If they were in 12 personnel the TE.
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[Pick 67] Davis Mills QB Stanford
- Thread starter AcresHomesTexan
- Start date
banned1976
sleeper mode
Texansballer74
The Marine
Thunder are you watching the Buccaneers vs Patriots game?
Prime example of what I’m talking about, in terms of the rookie making plays. Now to be completely fair Matt has started every game this season. But on the Patriots last drive that resulted into a touchdown, Matt got blitz for a sack. The very next play he was blitzed again, this time he made him miss and delivered a beautiful throw to his receiver. The Buccaneers didn’t blitz again on that possession and Matt was able to basically dink and donk his way to a beautiful touchdown pass to his TE. The biggest thing was the quarterback made a play and installed confidence in his team.
Prime example of what I’m talking about, in terms of the rookie making plays. Now to be completely fair Matt has started every game this season. But on the Patriots last drive that resulted into a touchdown, Matt got blitz for a sack. The very next play he was blitzed again, this time he made him miss and delivered a beautiful throw to his receiver. The Buccaneers didn’t blitz again on that possession and Matt was able to basically dink and donk his way to a beautiful touchdown pass to his TE. The biggest thing was the quarterback made a play and installed confidence in his team.
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
or they have no other choices.
Texansballer74
The Marine
Oh and Thunder the Patriots doesn’t have any big time names/talent either.
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
biggest difference is the protection and Mac has someone to go to. We saw Mills evade the rush several times…he emerges from it and has no one to throw it to b/c no one is open.
banned1976
sleeper mode
& they can run the ball, throw screens, & they're not killing themselves with penalties.
& I'd take Josh McDaniels over Tim Kelly any day.
& @Texansballer74 Mac Jones started 30 college games including the National Title game. Davis Mills is practically straight out of high school.
austins23
Hall of Fame
So back to my point in the GAMEDAY thread, Kelly needed to change it up. Get guys open.
Of course the Oline didn’t help much but…
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
couldve changed it up, I just don’t think it would’ve mattered. Pats have playmakers, we don’t.
austins23
Hall of Fame
Not arguing but who on the Pats offense instills fear into any DC?
Jonuu Smith?
Cooks is about it on the Texans.
yes it wouldn’t have mattered but look what a competent OC and HC did with a rookie tonight. Granted he’s a better rookie but still…
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
hunter henry is better than any TE we have
Jakobi Meyers is at least as good as Cooks
Harris is better than any 1 of our trio. More importantly, Jones is better than Mills.
also right now, The Bills defense is better than TB’s.
The plays called are only as good as the talent executing them.
Texansballer74
The Marine
He’s still a rookie in the NFL correct who has struggled a lot so far this season. But that was not my point. My point was to install some type of confidence in the team around, on this level you have to make some plays. You have to burn a defense like the Bills in order to somewhat tame the bulldogs.
Texansballer74
The Marine
Just the other day a few members where talking about how Mills so far looking better than all the rest of the rookie quarterbacks. His numbers at that time did favor him but after tonight it has even out because Fields, Jones and Wilson finally had good games. So this stuff about Mills playing 10 games in college is out window. He’s fair game since he was talked up just a few days ago of being/playing better than the rest.
I talked him up as well. But after tonight with a full week of practice. Imo he’s not ready.
I agree. Davis made a few good plays. His receivers didn’t catch the ball, or they fumbled it away. Kid can only do so much in his 2nd start.
they couldn’t sustain enough drives to produce many of those plays. The ones he made had to count, but the drops & fumbles & holding… too much for the rookie to overcome.
When you’re arguing with those guys, sure. But I was saying he never should suit up on game day.
Tell you what, let’s see what Mills looks like after starting 4 games. I doubt he’ll look like Mac Jones did today, but he won’t look as bad as he did today.
These are part of the growing pains.
Is that you OB?
Yeah, Jacobi Myers the best UDFA ever that ran a 4.63 forty.
Nick Caserio was about to trade all the picks to draft him in the first round but Easterby said NO.
Speedy
Former Yeller Dweller
It’s called making progress. Yes, all these rookies have their struggles, but they show progress week to week. Jones has certainly made progress, Lawrence is making progress, and we’ll see if Wilson and others continue to do so.
