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State of the O-line

dream_team said:
That commitment to the OL has them at 23rd in the NFL at yards per play, worse than the Texans. Investing heavily in one aspect of your team means you’re ignoring other problems.
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He did this with the Jaguars to. They had one successful season with that method.

The Cowboys had one successful season with that same method.

It just amazes me on how some can be so Optimistic when it come to other teams. But are so pessimistic when it comes to their own.

We have practically a brand new oline and all dude can say was, " they're a bunch of backups ".
Yes they started off rough. But so did the Colts oline. But for them, they will be a playoffs team next year.

Gotta love Houston fans
 
dream_team said:
That commitment to the OL has them at 23rd in the NFL at yards per play, worse than the Texans. Investing heavily in one aspect of your team means you’re ignoring other problems.
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Rebuilding one unit at a time is what Ballard is doing. This year it was actually two units, ol,pass rush Next year will be working on the secondary in a deep class and probably lb's.

I'm really looking forward to watching the Texans rebuild vs the Colts rebuild. This kind of stuff interests me. Game and Ballard are the new breed of GM's.

Did you know Ballard is from Texas City?
 
Texansballer74 said:
He did this with the Jaguars to. They had one successful season with that method.

The Cowboys had one successful season with that same method.

It just amazes me on how some can be so Optimistic when it come to other teams. But are so pessimistic when it comes to their own.

We have practically a brand new oline and all dude can say was, " they're a bunch of backups ".
Yes they started off rough. But so did the Colts oline. But for them, they will be a playoffs team next year.

Gotta love Houston fans
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The Colts offense hasn't struggled at all thos year.

The Jags are on their third LT this is to be excited. Plus Bortles still sucks.
 
dream_team said:
True statements. Texans can go into the same mindset next draft if they want. But IMO, I want them to focus on building a better team, and not just focus on building a better OL. That's all I'm saying.
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If you build a better ol you will be building a better team. Is keeping the defense off the field and Watson not having to play with a punctured lung important to you?

BTW, although I think the ol is far below avg. Particularly the OT's although Kelemete isn't very good either. I do agree with you and think Devlin needs to go.
 
dream_team said:
Ok. I guess I don’t exactly get the point of his post? If you spend a lot of 1st & 2nd rounders on a position group, yes, they should be good. That’s not quite rocket science. Any team can do that.

The Texans chose to build a better team, instead of just trying to build the best OL in the league.
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Building an OL helps keep your franchise QB healthy and helps your defense by keeping them off of the field. It's really a simple philosophy. A good OL can even make RB's like Miller/Mack ect... look good.
 
steelbtexan said:
If you build a better ol you will be building a better team. Is keeping the defense off the field and Watson not having to play with a punctured lung important to you?

BTW, although I think the ol is far below avg. Particularly the OT's although Kelemete isn't very good either. I do agree with you and think Devlin needs to go.
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I was listening to the NFL channel on Sirius and they were giving OB and Devlin high praise for the last two weeks. I'm in hide and watch mode to see how things turn out with the OL.
 
JB said:
As he said, it's just year one... down the road it will payoff handsomely
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People are shortsighted and generally only look at the small picture.

Big picture is if this team doesn't do a better job of protecting Watson they're screwing themselves. It's like some here dont remember what happened to Carr.
 
DocBar said:
I was listening to the NFL channel on Sirius and they were giving OB and Devlin high praise for the last two weeks. I'm in hide and watch mode to see how things turn out with the OL.
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I'm worried about Miller/Chubb this weekend.

Hopefully Miller isn't 100% and the Texans can run the ball.

Watson coming off of a punctured lung playing at Mile High cant be a good thing.
 
steelbtexan said:
Nothing in year one

But if Luck stays healthy I'm willing to bet that it will payoff in the long run.
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Yeah... if Luck stays healthy they're in the playoffs. But that's Luck.

A couple of years ago you were slurping on the Cowboys & how they had the gnads to select La'ell Collins who Rick never would have touched.

