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Watson through 3 Games

JWTexans

Practice Squad
You're right it hasn't just been the 3 games this yr. It's the last 5 games of last yr and the 1st 3 games of this yr.

5 games last yr + 3 games this yr is very simple math = 8 bad games in a row. That's what a trend looks like and fanboys can make all of the excuses in the world but DC's have figured his game out and things may get some better (But I doubt it) and there will be no championships.
I really don't think he had a bad game yesterday. He was dynamite in the first half. He had some issues with holding the ball long at some points, but he kept his eyes down the field while extending the play, which is what a lot of people bash him about. The second half was a different story, but it was for the entire team. If its the entire team then it comes down to BoB. He didn't do his job when it came to putting Watson and the rest of the squad in the best position to win. They didn't throw the ball ONCE on first down in the 2nd half yesterday, they tried one if I'm not mistaken, and the rush got there so quick DW4 had to pull it down and run.
About the "8 bad games in a row", he played very well against the Patriots and the Broncos last year, which would fall in those 8 games. I know I'm probably taking what you meant as literal and maybe not precisely how you meant it. Either way, I think yesterday is a perfect example of how its more BoB holding Watson back than anything Deshaun is doing or not doing. He let him throw it around in the first half yesterday and Watson looked like a Championship caliber QB. Just like in 2017 against Tennessee, KC, and Seattle. Just like in 2018 against Philly. In 2019 against New Orleans, San Diego, Atlanta, and New England.
I understand he has issues, but it's more a situation where its the HC holding him back more. Give him Reid or Harbaugh and he's doing what those 2 QBs are doing. My opinion.
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
That would be opinion , not fact.

An image is hard to refute.

So tell us the full story of that particular play. Not just a portion of it. What happened with the offensive line.


Tell me the real time verses a caption. So much going on right there.


Now go pull up the the plays he executed to perfection. Why don’t you ever talk about those plays?
 

Mr teX

Hall of Fame
I really don't think he had a bad game yesterday. He was dynamite in the first half. He had some issues with holding the ball long at some points, but he kept his eyes down the field while extending the play, which is what a lot of people bash him about. The second half was a different story, but it was for the entire team. If its the entire team then it comes down to BoB. He didn't do his job when it came to putting Watson and the rest of the squad in the best position to win. They didn't throw the ball ONCE on first down in the 2nd half yesterday, they tried one if I'm not mistaken, and the rush got there so quick DW4 had to pull it down and run.
About the "8 bad games in a row", he played very well against the Patriots and the Broncos last year, which would fall in those 8 games. I know I'm probably taking what you meant as literal and maybe not precisely how you meant it. Either way, I think yesterday is a perfect example of how its more BoB holding Watson back than anything Deshaun is doing or not doing. He let him throw it around in the first half yesterday and Watson looked like a Championship caliber QB. Just like in 2017 against Tennessee, KC, and Seattle. Just like in 2018 against Philly. In 2019 against New Orleans, San Diego, Atlanta, and New England.
I understand he has issues, but it's more a situation where its the HC holding him back more. Give him Reid or Harbaugh and he's doing what those 2 QBs are doing. My opinion.
Harbaugh huh? Lamar Jackson has largely looked like garbage tonight compared to Mahomes. And contrary to what everybody thinks, that’s not Reid.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
I really don't think he had a bad game yesterday. He was dynamite in the first half. He had some issues with holding the ball long at some points, but he kept his eyes down the field while extending the play, which is what a lot of people bash him about. The second half was a different story, but it was for the entire team. If its the entire team then it comes down to BoB. He didn't do his job when it came to putting Watson and the rest of the squad in the best position to win. They didn't throw the ball ONCE on first down in the 2nd half yesterday, they tried one if I'm not mistaken, and the rush got there so quick DW4 had to pull it down and run.
About the "8 bad games in a row", he played very well against the Patriots and the Broncos last year, which would fall in those 8 games. I know I'm probably taking what you meant as literal and maybe not precisely how you meant it. Either way, I think yesterday is a perfect example of how its more BoB holding Watson back than anything Deshaun is doing or not doing. He let him throw it around in the first half yesterday and Watson looked like a Championship caliber QB. Just like in 2017 against Tennessee, KC, and Seattle. Just like in 2018 against Philly. In 2019 against New Orleans, San Diego, Atlanta, and New England.
I understand he has issues, but it's more a situation where its the HC holding him back more. Give him Reid or Harbaugh and he's doing what those 2 QBs are doing. My opinion.
The Pats weren't 1 of the last 5 games of the last yr. I disagree that he played well against the Broncos last yr. DW4 had a bad 2nd half and I agree part of that was on BOB but getting shut out wasn't all BOB's fault.

