Then why is it only the same few that are making the duplicate posts? I do agree it's a website issue, but easily avoided
Keep Texans Talk Google Ad Free!
Venmo Tip Jar | Paypal Tip Jar
Thanks for your support! 🍺😎👍
The New New JaDeveon Clowney Thread
- Thread starter Marshall
- Start date
Then why is it only the same few that are making the duplicate posts? I do agree it's a website issue, but easily avoided
Tweet from @StephStradley: See. This is a garbage answer. “Please sign on the dotted line, JD so we can screw you over and if you don’t, that will screw you over in a different way.”
From a negotiation perspective, this isn’t terribly inviting. https://twitter.com/kprc2adamw/status/1167461273560391682
From a negotiation perspective, this isn’t terribly inviting. https://twitter.com/kprc2adamw/status/1167461273560391682
She's not wrong. It's disingenuous for the Texans to not give Clowney any assurances that he won't be traded to a team he seems hell bent on not wanting to go to, unless he signs the Franchise Tag and gives up any ability to do anything about whether the team ultimately trades him to a team he doesn't prefer. Sure, team first and all that, but the team is made up of individuals that are actively watching how you're treating a star player.
The good news is Jerry Jones is doing his best to out-mismanage Cal and Bill when it comes to his star players
Jane Slater
@SlaterNFL
“You enter a different world when you don’t honor your agreements” - Jerry Jones talking about Zeke, the holdout and the contract he currently has in place on
@1053thefan
on the Ben & Skin show
11:47 AM · Aug 30, 2019·Twitter for iPhone
Jane Slater
@SlaterNFL
“You enter a different world when you don’t honor your agreements” - Jerry Jones talking about Zeke, the holdout and the contract he currently has in place on
@1053thefan
on the Ben & Skin show
11:47 AM · Aug 30, 2019·Twitter for iPhone
cuppacoffee
Resident Grouch
Care to give an example of how you think Obrien should have answered the questions?
Keep honesty in mind.
She's right !
I've read in several places that the terms of these trender-tag contacts (whatever they are called ?) can be modified so if that's accurate then it would seem that Clowney
could sign the tender as long as it's amended to explicitly state where Clowney is willing to go and also which teams he refuses to be shipped off to.
Every game he sits out is a lose/lose for him & the Texans.
Care to give an example of how you think Obrien should have answered the questions?
Keep honesty in mind.
Honesty?
"I want to trade clowney and a first round pick and a second round pick for Tunsil as soon as he signs his tender."
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
Yes. What's he supposed to say.."Naw i'm good".
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
....
It would be disingenuous if the Texans says they would not trade him to a team he doesn't want to go to, don't include it in his tender & do it anyway.
As of right now, that is not what they are saying. They are saying you sign & chances are you will be traded to Miami.
That is not disingenuous. That is brutal honesty.
cuppacoffee
Resident Grouch
So you really believe that?
I don't think that Obrien would make that trade.
It has been posed here that possibly Miami would also give up a couple of more players with Tunsil.
Not too sure what the "value" would be in adding those players? Or if its even true.
I don't think Obrien dislikes Clowney, he just can't see paying Clowney what he is supposedly asking for.
Cap space will disappear quickly next year. Hell, Watson alone will probably gobble it up.
The Texans seem to be operating from the position that Clowney won't play another down in Houston. So it's not a loss as long as Clowney sits out.
If Miami agreed in principle to give the Texans what they are asking for in exchange for what the Texans want to give up. Every day is a loss for the Texans.
However if Clowney will not sign unless we guarantee he won't be traded to Miami, it's not a loss.
So you really believe that?
I don't think that Obrien would make that trade.
It has been posed here that possibly Miami would also give up a couple of more players with Tunsil.
Not too sure what the "value" would be in adding those players? Or if its even true.
I don't think Obrien dislikes Clowney, he just can't see paying Clowney what he is supposedly asking for.
Cap space will disappear quickly next year. Hell, Watson alone will probably gobble it up.
