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Trade Partners for JJ

badboy

Hall of Fame

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
I don't have any faith in anything that this organization does at this point.
Everyone here knows Easterby should've been sent packing, but DHop got ran off instead. We RARELY hit on first round picks, and when we do we either don't build around them or we let them walk. The cap situation isn't good at all, and this team loves to hand out money to JAGs..... that may change under NC, but I'll believe it when I see it. If they trade Watson, then that's something else this organization screwed up.
If they trade DW4 most of the cap/draft issues will be fixed and by next offseason (2022) they will should all be fixed. They will basically be an expansion team but they will be able to start out with four 1st rd picks. A 2021 1st (Pick #2) A 2021 2nd (Pick #34 just like a late rd 1st) Their 2022 pick which should be a high pick because 2021 should be about clearing bad contracts and getting your rookie 2021 QB #2 pick experience. Then you will also have another high 1st in the 2022 draft. (The Jets are going to suck) and your high 2022 2nd rd pick plus the Jets high 2nd rd pick.

All you have to do is find your QB and you should be able to get 3 franchise level players and two solid starter level if not better with your two high 2nd rd picks.

That doesn't even include the Texans high 3rd rd pick this yr and next yr because they are going to suck next yr. (Those will be like late 2nd rd picks.) So you could possibly add 7 star or starter level players. Keep the OL in tact and add 3-4 FA's in these 2 off-seasons and the team will be in much better shape talent/cap wise than they will be if they hold onto DW4 at 35-40 mil per yr against the cap. The kicker is that DW4 doesn't want to be here so if Cuck gets extremely lucky and NC does a great job a solid foundation for yrs to come will be built.

If they trade DW4 and draft say Wilson I would be all on board with hiring Caldwell. He's a great teacher of QB play for the rookie QB and at 65 he will be happy to be a placeholder (Get paid) while NC is building a solid foundation over the next 3=5 yrs.
 
I 100%agree that he should have absolutely 0 input as far as the GM search before Caserio got the job. He is not qualified in the slightest. But to be told he would have input in the decision and then just hiring the guy Easterby wanted anyway, its not a good look. DW4 was lied to, plain and simple. None of us here would appreciate being lied to by our employer. Its not the fact that he didn't choose the GM, its the fact that they should've never told him he'd have input in the first place which put them in a position to lie to him.
So what does input mean in your book? At my work place having input means you get to give your opinion, point of view and your advice. It does not mean you get final say, it does not mean they will go with your suggestion, it doesn’t even mean they will value your input. It means you get to have your say and that’s it.

Maybe where you work it’s different but I’ve worked, and currently do, for every major petroleum/chemical company in the greater Houston area and input meant the same at all of them. Never once did I think they “lied” to me if they didn’t take my input. And IF Watson feels that way, well, grow up kid and welcome to the real world.

Finally Caserio wasn’t just “the guy Easterby wanted” and that statement shows you haven’t been paying attention. Caserio was the guy Cal wanted and the guy Bob McNair wanted before that. They have been chasing Caserio for three years and I think that played a big part in keeping OB so long and yes hiring Easterby both of whom are personal friends with Caserio. You have it backwards, Caserio was the prize, Easterby was just the bait.
 

leebigeztx

Keep it Movin!
Not true

The Redskins won 3 different championships with different QB's.

Montana was traded to the Chiefs and Young won a SB.

Etc...
Moving the goalposts again. Pre cap era, build the team, minimize the qb was possible. Thats not possible anymore and you know it. Steve Young still had hall of famers not to mention they added hall of famers. Carry on though.
 

Double Barrel

Moderator / Admin
Staff member
Contributor's Club
I 100%agree that he should have absolutely 0 input as far as the GM search before Caserio got the job. He is not qualified in the slightest. But to be told he would have input in the decision and then just hiring the guy Easterby wanted anyway, its not a good look. DW4 was lied to, plain and simple. None of us here would appreciate being lied to by our employer. Its not the fact that he didn't choose the GM, its the fact that they should've never told him he'd have input in the first place which put them in a position to lie to him.
I do not disagree with you about Watson not being qualified in the slightest to pick a GM or HC.

That said, to be fair, neither are Cal McNair and Jack Easterby (just consider they made Bill O'Brien a GM after 51-7).

Daddy McNair wanted Caserio, so at least Cal is good at trying to do what Bob would have done. . .at least with this one thing.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
Moving the goalposts again. Pre cap era, build the team, minimize the qb was possible. Thats not possible anymore and you know it. Steve Young still had hall of famers not to mention they added hall of famers. Carry on though.
He asked if an all pro/HOF type QB had been traded and the QB that replaced him was good? Montana/Young and that's not moving the goalposts.
 

