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Official Brock Osweiler MVP Watch Thread!
- Thread starter 76Texan
- Start date
CloakNNNdagger
Hall of Fame
Jayson Braddock Verified account @JaysonBraddock
Half of the 6 QBs w the most INTs in the NFL play in the AFCs Bortles, Osweiler, Mariota. 2 of remaining 3 are former Texans: Fitz, Keenum
The 3 worst INT% among starting NFL QBs for the 2016 season: Fitzpatrick 4.3 Keenum 3.9 Osweiler 3.0
Half of the 6 QBs w the most INTs in the NFL play in the AFCs Bortles, Osweiler, Mariota. 2 of remaining 3 are former Texans: Fitz, Keenum
The 3 worst INT% among starting NFL QBs for the 2016 season: Fitzpatrick 4.3 Keenum 3.9 Osweiler 3.0
Max
Veteran
I guess we now know who our next starting qb will be - whoever that 6th guy is.
CloakNNNdagger
Hall of Fame
The above statements/conclusions are not entirely accurate.................here is a site I came across that follows INT%:
Quarterback Interception Rate - INT% (minimum 50 pass attempts)
Player Team INTs Att Interceptions %
1 Derek Anderson CAR 4 52 7.70
2 Josh McCown CLE 4 82 4.90
3 Ryan Fitzpatrick NYJ 13 299 4.30
4 Blaine Gabbert SF 6 150 4.00
5 Case Keenum LA 11 283 3.90
6 Brock Osweiler HOU 9 297 3.00
7 Blake Bortles JAX 10 331 3.00
8 Jameis Winston TB 9 306 2.90
9 Ryan Tannehill MIA 7 241 2.90
10 Marcus Mariota TEN 8 291 2.70
11 Jay Cutler CHI 2 77 2.60
12 Eli Manning NYG 8 306 2.60
13 Ben Roethlisberger PIT 7 271 2.60
14 Cam Newton CAR 6 239 2.50
15 Kirk Cousins WAS 7 321 2.20
16 Philip Rivers SD 7 325 2.20
17 Carson Palmer ARI 6 282 2.10
18 Joe Flacco BAL 7 338 2.10
19 Colin Kaepernick SF 2 102 2.00
20 Andrew Luck IND 7 347 2.00
21 Trevor Siemian DEN 5 251 2.00
22 Carson Wentz PHI 5 275 1.80
23 Paxton Lynch DEN 1 59 1.70
24 Matthew Stafford DET 5 318 1.60
25 Aaron Rodgers GB 5 318 1.60
26 Drew Brees NO 5 347 1.40
27 Matt Ryan ATL 4 313 1.30
28 Tyrod Taylor BUF 3 268 1.10
29 Andy Dalton CIN 3 288 1.00
30 Alex Smith KC 2 233 0.90
31 Derek Carr OAK 3 354 0.80
32 Dak Prescott DAL 2 248 0.80
33 Russell Wilson SEA 2 267 0.70
34 Cody Kessler CLE 1 160 0.60
35 Sam Bradford MIN 1 243 0.40
36 Brian Hoyer CHI 0 200 0.00
37 Jimmy Garoppolo NE 0 60 0.00
38 Tom Brady NE 0 134 0.00
39 Jacoby Brissett NE 0 55 0.00
40 Nick Foles KC 0 55 0.00
I tend to procrasinate but count me down
Max
Veteran
I’m going to get destroyed for this, but here goes. 3 plays stood out to me today where Os looked bad: he didn’t take anything off of a short throw to Brax, he didn’t let a screen play develop and he threw the ball too early (to Hunt I believe but may have been Miller) and another early throw to Hop in the flats where Hop didn’t have a chance to get his head around before the ball was there. A fourth play would have been his downfield throw to Hop on the left sideline but he got bailed out by a pass interference call – the ball looked like it was thrown up for grabs and not placed well. I’m feeling like we’re back to where we were earlier in the year in that Os is not being given a chance to get a rhythm going.
As far as accuracy goes, I feel like I watched a different game than many others on the board – I didn’t really see any balls thrown inaccurately save the one mentioned to Hop. The other 2 I mentioned were timing issues and one was not taking anything off of the throw (it was a little inaccurate but catchable if there was some touch on the ball). Overall, I’m actually encouraged that Brock may be able to hit the broad side of a barn after all.
The majority of the problem I saw today in our passing game was the same problem I’ve been seeing all year – the receivers are not getting any separation. Every throw is being contested and the windows are too small to expect reasonable success. I think that this is a combination of route running (play calling) and receivers not beating press coverage. I don’t know what’s going on w/ Hop. I didn’t pay attention to how he’s beat press coverage in the past because there was never a need to – he always beat it. I just know that it’s not happening this year.
