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Would you make a trade before the trade deadline?

JB said:
Do you even watch the games?
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apparently you guys have a magnifying glass while the games are on .. it should be simple to prove that Fuller is actually running these 'great routes' that yall are implying. Firstly, that would necessitate a creative route combo which has been lacking all year up until the last game. Agree or no? I'll keep going. Fuller has a good ability to mix and match speeds, but he isnt losing guys by jukes, who knows if he's keying routes by body language. You guys are making a claim and I'd like to know what substantiates it. Fuller gets open cuz he's fast as hell, not the same way DHop gets open. Great route running? Key on DHop for sure, even Coutee is a better route runner than Fuller. I'd say that Fuller owes all his success to Deshan Watson, but then I'd be a Texan Hater who doesnt watch any games right?
 
Shishkabob said:
Literally everyone who follows the Texans have mentioned how good of a route runner Fuller has become this year, but yea go on with your uninformed opinions because you rather be cool and edgy, then educated
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LOL ohh okay "everyone" ... because I've tried to dig up any research material on these claims "everyone" is making and NOBODY out there that doesnt have Texan blinders on gives him props for route running, its okay to be a fan, but lets not get carried away.
 
Uncle Rico said:
LOL ohh okay "everyone" ... because I've tried to dig up any research material on these claims "everyone" is making and NOBODY out there that doesnt have Texan blinders on gives him props for route running, its okay to be a fan, but lets not get carried away.
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https://torotimes.com/2018/10/05/houston-texans-will-fuller-is-exceeding-expectations/
https://texanswire.usatoday.com/2018/08/20/espn-texans-wr-will-fuller-breakout-2018/
https://www.houstonchronicle.com/sp...ill-Fuller-developing-into-a-key-12257015.php
https://www.houstonchronicle.com/sp...Will-Fuller-gets-up-to-speed-for-12952129.php
https://www.houstontexans.com/news/will-fuller-confident-in-his-return

There is a few who mention his route running how it has improved, and become very good. Or if you want video evidence go scour PatDStat's twitter for one of the times he has broken it down, or if you ask him I'm sure he will oblige you with evidence
 
Shishkabob said:
https://torotimes.com/2018/10/05/houston-texans-will-fuller-is-exceeding-expectations/
https://texanswire.usatoday.com/2018/08/20/espn-texans-wr-will-fuller-breakout-2018/
https://www.houstonchronicle.com/sp...ill-Fuller-developing-into-a-key-12257015.php
https://www.houstonchronicle.com/sp...Will-Fuller-gets-up-to-speed-for-12952129.php
https://www.houstontexans.com/news/will-fuller-confident-in-his-return

There is a few who mention his route running how it has improved, and become very good. Or if you want video evidence go scour PatDStat's twitter for one of the times he has broken it down, or if you ask him I'm sure he will oblige you with evidence
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You're right, Will Fuller is the next Jerry Rice because the Toro freakin' Times says so LOL .. okay we'll just agree to disagree. At least you didnt quote Pancakes McClain.
 
Uncle Rico said:
You're right, Will Fuller is the next Jerry Rice because the Toro freakin' Times says so LOL .. okay we'll just agree to disagree. At least you didnt quote Pancakes McClain.
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Did I say that? no but I did give 5 separate sources of people who follow the team, meaning they watch our games and practices, complimenting him on his route running. To say he is a bad route runner is just an uneducated take, it's as almost if you are stuck in the logical fallacy that fast guys who run 9 routes will always rely on their speed and never develop as a route runner. For some like Mike Wallace that has held true, for others like a Fuller or AB they have worked to develop that part of their game.
 
Uncle Rico said:
wierd. i would hope that informational snippet came out before the Thomas acquisition, because we signed a wideout, the next logical area of need would have been CB.
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It came out after the DT deal, and I agree with you. However, if there are no CBs available at a good value, then wide receiver it is.
 
Shishkabob said:
Did I say that? no but I did give 5 separate sources of people who follow the team, meaning they watch our games and practices, complimenting him on his route running. To say he is a bad route runner is just an uneducated take, it's as almost if you are stuck in the logical fallacy that fast guys who run 9 routes will always rely on their speed and never develop as a route runner. For some like Mike Wallace that has held true, for others like a Fuller or AB they have worked to develop that part of their game.
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just look through the route charts its all there, no innuendo, no subjectivity .. black and white results. Uneducated is usually when someone just takes "everyones" word on the matter, or only digests homegrown data to make a case. Why no national writing on Fullers route running? Hmmm.

https://nextgenstats.nfl.com/charts.../2018/week/will-fuller/FUL503598/2018/8/route

route-chart_FUL503598_2018-reg-8_1540529025147.jpeg
 
Happy about getting Thomas but I really hope there is a solid OL available too (that doesn't cost us too much)

Hey is Duane Brown available?
 
