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FIRE O'BRIEN NOW!!!

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76Texan said:
So, who will be the stop-gap starter and the backup in 2015?
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76Texan said:
How did O'Brien hope to use yet another stop gap measure in Hoyer?
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I agree. BO'b made the QB search a lot harder than it had to be. The Titans had just cut Fitzpatrick after a horrible season of bad QB play. & we pick him up & pay him more money.

We already had bad QB play under contract. Cheap contracts in Yates & Keenum.

Going after Hoyer I can understand. Didn't agree with it. But I understand. Biggest failure there, I think, is he never got to the realization that the Hoyer he knew was long gone.
 
banned1976 said:
I know...that’s why I wrote “...for awhile.” There would be a segment of fans that unless it’s “their guy” they’d be tearing down the new HC the moment he was announced.
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Get to the AFCCG. I bet that would help. Do it again, or at least don't get blown out trying to get there.

I'd be defending BO'b right now if it wasn't for such an ugly loss to the Colts at home in the playoffs. Then it was his 2nd embarrassing playoff loss at home.

Seriously, that was me saying 9 straight wins, he's gotta be doing something right. I don't like the man, but I will jump on his wagon if he's winning.

We're an expansion team. Seriously. All that crap that happened between Capers & now where we (l) were saying, "We aren't an expansion team anymore." That's gone. Everything that's happened this offseason (Matt Kalil, really?) We're the freak'n Browns.
 
Seriously have any of Texans QB’s enjoyed a truly great OL? MS is only possible exception and inside was blown up on infamous QB sneak that essentially ended that.

Until Texans put together a solid functional OL, QB play will be suspect no matter what the talent (Watson could be great).
 
TheKDog said:
Except hopefully that time the people who think the coach is great are right, unlike now.
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While I'm sure there are people out there that think he is great of the regular posters on this site please tell me who on here has, at any point, said he was a great HC and then at least tell what thread they said this in if not quote the post. I'll tell you right now you won't find it because no one has said that he is great. Just some of us don't think that every F up the Texans do is his fault and nor do we think that everything he does is wrong.
 
maverick512000 said:
While I'm sure there are people out there that think he is great of the regular posters on this site please tell me who on here has, at any point, said he was a great HC and then at least tell what thread they said this in if not quote the post. I'll tell you right now you won't find it because no one has said that he is great. Just some of us don't think that every F up the Texans do is his fault and nor do we think that everything he does is wrong.
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Ok many posters think he's a good coach
 
thunderkyss said:
Get to the AFCCG. I bet that would help. Do it again, or at least don't get blown out trying to get there.

I'd be defending BO'b right now if it wasn't for such an ugly loss to the Colts at home in the playoffs. Then it was his 2nd embarrassing playoff loss at home.

Seriously, that was me saying 9 straight wins, he's gotta be doing something right. I don't like the man, but I will jump on his wagon if he's winning.

We're an expansion team. Seriously. All that crap that happened between Capers & now where we (l) were saying, "We aren't an expansion team anymore." That's gone. Everything that's happened this offseason (Matt Kalil, really?) We're the freak'n Browns.
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Yr 2 of a 3 yr rebuild and this cheapass franchise is about nothing more than profiteering.

Dont re-sign Clowney? Ok spend his $$$$ in FA on an OT that can help protect your franchise QB. What does Cletus choose to do? Hold on to all of his $$$$. I know they have to re-sign Watson, but they're going to be re-signing a badly beaten up Watson because for the 3rd yr in a row he's going to get beaten up like a stepchild.

Like I said before, they didn't learn a damn thing from the Carr debacle. What a clusterfvck of an org.
 
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steelbtexan said:
Yr 2 of a 3 yr rebuild and this cheapass franchise is about nothing more than profiteering.

Dont re-sign Clowney? Ok spend his $$$$ in FA on an OT that can help protect your franchise QB. What does Cletus choose to do? Hold on to all of his $$$$. I know they have to re-sign Watson, but they're going to be re-signing a badly beaten up Watson because for the 3rd yr in a row he's going to get beaten up like a stepchild.

Like I said before, they didn't learn a damn thing from the Carr debacle. What a clusterfvck of an org.
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The OL is in year 1 of a 3 year rebuild
 
Mr teX said:
He should...he is the HC so ultimately he is responsible for everything... positive and negative.