I’m also concerned that we’re not thinking ahead as far as getting our passing game going. Running the ball this much got the job done today – but if our passing game doesn’t get going, we’re not going to beat better teams and have no chance of making a playoff run. We need to get Os going and can’t expect him to just turn it on when needed.
As far as accuracy goes, I feel like I watched a different game than many others on the board – I didn’t really see any balls thrown inaccurately save the one mentioned to Hop. The other 2 I mentioned were timing issues and one was not taking anything off of the throw (it was a little inaccurate but catchable if there was some touch on the ball). Overall, I’m actually encouraged that Brock may be able to hit the broad side of a barn after all.
The majority of the problem I saw today in our passing game was the same problem I’ve been seeing all year – the receivers are not getting any separation. Every throw is being contested and the windows are too small to expect reasonable success. I think that this is a combination of route running (play calling) and receivers not beating press coverage. I don’t know what’s going on w/ Hop. I didn’t pay attention to how he’s beat press coverage in the past because there was never a need to – he always beat it. I just know that it’s not happening this year.
I’m also concerned that we’re not thinking ahead as far as getting our passing game going. Running the ball this much got the job done today – but if our passing game doesn’t get going, we’re not going to beat better teams and have no chance of making a playoff run. We need to get Os going and can’t expect him to just turn it on when needed.
Speedy
Former Yeller Dweller
Will have to wait until the all 22 is out but I can recall seeing a couple of plays where the receiver is open and Brock is late with the delivery. Could be a big reason there's so many contested, small window type plays.
I have a hard time believing that Hopkins can't get separation all of a sudden when that hasn't seemed to have been the case before this season. Not to mention that when he is tightly covered Nuk could still make a play on the ball where Brock can't put it where he can even do that.
Max
Veteran
I'm certainly open to the possibility that the problem is that Brock sucks and it's as simple as that -- I'm just not sure that this week demonstrated that w/ what he was asked to do. If BoB is going to stick with Brock, he needs to do everything he can to get his pump primed by playoff time (if we even get there). If this is going to be the offensive game plan the rest of the year, we might as well pack it up.
Texas Jake
Rookie
I think as long as we are winning Brock will be QB. I would like to see what this offense can do with Savage or Weeden at QB. At this point I would be reluctant to make that change, though, if I were HC. There is no guarantee that either would do better, and when the team is winning and leading the division, I don't think you want to make that kind of change. Brock is not costing us any games - he's not doing a lot to help win games, but he has not been "Hoyer vs. the Chiefs - cost us the game" bad. If Brock stinks it up and costs us the game in Mexico, then it might be a good time to make a change at QB and maybe that would be enough to force BOB's hand and make a move. I think the Hoyer/Mallet fiasco to start the season last year has made BOB reluctant to change QBs and was a big reason he didn't pull Hoyer in the play-off game vs. KC. That combined with the fact that Brock was suppose to be the answer makes it a big hurdle for BOB to get over before he makes a change at QB even in the second half of a game in which QB play is costing any chance to win.
Max
Veteran
W/ your first take on run, run, run, pass -- I'm curious what you saw today that makes you want to make the switch. Just discussing -- not trying to be an a-hole. I feel like if you're going to make a switch -- at least call some plays that gives him a chance to show whether or not he's improving. I don't know any more about Brock today than I did 2 weeks ago other than I feel like he may be improving w/ his accuracy and maybe making better decisions (w/ no interceptions).
Number19
Hall of Fame
I believe we all, at least most, realize this. Doesn't change the fact that many of us believe that this isn't the best direction the team could take. I had the frightening thought this afternoon that if we win the division and go one and out in the playoffs, again, Oz will be our QB next year and we'll be in the same mediocre position. Oz simply has shown he doesn't have a high up side.
Thorn
Dirty Old Man
Brock has had just enough (although few) good moments to give hope to the hopeless. I don't think he's going to turn into something good like Schaub did though.
I do remember though, spending a lot of Schaub's first season here trashing him. LOL
Max
Veteran
For me, this brings up the ongoing question, what is the identity of our team? Obviously everyone agrees that we need to improve throwing the ball, but what is this supposed to look like when the offense is clicking? I personally don't think we're equipped for a run, run pass team right now with this offensive line. Much of our running yardage is coming from big plays -- we're not getting 3-4 yards consistently, but are usually stuffed at LOS on the first 2 runs leaving us 3rd and long and asking an out of rhythm Os to be the hero on 3rd and long too often. Brock sucks! So do most qb's in that scenario. We need to get this passing game going earlier in the game and earlier in downs, get Os into a rhythm and I think our running game will actually improve as we get safeties and lb's on their heels. The game plan we had today worked today -- but it's not going to against better teams and we're running out of time to figure out if Brock is up to putting the team on his back when we need him to.