[QUOTE="chicagotexan2, post: 2875296, member: 10613"

]Happy about getting Thomas but I really hope there is a solid OL available too (that doesn't cost us too much)
[/QUOTE]

There have not been any OL rumored to be on the block, more of the league is short OL than have extra hanging around
 
steelbtexan said:
I dont think I would give up more than a 4th for him. But may do something like a 4th/6th for Thomas. If Gaine was to give up a 3rd Thomas is under contract thru 2019 and you wont find a better WR in the 3rd rd of the draft next offseason than Thomas so I might bite the bullet and give a 3rd for Thomas.
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4th and trading spots in the 7th.

Pretty close to a 4th and a 6th
 
steelbtexan said:
I dont think I would give up more than a 4th for him. But may do something like a 4th/6th for Thomas. If Gaine was to give up a 3rd Thomas is under contract thru 2019 and you wont find a better WR in the 3rd rd of the draft next offseason than Thomas so I might bite the bullet and give a 3rd for Thomas.
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4th and trading spots in the 7th.

Pretty close to a 4th and a 6th
 
steelbtexan said:
Still not far off.
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My understanding is that we swapped 7th's with Denver? Is that correct? I know it wasn't clear at first.

But if that's the case, then we would actually move UP in the 7th, not down - IF we finish ahead of Denver.

If Denver finishes better than us, then we would only move down the difference in spots.

So I'm confused as to how this is close to giving up a 6th? It's not even close to giving up a 7th.
 
Bull Durham said:
My understanding is that we swapped 7th's with Denver? Is that correct? I know it wasn't clear at first.

But if that's the case, then we would actually move UP in the 7th, not down - IF we finish ahead of Denver.

If Denver finishes better than us, then we would only move down the difference in spots.

So I'm confused as to how this is close to giving up a 6th? It's not even close to giving up a 7th.
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actually Denver doesn't have its own 7th anymore due to a previous trade, the 7th they are swapping is the Giants, who as it stands currently have the #1 pick
 
Uncle Rico said:
just look through the route charts its all there, no innuendo, no subjectivity .. black and white results. Uneducated is usually when someone just takes "everyones" word on the matter, or only digests homegrown data to make a case. Why no national writing on Fullers route running? Hmmm.

https://nextgenstats.nfl.com/charts.../2018/week/will-fuller/FUL503598/2018/8/route

route-chart_FUL503598_2018-reg-8_1540529025147.jpeg
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lol you're a joke, watch the game film see the crispness of his routes, how he is in and out of his breaks, the slight studder steps he gives to create separation and get open. Yea no ones routes look impressive when you look at only 5 of them as lines. I can watch film and see good routes being ran, I don't think you have that ability
 
Bull Durham said:
My understanding is that we swapped 7th's with Denver? Is that correct? I know it wasn't clear at first.

But if that's the case, then we would actually move UP in the 7th, not down - IF we finish ahead of Denver.

If Denver finishes better than us, then we would only move down the difference in spots.

So I'm confused as to how this is close to giving up a 6th? It's not even close to giving up a 7th.
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When this 1st came out I thought it was a 4th and a 7th.
 
Uncle Rico said:
just look through the route charts its all there, no innuendo, no subjectivity .. black and white results. Uneducated is usually when someone just takes "everyones" word on the matter, or only digests homegrown data to make a case. Why no national writing on Fullers route running? Hmmm.

https://nextgenstats.nfl.com/charts.../2018/week/will-fuller/FUL503598/2018/8/route

route-chart_FUL503598_2018-reg-8_1540529025147.jpeg
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So to you, five catches for 125 yds = bad route running?

I'll take that every game, thank you.
 
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I like the Thomas deal b/c it didn't cost the Texans too much and even improved the draft position in RD7. The key will be how this plays out in 2019 especially if he produces down the stretch for the team.
 
OptimisticTexan said:
I like the Thomas deal b/c it didn't cost the Texans too much and even improved the draft position in RD7. The key will be how this plays out in 2019 especially if he produces down the stretch for the team.
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When Fuller comes back health, Thomas will be the third receiver on this team.
Right now, he's an affordable rental at $4.5M for the rest of the year.
If he does well, the Texans will have some difficulty renegotiating the remaining of his contract, which call for $14M on 2019.
How much do you think the Texans will be willing to spend on a no. 3 receiver?

