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More Madness !

Texansphan

All Pro
Some of us believe the team hasn't been destroyed by the Nuk trade.

If they have been destroyed by losing any single player other than DW4 then there are far greater issues to discuss in regards to what's wrong with this team.
Agree, but when you have a diamond like Nuk, you have to find a way to keep them. He was DW4s go to guy and now has to develop a rapour with someone else. I expect that guy will be Cobb, but still needs time to develop.
Those top tier types of players are very hard to replace.
 

Double Barrel

Moderator / Admin
Staff member
Contributor's Club
The entirety of your post points to the defense. Much like 35-3, which is why there is a new DC on the staff
The last time I checked, defense was also considered a part of the team under the head coach's and general manager's overall responsibilities.

I get it, though: scapegoat time to protect King Billy. :king:

p.s. not pointing the finger at you, but just the overall vibe of giving this Marvin Lewis clone Bill Belichick power.
 

Hervoyel

BUENO!
It's a constant pattern of bad deals. That whole mess with Brock Osweiler and paying a fortune to be rid of him. ditching Duane Brown for next to nothing. Throwing away Jadeavon Clowney for next to nothing. Trading away a fortune for Laremy Tunsil. Throwing away DeAndre Hopkins for next to nothing. Not all GM's can consistently win in trades but the ones that never win aren't hard to spot. Bill O'Brien is a plain fraud as a GM and a cancer as the HC. Nobody comes here to stay. The pattern is and will remain that good free agents coming off injuries or down years will come to Houston, play a season, and parlay that into a better deal with a better team. Get excited about Honey Badger? He's gone in a flash. Think it's great that Jernigan signed here? He'll be gone next year no matter how he plays. I think it comes down to nobody wanting to play for this belligerent chump if they can do anything about it.
 

OptimisticTexan

Go Texans 4-3...Post OB!!!!!
So trading Nuk and Clowney' ruined the Texans org.

LMAO even you don't really believe this.
It might take 1 to 2 more seasons but when the dust settles, OB could be right up there Casserly and RS. This is a McNair's total ducking mess. They failed to emulate the old Redskins, Broncos and Patriots......may be time to build a Houston identity from the ground up.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
It might take 1 to 2 more seasons but when the dust settles, OB could be right up there Casserly and RS. This is a McNair's total ducking mess. They failed to emulate the old Redskins, Broncos and Patriots......may be time to build a Houston identity from the ground up.
Whoever they hire is going to be from another org and he's going to try to emulate what that org does.

It's been this way since the beginning of football.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
It's a constant pattern of bad deals. That whole mess with Brock Osweiler and paying a fortune to be rid of him. ditching Duane Brown for next to nothing. Throwing away Jadeavon Clowney for next to nothing. Trading away a fortune for Laremy Tunsil. Throwing away DeAndre Hopkins for next to nothing. Not all GM's can consistently win in trades but the ones that never win aren't hard to spot. Bill O'Brien is a plain fraud as a GM and a cancer as the HC. Nobody comes here to stay. The pattern is and will remain that good free agents coming off injuries or down years will come to Houston, play a season, and parlay that into a better deal with a better team. Get excited about Honey Badger? He's gone in a flash. Think it's great that Jernigan signed here? He'll be gone next year no matter how he plays. I think it comes down to nobody wanting to play for this belligerent chump if they can do anything about it.
And yet they will win between 9-11 games

I'm sure you didn't like the Cooks trade.

Roby says hi.
 

OptimisticTexan

Go Texans 4-3...Post OB!!!!!
Whoever they hire is going to be from another org and he's going to try to emulate what that org does.

It's been this way since the beginning of football.
You're correct.....the difference, the Texans in charge of emulating their former organizations were piss-poor at their craft. If I had my choices: Polian (Colts), Wolf / Highsmith (Packers / Browns) and Sweeney (Clemson).....it'd be hard to emulate any one system but nice to have one successful cagey veteran and a young group of talented/successful leaders.
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
Hurt again

There's a reason he's still a fa

But keep on lying to yourself.
He’s a FA by choice. Dude you really need to stop talking out your backside. The Seahawks offered him 18 per year. His dumb ash declined because he wants more. There a teams such as the Titans interested.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
He’s a FA by choice. Dude you really need to stop talking out your backside. The Seahawks offered him 18 per year. His dumb ash declined because he wants more. There a teams such as the Titans interested.
If they are interested they are the only one and at a reduced price.

But keep on telling yourself this.
 

mussop

Hall of Fame
Then the Texans owner "Cal" should fire him but that has proven to be difficult since other team personnel can't seem to get Cal out of his office. Seems they keep hearing his lame arse talking into the fan and saying, "I'm your father Luke". Since he's locked his door, no one can either confirm nor deny that action figures are involved in his role playing behind closed doors.
I wonder how many people actually got this reference.
 

Hervoyel

BUENO!
And yet they will win between 9-11 games

I'm sure you didn't like the Cooks trade.