I really want to believe but unlike others here I don't see much to be happy about.
Today he completed 51.8% of his passes for 99 freaking yards. He is averaging 202 yards a game, that's very pedestrian for a fifth year guy.
Hop looks like JAG with him at center, that speaks volumes. I get that this team had to something after last season, and that he won't be benched anytime soon, but he is at best a back up in this league period.
Today he completed 51.8% of his passes for 99 freaking yards. He is averaging 202 yards a game, that's very pedestrian for a fifth year guy.
Hop looks like JAG with him at center, that speaks volumes. I get that this team had to something after last season, and that he won't be benched anytime soon, but he is at best a back up in this league period.
He also threw several away. might have looked like he was trying to connect deep, but I think he was just throwing the ball away. being ultra conservative. maybe he would have thrown something for our guys to make a play on, if the game was closer.
as far as getting the passing game going, eh...
teams win Super Bowls. those were dang good teams that won Brady's first two Super Bowls. team wins that won Roethlisberger's first super bowl, dang good teams that won Elway's two rings & Peyton's two rings.
our team is very close, I think, to be that kind of team where our QB only needs to make plays when he needs to make plays. Brock is definitely not a "carry the team on his shoulders" yet. hopefully he's a "the guys rally around him" kind of guy... for now anyway.
H
humblegeo
Guest
Osweiler is not much of a quarterback. Almost all his passes are off target, out of bounds or thrown too hard or too low. Most everything Hopkins catches is off target and takes an unbeleavable effort to even catch. After 9 games now, there is no doubt in my mind that Savage is the better of the two. Todays effort of less than 100 yards passing is just pathetic!!!
Texas Jake
Rookie
I didn't say I think we should make the switch. I said I would like to see what this offense can do we those two. I don't think you change QB when you are winning and lead the division. But I am really curious as to what this offense would look like with Savage or Weeden. And I think we are all hungry for good QB play. As long as we are winning and the QB is not costing us games, I don't think you should make the switch. You have to hope Brock can elevate his game and figure it out by the time we reach the playoffs.
Max
Veteran
We're back to our conversation earlier in the week and we see it different. Even with our running game and defense playing at its full potential, I don't see us as a SB contender without this passing game improving a lot. I know that you agree that the passing game needs to improve, but I still think we differ on the degree to which it needs to improve. The 3rd down pass to Hop at the end of the game was clutch -- he's got it in him. I think they brought in Os because they thought he was big game clutch. But I don't think they're doing near enough to get everything out of him and waiting until the end of a game to come up big for us is too much to ask.
There is no way you guys are ready for this team to draft a QB in the first round.
we'd likely see this kind of play for two or three years with a rookie. a rookie drop back passer anyway.
we're watching Derek Carr's rookie season, Blake Bortles rookie season, maybe even Kirk Cousins' first year as starter. hopefully we've only got a few more games of this, where Brock turns it around & is playing well going into the playoffs. Where it took Carr & Bortles two full seasons... Cousins 9 or 10 games.
or maybe this is Joe Flacco's rookie season. is our defense as good as that defense? no. but we know Osweiler isn't Tom Brady either right?
klockWork
Rookie
Guys, I'm so disgusted by Osweiler QB play that not only do I think he's the worst QB the NFL has ever seen, I actually think if you give Braxton Miller a week to prepare to play as a QB again I've no doubt believe he can be more productive than Brock. It will be an offense consists of wildcats, QB options, screens, and bootlegs that would yield at least 200 yards of total offense at the QB position.
If Osweiler was the only QB you ever saw played and someone showed you game footage of Tim Tebow NFL days it would be an easy thing for a person to say that that guy is a way better QB than Brock.
If Osweiler was the only QB you ever saw played and someone showed you game footage of Tim Tebow NFL days it would be an easy thing for a person to say that that guy is a way better QB than Brock.
we heard this same kind of talk about every player not named AJ early on (not saying from you) ...
enjoy it while you can
Max
Veteran
Yeah, but Tebow could do that jump pass thingy so it's a little bit of an unfair comparison.
If allowing the Jags to score 21 points is the best this defense can do, why are we even talking about the QB?
if we're lining up with an empty backfield on 3rd & 2 (or 1) why are we even talking about the QB?
as bad as our QB played, we should have scored 30 points. we only scored 24 because our kicker shanks two kicks. plenty of leg, neither blocked or tipped. he "just" missed.
Max
Veteran
Because this may be the best (or close to) the best our defense can do? This has been my point in our discussion. I've said for a while that I think defense is going to be a big concern as the year progresses. I really don't expect better from them than what we saw today.
powda
The bridge between stupid and useless is short.
