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"Texans players say they had illegal contract drills at 2008 mini-camp"

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Hoth-Boy said:
My problem is that I feel Stevenson is only bringing this to the attention of the media becuase he didn't get the results he wnated by going through the offical channels established by the CBA.
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True, but again we do not know his motives. It could be good old greed, then again it could be because he honestly feel that he and others were taken advantage of, and that he wants to see some sort of consequences to what he believes are improper and illegal procedures.

Im glad the cat is out of the bag honestly, if it holds water he'll get what he is entitled to, if not then our team is cleared. For someone who cherishes things being 'right' this is a win-win.
 
"It was a live blocking drill. There were people getting pancaked. Everyone's going as hard as he can," Stevenson said.

"I felt like, for my career, my occupation, my dreams, for all this to be taken away from me, to be jeopardized not for just one season but for my entire football career for something that wasn't supposed to be done -- I was upset," Stevenson said


Stevenson suffered a labia tear that he feels might end his career.
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Fixed it for him.
 
Malloy said:
I agree, Im sure all teams do it. That does IMO not change the fact that the players injured are entitled to bring it to the NFLPA's attention and seek some sort of compensation.

Perhaps this will bury the accusations by some that this is a soft franchise :)
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Señor Stan;1112947 said:
Fixed it for him.
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:spit: Damn!
 
Hoth-Boy said:
You need to watch the video. I'vee seen drills at the Combine get way more physical then the drill shown in the video clip.
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Im not sure what I would be looking for, I have zero experience with this so my evaluation of said training would be done based on absolutely nothing. I'll rather leave that to the people charged with the task of determining whether it is a breach of NFLPA rules or not :)
 
Stevenson suffered a labia tear that he feels might end his career.
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:spit:

He may very well find this ends his career even if the injury doesn't. He was marginal to begin with and other teams aren't going to appreciate this either.

Like Arlington said above--profootballtalk has been talking for a couple years about how pervasive this is and the NFL does nothing. Look at the quotes and pictures from around the league and you can tell the rule gets violated all the time.
 
infantrycak said:
:spit:

He may very well find this ends his career even if the injury doesn't. He was marginal to begin with and other teams aren't going to appreciate this either.

Like Arlington said above--profootballtalk has been talking for a couple years about how pervasive this is and the NFL does nothing. Look at the quotes and pictures from around the league and you can tell the rule gets violated all the time.
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You mean future coaches and teammates may not approve of this behavior?
Stevenson took a video camera into the Texans' meeting room and filmed the team's video of the workout.
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Yikes... now what will this be known as? Illegal Contact-Gate...

Hey, we may be classless but at least we don't cheat lol:
 
HOU-TEX said:
Meh, I don't think it's going to be a big deal. It sounds like sour grapes from 3 players no longer with the team. Even if it were to go against the Texans I wouldn't think the punishment would be too extreme.
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My initial reaction, based on what I have read, is that this was VERY wrong to have happened.

Going all out in a drill where you went hard enough to tear a labrum? Pads might have absorbed a lot of that punishment.

This isn't good, at all, if it's true.
 
GP said:
You DO cheat. LenWhale cuts in line at the meals all the time. :smiliedance:
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I was thinking more along the lines of: with every breath and exhale, a certain owner cheats a deserving human of clean air


but that is just me :specnatz:
 
GP said:
You DO cheat. LenWhale cuts in line at the meals all the time. :smiliedance:
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Haha, and goes back for seconds before everyone has been through. Good one :whip:

OK, we'll take it another step. At least when we cheat we win more than we lose!
 
Pay them their money so everyone can get over it. Get back to football. The NFL cheats teams out of Super Bowls all the time.
 
This isn't the first time this has happened with the Texans, and I doubt it will be the last. In fact, I believe that Aaron Glenn's complaints as player rep about the same activity was a factor in his falling out with the Texans.

That being said, other teams do the same thing. If the Texans really want to be a place that is known to be a "good place to play" for free agents, maybe they should learn from this and abide by the agreement. I doubt they will, even though it must have very minimal benefits when compared to the risks.
 
Yankee_In_TX said:
Seriously dude - you're a player I have never herd of, get injured, and sneak a video camera in the film room? Hope your grievance works out, because you'll never play in the NFL again.

Sorry you got hurt, hope you get what is coming for your injury AND NOTHING MORE, but jackass.
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Isn't that a crime to take a camera in the film room and record it??? If so would the tape be admissable as evidence in his suit since he aquired it illegaly?
 
Runner said:
This isn't the first time this has happened with the Texans, and I doubt it will be the last. In fact, I believe that Aaron Glenn's complaints as player rep about the same activity was a factor in his falling out with the Texans.