There's a difference between being unable to develop a player and said player just not being good enough to play on this level. Fans like to use these terms interchangeably postulating that b/c a guy didn't work out, Its on the coach No, not necessarily. Sometimes guys just don't work out b/c they can't play & its noone's fault really. Its like faulting every NFL team for passing on TB12....6 times each. You can't really know how a guy will rise or sink until you commit to trying to see if it can work. & like i said, BoB isn't the only coach to have moved on from Keenum. Several have.





A HC gets paid to do many things & not all players are motivated the same. I was told by people here that BoB disliked AJ & was purposely trying to run him off....Well, do you hire people to your staff you dislike?

You're right though man. Its a team game. That's what i firmly believe & If you look at most of the moves BoB has made in his time here, they've been made with the team/franchise in mind. And on the NFL level...or really any level of football except little league, you can't look at the strengths and weaknesses of individual players, you have to look at the team as a whole's strengths and weaknesses. Playing Howard at guard instead of throwing him to the wolves at LT when you know he's probably not ready?.......team move. Bringing in a veteran qb who knows the system better than a guy that's been in a deer blind..........team move.

The problem around here is once the naysayers get it in their heads about what is & what isn't, they can't separate their personal dislike. I can. Today with them i'm a "BoB defender". Before him I was considered a "koolaid drinker" because i wasn't on board the Kubiak pink soap brigade. That's why when BoB eventually gets fired b/c make no mistake about it, coaches are hired to be fired, It won't bother me 1 iota like some of the pink soapers believe. While everyone will be basking in the glory of what they believe is a new era until they get pissed with that HC, I'll just be quietly, objectively measuring the moves against what the team needs.
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I’d say I’m similar in thoughts like TK and xtruyolty.
We think O’Brien is a mediocre HC.
And it’s the most important job of all.
The organization needs to turn all the stones to try to find one instead of extend O’Brien.
 
beerlover said:
Seriously have any of Texans QB’s enjoyed a truly great OL? MS is only possible exception and inside was blown up on infamous QB sneak that essentially ended that.

Until Texans put together a solid functional OL, QB play will be suspect no matter what the talent (Watson could be great).
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Preaching to the choir.

Been saying this for the last 3 yrs. Gotta spend $$$$ to pay for the past sins of neglect and this cheapass franchise wont do it. So the price they choose to pay will be screwing up another young star QB's career. I hope Cletus chokes on all ofthis cap space. Hopefully I'm wrong and they get a good LT when they trade Clowney, since they dont want to pay Clowney either.
 
steelbtexan said:
Preaching to the choir.

Been saying this for the last 3 yrs. Gotta spend $$$$ to pay for the past sins of neglect and this cheapass franchise wont do it. So the price they choose to pay will be screwing up another young star QB's career. I hope Cletus chokes on all ofthis cap space. Hopefully I'm wrong and they get a good LT when they trade Clowney, since they dont want to pay Clowney either.
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Every team is required to spent 90% of cap
 
76Texan said:
I’d say I’m similar in thoughts like TK and xtruyolty.
We think O’Brien is a mediocre HC.
And it’s the most important job of all.
The organization needs to turn all the stones to try to find one instead of extend O’Brien.
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See and here is what I don't get about this place. I think at this point we all believe him to be a middle of the road HC and no one is saying he is going to lead us to the football promise land. When some us point out though that there are other issues playing a part in it, Watson holding the ball to long, defense can't stop the air game, WRs not named Nuk dropping like flies and we point out that he does do some things right as a HC we get labeled as "OBrien defenders" and people act like changing HCs is going to solve all our problems.

I've said all along that I give BoB this last season before I'm ready to pass final judgement because whether some want to believe it or not going on a 9 game winning streak after starting 0-3 is impressive. I don't really count the Colts game because if we just judge the season off of that then we need to fire every coach, find a new QB, find new WRs, again not named Nuk, and rebuild the defense.
 
76Texan said:
I’d say I’m similar in thoughts like TK and xtruyolty.
We think O’Brien is a mediocre HC.
And it’s the most important job of all.
The organization needs to turn all the stones to try to find one instead of extend O’Brien.
Click to expand...

