humbling experience that hopefully takes, since this guy has the tools to be an NFL starting QB. Getting a season with him on the PS will allow the Texans to carry the 3 QB's already under contract for 2017 while giving each of them a chance to play for a future with the Texans. Meanwhile, Kelly has a season to learn as he prepares to join the competition in 2018.
 
OptimisticTexan said:
If it happens in the draft then I'm going with Chad Kelly if he's on the board in RD5. He will be a safe high risk/reward project that represents the best QB available that could safely sit for a season on the PS while he learns O'Brien's system and grows up. Should be an humbling experience that hopefully takes, since this guy has the tools to be an NFL starting QB. Getting a season with him on the PS will allow the Texans to carry the 3 QB's already under contract for 2017 while giving each of them a chance to play for a future with the Texans. Meanwhile, Kelly has a season to learn as he prepares to join the competition in 2018.
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I would give up a rd 3/4 pick for Kelly.

He has great arm talent and bloodlines.
 
xtruroyaltyx said:
Big risk potential big reward.

Go for it.

If not then they are just going to stay on this hamster cycle.
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If they take Mahomes in the first round, I won't be all that upset. I'd like to see them make the effort and QBs are really difficult to evaluate. The potential is definitely there. He just scares me.

If Watson and Mahomes are there, I'm much happier with Watson.
 
Apparently obrien said he doesn't even know who's out there yet.

So what has he be doing the last month?

I thougt in order to prepare for the draft you would at least need to know who you can draft....
 
OptimisticTexan said:
If it happens in the draft then I'm going with Chad Kelly if he's on the board in RD5. He will be a safe high risk/reward project that represents the best QB available that could sit for a season on the PS while he learns O'Brien's system and grows up. Should be an humbling experience that hopefully takes, since this guy has the tools to be an NFL starting QB. Getting a season with him on the PS will allow the Texans to carry the 3 QB's already under contract for 2017 while giving each of them a chance to play for a future with the Texans. Meanwhile, Kelly has a season to learn as he prepares to join the competition in 2018.
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So you are willing to bet your coaching / GM Future on a guy with a first round arm and an UDFA brain ?
 
TexansSeminole said:
If they take Mahomes in the first round, I won't be all that upset. I'd like to see them make the effort and QBs are really difficult to evaluate. The potential is definitely there. He just scares me.

If Watson and Mahomes are there, I'm much happier with Watson.
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Pretty much my thoughts on the subject .... I much prefer Kizer to any of the others but know he wont be there at 25. Knowing that they have to resolve the position , I'm content with taking the guy I have next on that prospect list at 25.

Watson scares me like Mahomes scares you ....


Sigma said:
Apparently obrien said he doesn't even know who's out there yet.

So what has he be doing the last month?

I thougt in order to prepare for the draft you would at least need to know who you can draft....
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You know he has to be telling little white lies here .... he cant be that stupid , can he ?!

Hell I bet most of those in the draft forum here have been watching film on guys since mid season .... and its just a hobby for them , not their job on the line.

steelbtexan said:
I would give up a rd 3/4 pick for Kelly.

He has great arm talent and bloodlines.
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He's got talent .... but no brains or work ethic and thinks those bloodlines entitle him to more than he's earned. I wouldn't touch him other than UDFA.
 
Every quarterback that has ever played for this team has done something to be rightfully cut/released. And right now we're just hoping we can find a quarterback who earns being the starter for 2 years in a row.
 
Corrosion said:
So you are willing to bet your coaching / GM Future on a guy with a first round arm and an UDFA brain ?
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There is a reason I said RD5 (Maybe RD6). This is where I'm willing to risk the pick on one of the more talented QB's in the draft. He comes with baggage but I can deal with this if I can hide him on the PS while the team can smarten him up and educate him on O'Brien's playbook. I'm basing my entire expectations of CK on his 2015 season. Had he been in a position to enter the 2016 Draft, he's a RD1 pick. So, if he's there in RD5 or RD6 I'm more than ok with this high risk/reward QB.

