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Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

Realistically, will AJ get a yellow jacket based on his career to date

  • Yes

    Votes: 112 62.9%

  • No

    Votes: 66 37.1%
  • Total voters
    178
Double Barrel said:
Do you think HoF voters will agree with you? They just dissed Chris Carter, and according to some NFL analysts, this will be a trend that continues for awhile against receivers.
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He was more one-dimensional compared to Andre Johnson who can do everything but he caught more TD passes. I think if Andre stays healthy and keeps his production high he'll be considered one of the top 2-3 wide outs of his era. I think Carter is more of a HOF guy than Art Monk was fwiw.
 
Vinny said:
He was more one-dimensional compared to Andre Johnson who can do everything but he caught more TD passes. I think if Andre stays healthy and keeps his production high he'll be considered one of the top 2-3 wide outs of his era. I think Carter is more of a HOF guy than Art Monk was fwiw.
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I agree with you completely about AJ. I just hope the HoF voters share our perspective when the time comes. Hopefully that's a decade away (or longer).
 
Vinny said:
AJ has been the dominant wr of the last half decade. Art Monk couldn't carry Andre's jock and he is a HOF'er. He only went to 3 Pro Bowls and was pretty much only a possession wr. All he did was be pretty good for a long time (has some longevity records)...he wasn't ever "dominant" and didn't make defenses change their schemes for his game like teams HAVE to defend Andre Johnson. If AJ stays healthy he is a no brainer HOF player.
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eventhough it was less than 5 yrs ago, imo monk would have a slim chance of getting into the hall today. much more prolific wrs than aj (td wise) and probably comparable yardage wise (when its said and done) are being kept out

the 'dominant receivers' at various points of the last decade were probably: holt, TO, moss, AJ, welker, fitz, wayne & harrison, chad johnson, steve smith... not to mention guys like megatron, aj green, nicks etc who've started out real strong and you're looking at a potential greater bottleneck than we have now at wr in the hof

aj had about 2 yrs where he was considered the best... but most of those guys will have pretty comparable cases or stronger to him

its by no means a no brainer. i think most realistic ppl would agree with that. heres hoping he can string together a few more 1500 yd, 10+ td seasons to help himself out
 
Double Barrel said:
Do you think HoF voters will agree with you? They just dissed Chris Carter, and according to some NFL analysts, this will be a trend that continues for awhile against receivers.
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This is THE crucial question. As Texans fans we have to remember that most of the HoF voters won't have Battle Red KoolAid running thru their veins. They won't care what A.J. has meant to us. They'll look at the numbers - five 1000-yd seasons, four 85+ catch seasons, only 54 TDs in nine years - and say "maybe".

As a comparison, let's look at two HoF WRs vs CC and AJ.

Lynn Swann:
336 receptions, 51 TDs, 5462 yds, FOUR rings.

Michael Irvin:
750 receptions, 11,904 yds, 65 TDs, three rings.

Cris Carter:
1101 receptions, 13,899 yds (including a stretch where he had 8 straight 1000+ yd seasons), 130 TDs, zero rings.

A.J.:
706 receptions, 9656 yds, 52 TDs, no rings.

See a pattern in the HoF voters thinking? It's the SB rings that get you in over your stats... and they get you in sooner rather than later.

We better get AJ into a couple of Super Bowls and let him shine for him to have a shot at a yellow jacket.
 
ObsiWan said:
This is THE crucial question. As Texans fans we have to remember that most of the HoF voters won't have Battle Red KoolAid running thru their veins. They won't care what A.J. has meant to us. They'll look at the numbers - five 1000-yd seasons, four 85+ catch seasons, only 54 TDs in nine years - and say "maybe".

As a comparison, let's look at two HoF WRs vs CC and AJ.

Lynn Swann:
336 receptions, 51 TDs, 5462 yds, FOUR rings.

Michael Irvin:
750 receptions, 11,904 yds, 65 TDs, three rings.

Cris Carter:
1101 receptions, 13,899 yds (including a stretch where he had 8 straight 1000+ yd seasons), 130 TDs, zero rings.

A.J.:
706 receptions, 9656 yds, 52 TDs, no rings.

