Tampa Bay Buccaneers @ Houston Texans. Noon. 9/27. FOX. **Artificial Gameday Thread**

[TexansSeminole]

Excuses dude. It's still only his 4th start, I don't care how old he is, or how many years he has been in the league. You are the only one expecting too much. Fans and analysts a like all call him basically a rookie.

Yeah, yeah, I know. You are a super fan just keeping it real for all of us suckers. Whatever. If I were you, I would keep the suicide hotline on speed dial because the misery you appear to be wallowing will eventually take it's toll.

As far as massive failure in the history of franchise goes. Take a look at the record of the Patriots, Steelers, Colts, Cowboys and other dynasties in their first 15 years. I think you might be surprised. I take that back. You should be surprised, but I imagine you will just say "yeah but" and then go on an Anti-Texans rant.

You're right, nothing in the NFL has changed since 1933 (Steelers), 1960 (Cowboys, Patriots) or 1963 (Colts). It's the same thing as entering the league in 2002.

Oh wait, they've changed the rules for new franchises since then. On top of that, there are less than 12 players still playing in the league that were drafted prior to the Texans inaugural year. We have as fair a shot as any team. We've been through 3 head coaches, 2 general managers and plenty of quarterbacks. We've also had more than our fair share of #1 overall picks. There's no deck stacked against this team, sorry to break it to you.

In regards to Mallett, I guess you're saying that there is no value in a quarterback sitting behind a competent starter and learning? Check that, a hall of famer. You may want to let some NFL front office people in on the secret that you and these "analysts" have, they may find it useful. There's also no maturity difference between a 21 year old and a 27 year old, right again. Further, why don't you point me to one credible opinion that refers to Mallett as a rookie. I'll wait...

You're the guy who hates everyone who posts here frequently, consistently claiming that this forum is some kind of club that thinks too highly of itself, and were the top Schaub apologist. Excuse me while I laugh.

 

[infantrycak]

In regards to Mallett, I guess you're saying that there is no value in a quarterback sitting behind a competent starter and learning? Check that, a hall of gamer. You may want to let some NFL front office people in on the secret that you and these "analysts" have, they may find it useful.

Maybe you're the one who needs to consult GMs and HCs since they almost universally start rookie QBs of note as rookies much less let them season for years on the bench. The only real example of such seasoning is Rogers and that was a fluke from the beginning and even from there not by design.

I am sure it is of some value. But one of diminishing returns and not of anything close to game play.

Further, why don't you point me to one credible opinion that refers to Mallett as a rookie. I'll wait...

Not a rookie. Just a QB starting his 4th game.

 

[TexansSeminole]

Maybe you're the one who needs to consult GMs and HCs since they almost universally start rookie QBs of note as rookies much less let them season for years on the bench. The only real example of such seasoning is Rogers and that was a fluke from the beginning and even from there not by design.

[Quote)Further, why don't you point me to one credible opinion that refers to Mallett as a rookie. I'll wait...

Not a rookie. Just a QB starting his 4th game.

What does that have to do with whether or not sitting on the bench for a year or 4 yields a more prepared and mature QB than a guy coming straight out of college? Do you disagree with that philosophy? That's what is being discussed. I'm not arguing for sitting guys over starting guys, to do so would be nonsensical when speaking about 1st rounders, and off topic. I'm simply saying that sitting and learning in NFL meeting rooms is better (yields better results in the first year at least) than coming in out of college straight up.

His words were "rookie," which is more in line with a direct comparison to Winston as they are now, which is what he was going for. Still, anybody with eyes saw that Winston was the more capable player. Mallett had time against a porous defense and was playing behind a defense with good players and an offensive line that is much better than the Bucs' offensive line. Our offensive line is no good, but Tampa's offensive line is pure trash. The "analysts" all agree. So is Tampa's defense. They are one, if not the worst team, outside of QB, in the league. There's a reason they had a shot at Winston, even with decent QB play last year in Mike Glennon. They suck, period.

Our defense is actually all that we really have going for us. Winston's team has the worst offensive line in the NFL, one of the worst defenses, and a coach in over his head, yet he still almost beat us. Even with some poor, poor plays/throws. This will be one of his worst games this year, I guarantee it.

I can't see how the Texans barely winning this game is positive in any sense other than in the win column, which is obviously nice, but not representative of the potential of this team.

 

[fiasco west]

The playing calling on offense...what's their to say about it besides it stinks? We need to remove screen passes from our arsenal. The next time we successfully complete a screen will be the first time we've completed one. Talk about looking like dog ****. Oh and if we need 2 yards for a first and the run game was as strong as it was today, let's do that and not the same pass play.

