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Who do you want as the new OC?

badboy said:
Are you serious? You just lost all relevancy to me. The quarterback calls the play and each player knows where they're supposed to go. Now each player not just wide receivers can hear the play wrong or confuse it but the quarterback never says "okay Nico you run down 10 steps and go to the left. Robert, you cut across the middle and block before you release and look for the ball".
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So how do you think the receivers know the play? It is PRACTICED. Repetition. If Stroud’s only job is to just throw the ball, we are in trouble. If they hear the play wrong, that is the QB not communicating properly. It’s amazing the lengths some of you will go.
 
djohn2oo8 said:
So how do you think the receivers know the play? It is PRACTICED. Repetition. If Stroud’s only job is to just throw the ball, we are in trouble. If they hear the okay wrong, that is the QB not communicating properly. It’s amazing the lengths some of you will go.
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The f'ing play call tells you what your f'ing route is... Jesus f'king christ... If you can't read and execute the only part of the play call that applies to you out of a dozen, how's that on the QB?
 
leebigeztx said:
You mean like running deep over routes with no check downs? How about the oline inability to block t-e games and the qb being pressured the most in nfl? Did you see the compressed sets which just brought more pressure to the qb?
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I had a big issue with the condensed sets.

They invited the blitz and the OL proved that they struggled to pickup blitzes.
 
djohn2oo8 said:
No. I can’t believe you don’t think the QB’s job is to make sure everyone in his huddle knows the play. That’s insane, sad and pathetic.
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djohn2oo8 said:
Who communicates the play in the huddle? The QB. Receivers continuously running the wrong route falls on the QB.
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Sure, once again, I'll play... And who calls the play on the sidelines? Who's job is it to make sure the TE doesn't get blown up by a DE because the protection scheme sucks? And so on, and so on, and so on.. But no, let's hang it on the 2nd year QB who's shown us what he can be...
 
leebigeztx said:
The fact Robert Woods is even in rotation is a problem
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There's definitely issues with the skill positions and also depth at the skill positions.

Which 2nd/3rd rd receivers do you like? They need to add at least 2 WR's in the draft/FA. Also they interviewed a guy who is said to be the best blocking TE in the draft at the Sr. Bowl. Jackson Hawes TE Georgia Tech. I find this very interesting.
 
paycheck71 said:
Sure, once again, I'll play... And who calls the play on the sidelines? Who's job is it to make sure the TE doesn't get blown up by a DE because the protection scheme sucks? And so on, and so on, and so on.. But no, let's hang it on the 2nd year QB who's shown us what he can be...
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Sound like you are saying: During the week, the QB IS NOT responsible for meeting with his offense and discussing where he expects them to be on certain plays. The OC gets the play in to the QB who relays it to his offense.
 
djohn2oo8 said:
Sound like you are saying: During the week, the QB IS NOT responsible for meeting with his offense and discussing where he expects them to be on certain plays. The OC gets the play in to the QB who relays it to his offense.
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yeah, sure. that's what I was saying.
 
paycheck71 said:
Sure, once again, I'll play... And who calls the play on the sidelines? Who's job is it to make sure the TE doesn't get blown up by a DE because the protection scheme sucks? And so on, and so on, and so on.. But no, let's hang it on the 2nd year QB who's shown us what he can be...
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If they draft Jackson Hawes TE Georgia Tech the DE's will be blocked much better than the crap that Schultz was doing out there last night.
 
leebigeztx said:
So we're gonna act like Dallas offense wasn't good when Dak was healthy? Coaches need players, especially a qb. Jacksonville struggling offensively tells me more about Lawrence than it does Pederson. Pederson to me would be a great oc because that's all he would be responsible for. He's won a sb with Nick Foles and had the other qb in mvp conversation.offensively imo
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Fools gold imo. Yes I know the type of numbers they put up on offense in the regular season during McCarthy’s tenure but it was largely a function of soft schedules and a weak division imo. Soon as they faced a team worth a damn every season, more often they lost and Dak and the offense looked like ****. Also hadn’t been able to run the ball the last few years.. hence their lack of playoff success during McCarthy’s tenure; they were very Schaub-era Texanish. Look good until you face a real contender and then u find out you’re not close at all.
 