Roby says hi.
I’d have preferred to keep Hopkins and the pick we wasted on Cooks but that’s just me. Had maybe the best WR in the game and then the HC couldn’t get along with him and “poof!” Gone. Every time O’Brien butts heads with someone the Texans lose assets and players but as long as he can Marvin Lewis the thing he keeps enough people happy to stay the course. You may get your 9-11 wins but you’re in for endless disappointment in the postseason. Why would you be for that? What’s the point in that?

He’s a .500 coach with a personality disorder and anger management issues. This can’t go on forever. Eventually he’s going to run out of draft picks to waste.
 

Lucky

A Beautiful Day in the Neighborhood
Staff member
...giving this Marvin Lewis clone Bill Belichick power.
To be fair to Marvin Lewis, he was a nice guy put in a bad situation. No scouting department to speak of. A historically cheap owner. And constantly being dealt bad characters by manangement. Still, Lewis kept that franchise's head above water. Had Lewis had more power, it's not a stretch that he would have had even more success.

Bill O'Brien, you're no Marvin Lewis. Not as a coach. Or as a man.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
I’d have preferred to keep Hopkins and the pick we wasted on Cooks but that’s just me. Had maybe the best WR in the game and then the HC couldn’t get along with him and “poof!” Gone. Every time O’Brien butts heads with someone the Texans lose assets and players but as long as he can Marvin Lewis the thing he keeps enough people happy to stay the course. You may get your 9-11 wins but you’re in for endless disappointment in the postseason. Why would you be for that? What’s the point in that?

He’s a .500 coach with a personality disorder and anger management issues. This can’t go on forever. Eventually he’s going to run out of draft picks to waste.
The WR Corps is better with Cooks/WFV/Cobb/Stills IMHO and they aren't under real long term contracts like Nuk would be which should give them more cap flexibility in the future.

One things for sure, the Texans have one fastest WR corps in the NFL and DW4's deep throws are going to have to improve.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
To be fair to Marvin Lewis, he was a nice guy put in a bad situation. No scouting department to speak of. A historically cheap owner. And constantly being dealt bad characters by manangement. Still, Lewis kept that franchise's head above water. Had Lewis had more power, it's not a stretch that he would have had even more success.

Bill O'Brien, you're no Marvin Lewis. Not as a coach. Or as a man.
LMAO

You've met BOB

Is this the real reason you dislike BOB?
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
and then get smoked in the playoffs because when OB goes against good proven head coaches we all know what happens.
The better team with better QB play has won each of those playoff losses. I'm interested in seeing if the changes BOB has made in his FIRST season of calling the shots is successful.

Surely after seeing what BOB's doing (Whether you agree with him or not) is a sign that he wasn't the last voice calling the shots while RS/Gaine were GM's.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
Yeah that’s right you know better than everyone else.
Facts are facts

Not only is Clowney not been signed in FA but his price is dropping daily.

Bury your head in the sand and make all of the excuses you want. But those are the facts and this isn't about ME or what I think. This is about what GM's think and they're speaking loudly.
 

mussop

Hall of Fame
Facts are facts

Not only is Clowney not been signed in FA but his price is dropping daily.

Bury your head in the sand and make all of the excuses you want. But those are the facts and this isn't about ME or what I think. This is about what GM's think and they're speaking loudly.
Lol hes Asking to be one of the highest paid players in the league. Of course his price is going to come down. There’s not a lot of contending teams out there with that kind of available cap space that need a hybrid end/LB. he’s still going to get a HUGE contract. He still was a difference maker even if the stats didn’t reflect it. Clowney is never going to be sack specialist thats not his game but he is going to make a shitload of money and be a difference maker Wherever he ends up.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
Lol hes Asking to be one of the highest paid players in the league. Of course his price is going to come down. There’s not a lot of contending teams out there with that kind of available cap space that need a hybrid end/LB. he’s still going to get a HUGE contract. He still was a difference maker even if the stats didn’t reflect it. Clowney is never going to be sack specialist thats not his game but he is going to make a shitload of money and be a difference maker Wherever he ends up.
Of course he will make alot of $$$$, probably just above avg on a 1 yr prove it deal. He's not a bad player, he's just not a top of the line guy and with his injury history nobody's going to pay him anything without a physical. By then most if not all teams will have spent there $$$$ allotment.

Clowney being a FA at COVID-19 times was a worse case scenario for Clowney's FA status. IMHO
 

zshawn10

All Pro
The Athletic’s Aaron Reiss pegs Texans third-year WR Keke Coutee as a "candidate to land elsewhere" this offseason.
Coutee has largely fallen out of favor under coach Bill O’Brien. The former fourth-rounder has missed time with soft-tissue injuries and was healthy-scratched at times down the stretch last season. Houston then went out and signed Randall Cobb to take over slot duties, essentially eliminating Coutee from the lineup. At 5’11/180, that’s where Coutee lines up. Coutee has flashed at times in the NFL, but he needs a change of scenery. He could likely be had for a conditional late-round pick.

