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The All Encompassing FIRE KUBIAK & REPLACEMENT thread

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Cowher is the only coach AVAILABLE (<---- key word) that would be worth firing Kubiak for. And unless he's already called Bob McNair and said, "Hey, Bob - if you decide to make a change, I'm available", then it's not worth the risk. You may end up with some other castoff like Big Shanny, Dick Jauron, or Herm Edwards if you do and Cowher says no. I'd rather ride the storm with Kubiak as long as he has the offensive side of the ball working. He'll eventually get the defense turned around.

what makes you think he will get the defense turned around? this is year 4 and its still not turned around...are we supposed to just sit around and be a losing franchise until Gary finally hires someone worth a crap.

As for Dick Jauron and Herm Edwards, both of those coaches are better than Kubiak and so is Gruden, Cowher, Schotty, Shanahan, and just about anyone.

Gary has done a great job with the offense but has been a disaster with defense.
 
what makes you think he will get the defense turned around? this is year 4 and its still not turned around...are we supposed to just sit around and be a losing franchise until Gary finally hires someone worth a crap.

As for Dick Jauron and Herm Edwards, both of those coaches are better than Kubiak and so is Gruden, Cowher, Schotty, Shanahan, and just about anyone.

Gary has done a great job with the offense but has been a disaster with defense.

He's still a first-time head coach. He had an absolute mess on both sides of the ball. He focused on his forte - the offense - for four years and trusted Dick Smith to take care of the defense. Smith was a failure, and you can tell just from his press conferences and talk shows that his focus is for the first time 100% on defense. Yeah, he might have taken a year too long to turn to the defense, but again - it's a mistake I think a first-timer could make. I'm still on the side of keeping him through his contract, no matter how this season turns out, as long as the offense is still a top producer. If one side of the ball is firing and you can put it on auto-pilot, everyone in the organization can crack the whip on the other side.
 
:confused:

Where you going with this, TB?

Yeah, I was wondering that too. Okoye had a strong game this week (probably the only guy on defense that did) and if he continues, looks like he may finally be developing into a worthy first-round pick. We didn't draft Busing or Wilson, Bennett was a 4th round pick...and Dunta had a career-hindering injury. They're TRYING to fix the defense, but there's only so many early picks and so much money to go around.
 
Yeah, I was wondering that too. Okoye had a strong game this week (probably the only guy on defense that did) and if he continues, looks like he may finally be developing into a worthy first-round pick. We didn't draft Busing or Wilson, Bennett was a 4th round pick...and Dunta had a career-hindering injury. They're TRYING to fix the defense, but there's only so many early picks and so much money to go around.

1 game in 3 seasons?

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/End rant. I just didn't get my frustrations out yesterday. Those guys are great.
 
I'd hire Schottenheimer in a heartbeat as well, with the same (lack of) hesitation.

I'd hire Fisher a hell of a lot quicker than I'd hire Schottenheimer. Fisher doesn't screw up that loaded team that choked at home to NE. Of course I type that knowing what happened to the Titans last year versus BAL.

I'd go for some Martyball at this point. I'm beginning to have my doubts about Kubiak's ability to get this ship completely righted. Maybe I'm jumping the gun, but that D just hasn't gotten any better. The team is really inconsistent, IMO, and I keep thinking that it has to go back to the coach. Period. Other teams are doing more with less - why isn't Gary?

I know Marty is a choker, but his teams are at least relevant in December which is a damn sight more than I can say for Kubiak so far. If Marty were to come in (which I doubt and all of this is strictly waaaay out in left field pie in the sky conjecture) and get this team on the right track, then we might have an easier time getting a big name coach to come in. Not many coaches want to come in and take over a turd.
 
1 game in 3 seasons?

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/End rant. I just didn't get my frustrations out yesterday. Those guys are great.

I think I'm tired of slow SS/FS , bad CBs , shopping cart DTs , 1 DE , but hey the LBs are looking better .

Their on their 3rd DL coach in 4 years ... hmmm .... maybe it's not the coach . We're on the 2nd DB coach ... hmmm ... maybe it's not the coach .

I'm tired of a small OL to . How I yearn for a big physical OL who can dominate a game . The good news is we may already have some pieces .

