Texans #2 WR position

[Texans_Chick]

Everybody knows this is an issue, but finding solutions are harder.

I frame the issue here:

Options, pessimism about 2013 Texans #2 wide receiver position

Framing the issue doesn't mean solving it, but it is hard to discuss things without a framework of what is possible/feasible.

Maybe I'm just grumpy at the beginning of February on this subject, but this topic puts me in a grim mood. Are there reasons to be less grumpy about this? Your ideas welcome.

 

[CloakNNNdagger]

Everybody knows this is an issue, but finding solutions are harder.

I frame the issue here:

Options, pessimism about 2013 Texans #2 wide receiver position

Framing the issue doesn't mean solving it, but it is hard to discuss things without a framework of what is possible/feasible.

Maybe I'm just grumpy at the beginning of February on this subject, but this topic puts me in a grim mood. Are there reasons to be less grumpy about this? Your ideas welcome.

Nice write up as usual, Steph.

Grumpy/grim probably is not an unreasonable mood to be in at this point. Our bargain hunting pattern for WRs over the years are no more likely to produce results this year. On top of that, it is hard to feel comfortable that even with the addition of that "it" WR, we can't be guaranteed that the ball will ever be "delivered" effectively to make such a move significantly productive this upcoming season. As McNair has made a public statement that he essentially feels the WR position needs to be given attention, while looking at our Cap situation this year and next, and our diffuse needs, I more expect to see a window dressing WR appear on the 2013 Texans..... I hope that I am wrong. But, meanwhile, along with you, Steph, I can't help but remain somewhat cynical, grim and grumpy.

 

[CloakNNNdagger]

BTW, how did "Matt Schaub" make it onto the linked 2013 FA list???:kubepalm:

 

[Stemp]

I've had my eye on Quinton Patton since the game against A&M. I think this guy is going to be a stud and I'm hoping he falls into the Texans' lap at the draft and they pull the trigger.

 

[Wolf6151]

The Texans have alot of holes right now and with our salary cap situation I don't think there's any way we fill them all with good or even decent players. We're going into next season with a few team weaknesses plain and simple. We don't have the money to properly address WR in FA unless we make some painful cuts elsewhere on the team. I honestly think that this offseason could be even bloodier than last with all the cuts that may get made. Also the fact that McNair is making his opinion known publicly regarding WR, tells me that he's not real happy with Smithiak right now and the fact that the WR position hasn't been fixed when it's been an obvious issue to everyone in the NFL. Using the "bargain hunting pattern" that Kubiak has used the last few year to fix the problem hasn't worked, and I'm thinking it's really irritating McNair. Last years draft was a perfect example, it was really deep at WR yet we traded out of the 2nd round when there were good WR's available to us and then took a guy who should have been a 6th round pick at best in the 3rd. That move will come back to haunt us and it looks like it's already starting to.

I think we address the issue in the draft, we've got no other choice.

 

[CloakNNNdagger]

I've had my eye on Quinton Patton since the game against A&M. I think this guy is going to be a stud and I'm hoping he falls into the Texans' lap at the draft and they pull the trigger.

My favorite.

 

[deucetx]

Last years draft was a perfect example, it was really deep at WR yet we traded out of the 2nd round when there were good WR's available to us and then took a guy who should have been a 6th round pick at best in the 3rd. That move will come back to haunt us and it looks like it's already starting to.

I think we address the issue in the draft, we've got no other choice.

I wouldn't hold trading back against them. Even after that only one receiver was chosen before their next pick (Rueben Randle) and he had an unsubstantial year. But yeah, the way they address it leaves something to be desired. Seems like we go for projects even in draft. Jones out of Lane college and Posey who missed an entire season were at the top of our receiver picks. Come on...

Two that did well that we missed on were T.Y. Hilton which of course come back to bite us in the backside and Chris Givens. But it's hindsight at this point though I originally liked Givens so was a bit peeved when we didn't pick him. Heh, I would have been surprised if this team rolled the dice and went for Josh Gordon in the supplemental draft but of course not bias on that one since he's a friend of the family.

Definitely looks like draft is the way we have to go again though I would really rather a free agent WR since rookies usually take time to develop at this position.

 

[badboy]

I think there are moves that canbe made to bring on top notch WR, whether we go that direction is the question. As McNair has spoken on this it might happen. I could see a high motor guy like Kawaan Short being selected to replace A. Smith and use that cap savings towards FA #2 WR. Reworking Walter saves a small amount. I like Stedman Bailey in draft who should be available in third.

