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FIRE O'BRIEN NOW!!!
- Thread starter Carr Bombed
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Shishkabob
All Pro
is he suppose to trash on the qb the team just spent a lot of money on?
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
He doesn't have to say anything.
Wanna see an HC get a QB forced on them? See Jeff Fisher/VY.
FuzzyLogic
Mathematically Possible
That was OB's response after watching game films of Osweiler.
There was a video (which I can't locate at this time) showing O'Brien watching the game films and gave his thumb up to Osweiler.
That was before the Texans signed Osweiler.
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Also, I had said this before, so I'm just going to restate it.
All the FA QBs that the Texans signed had had experiences in the Earhardt Perkins system that O'Brien learned during his time with the Patriots.
For example, if you go to the stats page of the Buffalo Bills when Fitzpatrick was there (2010-12) and click on the "More Team Info" button, you will see that the Bills were running the E-P system at that time.
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/buf/2010.htm
All the FA QBs that the Texans signed had had experiences in the Earhardt Perkins system that O'Brien learned during his time with the Patriots.
For example, if you go to the stats page of the Buffalo Bills when Fitzpatrick was there (2010-12) and click on the "More Team Info" button, you will see that the Bills were running the E-P system at that time.
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/buf/2010.htm
CloakNNNdagger
Hall of Fame
Here is an enlightening take on the Texans, O'Brien and Watson by Greg Cosell (today by far the most respected NFL analyst)...............the full radio 610 podcast
If this is coach speak, then O'Brien should go to Hollywood because it was an Oscar worthy performance.
Does it really matter?
If I thought O'Brien tried everything he could to make it work, I'd give him a pass. I'd blame Rick for everything. But instead he was going through the motions at best. If I were McNair, I'd have fired him for that alone. "You don't like the guy I put in charge of getting talent? You don't like the decision I made when I hired him? When I gave him an extension? When I promoted him? You obviously don't want to be part of the team I'm trying to build here."
Imagine you hired two guys to work together & one does everything he can to accent the other guys errors... I mean he wanted Bryan Hoyer. Because he wanted Bryan Hoyer, we really don't know what Keenum, Mallett, or Osweiller could have been. I'm not saying those guys would have been Tom Brady, but had he stuck with Keenum, who knows we probably could have pur bookend tackles by now.
But no... We waste time spending money & resources on QBs nobody wanted.
Hopefully not with ghost peppers... the last thing this place needs is more butt hurtin.
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
Talent evaluation “skills” don’t just apply to who starts and who sits.
Belichick kept Mallet on his roster for 3 years as TB12’s primary back up...literally a freak injury away from having him starting.....Harbaugh actually had him starting a few games...I guess their talent evaluation skills suck too.
I guess that's what obrien thought. If belichick had hoyer and mallet on the roster, they just be awesome!
1. He says Watson has a lot to learn, which is true, but the main thing he mentioned, leaving the pocket too early due to a bad OL can be directly related to poor coaching and development by obrien.
2. He says obrien did a good job because the offensive personnel sucked. Doesn't seem to realize obrien was a big part of building the offensive roster. These are the guys he wanted and he made it worse with OL shuffling.
Also, people before the season said the offense had plenty of talent. When obrien can't do anything with it all of a sudden it's a talent problem.
And even if you think it's not a lot of talent, is it really only 7 points against the Colts bad?
Shishkabob
All Pro
it is when your best offensive player has a separated shoulder, and your QB plays one of the worst game of his career
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
Lol...jesus christ dude your logic and reasoning skills are absolutely atrocious.
Speedy
Former Yeller Dweller
No one is perfect when it comes to evaluating talent or there'd never be a 1st round bust ever. Missing is fine but you've got to get some right too. When has OB ever done that? OB works with these guys all summer long. He, more than any of us, should know what he's got, what he's working with, yet twice now he's changed QBs after the 1st half of the 1st game. What do you see in a half of football that you didn't see all summer? TWICE?
As I've said before, OB does not appear to be learning from his mistakes, that all make, and keeps making those same mistakes over and over. There's no growth. He forces players to play his system and doesn't adapt to their skill sets. The 6 games he was forced to do that last year he was blowing up the scoreboard. So what does he do this year? Goes right back to his same old bland, unimaginative ways, misusing the talent he does have thus putting them in positions where success is a whole lot harder to achieve.
Talent evaluation, which I don't believe he's good at, is one thing. What you do with the talent you have, which I don't believe he's good at either, is another.
How so?
He also changed his starting OL at halftime this year. It's embarrassing.
Eh that's just an excuse. Maybe the QB had a bad game because the game plan and playcalling sucked.
Besides, it's not like the offense was lighting it up even when Watson played well and Hopkins was healthy.
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Shishkabob
All Pro
Did you not see wide open throws he missed? Because I did
I did . But Watson said he couldn't step into throws due to instant pressure
Shishkabob
All Pro
He's been hitting those throws all season with pressure, it was just bad timing for him to have an off game. **** happens, I can't blame the play calling when a receiver is open and the QB doesn't throw an accurate ball.
I think it's interesting Cosell and others want to frame the discussion about the offense sucking in terms of Watson being a young, struggling QB instead of the fact that O'Briens offense has always looked like this.
Watson has areas to improve on, but he was very good most of the year and absolutely was not the problem.
Just use this simple logic: the offense was bottom 10 but Watson was not. Watson played more like a top 10 QB.
If you are expecting Watson to carry a poor ol, poor TEs, and poor rbs with a poor OC, then I think that's unfair to him.
Watson has areas to improve on, but he was very good most of the year and absolutely was not the problem.