SnakeEyes

Rookie
Who do you think will be in the running as a trade partner for JJ? What compensation would you ask for him?


TB- 2021 3rd Rd
Browns- 2021 3rd Rd
We also have a chance that TJ ends up with the Texans. If Ben retired, rumor of a rebuild and trade of many top players is floating around. If JJ stays and TJ wants to play with him...we should make it happen. Can you imagine that front 7?
 

SnakeEyes

Rookie
I don't have any faith in anything that this organization does at this point.
Everyone here knows Easterby should've been sent packing, but DHop got ran off instead. We RARELY hit on first round picks, and when we do we either don't build around them or we let them walk. The cap situation isn't good at all, and this team loves to hand out money to JAGs..... that may change under NC, but I'll believe it when I see it. If they trade Watson, then that's something else this organization screwed up.
The Watson part is smart if he wants to go. We can get picks, players and get a good QB too. And who says if we traded with Miami that Tua isn't better than Watson in 2yrs? Or we draft Fields at 6' 3" 220-some who can make every throw. Plus have 2 more 1st round picks and a 2nd or 3rd too. That type trade is what can make a team go from awful with a few good players to SB bound. Look at what the Hershel Walker trade did in Dallas.

I hope he figures everything out and gets his head on right. However, I will happily take a great trade haul like that. Look at the Panthers in the late 90's early 2000's. Got within a FG of a SB win with Delhome at QB. Never a QB to be confused with Brady, Brees, Rogers...
 

leebigeztx

Keep it Movin!
He asked if an all pro/HOF type QB had been traded and the QB that replaced him was good? Montana/Young and that's not moving the goalposts.
Montana was washed with that bad back. Steve Young basically made Montana expendable with his play. Oh yeah, young was also a former 1st rd pick.
 

Corrosion

Idealist
Staff member
How's that? He was lied to by all accounts. Cal and Esterby lied and now they may have ruined the only chance this team will have for a decade to do anything of significance if the reports about Watson wanting out are in fact true.
They never should've told DW4 that he would have input on the GM search because he SHOULDN'T have had any input on that hiring. The HC hiring, sure. Not the GM. But they told him he would and then he didn't. This is ALL on Cal and his snake oil salesman and false man of God Jack.
The reports that he was in the dark / misled / not heard are just not factual , he met with Cal not once but twice , his agent was present for one of those meetings & they discussed the direction of the team as far as HC / GM.

Watson had to know Cal had a boner for Caserio , they had tried to get him for three years.

He just didn't like the hire.

Players don't get a say in front office moves .... they might get some input for coaches but that guy's yet to be hired , have to wait two more weeks to make the official announcement.
Dude really has nothing to have his panties ruffled about .... especially when the guy he wants is the guy he's likely to get.

To be honest , I don't think any of that is "the problem" , its just a convenient excuse. He wants out because next year looks to be just as dismal as last & his agent has a history of moving big name players to bigger markets. Thing is , Ramsey wasn't locked in for that length of time , he was in the 4th year and Jax had exercised the 5th year option. He wasn't going to resign with Jax and they moved him with a little more than a year and a half left on his contract, he reupped with LA 5 years 100m after the trade.

In their position , there was no reason to hang onto him , he's a great player but not worth the money nor headache for a bottom dweller as the two #1 picks and #4 pick are more useful to a rebuilding team than one great player that doesn't move "Their Needle".

Watson can't play that trade me or I walk as a FA card with 5 years left on his deal.


If push comes to shove - using Ramesy's trade as a barometer , I want 4 #1's plus 3 #2's , a couple 3rds and take on a bad contract or I'm just not trading Watson.
 

Max

Veteran
I don't see anything close to a Herschel Walker trade happening in the NFL again. Sure the team holds the leverage, but it doesn't mean that the player has none. The players leverage is the compensation the team is foregoing to play hardball and watch their star player sit out. 3 1's or whatever the market dictates is going to be better than dealing with some prima donna to a lot of teams.
 

thunderkyss

Just win baby!!!
Staff member
Contributor's Club
I don't see anything close to a Herschel Walker trade happening in the NFL again. Sure the team holds the leverage, but it doesn't mean that the player has none. The players leverage is the compensation the team is foregoing to play hardball and watch their star player sit out. 3 1's or whatever the market dictates is going to be better than dealing with some prima donna to a lot of teams.
I hope the Texans can get a good placeholder in before camp. Andy Dalton, Nick Foles, or a Kirk Cousins.