See a pattern in the HoF voters thinking? It's the SB rings that get you in over your stats... and they get you in sooner rather than later.

We better get AJ into a couple of Super Bowls and let him shine for him to have a shot at a yellow jacket.
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its almost impossible to compare stats from the 70's. You could mug a wr all over the field...literally knock their blocks off at any time - today, every stat or new rule has gone on to enhance the stats of the offensive players in this newer era. In the greater picture, football is a sport very much unlike the stat-driven game of baseball (as an example of making HOF cases on pure stats alone). I think you have to look past raw data to see the impact of a football player. Sometimes you get a lot of catches because the defense is really doubling Ricky Sanders (Art Monk, cough, cough). AJ is a dominant blocker, an elite route runner, makes teams gameplan totally around his skill-set, and has been on some really bad teams. I think the voters will see that and there are tons of things players do to dominate games that don't end up on stat sheets. Stats are for baseball and fantasy leagues.
 
AJ is a lot more revered here than nationally. If we don't get to some playoff games where he can do something, the HOF will be a long shot.
 
Vinny said:
its almost impossible to compare stats from the 70's. You could mug a wr all over the field...literally knock their blocks off at any time - today, every stat or new rule has gone on to enhance the stats of the offensive players in this newer era. In the greater picture, football is a sport very much unlike the stat-driven game of baseball (as an example of making HOF cases on pure stats alone). I think you have to look past raw data to see the impact of a football player. Sometimes you get a lot of catches because the defense is really doubling Ricky Sanders (Art Monk, cough, cough). AJ is a dominant blocker, an elite route runner, makes teams gameplan totally around his skill-set, and has been on some really bad teams. I think the voters will see that and there are tons of things players do to dominate games that don't end up on stat sheets. Stats are for baseball and fantasy leagues.
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I recognize and agree with most of that statement. A.J. was the one stud on a sucky team. But now the offense goes thru Foster. Defenses don't fear A.J. like they fear Foster. What's more likely to happen... an opposing defense doubling A.J. with a CB and safety or them putting that safety in the box to stop Foster??

The part I disagree with is that you're giving the HoF voters more credit than they're due. They won't care that A.J. is a great downfield blocker or a great route runner. There's no evidence that they are that smart. Carter and Harrison are two of the best route runners this side of Jerry Rice. Carter still isn't in and it will be interesting to see if Harrison gets in when eligible (I think he's still 2-3 years away).

I'm telling you A.J. needs a ring or two to cement his chances.
 
I'll say that he does go to the HOF, but I won't be surprised if he doesn't get it in either.

I think that the voters will remember and realize how dominant he was and how feared he was around the league, and will understand that he played on a bad team for a long time.
 
TEXANRED said:
No. AJ is not in the top 25 in receptions. Also if Tim Brown (14th) and Cris Carter (3rd) are not in the hall of fame then you have to figure you are going to have to be better than those guys to make it in or have some rings like Michael Irving.
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This, if the Texans win two of the next three & Andre is MVP in at least one of them, he gets in.

But I voted no.
 
Double Barrel said:
Do you think HoF voters will agree with you? They just dissed Chris Carter, and according to some NFL analysts, this will be a trend that continues for awhile against receivers.
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Andre is what they want a WR to be. If he gets a couple of rings & an MVP, they'll bend over backwards to get him in, ASAP. Plus he'll have McClain in his corner. If he can get Moon in, he'll get AJ in. But AJ has to do his part.
 
As of today he's not a HOF WR imho. What he needs to do is to have a couple of years where he gets 1000+ yds and has double digit td receptions. He's a borderline guy as of now so he needs to do what I just said earlier and he'll be in Canton in no time.
 
The reason Chris Carter and Tim Brown have not got in is simple. They were never the best WR in the NFL at any given time during their career. They were good players, some years as maybe a top5 player most years as a top 10 player at their position. They had long careers and thus put up numbers.

Dre will get in becuase for the last 3 years he has been widely considered the best at his position with his only competition being Fitz (Megatron too). 08 and 09 were monster years back to back and while he may never put up numbers like that again there is no reason to think he can't put up 1100 - 1400 yards a season for 4-5 more seasons barring injury.

