I thought Mancz played the whole season at Center when Martin was out his Rookie season with a broken ankle. Mancz's injury history couldn't be any worse than Martin's, is it?
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State of the O-line
- Thread starter jradMIT
- Start date
I thought Mancz played the whole season at Center when Martin was out his Rookie season with a broken ankle. Mancz's injury history couldn't be any worse than Martin's, is it?
He was in and out of the lineup.
Mancz has a history of shoulder injuries/Martin has knee/ankle history. CND would be much better than me to comment on these things.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
Mancz started all 16 games at C in 2016.
2016
A yr and a half ago.
Nothing could've changed in that amount of time.
Like I said CND could inform all of us on Mancz.
A yr and a half ago.
Nothing could've changed in that amount of time.
Like I said CND could inform all of us on Mancz.
He has, more than once
Hmmm .... Dissention among the troops ?
Have we seen anyone of note challenge Jackson on the outside? I think he's been playing great facing the QB & in run support on the edge.
But I'd be worried about him covering a WR with a half decent QB, which Washington has.
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
The only bit of Colvin we’ve seen was when the defense as a whole was playing terrible. 2nd, he wasn’t playing nearly as bad as your asserting.
I’m more inclined to believe he will look much better...much like the rest of the defense has sense they’ve started tackling better.
badboy
Hall of Fame
where did I say KJ was bad outside although he hasn't looked great there last couple years and why Johnson was drafted. I just want to see Colvin with snaps outside especially if KJ needs to go back to safety if Hal has issues.
badboy
Hall of Fame
I agree Colvin should look better as defense is playing now; very glad he is available again. Perhaps his presence will encourage better play by Sharice Wright.
Calvin Johnson?
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
Well, Denver had good Wr and Keenum is just about as good as Smith. But hey, you can advocate for change for the sake of change if you want to. But as of right now KJax is as good as it gets.
I didn't say that, I just wanted to know your rationale for the move.
badboy
Hall of Fame
Just read it incorrectly when you asked what wrong with KJ? I'm very impressed with not only Kareem but Joseph and Lamm on offense all playing way better than I expected. Do you think KJ gets extension? I do although I was vociferous that he should be cut and if on roster not re-signed for 2019.
dream_team
Hall of Fame
What’s up with the KJax debate in the OLine thread?
Don't change the subject.
austins23
Hall of Fame
HAHA!
Yes, because if he drops off at CB he can still be a fine S.
He's been better
Texansphan
Football connoisseur
Guess we might get to see Kyle Fuller and/or Roderick Johnson and/or Chad Slade promoted from the practice squad.
So what's the word on Fulton & Kelemente
Rich Schmidt
Myopicone
some comments in injury thread
With Kelemete and Fulton already gimpy, O'Brien should have brought up and activated Fuller this week. Could have been a disaster with a D-lineman playing o-line.
Saw this on chron.com: https://www.chron.com/sports/texans...Fulton-downplays-shoulder-injury-13403546.php
One thing I did like to hear was that Martin played OG and actually did OK. Even got to pull a few times.
I didn't get to watch the game today (Cowboys childhood friend came over.) How did the OL look in general and Davenport in particular?
Yeah, I didn't get to see the game either. Was at work. Saw a few clips of the highlights and they looked like they were run blocking very well. Both Miller and Blue had some very good runs today. Pass blocking I don't think was good but most of the highlights I saw it looked like Watson got in trouble trying to move in the pocket or escape the pocket. One clip I saw it looked like the right side completely collapsed and it pushed Watson right into the player Davenport was blocking (can't remember if if was Kerrigan or not) and he ended up getting the sack. Not sure I can blame this completely on Davenport since his back was to Watson and what was happening behind him. Maybe if he had been able to push him out wider, but I don't know. He still needs to work on his strength but I did see one running highlight were he threw his man to the ground and buried him! That was nice to see!
Scooter
Funky
I think injuries are being blamed more than they should. The line, and offense as a whole looked about the same to me as it has all season (bad, and Davenport had a rough day). Mancz comes in and the run game improves. Our backs are able to break off some pretty good runs balanced by being gang tackled 3 yards behind the line. Watson has time to throw often enough, but nowhere to throw the ball before the rush arrives. Our longest pass was a 5yd out to Coutee - who took it 40+ (I want to throw a rock at O'Brien "TAKE THE HINT DUMBASS!"). Our tightends are asked to do too much stupid cross formation pass blocking, and don't just chip into their pattern, they go for a big block before releasing (taking too much time and removing a much needed receiving option).