The Athletic’s Aaron Reiss believes Kenny Stills is the likely "odd man out" among Texans wideouts.
The Texans signed Randall Cobb and traded the No. 57 overall pick in this year’s draft for Brandin Cooks, joining them with Will Fuller to be Houston’s new three-wide set following the trade of DeAndre Hopkins. Stills is entering the final year of his contract with a $7 million cap number, all of which can be cleared with a release or trade. Houston likely would have been better off just not signing Cobb and keeping Stills, but they’re here now. Trading Stills would likely only net a late-rounder. He turns 28 next week.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
Coutee is a guy that they trade for a RB that's going to be cut at the end of TC like they did with Hyde last year.
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
so much for the Madden 4 Verticals offense some guys were dreaming of LOL.
Are they Moving Stills?

With WFV/Cooks they can still run a vertical offense

BTW, I hope they don't trade Stills.

I could see Coutee rejoining Welker
 

steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
Agree, but when you have a diamond like Nuk, you have to find a way to keep them. He was DW4s go to guy and now has to develop a rapour with someone else. I expect that guy will be Cobb, but still needs time to develop.
Those top tier types of players are very hard to replace.
I would say their rapour was too good
with Nuk getting 1/2 of the wr targets.
 

FuzzyLogic

Mathematically Possible
This is like a 'fish' story - every time it's told the fish they caught gets bigger and Bigger and BIGGER...

Watson attempted 495 passes in 2019
Hopkins was targeted 150 times in 2019

Somehow 150 of 495 = 50%? That's barely over 30% by the way which is on track for almost anyone's #1 receiver (including Montana and Rice).

You can't compare DW's completions to Hopkins targets (333 to 150), that isn't a fair comparison - and if you use completions 333 to catches 104 you are right back to 31%.

I swear in a week I'll check and the message will be - 'Nuk was getting targetted 85% of the time"
 

Earl34

All Pro
This is like a 'fish' story - every time it's told the fish they caught gets bigger and Bigger and BIGGER...

Watson attempted 495 passes in 2019
Hopkins was targeted 150 times in 2019

Somehow 150 of 495 = 50%? That's barely over 30% by the way which is on track for almost anyone's #1 receiver (including Montana and Rice).

You can't compare DW's completions to Hopkins targets (333 to 150), that isn't a fair comparison - and if you use completions 333 to catches 104 you are right back to 31%.

I swear in a week I'll check and the message will be - 'Nuk was getting targetted 85% of the time"
The stat is being misinterpreted because it ignores the fact that there are other eligible receivers besides Hopkins (150), Fuller (71), Stills (55), Coutee(36) and Carter(9) that are being targeted.

For example, Duke (62), Akins (55), Fells (48), Hyde (16), Carter(14), Mitchell (6) and Thomas (3) were also targeted.

Technically, if you look at the targets, I was surprised by Duke's numbers. It also reflects a QB spreading the ball around and using his RBs and TEs as much as the 2nd and 3rd WR. But that doesn't fit the narrative. It's much easier just bouncing from thread to thread repeating the misinterpreted stat without any context.
 
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Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
The stat is being misinterpreted because it ignores the fact that there are other eligible receivers besides Hopkins (150), Fuller (71), Stills (55), Coutee(36) and Carter(9) that are being targeted.

For example, Duke (62), Akins (55), Fells (48), Hyde (16), Carter(14), Mitchell (6) and Thomas (3) were also targeted.

Technically, if you look at the targets, I was surprised by Duke's numbers. It also reflects a QB spreading the ball around and using his RBs and TEs as much as the 2nd and 3rd WR. But that doesn't fit the narrative. It's much easier just bouncing from thread to thread repeating the misinterpreted stat without any context.
Well I stand corrected, they did utilize the RBs and TEs a lot. 106 to the Tight ends and 88 to the running backs is a fair amount of targets.
 

Earl34

All Pro
Well I stand corrected, they did utilize the RBs and TEs a lot. 106 to the Tight ends and 88 to the running backs is a fair amount of targets.
Considering there were years when Alfred Blue had as many receptions as the leading TE, I was surprised by the target distribution. When you think about it, Fuller and Stills were injured and missed games. They also played at least 2-3 games at less than 100%. So, when they were limited, those targets went to the TEs and RBs.

That's why blindly repeating Hopkins got the majority of the targets to the WRs without considering the targets to the RBs and TEs is so misleading.
 
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steelbtexan

King of the W. B. Club
Contributor's Club
This is like a 'fish' story - every time it's told the fish they caught gets bigger and Bigger and BIGGER...

Watson attempted 495 passes in 2019
Hopkins was targeted 150 times in 2019

Somehow 150 of 495 = 50%? That's barely over 30% by the way which is on track for almost anyone's #1 receiver (including Montana and Rice).

You can't compare DW's completions to Hopkins targets (333 to 150), that isn't a fair comparison - and if you use completions 333 to catches 104 you are right back to 31%.

I swear in a week I'll check and the message will be - 'Nuk was getting targetted 85% of the time"
According to a stat CnD posted DW4 threw the ball to the WR's 333 times. 150 of those were to Nuk.
 


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