In his only appearance in the playoffs he averaged 100 yds a game with 15.5 yards per catch basically at 75% (at best).

I think he bounces back to the tune of 1200+ next year too.
 
ObsiWan said:
I recognize and agree with most of that statement. A.J. was the one stud on a sucky team. But now the offense goes thru Foster. Defenses don't fear A.J. like they fear Foster. What's more likely to happen... an opposing defense doubling A.J. with a CB and safety or them putting that safety in the box to stop Foster??

The part I disagree with is that you're giving the HoF voters more credit than they're due. They won't care that A.J. is a great downfield blocker or a great route runner. There's no evidence that they are that smart. Carter and Harrison are two of the best route runners this side of Jerry Rice. Carter still isn't in and it will be interesting to see if Harrison gets in when eligible (I think he's still 2-3 years away).

I'm telling you A.J. needs a ring or two to cement his chances.
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Uh, ask the Ravens, who let Foster go off while keeping everyone deep to stop AJ.
 
Double Barrel said:
Do you think HoF voters will agree with you? They just dissed Chris Carter, and according to some NFL analysts, this will be a trend that continues for awhile against receivers.
Click to expand...

Then again, you know how fickle the voters can be. Maybe they still hold Carter's early years against him. The whole alcohol, weed and ecstasy thing. Who knows?
 
Texan_Bill said:
Then again, you know how fickle the voters can be. Maybe they still hold Carter's early years against him. The whole alcohol, weed and ecstasy thing. Who knows?
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There is no telling, to be honest. The HoF voters do not have to be accountable. By the same token, they might not like the Houston Texans and hold that against A.J. for not seeking out a better team when he had the chance to do so.

I do not think either loyalty or potential are traits to be considered by HoF voters.

Different position, but the fact that Robert "Dr. Doom" Brazile is not in the HoF says it all. The voters have a bias, and it is unexplainable.
 
Double Barrel said:
There is no telling, to be honest. The HoF voters do not have to be accountable. By the same token, they might not like the Houston Texans and hold that against A.J. for not seeking out a better team when he had the chance to do so.

I do not think either loyalty or potential are traits to be considered by HoF voters.

Different position, but the fact that Robert "Dr. Doom" Brazile is not in the HoF says it all. The voters have a bias, and it is unexplainable.
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Agreed on all points, especially the bolded! :foottap:
 
BTW... This just in; The Pro Football Hall of Fame needs a Texans entry other than Joe Texan in the "fan" wing.... Seriously! :D
 
Texan_Bill said:
Didn't Charles Haley have an ummmmm, well :thinking: sorta weird pregame "ritual"? I may be thinking of someone else, but again, voters are a fickle bunch.
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He was known for practical jokes which sometimes ran into your neck of the woods. :kitten:

But seriously. Any QB with 5 rings would be a unanimous inductee even if it was Trent Dilfer doing it on the back of the Ravens defense.
 
infantrycak said:
How about Charles Haley? He was the best DE on five SB winning teams.
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Texan_Bill said:
Didn't Charles Haley have an ummmmm, well :thinking: sorta weird pregame "ritual"? I may be thinking of someone else, but again, voters are a fickle bunch.
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infantrycak said:
He was known for practical jokes which sometimes ran into your neck of the woods. :kitten:

But seriously. Any QB with 5 rings would be a unanimous inductee even if it was Trent Dilfer doing it on the back of the Ravens defense.
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Damn... I had forgotten about Haley...
Found this in his Wiki write up.
Haley's supporters, who included the late Bill Walsh, believe his personal accomplishments, especially his record five Super Bowl rings, make him worthy of induction into the Pro Football Hall of Fame.[citation needed] However, his history of obscene, violent, and mutinous behavior during his playing days has not helped his candidacy. He was one of the fifteen finalists in 2010 and 2011; however, he was not selected. He was inducted into the Virginia Sports Hall of Fame in 2006. He was inducted into the College Football Hall of Fame in 2011.
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I remember him going at it with George Seifert but I don't know what they mean by "obscene" behavior.
 
