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The All Encompassing FIRE KUBIAK & REPLACEMENT thread

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"There is a significant difference between Tom Brady and ANYBODY ELSE I have seen this whole year."

- Steve Young, just now in the post-game show at Foxboro.

Echo'd my statements I made tonight. The guy is all-universe, especially in December AT HOME and especially when the stakes are high and it's against a really good team.

I wish people wouldn't be as hard on our team as they are. I was at that point after the GB game this year, and all the Texans did was just reel off countless wins in many fashions--Grinded out games, blew out the Ravens, OT wins back-to-back in under 5 days. Swept jags, Swept titans. And can sweep colts, too.

Go back and loom at the game logs.

Opposing qb's have had good games against us.

It's just that guys lime Brady and rivers have been lights out.

Heck, even back to last year Brees took us to the woodshed.

Mark Sanchez looked competent against us. Stafford lit us up...Henne I'm relief duty...Tannehill in his first game ever wasn't as bad as watt made him look with those tips. Manning struck us up.

The teams we face in the play offs will be closer to the patriots than they are to the jags and titans...

When you are at the level the texans want us to believe they are at, those games against non play off teams mean a lot less...

We can get our stuff together, but that's nothing but a hope and a wish at this point
 
This one is on Kubiak. May have not mattered but the bottom line is he absolutely did not put us in the best position to win. He called a piss poor game and the for the first time ever I'm calling him out about it. Yes stupid ass penalties( 3 illegal blocks on returns) bogus ass pass interference calls, etc.., but the most glaring weakness to me was the offensive play calling.
 
There's just always this "Oh yeah? We'll get you NEXT time!" mindset by a Kubiak-led team.

That works against lesser teams. You can be down to the Jags and claw your way back. You can be down to the Lions and make them crack under the weight of their own pressure, and win that game too. You cannot bring anything but your very best and expect to stand a chance against the Patriots.

Tonight, I felt the air was let out of our tires when KJ failed to secure that loose ball near the EZ. After that, it was a TD and you could sense that the Texans had given up (mentally) and were coasting from there. They went into the mode of "Yeah, we're still 11-2 and can win HFA in the next 3 games."
 
See thats the difference. I know we have a superbowl team, the guys just have to be put in position to win, and tonight they were not.

No doubt, both Gary & Wade deserve some criticism & blame.... but the 52+ guys who took the field deserve a little bit as well.
 
And of course . . . the playcalling . . .
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Two things I didn't like about the playcalling.

  1. When they man up on Andre... take advantage of it
    Until they change what they are doing, we should be feeding Andre the ball.
  2. Shouldn't there have been a point in that game where we aired it out?
    Did we ever go to the hurry up offense? Matt was struggling, needed to find his rhythm.... why didn't we try to get him some rhythm?
 
If we don't destroy Indy next week I'm busting out the soap again. I thought keeping Kubiak on after 2 years ago was a bad decision, and extending him again was a bad decision.
 
We be idiots to fire him now, but come February and yes, pending the outcome, Kubes' job needs to be re-evaluated.

He simply is not a coach in line with those that bring Championships. We've seen this time and time again. The only difference between this Kubes and the 6-10 Kubes is he has more to work with now, it doesn't mean he is a better coach.

I can drive a Prius, but I can look better and make a Maserati look a lot better even though I'm the same driver as I was with the Prius.
 
Two things I didn't like about the playcalling.

  1. When they man up on Andre... take advantage of it
    Until they change what they are doing, we should be feeding Andre the ball.
  2. Shouldn't there have been a point in that game where we aired it out?
    Did we ever go to the hurry up offense? Matt was struggling, needed to find his rhythm.... why didn't we try to get him some rhythm?

That all sounds so simple if you happen to forget what kind of pressure they were putting on him. And Schaub was being hurried a lot, he was making bad throws, and bad reads. I think it was more about playing the call right than calling the right play.
 
Wow, I thought the same thing this morning. :cool:

I knew as soon as the Pats went up 21-0, it was over.

I thought we had a chance till they scored in the third.

By that time, it was at least 3 (maybe 4) times our defense stopped the Pats without giving up any points & we still couldn't put together a scoring drive.
 
It wouldn't be the first time a team with this many wins fired their coach after the season. Marty Schottenheimer was 14 and 2 when San Diego ran him out of town and hired Norv Turner...... That worked out well.
 