 

[CloakNNNdagger]

Walter already restructured his 2012 income. Wonder, if asked, how likely he would be to even agree to another one of any significance this year

Houston Texans wide receiver Kevin Walter took a pay cut earlier this month. Walter, 31, was scheduled to earn $3.5 million in base salary with a $4.5 million salary cap number in each of the three remaining seasons on his current contract. On March 16, Walter agreed to reduce his salary to $2 million, lowering his cap number for this season to $3 million. The final two years on Walter's contract (2013-14) were unchanged.

link

 

[ATXtexanfan]

When pay a #1 like a #1 then you can't afford a #2. Gotta hit in the draft.

 

[Texn4life]

I like Patton where we're drafting as well. Reading some things on him recently it seems like he has a nice edge to him. I like guys that play with a chip on their shoulder and it seems like he plays with that mentality. He'd be a nice change of pace attitude wise to what we currently have. Good guy, but full of self confidence.

I'd bring in another 2nd tier vet at receiver and let he, Walter, and Jean battle it out. Martin and Posey aren't going anywhere so you can figure them into the equation. A group of AJ, Patton, Martin, Jean/Walter/FA (Posey when he's healthy) looks better than what we threw out at the end of the year. Martin should be better with a full year under his belt, and I believe Patton is polished enough as a route runner to contribute right away. The key would be getting him acclimated to the offense and the staff will make that judgment during the process.

 

[Texan_Bill]

When pay a #1 like a #1 then you can't afford a #2. Gotta hit in the draft.

Just throwing this out there but how do we know, Keyshawn Martin, Lestar Jean and the like, aren't that guy yet?

I'm not saying, by any stretch that those guys are the answer but I would rather focus the draft in other areas. Primarily the Texans defensive interior.

 

[AcresHomesTexan]

My prediction of what will happen with the number 2 WR

Kevin Walter will be outright cut- Actual cap savings
the Texans will sign a mid or lower level Wr as a veteran WR2- 9(Ramess Barden, Brandon gibson since they are at least young)
Draft another rookie Wr in rounds 2-4.

My only hope for diferent is that fact that the owner has already said on several occassions that WR2 is a priority.

 

[CretorFrigg]

My prediction of what will happen with the number 2 WR

Kevin Walter will be outright cut- Actual cap savings
the Texans will sign a mid or lower level Wr as a veteran WR2- 9(Ramess Barden, Brandon gibson since they are at least young)
Draft another rookie Wr in rounds 2-4.

I just can't see how that will help the Texans' WR situation. I've never even heard of Ramses Barden or Brandon Gibson. As you said, these guys are mid to lower level WRs. We know what we're going to get from them. They're probably not going to be able to step in as the #2 WR.

And relying on another WR rookie? That's just a gamble. We need a proven, solid #2 WR who can step in immediately and contribute to the team.

 

[Texn4life]

My prediction of what will happen with the number 2 WR

Kevin Walter will be outright cut- Actual cap savings
the Texans will sign a mid or lower level Wr as a veteran WR2- 9(Ramess Barden, Brandon gibson since they are at least young)
Draft another rookie Wr in rounds 2-4.

My only hope for diferent is that fact that the owner has already said on several occassions that WR2 is a priority.

I really like the Barden option. The kid for some reason just hasn't been given much of a chance in New York, but his size is something that can't can't be coached or taught and whenever I see him out on the field it seems like he produces. Had a very nice game against Carolina this year.

EDIT: probably shouldn't say he has produced especially in the regular season, but he has looked good in preseason and in his limited play in the regular season. I believe he's been nicked up some but he has a lot of upside.

 

[CloakNNNdagger]

My prediction of what will happen with the number 2 WR

Kevin Walter will be outright cut- Actual cap savings
the Texans will sign a mid or lower level Wr as a veteran WR2- 9(Ramess Barden, Brandon gibson since they are at least young)
Draft another rookie Wr in rounds 2-4.

My only hope for diferent is that fact that the owner has already said on several occassions that WR2 is a priority.

It's pretty discouraging to look back at our WR Draft history, especially during our present regimen. Andre was the #3 overall pick, and Jabar Gaffney was a 2nd rounder..........10 and 11 years ago. After that, Posey has been our top drafted receiver at #68 overall. Jacoby went #73 overall in 2007. After 12 years, you might think that the Texans could have successfully played the role of the blind squirrel and at least found one or two "nuts" that weren't their own.