Has the Cowboys accomplished anything that Rick Smith's team hasn't?
 
thunderkyss said:
Yeah... if Luck stays healthy they're in the playoffs. But that's Luck.

A couple of years ago you were slurping on the Cowboys & how they had the gnads to select La'ell Collins who Rick never would have touched.

Has the Cowboys accomplished anything that Rick Smith's team hasn't?
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I would like to see Collins playing RT for the Texans today.

The Cowboys struggles have more to do with Jerrah's love affair with Garrett and I dont expect much to change anytime soon.
 
JB said:
Just saying that the Colts picked this year to address the OL for years to come, knowing that Luck wouldn't be 100%. However if he survives they can address other areas next year. After all they beat the Redskins, took the Eagles, Texans, and Patriots to close games. Perhaps they aren't all that far off
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I understand the logic. My issue is with his, this is the way the only way attitude & if we had done this blah, blah, blah.

Rick selected Sua Folo & Martin while getting speed & skill on the offensive side of the ball. & a QB.

So far XSF & Martin hadn't worked out. But that's a different story.

& I use the Cowboys as an example to show it's going to take more than a commitment. That was a damn good OL when the built it. Hadn't got anything out of it.
 
thunderkyss said:
I think Davenport & Lamm played well today. Millers only sack was against Rankin. Chubb's only sack was against Kelemente. Davenport did well against Chubb, Lamm did well against Miller.

Didn't shut them down, but played respectably.
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Agree but I thought Chubb's sack came against Griffin? Kind of ole'd him right to Watson
 
FuzzyLogic said:
Agree but I thought Chubb's sack came against Griffin? Kind of ole'd him right to Watson
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One of the sacks on Griffin was a flaw in the design. He was supposed to chip the edge rusher (he did) and then release into the flat as someone from inside, I think the TE Thomas, comes in to play cleanup. The interior guy arrived way too late. We ran it another time or two that worked as intended.

Poorly designed play. Fine when it works, but is too many moving parts.
 
I was hoping we would get some dry cleaning from another team for Griffin at the trade deadline. I like the rookies a lot better
 
thunderkyss said:
I think Davenport & Lamm played well today. Millers only sack was against Rankin. Chubb's only sack was against Kelemente. Davenport did well against Chubb, Lamm did well against Miller.

Didn't shut them down, but played respectably.
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Yeah, I agree. I think Davenport might have had 2 holding penalties but other than that I think he played clean. I think the play when Lamm went out with an injury was when Miller got his sack. Don't know if it was Griffen or the RT (and I don't know who filled in for Lamm) that got charged for the sack. Overall, I think they did well in a tough stadium against a good defense. Glad they got out of there with a win!
 
Insideop said:
Yeah, I agree. I think Davenport might have had 2 holding penalties but other than that I think he played clean. I think the play when Lamm went out with an injury was when Miller got his sack. Don't know if it was Griffen or the RT (and I don't know who filled in for Lamm) that got charged for the sack. Overall, I think they did well in a tough stadium against a good defense. Glad they got out of there with a win!
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Rankins filled in for Lamm and gave up the sack
 
@Jason_OTC: Teams investing the least per year on the offensive line

1. Bills- $12.5M
2. Texans- $21.5M
3. Dolphins- $22M
4. Ravens- $22.6M
5. Cardinals- $26.1M
6. Broncos- $26.9M
7. Bengals- $27.3M
8. Patriots- $27,6M
 
TheKDog said:
@Jason_OTC: Teams investing the least per year on the offensive line

1. Bills- $12.5M
2. Texans- $21.5M
3. Dolphins- $22M
4. Ravens- $22.6M
5. Cardinals- $26.1M
6. Broncos- $26.9M
7. Bengals- $27.3M
8. Patriots- $27,6M
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well if the progress continues that will be brilliant planning (!?) as LT is basically a rookie 4th rounder in second year. Center Martin is a 2nd round pick backed up by Mancz a UDFA that can start at OG with Lamm another UDFA starting at RT. It is quite possible Kelemete could be cut off season with Rankin or Mancz getting a look. This roster of OL with a draft pick in 2019 that could replace Fulton in 2020 (saving $7 million cap) would be amazing & young & cheap. We would then be in a position to select lower round quality and develop (I know but it still thing to do) with right coach. We may be going in correct direction at least with this part of team which would be great with #4.
 