Someone that says, “We’re prepared to play this season without Watson.”

At the same time someone we’d be content to let ride the bench with Watson playing
 

leebigeztx

Keep it Movin!
The reports that he was in the dark / misled / not heard are just not factual , he met with Cal not once but twice , his agent was present for one of those meetings & they discussed the direction of the team as far as HC / GM.

Watson had to know Cal had a boner for Caserio , they had tried to get him for three years.

He just didn't like the hire.

Players don't get a say in front office moves .... they might get some input for coaches but that guy's yet to be hired , have to wait two more weeks to make the official announcement.
Dude really has nothing to have his panties ruffled about .... especially when the guy he wants is the guy he's likely to get.

To be honest , I don't think any of that is "the problem" , its just a convenient excuse. He wants out because next year looks to be just as dismal as last & his agent has a history of moving big name players to bigger markets. Thing is , Ramsey wasn't locked in for that length of time , he was in the 4th year and Jax had exercised the 5th year option. He wasn't going to resign with Jax and they moved him with a little more than a year and a half left on his contract, he reupped with LA 5 years 100m after the trade.

In their position , there was no reason to hang onto him , he's a great player but not worth the money nor headache for a bottom dweller as the two #1 picks and #4 pick are more useful to a rebuilding team than one great player that doesn't move "Their Needle".

Watson can't play that trade me or I walk as a FA card with 5 years left on his deal.


If push comes to shove - using Ramesy's trade as a barometer , I want 4 #1's plus 3 #2's , a couple 3rds and take on a bad contract or I'm just not trading Watson.
We're all speculating, but why hire a search firm if you already know who you're going to hire? Think about this, why did Esterbe get the interim gm job when the player personel guy who you interviewed for the gm was here? Its just all the dysfunction
 

Max

Veteran
I hope the Texans can get a good placeholder in before camp. Andy Dalton, Nick Foles, or a Kirk Cousins.

Someone that says, “We’re prepared to play this season without Watson.”

At the same time someone we’d be content to let ride the bench with Watson playing
It's really tricky. Can you really tie that much $ up in the qb position when you're already strapped as it is? Watson has way more leverage over us than he would on a team with a bunch of cap space and pics. If we're going to rebuild without him, we need those picks we could get in a trade and his agent knows this. I just don't agree with Herschel Walker compensation or no trade. I don't think that the market is anywhere near that and I think that it can still make sense to move him at the market if we really are at a dead end with him. Don't believe that we're there yet though.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
Was it 93 or 94 that Montana beat the Oilers in the Dome to advance to the AFCCG? That loss was the final straw that set the Oilers on their way to Nashville.
 
We're all speculating, but why hire a search firm if you already know who you're going to hire? Think about this, why did Esterbe get the interim gm job when the player personel guy who you interviewed for the gm was here? Its just all the dysfunction
So you can make sure you have done your due diligence, so you can make sure that the guy you want is at least equal to the other candidates and so you can feel more comfortable about the hire you are making. Its like those change my mind challenges, "I'm wanting to hire Caserio, change my mind." You keep calling it dysfunction but its not, its a very corporate style of doing business and maybe thats not the way to run a football organization but its what the McNairs know so its what they will use. In their defense that method has worked for pretty much every major corporation in the world so there's that.

As far as why they interviewed whats-his-face I can promise you that he was never going to get the job or seriously considered. Generally though if there is an internal candidate that puts in a resume for a job you give them the curtsey of an interview unless they are massively under qualified like the water boy putting in a resume for the GM job. You do this to keep the office peace, so you can say we look inward first then went outward and just in case they might be a diamond in the rough. Again standard operating procedures for a corporation.
 

thunderkyss

Just win baby!!!
Staff member
Contributor's Club
It's really tricky. Can you really tie that much $ up in the qb position when you're already strapped as it is?
That’s why I named guys like Dalton & not Dak.

We all know we’re not making the playoffs with Watson, getting a QB to play, heck even Fitzpatrick would be a strong enough statement.
 
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leebigeztx

Keep it Movin!
So you can make sure you have done your due diligence, so you can make sure that the guy you want is at least equal to the other candidates and so you can feel more comfortable about the hire you are making. Its like those change my mind challenges, "I'm wanting to hire Caserio, change my mind." You keep calling it dysfunction but its not, its a very corporate style of doing business and maybe thats not the way to run a football organization but its what the McNairs know so its what they will use. In their defense that method has worked for pretty much every major corporation in the world so there's that.

