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Marlon Greenwood Signed!
- Thread starter Bayern
- Start date
Reddevil63
Veteran
Considering the state of their team, I wouldnt put to much weight on what they say 
MikeMc said:
I don't think Greenwood was picked up to be an immediate starter. He is a little too undersized right now to be and outside or inside linebacker. He is a coverage linebacker. He has tremendous upside though. Right now we'll probably see him in 3rd down situations, nickel, 3-3-5, and maybe dime packages. But we must not forget the clever defensive mind of Dom Capers. In the playoffs the Patriots started using a lot of defensive formations that the Texans used this year and last year. Picture this its, 3rd and long and the Texans come on the field with Sharper, Greenwood, Peek, Babin, Wong, Foreman, and Polk. Who's coming and who's dropping in coverage? If I'm an offensive lineman I sure would be confused with 0 D-lineman and 7 linebackers all showing blitz. It's schemes like this that make me think this pickup was a good one. For the starters I would say OLB Peek/Babin ILB Wong/Sharper. But I wouldn't be suprised if they go after Derrick Johnson in the draft and throw him in the rotation also.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
ginessey said:
He is the same size as our starting ILB for the last three years that he will be replacing--Foreman. And the texans didn't pay that kind of money for a situational LB.
FYI from the Texans roster:
Greenwood 238 lbs
Anderson 243 lbs (and 4" taller)
Foreman 240 lbs
Polk 242 lbs
Sharper 240 lbs
Here Here infantrycak!
With a $7mil signing bonus and avg of $4mil a year, he better play all special teams, start at ILB and be the holder on FGs & PATs!
Not start??? Hell, there are several LBs in FA that would kill to have that signing bonus & contract...all of them are projected starters!
He is also rated as the #31 FA this season and #5 LB. At 26 and only 4 years in the league, I'd say he is the ILB of the future!! He is just starting to show what he can do. Here are his tackles thus far:
2001- 70
2002- 70
2003- 85
2004- 133
With a $7mil signing bonus and avg of $4mil a year, he better play all special teams, start at ILB and be the holder on FGs & PATs!
Not start??? Hell, there are several LBs in FA that would kill to have that signing bonus & contract...all of them are projected starters!
He is also rated as the #31 FA this season and #5 LB. At 26 and only 4 years in the league, I'd say he is the ILB of the future!! He is just starting to show what he can do. Here are his tackles thus far:
2001- 70
2002- 70
2003- 85
2004- 133
S
SESupergenius
Guest
Here's what the Dophins fans have to say:
Huh?
Greenwood has'nt made a meaningful play in four years. Yes he made some tackles when Zach got hurt but in our system a traffic cone would get some tackles...it is about PLAYS...and Morlon has'nt made one in four years.
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He's a very solid player. I don't know if I'd say "playmaker". But I'll be interested in seeing what he can do in a more aggressive scheme (such as Houston's 3-4).
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MG is indeed a sold LB who I believe will improve over the next few years as he is still young, but when you look up Playmaker in the dictionary your def not going to find a picture of Morlon Greenwood
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It's funny how his named is never heard in a game.
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Kinda boring wasn't he...at least he wasn't a big penalty maker..
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If Morlon Greenwood was so solid ..... Can anyone name or place one big play he made over the last four years?? Like turnover,cause a fumble or big sack or INT!! You can't because in 4 years he never had an INT, a fumble recovery,forced fumble!! I mean we are talking about linebacker and four years!! NO BIG TIME PLAYS IN 4 YEARS!! NOTTA!!The price we paid for this clown rapper was way too much! He was a bust! I mean you sometimes luck out and even cause a turnover or even recover a fumble,especially at linebacker.Morlon had ZERO in four years!He's a ZERO! Trust me, The Texans did us a huge favor!
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Greenwood was the same way here at Syracuse...tons of athletic ability, but he never made any plays here either. When we drafted MG, I was still giving Wanny the benefit of the doubt, but it seriously made me question why we gave up a 2nd round pick the next year for a guy who never made any plays in college.
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He's a solid starter, but nothing special. Texans definitly overpaid. I don't see how he fits into the 3-4 either.
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the texans problem with there D is there so slow in the linebacker area...jamie sharper is fast but everyone else is slow...jason babin is fast and so is morlon greenwood...will help them more than it did us
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Texans need an inside linebacker more than anything, not sure why they went for Greenwood
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Their GM must be asking Ricky for advice. Morlon Greenwood is an ok player, they're paying him like if he was a game changer. They're on crack, they overpaid big time.
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I still don't get it. He doesn't fit their scheme at all. They should have at least looked at Ed Hartwell or Kendrell Bell. I would be pissed if I was a Texans fan.
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alot are saying it was a great signing because of his upside, and because he can play both outside and inside(not my words from the Texans message board on nfl.com) I'm cotemplating registering and telling them that in the course of 1 month, Moore, Pope, AND Ayo made more meaningful plays than Morlon did in 4 years here.[
Huh?