Disagree with the last sentence. I think he would be better in both of those offenses but not at the level of those 2 guys. I've wanted BOB to install the Ravens offense. It's the only offense I believe he can have a chance to be a SB caliber QB in.
 

JWTexans

Practice Squad
The Pats weren't 1 of the last 5 games of the last yr. I disagree that he played well against the Broncos last yr. DW4 had a bad 2nd half and I agree part of that was on BOB but getting shut out wasn't all BOB's fault.

Disagree with the last sentence. I think he would be better in both of those offenses but not at the level of those 2 guys. I've wanted BOB to install the Ravens offense. It's the only offense I believe he can have a chance to be a SB caliber QB in.
You're right about the Pat's. I was going with the last 5 games of the regular season and not counting the playoffs. I guess I tried to block the Chiefs playoff game out.
As far as Mahomes and Jackson, maybe not to the Mahomes level, but I firmly believe he is every bit the player as Jackson. Their coaches just put them in better positions to make plays.
I'd like to see a year of Watson with someone like Brian Daboll and see where we're at then. I know Watson has some things he really needs to work on, but I think if BoB was replaced with someone who knows how to scheme with the type of QB they have then Watson would be a lot better off.
 

Corrosion

Idealist
Staff member
The Pats weren't 1 of the last 5 games of the last yr. I disagree that he played well against the Broncos last yr. DW4 had a bad 2nd half and I agree part of that was on BOB but getting shut out wasn't all BOB's fault.

Disagree with the last sentence. I think he would be better in both of those offenses but not at the level of those 2 guys. I've wanted BOB to install the Ravens offense. It's the only offense I believe he can have a chance to be a SB caliber QB in.

Lot of people have talked about Eric Bieniemy coming in as the next coach for this team .... I wouldn't argue the point but I'd sure as heck take a look at Greg Roman before I let him put ink to paper.
Roman has designed that offense specifically to suit a player very similar to Watson , that helped Jackson earn an MVP and the leagues best record.


Either of them would be a massive upgrade in offensive creativity.
 

JWTexans

Practice Squad
Lot of people have talked about Eric Bieniemy coming in as the next coach for this team .... I wouldn't argue the point but I'd sure as heck take a look at Greg Roman before I let him put ink to paper.
Roman has designed that offense specifically to suit a player very similar to Watson , that helped Jackson earn an MVP and the leagues best record.


Either of them would be a massive upgrade in offensive creativity.
Roman would definitely be in my top 3. Bieniemy would actually be 3rd after Roman and Daboll.
I think KC is definitely more Reid than Bieniemy. Roman and Daboll have made their offenses around Jackson and Allen.
 

76Texan

Hall of Fame
Eat it/throw it away. Would’ve been a long shot given how our defense has been playing but you continue to play the field position game..You don’t force it in a situation like that even though his throw was essentially like a punt. The int was more than just a TO..it gave the momentum back to Pitt.

If you watch that play, DW4 had DJ31 AND Fells running wide open by themselves in front of him. Sure, they were t going to get 15 yards for a 1st down but 7-8 possibly 10, can get them on the edge of FG range. You take what the defense gives you in that situation over a force downfield. In addition to this, HE WAS UNDER NO IMMEDIATE PRESSURE...yet he left the pocket...