Having said all the above , if we lose the next 2/3 ... I'm firing folks . If we are not in the playoff race come December ... firing . That's not just Kubiak , it's Smith also , who's forte is supposed to be scouting DB's .
 
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it's not hte coaches fault, its the fault of the guys who are hiring such bad and unqualified coaches.

when you nickel and dime on coaches, this is what you get. Kollar is the first coach who actually was coveted by other teams that we convinced to come here to help our defense.

i am just sick of excuses. this is year 4 and Kubiak still doesnt have a decent defense. THAT IS ON HIM. No excuses. He hired Smith. He hired Bush.

Both guys suck. There is no debate. There is enough talent to win if the scheme is run competently. The coaching staff on defense is incompetent.

It really is that easy. Ray Rhodes is way past his prime. Kollar is good but everyone else sucks and that includes Bush.

Do we have to sit through another 2-14 season before we can actually get some change in this organization? I am sick of this pathetic coaching staff.

It's a nickel and dime staff comprised of losers and cronies and Kollar.
 
it's not hte coaches fault, its the fault of the guys who are hiring such bad and unqualified coaches.

when you nickel and dime on coaches, this is what you get. Kollar is the first coach who actually was coveted by other teams that we convinced to come here to help our defense.

i am just sick of excuses. this is year 4 and Kubiak still doesnt have a decent defense. THAT IS ON HIM. No excuses. He hired Smith. He hired Bush.

Both guys suck. There is no debate. There is enough talent to win if the scheme is run competently. The coaching staff on defense is incompetent.

It really is that easy. Ray Rhodes is way past his prime. Kollar is good but everyone else sucks and that includes Bush.

Do we have to sit through another 2-14 season before we can actually get some change in this organization? I am sick of this pathetic coaching staff.

It's a nickel and dime staff comprised of losers and cronies and Kollar.


SH, It's a valid point to want a more experienced staff. However, the constant insinuation you make that McNair hires the men he does in order to save a buck is baseless. There is no evidence to suggest that is the case. McNair's original hires at GM, head coach, and OC were all men with a lot of experience.

I'm still expecting 10 wins this year, so I'm not ready to jump off the cliff. In 2005, I was already rooting against the team by week 3 because I wanted a bad enough season to clean house. I don't see anything resembling that situation happening this season.

If Kubiak fails, I would love to see Schottenheimer come in here. I think he's a great coach and find the "choker" label to be quite silly.
 
SH, It's a valid point to want a more experienced staff. However, the constant insinuation you make that McNair hires the men he does in order to save a buck is baseless. There is no evidence to suggest that is the case. McNair's original hires at GM, head coach, and OC were all men with a lot of experience.

I'm still expecting 10 wins this year, so I'm not ready to jump off the cliff. In 2005, I was already rooting against the team by week 3 because I wanted a bad enough season to clean house. I don't see anything resembling that situation happening this season.

If Kubiak fails, I would love to see Schottenheimer come in here. I think he's a great coach and find the "choker" label to be quite silly.

so he didn't hire them to save money? why else did he hire them? it sure wasn't their experience or qualifications.

I am just trying to find a reason that Bush was hired/promoted. The only reason i can come up with is that he is Kubiaks friend and I am sure it didn't hurt that he was dirt cheap and already on the payroll.

just sayin...
 
so he didn't hire them to save money? why else did he hire them? it sure wasn't their experience or qualifications.

I am just trying to find a reason that Bush was hired/promoted. The only reason i can come up with is that he is Kubiaks friend and I am sure it didn't hurt that he was dirt cheap and already on the payroll.

just sayin...

There are reasons to hire a guy other than experience. McNair was impressed with Kubiak. You know, the NFL has a high opinion of the guy and he would've been a head coach somewhere. Regarding Bush, I think McNair had absolutely nothing to do with that hire. And, he is right to not dictate hirings to Kubiak. Kubiak believed in Bush and wanted him as his DC back in 2006. I'm not sure his exact reasonings but I'm sure it wasn't to save Bob McNair a few $100,000.

Personally, I kind of like the Bush hire and am optimistic about him. I think this season's problems go directly to how Kubiak, Smith, and Bush assessed the talent on the team. For reasons I don't understand, they decided to stand pat at Safety... As a result, we are in a world of trouble back there.
 