 

[dream_team]

Until we get a legitimate QB the WR position doesn't matter and threads like this are useless ...

Until we get logical fans, message boards like this are useless ...

 

[leebigeztx]

Why are people so afraid of a rookie wr? I mean torrey smith has been making big plays since he's come into the league. He may only catch 50 balls or so, but they eat up a lot of real estate. There will be a wr in the first staring them in the face they should take. They can help themselves by also upgrading the te position since schaub like to throw to that guy a lot. Daniels kills the offense as much as not having a #2 cuz he can't get verticle against lbs any,ore.

 

[Norg]

i dont feel like WR is not the issuse here we got young WR CORE

Martin Posey and Jean maybe these guys get better year 2 maybe they dont

i dont see how bringing in a New rookie WR from the draft is going to help

IF u want to make a huge impact we are going to need a F/a WR superstar

I say we go Tight End instead thats more our system Tight ends

 

[AcresHomesTexan]

I just can't see how that will help the Texans' WR situation. I've never even heard of Ramses Barden or Brandon Gibson. As you said, these guys are mid to lower level WRs. We know what we're going to get from them. They're probably not going to be able to step in as the #2 WR.

And relying on another WR rookie? That's just a gamble. We need a proven, solid #2 WR who can step in immediately and contribute to the team.

Just for reference Barden is a Huge WR who has been stuck behind guys in New york. Not much overall production, but has had moments.

Gibson- caught 53 balls last year with Rams.

Both around 26, but i don't want get bogged down in names just expect to be "disappointed" with the veteran WR brought in this off-season.

--------

My post was not what I thought was optimal, but what i am expecting to happen.

 

[AcresHomesTexan]

It's pretty discouraging to look back at our WR Draft history, especially during our present regimen. Andre was the #3 overall pick, and Jabar Gaffney was a 2nd rounder..........10 and 11 years ago. After that, Posey has been our top drafted receiver at #68 overall. Jacoby went #73 overall in 2007. After 12 years, you might think that the Texans could have successfully played the role of the blind squirrel and at least found one or two "nuts" that weren't their own.

Honestly, the Texans have not thrown enough bodies at the posistion. Wrs can be found throughout the draft, but you probably should be drafting one every year at some point. We have overdrafted CBs during smith's time here and really only have Brice McCain and Kareeen jackson to really show for it.

 

[BullBlitz]

Honestly, the Texans have not thrown enough bodies at the posistion. Wrs can be found throughout the draft, but you probably should be drafting one every year at some point. We have overdrafted CBs during smith's time here and really only have Brice McCain and Kareeen jackson to really show for it.

Don't we have to give him credit for stumbling into Glover Quinn?

 

[AcresHomesTexan]

Don't we have to give him credit for stumbling into Glover Quinn?

yes we do and I just forgot about him since he is no longer a CB. Also, i think Rick smith has done a good, not great job overall simply because we have managed to go from awful to a legitimate playoff team. Probably happened too slow and he has plenty of ways to improve though.

 

[tru80texan]

I really like the Barden option. The kid for some reason just hasn't been given much of a chance in New York, but his size is something that can't can't be coached or taught and whenever I see him out on the field it seems like he produces. Had a very nice game against Carolina this year.

EDIT: probably shouldn't say he has produced especially in the regular season, but he has looked good in preseason and in his limited play in the regular season. I believe he's been nicked up some but he has a lot of upside.

I like Barden as well. The kid is big & fast & has shown some flashes in very limited action. He shouldn't be expensive & could be a high reward investment IMO. Outside of him the others that possibly fall into the same area as him are Gibson, Jerome Simpson, Devery Henderson, Cribbs,& Danario Alexander. The latter I believe is a restricted FA. Barden seems to have the most potential of that group IMO.

The draft has some potential, but I believe last years yielded more. I think the boat was missed on that one & once again Kubiak & the FO are a day late & a dollar short on properly addressing a need. Hopefully some wr's separate themselves from the pack at the combine, but then we have to hope of those that do that one of them will actually fall to the Texans in the draft. Wishful thinking to obtain someone who can step in on day 1 & produce, but we can hope.