That being said, other teams do the same thing. If the Texans really want to be a place that is known to be a "good place to play" for free agents, maybe they should learn from this and abide by the agreement. I doubt they will, even though it must have very minimal benefits when compared to the risks.
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If they violated the spirit of the rule and took advantage of the players, then I'm disappointed with the organization. However, if they simply breached the literal reading of the rules in order to begin to institute a new OL system with the new coach (Gibbs) and the players weren't placed at any greater risk than normal, then I've got no problem with it but still hope that a fringe player like Stevenson and Okobi get some financial restitution for damage done to their careers.
 
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/6248129.html

If the Texans are found to have violated the NFL’s offseason workout policy, they will lose one week of their organized team activities, and coach Gary Kubiak could be fined.

If a league investigation finds more than one violation during the league year, the Texans could be fined a fourth-round draft choice, according to the collective bargaining agreement.
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So it seems that 4th rounder is the max punishment that the team could suffer.

If Kubiak knew this, and ran these practices anyways, and we end up losing a draft pick; I'll be highly pissed.
 
I don't know what this extra contact is supposed to gain the team anyway. Today's players are much more fit year round than in previous eras, and they all know how to hit already. I think the coaches just fall back to the "tough guy" methods they learned under.

If the point was to teach a new OL scheme, it seems spending the time on group OL training would be more beneficial. I know some players think there is too much practice contact; I guess that is why the players wanted it in the CB (which the teams agreed to signed).

I'm with the players on this one.
 
Thanks for pissing off the rest of the team. Now OTA's will be soft and short but training camp will be the most brutal that the team has ever had. They will have to put in the extra work that they missed. Alex Gibbs probably wants this guy booted out of there so bad. LOL
 
Looks like Gibbs is following along Darwin's, quick way to sort out the scrub from the players, in his natural selection program.

Survival of the fittest baby.

Look like these scrubs are just trying to milk out some money cause they know they have no chance of success anymore in the NFL. W/E.
 
Dick Justice's take:
http://blogs.chron.com/sportsjustice/archives/2009/02/kubiak_messed_u.html

I bet you can't guess how it reads?

The video shows players doing full-speed blocking drills without pads. First, the drills are illegal. Second, they're dumb.

There's a reason the NFL's labor agreement allows contact drills only at appointed times. Otherwise, coaches would have players banging on each other 10 months a year.

Maybe Gary Kubiak and Alex Gibbs thought they'd toughen the boys up. If the Texans are cheating, shouldn't they at least win a few more games?

This thing could get really ugly. It goes beyond illegal drills. It gets into how injured players are cared for.

The Texans look really bad. For a franchise that prides itself on doing things right, on wanting high-character guys, this deal looks terrible. Cheating is cheating. Do other teams do it? Sure they do. Do other teams get caught? Sometimes?

Now we're down a road that includes grievances, depositions and lawsuits. Ugh. You'd think if the Texans were cheating, they'd be better on the field. You'd think if Rick Smith is smart enough to be on the NFL's Competition Committee, he'd be smart enough to let his head coach know he's breaking the rules about off-season workouts.

Maybe Rick was so busy surrounding himself with ''his people'' that he didn't have time to care of these silly little details.

The Texans can't do anything right, can they? It's not that Gary Kubiak broke a rule or two regarding off-season workouts. Lord knows, he's not the first.

There are dumber teams. The Redskins got caught a couple of years ago when they posted an illegal practice right there on their own Web site. At least the Texans weren't that dumb.

The problem is that Kubiak doesn't come off as real smart. If you're going to cheat, you've got to know you can get away with it.
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And yes I know I had promised myself to not read The Media's drivel again, but this might be something fairly important about the team.
 
Let's try to keep this thread on subject and keep the smack talk in the proper forum.

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I wonder how the "survival of the fittest" theory will sound if it is an Eric Winston type that gets hurt the next time.
 
I am missing it, is there a video link somewhere of the practice?

I am the the main site but don't see it
 
Wolf said:
I am missing it, is there a video link somewhere of the practice?

I am the the main site but don't see it
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Espin has a clip on their site. It shows a couple of seconds of hand fighting. Kinda lame if you ask me.
 
dtran04 said:
Thanks for pissing off the rest of the team. Now OTA's will be soft and short but training camp will be the most brutal that the team has ever had. They will have to put in the extra work that they missed. Alex Gibbs probably wants this guy booted out of there so bad. LOL
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I'm still not clear on what the players are missing if they don't have early contact drills with no pads. There is plenty of wear and tear on these guys' bodies through the season. Extra hitting at OTAs isn't going to make them less injury prone the last few games of the year; if anything it will have the opposite effect.
 
Runner said:
Let's try to keep this thread on subject and keep the smack talk in the proper forum.

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I wonder how the "survival of the fittest" theory will sound if it is an Eric Winston type that gets hurt the next time.
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I agree, damn.

Seriously, though. This is a non-issue from an outside fan. Cheating is the wrong word for this, it was just a bad decision. It isn't comparable to Spygate or steroids or whatever like ESPN's Bottomline seems to want it to be. Bad decision that Kubiak and Co. will pay for. Really sucks that those guys got hurt but were those injuries a direct result of these drills?
 