This is early in the play..easy dump off there to Akins on his left or DJ31 on his right. As you can see, the ball is on the 43. Get the ball in your playmakers’ hands..perhaps they can make someone miss and you’re on the edge of FG range.

View attachment 6682

Here it is a few secs later. Tunsil I’m assuming thinks he’s gotten rid of the ball so Dupree comes free late..& DW4 still hasn’t gotten rid of the ball. Akins and DJ31 are still running pretty much by themselves. Easy check down there and no need to force the ball downfield like he wound up doing.
View attachment 6683
I don't think it was all that simple.

1. Watson had 5 routes to look at in the beginning. That and reading the defense. it was not a normal drop; the Steelers dropped into an inverse 52 (5 deep) that finally turned into 3 deep 4 under.

2. Watson had to feel the RDE coming around Tunsil. When he stepped back 9 yards behind the LOS, he can see the RDE.
Tunsil had not redirected his man deep enough.

3. Obviously, Watson wanted to go deep if he can. For that reason, he needed to also gage whether he can step up the pocket.

4. The RB was running a shallower crossing route than the TE; they were only open at the beginning, and that was too soon to throw the ball unless the QB and the coach really want to go with a dump off right off the bat. (It doesn't seem to be the first option).

5. As Watson stepped up the pocket, the RB was crossing the TE, shielding him from the passing lane.
As the TE was coming into the clear, you can see Watson wanting to make a throw. but the two deep men were converging on the seam route.
Watson decided not to throw (and so he missed that tiny little window to the TE underneath).

6. By this time, the RDE was starting to come up so Watson could no longer throw to the TE so he had to scamper out of there.
All of this is going on at 200mph.

7. There was nobody open except for the very first moment where he can throw to the RB.
But the RB was running toward a defender. I would estimate the gain to be about 3-5 yards.
Honestly, I'd like for Watson to take this throw.
If Johnson doesn't shake the defender, the FG attempt would be around 55-57 yards, probably out of range.
But you want to think that Johnson can make something out of it.

8. In between dodging defenders and 92 chasing him, there just wasn't any time to do anything else but to make that hail mary / punt. Yeah, I miss Hopkins there.

To me, it wasn't a blatant miss.
It looks like the play call for a read deep first and then come back to the TE and then the RB, and so on.
It just wasn't there.

Things happen very fast on the field. The QB had to process a multitude of things in real time, constantly.
 
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badboy

Hall of Fame
Lot of people have talked about Eric Bieniemy coming in as the next coach for this team .... I wouldn't argue the point but I'd sure as heck take a look at Greg Roman before I let him put ink to paper.
Roman has designed that offense specifically to suit a player very similar to Watson , that helped Jackson earn an MVP and the leagues best record.


Either of them would be a massive upgrade in offensive creativity.
yes and I think Roman would be much cheaper.
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
Roman would definitely be in my top 3. Bieniemy would actually be 3rd after Roman and Daboll.
I think KC is definitely more Reid than Bieniemy. Roman and Daboll have made their offenses around Jackson and Allen.
No biggie but I would put Sweeney at top due to his time with Watson but he would be much more expensive as he makes $9.3 million at Clemson. Really not much use in going to NFL unless he wants to see if he could make it work.
 

Mr teX

Hall of Fame
So tell us the full story of that particular play. Not just a portion of it. What happened with the offensive line.


Tell me the real
I don't think it was all that simple.

1. Watson had 5 routes to look at in the beginning. That and reading the defense. it was not a normal drop; the Steelers dropped into an inverse 52 (5 deep) that finally turned into 3 deep 4 under.

2. Watson had to feel the RDE coming around Tunsil. When he stepped back 9 yards behind the LOS, he can see the RDE.
Tunsil had not redirect his man deep enough.