The WR position is in need of an upgrade & I believe that only truly happens if Walter is completely out of the way. Kubiak refuses to give others a true opportunity w/ Walter being around as his security blanket. The WR group would be thin if Walter is let go, but I think it was worse off last season & they not only chose to release Jacoby, but cut Walter's pay as well. That says a lot & I expect the same to happen this offseason as Walter simply is not a #2 wr worth the money he is projected to make. It's time to cut ties w/ him.

Sign a FA w/ potential, such as Barden, that won't break the bank & draft a wr that has actually produced something worth noting in Division 1, not Lane College, as well as has played during his whole career at college as opposed to the players who have missed whole seasons for 1 reason or another. All the above would be a great start that actually might prove to some that kubiak & his FO are finally serious about addressing the wr appropriately. Which is not something that has been done in the past despite their multiple failed attempts IMO.

 

[thunderkyss]

It's pretty discouraging to look back at our WR Draft history, especially during our present regimen. Andre was the #3 overall pick, and Jabar Gaffney was a 2nd rounder..........10 and 11 years ago. After that, Posey has been our top drafted receiver at #68 overall. Jacoby went #73 overall in 2007. After 12 years, you might think that the Texans could have successfully played the role of the blind squirrel and at least found one or two "nuts" that weren't their own.

If you look at those facts in a vacuum, yeah, it's pretty sad.

However, when you factor in the dismal state our defense was in compared to the offensive production we were getting during that time, then it's understandable.

We haven't been looking as hard for a WR as we've been looking for a pass rusher, a cover corner, or competent inside pressure.

It's still sad, but understandable.

 

[Corrosion]

My prediction of what will happen with the number 2 WR

Kevin Walter will be outright cut- Actual cap savings
the Texans will sign a mid or lower level Wr as a veteran WR2- 9(Ramess Barden, Brandon gibson since they are at least young)
Draft another rookie Wr in rounds 2-4.

My only hope for diferent is that fact that the owner has already said on several occassions that WR2 is a priority.

I dont know that Walter will be cut .... His cap hit is ~$4.5m but the actual savings against the cap is just under $2m.

The question is are you going to get a better player for that $2m , if not he's not going anywhere.


Got a list of players you feel are an upgrade for $2m or less ??

 

[thunderkyss]

Also, i think Rick smith has done a good, not great job overall simply because we have managed to go from awful to a legitimate playoff team. Probably happened too slow and he has plenty of ways to improve though.

It took a great coach like Bill Parcels 4 years to turn a lost cause around. We've got the blind leading the blind in Smith & Kubiak & they did it in 6.

That's about right for the talent we've got. Talent in the F.O. that is.

 

[Corrosion]

It's pretty discouraging to look back at our WR Draft history, especially during our present regimen. Andre was the #3 overall pick, and Jabar Gaffney was a 2nd rounder..........10 and 11 years ago. After that, Posey has been our top drafted receiver at #68 overall. Jacoby went #73 overall in 2007. After 12 years, you might think that the Texans could have successfully played the role of the blind squirrel and at least found one or two "nuts" that weren't their own.

To be fair Jacoby Jones looked pretty darn good for the Ravens .... but two things were different , he wasnt asked to understand a complex route tree there , just run fast and try to catch the ball ..... and he had a big armed QB who could throw him open allowing him to use his speed.


Posey improved all season and was pushing Walter down the depth chart ... that injury really sucks because I was expecting him to contribute significantly next season. This sets the team back and they have to address the position either in FA or a premium draft pick.

 

[dream_team]

Logic dictates that since Matt cant get the ball to the players we have, having better players would not improve the team. Matt's issue isn't dropped balls, it's his inaccuracy, weak arm, and bad decisions.

Schaub ranked 8th in completions, 6th in completion percentage, 10th in yards per attempt. AJ ranked 4th in receptions. Logic says our QB gets the ball to the receivers just fine.

 

[Malloy]

How, stat-wise is schaub looking when it comes to spreading the ball around? I have a feeling that despite the respectable general qb-stats, the possible one-dimentioness is more the issue than arm strength or reciever quality. Ofcourse i could be all wrong

 

[deucetx]

Schaub ranked 8th in completions, 6th in completion percentage, 10th in yards per attempt. AJ ranked 4th in receptions. Logic says our QB gets the ball to the receivers just fine.