I can respect that thought process, but Belichick wasn't considered a great HC until he lucked up with TB12. We saw Jimmy Johnson look pretty damn mediocore in Miami when he left the Tripletts behind in Dallas. Our very own Gary Kubiak...pretty much the definition of mediocore here, goes to Denver & becomes a SB winner. Remember Chuck Pagano? He was once thought to be a pretty good HC too. But his descent from good to mediocore/bad HC pretty much mirrors Luck's injury history in that time.

What the evidence says is that most of these guys are pretty much in the same boat...largely mediocore...even some of those considered good. What separates good from bad alot of the times though is simply just luck & 1-2 gambles that work out for them that they can parlay. Imagine what Jimmy Johnson's legacy would be if that herschel walker trade didn't net him Emmitt & Woodson. Imagine his legacy if he'd gone with Walsh instead of Aikman.

So to me this whole "turn all the stones to try to find one" is just folly. Fire him.....don't fire him..doesn't really matter b/c whomever you hire is most likely someone in the same category.
 
steelbtexan said:
Your point is what?

2nd most cap space in the NFL.

Meanwhile their franchise QB is going to get the crap beat out of him for the 3rd yr in a row. Stupid F'ers
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My point is they can't really be cheap. That capspace is likely being rolled forward to sign Watson and other free agents
 
TheKDog said:
My point is they can't really be cheap. That capspace is likely being rolled forward to sign Watson and other free agents
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They're being as cheap as humanly possible. Nickle and dining. They've got plenty of cap space to sign Watson/Watt and add a LT to protect Watson, particularly if they don't re-sign Clowney.
 
TheKDog said:
My point is they can't really be cheap. That capspace is likely being rolled forward to sign Watson and other free agents
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Not sure cheap would be the right term, seems they consistently overpaid, especially free agents but when it comes to keeping their own, sure seems like they just push them away and attempt to diminish market value. Then it becomes personal. O'B is the perfect example of what not to have as a GM/Coach, not only is there a conflict of interest, he gets way to personal and has abrasive personality.
 
steelbtexan said:
They're being as cheap as humanly possible. Nickle and dining. They've got plenty of cap space to sign Watson/Watt and add a LT to protect Watson, particularly if they don't re-sign Clowney.
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I don't know about that honestly. You've got Dak up in Dallas turning down 32 mil a year & if he's getting that offered to him, that means DW4 is gonna get at least that. DW4's contract alone would swallow 85% of our current space by itself. Then you turn to Watt who will at least command 12-13 million. This is what's lost with the those up in arms about Clowney. paying him what he wants..or even close to that makes it more difficult than it has to be resigning DW4.

This isn't even factoring in resigning Roby if he has a breakout season.
 
Mr teX said:
I can respect that thought process, but Belichick wasn't considered a great HC until he lucked up with TB12. We saw Jimmy Johnson look pretty damn mediocore in Miami when he left the Tripletts behind in Dallas. Our very own Gary Kubiak...pretty much the definition of mediocore here, goes to Denver & becomes a SB winner. Remember Chuck Pagano? He was once thought to be a pretty good HC too. But his descent from good to mediocore/bad HC pretty much mirrors Luck's injury history in that time.

What the evidence says is that most of these guys are pretty much in the same boat...largely mediocore...even some of those considered good. What separates good from bad alot of the times though is simply just luck & 1-2 gambles that work out for them that they can parlay. Imagine what Jimmy Johnson's legacy would be if that herschel walker trade didn't net him Emmitt & Woodson. Imagine his legacy if he'd gone with Walsh instead of Aikman.

So to me this whole "turn all the stones to try to find one" is just folly. Fire him.....don't fire him..doesn't really matter b/c whomever you hire is most likely someone in the same category.
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This is where I'm different than many.
I had done a lot of researches on BB, and I recognized the good things he did in Cleveland.
He inherited an aging roster that needed to be replenished continually.
His starting QB missed 17 games in 3 years.
You know back then the QB can get hit pretty hard.
The last year he was there, the Browns faced 7 teams that went to the playoffs.
Besides, the players knew that the franchise was going to relocate.
And the Browns fans can be very harsh.
There was a lot of distractions.
 