Seriously though...why does it feel like every other NFL team can run a screen play besides ours? It's been this way for years, even under Kubiak.

It's now at a point where if they just complete the screen play I think "That's a good play!" simply because it's not a pick 6 or a fumble because the QB threw it backwards.

 

[TexansSeminole]

Seriously though...why does it feel like every other NFL team can run a screen play besides ours? It's been this way for years, even under Kubiak.

It's now at a point where if they just complete the screen play I think "That's a good play!" simply because it's not a pick 6 or a fumble because the QB threw it backwards.

Because we don't throw the ball down field with anything close to consistent success. It's not difficult to game plan against this team. I'm of the opinion that this isn't a coaching issue, but a QB issue. I still don't blame the coaching staff or GM for the lack of talent at QB, there weren't many options. I do however blame the GM, and at least put partial blame on the coach for our lack of talent at other positions. We also don't seem to work well as a unit in anything but defense. It's hard to put it all on BOB, but if he doesn't get it corrected quickly, he'll be the one who pays.

 

[infantrycak]

What does that have to do with whether or not sitting on the bench for a year or 4 yields a more prepared and mature QB than a guy coming straight out of college? Do you disagree with that philosophy? That's what is being discussed.

And I stated very plainly there is some value in a limited time on the bench. The remainder was in direct response to your quip about GMs and contrary to your assertion, GMs and HCs do not see significant value in more than minimal bench time as readily shown by their actions.

 

[infantrycak]

Because we don't throw the ball down field with anything close to consistent success. It's not difficult to game plan against this team. I'm of the opinion that this isn't a coaching issue, but a QB issue.

It's a straight up coaching issue. Our screens are horribly designed. Look at teams that do it well, there's actually a screen in front of the receiver. We toss it out there with zero or one guy to block. And then there's shitty execution as well like the screen today where the lead WR blocked his man to the right and the carrier instead of cutting to his left behind him cut to his right directly into the tackle.

And you don't have to run a consistent down field game to run screens. KC is one of the least down field throwing teams around and one of the best at screens.

 

[TexansSeminole]

And I stated very plainly there is some value in a limited time on the bench. The remainder was in direct response to your quip about GMs and contrary to your assertion, GMs and HCs do not see significant value in more than minimal bench time as readily shown by their actions.

You stated such in an edit after I had quoted you, which is fine, but I obviously didn't see it.

 

[TexansSeminole]

It's a straight up coaching issue. Our screens are horribly designed. Look at teams that do it well, there's actually a screen in front of the receiver. We toss it out there with zero or one guy to block. And then there's shitty execution as well like the screen today where the lead WR blocked his man to the right and the carrier instead of cutting to his left behind him cut to his right directly into the tackle.

And you don't have to run a consistent down field game to run screens. KC is one of the least down field throwing teams around and one of the best at screens.

Andy Reid has always been about screens. He's always been the best at utilizing it, regardless of talent. KC and any Andy Reid team is a outlier, and I think you know that, that's why you used them in your example.

This is one article that would give some insight into how important it is to Andy Reid, you'll find many more with a quick Google search

Screen passes have long been a staple of the West Coast offense, and you’ll be hard-pressed to find a more creative coach than Reid. He’s got the full complement of screen passes in his toolbox — tunnel screens, bubble screens, slow screens, swing screens — and in the past, he hasn’t been afraid to use all of them.

I'm not defending OB, I just see a lack of talent at quarterback that makes everything more difficult.

 

[thunderkyss]

Sorry for the late replies, but I cannot take the negativity on this board during the games, so I just tune it out so I can enjoy the game win, or lose. I have to say it was hilarious to read the entire thread after the fact 10 hours later. You guys are bi-polar.

I'm with you. I'd much rather watch Randy Bullock miss a meaningless field goal & extra point than join in that pathetic excuse for "support" in the game day thread.

 

[thunderkyss]

If some people cannot see that the team is trash, sorry 'bout it. If some people cannot see that this team has no future at QB, sorry 'bout it. If some people cannot see that football success (championships) 99.99999999999% of the time is dependent on great QB play, sorry 'bout it.

I don't follow any of my teams simply hoping that we win a few. .500 or sub .500 ball is not my cup of tea. It takes massive failure for 90% of the teams to enact or even have the ability to enact the proper change to lead a team to championships. That's the NFL. Most of the time, it doesn't even work, but it's necessary. You may know this as a Texan fan, because the history of the franchise is littered with massive failure.

