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State of the O-line

Number19

Hall of Fame
Texans met with OT Taylor Moton at the senior bowl:

https://twitter.com/PatDStat/status/824300100088434688
Looks like a good prospect. Played RG starting his jr year. Never has had an injury . Western Michigan has a good passing offense so coached in pass blocking. Currently rated #6 OT by Walterfootball projected as a 3/4 round selection. Found one reference that he has an excellent wingspan. Found comment that his best position may be OG. Found some comment that he is marginal in both run blocking and pass blocking but don't know how recent this analysis is.
 

infantrycak

Admin & Mod
Well, it is a thread about the 2017 OL. It seemed natural to me that people would post about draft picks they wanted.
Generic we need to draft a G and T to go with these vets, sure. When it gets to actual draft prospects it should go in the draft forum.
 

DocBar

Hall of Fame
Contributor's Club
Generic we need to draft a G and T to go with these vets, sure. When it gets to actual draft prospects it should go in the draft forum.
That makes sense as to why you didn't post something like this in the QB thread. It's all about "draft a guy in the 1st 3 rounds" but not much about a specific player. Good call.
 
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76Texan

Hall of Fame
Pretty intersting; Brock had 2.61 seconds to throw

http://www.nfl.com/stats/ngs/timetothrow

27th out of 50
Time to throw includes several variables; a few were listed in the article.
Those not included (besides the time allowed by the blocking) are the long wind up, the time it takes the QB to set up to throw, or reset to throw when he needs to move around, and the time the QB needed to locate a receiver (his reads, both pre-snap and post-snap).
When adding all the factors together, Osweiler could be late by about 1/4 of a second as compared with an Osweiler with a short stride, a quick release, and a quick mind (the franchise QB).
 

powda

You forgot the briefcase!
I agree, but if there's mentioning of a name or two in passing, I think it's OK.
I agree. In passing it's probably not a big deal. If someone went off about watson vs oz i wouldnt even argue much.

Straight draft news or scouting report/rumor and there is a defined place for it. The people really looking for it in the draft forums wont find it because it's mish mashed in here.

Either way, jmo. Not my place to regulate sh*t. Just seems sensible.
 

ObsiWan

Hall of Fame
Contributor's Club
I agree, but if there's mentioning of a name or two in passing, I think it's OK.
And if you want to go into detail about a guy then put the detail analysis in the draft threads
oh and maybe post a link to that thread.
That brings everything full circle.
:twocents:
 

IDEXAN

Hall of Fame
The Seahawks have signed offensive lineman Oday Aboushi, according to Aboushi’s Twitter and several earlier reports.

Aboushi spent the last two seasons with the Houston Texans, starting eight games at guard and has started 18 games overall since joining the NFL as a fifth-round pick of the Jets in 2013 out of Virginia.
http://www.seattletimes.com/sports/seahawks/report-seahawks-sign-ol-oday-aboushi/
****
I don't like this news because we've got enough issues at OT but now losing this guy also now makes our situation at guard at bit more tenuous.
 

TheRealJoker

Hall of Fame
It was a numbers game with Aboushi. He's gotta deal with Jeff Allen's contract and Nick Martin's draft position. Plus Mancz has the ability to play guard/center.
 

Texansphan

All Pro
Texans quietly added two olinemen during the season - Laurence Gibson 6'6" 305lbs T from VT (1 year) and Josh Walker G 6'5" 328lbs Middle Tenn St. (2 yrs) Not exactly stars but they will be developed and depth.
I expect Texans will add a RT in the first two rounds of the draft - I predict Taylor Moton in the 2nd. (Pressure on olinemen in this draft will drive their values higher.)
 

mussop

Hall of Fame
This class of OTs is not good at the top. At the top! In other words there are no franchise guys that are going to go top ten or 15. The rest of the draft isn't much different than most drafts as far as OL go. There isn't any reason to panic and draft an RT in the first or second round. If one is there and he's worthy and we're not passing up far superior talent then yeah draft him, but there are plenty of OTs in this draft that can come in and start at RT and do more than an adequate job.