Mr teX said:
I can respect that thought process, but Belichick wasn't considered a great HC until he lucked up with TB12. We saw Jimmy Johnson look pretty damn mediocore in Miami when he left the Tripletts behind in Dallas. Our very own Gary Kubiak...pretty much the definition of mediocore here, goes to Denver & becomes a SB winner. Remember Chuck Pagano? He was once thought to be a pretty good HC too. But his descent from good to mediocore/bad HC pretty much mirrors Luck's injury history in that time.

What the evidence says is that most of these guys are pretty much in the same boat...largely mediocore...even some of those considered good. What separates good from bad alot of the times though is simply just luck & 1-2 gambles that work out for them that they can parlay. Imagine what Jimmy Johnson's legacy would be if that herschel walker trade didn't net him Emmitt & Woodson. Imagine his legacy if he'd gone with Walsh instead of Aikman.

So to me this whole "turn all the stones to try to find one" is just folly. Fire him.....don't fire him..doesn't really matter b/c whomever you hire is most likely someone in the same category.
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As far as Kubiak goes, yes, he has his flaws.
But because of his system, a team doesn't have to spend much capital on the offense like other teams do.
Just find a good DC; that guy will have more resources to work with.
 
Mr teX said:
I can respect that thought process, but Belichick wasn't considered a great HC until he lucked up with TB12. We saw Jimmy Johnson look pretty damn mediocore in Miami when he left the Tripletts behind in Dallas. Our very own Gary Kubiak...pretty much the definition of mediocore here, goes to Denver & becomes a SB winner. Remember Chuck Pagano? He was once thought to be a pretty good HC too. But his descent from good to mediocore/bad HC pretty much mirrors Luck's injury history in that time.

What the evidence says is that most of these guys are pretty much in the same boat...largely mediocore...even some of those considered good. What separates good from bad alot of the times though is simply just luck & 1-2 gambles that work out for them that they can parlay. Imagine what Jimmy Johnson's legacy would be if that herschel walker trade didn't net him Emmitt & Woodson. Imagine his legacy if he'd gone with Walsh instead of Aikman.

So to me this whole "turn all the stones to try to find one" is just folly. Fire him.....don't fire him..doesn't really matter b/c whomever you hire is most likely someone in the same category.
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Among the good things BB did in Cleveland was the hiring of Kirk Ferentz (now the HC at Iowa).

In just a few short years, they were able to identify and develop 3 UDFA offensive linemen into starters (including Orlando Brown).
The 4th starter was a 3rd rounder, and the 5th one was a first rounder.

Under O'Brien, we have yet to see any Olinemen succesfully groomed/developed.
 
76Texan said:
McVay was the one I would have like as a HC.
Very innovative and forward thinking.
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Not disagreeing but the NFC as a whole is very weak and McVay has a good team. I fully believe if last season you dropped the Texans, BoB and all, into the NFC they would crush many of the teams with only Rams, Saints, Bears and maybe the Eagles giving us trouble.
 
LOL @ Texans only having trouble in the NFC with all the other NFC playoff teams LOLLLL .. so then its exactly whats going on in the AFC too! That was great. Needed it. Thx.
 
maverick512000 said:
Not disagreeing but the NFC as a whole is very weak and McVay has a good team. I fully believe if last season you dropped the Texans, BoB and all, into the NFC they would crush many of the teams with only Rams, Saints, Bears and maybe the Eagles giving us trouble.
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Bill O'Brian's record against the NFC.
8/12 .400
 
JB said:
Except he wasn't on anyone's radar in 2013
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I don't understand what you mean here.
In 2013 mcVay was a 26 yr old TE coach.
His work with the TEs were very good.
So he was promoted to OC.
Even as he had to go through 3 different QBs, he was still able to make that offense look half way decent while implementing a new system (going away from the WCO that Shanahan ran).
RGIII was always injured and Cousins was erratic early on in his career.
And Cousins have always had problem with protecting the ball and fumbling.
In fact, he lost , if I remember correctly, 3 games last year because of those key turnovers.