steelbtexan said:
If they draft Jackson Hawes TE Georgia Tech the DE's will be blocked much better than the crap that Schultz was doing out there last night.
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I'm assuming you mean the divisional game, but yeah... I agree, why would anyone design a play where the worst blocking TE in history is asked to block elite DE's one on one?..
 
paycheck71 said:
I'm assuming you mean the divisional game, but yeah... I agree, why would anyone design a play where the worst blocking TE in history is asked to block elite DE's one on one?..
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There were times where Schultz and Dare both tried to block the DE at the same time and failed. They've gotta add skill position players.
 
djohn2oo8 said:
Robert Woods actually got open a multitude of times this season and Stroud didn’t see him.
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Teams just started sitting in the middle, waiting on those deep over routes to develop. In the meantime, they ran stunts or games and broke down protection. CJ didn't make all the best reads, that's for certain, but when you watch the all 22 you see the offensive flaws bright as day. I'm not even gonna get started on Dare, who never runs the ball played damn near every 3rd down. Basically every 3rd and 4, he was in which told the defense it's 100% pass play.
 
Mr teX said:
Fools gold imo. Yes I know the type of numbers they put up on offense in the regular season during McCarthy’s tenure but it was largely a function of soft schedules and a weak division imo. Soon as they faced a team worth a damn every season, more often they lost and Dak and the offense looked like ****. Also hadn’t been able to run the ball the last few years.. hence their lack of playoff success during McCarthy’s tenure; they were very Schaub-era Texanish. Look good until you face a real contender and then u find out you’re not close at all.
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I said points, not just yards. The Chiefs can't run the ball effectively either, doesn't seem to matter. I'm merely stating some coaches are just better coordinators than coaches. Spags and Fangio are classic examples. For me,with a young qb, I want a oc of experience that has answers in real time. It was week 9 and they were still struggling to move the ball vs cover 2.
 
leebigeztx said:
I said points, not just yards. The Chiefs can't run the ball effectively either, doesn't seem to matter. I'm merely stating some coaches are just better coordinators than coaches. Spags and Fangio are classic examples. For me,with a young qb, I want a oc of experience that has answers in real time. It was week 9 and they were still struggling to move the ball vs cover 2.
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Doesn’t matter, points or yards, when they faced good teams they couldn’t really score.

We only think Spags isn’t a very good HC b/c he has only had the 1 opportunity. We really don’t know what kind of HC he’d be now. McCarthy and Pederson the results are in on them after 2 stops at HC we know what they are. Furthermore I don’t see how you think a guy like Pederson or McCarthy would be great OC’s. Pederson’s only experience as an OC came under Reid..which we already know how that goes. And McCarthy kinda of the same thing but under Sean Payton. HIS only other opportunity as an OC was with the niners, & he was terrible fired after 1 year. Neither of these guys has stood on their own as just offensive play callers. Pederson had Reich & Steichen in Philly when he won his SB and McCarthy had a prime Aaron Rodgers running the show for him all those years in GB before Rodgers basically ran him outta there for what was intimated subtly as the same thing has been implied why Slowik was released..incompetence and not handling his star qb well.
 
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I wonder if we could coax Ryan Day away from Ohio State. He's been there for 8 years. His salary is $10M and his record as a HC is 70-10 and coming off a national championship. Before Ohio he had one year each with the Eagles and the 49ers as their QB coach. Now would be the perfect time to move back to the NFL with the opportunity to reunite with Stroud as his QB. And just as an aside, Chip Kelly is already there at Ohio to take over as HC.