Actually I would say this is a deep draft for OL in the middle rounds. Hopefully Smith recognizes this and doesn't get to froggy early and pass up some really good talent in this really deep in talent draft. I wouldn't draft an OL until third or fourth round unless one of the top guys falls to the second round. Even then it would depend on who's available at that point.
 

IDEXAN

Hall of Fame
This class of OTs is not good at the top. At the top! In other words there are no franchise guys that are going to go top ten or 15. The rest of the draft isn't much different than most drafts as far as OL go. There isn't any reason to panic and draft an RT in the first or second round. If one is there and he's worthy and we're not passing up far superior talent then yeah draft him, but there are plenty of OTs in this draft that can come in and start at RT and do more than an adequate job.


Actually I would say this is a deep draft for OL in the middle rounds. Hopefully Smith recognizes this and doesn't get to froggy early and pass up some really good talent in this really deep in talent draft. I wouldn't draft an OL until third or fourth round unless one of the top guys falls to the second round. Even then it would depend on who's available at that point.
Ah yes good advise.
Draft into the strength of the Draft rather than chasing after its weakest positions. For example we know that defensive backs and especially corner backs are probably the strongest position in the whole Draft so if a corner is the highest rated player on our Board consider using that first round pick on him especially with the recent departure of AJ Bouye.
 

honored82

Waterboy
Texans quietly added two olinemen during the season - Laurence Gibson 6'6" 305lbs T from VT (1 year) and Josh Walker G 6'5" 328lbs Middle Tenn St. (2 yrs) Not exactly stars but they will be developed and depth.
I expect Texans will add a RT in the first two rounds of the draft - I predict Taylor Moton in the 2nd. (Pressure on olinemen in this draft will drive their values higher.)
So, we have had them on our PS in 2016? or they will be invited to camp as JAG ?

on a side note.....

The Texans conducted a private workout with Villanova offensive tackle Brad Seaton on Friday, according to a league source.

Seaton is a 6-8 6/8, 330-pound right tackle candidate regarded as a middle-round draft target.

Seaton is considered a rising small-school draft prospect due to his size and blocking skills. He was a second-team All-Colonial Athletic Association selection.

The New York native participated in the College Gridiron Showcase where he met with the Minnesota Vikings, New Orleans Saints, Kansas City Chiefs, Texans, Green Bay Packers, Tampa Bay Buccaneers, Philadelphia Eagles and Chicago Bears.
 

jradMIT

Veteran
Texans quietly added two olinemen during the season - Laurence Gibson 6'6" 305lbs T from VT (1 year) and Josh Walker G 6'5" 328lbs Middle Tenn St. (2 yrs) Not exactly stars but they will be developed and depth.
I expect Texans will add a RT in the first two rounds of the draft - I predict Taylor Moton in the 2nd. (Pressure on olinemen in this draft will drive their values higher.)

I really like Moton as a guy who's probably a better fit at guard but who can play some tackle.


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jradMIT

Veteran
Ah yes good advise.
Draft into the strength of the Draft rather than chasing after its weakest positions. For example we know that defensive backs and especially corner backs are probably the strongest position in the whole Draft so if a corner is the highest rated player on our Board consider using that first round pick on him especially with the recent departure of AJ Bouye.

I like that strategy so the Texans should walk away with a TE, CB, S, and possibly a RB or Edge.


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thunderkyss

It's good to be me... again.
Staff member
Contributor's Club
Seaton is a 6-8 6/8, 330-pound right tackle candidate regarded as a middle-round draft target.

Seaton is considered a rising small-school draft prospect due to his size and blocking skills.

Due to his size? At 6'8" I'd be worried about his size. Even in a full squat, he'd be playing too tall.