The line is crap before and after injuries, but they wouldn't look so much like crap if they weren't asked to do so much. We've proven over and over that Watson can locate his safety valve and move the chains. Can't do that if the safety valve is 12yds into the teeth of cover 2 or late getting off of his heavy block. I have no fear of Watson developing Carr syndrome, give him the dink and dunk offense and let HIM decide when to get more aggressive.
The line is crap before and after injuries, but they wouldn't look so much like crap if they weren't asked to do so much. We've proven over and over that Watson can locate his safety valve and move the chains. Can't do that if the safety valve is 12yds into the teeth of cover 2 or late getting off of his heavy block. I have no fear of Watson developing Carr syndrome, give him the dink and dunk offense and let HIM decide when to get more aggressive.
Watched the third series just now. On the first pass, Davenport & Kelemente hold their blocks. Looks like some miscommunication between Lamm & Thomas. Thomas runs an edge rusher out wide like you'd think he should. Lamm blocks down, leaving a free rusher between Lamm & Thomas with a straight shot on Watson. They wrap around & fall on the back of Kelemente's legs.
On the next snap Davenport struggles to stay in front of an edge rusher. Pressure from the right forces Watson to his left. He runs into Davenport as he's throwing the ball. The ball floats, is tipped & intercepted.
Texansballer74
The Marine
Overall the offensive line was horrendous. Kel and Fulton went down again. The play calling should've been either dink and donk or hurry up. But our guru of a coach drawing up these long developing plays didn't help any either.
So enough of this "the O-line sucks" crap.
That's obvious to even the untrained eye...
Tell me who, specifically, both in free agency and the draft, should the Texans be targeting to upgrade the O-line?
do they replace all five or will one or two additions shore things up sufficiently...?
That's obvious to even the untrained eye...
Tell me who, specifically, both in free agency and the draft, should the Texans be targeting to upgrade the O-line?
do they replace all five or will one or two additions shore things up sufficiently...?
This is my biggest beef with BOB. Has been for a while now. Run the short passing game and take a few shots every now and then. For gods sake use the TE's/RB's to chip and give Davenport some help.
BTW, like I said, I haven't watched the game yet so I'm going by Scooter's observations.
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Scooter
Funky
I can't answer this question as it's for our draft experts, but it leads to my worry.
I know we want to and need to throw resources at the problem, but IMO if we aren't able to stabilize the roots - these new players will rot like everyone else has. Our line coaching is bad, I'm not sure I've seen anyone who would disagree with this. Our scheme is bad, if anyone can actually claim we have a scheme. We're wildly inexperienced and proven failures on the offensive side of the coaching staff. The only one seemingly pulling his weight is Welker. My worry is that we laud the instant success of acquiring much needed talent on the line, throw a party, resume ignoring the position, then watch the unit injure and coach itsself into obscurity - as Dallas is trying very hard to do. We need first an offensive direction from HC/OC, experience at line coach who can identify and TEACH (when did that stop being a thing?) the position, and I think Steelb will back me on this - keep acquiring talent unto infinity instead of 'fix it and forget it'.
I believe I may be getting drumk, that seems to have rambled.
1. Obsi, the 2 guys I really want them to get are Yodny Cajuste LT West Va. who's projected as a late 1st/ early 2nd rd pick and Andre Dillard LT Washington St. who's projected to be an early 2nd rd pick. Dillard will be able to play LT in the NFL but is ideally suited for RT in the NFL. Re-sign Lamm and draft these 2 guys and the OL will be much improved and have quality depth. The OG's are fine and there's quality dept there in Mancz/Rankin which will be tested now that Kelemete/Fulton are hurt.
Lie Scooter said though, the results that Devlin has achieved has been underwhelming at best and I really question if he's the guy to lead the Ol where the org needs it to be to achieve the goal of bringing a Lombardi to Kirby.
Another OL I really like is Dalton Risner, he's a 10 yr starter at RT and probably an all pro OG. But he's going to go in the top 20 and the Texans need a LT so bad I would probably pass on Risner for Cajuste.
TexansFan15
All Pro
Here are the guys I’m keeping my eye on:
RT- D. Risner, D. Edwards. K. McGary
LT- Y. Cajuste, A. Dillard, M. Scharping, G. Little (not as consistent as I’d like but still keeping an eye on him)
OG- C. Lindstrom, G. Bradbury
C- T. Biadasz (RS Soph so he might not declare), E. Jenkins
Which one of these guys do you like.
TexansFan15
All Pro
I like all 3 of the RTs, Cajuste, Lindstrom, and Biadasz. Scharping has a lot of potential, but his level of competition is lower.
I don’t think Biadasz will declare, but if he does he’ll go late 1st/early 2nd. Whenever he moves on to the NFL, he’ll be a pro bowl center.
Carr Bombed
Hall of Fame
For some reason this post popped in my head
What do you think about the state of the Jaguars now SB?