O'Brien already offered a 1st and clowney and they turned him down
I read, (on the board), that PFF had Tunsil ranked as #11 among NFL tackles. Has anyone seen what number Clowney is rated among edge rushers ? I, and I think, most of us are angry beyond words, over the coup that Miami is trying to pull off. Players are like cars or homes, or anything else that is sold. The fair value is in the eye of the beholder.... "it's worth as much as we can get" is the stance being taken by Miami's front office. This is crazy .... I want Tunsil in the worst way .... but .... I can't stand being part of Miami's obvious attempt to "cut a fat hog in the a$$ ! So a question .... what do you think is a fair deal ....
You still here? I don’t blame you. Being a dolphins fan you have to find ways to entertain yourself because your team sure ain’t going to do it.
Clowney's grade was like 90 and Tunsils was 70
I mean it's disingenuous to tell him he has to sign before even discussing what happens trade-wise. Hammer out the framework beforehand. Make the deal that Clowney won't be traded to a team he disapproves of, but he needs to sign the tag immediately after that agreement is made.
You don't sign a blank contract and let the organization fill it in. Yes, I'm aware what the FT language is, though it seems it can be altered to accommodate player and team wants/needs. That seems to be what O'Brien is asking for. He wants Clowney to give up all the leverage he holds for nothing in return.
If Clowney is dead set against going to Miami, and the Texans wants Tunsil, make that deal separately. Miami seems to not want Clowney as much as they want all the picks for Tunsil. They seemingly are hoping to leverage all the picks we would give them, plus any picks they could get for Clowney after the 2019 season for more or better picks.
Dakota
Ticketbooth Attendant
It's a rare position I find myself in, but I completely understand both arguments for trading Clowney + picks vs not.
I completely buy the argument that Clowney's career comes with more accolades, and that pass rushers are more highly regarded than a LT (as draft history and professional contracts have proven). But I also get the argument that the higher priority is DW's safety, and that you are unlikely to find a better LT in the first round or later - so you're buying a (more) reliable and proven asset.
Sure is a doozy of a decision for BOB's first major decision as coach and GM of this team... Fitting that it is as polarizing of a decision as he is a coach of this football team.
I completely buy the argument that Clowney's career comes with more accolades, and that pass rushers are more highly regarded than a LT (as draft history and professional contracts have proven). But I also get the argument that the higher priority is DW's safety, and that you are unlikely to find a better LT in the first round or later - so you're buying a (more) reliable and proven asset.
Sure is a doozy of a decision for BOB's first major decision as coach and GM of this team... Fitting that it is as polarizing of a decision as he is a coach of this football team.
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
So you really believe that?
I don't think that Obrien would make that trade.
It has been posed here that possibly Miami would also give up a couple of more players with Tunsil.
Not too sure what the "value" would be in adding those players? Or if its even true.
I don't think Obrien dislikes Clowney, he just can't see paying Clowney what he is supposedly asking for.
Cap space will disappear quickly next year. Hell, Watson alone will probably gobble it up.
Don’t bother bro, reason has gone out the window with many in here. They aren’t really looking down the road except in the sense of what they won’t be able to do.
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
It’s really only polarizing for those that hate him. They’re are THOROUGHLY convinced dude is the devil incarnate out to destroy the Texans.
Rich Schmidt
Myopicone
I am where Dakota is, this is not cut and dry and a big dilemma. We ***** because we are going to Andrew Luck DW4, but when we go after someone hard we get bitching from this board. It takes value to get value and if you overpay, young good LT may be the place to do it. Miami is rebuilding, Maybe we can get Drake or Ballage and/or Stills with Tunsil for Clowney, rd1 and rd3. If we had LT shored up for years, and the interior strengthened with the latest guys we could be competitive now. I am also fine to have a man to man and just have Clowney come back in and play on the tag after the guys reach an agreement and cool off. Clowney helped get us here because he over valued himself, Texans could have been more aggressive and avoided this too. I tend to agree that he was asking too much it appears. Just sucks, at least if he sits out we have Mercilus and maybe get value at the trade deadline for him
Really ? I somehow thought it would be the other way around .... and even more of a discrepancy. That makes me even angrier ! Yet, Tunsil seems so right for our need .... and that is what Miami is banking on. I'm sure others have thought of this, but I don't remember seeing it .... what has O'Brien got to lose ! He has a huge ego ! He wants no part of a 4 and 12 season, and/or the humiliation and firing that would accompany it. On top of that, he really doesn't want Watson injured again. How does he not cave ? Send one of his friends in low places - from South Boston, to remind Miami GM that he knows where his children go to school ??
