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**Official Game-Day Thread** Texans at Patriots Game 1, Sunday Sept 9, 2018!!

banned1976

American
We are and you will. If I have to put up with this piece of **** with no ******* experience coaching us into the ******* ground, you have to stick around and endure failure too - like a Houston fan should lol.
I was watching a Texans game in 2016. They had just lost and I was in a terrible mood. I have a boarderline personality disorder. After I get really angry about something and calm down severe depression sometimes sets in; that’s what happened after that loss.

I started thinking about my life. My best friend had passed away due to cancer just a few months before. My dad had passed away the previous summer. Although we didn’t get along it affected me. I had quit my job in Minnesota due to family crisis in Houston...my mom was sick. At that time I hadn’t seen my son for 6 years. I had had multiple serious surgeries so health wise I wasn’t doing so hot.

After reflecting on all that I thought to myself there is no good reason to let a football team bring me down like this. All its done for me is triggering me to drag out all the negative crap that I don’t have any control over anyway.

Since then I don’t get emotional over them. It’s just a damn game.
 

ArlingtonTexan

Moderator
Staff member
Sounds good, but the owners will never go for that unless they can sell tickets. They might even want as much as half the price of a regular season ticket...
What you think it a bad bargain for everyone that fans pay full price for games designed to prepare teams for the regular season, and don't accomplish that. I mean what better use of fans money, than making the first game and often the last game of the season looking like a product that equals to the "pre-season."
 

Lucky

Moderator
Staff member
I just got a notice from the nfl that the call from the NFL to review the Gronk catch came too late to the refs from the nfl......whole story written up on it on the nfl website and everything.

Still doesn’t change the fact that OB should’ve called a TO
...but its becoming comical at this point how these “technical difficulties” always seem to happen at Gillette stadium..
It makes the mistake even worse. Had he called the TO, the NFL would have had time to tell the ref to stop the game for a review. In a 7 point loss, the 7 points New England scored is squarely on O'Brien. Yes, the players are the one who are on the field. But it is the HC job to manage the game. O'Brien cannot manage a game.

Here is the link to the article you referred to.

New England Patriots tight end Rob Gronkowski made a spectacular catch late in the first half against the Houston Texans -- unless he didn't.

Gronk's controversial 28-yard catch between two Texans defenders helped set up a Patriots touchdown five plays later to take a 21-6 lead into the locker room. But replays of the catch immediately cast doubt on whether Gronkowski had possession of the ball when he went down, so why wasn't it reviewed?

Well, NFL officials in New York tried to get the on-field officials' attention, but the call to the field came too late, referee Tony Corrente said after the Patriots' 27-20 victory.

"...The situation was that New York did get back to us," Corrente said, per the official pool report. "However, unfortunately, they didn't get to the game officials on the field until after the play had already started. ... They got to us on the field, but the play had already developed. It had started."
O'Brien's quote in the article.

"It's not my job to do that," O'Brien said. "... That's not my job to call a time out, to make their job easier. You know, what I am trying to do is make sure we go into halftime ... down 14-6. Say I call a time out there, they rule it a catch, now the Patriots have more time to put a play together."
If he really believes this, then O'Brien is hopeless.
 

leebigeztx

Keep it Movin!
I would’ve fired OB after his second year here.

Once he shipped off Fitz and brought in Hoyer I knew he was going to be bad news. That’s not the type of move good teams make. You replace Fotz with a clear upgrade or your q.b of the future. Not ******* Hoyer.

If you can’t get the obvious simple stuff right then I can’t trust you to do the complicated things.
Pretty much. They still don't have an identity. I still don't see staple plays.
 

Mr teX

Hall of Fame
It makes the mistake even worse. Had he called the TO, the NFL would have had time to tell the ref to stop the game for a review. In a 7 point loss, the 7 points New England scored is squarely on O'Brien. Yes, the players are the one who are on the field. But it is the HC job to manage the game. O'Brien cannot manage a game.

Here is the link to the article you referred to.



O'Brien's quote in the article.


If he really believes this, then O'Brien is hopeless.

Ehh u can pick those 1st 7 pts NE scored off the botched Handoff and say that was the difference...& that had nothing to do with BoB.

I only brought that article up b/c as a coach he’s right. He shouldn’t have to do that, but once u see it’s not coming you need to do the prudent thing and call a TO if for nothing else to see why the hell the booth didn’t review the catch since he couldn’t challenge it.