I know there are exceptions to every rule & all, I'm just saying his "size" would concern me more than it would intrigue me.
 

jradMIT

Veteran
Per Rotoworld

Pro Football Focus notes that Western Michigan OL Taylor Moton "has the strength and athletic ability" to succeed in any scheme.

The PFF analysis team believes that Moton's best NFL fit will come at guard. "There are some concerns as can improve his pass protection against skilled rushers, but a move to guard can protect him in that regard," writes the outlet. The Bengals and Panthers both reportedly spent a fair amount of time talking with Moton on pro day. Scouts Inc. saw him as a "winner" coming out of the Combine.
 

Texansphan

All Pro
Looks good. Not saying he's the one, but I'm going OL with 1-25. I'd have to give serious consideration to a versatile player who can play inside and out. If rated as the 6th best OT, he would be slotted bottom of the first/top of the second.
Agree.
It will be interesting to see how teams pick in this draft with such excellent talent on D available and a paucity of olinemen - they need olinemen, but it is difficult to resist stellar talent especially in the D backfield.
I can see some nice talent slipping well down into the second - Texans could get two very good pieces even though we pick at 25 and 57.
I can see one BPA choice for Texans FO, but then again is BPA based on value or raw talent or both? I suspect a QB takes precedence.
 

Number19

Hall of Fame
Agree.
It will be interesting to see how teams pick in this draft with such excellent talent on D available and a paucity of olinemen - they need olinemen, but it is difficult to resist stellar talent especially in the D backfield.
I can see some nice talent slipping well down into the second - Texans could get two very good pieces even though we pick at 25 and 57.
We need not just starters, but we need to upgrade our OL depth. Depending on how the draft developed, I wouldn't mind seeing, in no particular order, OL, OL and DB with our first three picks. Then QB in the forth. Also in the forth, or fifth, I'd like to see us find LB help. But other than addressing our QB question, our Oline is our highest priority. According to national sources, as well as several evaluators who post here, this is one of the worst QB classes with no QB carrying a first round grade. I prefer not to reach on a QB. Address our other needs and draft a first round QB next year when the talent is more highly regarded than this years.
 

jradMIT

Veteran
If by some miracle Bolles is there, I really like grabbing him in the first and either Moton or Dawkins in the 2nd, that way u could have a RT and RG in the near term and your future LT and RT


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Corrosion

Idealist
Staff member
If by some miracle Bolles is there, I really like grabbing him in the first and either Moton or Dawkins in the 2nd, that way u could have a RT and RG in the near term and your future LT and RT


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Taking OL in 1 and 2 .... who the hell's playing quarterback ?!

I'm ok with one or the other , just not both. Had enough of hot garbage at quarterback.
 

Number19

Hall of Fame
Taking OL in 1 and 2 .... who the hell's playing quarterback ?!

I'm ok with one or the other , just not both. Had enough of hot garbage at quarterback.
Is this rhetorical? I'll answer anyway. Savage, Weeden and a 4th round draft choice this year; a first round prospect in 2018. This is my preference.

A second scenario would replace Weeden with Romo. We're waiting to see how this plays out. IMO, this is the direction McNair & Smith would like. PR value.
 

Corrosion

Idealist
Staff member
Is this rhetorical? I'll answer anyway. Savage, Weeden and a 4th round draft choice this year; a first round prospect in 2018. This is my preference.

A second scenario would replace Weeden with Romo. We're waiting to see how this plays out. IMO, this is the direction McNair & Smith would like. PR value.
I'm not so sure about that. Not after they made the investment of a #2 pick to make enough cap space to improve the team immediately rather than wait a year.

They , like me believe that this team is ready for the bigtime .... if they can find a competent quarterback. That aint Savage , aint Weeden and probably isn't any rookie much less some jag on day 3.

If all they do to improve the QB spot is a 4th round pick .... that #2 was thrown away.

Get Romo , OK 4th round clipboard holder is fine.

No Romo , you gotta get a guy early in the draft.

As of right now it's worse than it was last yr.

OL lost in FA and coming off surgery.