As far as why they interviewed whats-his-face I can promise you that he was never going to get the job or seriously considered. Generally though if there is an internal candidate that puts in a resume for a job you give them the curtsey of an interview unless they are massively under qualified like the water boy putting in a resume for the GM job. You do this to keep the office peace, so you can say we look inward first then went outward and just in case they might be a diamond in the rough. Again standard operating procedures for a corporation.
So you're in negotiations with Khan, then all of a sudden, you and Esterbunny hop a plane and go get Caserio. No zoom, no negotiation, they fly to NE because Caserio doesn't mind having Esterbunny in the mix. How many times have we seen a clean sweep when a coach is fired, yet Esterbunny and the other coaches are still here throughout the hiring process. Look at Atl and Detroit.
 
So you're in negotiations with Khan, then all of a sudden, you and Esterbunny hop a plane and go get Caserio. No zoom, no negotiation, they fly to NE because Caserio doesn't mind having Esterbunny in the mix. How many times have we seen a clean sweep when a coach is fired, yet Esterbunny and the other coaches are still here throughout the hiring process. Look at Atl and Detroit.
So its clear you haven’t been following any of the threads on these forums as you are repeating things that are pure speculation of which most have been debunked.
 

Corrosion

Idealist
Staff member
We're all speculating, but why hire a search firm if you already know who you're going to hire?
That's easy .... You have a candidate you really like in Caserio , you tell that search firm to compile a list of the very best candidates and weigh them against your guy , if one of them is better you hire that guy , if not , you go with your original plan.

Easterby or no Easterby , we'd be in this situation .... you look at that list of potential GM's compiled by the search firm .... Omar Khan & Louis Riddick were their two finalists and he wouldn't have had any complaints on either.

I get the recommendation of Omar Khan but Riddick's resume doesn't stack up to either Caserio or Khan's and it aint even close. What has he done since leaving Philly in 2013 ?
 
What if we trade Watt to the 49ers for one of the 3rd round comp picks that they’ll get for developing Saleh?

I think it’d be an interesting option. Watt gets to move to a contender, and the 49ers get to pair him with their young DL.
 

thunderkyss

Just win baby!!!
Staff member
Contributor's Club
What if we trade Watt to the 49ers for one of the 3rd round comp picks that they’ll get for developing Saleh?

I think it’d be an interesting option. Watt gets to move to a contender, and the 49ers get to pair him with their young DL.
I’d take both those compensatory picks.
 

beerlover

Hall of Fame
Don’t we owe JJ Watt the best fit/opportunity?

For everything he’s done and meant not only to the Texans organization but the community. He is a class act and deserves chance to compete for a Super Bowl and post season success.

We’ve already had our compensation for the 11th overall pick from 2011. Now it’s his turn to turn back time, get healthy and turn on that magic for new team on the upswing who need a DE who can stop the run and pass rush.

Texans would benefit not only from doing the right thing, but clear 17.5 million off the books. A team would need that cap room to fit him under, this late in career would be rare. A draft pick thrown on top of that minimal. Texans could ask for a 3rd or 4th but 5th or 6th more likely.

Best fit would be the Los Angles Chargers who have a new defensive minded head coach, Brandon Staley and former Bears DL coach, one of the best, Jay Rodgers along with a new DC, Renaldo Hill, secondary coach from the Broncos. Melvin Ingram is UFA @ 16 million they would be able to fit JJ’s full contract but would expect them to restructure a more enticing 3 year guaranteed deal.
Chargers could also include another player who interests Texans, like WR, where they have depth and Texans don’t. Just saying, it’s a fit for JJ. Wish him the best!
 

thunderkyss

Just win baby!!!
Staff member
Contributor's Club
For everything he’s done and meant not only to the Texans organization but the community. He is a class act and deserves chance to compete for a Super Bowl and post season success.
Once he sits down with David Culley & Lovie Smith I'm sure he'll come to see that opportunity is right here in H-Town.


I hope Easterby is working on some LuvYaBlue uniforms like the Rockets.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
Don’t we owe JJ Watt the best fit/opportunity?

For everything he’s done and meant not only to the Texans organization but the community. He is a class act and deserves chance to compete for a Super Bowl and post season success.

We’ve already had our compensation for the 11th overall pick from 2011. Now it’s his turn to turn back time, get healthy and turn on that magic for new team on the upswing who need a DE who can stop the run and pass rush.