It's not even like Kubiak lacked qualifications, either.

He has a handful of SB rings, have coached under one of the best offensive systems in the league, played next to one of the best QB in the history of the league, and had extensive experience calling plays in the NFL. He was entirely qualified to take a head coaching position.

And, to top that off, he is pretty much a polar opposite of Capers.

I don't know if McNair would be unwilling to spend the money on a great head coach, but he's never given me a reason to think he wouldn't and, to the contrary, has done everything to make me think he would
 
He's still a first-time head coach.

No he's not, this is his 4th year as a head coach. Eventually that excuse has to go. Especially after 3 teams including the 1-15 Dolphins made the playoffs with real first time head coaches last season.

He's had 4 years and aside from the offense we still have the same terrible defense (although now at least we have Mario, Meco, and Cushing), the same inconsistent performances, and the same terrible game management. Not to mention there is no team in the NFL who undervalues the safety and DT positions like we do! Only time Smithiak took a real shot at either of them they draft a project DT ahead of NFL ready players like SEC DPOY Patrick Willis and CB Darelle Revis.

Kubiak's inability to hire out of his comfort zone will prove to be the nail in the coffin for his Head Coaching run in Houston.
 
If Kubiak fails, I would love to see Schottenheimer come in here. I think he's a great coach and find the "choker" label to be quite silly.

I won't argue that he's a great coach. I wholeheartedly support that notion. You can't deny the 200-126-1 coaching record.... He's 5-13 in the postseason, though, and SD getting "debacled" by NE back in 07 still jumps out at me.

All that said, I'm all for some martyball.
 
Can we blame the players? Yes, but it ain't all their fault.

If Dungy was head coach, and Rex Ryan was D-Coordinator, would the Texans D be this bad with the exact same players?

NO FREAKING WAY.
 
:thinking:

Fred Bennett
Dunta Robinson
John Busing
Eugene Wilson
Amobi Okoye

Can we blame the players? Yes, but it ain't all their fault.

If Dungy was head coach, and Rex Ryan was D-Coordinator, would the Texans D be this bad with the exact same players?

NO FREAKING WAY.

Umm . . YES, THEY WOULD.

You can get any spoon out of the drawer, but the pot of soup will still have those same players in it.

(There is no debate. End of story) LOL!
 
Umm . . YES, THEY WOULD.

You can get any spoon out of the drawer, but the pot of soup will still have those same players in it.

(There is no debate. End of story) LOL!

Well said! And to add to that, any team would LOVE to have that combo of coaches. That's like saying, "if our defense had Darelle Rivas and Troy Polamalu, we could be the best defense ever". It ain't gonna happen, so stop with the hypotheticals.
 
Well said! And to add to that, any team would LOVE to have that combo of coaches. That's like saying, "if our defense had Darelle Rivas and Troy Polamalu, we could be the best defense ever". It ain't gonna happen, so stop with the hypotheticals.

Good coaches can scheme to hide weaknesses and play to strengths. Do ours do that?

ummmmm.......

Unless we're running some kind of bizarro scheme that hides strengths and emphasizes weaknesses but I doubt that.... sort of.

Our defense =
bizarro.jpg
 
There are reasons to hire a guy other than experience. McNair was impressed with Kubiak. You know, the NFL has a high opinion of the guy and he would've been a head coach somewhere. Regarding Bush, I think McNair had absolutely nothing to do with that hire. And, he is right to not dictate hirings to Kubiak. Kubiak believed in Bush and wanted him as his DC back in 2006. I'm not sure his exact reasonings but I'm sure it wasn't to save Bob McNair a few $100,000.