Signed nobody.
Still lots of guys on the FA list who can be had for cheap to fill those OL spots ..... QB not so much. Damnit I been saying this for 3 years ....
 

steelbtexan

Hall of Fame
QB above all else is needed. What I see happening is Ricky signs Romo and drafts an OT at 25. Then drafts a QB with one of the 4th rd picks.

Chad Kelly anyone?
 

Insideop

All Pro
Taking OL in 1 and 2 .... who the hell's playing quarterback ?!

I'm ok with one or the other , just not both. Had enough of hot garbage at quarterback.
I'm not sure if taking a rookie 1st rd QB in this draft would be any better than the "hot garbage" we've seen over the last few years but it might be more entertaining! :D

Seriously though, I don't see them taking OL in the 1st 2 rds. Maybe the 1st rd or the 2nd rd but not both. Now whether they get a QB with the other pick remains to be seen. I still have no clue as to what the Texans are planning on doing in the Draft or FA as far as the QB situation goes, and I'm not sure they do either. If Romo gets cut they will probably go after him which will probably affect who and when they pick a QB in the Draft and maybe even if they pick a QB. But all of this is just pure speculation at this point and just fodder for the message boards and media outlets. I guess all we can do (besides speculate) is sit back and enjoy the show! :popcorn:
 

Number19

Hall of Fame
...They , like me believe that this team is ready for the bigtime .... if they can find a competent quarterback. That aint Savage , aint Weeden and probably isn't any rookie much less some jag on day 3 ....
This is where we differ. You have a low opinion of Savage and Weeden. I believe that both Savage and Weeden have the arms to take advantage of the speed we drafted last year. They both have developed the familiarity with our receivers and have the familiarity with the offense to run it effectively. I believe both can take the team to the next level. I simply don't have the urgency to bring in someone new.

I do have an urgency to upgrade the talent on our Oline, both starters and backups.
 

mussop

Hall of Fame
We still need to add an OT via FA.
Austin Pasztor played RT for Cleveland last year. He only gave up 5 sacks in 950 snaps in his first year as a starting RT and He's only 26. Not a world beater but played more than adequate last year.
 

Number19

Hall of Fame
We still need to add an OT via FA.
Austin Pasztor played RT for Cleveland last year. He only gave up 5 sacks in 950 snaps in his first year as a starting RT and He's only 26. Not a world beater but played more than adequate last year.
Since I'm ready to go into the season with Savage and Weeden, I place a lower priority on signing Romo. If Pasztor appears to be an acceptable signing, do so, without waiting for the Romo situation to resolve.
 

infantrycak

Admin & Mod
This is where we differ. You have a low opinion of Savage and Weeden. I believe that both Savage and Weeden have the arms to take advantage of the speed we drafted last year. They both have developed the familiarity with our receivers and have the familiarity with the offense to run it effectively. I believe both can take the team to the next level. I simply don't have the urgency to bring in someone new.

I do have an urgency to upgrade the talent on our Oline, both starters and backups.
Neither has shown anything other than not being incompetent. The record of success for 4th+ rounders and 3rd team QBs is abysmal.

Just like our sacks more than halved going from Carr to Schaub, competent QB play will make the OL look a lot better. And they are getting Martin back.

Also as mentioned in another thread, maybe we should get a more experienced OL coach.
 
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IDEXAN

Hall of Fame
Former No. 2 overall pick Luke Joeckel inspired the Seahawks to give him $8 million for the 2017 season, presumably based on his college game tape. He struggled to keep his job in Jacksonville or provide average starter play before tearing his ACL last season.

