Hall of Fame
First of all, i didn't say he tried to hold on to the ball on that particular play...I said, or have rather IMPLIED thru several posts as have others that he tends to do that when he doesn't necessarily have to......which causes problems..& then guys like you like to erroneously claim that better play calls, better "designed" plays could alleviate him from doing that, which is only a half truth and a rather stupid argument b/c of course you could call quick slants and screens all day to help him get the ball out of his hands quicker. All me and others who see it like me are saying is that DW4 needs to get better at finding those shorter & intermediate routes WITHIN those plays with the deeper routes....b/c they ARE there and his decisions to continue to hold onto the ball at times waiting for the deeper stuff is purely HIS DECISION and his alone & as a result he/we tend to pay the price for that........AT TIMES. & just based on what he himself recently said (gotta just take what the defense gives me sometimes), he would agree with us. Only dudes like you like to argue otherwise...even though he & other professionals who've actually played the game & know what they're looking at have said so as well.I'm going to be very patient and try to explain to you (and those who seem to take your side) for the last time regarding this matter by bringing up the Mahomes' 3rd and 15 TD pass in the SB that xtruroyaltyx had mentioned in the Watson Int's thread as followed:
1. Mahomes took OVER 3 seconds to throw that ball with Buckner hitting him right after the release.
2. Andy Reid draw up that play knowing how long it would take for Hill to get there.
3. He initially had Max Protect for Mahomes; the RB made sure that his LT didn't get beat around the edge before releasing to the flat.
4. The RTE 81 took a hit on the LDE before running a seam route.
These two guys represent the short and medium routes.
5. The X ran a medium deep (about 20) in route, with the LTE 87 ran a similar route, both on play side (double dig, I think that's what they call it).
6. It's Mahomes' discretion on where the ball is going to.
In the long version here:
It was explained that:
- Mahomes had drifted some 14 yards back behind the LOS; that is a long, deep drop for a QB.
- Before that, he had come up to Bieniemy to ask for the play, which is call WASP in short (and his OC gave the AOK).
The Texans play is fairly similar in that:
1. They had 6 men to protect against a 4-man rush.
2. The right slot 12 ran a shallow crossing route, giving Watson the check down option.
3. The RB gave the LT help with a BIG chip on the RDE before releasing on a shallow crossing route in the opposite direction from above; another underneath option for the QB.
4. The Y 13 ran a 17-yd comebacker along the right side line for a medium deep option.
5. The Z 18 ran a deep seam route from the left slot to take away the SS in what started out as Cover 2 -
5 under, with both boundary corners carrying their man deep.
6. The X Fuller 15 ran a 20 yard deep in route from the left side line (Hi-Lo concept, inserting the wide out underneath the SS).
Here we can only guess at what depth Fuller needed to stem and turn inside for the throw; that's between the QB and the receiver (and the OC) when they draw up the play and practice it. It could be 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22 yards whatever. But here, that doesn't really matter because the ball was tipped. Just a note.
7. Watson threw the ball somewhere between the 2-1/2 to 2-3/4 second mark.
It was not a stupid long developing play because it had an extra blocker; it had two shallow underneath routes, a medium deep route on the right, another one on the left, and the deep route to clear space underneath.
The play was called after a missed FG by the opponent, with 34 seconds left in the half.
That's a great time for such a call, trying to capitalize on the negative mood of the opponent.
Watson didn't hold on to the ball forever like you tried to claim (well under 3 seconds).
Are you satisfied now?
But you seem to take alot of pride in your ability to break down a play. Yet, you wrote all of that out & still fail to understand the overriding point. A play is only as "long developing" as the QB decides it to be & the situation (3rd & long) 9 out of 10 times b/c almost every play is drawn up for every offense with long, medium and short options for the qb to get the ball out... depending on what he sees from the defense. So, classifying a play as "long developing" based on the primary read?.....yet another error in how you "analyze" film. The Wasp play as well as any of the criticisms you have had against BoB and our current offense bear that out. All of those things you highlighted above in the wasp play...the thing that made the biggest difference? "Mahomes' discretion on where he wanted to go with the ball"...........i can also assure you, genius Reid DID NOT draw up Mahomes drifting back 14- 15 yards on that play to buy more time either. Furthermore, the protections you're citing are basic and largely standard any time you're in that particular situation (3rd and long) & running with those types of wide open personnel packages that the chiefs were in....which was 12 i believe. but could also apply to similar types as well.
But that's not the only way that scenario can play out for success either. Check out DW4 against the Bills in our playoff game. 3rd & 18...gotta have it moment, the defense knows we need to pass it, rather than force it deep to his favorite target, he checked it down to his 3-4th option whom Buffalo had pretty much abandoned, Duke....1st down. Duke, chipped before he went out as well. Standard stuff really. Great decision by DW4 to understand the situation & we need more of that from him. And not that anyone should've been, But i didn't hear you lauding BoB for "play design" and all that back when it happened though.
The overriding bottom line to all of this is............. The game isn't played on a playbook sheet or in a coaches headset. It is still largely an instinctive game & it will always be played through the decisions that a QB makes play in, play out.