badboy said:
well if the progress continues that will be brilliant planning (!?) as LT is basically a rookie 4th rounder in second year. Center Martin is a 2nd round pick backed up by Mancz a UDFA that can start at OG with Lamm another UDFA starting at RT. It is quite possible Kelemete could be cut off season with Rankin or Mancz getting a look. This roster of OL with a draft pick in 2019 that could replace Fulton in 2020 (saving $7 million cap) would be amazing & young & cheap. We would then be in a position to select lower round quality and develop (I know but it still thing to do) with right coach. We may be going in correct direction at least with this part of team which would be great with #4.
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O'Brien and Devlin could go with the young guys since they've looked ok leading up to this game. O'Brien has the Bye-Week to create some continuity with a shift in OL personnel. They couldn't be any worse than what O'Brien and Devlin deemed as their starting unit against Denver. My OL coming out of the Bye-Week:

LT- Davenport
LG- Rankin
OC- Martin
RG- Mancz
RT- Lamm

Martin was actually looking better in Weeks 7-8 b/c Mancz just flat out played RG better than anyone else on the team had and he made both Martin and Lamm better in the process. Not to mention, for the first time in a really long time, the Texans were running to the right side with some authority and success. Kelemete and Fulton would be the backups.....positions they know very well.

If Davenport and Lamm continue to improve over the next 7+ weeks, I could easily change my focus in regards to the 2019 NFL Draft. The Texans are more than likely looking at the 24+ range for their first pick, so I'd probably look at OLB or CB with the first pick and then look at Dalton Risner (OC / OG) with the first pick of RD2. I'd look at OT's in RD2 and RD5. Getting Risner would make Kelemete expendable.
 
Line looked very good yesterday in terms of pass pro, not so good against the run. Like 3 of those sacks Watson had more than enough time to make something happen. If they can keep it up, the offense should be able to get going more if Watson picks it up.


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I dunno but we won't see another defense with the caliber of cadre of pass-rushers of the Broncos the rest of the year will we ?
 
I would like to know if Rankin can play guard, tackle is no bueno, not quick enough. Mancz seems to solidify running game so needs to be on the field. Kelemente is VERY nicked up, so agree the bye week you make some big decisions. I am not sure Rankin outplays either of our guards when healthy yet
 
OptimisticTexan said:
O'Brien and Devlin could go with the young guys since they've looked ok leading up to this game. O'Brien has the Bye-Week to create some continuity with a shift in OL personnel. They couldn't be any worse than what O'Brien and Devlin deemed as their starting unit against Denver. My OL coming out of the Bye-Week:

LT- Davenport
LG- Rankin
OC- Martin
RG- Mancz
RT- Lamm

Martin was actually looking better in Weeks 7-8 b/c Mancz just flat out played RG better than anyone else on the team had and he made both Martin and Lamm better in the process. Not to mention, for the first time in a really long time, the Texans were running to the right side with some authority and success. Kelemete and Fulton would be the backups.....positions they know very well.

If Davenport and Lamm continue to improve over the next 7+ weeks, I could easily change my focus in regards to the 2019 NFL Draft. The Texans are more than likely looking at the 24+ range for their first pick, so I'd probably look at OLB or CB with the first pick and then look at Dalton Risner (OC / OG) with the first pick of RD2. I'd look at OT's in RD2 and RD5. Getting Risner would make Kelemete expendable.
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After seeing Davenport get worked by Chubb yesterday OT should still be at the top of the shopping list.
 