3. Obviously, Watson wanted to go deep if he can. For that reason, he needed to also gage whether he can step up the pocket.

4. The RB was running a shallower crossing route than the TE; they were only open at the beginning, and that was to soon to throw the ball unless the QB and the coach really want to go with a dump off right off the bat. (It doesn't seem to be the first option).

5. As Watson stepped up the pocket, the RB was crossing the TE, shielding him from the passing lane.
As the TE was coming into the clear, you can see Watson wanting to make a throw. but the two deep men were converging on the seam route.
Watson decided not to throw (and so he missed that tiny little window to the TE underneath).

6. By this time, the RDE was starting to come up so Watson could no longer throw to the TE so he had to scamper out of there.
All of this is going on at 200mph.

7. There was nobody open except for the very first moment where he can throw to the RB.
But the RB was running toward a defender. I would estimate the gain to be about 3-5 yards.
Honestly, I'd like for Watson to take this throw.
If Johnson doesn't shake the defender, the FG attempt would be around 55-57 yards, probably out of range.
But you want to think that Johnson can make something out of it.

8. In between dodging defenders and 92 chasing him, there just wasn't any time to do anything else but to make that hail mary / punt. Yeah, I miss Hopkins there.

To me, it wasn't a blatant miss.
It looks like the play call for a read deep first and then come back to the TE and then the RB, and so on.
It just wasn't there.

Things happen very fast on the field. The QB had to process a multitude of things in real time, constantly.
you just made a mountain out of a mole hill and a lot of what you’re saying could’ve been deduced from the presnap , the personnel grouping the Steelers have on the field and the down and distance and just general field awareness.

presnap you can see by how the Steelers are lined up, they are set up to where it’s clear they’re not trying to give up anything deep; they want everything in front of them; hence the inverted 5-2 look. Everyone but 1 DB and the d-line & OLB’s who are rushing the passer are way off the LOS. IOW’s they are pretty much conceding everything underneath. Also Looks like they were in nickel or dime b/c there’s literally only 1 middle LB on the field and he’s already pretty much bailing before the ball is even snapped....another sign they’re geared up for deep passing. A lot of that should’ve told him that it’s likely not going to be there so I’ll take a quick look, but will get to my check down quickly to make sure we at least get a chance at a FG attempt.

Finally, there’s not a whole lot in most playbooks for 3rd and 15 or more and there’s a reason for that..they are low percentage plays that often times require a lot of time for development. you have to know that even though they weren’t blitzing, there’s still a decent rush coming for you. So as soon as he seen those dudes bail and pretty much vacate the middle of the field, he should known that it just wasn’t going to be there deep and look to dump it of to 1 of those crossers in the middle.

it looks to me like he was gonna try to run it once he came off the deep read, but Fulton’s man started getting loose so he bounced it outside.

Regardless, all of that still had nothing to do with the ill advised throw.
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
I don't think it was all that simple.

1. Watson had 5 routes to look at in the beginning. That and reading the defense. it was not a normal drop; the Steelers dropped into an inverse 52 (5 deep) that finally turned into 3 deep 4 under.

2. Watson had to feel the RDE coming around Tunsil. When he stepped back 9 yards behind the LOS, he can see the RDE.
Tunsil had not redirect his man deep enough.

3. Obviously, Watson wanted to go deep if he can. For that reason, he needed to also gage whether he can step up the pocket.

4. The RB was running a shallower crossing route than the TE; they were only open at the beginning, and that was to soon to throw the ball unless the QB and the coach really want to go with a dump off right off the bat. (It doesn't seem to be the first option).

5. As Watson stepped up the pocket, the RB was crossing the TE, shielding him from the passing lane.
As the TE was coming into the clear, you can see Watson wanting to make a throw. but the two deep men were converging on the seam route.
Watson decided not to throw (and so he missed that tiny little window to the TE underneath).