If you follow the team simply hoping for a win every once in awhile, sorry 'bout it, we're different.

I see where NitroFish is coming from. I think he looks at the game day thread the way I do. I can't go to the game (or decided not to, or whatever) but I want to sit with like minded folks & root for my team through the magic of the internets... but that doesn't happen in the game day thread. It's almost as if everyone wants to be the first one to "identify" a problem, or be the loudest, or whatever. We focus on the negatives.

Where during the game, I want to be focused on the positives. I'm not "hoping" to win, I'm rooting to win. & when we win, all that energy pays off. When I'm at the game, regardless how bad it's going, I'm trying to stay positive so I can scream my head off on defense, & muster the proper energy to scream first down on offense. Let those guys on the field know, we're behind them.

Big difference on the internet, I know.

But even at home, when I'm watching the game I hate having someone in my ear telling me how bad the team is. We can talk about all that crap when they're not on the field. I'm trying to root for my team to come back from three scores in less than six minutes. I don't need someone reminding me Randy missed three of his last 5 FG attempts.

Years ago (two years ago I think) I used to try to keep the morale up in the game day threads. It took a while, but I realized it's not going to happen. Some guys aren't going to be happy unless they're complaining about something. That's fine. But I realized, the game day thread is not for me. Not during the game anyway.

You guys are fans. I get that. You love the Texans, I get that. But I also understand how some of you can find "better" things to do. Turn the TV off & go play on the lake or whatever. Find something more productive like cut your grass.

Not me. The game is exciting. I like it when the last drive is going to decide the outcome of the game. Win or lose, that's some exciting stuff. I'd rather we win them all. But that last minute loss doesn't negate the three hours I spent bonding with my family & friends (I rarely watch a game alone).

& it was actually Mallett's 5th start. The Mallett guys like to not count the Cincinnati game.

 

[thunderkyss]

4th game in how many years? A 27 year old in his 5th year and a 21 year old in his 1st year. Yeah, that's the same.

Far as I'm concerned, yeah it's more the same than not.

I expect Mallett to progress faster, because of the time he's been in the NFL, working with OB, Godsey, McDaniels, Brady, & Belichick. But for all intents & purposes, Ryan Mallett is only two games ahead of Winston.

I hope Mallett is further ahead by week 8, & way ahead by week 17.

 

[sandman]

& it was actually Mallett's 5th start. The Mallett guys like to not count the Cincinnati game.

Cleveland, Cincinnati, Carolina, Tampa Bay. What start are we missing?

 

[steelbtexan]

Excuses dude. It's still only his 4th start, I don't care how old he is, or how many years he has been in the league. You are the only one expecting too much. Fans and analysts a like all call him basically a rookie.

Yeah, yeah, I know. You are a super fan just keeping it real for all of us suckers. Whatever. If I were you, I would keep the suicide hotline on speed dial because the misery you appear to be wallowing will eventually take it's toll.

As far as massive failure in the history of franchise goes. Take a look at the record of the Patriots, Steelers, Colts, Cowboys and other dynasties in their first 15 years. I think you might be surprised. I take that back. You should be surprised, but I imagine you will just say "yeah but" and then go on an Anti-Texans rant.

Different times

Yep, because those franchises started out as losers it's OK for the Texans org to be losers.

One huge difference, those franchises fans didn't turn their orgs into a top 5 richest NFL franchise and a top 10 richest franchise in the world. Despite all of the storied franchises that you listed's histories. In short, some on this MB have said that Texans fans dont deserve anything, but I disagree with that. McNair/Smith/BOB need to put a much better product on the field. Or maybe they dont if they're already achieving the goals that they set out to accomplish.

 

[thunderkyss]

Cleveland, Cincinnati, Carolina, Tampa Bay. What start are we missing?

 

[beerlover]

This years version of Texans is just as unwatchable as the last season, maybe even more so given some elevated expectations (my own) after hard knocks. Ugly football at its best. Matching intensity of 2nd year head coach O' Brian. Know exactly what SB is saying. This is Texas for goodness sake & Texans can't find a franchise QB? Or any semblance of exiting playmakers offensively? My favorite play yesterday was the one deep throw from Mallet to Nate Washington, where he couldn't locate the ball as it dropped right in front of him. That is the story of our Texans in a nut shell, right or wrong

 

[Honoring Earl 34]

I see where NitroFish is coming from. I think he looks at the game day thread the way I do. I can't go to the game (or decided not to, or whatever) but I want to sit with like minded folks & root for my team through the magic of the internets... but that doesn't happen in the game day thread. It's almost as if everyone wants to be the first one to "identify" a problem, or be the loudest, or whatever. We focus on the negatives.