It wouldn't be the first time a team with this many wins fired their coach after the season. Marty Schottenheimer was 14 and 2 when San Diego ran him out of town and hired Norv Turner...... That worked out well.

Problem is Kubiak isnt going anywhere! Even when we lose the division to the Colts this year he STILL WONT BE FIRED!
 
Problem is Kubiak isnt going anywhere! Even when we lose the division to the Colts this year he STILL WONT BE FIRED!

Maybe I need a sarcasm smiley. San Diego threw whatever chance they had at a Superbowl away when they fired Marty. If letting go of Marty was not the final nail in the coffin then hiring Norv was. You can't fire your coach when your one of the top teams in the league. With 32 teams in the league simple odds tell you that your chances of getting worse are much greater than your chances of getting better.
 
Maybe I need a sarcasm smiley. San Diego threw whatever chance they had at a Superbowl away when they fired Marty. If letting go of Marty was not the final nail in the coffin then hiring Norv was. You can't fire your coach when your one of the top teams in the league. With 32 teams in the league simple odds tell you that your chances of getting worse are much greater than your chances of getting better.

This.

Kubiak is an above-average coach. He can draw up plays with the best of them, his players love him, and he has taken us from 2-14 to 11-2. But he is terrible at deviating from his pre-determined gameplan, clock management, and all things defense (think of the DCs he hired before Wade was hired).

But until there is someone out there who is better than Kubiak, we should roll with Kubiak. There is no sense in making a change just for the hell of it.
 
I'm with Joe... I was in a bar full of Texans fans and we went down by a touchdown and everyone got all weepy eyed. Makes me sick. Sick Sick Sick!

Scores don't always matter to my reaction. It's about how the team is playing. You could see early in the 1st quarter that we were going to be blown out. Destroyed. Boston Massacre Style.

The team came out looking flat. They committed stupid penalties early. So yeah, by the time the Pats scored their first TD I was nervous. When Schaub threw an INT in the end zone and the Pats marched back to score another TD, my fears were confirmed.

We were woefully unprepared last night
 
This.

Kubiak is an above-average coach. He can draw up plays with the best of them, his players love him, and he has taken us from 2-14 to 11-2. But he is terrible at deviating from his pre-determined gameplan, clock management, and all things defense (think of the DCs he hired before Wade was hired).

But until there is someone out there who is better than Kubiak, we should roll with Kubiak. There is no sense in making a change just for the hell of it.

But that's just it; WHY can't he learn to make in-game adjustments. It's not that freaking hard to see that when you are down 21-0 you gotta open things up and take a lot of risks. Otherwise, you might as well just head for the airport with 10 minutes left in the first half. Maybe the whole team can catch an earlier flight, LOL.

I defend Kubiak when he keeps running the ball with a lead and trying to burn clock instead of taking risks to score points. I will NOT defend him when we are down by 3 or more scores and he lines up AJ at fullback (little sarcasm, although I'd like to hear the explanation for that) and runs right at Wilfork. If you're going to give up with half or more of the game left, then trot out the 3rd stringers and let the starters go to the local bar or something.
 
But that's just it; WHY can't he learn to make in-game adjustments. It's not that freaking hard to see that when you are down 21-0 you gotta open things up and take a lot of risks. Otherwise, you might as well just head for the airport with 10 minutes left in the first half. Maybe the whole team can catch an earlier flight, LOL.

I defend Kubiak when he keeps running the ball with a lead and trying to burn clock instead of taking risks to score points. I will NOT defend him when we are down by 3 or more scores and he lines up AJ at fullback (little sarcasm, although I'd like to hear the explanation for that) and runs right at Wilfork. If you're going to give up with half or more of the game left, then trot out the 3rd stringers and let the starters go to the local bar or something.

There are many different trains of thought here. I thought it was the right thing to run the ball down 21 points early in the second qtr. I thought going in that we would have to slow the game down to beat the Patriots.

However, when we couldn't extend drives after the defense held the score, that's when I got worried.

When they kept loading the box & we were getting stopped for losses, I kept thinking, surely we have a contention plan for that. Man coverage on AJ, surely we have a contention plan for that. But we obviously didn't.

I was also disappointed we didn't take the points when we had a chance. I think it would have been a 51 yarder. I know we get on Kubiak for not taking a chance & going for it on 4th down when we've got momentum, but we were on the road, we were down 21 points, I think the smart thing there would have been to take the points. Of course with our kicker, a 51 yard field goal is hardly a given.