Pretty sure they mean down the field. Schaub threw it only 55 times 20+ times. For comparison sake that is lower than all the playoff quarterbacks except for Ponder, RG3 and Kaeperncik (though Kap threw it 49 times in a heck of a lot less starts so easily would have been more)

How, stat-wise is schaub looking when it comes to spreading the ball around? I have a feeling that despite the respectable general qb-stats, the possible one-dimentioness is more the issue than arm strength or reciever quality. Ofcourse i could be all wrong

Regular Season target%

Andre Johnson: 29.6%
Owen Daniels: 18.6
Kevin Walter: 12.6
Arian Foster: 10.5
James Casey: 8.1
Garrett Graham: 6.9
Keshawn Martin: 4.9
Devier Posey: 2.5
Lestar Jean: 2.2

 

[AcresHomesTexan]

I dont know that Walter will be cut .... His cap hit is ~$4.5m but the actual savings against the cap is just under $2m.

The question is are you going to get a better player for that $2m , if not he's not going anywhere.


Got a list of players you feel are an upgrade for $2m or less ??

Click on the any free agent WR list. Pretty much any WR in league can catch 40 balls for 500 yards if the majority of snap at WR2

 

[badboy]

Why are people so afraid of a rookie wr? I mean torrey smith has been making big plays since he's come into the league. He may only catch 50 balls or so, but they eat up a lot of real estate. There will be a wr in the first staring them in the face they should take. They can help themselves by also upgrading the te position since schaub like to throw to that guy a lot. Daniels kills the offense as much as not having a #2 cuz he can't get verticle against lbs any,ore.

My thoughts are it is a hard position to learn especially ours. Count how many rookies receivers are selected in say top three rounds. How many actually have Torrey SMith stats? It is risky.

 

[HOU-TEX]

Just throwing this out there but how do we know, Keyshawn Martin, Lestar Jean and the like, aren't that guy yet?

I'm not saying, by any stretch that those guys are the answer but I would rather focus the draft in other areas. Primarily the Texans defensive interior.

Agreed! Of course, I'll always lean towards defense

A lot depends on our UFAs. OLB if Barwin leaves? DB if Quin and/or McCain leave? NT if Cody leaves? ILB for sure

What else do we need on offense other than WR and an olineman or two? So yeah, my draft would be defense heavy....again

 

[badboy]

I dont know that Walter will be cut .... His cap hit is ~$4.5m but the actual savings against the cap is just under $2m.

The question is are you going to get a better player for that $2m , if not he's not going anywhere.


Got a list of players you feel are an upgrade for $2m or less ??

I don't think he got a signing (upfront) bonus that was prorated. He gets an annual $1m but seems either roster or performance based. IMO based on known info there is no bonus to move up if cut. There should be a true $4.5m cap savings. Also, that amount can be added to other sums to go get a very good WR. Eliminate A Smith $6m & Walter's $4.5m = FA starter money. Does not include the $2.4m that we found out will be brought forward or any other contract re-works. If McNair wants to spend we should be able to greatly improve this roster.

 

[b0ng]

I believe there are a lot of quality WR's that will be available at the bottom of round 1 and round 2. I do hope the Texans take one very high as this appears to be a very WR heavy draft. I don't really see an AJ Green or Julio Jones type (a player who could become the best in the league) but there is a lot of good talent.

This is, of course, just one man's humble opinion.

 

[TexanSam]

Are there any tight ends in this draft who have amazing potential? I don't think our 2nd best receiving option necessarily has to be a wide receiver. We definitely need one since AJ only has a few years left in his prime, but in the short term if a TE is a better option in the draft than a WR then maybe the Texans would go that route? OD, Casey, and Graham are all okay but all are replaceable if someone better is available I think.

 

[sandman]

Doesn't pass the eye test.

Anyone who watches the games cant say that with a straight face.

I will let others have their stats ... I prefer to watch the games.

The only game that matters is the game that ends the season. I would say a defense that gave up 41 points is more indicative of the Texans not moving on than Schaub's performance.

That's like saying the Texans lost because Casey dropped a TD in the first 30 seconds of the game. Oh wait...

 

[steelbtexan]

I don't think he got a signing (upfront) bonus that was prorated. He gets an annual $1m but seems either roster or performance based. IMO based on known info there is no bonus to move up if cut. There should be a true $4.5m cap savings. Also, that amount can be added to other sums to go get a very good WR. Eliminate A Smith $6m & Walter's $4.5m = FA starter money. Does not include the $2.4m that we found out will be brought forward or any other contract re-works. If McNair wants to spend we should be able to greatly improve this roster.[/QUOTE

Yep

I would cut Walter and A.Smith, Draft Datone Jones and sign an up and coming WR like Rames-Barden. Then draft the best WR available in the 2nd rd. This would give the Texans a chance to have their best WR corps ever and possibly turn a weakness into a strength.