Would you rather have Kelly or Day?

It would mean another newby at the position, but what a resume. And not least, he played QB in college.
 
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djohn2oo8 said:
Who communicates the play in the huddle? The QB. Receivers continuously running the wrong route falls on the QB.
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Huh.... So is the Oline not picking up the correct blocks on the QB as well? Pretty sure the OC who drew up the plays, and possible the WR coach were responsible for making sure WRs knew the play and their respective routes.
 
I do like Caley’s varied coaching experience. And time under Mcvay. But the lack of play calling experience concerns me. He must be really impressive in the interview process if the story about the Pats offering him 3 million to be a first time OC last season (and him turning it down) is true.


But my question is why would the GOAT coach go with Joe Judge and Matt Patricia to run his offense in 2022 if Caley was the next big thing at OC?

And like we are concerned with the in-house candidates being interviewed (Johnson and Lazor): Why couldn’t Caley do anything to fix the offense in New England that season?

It’s easy to look great with Mcdaniels and Mcvay calling plays.
 
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leebigeztx said:
Teams just started sitting in the middle, waiting on those deep over routes to develop. In the meantime, they ran stunts or games and broke down protection. CJ didn't make all the best reads, that's for certain, but when you watch the all 22 you see the offensive flaws bright as day. I'm not even gonna get started on Dare, who never runs the ball played damn near every 3rd down. Basically every 3rd and 4, he was in which told the defense it's 100% pass play.
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Mixon has mentioned in an interview earlier this season that it is now known as "3rd and Ogunbawale" instead or 3rd and long.
 
djohn2oo8 said:
Sound like you are saying: During the week, the QB IS NOT responsible for meeting with his offense and discussing where he expects them to be on certain plays. The OC gets the play in to the QB who relays it to his offense.
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It is the cooks job to know every menu item on the menu and how to cook it when the waiter/waitress sends in the order. Those cooks have been taught prior to entering the kitchen how to cook...they train, practice and refine theirs skills for years.

In this example the OC is the customer ordering food. Stroud is the waiter and the receivers are the cooks.

There is an entire coaching staff on hand to teach recievers the route tree. The QBs ONLY job presnap is to survey the defense, assign protections (in some offenses, not all) and to tell the recievers what play they will be running off the menu. To think CJ is to blame for a reciever running the wrong route is asinine. If all recieverd ran the wrong route on a particular play, that's the QBs fault, if only one ran the wrong route, guess what.....that reiciever is an idiot and CJs hands are clean.

During the week CJ meets with recievers to throw the ball and work on timing.
 
Mr teX said:
Doesn’t matter, points or yards, when they faced good teams they couldn’t really score.

We only think Spags isn’t a very good HC b/c he has only had the 1 opportunity. We really don’t know what kind of HC he’d be now. McCarthy and Pederson the results are in on them after 2 stops at HC we know what they are. Furthermore I don’t see how you think a guy like Pederson or McCarthy would be great OC’s. Pederson’s only experience as an OC came under Reid..which we already know how that goes. And McCarthy kinda of the same thing but under Sean Payton. HIS only other opportunity as an OC was with the niners, & he was terrible fired after 1 year. Neither of these guys has stood on their own as just offensive play callers. Pederson had Reich & Steichen in Philly when he won his SB and McCarthy had a prime Aaron Rodgers running the show for him all those years in GB before Rodgers basically ran him outta there for what was intimated subtly as the same thing has been implied why Slowik was released..incompetence and not handling his star qb well.
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Didn't he win a superbowl before Reid? In Jacksonville with a qb who did nothing as a rookie, 10th in yds and points, 2nd yr 13th in yds and pts. If we're to believe CJ is much better than Lawrence, is it not safe to say Pederson can make this a top 10 offense? I mean having Wentz as a mvp front runner pre injury and finishing the deal with Foles has to account for something right?
 