But I don't have a problem with the idea of sticking with the run game that early in the game. I wish we'd have been a little more imaginitive than run on first & second, throw on third. There was a 3rd & 3 (I think) that we lined up in shot-gun with no back..... duh?

:barman: but I don't do this for a living.
 
You can't fire your coach when your one of the top teams in the league.

As a counterpoint, it should be noted that Tony Dungy got his team to the playoffs, 4 or 5 times in a row and was fired with a winning record after a playoff loss. The next year, that team won the Super Bowl with a new coach.
 
As a counterpoint, it should be noted that Tony Dungy got his team to the playoffs, 4 or 5 times in a row and was fired with a winning record after a playoff loss. The next year, that team won the Super Bowl with a new coach.

Think this might be revisionist. He won a SB. Coached a couple more years and then retired and the reins went to Caldwell.

But, I think Kubes should be fired!Just fun to say:stirpot:
 
Maybe our team would learn more if we hire a new head coach every year. :turtle:

I'll do it next year, and I'm not coming on here to hear all you guys gripin'.
 
I'm a Kubiak supporter. Last night he had some terrible calls and the team overall seemed underprepared mentally. Just like the Packers game, the Texans fell behind by making mistakes early and could never recover. That is a combination of coaches and players. Neither coordinator adjusted well. Most players played poorly. Overall a terrible showing made worse since it was on national TV.

The 2 losses this season were the result of complete meltdown. Offense, defense, special teams, coaches & players. Kubiak's offense failed. Phillips' defense failed.

The overall picture is the only thing that counts though. Injuries have killed the defense. The salary cap killed the o-line in the offseason. This team is playing well overall though. The '12 Kubiak led Texans are 11-2. Win the next game and they win the AFCS. Win the next 2 and they get a BYE. Win the next 3 and they get HFA.

A head coaching change (after the season) would be opening the door for the other teams in the division. If Kubiak goes - Schaub goes. Does anyone run the "Kubiak" offense successfully other than Kubiak? How's the Redskins version worked out? Schaub is a "master" of this offense. He's not going to be a great QB and surely not in a new offense. Foster is less effective in a new offense. AJ is getting older. We have 1 olineman that would start for a conventional offense. Looks like a rebuild job to me. I'd rather not go through that again.

There are some scenarios that would make me feel a change at HC is needed. It would take a serious collapse that I hope none of us want to see.

Here's hoping that the anti-Kubiaks are wrong and we win a Superbowl this season. We need some feel-good vibes to wash away the crap that seems to repeat after every loss now.
 
Maybe I need a sarcasm smiley. San Diego threw whatever chance they had at a Superbowl away when they fired Marty. If letting go of Marty was not the final nail in the coffin then hiring Norv was. You can't fire your coach when your one of the top teams in the league. With 32 teams in the league simple odds tell you that your chances of getting worse are much greater than your chances of getting better.

This, again.

People. You are 11-2. You have 85 pages of fire Kubiak? Other than when Tampa fired Dungy and hired Chucky, when has a good team fired a coach and got better? Dungy would have won the following year, anyway, Tampa was impatient.

You guys are so close. Stay the course. Judge it at the end of the season. Maybe *MAYBE* you can bring in a D coordinator or secondary coach.

Look...our team was horrific on defense earlier in the year; couldn't stop a good high school team. Teams grow. You guys are right there. Relax.
 
This, again.

People. You are 11-2. You have 85 pages of fire Kubiak? Other than when Tampa fired Dungy and hired Chucky, when has a good team fired a coach and got better? Dungy would have won the following year, anyway, Tampa was impatient.

You guys are so close. Stay the course. Judge it at the end of the season. Maybe *MAYBE* you can bring in a D coordinator or secondary coach.

Look...our team was horrific on defense earlier in the year; couldn't stop a good high school team. Teams grow. You guys are right there. Relax.

The original OP was in 2009.
 
Kubiak keeps making the same stupid mistakes for that long. Actually, from the beginning, but it took until 2009 for people to start to figure out that his stripes weren't going to change.

I'm not passing judgement, so don't take it wrong... but you're saying that you guys are 11-2 in spite of Kubiak?
 
I'm not passing judgement, so don't take it wrong... but you're saying that you guys are 11-2 in spite of Kubiak?

This thread always comes back whenever there is a loss or the team doesn't win strongly.

I am all for keeping Kubiak. In my mind the only way he loses his job is if the Texans get smacked around in the playoffs.

When people talk about replacing Kubiak they need to have someone that is without a doubt better.
 