O'Brien's future is directly related to Savage staying healthy for 2017. RS could try and blame O'Brien if Osweiler isn't ready to go as QB1 but something tells me that O'Brien is going to really push Savage to make his job easier. Weeden is going to be in on this competition as well and I fully expect him to bump Osweiler to being a 19M dollar clipboard caddy. Making Osweiler a clipboard caddy is what I call, "a gutsy move"! If Osweiler were to fall to QB3, maybe RS finally concedes to their blunder and actively begins searching for a team that might be willing to take on Osweiler fora late 2018 pick while the Texans cover a handsome portion of that guaranteed money in 2017. If this were to happen, Savage, Weeden and Kelly would be the QB trio. If Savage or Weeden were to get injured, then I'm hoping Case Keenum is in his deer stand waiting on the Texans call so he can come back and handle the QB2 spot.
 
OptimisticTexan said:
There is a reason I said RD5 (Maybe RD6). This is where I'm willing to risk the pick on one of the more talented QB's in the draft. He comes with baggage but I can deal with this if I can hide him on the PS while the team can smarten him up and educate him on O'Brien's playbook. I'm basing my entire expectations of CK on his 2015 season. Had he been in a position to enter the 2016 Draft, he's a RD1 pick. So, if he's there in RD5 or RD6 I'm more than ok with this high risk/reward QB.

O'Brien's future is directly related to Savage staying healthy for 2017. RS could try and blame O'Brien if Osweiler isn't ready to go as QB1 but something tells me that O'Brien is going to really push Savage to make his job easier. Weeden is going to be in on this competition as well and I fully expect him to bump Osweiler to being a 19M dollar clipboard caddy. Making Osweiler a clipboard caddy is what I call, "a gutsy move"! If Osweiler were to fall to QB3, maybe RS finally concedes to their blunder and actively begins searching for a team that might be willing to take on Osweiler fora late 2018 pick while the Texans cover a handsome portion of that guaranteed money in 2017. If this were to happen, Savage, Weeden and Kelly would be the QB trio. If Savage or Weeden were to get injured, then I'm hoping Case Keenum is in his deer stand waiting on the Texans call so he can come back and handle the QB2 spot.
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This QB with a UNFA brain beat Alabama/LSU in the 2015 season. You cant do that and not be talented/a leader.

Yep, I'll take that guy and teach him the ways of the NFL life.

As far as risk reward goes, you're talking about a GM that took a risk om Os. LOL
 
Mollywhopper said:
What does 'bloodlines' signify any more than actually seeing their play?
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When you've seen Kelly play you can tell he's got the ability to be a starting QB in the NFL. I will even say he's the most NFL ready QB in this draft. The game isn't too big for him and that probably is because he grew up around NFL players. Hence bloodline, he more likely to understand what it's like to be an NFL QB and everything that goes with it.
 
I don't think there is any way you can "stash" Kelly on the practice squad, if he gets drafted you have to use the roster spot to keep him, on the PS would pretty much defeat the purpose of it all. Watson was an amazingly impressive college QB, but as a prospect there are some huge holes in his game, I think he has much worse bust potential than Maholmes. The high INT's are the first indicator, if you look at other guys coming out of the spread Dak Prescott threw 5INT's in 477 attempts his last year for a 1.3 int %, Watson threw 17 INTs in 579 att for 2.9 INT%. That's more than twice the clip, and a 2.9% INT rate would be a bad number for a pro. Also Watson has accuracy issues that worry me in the long term. Add in the fact that Clemson had a great O-line, so he played with great protection most of the time, you would have expected him to be better with the picks and the accurracy, this gives me doubt about the NFL because he will see a lot more pressure than previously.

Mahomes demonstrated accuracy and touch as well as poise, he goes off script and that is probably the biggest worry about his game. In the NFL its much harder to do this and come out ok.
 
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