He is turning the team into a steaming pile of dung right in front of us and your chief complaint is people commenting about it on message boards
dream_team
Hall of Fame
These are last season's scores:
Clowney 88.0 (tied-9th)
Tunsil 70.4 (tied-36th)
At this point in their careers, Clowney is clearly the superior player. Miami is simply trying to take advantage of our desperation. We have a player we need to trade. We have a position that we desperately need. Miami, being in rebuild mode, doesn't need Clowney, so they have all of the bargaining power in this negotiation.
powda
The bridge between stupid and useless is short.
It's funny, if this trade goes through for anything close to whats being speculated, OB will probably laugh about it to himself. He managed to get rid of Clowney for something and as a last F you he sent Clowney to a losing team he doesnt really want to go to.
Truth is, if this trade goes through for anything close to whats being speculated Clowney should laugh to himself. This trade will be the one thing we look back to that gets OB fired.
Truth is, if this trade goes through for anything close to whats being speculated Clowney should laugh to himself. This trade will be the one thing we look back to that gets OB fired.
If the trade is for Tunisl, Clowney should go. It would mean Miami is starting over a bigger rebuild and they won't try to keep him next year.
banned1976
sleeper mode
That’s kind of where this whole mess started. The Texans, according to the franchise tag, views Clowney as a LB. There’s about 1.6 million dollar difference between the two positions, concerning the franchise tag.
Personally, I rank priority of positions:
1. QB
2. LT
3. DE
How one views Clowney in terms of DE performance versus other defensive ends and his career arch is in the eye of the beholder. Me personally, I’m still concerned about his knee. If I’m a buyer, I can’t ignore that. IMHO, I don’t blame Miami for their counter offer (if it is true that they were having trade talks regarding Tunsil/Clowney). I view a franchise LT much higher than a franchise DE.
Don’t hate him. Dislike him as a coach. Don’t think he’s the devil. He’s just mediocre coach who thinks he’s bill billacheck even though he’s done nothing in his career to justify it. Look at his playoff record. Look at his win percentage against winning teams. I don’t think he wants to destroy the Texans. He’s just not good at running a team. The proof is his miss handling of one thing after another.
@AaronWilson_NFL
One league source informed of Jadeveon Clowney's thinking reiterated that he remains adamant he doesn't want to play for the Miami Dolphins regardless of the trade discussions between Texans and Dolphins
One league source informed of Jadeveon Clowney's thinking reiterated that he remains adamant he doesn't want to play for the Miami Dolphins regardless of the trade discussions between Texans and Dolphins
@AaronWilson_NFL
·
5m
If Jadeveon Clowney had accepted Texans' previous offer, which was very far below his financial expectations of getting into the Khalil Mack, Aaron Donald neighborhood, per sources, it would have been regarded as a complete steal for the Texans for a player of his caliber
·
5m
If Jadeveon Clowney had accepted Texans' previous offer, which was very far below his financial expectations of getting into the Khalil Mack, Aaron Donald neighborhood, per sources, it would have been regarded as a complete steal for the Texans for a player of his caliber
banned1976
sleeper mode
Aaron’s getting plenty of push back on that tweet and deservedly so. Clowney is far below those other two guys and he is a penalty machine at the worst times. As someone else suggested, Clowney could have negotiated a bridge prove it contract but he didn’t. There’s plenty of culpability on both sides of this train wreck.
The Texans did not negotiate. They gave him that one lowball offer and that's it.
Good, I’m not fired up for trading Clowney plus a first or more to Miami. F the Dolphins. I also don’t care if Clowney sits out all year because his feelings are hurt. Franchise and trade him next year before the draft to maximize the return.
One thing I’ve found interesting in this whole ordeal, earlier this week there were reports that the Dolphins players would revolt if they traded Tunsil for Clowney. We didn’t hear any such reports from the Texans players about Clowney being traded. You would think if the guys on the roster were pissed about Clowney being dealt, with all the former players involved in our sports media, we’d hear something if they were upset.
I do think if they dump him for peanuts you’ll hear grumbling at that point
One thing I’ve found interesting in this whole ordeal, earlier this week there were reports that the Dolphins players would revolt if they traded Tunsil for Clowney. We didn’t hear any such reports from the Texans players about Clowney being traded. You would think if the guys on the roster were pissed about Clowney being dealt, with all the former players involved in our sports media, we’d hear something if they were upset.