Texans would benefit not only from doing the right thing, but clear 17.5 million off the books. A team would need that cap room to fit him under, this late in career would be rare. A draft pick thrown on top of that minimal. Texans could ask for a 3rd or 4th but 5th or 6th more likely.

Best fit would be the Los Angles Chargers who have a new defensive minded head coach, Brandon Staley and former Bears DL coach, one of the best, Jay Rodgers along with a new DC, Renaldo Hill, secondary coach from the Broncos. Melvin Ingram is UFA @ 16 million they would be able to fit JJ’s full contract but would expect them to restructure a more enticing 3 year guaranteed deal.
Chargers could also include another player who interests Texans, like WR, where they have depth and Texans don’t. Just saying, it’s a fit for JJ. Wish him the best!
They've paid Watt over 100 million dollars.

I would say they owe him nothing.
 

whiteboy

Practice Squad
Green Bay might have even less cap space than the Texans. The Colts and Jags could easily absorb his contract. Boy do I dread that happening
Agreed, but if they release him it wont matter.

He can sign for whatever he wants, with the team he grew up watching.

I just feel like the Texans will do that for JJ ... he has earned that ... and if they dont, they are bigger a-holes than we think.
 

CstatTexan

Waterboy
Agreed, but if they release him it wont matter.

He can sign for whatever he wants, with the team he grew up watching.

I just feel like the Texans will do that for JJ ... he has earned that ... and if they dont, they are bigger a-holes than we think.
It all depends on how little JJ is willing to play for. Green Bay is pretty bad up against the cap.

And the Texans have paid JJ handsomely, they own him nothing. He’ll be traded for the most value just like Andre was.
 

whiteboy

Practice Squad
It all depends on how little JJ is willing to play for. Green Bay is pretty bad up against the cap.

And the Texans have paid JJ handsomely, they own him nothing. He’ll be traded for the most value just like Andre was.
They owe him nothing for what he has done on the field, but I cant think of any other player who has done more in the Houston community.

Ever.
 

Texian

Hall of Fame
It all depends on how little JJ is willing to play for. Green Bay is pretty bad up against the cap.

And the Texans have paid JJ handsomely, they own him nothing. He’ll be traded for the most value just like Andre was.
Andre Johnson was not traded, he was released. The year before teams were offering 2nd and 3rd RD picks for Andre. Bob McNair said no.
Andre Johnson released by Houston Texans (nfl.com)
 

CstatTexan

Waterboy
They owe him nothing for what he has done on the field, but I cant think of any other player who has done more in the Houston community.

Ever.
Andre did a lot for Houston which is why he’s beloved. The difference is there wasn’t always a camera present when he did.
 

whiteboy

Practice Squad
Point being the organization needs to do what’s best for the team and not whats best for JJ
Right now whats best for this team, which has earned the reputation for not giving a **** about its players, is to do right by JJ.

Otherwise who the hell would want to come here?

We are turning into the Bengals South ...
 

CstatTexan

Waterboy
Right now whats best for this team, which has earned the reputation for not giving a **** about its players, is to do right by JJ.

Otherwise who the hell would want to come here?

We are turning into the Bengals South ...
Yeah man players are totally going to forget about Deshaun and Hopkins when the Texans do what’s best for JJ
 

CstatTexan

Waterboy
Point made.

It would probably be spun as how they treated the white guy better ...
Rather than embracing the suck and buying into a several year rebuild, I full expect this team to half ass it and create problems that didn’t need to exist along the way.

They’ll probably announce they want to move JJ, stall and waste time, ultimately end up keeping him and he goes down mid season with an injury. That’s just sounds so Texans.
 

whiteboy

Practice Squad
Rather than embracing the suck and buying into a several year rebuild, I full expect this team to half ass it and create problems that didn’t need to exist along the way.

They’ll probably announce they want to move JJ, stall and waste time, ultimately end up keeping him and he goes down mid season with an injury. That’s just sounds so Texans.
I disagree.

JJ Watt never plays another down as a Texan ... 100%.
 

beerlover

Hall of Fame
OMG. Texans pick that paid off several times over and player well compensated in return but I would argue, with home town discount, for ....... wait for it ....... a Championship run.
 

beerlover

Hall of Fame
Championship run never materialized, then Clowney traded, Hopkins traded, maybe Watson traded, you tell me, I’d get the hell out of dodge myself. Do I need to go back to another #1 overall pick Mario Williams, surely not He Who Must Not Be Named. No, even the truest of true, Texan fan has seen enough, time to move on season ticket holders.
 


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