Where during the game, I want to be focused on the positives. I'm not "hoping" to win, I'm rooting to win. & when we win, all that energy pays off. When I'm at the game, regardless how bad it's going, I'm trying to stay positive so I can scream my head off on defense, & muster the proper energy to scream first down on offense. Let those guys on the field know, we're behind them.

Big difference on the internet, I know.

But even at home, when I'm watching the game I hate having someone in my ear telling me how bad the team is. We can talk about all that crap when they're not on the field. I'm trying to root for my team to come back from three scores in less than six minutes. I don't need someone reminding me Randy missed three of his last 5 FG attempts.

Years ago (two years ago I think) I used to try to keep the morale up in the game day threads. It took a while, but I realized it's not going to happen. Some guys aren't going to be happy unless they're complaining about something. That's fine. But I realized, the game day thread is not for me. Not during the game anyway.

You guys are fans. I get that. You love the Texans, I get that. But I also understand how some of you can find "better" things to do. Turn the TV off & go play on the lake or whatever. Find something more productive like cut your grass.

Not me. The game is exciting. I like it when the last drive is going to decide the outcome of the game. Win or lose, that's some exciting stuff. I'd rather we win them all. But that last minute loss doesn't negate the three hours I spent bonding with my family & friends (I rarely watch a game alone).

& it was actually Mallett's 5th start. The Mallett guys like to not count the Cincinnati game.

Yup ... it's like Mimi is your wife and your buddies are trying to tell you all the things that are bad about her . You know full well but are trying to work through it .

 

[infantrycak]

One huge difference, those franchises fans didn't turn their orgs into a top 5 richest NFL franchise and a top 10 richest franchise in the world.

Which means exactly squat because of the salary cap.

 

[thunderkyss]

Yup ... it's like Mimi is your wife and your buddies are trying to tell you all the things that are bad about her . You know full well but are trying to work through it .

FiFY

She can't cook. Doesn't like kids. Calls every 15 minutes... but the things she does right, she does right.

 

[steelbtexan]

Which means exactly squat because of the salary cap.

I didn't know that they had a salary cap on the scouting dept/asst coaches/top level med staff etc....

They should be paying top $$$$ to get the best people available. Obviously that hasn't happened.

 

[Hervoyel]

Far as I'm concerned, yeah it's more the same than not.

I expect Mallett to progress faster, because of the time he's been in the NFL, working with OB, Godsey, McDaniels, Brady, & Belichick. But for all intents & purposes, Ryan Mallett is only two games ahead of Winston.

I hope Mallett is further ahead by week 8, & way ahead by week 17.

I think of Mallett as a super-well-prepared rookie. He is about to make his 4th start (playing in his 5th game, did we get that sorted) but he's had this experience spread over 2 years with an injury/rehab in between. He's had years to prepare mentally. He should have a better command of this system than any rookie QB who ever lived (because he's really not a rookie) but it's more of a game-speed/chemistry/decision making thing. He needs to see defenses and not preseason or practice defenses but real live NFL defenses trying to stop him. In that respect he's like a rookie about to make his 5th start. I expect him to improve much quicker than a real rookie would. He's got too many advantages to make excuses for bad play. If he can't ramp it up and look at least as good as the other newcomers and part timers this year then he's not going to get a pass from me.

To be honest though if he'd started the KC game I really think we might be 3-0 right now or at least 2-1.

 

[infantrycak]

Herv is spot on above about Mallett.

I didn't know that they had a salary cap on the scouting dept/asst coaches etc....

They should be paying top $$$$ to get the best people available. Obviously that hasn't happened.

We only know OB. Everyone ahead of him except for Kelly and Fisher have rings.

You're just making up your plot again.

 

[steelbtexan]

Herv is spot on above about Mallett.



We only know OB. Everyone ahead of him except for Kelly and Fisher have rings.

You're just making up your plot again.

The scouting dept all have rings?

 

[infantrycak]

The scouting dept all have rings?

Which part of 'we only know OB's salary' do you not understand?

 

[thunderkyss]

I think of Mallett as a super-well-prepared rookie. He is about to make his 4th start (playing in his 5th game, did we get that sorted) but he's had this experience spread over 2 years with an injury/rehab in between. He's had years to prepare mentally. He should have a better command of this system than any rookie QB who ever lived (because he's really not a rookie) but it's more of a game-speed/chemistry/decision making thing. He needs to see defenses and not preseason or practice defenses but real live NFL defenses trying to stop him. In that respect he's like a rookie about to make his 5th start. I expect him to improve much quicker than a real rookie would. He's got too many advantages to make excuses for bad play. If he can't ramp it up and look at least as good as the other newcomers and part timers this year then he's not going to get a pass from me.