The Seahawks probably believe their coaching can fix him, and maybe they'll be proven right. But that was the gambit made by almost every team spending on linemen this offseason. The Lions, Jaguars, Vikings, Chargers and Jets all swapped players, paying premium prices for another team's problem.
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http://www.espn.com/blog/nfcwest/post/_/id/125812/was-luke-joeckel-one-of-the-worst-free-agent-signings-so-far
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People are starting to make fools out of themselves as they fight over the crumbs of offensive tackles in free agency, so no telling what they might do in next months Draft ?
I just hope the Texans keep their cool and don't act out of desperation as apparently the Seahawks did as they couged up 8 million US greenbacks for the services of one Luke Joeckel,
former Aggie OT and a bona fide NFL bust, for just one year, 2017. Yea the Seahawks, usually considered a first class organization. Yikes !
 

mussop

Hall of Fame
Pasztor is currently a free agent and although he’s not an elite tackle, he’s done well enough to helpful on anybody’s roster.

The 26-year-old tackle certainly was among the highest-graded offensive players by Pro Football Focus, week in and out for the Cleveland Browns in 2016.

He was the featured tackle on the right side replacing the outgoing Mitchell Schwartz, who signed a five-year, $33 million contract with $20.7 guaranteed with the Kansas City Chiefs this past off season.

It’s not clear if the Browns are going to bring Pasztor back as he got the job done but didn’t necessarily wow the team’s brass as well.

But he’s still quite young and there’s tons of room for growth for the guy.

He also has proven he can play both the guard and tackle positions, having done so with the Jacksonville Jaguars, his previous team before signing tender with the Browns last year.
 

PapaL

Loose Screw
Where was he rated among OT's?
Seems to be more of a RG than a RT

http://www.dawgsbynature.com/2017/2/12/14593472/cleveland-browns-free-agent-review-ol-austin-pasztor

Productivity Level Last Season: For the first time in his career, Pasztor started all 16 games. 15 of them came at right tackle, but he was moved to right guard in the season finale as the club decided to toy with the offensive line a bit.

After a rough start to the season, Pasztor turned things around and regularly graded as one of the Browns’ best players on offense. Considering guard might have been his projected strong suit, his work at right tackle for most of the year was admirable and his pass protection improved to match his run blocking.

...

What the Browns Should Do: I thought Pasztor far exceeded expectations in 2016, but I’m stuck with what to do. In an ideal scenario, I would retain him as a versatile backup offensive lineman. We’re talking about a guy who, and this might sound surprising, has started 43 games in the NFL. He’s only 26 years old, so this is the time when he’s going to want to pitch himself as a starting offensive lineman to a team who will pay him low starter-level money.

It’s possible that Cleveland will buy in to Pasztor for that low-level starter money. However, I know that they worked toward developing Shon Coleman all of last year so he could compete to be the right tackle in 2017. Cameron Erving might also get a shot at right tackle. Spencer Drango got some experience at guard, in the event that Greco is near the end of his time with Cleveland. Cleveland could also decide to add another offensive lineman through the draft. Do we really want to lock ourselves in to Pasztor? I’d say we should shoot a little higher and let another team have him.
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
I would hope that any reasonable improvement that became available at FA would be on a plane to Houston for physical and a contract before any notice posted here. Not in a panic mode yet for Oline but not far from it...
 

Number19

Hall of Fame
If we would go ahead and pull the trigger on Austin Pasztor; and then draft, say, Taylor Moton at 1-25, we could save a draft pick which might be a second Oline man.

We'de have a potential group of: Brown, Sua'filo, Mantz, Martin, Allen, Pasztor and Moton. Also add in Clark, Lamm or another recent Jag signing, then we would have a pretty good potential starting 5 out of this group and pretty good backups.
 

WolverineFan

Hall of Fame
He started 15 games at RT last year and acquitted himself quite well. He was only moved to OG in the finale because Cleveland wanted to give Cameron Erving a look at RT since he's been a total bust on the interior thus far and, as a former 1st round pick, the new regime needs to figure out what they have in him since they will have to decide on his option after this year.
 

jradMIT

Veteran
Do they realize the OL is below average?

I'm not sure.

Actually this o-line is average, there's a lot of bad units out there, average now is not that good, but just by having a above average LT and an ok left size, puts them in the middle of the pack despite the poor right side.


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