Davis Mills, however, has yet to show that progress. It wasn’t there in the preseason, and it certainly hasn’t been there through 10 quarters. The dude was about as green as they come, and he is not ready for this game, by a long shot.
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
I think so. If Cooks is better, it ain’t by much.
TheRealJoker
Hall of Fame
Cooks is better at pretty much every metric except arm strength and accuracy throwing the ball. Which, as a WR, is pretty far down the list of priorities.
Gotta disagree with you here.
Cooks has started on SB teams before he got here. Teams have traded two 1sts and a 2nd for Cooks. I can't ever see a team giving up that much for Meyers and I like Meyers.
Meyers is a slot guy comparing him to Cooks is apples/oranges.
banned1976
sleeper mode
I 100% agree with the statement I bolded. You have to put pressure on good defenses by mixing in some deep passes, PA's, and hitting them with some seam routes. The problem is, they don't have the speed on the outside or inside, nor do they have a running game to keep the defense honest. PA's won't work with this offense.
Bottom line, this team has been stripped to the bones. They don't have the talent (I know that phrase bothers you but it's true) on offense to keep a good defense honest. I don't care that NE hung in there with Tampa. It was one game and NE is coached by a future HOF HC. Culley ain't that.
Cooks/Collins are plenty fast enough. 2/3 of their starting wr corps is hurt and on IR. The team will look better when they get back and Mills gets more experience.
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
Part of why Cooks has been traded so much despite his production is b/c he’s basically a 1 trick pony. Meyers while not as good of a pass catching WR…yet, he is the better blocker in the run game and as you saw yesterday offers other things.
banned1976
sleeper mode
The Texans drafted Mills in the 3rd round because the other QB's they wanted to draft were already off the board; or at least I believe that to be the case. The next quarterback drafted after Mills was selected in the 6th round. I think the Texans could/should have waited until then to draft Mills and if he wasn't there, no big loss. Mills showed no special qualities in college and was/is the quintessential "project quarterback" in the draft.
Number19
Hall of Fame
I agree. I simply don't get the negativity when this game turned out just as expected. The Texans was a bottom tier team going up against a Super Bowl talented team. This game was not a good example for bashing Mills because results, as commented on, fall more on Kelley, on the OL, on the lack of a running game and on the lack of downfield targets/reads.
Is Mills ready? Whoever said he was? He is starting because TT is injured. He was thrown into the game against top tier teams. What should be focused on is how he is handling this beating. If it is not effecting his head, it can be a positive in his growth.
The overall lack of team talent won't be addressed this season but let's see how Mills responds against the Pats and, if Taylor is not back, against the Colts.
One argument is that it is best for a rookie QB to sit. The other argument is to throw him in the game sink or swim. Well, the sink or swim argument is the order of the day because of circumstances. Now let's see how Mills deals with this adversity.
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
Hindsight is always 20/20...but He was a 3rd round prospect.....which in theory means it was gonna take him a little longer to develop as a potential starter...Which also means that whomever you took in his place was likely also someone in the same boat. So this notion we could've snagged someone else at a position of need and been better off than taking Mills there is a flawed assertion, thought..or whatever. Those guys aren't really expected to be able to contribute and step into a starter's role until the next year. So why would it be any different for him? Just b/c he's been forced into the starting role doesn't necessarily change the typical development curve of a 3rd round prospect.
He has shown progress, just not the progress YOU and fans think he should be making. Fact is from the preseason to now, he had the 2nd best debut of all rookies qbs who made their 1st start this year & that's progress. Yesterday was terrible, but not totally unexpected given what he was facing, where he was in his development and the fact that as a rookie qb, he was just flat out due when you consider that all the other guys taken ahead of him had already had a game where they threw 3+ ints. he wasn't ready, a few of us new that & its why we argued he needs to sit when TT comes back.
I will also say that next week, he won't look good either. Belichick has the same level of talent on defense over there that the Bills have & he's going to have a tough time dealing with that...Like Zach Wilson did and pretty much every rookie qb does against Belichick's defenses. You guys need to back away from the ledge.