6. By this time, the RDE was starting to come up so Watson could no longer throw to the TE so he had to scamper out of there.
All of this is going on at 200mph.

7. There was nobody open except for the very first moment where he can throw to the RB.
But the RB was running toward a defender. I would estimate the gain to be about 3-5 yards.
Honestly, I'd like for Watson to take this throw.
If Johnson doesn't shake the defender, the FG attempt would be around 55-57 yards, probably out of range.
But you want to think that Johnson can make something out of it.

8. In between dodging defenders and 92 chasing him, there just wasn't any time to do anything else but to make that hail mary / punt. Yeah, I miss Hopkins there.

To me, it wasn't a blatant miss.
It looks like the play call for a read deep first and then come back to the TE and then the RB, and so on.
It just wasn't there.

Things happen very fast on the field. The QB had to process a multitude of things in real time, constantly.
This is spot on. The read was for the deep pass not the underneath routes. Why would he check that down when they were up against the sticks, 3rd and what 15. The offensive line has to get better with protection here. Play calling has to improve in this type of situation. Running a wide receiver sweep shouldn’t have been a play called on this drive. But hey as usual these dudes only wants to focus on Watson negatives. How about the lack of intensity to start the 2nd half.
 

OptimisticTexan

Go Texans 1-1...Post OB!!!!!
So, according to a select few...Watson’s 8 Incompletions and 1 INT was single handedly the reason the Texans lost yesterday? That’s straw you guys are grasping for?

Remember, Tannehill is the far superior QB yet he misses on 14 passes, throws no TD’s, and tosses 1 INT.....yet, his crappy day as an NFL QB resulted in a win.

Cam Newton has 11 misses, 1TD, and 1 INT...yet his crappy day also results in a victory.

Fools hoping like hail to make fools gold. Obviously, these QB’s have teams built around them to help cover what you guys have described as a career ending day.
 

76Texan

Hall of Fame
you just made a mountain out of a mole hill and a lot of what you’re saying could’ve been deduced from the presnap , the personnel grouping the Steelers have on the field and the down and distance and just general field awareness.

presnap you can see by how the Steelers are lined up, they are set up to where it’s clear they’re not trying to give up anything deep; they want everything in front of them; hence the inverted 5-2 look. Everyone but 1 DB and the d-line & OLB’s who are rushing the passer are way off the LOS. IOW’s they are pretty much conceding everything underneath. Also Looks like they were in nickel or dime b/c there’s literally only 1 middle LB on the field and he’s already pretty much bailing before the ball is even snapped....another sign they’re geared up for deep passing. A lot of that should’ve told him that it’s likely not going to be there so I’ll take a quick look, but will get to my check down quickly to make sure we at least get a chance at a FG attempt.

Finally, there’s not a whole lot in most playbooks for 3rd and 15 or more and there’s a reason for that..they are low percentage plays that often times require a lot of time for development. you have to know that even though they weren’t blitzing, there’s still a decent rush coming for you. So as soon as he seen those dudes bail and pretty much vacate the middle of the field, he should known that it just wasn’t going to be there deep and look to dump it of to 1 of those crossers in the middle.

it looks to me like he was gonna try to run it once he came off the deep read, but Fulton’s man started getting loose so he bounced it outside.

Regardless, all of that still had nothing to do with the ill advised throw.
Obviously, there weren't as many plays for 3rd and 15, the question here is what was the intention of this play call.
Was it designed to get enough yards to get into FG range?
Sure as heck doesn't look like it to me.

The three deep routes were all beyond 15 yards while the two shallow routes were, exactly that, very shallow.
If the play was designed to look for a FG first, it was very poorly drawn up.
When the RB 31 first got to his stem, he was barely a yard from the LOS.
The TE came from the other side less than 2 yards from him (obstructing any possible throw).

So the first read would have been to the RB, and he was open, as expected.
But a throw there would be too shallow while the defenders haven't dropped deep enough to allow for the RB to get more than 3-5 yards; and likely less with how fast the Steelers D are.