Rich Schmidt said:
I would like to know if Rankin can play guard, tackle is no bueno, not quick enough. Mancz seems to solidify running game so needs to be on the field. Kelemente is VERY nicked up, so agree the bye week you make some big decisions. I am not sure Rankin outplays either of our guards when healthy yet
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You know what's worth mentioning? When you solidify the running game, you solidify the passing game as well. Watson started having some amazing games when the running game was on point.
 
steelbtexan said:
After seeing Davenport get worked by Chubb yesterday OT should still be at the top of the shopping list.
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I like this as well, depending who's available from that position. If the target might be available early in RD2, I'd trade back in an instance for an early RD2 and RD3, then only hope that I could land a solid LT to go along with OC/OG- Dalton Risner. Nothing like having Risner learn behind Martin for a season, then the Texans could decide what to do with Martin in 2020. Two picks that could set the Texans OL for the foreseeable future.

As for the LT prospects who could fall into the early part of RD2: I like Andre Dillard, Washington State and 4 year starting LT, Mitch Hyatt, Clemson. I might lean on Hyatt, since he had 3 years protecting Watson's blind side and probably knows his habits as good as anyone coming into the Draft. On a side note, if LT, Trey Adams, Washington decided to enter the draft and teams are scared of his injuries and he drops in the draft, any of you interested in grabbing him later and letting him rehab under team supervision for a season?
 
OptimisticTexan said:
I like this as well, depending who's available from that position. If the target might be available early in RD2, I'd trade back in an instance for an early RD2 and RD3, then only hope that I could land a solid LT to go along with OC/OG- Dalton Risner. Nothing like having Risner learn behind Martin for a season, then the Texans could decide what to do with Martin in 2020. Two picks that could set the Texans OL for the foreseeable future.

As for the LT prospects who could fall into the early part of RD2: I like Andre Dillard, Washington State and 4 year starting LT, Mitch Hyatt, Clemson. I might lean on Hyatt, since he had 3 years protecting Watson's blind side and probably knows his habits as good as anyone coming into the Draft. On a side note, if LT, Trey Adams, Washington decided to enter the draft and teams are scared of his injuries and he drops in the draft, any of you interested in grabbing him later and letting him rehab under team supervision for a season?
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On trey, ACL is not as scary as the back they dont detail. I am sure Doc could give us a lot of reasons this is career threatening. He was a top 15-20 pick for some before the injuries. If later is a third or later, I guess we could try. Louis Nix was thought to be talent with a bum knee, epic fail. They would need to do their medical diligence and see what kind of person he is to take the gamble. I dont get too targeted this time of year, a lot still happens with injuries and such, and we see SOME development in our OL personnel so let's give them an honest assessment as well, but we should always bolster the OL
 
TheKDog said:
@Jason_OTC: Teams investing the least per year on the offensive line

1. Bills- $12.5M
2. Texans- $21.5M
3. Dolphins- $22M
4. Ravens- $22.6M
5. Cardinals- $26.1M
6. Broncos- $26.9M
7. Bengals- $27.3M
8. Patriots- $27,6M
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I guess it's better to be in this group and have a winning record then to be in the group with the Giants and "Cowplops" that have spent big money on their O-lines but have a losing record! :D
 
I'm not alone in thinking we seem a bit predictable on our 1st down strategy, but I wanted to get some metrics. Turns out we're well balanced stat-wise, falling 13th in pass/run propensity. I think the obviousness is more subtly situational.
 
markn said:
I'm not alone in thinking we seem a bit predictable on our 1st down strategy, but I wanted to get some metrics. Turns out we're well balanced stat-wise, falling 13th in pass/run propensity. I think the obviousness is more subtly situational.
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This last game was in an 11 MPH wind with gusts up to 25. At least for this game, understandably, neither team showed much passing propensity during that period. Trying to run on 1st down under those conditions should not have surprised anyone. It wasn't until well into the 2nd half the the wind began to let up intermittently.
 