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I agree with everything but the last sentence. Gotta let him take his lumps and learn.
austins23
Hall of Fame
Sure, those guys are all better than what the Texans have, except maybe Meyers, but my point was none of those guys make a DC game plan specifically for them. Daniels drew up a game plan to get these guys open against a pretty good defense. Kelly hasn’t done much to impress lately.
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
Disagree, there were very few plays McDaniels drew up where guys were just running wide open. It was more about Jones. He stood tough in the pocket all night and delivered some nice, accurate throws in some tight spots even when he knew he was about to be hit. He was going to his 2nd and in some cases 3rd read. He really outplayed Brady last night.
austins23
Hall of Fame
Never said “wide open”. Yes, Jones played very well.
Sometimes it’s about the Jimmy and the Joes, last night it was about the X’s and the O’s. Coaching matters, and the Texans OC hasn’t come up with good X’s and O’s. I think maybe he’s still trying to shake the ghost of OB. Let’s hope he gets it together, for Mills’ sake.
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
There was nothing wrong with Kelly's playcalling when Tyrod was in there so I don't put much if anything at all on Kelly here. Mills need to get it together for Mills' sake.
austins23
Hall of Fame
We will agree to disagree on Kelly. I don’t think he’s cut out for the position.
Agree with you on Mills. He needs to get the head out of his arse!
TheRealJoker
Hall of Fame
The only GM that might agree with you is now on Alabama’s coaching staff (OB).
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
That GM's thoughts on how good Cooks is actually lines up with your take, not mines. After all, he was the guy who brought him here thinking he would be able to replace the all-pro WR production that he shipped out of here. Cooks is solid, but he ain't as good as you and apparently BoB think he is.
Number19
Hall of Fame
Disagree, to a point. The week leading up to the game, Kelly comes up with the game plan and the plays to be used for that game. Kelly dialed back the playbook for Mills. I would be surprised if Mills, or any rookie qb with any coach, is going to go against the instructions given him by his coach.
Does your thoughts align with Belichick/Snead/McVays thoughts on Cooks?
They've all been very complimentary of Cooks in the past and since he's been with the Texans he's done a good job replacing WFV. Plus he's been healthy, unlike WFV.
Speedy
Former Yeller Dweller
And I simply don’t get the excuse making for him. Yeah, there’s not a lot of help around him, not everything is his fault so on and so forth, but that shouldn’t be an excuse for his play. He’s not been good, period.
Tyrod Taylor had the same “help” and they at least looked like a competent team.
And yeah, though you could say it was expected from a 3rd round rookie, and I do think there’s been some really harsh comments towards him the last 24 hours, I think most of those responses are directed at those making those excuses for him.
I would agree with you if Mills was like the other rookies who played 20+ games & highly talented teams.
But he's not. I think it would be good for him to take a break, decompress & refocus.
Rookies will hit a wall. They all do.
Mills wall may be coming up quicker than the others. I'd rather take him out of the game, let him focus on the basics & mechanics for a few weeks, then throw him back out there.
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
Yeah...but if Kelly dialed it back for Mills, it was probably for a reason...a reason related to Mills' comfortability, not Kelly's ineptitude in calling the offense.
I don't know this to be fact or anything, but from what i've heard & seen over many years of watching this game is when coaches are tasked with developing gameplans for young guys, typically what happens is they run pass plays and concepts that the player is most comfortable with & knows really well & then maybe a few that he's just ok with & they go from there. The hope with this approach is that the game can be controlled enough to where the offense isn't forced to delve into the portion of the playbook that the rook doesn't know all that well & maybe you can put together a few things on the sideline mid game based on what you see from the defense....like Cooks helped Mills with in that Browns game on that deepshot that he missed on.
But................. if you can't control the flow of the game & it starts to get away from you a little too early, like with what you saw yesterday, you can't come out with the same conservative gameplan. You have to attempt to threaten downfield and run things the kid probably isn't comfortable with.....which opens him up to making more mistakes throwing the ball & getting hit. This is what happened late in the Panthers game when we were running out of time & early in the 2nd half of the Bills game when it was getting away from us...