Also, we can see that Watson never intended to go underneath at the outset, so the call wasn't made to look for the FG first.
 
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76Texan

Hall of Fame
This is spot on. The read was for the deep pass not the underneath routes. Why would he check that down when they were up against the sticks, 3rd and what 15. The offensive line has to get better with protection here. Play calling has to improve in this type of situation. Running a wide receiver sweep shouldn’t have been a play called on this drive. But hey as usual these dudes only wants to focus on Watson negatives. How about the lack of intensity to start the 2nd half.
I wouldn't go with a sweep here unless I was only looking for a FG.
But yeah, at least the blocking for this call needs to be designed better to give the QB a clear throwing lane.
 

Mr teX

Hall of Fame
Obviously, there weren't as may plays for 3rd and 15, the question here is what was the intention of this play call.
Was it designed to get enough yards to get into FG range?
Sure as heck doesn't look like it to me.

The three deep routes were all beyond 15 yards while the two shallow routes were, exactly that, very shallow.
If the play was designed to look for a FG first, it was very poorly drawn up.
When the RB 31 first got to his stem, he was barely a yard from the LOS.
The TE came from the other side less than 2 yards from him (obstructing any possible throw).

So the first read would have been to the RB, and he was open, as expected.
But a throw there would be to shallow while the defenders haven't dropped deep enough to allow for the RB to get more than 3-5 yards; and likely less with how fast the Steelers D are.

Also, we can see that Watson never intended to go underneath at the outset, so the call wasn't made to look for the FG first.
Thr INTENTION OF THE PLAY DOESNT MATTER AT THIS POINT! The point is Pittsburgh was giving you every damn indicator PRESNAP that they were determined not to give up anything that deep that could result in a long 1st down conversion or get beat deep. They wanted everything in front of them so that they could rally up and force the 4th down. As the qb processing all this, why would you then go out and force it deep when you don’t have the numbers when a short completion is right there that could possibly set u up in FG range?

sometimes the defense just wins and you gotta take what they’re giving you. What is so damn hard for you and others to understand about that?

He shouldn’t have thrown it where he did when he had wide open options underneath period and for the life of me I can’t understand what’s so hard to grasp about that from some of you. No playcaller calls every play where guys are running wide open every time exactly where they want them to..I think some of you actually believe that to be how it happens and it is foolish. The qb largely makes or breaks whether each and every play is a success or not, not the other way around & the primary means by which they do that is through their DECISION MAKING! Tom Brady isn't considering the GOAT b/c of his rocket arm, or elusiveness, its b/c his decision making is impecable..under pretty much all conditions..pocket/no pocket...blitz/no blitz..... pressure/no pressure......stud WR/no stud WR.

Noone’s saying that his lone int was what caused us to lose the game, but let’s be real, you can’t have that in a close game.....and let’s face it, that particular play WAS the inflection point of the game. The Steelers went right down and scored off that play, we lost the lead off that play and the defense never looked quite the same after it either. IT WAS A MOMENTUM KILLER.
 
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steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
So tell us the full story of that particular play. Not just a portion of it. What happened with the offensive line.


Tell me the real time verses a caption. So much going on right there.


Now go pull up the the plays he executed to perfection. Why don’t you ever talk about those plays?
There aren't enough of those perfectly executed plays to win games against top tier teams. That is and has been the issue. It's not going to change anytime soon.
 

dream_team

Hall of Fame
Let's just stop this... everyone is right, why can't we just leave it at that?

At times, Watson misses open receivers.
At times, no one is open.
At times, the OL does a horrible job at pass pro.
At times, Watson holds onto the ball too long.

It's easy to go on the All-22 to find evidence for all of this.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
Let's just stop this... everyone is right, why can't we just leave it at that?

At times, Watson misses open receivers.
At times, no one is open.
At times, the OL does a horrible job at pass pro.
At times, Watson holds onto the ball too long.