I would use the rest of the $$$$ saved on cutting A.Smith to bring in a vet NT like Casey Hampton. I know he's 35 but he was a very productive 2 down run stopper.

BoB probably wont be willing to do this.

 

[dream_team]

Doesn't pass the eye test.

Anyone who watches the games cant say that with a straight face.

I will let others have their stats ... I prefer to watch the games.

I have watched every second, of every game, Schaub has played with the Texans. He gets the ball to the receivers just fine. Yes, I can say that with a straight face.

Does his performance degrade when he doesn't have good protection and has to make a play with his feet? No doubt... but doesn't change the fact he gets the ball to his receivers just fine.

I don't want to turn this into another Schaub thread... so all I'll say is I hope we get another playmaker at receiver (whether he's a WR or TE). Out of all the young guys we have, I thought Posey had the most potential to be that guy, but looks like we can't depend on him anymore. The more weapons we can give Schaub, the less his deficiencies become a problem.

 

[b0ng]

Doesn't pass the eye test.

Anyone who watches the games cant say that with a straight face.

I will let others have their stats ... I prefer to watch the games.

"I will never change my mind about this no matter how many facts or stats are presented to me because changing my mind is hard."

 

[steelbtexan]

Are there any tight ends in this draft who have amazing potential? I don't think our 2nd best receiving option necessarily has to be a wide receiver. We definitely need one since AJ only has a few years left in his prime, but in the short term if a TE is a better option in the draft than a WR then maybe the Texans would go that route? OD, Casey, and Graham are all okay but all are replaceable if someone better is available I think.

Gavin Escobar is a name to keep in mind. 6'5 really good speed/hands, good route runner, not a good run blocker.

 

[sandman]

The game that probably ended our season was the Viking game at home which we lost that could have given us home field throughout. If we would have been here playing the Patriots it could have been a different outcome.

The Green Bay game probably ended our season because we could have gone into the New England game undefeated and walked away with a bigger cushion even if we lost.

The New England game probably ended our season because it gave us only a one game lead in the conference with New England holding the tie breaker against us.

The Indianapolis game probably ended our season because we owned the tie breaker against the Broncos and could have had a first round bye.

So basically, every loss we had in the regular season probably ended our season...

 

[Brisco_County]

One thing is certain, the prospective WR#2 won't ever be Posey. I love his upside and work ethic, but the fact that he wore patella braces throughout college was a sign that his Achilles injury was probably destined.

So where do we draft a receiver? Well, we also need a nose tackle, since Cody will either be cut or won't be in shape by preseason. Since the loss of Posey has only been an opportunity cost, the receiving talent has not regressed. But losing Cody will pose regression, so I think NT will be #1, and WR #2.

 

[Wolf6151]

One thing is certain, the prospective WR#2 won't ever be Posey. I love his upside and work ethic, but the fact that he wore patella braces throughout college was a sign that his Achilles injury was probably destined.

So where do we draft a receiver? Well, we also need a nose tackle, since Cody will either be cut or won't be in shape by preseason. Since the loss of Posey has only been an opportunity cost, the receiving talent has not regressed. But losing Cody will pose regression, so I think NT will be #1, and WR #2.

I agree, although WR is a huge need, NT is a bigger need. Cody will be gone in FA and Mitchell can't handle the position by himself. Also having a better NT lessens the need at ILB as well. WR would then be our 2nd round pick and with all the extra comp. picks we should have coming to us, trading up in the 2nd to get a really good WR would be very possible and plausible. Of course all of this is dependent on who is available to us at #27. A slight trade down from #27 to the top of the 2nd round might be an option to consider as well depending on who's available.

 

[leebigeztx]

When I spoke to Pat Kirwan on sirius,he said texans had 9m in cap room. 9m of cap room and a very good deep wr draft is plenty to fill holes and get better. The texans can fill the nt spot with terrance knighton or sammy lee hill for cody money. That would allow them to attack the draft and fill holes. I would draft Williams from Baylor or Hunter from Tenn at bottom 1st. If they wait, they can get patton in 2nd or King in 3rd. They could also gamble and get rodgers in the 3rd. He might be the most physically gifted wr in the draft,but he busted a weed test and was kicked off the squad.