Just glancing over the games, Mills got hit the most & the offensive play calls looked the most incompetent in the Panthers & Bills games at those particular points.....& its b/c he doesn't know that mid-deep passing game portion of the playbook. No great playcall is gonna be able to overcome that, period. You can tell b/c he's slow with his reads, he's bailing out of the pocket..typically away from where the routes are being run and he's not decisive in the throws he is making.
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We really don't know how they would have called the game if Tyrod played.
They had an excuse to dial things back because they had the rookie playing Carolina. They talked all week about putting more on Davis' plate. But when the rain started falling, it looked like they found another excuse to turtle up.
Maybe, & most likely it's because of the rookie.
But ask yourself, have they made any other calls that exposed their overly conservative nature?
I think they've done plenty. They know they have to play perfect & not make mistakes. Which is smart & true of every team. But other teams would look at 1st & 28 as manageable. We appear to throw up our hands & set things up for the punter.
Again, maybe it's because of Mills.
The sample size is too small with Tyrod, but we know a lot of the things he did was off script. So it's really hard to say what they would have done with Tyrod.
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
& yet they've all traded him and haven't really missed a beat. What they say about him is irrelevant at that point. Im not saying Cooks isn't a good WR....im just saying he aint as good as y'all are making him out to be.
vtech9
All Pro
Correction. Mills will be the starter next week because the coaches see something in him that YOU and a few OTHERS don't. And also, yes, Driskell is that bad.
banned1976
sleeper mode
Just heard on 610 from Culley interview that at this time they don't plan on bringing in another quarterback. That was a dumb plan going into yesterdays game and it's doubly dumb this week.
All I ask is do something to at least try to fix the problems. Look under every rock, into every nook and cranny, in every deer stand to try and fix the running back and quarterback problems. You just got curb-stomped to the tune of 40 to zero. Worst loss in franchise history.
All I ask is do something to at least try to fix the problems. Look under every rock, into every nook and cranny, in every deer stand to try and fix the running back and quarterback problems. You just got curb-stomped to the tune of 40 to zero. Worst loss in franchise history.
Agreed.
However, I remember one play where he faced pressure in the pocket, backed out of it, then felt pressure coming on the edge, steps up, then sets up to throw, pulls it back down & ends up getting sacked.
Now, he's not Tyrod or Deshaun. I don't expect to see any Houdini moments. But I like the way he moves in the pocket. Didn't look too good about it yesterday, there were just too many Bills that were too fast & all of them eventually beating our protection.
On that play, Tiki was talking about the errors of a young QB & the dangers of him focusing on one guy, meaning Cooks.
But Davis was already off Mills, & off his 2nd read. Looked like he saw the guy covering 18 had fell down. He tried to get in position to throw him the ball when he finally got sacked.
It was near the end of the 1st qtr I think, where we ended up punting out of the end zone. He did that several times yesterday, almost made a lot of plays... just not quite.
Mr teX
Hall of Fame
Not alot. I can remember 2 plays of note TT made off script. Most of the other plays he made came as a result of reading out the defense and making the appropriate throw. I think its pretty obvious that they've turtled up with Mills b/c he's a rookie and also b/c they know he's not ready & they're trying to protect him as best they can while also trying to compete.
I think the talk about putting more on his plate was part coachspeak and part truth. You can put more on his plate than he had against Carolina and still not open up the entire playbook to him. & i think part of the plan coming into the Buffalo game was to test him..see how much he could handle. but after a few drives it was clear where he was & so they scaled back..at least when they were still in the game.
I also don't think the rain had any effect on the playcalling for him either. Early in that game we went for it on 4th down in lieu of taking the 3 pts....& we did so by by letting him attempt a pass...this was after he had the ball slip out of his hands on the 1st drive due to the weather. If they had truly "turtled up" with him b/c of the weather, you likely see us take the points there & not even attempt a pass.
I also don't know about 1st and 28 being "manageable". That's about as bad as you can start any set of downs for any qb let alone a rookie in a hostile enviornment.
The playcalling appears different b/c it is..we're running base stuff and alot of stuff that is geared around protecting him in the pocket and stuff he's comfy with. It isn't b/c Kelly all of a sudden doesn't know what to call when defenses are doing certain things imo. Its b/c Mills has effectively closed off a portion of the playbook b/c he doesn't know it...at least well enough to get through his reads fast enough to make defenses pay imo.