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CloakNNNdagger said:
This last game was in an 11 MPH wind with gusts up to 25. At least for this game, understandably, neither team showed much passing propensity during that period. Trying to run on 1st down under those conditions should not have surprised anyone. It wasn't until well into the 2nd half the the wind began to let up intermittently.
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Wind gusts in the last 10 seconds were deceiving as hell
 
OptimisticTexan said:
O'Brien and Devlin could go with the young guys since they've looked ok leading up to this game. O'Brien has the Bye-Week to create some continuity with a shift in OL personnel. They couldn't be any worse than what O'Brien and Devlin deemed as their starting unit against Denver. My OL coming out of the Bye-Week:

LT- Davenport
LG- Rankin
OC- Martin
RG- Mancz
RT- Lamm

Martin was actually looking better in Weeks 7-8 b/c Mancz just flat out played RG better than anyone else on the team had and he made both Martin and Lamm better in the process. Not to mention, for the first time in a really long time, the Texans were running to the right side with some authority and success. Kelemete and Fulton would be the backups.....positions they know very well.

If Davenport and Lamm continue to improve over the next 7+ weeks, I could easily change my focus in regards to the 2019 NFL Draft. The Texans are more than likely looking at the 24+ range for their first pick, so I'd probably look at OLB or CB with the first pick and then look at Dalton Risner (OC / OG) with the first pick of RD2. I'd look at OT's in RD2 and RD5. Getting Risner would make Kelemete expendable.
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Wouldn't be opposed to that but my emphasis is on corners at 2a and rounds 4 & 5. I will be posting another mock soon under my thread in College football.
 
badboy said:
Wouldn't be opposed to that but my emphasis is on corners at 2a and rounds 4 & 5. I will be posting another mock soon under my thread in College football.
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If your mock doesn't have a LT to replace Davenport in rds 1 or2 or both then your mock cant be taken seriously. Love you Steve but Davenport stunk up the joint against Chubb last week. It's become a weekly occurrence and he needs to be replaced. Lamm is actually showing signs of improvement but will always be avg at best. Which makes him look like an all pro when compared to Davenport.
 
steelbtexan said:
After seeing Davenport get worked by Chubb yesterday OT should still be at the top of the shopping list.
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Yeah because he only gave up one sack in game and played against one of the best DE opponents in NFL. He is the only LT to struggle against Chubb this season. You so funny!
 
steelbtexan said:
If your mock doesn't have a LT to replace Davenport in rds 1 or2 or both then your mock cant be taken seriously. Love you Steve but Davenport stunk up the joint against Chubb last week. It's become a weekly occurrence and he needs to be replaced. Lamm is actually showing signs of improvement but will always be avg at best. Which makes him look like an all pro when compared to Davenport.
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You expected D or any of our OTs to look good against Chubb? I want and expect D to hold his own which he basically did against one of best in NFL. He does get better every game but you must figure in his opponent as we should with all players. I am mocking an OT but he will replace Lamm not D.
 
steelbtexan said:
If your mock doesn't have a LT to replace Davenport in rds 1 or2 or both then your mock cant be taken seriously. Love you Steve but Davenport stunk up the joint against Chubb last week. It's become a weekly occurrence and he needs to be replaced. Lamm is actually showing signs of improvement but will always be avg at best. Which makes him look like an all pro when compared to Davenport.
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D is in his second year... how many years of suckitude did Lamm get?
 
badboy said:
You expected D or any of our OTs to look good against Chubb? I want and expect D to hold his own which he basically did against one of best in NFL. He does get better every game but you must figure in his opponent as we should with all players. I am mocking an OT but he will replace Lamm not D.
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Chubb is a rookie and has had an avg yr up until this week. If you were talking Davenport against Miller I would agree with you. Miller was Lamm's primary responsibility and I thought he held up surprisingly well. Lamm has surprised me with his in season improvement.

But keep on with the D love it makes for interesting conversation. Although I've tried to see what you see and just dont get your love for D. I guess the love comes from him being one of the guys you loved comng out of college but expecting more than avg at best from him is unrealistic. He just doesn't have the feet for LT or power for RT.
 
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