The point is rules were established and allegedly broken by the managment. You might not like to stop for red lights but that is a rule. Damage occured due to the violation and victims should be re-imbursed. It is amazing to me how many say "well it was a little rule or it did not kill'em or they would not have made the team". It does not matter. Cheating should not be laughed at. Thousand of children watch sports only to learn cheating or hitting the girl friend or wife is OK as long as it does not keep him from helping his team.

If Texans violated a rule, suck it up and pay the freight and go on. McNair is known for wanting quality character players. How about Kubes showing some character and stop breaking the rules?
 
Bulluck53 said:
I agree, damn.

Seriously, though. This is a non-issue from an outside fan. Cheating is the wrong word for this, it was just a bad decision. It isn't comparable to Spygate or steroids or whatever like ESPN's Bottomline seems to want it to be. Bad decision that Kubiak and Co. will pay for. Really sucks that those guys got hurt but were those injuries a direct result of these drills?
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And I agree with you that as far as "cheating" goes, this is small potatoes. In fact, I don't think doing it offers any competitive advantage.

It does however affect how the players perceive their coaches and the team as a whole. I'm not just talking about the ones that are complaining, I'm talking about the entire roster. Most of the players don't like it, and they all know it not supposed to be done. It is just another sign management thinks of them as pieces of meat.

Put yourself in the shoes of a player - do you think it makes the player respect the coach and credit him as "tough" just because he abuses his authority?
 
I think the most damning thing for Kubiak is that the player reps told him that the drills were a violation, and yet he continued to run them.
 
No, but to be honest I didn't play football in high school because I hated the coach so I may not be the one to ask.

I understand that the players may frown upon this but they didn't have pads on. How much contact could they have had? I'm on the fence on this one. If no one had been hurt would the players have been upset? I know "ifs and buts" and I know that someone indeed was injured but I just don't understand the big deal. It was very unfortunate that someone got hurt but I don't see the big picture as a big deal. People break the rules all the time. This one backfired more than some others.

And Badboy, I get what you're saying and definetly agree with you. It was cheating, someone got screwed out of a job because of it, and they should be reimbursed. Not to be a smart ass to ya but I do speed, I did drink before I was 21, I have smoked pot before, and teams break rules all the time (you think the Pats were the only ones taping signals? And remember my Fisher having a verbal agreement with Chris Simms when he was cut then re-signed this season? Hell there have been reports of offers made to Hyanesworth already by several different teams.) Teams cheat and wont stop doing so until they get hurt as a direct result (just like I probably won't stop speeding until I get a ticket or worse).

EDIT: to summarize I don't think this should be looked at as a burden towards Kubiak or the Texans
 
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Carl Mauk, Mike Webster, Art Shell, and all of the old school O-Linemen would laugh at these guys.

BTW, I've never heard of pads preventing torn labrums. Maybe MLB pitchers ought to start wearing shoulder pads if it helps... :gun:
 
Why did he participate if he's just going to complain about it later? Don't do the (practicing) if you can't do the (injury).

Man's game
 
Runner said:
I wonder how the "survival of the fittest" theory will sound if it is an Eric Winston type that gets hurt the next time.
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oh damn, I think I just got served.

You're right, the responses would be different. But Eric would probably have the decency of keeping this stuff private instead of blabbing to the media about it like that Stevenson chump.
 
Texan_Bill said:
Carl Mauk, Mike Webster, Art Shell, and all of the old school O-Linemen would laugh at these guys.

BTW, I've never heard of pads preventing torn labrums. Maybe MLB pitchers ought to start wearing shoulder pads if it helps... :gun:
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I don't think Mike Webster is a good example to use to promote more contact with less pads.

Of course, who cares if players are crippled, demented, or dead by fifty? Their careers are over and they can't help the team anyway. :sarcasm:
 
McClain wieghts in:
http://blogs.chron.com/nfl/2009/02/texans_better_hope_they_dont_l.html

The Texans better hope the NFL investigation doesn't turn up multiple violations of their offseason workout policy. If it does, they could lose a fourth-round draft choice as spelled out in the collective bargaining agreement.

At best, the team will lose a week of organized team activities for conducting illegal one-on-one blocking drills between offensive and defensive linemen. Coach Gary Kubiak can expect a fine that will be donated to charity. The CBA says the head coach can't be reimbursed by the team.
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I'm still pissed that this could cost the team a draft pick.
 
Runner said:
I don't think Mike Webster is a good example to use to promote more contact with less pads.

Of course, who cares if players are crippled, demented, or dead by fifty? Their careers are over and they can't help the team anyway. :sarcasm:
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In retrospect you're right, Webster, not so much. Mauck, Shell and numerous other tough guys are doing fine though. This is why Australian Rules Football and Rugby players laugh at American Football.
 
Runner said:
You could have responded, "he's one of the fit; he won't get hurt". :)
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Heck yeah, he's one of the fit. If running from T-Rex's and dragging Brontosaurus legs back to the cave won't get a dude in optimal shape, nothing will.
 
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