Just use this simple logic: the offense was bottom 10 but Watson was not. Watson played more like a top 10 QB.
If you are expecting Watson to carry a poor ol, poor TEs, and poor rbs with a poor OC, then I think that's unfair to him.
It's possible he had an off game because obrien doesn't prepare the team properly for the playoffs
Shishkabob
All Pro
Did you even read or listen to what he said? Because the only thing you got right was he said Watson is young. He never said he is struggling, he said he was young and learning and no he didn't put the offense sucking on Watson either. He pointed out the obvious that our offense has a bunch of holes, bad line, mediocre RB, 2 rookie TEs, only 1 reliable receiver
He never blamed Watson, he gave credit to both O'Brien and Watson for leading this team to 9 straight wins, and a playoff birth despite serious roster limitations..... but you'd probably know that if you bothered to read it
Well even if it's just the bad peronnel excuse, that's not what people were saying before the season. this was finally going to be the year obrien show what his offense could do now that he finally has a good QB.
Also, O'Brien wanted most of these guys on offense.
Shishkabob
All Pro
The people saying that stuff before the seasons are fans, short for fanatic. Idk if you have realized this fans can be delusional homers sometimes. Just because guys on this board were thinking we were going to win the SB because Watson is MJ in cleats, doesn't mean it was realistic.
and you could argue O'Brien shares responsibility for the talent or lack thereof and I won't argue with you there. But we have a new GM, it's only been 1 off season of him trying to remake our roster, hopefully he listens and works with Bill but has the balls to tell him to shut up when it's needed. Gaine has a pretty good scouting pedigree, I hope he trusts what he sees more than what Bill see's, but still gets players that work inside the system.
Not sure that the expert consensus was the offense would still suck with Watson starting all year.
Shishkabob
All Pro
Then those people weren't being realistic IMO. People knew the line was going t be really bad, our only reliable receiver on roster was Hopkins. I guess people expected Fuller to stay healthy and that would be the biggest variable there but he didn't stay healthy like usual. But outside of that all we had on offense were rookies and a mediocre RB
I'm with most of your take in this thread. If people can't see the poor coaching on top of the talent & injury issues, they just don't want to see it.
But he changed his OL at halftime because two of the 5 got hurt.
CloakNNNdagger
Hall of Fame
I believe you need to go back and listen to Cosell again...................nowhere did he say that.
Just to clarify, Cosell said Watson leaves the pocket too early. My opinion is that it's due to bad coaching
Shocking
That's true. What I was referring to was playing Rankin at LT and moving to Davenport at RT, which was disastrous and he didn't correct until later. (I erroneously remember Davenport starting the season at RT)
Well it's his job to develop Watson. He can't only take credit for the good things.
Also, O'Briens poor ol and poor blocking TEs contributed to it
Coming off an ACL and puncturing a lung to the point of having to catch a bus to Jacksonville and Fuller getting hurt could've had something to do with this. That and the OL sucking.
Watson has talked about how he's developed. Fix the OL and you will get the best from Watson. Another deep threat WR wouldn't hurt at all either.
He got the punctured lung because obrien mangled the ol. Took half the year for him to figure out who should start.
Or maybe the OL just sucked.
I'm sure that's on BOB too,
Or maybe the talent just wasn't there on the OL last season like I said before the season started.
CloakNNNdagger
Hall of Fame
That's a far cry from anything Cosell said or implied in his interview. In the post I responded to, you attributed your opinion to Cosell.
CloakNNNdagger
Hall of Fame
Dup post
I did not mean to attribute that part to Cosell. Cosell said Watson leaves the pocket early. I said that can be attributed to coach.
Yes the OL sucking is on BOB in my opinion. The OL sucking has been the most consistent aspect of his tenure.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
Yup. Did Gaine force OB to keep Devlin? Did he force Davenport on OB? According to steelb the dude has the heaviest feet since a brontasaur. Any coach should be able to see he is hopeless. So why do OB/Devlin get slack on him? Who's to blame for that unspent cap space after they brought backups in? Blame has to go on one or both but it appears neither gets any.
They didn't have the draft picks to fix the OL last yr and they struck out on Solder. This offseason I fully expect the OL to be fixed with true NFL talent (Not a bunch of backup OL) and draft picks.
I could really see an OL that looks like this.
Trent Brown/Rankin/Martin/Fulton/Drafted rooke
With Kelemete/Henderson/Mancz/Drafted rookie as reserves.
This is a really good yr for OL and Gaine should add atleast 2 OL in the draft.
CB almost as important given the QB's they'll be facing this year
Yep,
That's why I hope they can get a guy like Murphy/Baker and trade back up for a guy like Cajuste or Risner, or vice versa. It really depends on who Gaine can add in FA.
This would be an awesome offseason if Gaine could add a couple of FA CB's like Claiborne and Verrett in FA and draft a guy like Baker. Then add Trent Brown and trade up to the top of the 2nd for a guy like Cajuste if he falls or a guy like Edoga who should be there.
Edoga reminds me so much of a young D, Brown. Not tall 6'3 #/4 a little undersized probably in the 290-295 Lb range with 35 in arm length and great feet. He was awesome in pass pro at the Sr. Bowl and his best yrs are ahead of him. Plus he has the ability to play either LT or RT.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
You were railing at them last offseason for not bringing in better FAs. "They're backups." Why the pass now? - you were proven correct.
It's a better FA class for OL this yr.
Trent Brown/D. Smith are starting level OT's. Not the backup types that were brought in last yr.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
Trent Brown was available last year.
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