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Selection 1.1: JaDeveon Clowney DE-OLB
- Thread starter infantrycak
- Start date
- Status
We drafted this guy a week ago and he ain't gotta sack yet.
Can't beleive we haven't traded this POS YET.
We drafted this guy a week ago and he ain't gotta sack yet.
He's saving himself for his contract year.
This IS his contract year!
TheRealJoker
Hall of Fame
I am really excited to see how Crennel uses him. His speed off the ball is amazing!
So do I ....
Thorn
Dirty Old Man
We drafted this guy a week ago and he ain't gotta sack yet.
Sheesh, he hasn't gone grocery shopping yet. Give the guy a break.
Exascor
Veteran
Looks like Texans really wanted Clowney.
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.co...ve-to-no-1-to-ensure-sammy-watkins-selection/
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.co...ve-to-no-1-to-ensure-sammy-watkins-selection/
Scooter
Funky
i would love to know what they offered for the #1. if that report is true, we fubar'd the draft both this year and next - assuming realistic value in that trade.
Tania Ganguli of ESPN had the Texans in their mock draft. She seemed to be extremely informed and on the ball even though her results were too good to be true. Maybe they weren't.
if we turned down an offer even in that neighborhood, fire everybody.
Tania Ganguli of ESPN had the Texans in their mock draft. She seemed to be extremely informed and on the ball even though her results were too good to be true. Maybe they weren't.
if we turned down an offer even in that neighborhood, fire everybody.
ATXtexanfan
Hall of Fame
That's a nice haul but not enough in this year's draft. Wouldn't have been mad if they took it though
Scooter
Funky
much respect for your evaluations, but you lost me at "this year". are you going to stop being a fan next year? did the draft process end without anyone telling me? are you telling me that you wouldnt be ecstatic next year and be praising the forsight as you mock 2 first round talents to the texans, plus an additional third? would you be complaining about the extra 2nd we'd be projecting in 2016? part of taking that trade is taking advantage of the other team, one already in dire straits. next year's pick could very well be the #1 ... 9 this year and 1 next year plus another first isnt good enough?
that turns into barr in the first, a premier talent that was as high as #1 after the college season and a better fit in our defense. 41 was lamarcus joyner at cornerback, a need position. we still get everyone but clowney. if you're only interested in this year, please let me introduce you to mike ditka. and then i'll point to this year's rams. next year is going to happen, and next year there will be a draft. if i can stay in the top 10 this year and add 4 more top 100 picks - regardless of when they happen - i'm taking it.
Agreed. If we didn't take that deal, it was because Buffalo didn't offer it.
Scooter
Funky
i doubt it as well, but assuming the report has merit the bills would've come with a somewhat realistic effort to get the #1.
barr went #9 to vikings (bill's original spot). #8 (viking's original spot) was browns trade up for gilbert. doesnt change your point that barr probably isnt there, but doesnt change mine either that we can grab a top 10 talent in a great draft and add huge picks both now and especially later.
That's where I am too. I would need three picks (two additional plus the swap of 1's) in this past draft to pull the trigger. I need fixes NOW not two years from now.
Playoffs
Hall of Fame
Texans weren't interested in dropping out of the "elite 5" without getting a king's ransom, which was never offered.
That was a media mock draft and everyone was laughing at the BUF writer who did that deal. Not reality.
BUF GM is floating this crap out there in response to the majority opinion that they paid too much to move up where they did to get Watkins.
Scooter
Funky
this is the most plausible scenario.
having nfl network on as background noise the last few days however, they've shown an abundance of situations where a team locked onto one player - always a dynamic offensive option - that teams were willing to aggressively trade for. the teams doing the trading were almost always on the lowest rungs and desperate for a playmaker to change fate. with the bill's ownership and location in flux, and #1 receiver stevie johnson on the way out, a wild trade for a great receiver wouldnt really be surprising.
i dont think the bills were willing to trade the farm for our 1st, but i believe they put in a bid, and probably a bid i personally would've taken.
The more I think about it, the more I like this draft and taking Clowney.