Two things I didn't like about the playcalling.

  1. When they man up on Andre... take advantage of it
    Until they change what they are doing, we should be feeding Andre the ball.
  2. Shouldn't there have been a point in that game where we aired it out?
    Did we ever go to the hurry up offense? Matt was struggling, needed to find his rhythm.... why didn't we try to get him some rhythm?

How you gonna "air it out" or "get Matt some rhythm" when Vince Wolfolk was in the backfield a half second after the snap?? He's yet another version of Haynesworth or Kris Jenkins. Our O-line was simply out matched. Ben Jones was just abused all night.
 
I'm not passing judgement, so don't take it wrong... but you're saying that you guys are 11-2 in spite of Kubiak?

Tell you what. I'll just give you an example that happens over and over and over here in Houston. Kubiak has done this since the beginning and shows absolutely no signs of changing. This is from last night's play-by-play:

Houston Texans at 03:26
1-10-HOU 34 (3:26) 8-M.Schaub pass short middle to 23-A.Foster to NE 43 for 23 yards (32-D.McCourty).
1-10-NE 43 (2:42) 8-M.Schaub pass incomplete short right to 23-A.Foster.
Timeout #2 by NE at 02:38.
2-10-NE 43 (2:38) 23-A.Foster right tackle to NE 43 for no gain (51-J.Mayo).
Two-Minute Warning
3-10-NE 43 (2:00) (Shotgun) PENALTY on NE-99-T.Scott, Neutral Zone Infraction, 5 yards, enforced at NE 43 - No Play.
3-5-NE 38 (2:00) (Shotgun) 8-M.Schaub pass incomplete deep middle to 80-A.Johnson (31-A.Talib). NE-31-A.Talib was injured during the play.
Timeout #3 by NE at 01:55. injury in last 2 minutes
4-5-NE 38 (1:55) (Shotgun) 8-M.Schaub pass incomplete short left to 83-K.Walter [51-J.Mayo].

New England Patriots at 01:52
1-10-NE 38 (1:52) 34-S.Vereen left tackle to NE 39 for 1 yard (98-C.Barwin; 51-D.Sharpton).
2-9-NE 39 (1:24) (Shotgun) 12-T.Brady pass short left to 85-B.Lloyd to NE 45 for 6 yards (24-J.Joseph).
3-3-NE 45 (:55) (No Huddle, Shotgun) 12-T.Brady pass incomplete deep left to 81-A.Hernandez (29-G.Quin).
4-3-NE 45 (:50) 14-Z.Mesko punts 55 yards to end zone, Center-48-D.Aiken, Touchback.

Houston Texans at 00:41
1-10-HOU 20 (:41) (Shotgun) 8-M.Schaub pass short left to 81-O.Daniels to HOU 31 for 11 yards (51-J.Mayo).
1-10-HOU 31 (:21) (No Huddle, Shotgun) 8-M.Schaub pass incomplete short middle to 80-A.Johnson (37-A.Dennard).
2-10-HOU 31 (:16) (Shotgun) 8-M.Schaub pass incomplete deep right to 18-L.Jean [54-D.Hightower].
3-10-HOU 31 (:10) 23-A.Foster left guard to HOU 40 for 9 yards (23-M.Cole; 27-T.Wilson).
END QUARTER 2

Look at the time stamps. The Texans had the ball with 3:26 left and just drained the clock as if they were ahead. The Patriots called timeouts. They wanted the ball back. When the Pats had the ball, the Texans called no timeouts. When the Texans had the ball at the end of the half, they wasted what clock was left. Kubiak took two timeouts into the locker room with him. He basically curled up in a ball and begged to get to halftime. He plays scared in a game that you can't play with fear of failure.

It's a running joke around here that if the team is facing 3rd and long inside it's own 35, it's going to be a draw play to the right. And with about a 90% accuracy, we're right. It always is. Kubiak just gives up on the series and punts. No one's asking for 4 streaks there, but maybe mix in a screen, a bubble screen, hell ... even a toss play. Oooh, maybe even a draw to the left! LOL. I'm not busting your chops here, but you're just not familiar with the clock management issues, the tendency to quit in certain situations, the inability to adjust to the other team's game plan, and the questionable play calls in certain situations. Kubiak has a lot of strengths. He is a damn good play designer. When he gets this team's offense going in a rhythm, it's an awesome sight to behold. Generally, he drafts offensive guys pretty well. But when it comes to grading him as a HEAD coach, he's just not good. He can't do defense - AT ALL. He hired bad defensive coaches and stuck with them until his job was on the line. He drafted bad defensive players. He sucks at all the aforementioned things that a HEAD coach has to do.