Porky said:
This group so far sucks donkey balls. Absolutely horrible. Not a single cat in this group that should have been given a chance at this job. My God. Is this really what they are going to push down our throats? If I’m CJ, Mixon, Nico…I’d be absolutely livid.

And the leisurely pace of these interviews is like watching paint dry.

Two years back they nailed the HC search. All the guys interviewed were A+ candidates, and all of them have a HC job elsewhere. They nailed it. They had a sense of urgency, found their guy, and signed him.

This feels eerily similar to the previous HC search, where they are interviewing guys like Hines Ward, Josh McCown…and we got some WR coach that even his own team said who? We are about to be David Cully’ed guys.

This OC search is a Flat out 0 on a scale of 0-10. Once again, Nick is failing this team. If we get some yahoo with no experience, he is back on my chopping block. Nick HAS to do better then this crapfest.
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You blame Nick? The GM should only open his rolodex to help the head coach find his OC. If the GM is under cutting the head coach's power then we have bigger problems. This should be seen as a Demeco win or loss full stop
 
theCATALYST said:
It is the cooks job to know every menu item on the menu and how to cook it when the waiter/waitress sends in the order. Those cooks have been taught prior to entering the kitchen how to cook...they train, practice and refine theirs skills for years.

In this example the OC is the customer ordering food. Stroud is the waiter and the receivers are the cooks.

There is an entire coaching staff on hand to teach recievers the route tree. The QBs ONLY job presnap is to survey the defense, assign protections (in some offenses, not all) and to tell the recievers what play they will be running off the menu. To think CJ is to blame for a reciever running the wrong route is asinine. If all recieverd ran the wrong route on a particular play, that's the QBs fault, if only one ran the wrong route, guess what.....that reiciever is an idiot and CJs hands are clean.

During the week CJ meets with recievers to throw the ball and work on timing.
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Incorrect. The QB needs to know each route, how deep or short the receivers run each route. This is all discussed during practice and while game planning during the week. You are discussing presnap. These other duties are performed during the week.
 
EllisUnit said:
Huh.... So is the Oline not picking up the correct blocks on the QB as well? Pretty sure the OC who drew up the plays, and possible the WR coach were responsible for making sure WRs knew the play and their respective routes.
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The QB holding on to the ball longer than he should is on the QB. Which makes the line look worse. In which this had happened PLENTY during the season. It’s hilarious. Many of you were b*tching about the line not picking up defenders, and Stroud had plenty of games where he was holding on to the ball or throwing it into double coverage with a clean pocket.
 
djohn2oo8 said:
Incorrect. The QB needs to know each route, how deep or short the receivers run each route. This is all discussed during practice and while game planning during the week. You are discussing presnap. These other duties are performed during the week.
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Theres a difference between knowing what the WR is supposed to do and somehow making them do it. You seem to imply that CJ should make the recievers run the correct route. How would he do that? Hold their hand and run the route with them?

The offense, all of it, was dysfunctional this last season. From gameplan to play calling to execution. Everyone from Bobby to CJ to Nico to Tunsil failed. That is a failure in coaching, culture and system and ultimately Bobby paid the price for those failures.
 
Errant Hothy said:
Theres a difference between knowing what the WR is supposed to do and somehow making them do it. You seem to imply that CJ should make the recievers run the correct route. How would he do that? Hold their hand and run the route with them?

The offense, all of it, was dysfunctional this last season. From gameplan to play calling to execution. Everyone from Bobby to CJ to Nico to Tunsil failed. That is a failure in coaching, culture and system and ultimately Bobby paid the price for those failures.
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I said he makes sure his receivers know the play and route, during the week when practicing and game planning. If the wrong routes are constantly being run, yes that falls on the QB.
 
leebigeztx said:
Didn't he win a superbowl before Reid?
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No, he got the philly job based on what he did under Reid that 1 year he was there...which you can take that with a grain of salt considering every OC has success under Reid.