ObsiWan said:
I remember him going at it with George Seifert but I don't know what they mean by "obscene" behavior.
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He had some incidents of unexpectedly walking up to teammates and pressing his naked groin against them while they were sitting at their lockers.
 
infantrycak said:
How about Charles Haley? He was the best DE on five SB winning teams.
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Without a doubt, another travesty. It's like Rush and Deep Purple being excluded from the rock and roll hall of fame. It lessens the meaning of these institutions when they leave out clear examples of greatness.
 
infantrycak said:
He had some incidents of unexpectedly walking up to teammates and pressing his naked groin against them while they were sitting at their lockers.
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yeah, many thought he was just insane. He had many incidents along these lines...and I'm sure we don't know the worst of the stories either. On play alone, he was a HOF'er for sure. Perhaps he was just so much a jerk nobody is going to vote him in.
 
ObsiWan said:
No question A.J. is a bonafide stud. And, as others have said, he represents what the voters should be looking for in terms of personality and work ethic. I just worry that they will hold the "no SB rings" and no double-digit TD seasons things against him.

We need to get that man a SB ring!!
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They didn't hold no sb rings and a short career against Gayle Sayers, Dan Marino and many other players that were considered the best of their era.
 
Vinny said:
They didn't hold no sb rings and a short career against Gayle Sayers, Dan Marino and many other players that were considered the best of their era.
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And are any of the guys who voted them in around today? Very few, if any.

Gayle Sayers was one of a kind. Twenty-two TDs in his rookie year - and that's on a total of 232 touches (PR, KRs, receptions, and rushes). That's nearly one TD every ten times he touched the ball. Six TDs in one game. Voted All-Pro (not pro bowl) five times in his six seasons. Led the league in rushing twice and in yds from scrimmage 2 or 3 times.

Marino owned every significant passing record when he retired. Manning and Brees are just starting to rewrite some of them. But when he was voted in, he owned nearly all of them and still owns quite a few. You can look at the list HERE .

What NFL records does A.J. hold or share? I can't find any. I remember Kubiak pointing out he was the fastest to some yardage milestone of any receiver but that's not like saying he holds the all time yardage or reception or TD record now is it?

With few records to point to and no rings, A.J. is great role model but no shoe in for the HoF.

I heard, a long time ago, some wagging tongue talking about Moss or T.O. or someone regarding whether they belonged in the Hall. They said, "If you have to argue them into the Hall of Fame, they probably don't belong." And I agree. A Hall of Fame selection should be a no-brainer. Marino? Rings or not, he was a no-brainer. So was Sayers when he was elected in 1977 (I wonder if he'd get in today since his career was so short).

Trust me, I want A.J. in as much as you do. I just don't trust the current generation of voters to give him that honor. ...especially without a SB ring or league MVP to point to.
 
Sadly, no. Without more success from the Texans, including a championship run, AJ unfortunately will always be glossed over. :(
 
When it comes to receivers, if you have to ask, then no. Period. Nothing else needed. STFU.
 
Through the 2010–11 NFL season, Johnson ranks first all-time in NFL history in receiving yards per game (80.7 yds/game) for a career.

In 2008 first player in NFL history to record 7 games with at least 10 receptions.

In 2009 Johnson joined Jerry Rice as the only two receivers since the merger to lead the league in receiving yards in consecutive seasons.

In 2010 he became first player with at least 60 in each of his first eight seasons.
 
Originally I said no but looking at the company he keeps:

currently 18th all time. He could easily pass James lofton if he plays next year the way he played this year. just think of what he could have done had he ever had a real QB in his career.