He's just an offensive coordinator trying to play head coach, and he's not very good at it.
 
This thread always comes back whenever there is a loss or the team doesn't win strongly.

I am all for keeping Kubiak. In my mind the only way he loses his job is if the Texans get smacked around in the playoffs.

When people talk about replacing Kubiak they need to have someone that is without a doubt better.

bossmcnair.jpg


cowher.jpg
 
How you gonna "air it out" or "get Matt some rhythm" when Vince Wolfolk was in the backfield a half second after the snap?? He's yet another version of Haynesworth or Kris Jenkins. Our O-line was simply out matched. Ben Jones was just abused all night.

Move him. Move the pocket, make Wilfork move side to side. I'd have liked to see a bootleg at least once. While our run game wasn't all that, they were keyed in on it.

They had a 7th round pick on Andre 1 on 1, I'm sure he could have got open.
 
Against the Packers, he did the same sort of thing. He basically quit on the half. He didn't want any part of trying to compete and get better. When questioned about my take on it, this was my response:

Well, for starters you call that timeout immediately and prepare for the punt. You get the special teams coach that you employ to get his players to freakin' block someone and try for a decent return. Then you come up with a couple plays that are a balance of risk vs. reward that may result in something. That means no Hail Marys and no 3rd and long draw plays, in case that needed to be clarified. If they don't result in anything, you gave it an honest attempt. If they do, maybe you get a FG or even a TD.

What you don't do is kneel down on the sideline and pray to God that the half ends right then and there for the whole world to see.
 
Tell you what. I'll just give you an example that happens over and over and over here in Houston. Kubiak has done this since the beginning and shows absolutely no signs of changing. This is from last night's play-by-play:



Look at the time stamps. The Texans had the ball with 3:26 left and just drained the clock as if they were ahead. The Patriots called timeouts. They wanted the ball back. When the Pats had the ball, the Texans called no timeouts. When the Texans had the ball at the end of the half, they wasted what clock was left. Kubiak took two timeouts into the locker room with him. He basically curled up in a ball and begged to get to halftime. He plays scared in a game that you can't play with fear of failure.

It's a running joke around here that if the team is facing 3rd and long inside it's own 35, it's going to be a draw play to the right. And with about a 90% accuracy, we're right. It always is. Kubiak just gives up on the series and punts. No one's asking for 4 streaks there, but maybe mix in a screen, a bubble screen, hell ... even a toss play. Oooh, maybe even a draw to the left! LOL. I'm not busting your chops here, but you're just not familiar with the clock management issues, the tendency to quit in certain situations, the inability to adjust to the other team's game plan, and the questionable play calls in certain situations. Kubiak has a lot of strengths. He is a damn good play designer. When he gets this team's offense going in a rhythm, it's an awesome sight to behold. Generally, he drafts offensive guys pretty well. But when it comes to grading him as a HEAD coach, he's just not good. He can't do defense - AT ALL. He hired bad defensive coaches and stuck with them until his job was on the line. He drafted bad defensive players. He sucks at all the aforementioned things that a HEAD coach has to do.

He's just an offensive coordinator trying to play head coach, and he's not very good at it.

Eriadoc hit the nail on the head here. Good post!
 
I'm not passing judgement, so don't take it wrong... but you're saying that you guys are 11-2 in spite of Kubiak?

That's EXACTLY how some folks think around here. Boggles my mind. None of the players - with the possible exception of Schaub - have come up with a single game plan.

Oh and did I mention that the new "conventional wisdom" among the Fire Kubiak crowd is that we're winning because of Wade's defense not because of Kubiak. ...yeah, that same defense that has allowed an average of 30 pts per during the last four games. All while having, arguably, the best D-lineman and the best CB in the AFC if not the league!

Boggles my mind.

Yeah, they think it's all Kubiak.

Last I looked, neither Kubiak nor Wade has played a single down this season.
But let's excuse the players.
It's Kubiak.
 

Meh, Cowher is a great coach but I'm not sure how he fixes our problems.

I know, he screams on the sidelines and gets all angry on TV just like Gruden so people automatically assume that he's teaching toughness.

Any ways, I don't see how we could make a case for firing him now. The Texans should be judged by what they do in the playoffs, not the regular season.
 
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