It's easy to go on the All-22 to find evidence for all of this.
Because posters are sick of the DW4 apologists.

One thing I think we can agree on is DW4 isn't playing a winning brand of football right now.
 

KarlK

Waterboy
Thr INTENTION OF THE PLAY DOESNT MATTER AT THIS POINT! The point is Pittsburgh was giving you every damn indicator PRESNAP that they were determined not to give up anything that deep that could result in a long 1st down conversion or get beat deep. They wanted everything in front of them so that they could rally up and force the 4th down. As the qb processing all this, why would you then go out and force it deep when you don’t have the numbers when a short completion is right there that could possibly set u up in FG range?

sometimes the defense just wins and you gotta take what they’re giving you. What is so damn hard for you and others to understand about that?

He shouldn’t have thrown it where he did when he had wide open options underneath period and for the life of me I can’t understand what’s so hard to grasp about that from some of you. No playcaller calls every play where guys are running wide open every time exactly where they want them to..I think some of you actually believe that to be how it happens and it is foolish. The qb largely makes or breaks whether each and every play is a success or not, not the other way around & the primary means by which they do that is through their DECISION MAKING! Tom Brady isn't considering the GOAT b/c of his rocket arm, or elusiveness, its b/c his decision making is impecable..under pretty much all conditions..pocket/no pocket...blitz/no blitz..... pressure/no pressure......stud WR/no stud WR.

Noone’s saying that his lone int was what caused us to lose the game, but let’s be real, you can’t have that in a close game.....and let’s face it, that particular play WAS the inflection point of the game. The Steelers went right down and scored off that play, we lost the lead off that play and the defense never looked quite the same after it either. IT WAS A MOMENTUM KILLER.
Absolutely spot on. Excellent post.
 

76Texan

Hall of Fame
Thr INTENTION OF THE PLAY DOESNT MATTER AT THIS POINT! The point is Pittsburgh was giving you every damn indicator PRESNAP that they were determined not to give up anything that deep that could result in a long 1st down conversion or get beat deep. They wanted everything in front of them so that they could rally up and force the 4th down. As the qb processing all this, why would you then go out and force it deep when you don’t have the numbers when a short completion is right there that could possibly set u up in FG range?

sometimes the defense just wins and you gotta take what they’re giving you. What is so damn hard for you and others to understand about that?

He shouldn’t have thrown it where he did when he had wide open options underneath period and for the life of me I can’t understand what’s so hard to grasp about that from some of you. No playcaller calls every play where guys are running wide open every time exactly where they want them to..I think some of you actually believe that to be how it happens and it is foolish. The qb largely makes or breaks whether each and every play is a success or not, not the other way around & the primary means by which they do that is through their DECISION MAKING! Tom Brady isn't considering the GOAT b/c of his rocket arm, or elusiveness, its b/c his decision making is impecable..under pretty much all conditions..pocket/no pocket...blitz/no blitz..... pressure/no pressure......stud WR/no stud WR.

Noone’s saying that his lone int was what caused us to lose the game, but let’s be real, you can’t have that in a close game.....and let’s face it, that particular play WAS the inflection point of the game. The Steelers went right down and scored off that play, we lost the lead off that play and the defense never looked quite the same after it either. IT WAS A MOMENTUM KILLER.
The intention of the play matters. BIG TIME.
It was drawn up to go deep FIRST.
The only open receiving option at the outset was a RB, and the chance that he would get into FG range is slim to none.

Once that option was gone, there was no OPEN throw to be made.

If OB wants a better scenario for his QB, he needed to draw a play that give the QB a better option at the onset.
Say, like having the TE run an deeper adjustment route whenever he sees a deep drop by a defender in the same line of sight as the principal deep route.
Run the crossing route into that hole in the zone, EARLY.
 

76Texan

Hall of Fame
Has been going on for 4 years.