Personally, I kind of like the Bush hire and am optimistic about him. I think this season's problems go directly to how Kubiak, Smith, and Bush assessed the talent on the team. For reasons I don't understand, they decided to stand pat at Safety... As a result, we are in a world of trouble back there.

what? you kind of like the Bush hire? you do realize we are on pace to give up more yards than any team in NFL HISTORY!! you do realize he was partially responsible for the horrible defense we have had here the last 2 years, right?

what do you like about the Bush hire? honestly, bro. what has bush done that has made you 'like' the hire? I don't get it.

once again, we are on pace to give up more yards than anyone in NFL history..2 of those games were home games and all 3 were against teams that aren't exactly offensive juggernauts....

i understand that you go down with the ship, dale. that is fine, but you have to at least acknowledge that the defensive ship is sinking and Bush is ultimately responsible for that.

so you release Bush of any blame but you are OK with blaming Kubiak and Smith for the personnel moves....you know what personnel move I think was their worst move. Hiring Bush! (other than resigning Carr to max extension of course..but that was probably Bumbling Bob's fault)
 
Umm . . YES, THEY WOULD.

You can get any spoon out of the drawer, but the pot of soup will still have those same players in it.

(There is no debate. End of story) LOL!

I disgaree wholeheartedly. The Texans' defense is entirely more talented than they are playing. Obviously there are holes, but a defense featuring guys like Dunta, DeMeco, and Mario are not 32nd in the league bad no matter how you try and spin it.

AJ had a great article on that very topic last night:
Some of you may have heard a local radio talk show host rant for the past 24-36 hours about how the Texans defensive woes are due to 'no talent' and as a result he's giving Texans defensive coordinator Frank Bush 'a pass' for the Texans putrid performance over the first three games.

...

The first thing that struck me after hearing that comment was that the Texans had the 22nd ranked defense (in yards per game) last season with no better personnel, and after three games this season, the Texans will most likely be dead last in the league (that would be 32nd) after the completion of tonight's Dallas - Carolina game.

So if the Texans have 'no talent' on defense, is the radio host suggesting the Texans fall from 22 to 32 is due to the loss of Anthony Weaver, Travis Johnson, Morlon Greenwood, Will Demps and C.C. Brown?

AJ plays it safe with his argument and posits that the Texans' personnel is no worse than last season's. I'd comfortably venture that the Texans' personnel is better than last season's. Either way, it'd be pretty hard to argue that we're worse, and if we're not worse personnel-wise, we have to be worse coaching-wise.
 
FIRE FRANK BUSH..do we have to wait for 3 years like we did with Dick Smith?

Kubiak sucks so bad to hire this guy. Kubiak make some new friends. Your friends suck at coaching.
 
nero THE zero said:
Umm . . YES, THEY WOULD.

You can get any spoon out of the drawer, but the pot of soup will still have those same players in it.

(There is no debate. End of story) LOL!

I disgaree wholeheartedly. The Texans' defense is entirely more talented than they are playing. Obviously there are holes, but a defense featuring guys like Dunta, DeMeco, and Mario are not 32nd in the league bad no matter how you try and spin it.

AJ had a great article on that very topic last night:
Some of you may have heard a local radio talk show host rant for the past 24-36 hours about how the Texans defensive woes are due to 'no talent' and as a result he's giving Texans defensive coordinator Frank Bush 'a pass' for the Texans putrid performance over the first three games.

...

The first thing that struck me after hearing that comment was that the Texans had the 22nd ranked defense (in yards per game) last season with no better personnel, and after three games this season, the Texans will most likely be dead last in the league (that would be 32nd) after the completion of tonight's Dallas - Carolina game.

So if the Texans have 'no talent' on defense, is the radio host suggesting the Texans fall from 22 to 32 is due to the loss of Anthony Weaver, Travis Johnson, Morlon Greenwood, Will Demps and C.C. Brown?

AJ plays it safe with his argument and posits that the Texans' personnel is no worse than last season's. I'd comfortably venture that the Texans' personnel is better than last season's. Either way, it'd be pretty hard to argue that we're worse, and if we're not worse personnel-wise, we have to be worse coaching-wise.

We would have been wise to factor in a learning curve with whatever Bush wants to do differently. Especially with Cushing and Dunta missing camp.
 
We would have been wise to factor in a learning curve with whatever Bush wants to do differently. Especially with Cushing and Dunta missing camp.

I think this is key. We honestly can't expect a new DC and new scheme to be effective immediately, especially with two big starters out in TC.

Only time will tell if the defense is going to gel into a cohesive unit. I tend to think we'll see some improvements as time goes on, especially around the halfway mark. Our offense is set to compete with just about anybody, so any improvement on D will most likely result in another 8-8 season (or maybe 9-7 / 7-9, lots of close games ahead).