I'm pretty excited to see what the 2014 season brings. I don't have any W-L expectations. I just want to see a competitive team on the field. There's no way the Texans lose 7 games by a score or less.
I'm pretty excited to see what the 2014 season brings. I don't have any W-L expectations. I just want to see a competitive team on the field. There's no way the Texans lose 7 games by a score or less.
OK so I'm glad we got Clowney, but as much as I like him I don't think I like him nearly as much as what I'm hearing some do. I wonder what the Texans' "best offer" for him/1.1 really was ? We'll probably never know, but it's hard for me to believe the Texans were holding out for a package of picks which included multiple first-rounders, the kinda deal the Rams had with the Redskins a couple years ago for RGIII ? I would have made a deal with say ATL for less, say for their 1.6 and second rounder and a 4th round pick: did the Texans really have that opportunity with ATL but hold out for more ?
Why? Before the draft, the word was that Houston was desperate to get rid of the pick. so they called & lowballed us. We didn't bite.
They called & lowballed the Rams, they didn't bite.
They called & lowballed the Jags, no bite, but it got the Jags to take Bortles.
They called & lowballed the Browns, the Browns dropped back 5 spots & picked up a 1st & 4th next year.
That's it. Nothing this year.
I was all about trading out of 1.1 and I would've done it cheap. It didn't happen, though, so now I'm cheering for my team again and pulling for all the rookies.
I really don't see a single reach pick.
CloakNNNdagger
Hall of Fame
...
TheRealJoker
Hall of Fame
Lets see if he can beat out Trevardo Williams!
drs23
Veteran
That's a tuff row to hoe there!
Playoffs
Hall of Fame
Good piece by Farrar, w/videos, pics, comparisons...
The All-22: How does Jadeveon Clowney fit in Houstons hybrid defensive fronts?
The All-22: How does Jadeveon Clowney fit in Houstons hybrid defensive fronts?
b0ng
Bad Hombre
That guy needs to find a synonym for the word "generally".
Blake
MMQB
I agree with you. Generally.
Texian
Hall of Fame
When was the last time an end rusher with only 3 sacks was drafted #1, the first pick in the draft?
Clowney was not the Texans clear absolute first choice in this draft. If he was, why did the Texans try up until the last two minutes before their time expired, try and trade the pick? Trading the pick was almost a certain Clowney would NOT be a Texan. No team thought enough of Clowney to trade up. Clowney was merrily the Texans next best option. Their 2nd Choice.
Clowney was the Texans, "We don't want to fail pick". The next best option pick. Clowney was the play it safe pick. The Texans were afraid of failing.
Clowney was not the Texans clear absolute first choice in this draft. If he was, why did the Texans try up until the last two minutes before their time expired, try and trade the pick? Trading the pick was almost a certain Clowney would NOT be a Texan. No team thought enough of Clowney to trade up. Clowney was merrily the Texans next best option. Their 2nd Choice.
Clowney was the Texans, "We don't want to fail pick". The next best option pick. Clowney was the play it safe pick. The Texans were afraid of failing.
bhsman
Rookie
End rushers are rarely taken to begin with, but plenty of great defensive players were drafted high after seeing their stats down during their last year of college play. It's not that uncommon.
Also: It's post-draft and people still won't stop parroting the 3-sack argument? What are you fighting for at this point?
The Bills offered two firsts and some change just to move up for Sammy Watkins and were supposedly willing to deal with Houston as well - which speaks to earlier reports that Rick wanted a king's ransom for first overall (exchange of firsts + two more and change) not unlike what St. Louis got. Waiting until the last two minutes for any possible trades is the smart thing to do, not some indication that they don't like Clowney.
That's like saying you have the option of getting a free Ferrari but are offered money for it at one-and-a-half times its value, but only if you get the solid offer. If you do? Take it. If you don't? Then take the damn Ferrari; it's not rocket science.
Teams were interested in Clowney but were unwilling to give the Texans what they thought he was worth.
I can only recall one player in recent memory that went 1.1 and a team would be unwilling to trade under any circumstance (Andrew Luck).
The Texans did their due diligence by waiting until the last possible moment that someone could offer a blockbuster trade. I think the Bills made an offer, but in the Texans perspective, it was not worth the deal. Bird in the hand versus two in the bush kinda' mentality.