Regardless, u always here about **** like this happening in NE. I remember Tomlin saying something about how their headsets always go out at Gillette...they are notorious for purposely skirting rules that work to their advantage..at some point u have to look at their gamesmanship..
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
What you think it a bad bargain for everyone that fans pay full price for games designed to prepare teams for the regular season, and don't accomplish that. I mean what better use of fans money, than making the first game and often the last game of the season looking like a product that equals to the "pre-season."
I don't think preseason games are to prepare for regular season for most part or they would play regulars most of last preseason game. Preseason is to get depth guys and players like Davenport to see "live fire" and to separate sheep and goats.
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
I'm going to remain skeptical about the dehydration/cramping.................how often do you see intelligent,well-conditioned athletes dehydrate in cloudy 60-63 degree weather?
With a good head coach would Watson have been "rusty"? Just a few more snaps in the preseason is all I asked for
...to knock the rust off.
Some of us, CnnnD, Scooter, me, Herv, told y'all O'Brien (Mr. "Earn the right to put your name on your jersey in OTAs") should have played the ones in preseason until they looked sharp and earned the right to sit out the rest of the preseason. You don't wait until the games count to find out who's "rusty".

Belichick and Payton played their starting QBs in preseason. But not O'Brien.
go figure...

Yes we all were big advocates of Bill not playing his main guys in preseason. I didn't like it when he did it with JJ, Wilfork and several others in his first season here. Remember they started that season 0-4.

One would think dude would've learned his lesson. But as you can see he hasn't
 

CloakNNNdagger

Hall of Fame
I don't think preseason games are to prepare for regular season for most part or they would play regulars most of last preseason game. Preseason is to get depth guys and players like Davenport to see "live fire" and to separate sheep and goats.
That's never what it was prior to the CBA.
 

CloakNNNdagger

Hall of Fame
Yes we all were big advocates of Bill not playing his main guys in preseason. I didn't like it when he did it with JJ, Wilfork and several others in his first season here. Remember they started that season 0-4.

One would think dude would've learned his lesson. But as you can see he hasn't
It's not only O'Brien, though. It seems to have become a misguided trend with most teams...........one that is based on the wish to avoid injuries. "Unprepared" players will be unprepared to play regular season games at the same time of setting themselves up for an accumulation of "delayed" injuries when they do begin making it onto the field.
 

Mr teX

Hall of Fame
I don't think preseason games are to prepare for regular season for most part or they would play regulars most of last preseason game. Preseason is to get depth guys and players like Davenport to see "live fire" and to separate sheep and goats.

Games in the NFL are too precious to waste 1-2 every single ******* year working out chemistry issues; especially if you have the same coaching staff and mostly all the same players coming back....yet here we are every damn year.

I get it, you’re afraid of losing key personnel for the season, but you just can’t start a season every year like this when you’ve got so many of your guys coming back from injury.

U need the live reps...
 

ArlingtonTexan

Moderator
Staff member
I don't think preseason games are to prepare for regular season for most part or they would play regulars most of last preseason game. Preseason is to get depth guys and players like Davenport to see "live fire" and to separate sheep and goats.
Both of these can be accomplished...It wasn't that long along where the pattern was starters play 1st quarter (game 1), 2 quarters (game 2), anywhere from mid 3rd quarter to game end (3rd game) and at least 1 or 2 series if not a half (game 4)...some of this time was lesser when and until the unit performed well.

The starters played the equal of two games or so, still leaving time for the developmental back-ups and those truly fighting for roster spots. t

Teams really aren't finding anything out about 8th WR, 5th Rb, 7th safety that they don't know already by playing them for 3 Quarters week four of pre-season.
 

paycheck71

Hall of Fame
Play in the preseason vs don't play in the preseason is a lose lose argument. Same people would be bitching if we played starters and had a couple of torn ACL's by now.
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
It's not only O'Brien, though. It seems to have become a misguided trend with most teams...........one that is based on the wish to avoid injuries. "Unprepared" players will be unprepared to play regular season games at the same time of setting themselves up for an accumulation of "delayed" injuries when they do begin making it onto the field.

Indeed but when you have old man Brady and Belichick still grinding in the preseason, you better get with the program.
 

ObsiWan

Hall of Fame
Contributor's Club
Refresh my memory.

Is this the first time a Bill O'Brien team looked completely unprepared for the one game he has the most time to prepare for?