leebigeztx said:
In Jacksonville with a qb who did nothing as a rookie, 10th in yds and points, 2nd yr 13th in yds and pts.
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See my post about McCarthy and Dallas' offense.. Fools gold.... Team went 9-8 off a weak division and last place sched. ran up the score & stats when playing against bad teams and struggled to do a whole lot against legit contenders...& his offenses only got worse thereafter in both Philly and Jax. The Wade Phillips effect. Once teams get a bead on what you like to do, how do you counter. For both Wade & Pederson, it seems there is no counter & there are no answers except for "guys go out there and make a play.." & well, wasn't Slowik just fired for that?

leebigeztx said:
I mean having Wentz as a mvp front runner pre injury and finishing the deal with Foles has to account for something right?
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Can't poo poo his lack of success as a HC but give him credit for something that may or may not have been all him. But lets say for arguments sake i approach your statement with an open mind. It then Just really depends on how much credit you want to give him specifically. There is a thought that what you say above actually makes him look worse. Both Wentz and Lawrence were top 2 picks & yet these guys under his direct tutelage didn't really improve as players...they actually regressed. Wentz was an MVP candidate in 2017 came back and Pederson couldn't get him back to that level. Lawrence had a small improvement from terrible to serviceable & hasn't really taken the next step. IOW, He ain't really coaching these young talented guys up...& i don't know if that's what you want for CJ.

The other thing is Pederson's greatest success he had Frank Reich with him as his OC. I think 2017 for both those guys was a lighting in a bottle situation. Since each went their separate ways....away from Philly...which is a top level org these days, neither has enjoyed much success. Then you look at Sirianni going to his 2nd SB in his tenure...does anyone think he's some kind of offensive guru? Me thinks the Philly org propped up Pederson to be better than he was.
 
Errant Hothy said:
Theres a difference between knowing what the WR is supposed to do and somehow making them do it. You seem to imply that CJ should make the recievers run the correct route. How would he do that? Hold their hand and run the route with them?

The offense, all of it, was dysfunctional this last season. From gameplan to play calling to execution. Everyone from Bobby to CJ to Nico to Tunsil failed. That is a failure in coaching, culture and system and ultimately Bobby paid the price for those failures.
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I don't know what that dude's saying as i have him on the iggy..but based on your response, i can tell its something ridiculously idiotic.
 
Number19 said:
I wonder if we could coax Ryan Day away from Ohio State. He's been there for 8 years. His salary is $10M and his record as a HC is 70-10 and coming off a national championship. Before Ohio he had one year each with the Eagles and the 49ers as their QB coach. Now would be the perfect time to move back to the NFL with the opportunity to reunite with Stroud as his QB. And just as an aside, Chip Kelly is already there at Ohio to take over as HC.

Would you rather have Kelly or Day?

It would mean another newby at the position, but what a resume. And not least, he played QB in college.
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I imagine Day would only be interested in a HC gig and not an OC one.

Pretty rare for someone to leave a HC gig at one of the top schools to pursue a coordinator job.
 
Mr teX said:
No, he got the philly job based on what he did under Reid that 1 year he was there...which you can take that with a grain of salt considering every OC has success under Reid.


See my post about McCarthy and Dallas' offense.. Fools gold.... Team went 9-8 off a weak division and last place sched. ran up the score & stats when playing against bad teams and struggled to do a whole lot against legit contenders...& his offenses only got worse thereafter in both Philly and Jax. The Wade Phillips effect. Once teams get a bead on what you like to do, how do you counter. For both Wade & Pederson, it seems there is no counter & there are no answers except for "guys go out there and make a play.." & well, wasn't Slowik just fired for that?