I can only recall one player in recent memory that went 1.1 and a team would be unwilling to trade under any circumstance (Andrew Luck).
The Texans did their due diligence by waiting until the last possible moment that someone could offer a blockbuster trade. I think the Bills made an offer, but in the Texans perspective, it was not worth the deal. Bird in the hand versus two in the bush kinda' mentality.
If there is not that franchise QB you absolutely need, you have to listen to all offers. The Rams got 3 first round picks (2 of them were in the top 10) just to move down a couple of spaces. If you can get something like that, you have to do it, even if you love the player.
All we`ve heard was: the Texans want 3 first rounders to even consider moving out of the first spot. That`s how highly they thought of Clowney. They´d probably have taken a little less, but not much less than that. So the Texans were probably very much in love with Clowney. As were several scouts that had rated him higher than any other defensive player coming out of college in the last 20 years.
As fans we of course don`t get the whole picture. We don`t know what the Texans asked for and what was offered. But the Bills trade alone should show you, that offers were on the table, and most likely because someone wanted Clowney. That we didn`t take any offer but selected Clowney should tell you, how much the team wanted him.
Probably about the same time a QB with only two years starting for smallish football program was taken #3 overall.
Or the last time a QB less than 6 feet tall was taken in the first round.
You gotta be careful with them stats. They can make you look awfully foolish if you rely on them to much.
xtruroyaltyx
Hall of Fame
Mercilus had a lot of sacks his last year in college.
Now you're just makin fun.
From a week ago.
Texian
Hall of Fame
So you don't know....
That's one word to choose.
Oh, I'm sure that several "tried" to move up, but the Texans brain trust didn't get their asking price. Given the trades we DID see, I think the Texans were foolish not to take an offer, but only time will tell.
Agreed. I think they overvalued him, but it's done. I still don't understand why they didn't trade back into the late first, it wouldn't have cost much (based on what we saw) and the Texans had the picks to spare. Then again, the only time I remember us doing that, we got the great Jason Babin.
I think the Texans thought so highly of having the #1 SPOT, that they were unwilling to move except for the proverbial King's Ransom. This is the same franchise that announced the Mario Williams deal BEFORE the draft, thereby negating ANY chance of a deal.
xtruroyaltyx
Hall of Fame
I think more than clowney by himself, clowney's value (for us) rose higher because if jj watt. Now I know a lot of people will say a number 1 pick should be able to stand alone. I think clowney can be good all by himself, but I think if you pair him with watt (and sprinkle in some other talent up front) and he has the potential to help make this front 7 epic.
Clowney has that type of talent and ability to where if you pair him with someone like watt who is already proven to be special, you could have a unit on your team that could have a huge impact in every single game. Hard to double two guys. Add in some other talented guys like nix, Cushing, yada, yada...and this defensive front 7 all of a sudden this defense could be all time special.
Maybe even grabbing some other really good players didn't appeal to the texans as much as having two players the caliber of watt and clowney in the front 7. If clowney pans out we could witness done really cool stuff on Sundays.
Clowney has that type of talent and ability to where if you pair him with someone like watt who is already proven to be special, you could have a unit on your team that could have a huge impact in every single game. Hard to double two guys. Add in some other talented guys like nix, Cushing, yada, yada...and this defensive front 7 all of a sudden this defense could be all time special.
Maybe even grabbing some other really good players didn't appeal to the texans as much as having two players the caliber of watt and clowney in the front 7. If clowney pans out we could witness done really cool stuff on Sundays.
I think you nailed it. They are going to give JJ a big fat contract within the next year so he's around for a long time. Pairing him up with a very high potential rookie, who gives us 4-5 years on the roster, increases the odds that both players can have monster seasons.
I really think this is the mentality of this franchise right now. Build a defense so badass that they can protect whatever lead a work-in-progress offense can provide. We've seen defenses turn around in a year, and Crennel has a lot to work with right now. I truly expect this to be a highly ranked defense next year in stats that count: turnovers, third down percentages, pressures/sacks, tackles for loss, type of stuff.