Or has this happened before?
Well, look what the loss dragged in.
LoL

oh, and no, it is not.

I thought they opened better back when they trained here in Texas

you know, before the coach moved them out of the Texans heat, back east, to that country club to train
:D
 

ArlingtonTexan

Moderator
Staff member
Play in the preseason vs don't play in the preseason is a lose lose argument. Same people would be bitching if we played starters and had a couple of torn ACL's by now.
I think we have made past the so-called tipping point where the poor quality of play overrides the obvious injury risk. I am aware I can't prove this opinion.
 

Scooter

Funky
I realize the need to evaluate talent in a kind of 'live fire' situation, but you're damn right preseason should be preparation for your starters. 7vs7's and film study and a few contact drills and then - hey kid, I realize the Patriots know our plays better than you do .... go get 'em tiger!
 

paycheck71

Hall of Fame
I think we have made past the so-called tipping point where the poor quality of play overrides the obvious injury risk. I am aware I can't prove this opinion.
Yeah, I don't know where the line is. You obviously have the ps games as a tool to do something. You also have the entire training camp, so you see a ton of stuff in practice. I expected them to be better on offense. But I doubt a couple of extra quarters in the preseason would have helped what happened today.
 

badboy

Hall of Fame
Both of these can be accomplished...It wasn't that long along where the pattern was starters play 1st quarter (game 1), 2 quarters (game 2), anywhere from mid 3rd quarter to game end (3rd game) and at least 1 or 2 series if not a half (game 4)...some of this time was lesser when and until the unit performed well.

The starters played the equal of two games or so, still leaving time for the developmental back-ups and those truly fighting for roster spots. t

Teams really aren't finding anything out about 8th WR, 5th Rb, 7th safety that they don't know already by playing them for 3 Quarters week four of pre-season.
Total exaggeration of what I said. I think this CBA set up what we see. We have many players that we have little info on both sides. Entire OL, TEs, Ervin, Ellington and Watson needed more snaps in preseason. We pretty much knew what we had with defense.
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
Wow some people act like the Texans has the brass to skip out on preseason games and etc. Like our offensive line been together for 3-5 years. So bleep the much needed reps in quest to build up chemistry. Forget the crucial reps a QB needs with his receivers, Tight ends and running backs. Bleep the most important fact of Watson only playing 6.5 games last season.

Hey it was only the New England Patriots. We can half ash prepare for them.
 

jshabang

Quality Backup!
When people say things like you did (bolded) you look silly or maybe you just don't look at facts. Yes Fuller was injured 2017 but in ten games he had 28 receptions for 423 yards a 15 yard avg and 7 TDs. He also returned 9 punts for 135 yards also a 15 yard avg which is huge. Two rushes for 9 yards isn't horrible for a speed WR. Fuller has to be out significant games or flop as WR this season to be a wasted pick.

I never said the kid couldn’t play..... I love him when he’s on the field and I clearly said he is the difference in this offense being high octane........ without him it’s gonna get ugly even with Deshaun and Hopkins........... but if the guy can’t stay on the field it concerns me....... he’s out from training camp fam....... he ain’t even got Live reps in a preaseaon game and he’s hurt from practice...... that’s starting scare me........ the guy couldn’t make it thru training camp without gettin hurt.....
 
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ArlingtonTexan

Moderator
Staff member
Total exaggeration of what I said. I think this CBA set up what we see. We have many players that we have little info on both sides. Entire OL, TEs, Ervin, Ellington and Watson needed more snaps in preseason. We pretty much knew what we had with defense.
Yes, the CBA has influenced this greatly, but if pre-season was about seeing players a team needed to see more of them in those 3 quarters of the 4th game we would have been watching the specific list of guys you mentioned, not players 45-90 on the 53 man roster for an entire football game. My point is not an exaggeration of what you said, but a statement of what is happening instead of what you want to have happened which was/is a good point as to which players needed more work.
 

JB

Old Curmudgeon
BOB F'ed up by not calling a timeout to check out the Gronk catch. That and the Watson fumble (That's not on Miller) cost them the game.

You cant make those kind of mistakes and win in Foxboro.

Good news is every team doesn't have BB/TB as HC/QB. The season has just begun.
Yeah, I know OB screwed the pooch multiple times (not just today), but for someone that spends their weekends on the coach to state that a man that gets paid millions a year has no knowledge is just laughable.
 

steelbtexan

Hall of Fame
Yeah, I know OB screwed the pooch multiple times (not just today), but for someone that spends their weekends on the coach to state that a man that gets paid millions a year has no knowledge is just laughable.
I agree with you.