As far as firing Kubiak or anyone else right now, I am not a fan of mid-season coaching changes. The Palmer situation during 2-14 was a clear indication that the season was essentially over, and without trying to be optimistic, I still think there is a possibility of this season changing course for a more positive destination. Firing coaches is a one way ticket to rebuilding hell. (Don't bank on new HCs turning it around in a year, in spite of what has happened with other teams. This is HOUSTON, after all....)
 
We would have been wise to factor in a learning curve with whatever Bush wants to do differently. Especially with Cushing and Dunta missing camp.

Maybe if it were his first year on the job, but not a team that's trying to get over the hump. That's why they should have hired a guy that's held the position before.

Kubiak knew what he was getting into when he went with Bush. He had ZERO margin for error.
 
Maybe if it were his first year on the job, but not a team that's trying to get over the hump. That's why they should have hired a guy that's held the position before.

Kubiak knew what he was getting into when he went with Bush. He had ZERO margin for error.

Great post. Kubiak should've known that his job and a chance at the playoffs was on the line.

I guess the other thing I have to ask is that Bush knew what he had to work with regardless of not having Reeves and Cushing during TC. I don't get how it didn't occur to him at some point during OTAs, TC and Preseason we had crap at safety and didn't make a move to address it.

I guess he was waiting for a patented Texans wait until a few weeks into the season to make a move at safety.
 
I think this is key. We honestly can't expect a new DC and new scheme to be effective immediately, especially with two big starters out in TC.

Only time will tell if the defense is going to gel into a cohesive unit. I tend to think we'll see some improvements as time goes on, especially around the halfway mark. Our offense is set to compete with just about anybody, so any improvement on D will most likely result in another 8-8 season (or maybe 9-7 / 7-9, lots of close games ahead).

As far as firing Kubiak or anyone else right now, I am not a fan of mid-season coaching changes. The Palmer situation during 2-14 was a clear indication that the season was essentially over, and without trying to be optimistic, I still think there is a possibility of this season changing course for a more positive destination. Firing coaches is a one way ticket to rebuilding hell. (Don't bank on new HCs turning it around in a year, in spite of what has happened with other teams. This is HOUSTON, after all....)

First, let me say that I am not for firing Kubiak in the middle of the season. I do think he is pretty close to earning the "will be fired" title, if he isn't already there.

About the D scheme, I thought it was the same scheme only different playcalling. Seems that we were pretty much told that before the season and its pretty much what I have seen. It looks the same, but more aggressive therefore resulting in bigger plays (mostly bad, but some good). Am I wrong to think that?
 
First, let me say that I am not for firing Kubiak in the middle of the season. I do think he is pretty close to earning the "will be fired" title, if he isn't already there.

About the D scheme, I thought it was the same scheme only different playcalling. Seems that we were pretty much told that before the season and its pretty much what I have seen. It looks the same, but more aggressive therefore resulting in bigger plays (mostly bad, but some good). Am I wrong to think that?

I definitely agree with your first statement. If Kubiak wasn't on the "hot seat" prior to this season, I can't believe that he's not on it now.

The defensive scheme seems to be shrouded in mystery, simply because we have little to go on with regards to a Frank Bush resume, and everything else we have is sugar-coated sound bites from the coaching staff. I think it is borderline stupid to take a bad defense from last season and just do the same thing again but simpler. My previous post was giving them more latitude that something had to be different in the scheme, but that is just speculation on my part. Right now, though, it does look like Richard.Smith.v2 + extra suckiness.
 
These threads are getting old.

All firing any coach mid season is saying is that you have given up on the team for the year. It is not even halfway through the seson yet.

A new coach coming in will change half of the players. (Of course half of the players on defense probably deserve to be changed.) But probably the zone blocking scheme so there goes a bunch of the oline, the one-cut and run RB's as well - which is all of them? The offense will change. So there goes half the fun of watching. Probably a new QB as all these coaches like "their own" QB. Not many coaches are going to get a Flacco or Ryan to play QB. Besides they more or less had decent defenses to start off with. Then back to the wait 3-4 years again. The fire this person or that will start after year 1 again. Or the why did they hire this coach over that coach threads because some of the posters here know so much more that anyone in the NFL.