In McVay's first year, the Skins were 29th in points allowed, putting tremendous pressure on the offense.
The Skins were 13th in yard gained, but kept shooting themselves in the foot with turnovers and dropped passes that cut short their offensive drives.
 
maverick512000 said:
Not disagreeing but the NFC as a whole is very weak and McVay has a good team. I fully believe if last season you dropped the Texans, BoB and all, into the NFC they would crush many of the teams with only Rams, Saints, Bears and maybe the Eagles giving us trouble.
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McVay was a perfect 8-0 against the AFC until he lost to the Pats in the playoffs.

Two wins were against the Chiefs and Chargers last year.[/QUOTE]
 
76Texan said:
I don't understand what you mean here.
In 2013 mcVay was a 26 yr old TE coach.
His work with the TEs were very good.
So he was promoted to OC.
Even as he had to go through 3 different QBs, he was still able to make that offense look half way decent while implementing a new system (going away from the WCO that Shanahan ran).
RGIII was always injured and Cousins was erratic early on in his career.
And Cousins have always had problem with protecting the ball and fumbling.
In fact, he lost , if I remember correctly, 3 games last year because of those key turnovers.

In McVay's first year, the Skins were 29th in points allowed, putting tremendous pressure on the offense.
The Skins were 13th in yard gained, but kept shooting themselves in the foot with turnovers and dropped passes that cut short their offensive drives.
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You stated that you would have liked to see McVay as the Texans HC, but the last time they were looking for a HC, McVay was on no one's radar as a HC
 
JB said:
You stated that you would have liked to see McVay as the Texans HC, but the last time they were looking for a HC, McVay was on no one's radar as a HC
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McVay was set to interview with the Niners next, but the Rams were so impressed after the interview, they quickly hired him.
Yeah, he may be under the radar of the media, but NFL teams are supposed to keep tab of all the assistant coaches, unless they have an incompetent organization.
 
76Texan said:
McVay was set to interview with the Niners next, but the Rams were so impressed after the interview, they quickly hired him.
Yeah, he may be under the radar of the media, but NFL teams are supposed to keep tab of all the assistant coaches, unless they have an incompetent organization.
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2014, no team was looking at McVay
 
76Texan said:
McVay was set to interview with the Niners next, but the Rams were so impressed after the interview, they quickly hired him.
Yeah, he may be under the radar of the media, but NFL teams are supposed to keep tab of all the assistant coaches, unless they have an incompetent organization.
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A certain group (around these parts) likes to call it rebuilding. Incompetent seems to rattle their cage just a little bit.
 
JB said:
You stated that you would have liked to see McVay as the Texans HC, but the last time they were looking for a HC, McVay was on no one's radar as a HC
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I'm guessing you were saying McVay never had the chance to be the HC of the Texans.
In that case, you're correct.

I was saying that McVay is the type of guys I want to see as a HC of my football team.

I never meant that the Texans had a chance at him.

What I'm also saying that right now, the Texans should have dossiers on all the OCs and DCs, not just at the NFL level, but also at the college level - as well as the college HCs.
Just like some organization that look ls to identify genius and child prodigy.
When you look at how fast a coachn rise in his rank, you can then say, OK, this looks like a bright guy, let's do a more thorough investigation on him.
It's called identifying talents, looking for people with leadership skills and those rare qualities that prompt them to become sucessful early.
It's like the big corporations having head hunters working for them to find good people to hire for the high-level jobs.
 
76Texan said:
I'm guessing you were saying McVay never had the chance to be the HC of the Texans.
In that case, you're correct.

I was saying that McVay is the type of guys I want to see as a HC of my football team.

I never meant that the Texans had a chance at him.

What I'm also saying that right now, the Texans should have dossiers on all the OCs and DCs, not just at the NFL level, but also at the college level - as well as the college HCs.
Just like some organization that look ls to identify genius and child prodigy.
When you look at how fast a coachn rise in his rank, you can then say, OK, this looks like a bright guy, let's do a more thorough investigation on him.
It's called identifying talents, looking for people with leadership skills and those rare qualities that prompt them to become sucessful early.
It's like the big corporations having head hunters working for them to find good people to hire for the high-level jobs.
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Sorry, it came across to me that you thought the Texans should have hired McVay instead of OB... I was just pointing out that at the time McVay wasn't under consideration by anyone
 
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