I'm beginning to question BOB some.

But Watson had a bad game turning the ball over and the defense while holding it together certainly wasn't as dominate as I thought they would be.

Put all of this together and you get what we saw today. Good news is they aren't going to be playing the Pats again this season. The OL depth isn't good.
 

Speedy

Yeller Dweller
Yeah, I know OB screwed the pooch multiple times (not just today), but for someone that spends their weekends on the coach to state that a man that gets paid millions a year has no knowledge is just laughable.
Yeah, I guess you have to be knowledgeable to be able to collect time outs like they're Pokemon. Skilled too. You could even say it's an art form. Bill O'Brien, the artist.
 
Watson looked very uncomfortable today. For some reason, he made a conscience effort to not leave the pocket (until late in the game, when he actually started moving the offense a little).

My concern is the reason for this. It could be that -

1. OB told him to stay there, no matter what.
2. His knee is still bothering him somewhat.
3. He just doesn't have confidence in moving on the knee as he did before.

I saw every game of him in college. When he first returned after the ACL surgery in 2015, he looked ok, but it was obvious he was far more hesitant to use his legs than before the injury. I don't know if it was physical, or just a confidence deal. But he slowly returned to normal over the coarse of that season. He seemed to return to his normal self in 2016.

He has never been a run first qb, but he has always been more likely to run, or extend a play with his legs (to throw outside the pocket) in dire conditions, i.e., have to have a few yards for a first, game on the line.

And I saw that today late in the game.

He doesn't need to be a running qb, but he does need to be a mobile qb. A bootleg, or taking an open lane to leave a crashing pocket to roll out and buy time.

He is at his best in these dire situations.

So, whatever the reason he seemed to be locked up inside the pocket today, is not a good sign for him.

And he was misfiring pretty bad at times today.

This guy threw more TDs in his first 7 games than any qb in history. The Texans led the NFL in pts/game while he was the qb. It wasn't a fluke, defenses didn't catch on, and he didn't forget how to do it.

What's different is his knee, and maybe some orders from the coach. Maybe the coach had a good reason for tying him down today.

Again, last time he was not 100% mobile first game back. But he did seem to improve quickly. And too, it would not surprise me to see him not return to a full 100% until next season.

Whatever the case, I do believe he will improve on today's performance. But I am a bit concerned. Based on what I saw today, it could take some time.
 

TheMatrix31

Hall of Fame
Yeah, I know OB screwed the pooch multiple times (not just today), but for someone that spends their weekends on the coach to state that a man that gets paid millions a year has no knowledge is just laughable.
Wow, you really got him there.

Difference is, nobody's paying the guy on the couch millions of dollars a year to a supposed coaching guru only to repeatedly fail at coaching.

Nothing Bill O'Brien has ever shown me shows he possesses even a shred of football knowledge and nothing he's ever shown you should lead you to a different conclusion. And nothing in that clip that the person you were replying to was replying to shows anything otherwise.

If he possessed even a shred of football knowledge, we wouldn't be watching this perpetual failure from our couches on a week-to-week basis for now our fifth year.

He's a fraud.
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
Yeah, I know OB screwed the pooch multiple times (not just today), but for someone that spends their weekends on the coach to state that a man that gets paid millions a year has no knowledge is just laughable.
Whatever dude, its laughable that this coach continues to make the same got damn mistakes year in and year out. So hell yeah he acts like he doesn't know what the f he's doing.

Crazy but funny as hell how you and old buddy always come on here with this bullcrap.
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
Yeah, I know OB screwed the pooch multiple times (not just today), but for someone that spends their weekends on the coach to state that a man that gets paid millions a year has no knowledge is just laughable.
Whatever dude, its laughable that this coach continues to make the same got damn mistakes year in and year out. So hell yeah he acts like he doesn't know what the f he's doing.

Crazy but funny as hell how you and old buddy always come on here with this bullcrap.
 

steelbtexan

Hall of Fame
Whatever dude, its laughable that this coach continues to make the same got damn mistakes year in and year out. So hell yeah he acts like he doesn't know what the f he's doing.