To be honest though if he'd started the KC game I really think we might be 3-0 right now or at least 2-1.

That's basically what I said. I expect him to progress faster than Winston, but for all intents & purposes, it was just his 4th start (I think).

 

[The Pencil Neck]

I only like to read the game day threads AFTER the game is over. I'm with TK in that when I'm watching the team, I'm wanting them to win. I'm rooting for them. I don't care how they win, as long as they win. I'd prefer a 50 point victory, but I'll take a 1 pointer that we back into if that's what it takes.

I was expecting more from this team than I've seen so far, and I'm expecting more from them in the future.

I don't like negativity in my life, and I usually cut negative people out of my life if I can. So I don't like the doom and gloom that people get into in the gameday thread. I don't like all the doom and gloom period, but I like seeing different sides and perspectives on the team, and I like to get news about what's going on that I wouldn't otherwise get. And that's why I usually read as much as I can gameday or otherwise here about the Texans.

 

[steelbtexan]

Which part of 'we only know OB's salary' do you not understand?

I understand perfectly,

Tell me more about the guys with rings and since the Texans have the best of everything I should be expecting a long playoff run.

 

[DBCooper]

I only like to read the game day threads AFTER the game is over. I'm with TK in that when I'm watching the team, I'm wanting them to win. I'm rooting for them. I don't care how they win, as long as they win. I'd prefer a 50 point victory, but I'll take a 1 pointer that we back into if that's what it takes.

I was expecting more from this team than I've seen so far, and I'm expecting more from them in the future.

I don't like negativity in my life, and I usually cut negative people out of my life if I can. So I don't like the doom and gloom that people get into in the gameday thread. I don't like all the doom and gloom period, but I like seeing different sides and perspectives on the team, and I like to get news about what's going on that I wouldn't otherwise get. And that's why I usually read as much as I can gameday or otherwise here about the Texans.

No doubt.

It all comes down to who you'd rather watch a game with.

Someone who is fun and cheering and has a clue on what this team is or some Asswipe where all they say is how much the team sucks.

 

[infantrycak]

No doubt.

It all comes down to who you'd rather watch a game with.

Someone who is fun and cheering and has a clue on what this team is or some Asswipe where all they say is how much the team sucks.

I have zero problem watching a game with a back and forth of 'damn Jones whiffed the blitzer' 'Mallett missed a wipe open TE' 'f'k bet OB goes conservative here' etc. It's 'f'k Jones whiffed on the Blitzer, OB should be **** canned for trotting his fat ass out there, Smith should be burned in real life not effigy, this team is an embarrassment to Houston. ..' Dude, it's the 2nd play of the game, chill out.

 

[xtruroyaltyx]

I'd probably not be as negative on gameday if I thought this team was going to play better in the future, or if they hadn't looked so underwhelming thus far.

A few days after the game I always look back and see the positives to grow from and how if a couple things had changed we wouldn't have looked as bad.

But I haven't seen good football this year. I felt the same way about this team that I felt about the '13 Texans. Nowhere as good as they look on paper.

After the first game I've been watching the game kind of in the background of whatever else I'm doing. I still want them to win, and I still turn them on every gameday...but I'm just not feeling this year's squad. In the end I'd love to be wrong. I'd love to see this team get into the play offs. That'd be huge.

As far as not coming into gameday threads....it's never bothered me...here or at clutch fans....there's always going to be people over the top on the Internet. I can't even keep up with all the posts in gameday threads.

Now irl....that's another story. I cannot listen to someone complain the whole game. I'll leave and watch somewhere by myself.

 

[thunderkyss]

I'd probably not be as negative on gameday if I thought this team was going to play better in the future, or if they hadn't looked so underwhelming thus far.

Nothing wrong with that.

As far as the difference between this year's team & the 2013 team... there was no reason for the 2013 team to look like it did. That was our Pro Bowl offense & our top 5 defense stinking it up to start the season.

This year, we've got a "new" QB, a new OL every week (damn near every Qtr) & half the defense didn't play in the preseason. I think we can expect the team to get better over the course of the season. I expected them to get better in 2013 as well, but there was no excuse for what was happening. The focus of the organization wasn't on football, where this year, I feel it is.

 

[Bulls on Parade]

Ben Jones and his calm and confident demeanor before the game.