I do think if they dump him for peanuts you’ll hear grumbling at that point
PFF says Clowney is a top 10 edge defender.
10. JADEVEON CLOWNEY, HOUSTON TEXANS
2018 OVERALL GRADE RANK: T-9
Clowney is coming off a year that saw him set career-high marks in overall grade, sacks and snaps played (including the postseason). The former first overall pick tallied 63 quarterback pressures a season ago — the second straight year that he’s produced 60-plus quarterback pressures — and his career-high pass-rush grade of 78.8 was good for 13th among 111 qualifying players at the position. As promising as his career-high pass-rushing marks are, they pale in comparison to his performance against the run. Clowney has earned run-defense grades north of 75.0 in each of the last four seasons, and a staggering 47.2% of his career run tackles have been for a loss of yardage or no gain — second to only Michael Bennett (53.7%) among the 94 edge defenders with at least 500 run-defense snaps since 2014.
10. JADEVEON CLOWNEY, HOUSTON TEXANS
2018 OVERALL GRADE RANK: T-9
Clowney is coming off a year that saw him set career-high marks in overall grade, sacks and snaps played (including the postseason). The former first overall pick tallied 63 quarterback pressures a season ago — the second straight year that he’s produced 60-plus quarterback pressures — and his career-high pass-rush grade of 78.8 was good for 13th among 111 qualifying players at the position. As promising as his career-high pass-rushing marks are, they pale in comparison to his performance against the run. Clowney has earned run-defense grades north of 75.0 in each of the last four seasons, and a staggering 47.2% of his career run tackles have been for a loss of yardage or no gain — second to only Michael Bennett (53.7%) among the 94 edge defenders with at least 500 run-defense snaps since 2014.
@riversmccown
Bill O'Brien has somehow turned the franchise tag rights to one of the best 50 players in the NFL -- quite valuable -- into Clowney refusing to report into a trade. He's essentially lost a star on a team-friendly contract -- on a win-now team! -- for absolutely no reason.
@riversmccown
If this were happening to the Jets or Giants instead of to a mid-market AFC South team, Twitter would be such a napalm field you couldn't even keep up with cuts today.
Bill O'Brien has somehow turned the franchise tag rights to one of the best 50 players in the NFL -- quite valuable -- into Clowney refusing to report into a trade. He's essentially lost a star on a team-friendly contract -- on a win-now team! -- for absolutely no reason.
@riversmccown
If this were happening to the Jets or Giants instead of to a mid-market AFC South team, Twitter would be such a napalm field you couldn't even keep up with cuts today.
Max
Veteran
I don't know that it started there because they went through the same thing a year before regarding a roster bonus. I think the whole thing started w/ the 'worker bee' comments that BOB leaked in February. I've seen it said here (not directed at you banned) that there isn't a market for JD because we've been trying to trade him all along and there hasn't been any takers. The problem with that is that we clearly weren't trying to trade JD early on. Why would you leak it out that the guy you're about to trade isn't a worker bee?
So it was a threat in negotiating his extension that the franchise tag was coming if he wasn't more reasonable about the contract he wanted. Say what you will about Clowney wanting more than he was worth, but he isn't the one that started with the ugly. If you're BOB, keep it in the back of your mind while negotiating w/ JD that you wouldn't mind trading him if things don't work out because he doesn't work as hard as you'd like. Play nice, don't say anything and JD signs the tag and you trade him if you have to and hopefully work w/ him to go where he wants to go. Don't go blabbing to the world that the guy you're negotiating w/ is lazy and needs to prove himself. That's how you get things off to a bad start and it's the beginning of why we are where we are today.
https://texanswire.usatoday.com/2019/02/18/texans-jadeveon-clowney-worker-bee-avoid-franchise-tag/
You're splitting hairs now. Making an offer is negotiating.
They made one low ball offer and ignored all counter offers. Whatever that is, it's not great.
I think that would make him a free agent
I would assume free agent. I can’t imagine they’d do that though. If he sits they don’t have to pay him and they can franchise next season and hopefully do it right next time
Mangler
Toro de España
And, don’t expect for Butt Chin to stop there. I’m sure he has a few more blunders up his sleeve. This guy has got to go!