Can't poo poo his lack of success as a HC but give him credit for something that may or may not have been all him. But lets say for arguments sake i approach your statement with an open mind. It then Just really depends on how much credit you want to give him specifically. There is a thought that what you say above actually makes him look worse. Both Wentz and Lawrence were top 2 picks & yet these guys under his direct tutelage didn't really improve as players...they actually regressed. Wentz was an MVP candidate in 2017 came back and Pederson couldn't get him back to that level. Lawrence had a small improvement from terrible to serviceable & hasn't really taken the next step. IOW, He ain't really coaching these young talented guys up...& i don't know if that's what you want for CJ.

The other thing is Pederson's greatest success he had Frank Reich with him as his OC. I think 2017 for both those guys was a lighting in a bottle situation. Since each went their separate ways....away from Philly...which is a top level org these days, neither has enjoyed much success. Then you look at Sirianni going to his 2nd SB in his tenure...does anyone think he's some kind of offensive guru? Me thinks the Philly org propped up Pederson to be better than he was.
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Nobody could get Wentz back to his MVP form.

So hire Reich if you think he was responsible for Philly/Wentz success.

Not saying I want either Pederson or Reich as OC, but Pederson was a very successful OC before becoming Philly's HC. Nobody is going to be successful with Goldylocks as their OC.
 
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steelbtexan said:
Nobody could get Wentz back to his MVP form.

So hire Reich if you think he was responsible for Philly/Wentz success.

Not saying I want eithe Pederson or Reich as OC, but Pederson was a very successful OCbefore becoming Philly's HC. Nobody is going to be successful with Goldylocks as their OC.
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He was not "very" successful. He had 1 successful season under Reid as an OC where he was actually the guy calling plays..... that's it.
 
Sweech said:
I imagine Day would only be interested in a HC gig and not an OC one.

Pretty rare for someone to leave a HC gig at one of the top schools to pursue a coordinator job.
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Possibly, but maybe also the team would be a factor. And the QB. After a year or two or three in Houston, the HC offers would be there. He could wait and be more selective, if he succeeded in Houston as an OC with Stroud as his QB.

How often is a college HC with limited prior NFL experience offered a HCing gig in the NFL. I'm sure there are examples, and his record at Ohio is probably tempting to NFL owners.

His net worth is estimated as north of $70M; he's got an enviable record at the college level; and he's got a national championship. A super bowl ring, next, is possible in Houston with Stroud as his QB. He's young. An NFL HCing gig maybe could be postponed for a couple of years.

His base salary at Ohio I belive is only $2M. The Texans could offer him $3M (Ryans' salary is $4.6M avg per year).

Houston at least should put out feelers and make an offer.
 
djohn2oo8 said:
No. I can’t believe you don’t think the QB’s job is to make sure everyone in his huddle knows the play. That’s insane, sad and pathetic.
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I guess Ryans could ask the ref’s to pause the play clock so CJ has adequate time to state the play in the huddle, then go player by player to check their assignment knowledge for the called play. When the huddle quiz is complete, CJ could then signal the ref to go ahead and start the play clock. On a side note….should the OC come out and proctor the quiz or just leave it up to CJ?
 
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OptimisticTexan said:
I guess Ryans could ask the ref’s to pause the play clock so CJ has adequate time to state the play in the huddle, then go player by player to check their assignment knowledge for the called play. When the huddle quiz is complete, CJ could then signal the ref to go ahead and start the play clock. On a side note….should the OC come out and proctor the quiz or just leave it up to CJ?
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Yes!!!!!

IF this day ever comes where this becomes legitimate practice I am done with the NFL and Id watch the Astros season from game 1 to game 956...... cause an entire baseball season would end before a single NFL game.
 
OptimisticTexan said:
I guess Ryans could ask the ref’s to pause the play clock so CJ has adequate time to state the play in the huddle, then go player by player to check their assignment knowledge for the called play. When the huddle quiz is complete, CJ could then signal the ref to go ahead and start the play clock. On a side note….should the OC come out and proctor the quiz or just leave it up to CJ?
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Who does he think he is, Patrick Mahomes?! :foottap:
 
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