As a fan of defense, this is the most exciting part of the 2014 season.
HOU-TEX
Ah, Football!
I think you nailed it. They are going to give JJ a big fat contract within the next year so he's around for a long time. Pairing him up with a very high potential rookie, who gives us 4-5 years on the roster, increases the odds that both players can have monster seasons.
I really think this is the mentality of this franchise right now. Build a defense so badass that they can protect whatever lead a work-in-progress offense can provide. We've seen defenses turn around in a year, and Crennel has a lot to work with right now. I truly expect this to be a highly ranked defense next year in stats that count: turnovers, third down percentages, pressures/sacks, tackles for loss, type of stuff.
As a fan of defense, this is the most exciting part of the 2014 season.
Agree with both of y'all. However, will Crennel think outside the box with the personnel he now has? Meaning, will he be the Crennel of the Pats glory days where he mixed and matched on a weekly basis? Or will he be the Crennel that has that bleh kind of 3-4 that's easily read?
dalemurphy
Hall of Fame
The funny thing about this argument is that the ultimate wisdom regarding this pick will not be determined by Clowney. If Savage turns into a quality starting QB then the decision not to trade down will have paid dividends. If Savage doesn't work out and one of the following do: Bortles, Manziel, Bridgewater, the Texans will have a deep sense of regret for not trading out of that spot and getting their future QB... even if Clowney is a stud.
The Texans can have the best defensive player in the NFL (Watt), a top WR (AJ), a great LT, a great RB, etc.... and still only win 2 games. It is the ultimate team sport. Yet, the QB position can make all of the difference and mean more to a team than any one position in the other sports (hockey goalie, #1 starting pitcher, etc...)
The Texans can have the best defensive player in the NFL (Watt), a top WR (AJ), a great LT, a great RB, etc.... and still only win 2 games. It is the ultimate team sport. Yet, the QB position can make all of the difference and mean more to a team than any one position in the other sports (hockey goalie, #1 starting pitcher, etc...)
yeah, good points. I'm basing my excitement on him being the Crennel of the Pats glory days.
If it's the bleh predictable 3-4, blech. 2014 could be a really, really long season.
The interesting thing about Savage is that he seemingly has a lot more margin for error being a 4th round pick. Nobody truly has the expectations on him like they would a first round QB. If he sucks, then the Texans just chalk it up to experience and continue looking for their next QB, as opposed to a first round guy who has so much money wrapped up in him that they have to continually give him chance after chance even if he sucks.
At least if Clowney is a stud, we know going into 2015 that the Texans have a solid foundation on defense to build on, and they can put more resources into that QB search.
Number19
Hall of Fame
I keep hearing this and it just isn't true unless you have Clowney playing on the same side as JJ. If JJ plays the strong side and JD plays the weak side, he can be doubled team every time by the LT and a TE in a two TE set.
kiwitexansfan
Hall of Fame
Technically you can yes, but that is 4/11 guys occupied leaving your defense to play 9 v 7.
The Pencil Neck
Hall of Fame
Let's say we're going against a 12 formation and let's say we rush 5 - Watt, Clowney, Nix, Crick/Pagan, and Mercilus. If they've got a T and TE on Watt and Clowney. That leaves a center, two guards, and a running back on Nix, Crick/Pagan, and Mercilus.
They'll have 2 wideouts against 2 CBs, 2 Ss, and 2 ILBs.
We SHOULD be able to cover someone in that situation.
xtruroyaltyx
Hall of Fame
Hard to double two guys doesn't equal impossible.
When I say it's hard to double two guys I mean it's hard to do it and be successful.
Fine, leave two TE's in. That's two less guys we have to cover. If we have 6 in coverage we could double up on every receiver. And then you're still banking on no one else on defense being able to beat being single blocked.
We could even get into the possibility of bringing six and leaving 5 in coverage against your three. We still would outnumber you on the back end and now since you're doubling watt and clowney we have Cushing coming at you unblocked.
When I say it's hard to double two guys im not talking physically. I'm talking theoretically. If you're doubling watt and clowney they are doing their jobs and if the rest if the defense is even decent they should feast.
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