We are stuck in a time loop - over and over and over again. You don't have to be Harry/Mary Sunshine, but can't we all just lay off the "FIRE" threads till at least halfway through a season?
 
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...but can't we all just lay off the "FIRE" threads till at least halfway through a season?
Can't we lay off the "just lay off the _____" posts? Post what you want. If you don't like a thread's content, don't post in it. Or just say why you don't like it and be done with it.
 
If Kubiak has a losing record through the first 8 games of the season, I think we should can him at the end of the year. My reasoning is that we always seem to play better the last couple games when it's not possible to make the playoffs. I don't know if it's because the other teams are working towards draft picks or are already a lock for the playoffs but it gets us optimistic for next season when all we do is suck again and again.
 
I call bullshit. This team made ALL the right adjustments in the 2nd half, which is what good coaches do. That Arizona offense was completely shut down in the 2nd half. Schaub made one bad decision, and THAT was the difference in this game. And Kubiak reamed him for it. Sorry, this game was NOT on Kubiak. It was on a poor offensive performance in the first half.
 
I call bullshit. This team made ALL the right adjustments in the 2nd half, which is what good coaches do.

Do you know something else good coaches do?.......Good coaches get their teams ready to play a football game from the opening snap. Good coaches don't get in a 21 point hole that they have to spend the rest of the game trying to battle back from... If our boys were ready to play, we win that game, but once again when expectations are put on them they come out flat.

Good news though.....all expectations are now off of this team so now they can play good football........like they usually do after they dig themselves into a hole that they have to try to climb out of. :rolleyes:
 
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I call bullshit. This team made ALL the right adjustments in the 2nd half, which is what good coaches do. That Arizona offense was completely shut down in the 2nd half. Schaub made one bad decision, and THAT was the difference in this game. And Kubiak reamed him for it. Sorry, this game was NOT on Kubiak. It was on a poor offensive performance in the first half.

No no, this is a 16 game, four quarters each, season. This team doesn't show up for an entire game. They have to be punched in the mouth, have their backs against the wall, or whatever cliche you want to use, before they can wake up. More often times than not, they wake up too late.

The offense didn't show up, the defense didn't show up, and the coaching didn't show up. The one thing about this team that is consistent, is their inability to be consistent.

This start with Kubiak, and using his words, "Just didn't have these guys ready to go, and that's my fault."
 
I call bullshit. This team made ALL the right adjustments in the 2nd half, which is what good coaches do. That Arizona offense was completely shut down in the 2nd half. Schaub made one bad decision, and THAT was the difference in this game. And Kubiak reamed him for it. Sorry, this game was NOT on Kubiak. It was on a poor offensive performance in the first half.

Yep we made good adjustments. Yes, good coaches do that. But did you see the way we started the game? Did it look familiar? It should because for just about all the games this season and several games last season, the offense looked flat in the first quarter. Good coaches make adjustments, but they also make sure the team is ready to go from the first play. For whatever reason the team looks lethargic coming out of the gate and needs until the second quarter to wakeup.
 
I think a lot of people need to put their fire Kubiak pistols back in their holsters. There was a long discussion about this in the off season, and many vocal posters, and I believe the majority of the board, were very clear that Kubiak deserved another year, that he was building the Texans "the right way" i.e. slowly, and that those that didn't agree with this were pessimists and worse. Those that liked the way Kubiak did things then should be happy now. Nothing has changed.

As it turns out, this is just the type of performance we pessimists (known to outside observers as "realists") expected. I'm not that disappointed in this season because the team is meeting my expectations.

I'm sure that soon I'll be reading how the next game will prove what the Texans are made of. I think this Cardinals game has already showed us that - again. However, the next game will be a crucial step in the slow building of a better 8-8 team.
 
Im just worried about who McNair would hire if they fire Kubes and crew. Say that happens then what kind of D would the team run + the new staff has to move away from the ZBS and into something else. Im not saying keep Kubes, Im just worried about how this team will look and play each week.
 
I think if we are 7-9 or better at the end of the season, Kubiac and company have one more year. I was really hoping for the home town boy to take this team to the promised land, but it's not looking good right now.
 
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