Texansballer74
The Marine
He thought Bortles would be like E. Manning and the defense was on that level of his Giants teams that won the SB. Lol they went in got Norwell and some key defensive players. So he was 100% sure they made all the right moves.
But guess what the game still has to be played on the gridiron.
Talk about some classic arguments
OptimisticTexan
2024 / Rebuilding Block 4 After Playoffs / Texans
I sort of got what I asked for but didn't like the manner in which arrived. I would still like to see the Texans play this OL set-up a game or two.....but scheeez, how about a few practices before making it happen.
LT- Davenport
LG- Rankin
OC- Marti
RG- Mancz
RT- Lamm
This unit got the running game going but really got thrashed in pass blocking. Rankin had no practice time at LG before he was sent in to cover the position. It took Mancz and Lamm a few series to get back to being familiar with one another. If O'Brien will let this unit handle all the 1st team reps in practice.....it could make a difference this week.
O'Brien, for the love of god, get Griffin off the field. This guy is no better at blocking than the 2 Jordan's....and their ducking rookies. Griffin isn't even in their class as a receiver.....and their ducking rookies. I do not understand his need to start Griffin.....is he standing on the sideline with his eyes closed?
As for the answers in the draft, I want a top LT but the Texans aren't at the top of the draft to get the top projected guys. I still think LT, Hyatt (Clemson) is the right pick for this position. He's a 4 year starter at LT and he protected Watson's blind-side for 2 seasons....also during the season they won the National Championship. He's spent 4 years facing top talent so I don't think the move to the NFL will be as big as an adjustment as it could for other LT. I think Hyatt is an upgrade over Davenport com enext season even though Davenport is entering his 3rd NFL season.
I feel the same way about OC-OG-OT, Risner (Kansas State) b/c he's a senior and 3 year starter who's absolutely handled the positions they've asked him to cover. If Martin doesn't improve, Risner could play Center, where many analyst have him pegged to play in the NFL. He could definitely slide out RG or maybe even on a stretch play RT. I think Risner could be a solid upgrade over Martin at Center b/c in all honesty, I think Martin's stock got bumped during the draft b/c of who his brother Zach is in Dallas.
Both Hyatt and Risner are smart athletes who could adjust to the NFL quicker than expected b/c they'll pick up the playbook much faster than some of the other OL available.
I'd be OK with the following OL in 2019:
LT- Hyatt.....Davenport or Rankin
LG- Kelemete.....Rankin or Martin
OC- Risner.....Martin or Mancz or Fulton
RG- Mancz......Fulton or Martin or Risner
RT- Lamm......Henderson or Risner
That's a fairly versatile group of 8 OL.
For some reason this post popped in my head
What do you think about the state of the Jaguars now SB?
I can't wait to hear this.
Texansphan
Football connoisseur
Texansphan
Football connoisseur
One of the two TE's they drafted was ex oline I believe - big dude, but I don't know if he was suited up yesterday.
michaelm
vox nihili
That's probably Jordan Thomas.
He was suited up yesterday as well as the other rook TE Jordan Akins
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
running a hurry up offense with an o-line in taters & a WR whom has only been in the system for 2 weeks.....yeah, no. Running no-huddle requires great communication...& to run it efficiently usually requires a vet qb. Even then most offenses don't run it too much b/c its too hard to sustain that level of efficiency. So when you factor in all of the above with a 2nd yr qb....plus the overall inability of the o-line to protect period.......... & the noise you face in a hostile enviornment, it would've been a recipe for disaster.
The other thing is there's a check down/outlet/dink & dunk route built into 90% of pass plays for every offense in the league. All that's required is for the qb to take it once his primary reads are done. DW4 is inconsistent in doing this but he was trying late in the game as the rush started to hit him consistently. I seem to remember him being pissed with Miller when he tried to check it down to him in the red zone yesterday but Miller hadn't turned around out of his route yet & DW4 wound up throwing it into his back as the rush was bearing down.
Give the defense credit, they did what they've been doing to qb's all year to him.
For some reason this post popped in my head
What do you think about the state of the Jaguars now SB?
They're an injured team.
On their 3rd string LT, lost their C, Fournette has been out all yr.
Campbell/Bouye etc... hurt on defense.
Still should've beaten the Steelers.
As our resident ** is trying to say I thought Bortles = Eli just proves he's the ** with an agenda. (Not you)
Hey TB ** Texian was the guy who loved Bortles not me. I've posted this in several threads but YOU keep saing this BS. You're WRONG.
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No..neither was consider a blocker...Thomas is big, but played giant WR and Akin is on the small to barely average size for a in-line blocking TE...he a"move" guy