Crazy but funny as hell how you and old buddy always come on here with this bullcrap.
I dont know who old buddy is, but BOB made one fatal mistake. (Not calling timeout.) Watson looked like a guy coming off an ACL. (Hesitant) and turned the ball over too many times, made bad decisions. The OL looked better (How could they not) but still below avg.

The defense was good, but not as good as they need to be. The KJo experiment looks like it's finally coming to an end. (Thanks Ricky)

What I blame BOB fr more than anything is his failure to play the starters more in the preseason so they would be ready for the regular season like BB did with the Pats.
 

xtruroyaltyx

Hall of Fame
The Texans could've played the starters for every damn pre-season snap and they'd have still come out and lost with the way OB coached that game and the way the OL pass blocked.

Like they get more reps and all of a sudden they come out like a fine tuned machine?

This team looked like it was in mid-season form.
 

steelbtexan

Hall of Fame
The Texans could've played the starters for every damn pre-season snap and they'd have still come out and lost with the way OB coached that game and the way the OL pass blocked.

Like they get more reps and all of a sudden they come out like a fine tuned machine?

This team looked like it was in mid-season form.
This is what the OL looks like when you sign a bunch of backups in FA to be your starters.
 

OptimisticTexan

Hall of Fame
I just got a notice from the nfl that the call from the NFL to review the Gronk catch came too late to the refs from the nfl......whole story written up on it on the nfl website and everything.

Still doesn’t change the fact that OB should’ve called a TO...but its becoming comical at this point how these “technical difficulties” always seem to happen at Gillette stadium..
.....or better yet, Bill O'Brien!!!
 

xtruroyaltyx

Hall of Fame
This is what the OL looks like when you sign a bunch of backups in FA to be your starters.
I agree. That was a mistake.

Too many unproven guys who are aiming to out-shoot their potential.

Some said it at the time but in hindsight Texans maybe should have overpaid for the mediocre Solder to keep their franchise QB a little bit safer.

Having Duane Brown around would also be nice.
 

Speedy

Yeller Dweller
I dont know who old buddy is, but BOB made one fatal mistake. (Not calling timeout.)
One fatal mistake? How about a game plan of having your super mobile QB with a craptastic o-line play 7 step drop for an entire half? Move the pocket around, make the line not look so bad, take advantage of your QBs skills? Nah, who needs that? Not only is OB horrible at clock management, going on 5 years now, he's a horrible game planner, going on 5 years now.
 

steelbtexan

Hall of Fame
One fatal mistake? How about a game plan of having your super mobile QB with a craptastic o-line play 7 step drop for an entire half? Move the pocket around, make the line not look so bad, take advantage of your QBs skills? Nah, who needs that? Not only is OB horrible at clock management, going on 5 years now, he's a horrible game planner, going on 5 years now.
I would be fine with that gameplan if it wasn't Watsons 1st game back coming off the ACL. Watson looked rusty/tentative to me. This isn't giving BOB a pass.

The OL while improved still continues to be an issue. Hopefully the Pats defense is just really good this yr and the other defenses they face wont be as tough as the Pats. Jags not withstanding.
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
Stop trying to blame Watson's injury from last season. And of course the pass protection looked bad. When you don't understand the value of preseason REPS for your entire first unit. Knowing damn well you have 4 new linemen and a rookie backup. On top of that you move Davenport on the right side (mind you he did not get any reps there) once Henderson went down. Yeah good job Obrien for setting your team up for success.
 

steelbtexan

Hall of Fame
Stop trying to blame Watson's injury from last season. And of course the pass protection looked bad. When you don't understand the value of preseason REPS for your entire first unit. Knowing damn well you have 4 new linemen and a rookie backup. On top of that you move Davenport on the right side (mind you he did not get any reps there) once Henderson went down. Yeah good job Obrien for setting your team up for success.
I'm not going to stop blaming Watson injury as a contributor to his poor play.

He looked great last yr until injury. Not so great yesterday and hopefully that's what contributed to his regression. If not there are bigger issues with Watson, happy feet, accuracy, bad decision making were issues with his play yesterday. People around here dont want to admit that even if healthy Watson was due for some regression from his record setting rookie pace.

In short he looked like the QB that I thought he would be coming out of college yesterday. Not terrible, but not great like he was last yr.

BOB could also help him by using more roll outs and things like that to help with the pressure he was getting from the OL's poor performance. Although the OL looked better yesterday than it did at any point last yr it still was well below avg. IMHO
 


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