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/leaders/rec_yds_career.htm
1. Jerry Rice+ 22,895 1985-2004 3TM
2. Terrell Owens 15,934 1996-2010 5TM
3. Randy Moss 15,292 1998-2012 5TM
4. Isaac Bruce 15,208 1994-2009 2TM
5. Tim Brown 14,934 1988-2004 2TM
6. Tony Gonzalez (36) 14,824 1997-2013 2TM
7. Marvin Harrison 14,580 1996-2008 clt
8. James Lofton+ 14,004 1978-1993 5TM
9. Cris Carter+ 13,899 1987-2002 3TM
10. Henry Ellard 13,777 1983-1998 3TM
11. Reggie Wayne (34) 13,566 2001-2013 clt
12. Torry Holt 13,382 1999-2009 2TM
13. Andre Reed 13,198 1985-2000 2TM
14. Steve Largent+ 13,089 1976-1989 sea
15. Irving Fryar 12,785 1984-2000 4TM
16. Art Monk+ 12,721 1980-1995 3TM
17. Jimmy Smith 12,287 1992-2005 2TM
18. Andre Johnson (31) 12,220 2003-2013 htx
19. Charlie Joiner+ 12,146 1969-1986 3TM
20. Hines Ward 12,083 1998-2011 pit
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Surely the voters will take into account the type of teams he played for during the majority of his career. I've seen great players on bad teams make the Hall of Fame before. They don't need to dominate every category. His lack of career Touchdowns isn't a problem, IMO.
 
TEXANRED said:
Originally I said no but looking at the company he keeps:

currently 18th all time. He could easily pass James lofton if he plays next year the way he played this year. just think of what he could have done had he ever had a real QB in his career.

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/leaders/rec_yds_career.htm
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Look at all the WRs in front of him that are either not in the HOF, or had to wait a very long time (Monk). Cris Carter was kind of a no brainer and he still had to wait a while.
 
eriadoc said:
Look at all the WRs in front of him that are either not in the HOF, or had to wait a very long time (Monk). Cris Carter was kind of a no brainer and he still had to wait a while.
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You're right but I also feel Andre Johnson is far from done. I think he'll play another five or six more seasons. He's going to come very close to Jerry Rice's career receiving yardage. He'll pass Terrell Owens, who is only going to have a long wait because of his bad attitude and bitter exit from the league.
 
Bulls on Parade said:
You're right but I also feel Andre Johnson is far from done. I think he'll play another five or six more seasons. He's going to come very close to Jerry Rice's career receiving yardage.
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That's the path. He's not a prolific scorer, he doesn't play for a marquee team, and he doesn't play in the playoffs. So the only way he makes it is to bludgeon voters with receiving yardage.
 
eriadoc said:
Look at all the WRs in front of him that are either not in the HOF, or had to wait a very long time (Monk). Cris Carter was kind of a no brainer and he still had to wait a while.
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Realistically aj could be 15th all time by the end of the season. If he plays 14 years like the rest of his counter parts he could very well be #2 all time.
 
AJ will have a tough uphill battle with Moss and TO ahead of him, though maybe the Hall will be more generous with receivers in the next decade or so.
 
Everyone keep talking about the QB's, but the biggest thing that has plagued AJ's career as far as I'm concerned is Capers/Palmer and Kubiak.
 
eriadoc said:
Look at all the WRs in front of him that are either not in the HOF, or had to wait a very long time (Monk). Cris Carter was kind of a no brainer and he still had to wait a while.
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AJ is not done yet. By the time he is he may very well have only one player in front of him.

Cris Carter was for from a no brainer. In a 15 year career he was the leading WR on his team only 5 times and 3 of those were 962, 681 & 1071 yds.

The1ApplePie said:
AJ will have a tough uphill battle with Moss and TO ahead of him, though maybe the Hall will be more generous with receivers in the next decade or so.
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Folks always leave Marvin Harrison off. He'll be up next year for the 1st time.

That is a pair of dogs with flea infestations. If WRs are left waiting around for years, my bet is on them. Both of them were on 5 teams as a result of all the antics.

I think when AJ comes up Harrison will have gotten in and Moss & TO will be cooling their heels.

Reggie Wayne will be the only other guy in the discussion and now we'll have to see how he rebounds. .

Texecutioner said:
Everyone keep talking about the QB's, but the biggest thing that has plagued AJ's career as far as I'm concerned is Capers/Palmer and Kubiak.
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Maybe so but imagine this as a sales job by John McClain. He can quantify years with pro bowlers or all pros as QB and there is a clear connection between QB & WR. Coaching isn't going to be as easy to quantify or sell.
 
like others have said

What hes done so far NO


but if he keep laying at a high level injury free he has a chance gotta get them numbers up tho
 
i say yes. People that know football all rave about Andre Johnson and are very aware just how much he has accomplished with crap to average qbs that never learned to target him very well in the redzone.
 
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