I watched bortles botch two sure tds today. I watched an offense win in spite of os. The series where we ran, ran, and ran some more - only to be stalled by os says all you need to know.
Dude(os) is to shell shocked to use one of the best wr's in the game beyond 10 yards. Have we watched a single game os won? He's not the answer and i expect the raiders to castrate this team.
Dude(os) is to shell shocked to use one of the best wr's in the game beyond 10 yards. Have we watched a single game os won? He's not the answer and i expect the raiders to castrate this team.
Scooter
Funky
You forgot the interception at mid field where Bortles dumb luck bounced one off his back's foot - that we got nothing out of.
Grams
Veteran
I would say the OT win against the Colts was Os.
However you could be right about the Raiders.
Texansballer74
The Marine
I am also seeing a quarterback that doesn't have any composure in the pocket. Even when he had time it look like he was in a rush to get the hot potato out of his hands. I was screaming at my phone, "go through your progressions". Dude was locked in on his first option every freaking time.
These refs are allowing the corners to be extremely physical with Hop. On that offensive pass interference call, Hop was trying to do a swim maneuver, but the corner was mugging him. How the refs didn't see that is beyond me. This is causing a lot of timing issues.
Brock's ball placement is very inconsistent. One minute he's throwing a beautiful pass and then next pass I'm like wth was that Brock.
FirstTexansFan
The Unknown Fan
I'm ready for the Osweiler experiment to end. I've seen more than enough to determine he's not an NFL caliber QB. Bring out Savage, add an L to his name and let's Salvage what's left of this season. Take this Coach as well, he couldn't lead a fly to a trash can.
Texansballer74
The Marine
I'm not going to go that far with that notion of Savage being better, because nobody really knows. How can any body say he's better without any real time data. That's just ludicrous to say the least.
& if this is the best our defense can do, we're not getting out of the Wild Card round.
We barely beat the Jags... defense gave up 21 points. Kicker missed six points... but the main thing we're worried about is that our QB only threw for 99 yards. Never mind the two touchdowns & no interceptions.
I think we're saying the same thing. Our QB is only going to improve so much. Our defense is only going to improve so much. But both need to happen if we're to advance in the playoffs.
Texansballer74
The Marine
That's because the QB is a big time concern at this point. You know I posted we should see some big time improvement after the bi from Brock. Yesterday wasn't an indication of that Thunder, dude is still making the same mistakes, mechanics have not changed, the mental toughness is not there and he refuses to go through his progressions when he has time. We know were not going to see him pulled so he has to get better if this team wants to make any serious noise in the playoff's. Oh and " hand clapping over here" finally he didn't throw a pick. Those two TD passes were very easy, we could've completed those brother.
Yes Novak missed two FG's in which resulted in scoring drives for the Jaguars.
Yes the defense ended up giving up 21 points. But dang it man our offense suppose to much better than this. A lot of us really thought we will finally see a high powered scoring machine. Man after the 1st two games were not seeing that many big plays throwing the ball down field.
Brandon420tx
Flounder
You know what, this is strange. He definitely was more accurate in pre-season. I mean it could have been defense weren't adjusting to him and the offense yet. Which apparently isn't hard when all you need to do is hit Brock a few times and play press man coverage under 2 deep safeties 100% of the time.
our kicker isn't getting paid the big bucks.
If KJ doesn't come up with that pick-six, we lose this game
I've rewatched the game and you're correct. Osweiler doesn't even try to look off the safeties. He locks in on his first read AT THE SNAP and never looks away. On those deep attempts, if the target isn't open he just threw the ball into the sidelines. Never looked anywhere else.
Is Os worse than Hoyer? Playcalling looks drastically different to me. New OL, RB, WR's ... Is it really all the QB?
Texansballer74
The Marine
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
Then fire OB. He's made a hash of QB so far and now fans know better that the backup is better.
Texansballer74
The Marine
Hahaha yeah let's fire OB rant.
The backup is always popular when your quarterback play is as bad as ours.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
Seems to me critical part of being an offensive coach is being able to spot a QB.
Hahaha that away.
PS - I'm not a Savage fan.
Were all those "new" pieces in OTAs, training camp, and pre-season?
They still need MORE time?
Initially I defended Osweiler by saying that holding a clipboard behind Manning and him being at training camp and pre-season here wasn't the same as real game experience. You guys told me I was full of it and he should be waaay better than he's showing.
which is it?
Edit:
That sh!tty playoff game notwithstanding, I've seen better from Hoyer (note his play with the Bears) than I have from Osweiler this season. This year Hoyer has a 67% completion rate, 6 TDs, 1440+ yds, and ZERO INTs. Are Osweiler's stats that good?
Do I want Hoyer back? again, no. I just want Osweiler to be as good as he was during his first Texans' start against the Bears.
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