It's just now that more fans are being critical of DW4 and pointing out with screenshots the mistakes he keeps making. The DW4 fanboys can't have this, so all they have left are posts like this. Why was it alright for me when I was the lone wolf it ok for the rest of the MB to relentlessly hound me but now it's time to move on?
No, we have been bashing O'Brien stale play design and play calling.
 

76Texan

Hall of Fame
There aren't enough of those perfectly executed plays to win games against top tier teams. That is and has been the issue. It's not going to change anytime soon.
Exactly, and that is why a better HC/OC is needed.
To get players into better positions to execute some easy successful plays.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
This goes both ways. Posters are also sick of the DW dooms day people.
They aren't winning anything with DW4 making these kinds of decisions. You would think he would be better than this after 4 years. 8 bad games and counting. Well on their way to another lost decade.

It's very rich of you to post this after all of the things I've been through just for saying DW4 will never win a championship. Hater/Racist/BOB fanboy etc...
 

Toro Bravo

Waterboy
I honestly don't know what our offense is. It looks to me like most explosive plays happen when DW4 is under pressure and has to make something happen, not because the play is executed the way it is drawn up. There's too much emphasis on DW4 having to make explosive plays instead of having a good scheme and spreading the load.
 

dream_team

Hall of Fame
They aren't winning anything with DW4 making these kinds of decisions. You would think he would be better than this after 4 years. 8 bad games and counting. Well on their way to another lost decade.

It's very rich of you to post this after all of the things I've been through just for saying DW4 will never win a championship. Hater/Racist/BOB fanboy etc...
It's statements like this that riles up the other side and make people feel they have to come out and defend DW4. Saying he'll never win a championship is absolutely ridiculous. @Corrosion and @Mr teX have been critical of DW4, but they do it in a much more constructive manner IMO. Football is a team sport, it takes multiple people, multiple facets to be a championship caliber team. What riles people up is that you repeatedly single out just one person, and it's solely his fault on why he'll never win.
 

76Texan

Hall of Fame
They aren't winning anything with DW4 making these kinds of decisions. You would think he would be better than this after 4 years. 8 bad games and counting. Well on their way to another lost decade.

It's very rich of you to post this after all of the things I've been through just for saying DW4 will never win a championship. Hater/Racist/BOB fanboy etc...
The Texans will never get to an AFC Championship Game with O'Brien as a HC, so you are right that Watson won't have any chance in the near future.
 

76Texan

Hall of Fame
I honestly don't know what our offense is. It looks to me like most explosive plays happen when DW4 is under pressure and has to make something happen, not because the play is executed the way it is drawn up. There's too much emphasis on DW4 having to make explosive plays instead of having a good scheme and spreading the load.
O'Brien's scheme was so great, Vrabel scratched it the minute he got to Nashville. :corrosion: :hankpalm:
 

76Texan

Hall of Fame
....You simply think a play design is all that's needed for the position to be successfully played at a high level which is beyond ridiculous...its absurd. I guess all those genius OC's who have left to go & coach other teams without good decision makers at qb just need to draw up better plays huh? :thumbdown .

FIRST READ, doesn't mean you stay locked in there.......FIRST READ doesn't mean you force it...If its not there, ITS. NOT. THERE.........period & you've got to move on. In this scenario, he had pretty damn good clues pre-snap that it was not going to be there, so then the next option is to go to the next POSITIVE play you can make for your ball club..Yes all of this has to happen in a split second or 2, but it HAS TO HAPPEN. I've heard Stoerner speak to this SEVERAL TIMES on 610...You as a qb pretty much know what the defense is trying to do before the ball is even snapped.

I'm done with this, just move on......and lets talk about the defense...you know, the topic of this thread.
I never said the QB has to lock into his first read.
You always drum up a bogus of a claim to accuse people.

I had already laid it out that the 2nd read, the TE, wasn't available until he cleared off of the RB, and by that time, it was already too late.
The play was simply poorly designed.
 
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