I have a hard time seeing him on the roster next year.

The plus is that he knows he needs to perform to get the money next year, so he should be going hard for it - I hope.
 
ObsiWan said:
So to you, five catches for 125 yds = bad route running?

I'll take that every game, thank you.
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Of course not, results are what you want, and Fuller gets results by blowing past his defender and catching 70 yard bombs. Not because he's run a 10 yard dig, planted in one direction, lost his man and was at the precise location that Watson expected all the while never giving up a read, no telegraph exact body motion each route .. routinely. The claim that he's a 'great route runner' is exaggerated.

For the record I think Fuller is a great player for THIS SYSTEM .. his route running was never a strength in college or a detriment, his biggest risk factor was that he was prone to drops being a body catcher and not using his hands, but he's proven very reliable in that respect as a pro. As far as the chart compare the little squiggly lines between different receivers, you'll notice the guys who are actually out there running routes and getting open, nice, lazy long lines? Go routes, WR not in play etc...
 
76Texan said:
When Fuller comes back health, Thomas will be the third receiver on this team.
Right now, he's an affordable rental at $4.5M for the rest of the year.
If he does well, the Texans will have some difficulty renegotiating the remaining of his contract, which call for $14M on 2019.
How much do you think the Texans will be willing to spend on a no. 3 receiver?

I have a hard time seeing him on the roster next year.

The plus is that he knows he needs to perform to get the money next year, so he should be going hard for it - I hope.
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Wouldn't it be fair to assume that the Texans could very well find themselves in the very same situation next season based on WFV's track record of health? Not to mention, it's not like Coutee has stepped in and shown he's going to be healthy for 12+ games a season either.
 
OptimisticTexan said:
Wouldn't it be fair to assume that the Texans could very well find themselves in the very same situation next season based on WFV's track record of health? Not to mention, it's not like Coutee has stepped in and shown he's going to be healthy for 12+ games a season either.
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I was just glancing at the team's cap space and I noticed that the Texans picked up Kevin Johnson's fifth year option for over $9M guaranteed for injury only.
What does that mean exactly, does anybody know?

Will JJoseph return as good as he was before history last injury?

Fuller will be on the last year of his contract.
Will he want to reup his contract for more money?

What about Clowney, Kareem, Mathieu .

It looks like the Texans will have about $53M to take care of the last 4 guys (and a bunch of smaller ones).
https://overthecap.com/calculator/houston-texans/

KJo and DT's numbers are already included.

It certainly looks possible if the Texans don't sign any FA of note, but that would mean continuing problem on the offensive line.

Oh well, what's the use worrying about it all.
OB is going to fix it, isn't he? :barman:
 
Uncle Rico said:
Of course not, results are what you want, and Fuller gets results by blowing past his defender and catching 70 yard bombs. Not because he's run a 10 yard dig, planted in one direction, lost his man and was at the precise location that Watson expected all the while never giving up a read, no telegraph exact body motion each route .. routinely. The claim that he's a 'great route runner' is exaggerated.

For the record I think Fuller is a great player for THIS SYSTEM .. his route running was never a strength in college or a detriment, his biggest risk factor was that he was prone to drops being a body catcher and not using his hands, but he's proven very reliable in that respect as a pro. As far as the chart compare the little squiggly lines between different receivers, you'll notice the guys who are actually out there running routes and getting open, nice, lazy long lines? Go routes, WR not in play etc...
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When have you seen the Watson throw timing passes in the strict definition of the term - you know where the QB releases the ball before the WR/TE makes his break?? That's the kind of offense that demands the kind of route running you described.
Second, I need to re-read this part of the thread, but I don't remember saying Fuller was a great route runner. I think the assessment was that he's improved. No one, I don't think, said he was perfect at it.
 
76Texan said:
I was just glancing at the team's cap space and I noticed that the Texans picked up Kevin Johnson's fifth year option for over $9M guaranteed for injury only.
What does that mean exactly, does anybody know?
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It means that KJ can be released before the option kicks in (First game in 2019) based on performance. If KJ's injuries from this season (or any injury from now until the option kicks in) make him unable to perform in 2019, his contract is guaranteed.

The Texans will have to make the same decision on Fuller's 5th year option next offseason.
 
Lucky said:
It means that KJ can be released before the option kicks in (First game in 2019) based on performance. If KJ's injuries from this season (or any injury from now until the option kicks in) make him unable to perform in 2019, his contract is guaranteed.

The Texans will have to make the same decision on Fuller's 5th year option next offseason.
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I guess KJo is gone then?
 
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