 

[Lucky]

I don't think he got a signing (upfront) bonus that was prorated. He gets an annual $1m but seems either roster or performance based. IMO based on known info there is no bonus to move up if cut. There should be a true $4.5m cap savings.

From where is that info coming from? Walter had $11 million in guaranteed money. That was in a $5 million bonus and the first 2 seasons salaries ($6 million total). The salaries have been received, but that bonus didn't hit the cap in one year. There would be $2 million in dead money if Walter is released. If Walter is cut, it's a savings of $1.5 million.

If Walter again agrees to a salary reduction to $2 million,his cap number shrinks to $3 million. Thus, there would only be a $1 million difference in keeping Walter. If that's the case, the Texans would likely keep him. Here's what Kubiak had to say about Walter when he signed the contract:

“You can’t have enough Kevin Walters on your team,” Kubiak said. “He stands for everything we are. He’s a great kid, a hard worker, a player who does everything right on and off the field.

Even if the Texans sign a FA WR and draft another WR early, Walter likely stays. They won't keep a Lestar Jean over Walter for a cap savings of $500K. And it's very unlikely that Posey makes it on the field in 2013. Even as a 4th WR, I think Kubiak will keep Walter.

 

[tru80texan]

From where is that info coming from? Walter had $11 million in guaranteed money. That was in a $5 million bonus and the first 2 seasons salaries ($6 million total). The salaries have been received, but that bonus didn't hit the cap in one year. There would be $2 million in dead money if Walter is released. If Walter is cut, it's a savings of $1.5 million.

If Walter again agrees to a salary reduction to $2 million,his cap number shrinks to $3 million. Thus, there would only be a $1 million difference in keeping Walter. If that's the case, the Texans would likely keep him. Here's what Kubiak had to say about Walter when he signed the contract:

Even if the Texans sign a FA WR and draft another WR early, Walter likely stays. They won't keep a Lestar Jean over Walter for a cap savings of $500K. And it's very unlikely that Posey makes it on the field in 2013. Even as a 4th WR, I think Kubiak will keep Walter.

While I understand that there isn't a huge savings if Walter is cut, in the end its a savings that is needed. That 1.5M could help fill holes when you consider that Cody was roughly playing for that amount. So starting players can be had for that savings. I don't see the Texans paying a #3 or #4 wr 2M for the yr. That is dumb business & a waste to be honest. I believe they are simply taking too much heat now for not properly addressing the need & now the owner is even on the bandwagon to get a true #2 wr. Which I must admit I'm elated to see. When the owner speaks I'm sure the employees, kubiak & the FO, will take note & listen.

I also don't see the Texans giving up on Jean who has shown signs of potential to keep a player who is obviously past his prime & costing this team more money then he's worth. You simply don't dump cheap potential to keep a player who is in decline & overpaid imo. I know you don't think the savings is much, but its pretty obvious w/ the salary cap every penny counts & Walter is eating up valuable cap space.

As far as what kubiak had to say about Walter, was anything less expected? The running joke is that kubiak has a "man crush" on Walter which is why he refuses to replace him & honestly how many times has anyone seen a coach speak negatively about a player they just resigned? It simply won't happen & I'm sure if we dig deep enough we could find kubiak speaking highly of Jacoby after extending him & then he eventually cut him. Talking the player up & then eventually cutting them is hardly a new concept.

 

[Lucky]

While I understand that there isn't a huge savings if Walter is cut, in the end its a savings that is needed. That 1.5M could help fill holes when you consider that Cody was roughly playing for that amount. So starting players can be had for that savings.

Cody's cap number in 2012 was $3 million not $1.5. And you misconstrued pretty much every other number I posted. Lestar Jean and his potential have accumulated 6 receptions in 2 years. There's not a doubt in my mind that Kubiak would keep Walter over Jean if the number is close.

 

[b0ng]

I agree, although WR is a huge need, NT is a bigger need. Cody will be gone in FA and Mitchell can't handle the position by himself. Also having a better NT lessens the need at ILB as well. WR would then be our 2nd round pick and with all the extra comp. picks we should have coming to us, trading up in the 2nd to get a really good WR would be very possible and plausible. Of course all of this is dependent on who is available to us at #27. A slight trade down from #27 to the top of the 2nd round might be an option to consider as well depending on who's available.

If the Texans used an NT in their nickle and dime sets I could see NT being a bigger need, but we don't, and I can't imagine that they think it's 1st round need unless there's a guy there they thought wouldn't be available.