Greenwood has'nt made a meaningful play in four years. Yes he made some tackles when Zach got hurt but in our system a traffic cone would get some tackles...it is about PLAYS...and Morlon has'nt made one in four years.
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He's a very solid player. I don't know if I'd say "playmaker". But I'll be interested in seeing what he can do in a more aggressive scheme (such as Houston's 3-4).
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MG is indeed a sold LB who I believe will improve over the next few years as he is still young, but when you look up Playmaker in the dictionary your def not going to find a picture of Morlon Greenwood
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It's funny how his named is never heard in a game.
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Kinda boring wasn't he...at least he wasn't a big penalty maker..
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If Morlon Greenwood was so solid ..... Can anyone name or place one big play he made over the last four years?? Like turnover,cause a fumble or big sack or INT!! You can't because in 4 years he never had an INT, a fumble recovery,forced fumble!! I mean we are talking about linebacker and four years!! NO BIG TIME PLAYS IN 4 YEARS!! NOTTA!!The price we paid for this clown rapper was way too much! He was a bust! I mean you sometimes luck out and even cause a turnover or even recover a fumble,especially at linebacker.Morlon had ZERO in four years!He's a ZERO! Trust me, The Texans did us a huge favor!
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Greenwood was the same way here at Syracuse...tons of athletic ability, but he never made any plays here either. When we drafted MG, I was still giving Wanny the benefit of the doubt, but it seriously made me question why we gave up a 2nd round pick the next year for a guy who never made any plays in college.
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He's a solid starter, but nothing special. Texans definitly overpaid. I don't see how he fits into the 3-4 either.
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the texans problem with there D is there so slow in the linebacker area...jamie sharper is fast but everyone else is slow...jason babin is fast and so is morlon greenwood...will help them more than it did us
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Texans need an inside linebacker more than anything, not sure why they went for Greenwood
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Their GM must be asking Ricky for advice. Morlon Greenwood is an ok player, they're paying him like if he was a game changer. They're on crack, they overpaid big time.
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I still don't get it. He doesn't fit their scheme at all. They should have at least looked at Ed Hartwell or Kendrell Bell. I would be pissed if I was a Texans fan.
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alot are saying it was a great signing because of his upside, and because he can play both outside and inside(not my words from the Texans message board on nfl.com) I'm cotemplating registering and telling them that in the course of 1 month, Moore, Pope, AND Ayo made more meaningful plays than Morlon did in 4 years here.[
*shrug*.. has he ever played in a 3-4? as an ILB? its completely different. if he has the coverage skills and tackling ability that he is supposed to have.. he could be really good for us.
Im going to trust Casserly on this one.. and we have 3 years to decide if we want him or not before his contract really makes a difference.
Im going to trust Casserly on this one.. and we have 3 years to decide if we want him or not before his contract really makes a difference.
Hell, making tackles and stopping big plays (gains of 20+ yards) is just the same as getting a FF,FR or INT. It is part of the game. The Texans "other" LBs have lacked fundamentals....if Greenwood can get the job done w/o the flash (i.e. tackle) then I'm all over that.
Hell, Matt Stevens would of needed a 15 INT season to compensate for all of his missed tackles! Too many people only care about the "flashy" play, HomeRuns & TOs, but the real playmakers make the "simple" plays!
Hell, Matt Stevens would of needed a 15 INT season to compensate for all of his missed tackles! Too many people only care about the "flashy" play, HomeRuns & TOs, but the real playmakers make the "simple" plays!
TexanExile
A New Hope
This guy is a joke. As someone who lives in Miami and watches the Dolphins as my "second" team, I can assure you he's never been part of a big play in his entire career. If memory serves, his career stats include the following highlights:
No sacks EVER
No forced fumbles EVER
No INTs EVER
And only a significant number of tackles 1 of 4 years. Even with a GREAT DL and GREAT secondary in Miami, he was still invisible. The sports media here was crucifying the Texans yesterday for this move and I totally agree.
No sacks EVER
No forced fumbles EVER
No INTs EVER
And only a significant number of tackles 1 of 4 years. Even with a GREAT DL and GREAT secondary in Miami, he was still invisible. The sports media here was crucifying the Texans yesterday for this move and I totally agree.
Vinny
shiny happy fan
Sporting news radio said that the sportingnews him ranked very high as I was listening to their broadcast this last night. They were praising the move and said he had a rating with up with Claiborne and Gold (couple of pretty good linebackers). They had him rated at 7.something on their rating scale, and that rating figure was fairly high from what Kevin Wheeler was relaying. Juinor Seau's best sack year in the last 7 years is 3.5 The Dolphins do not ask their linebackers to sack the quarterback (the DE's do in a 4-3). Run and chase is what they wanted out of Greenwood. btw, Greenwood was the second leading tackler last year on a pretty good defense. Only Zach Thomas had more tackles.
Looks like the other higher rated LB's were asking for the moon.
http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/3437464
Looks like the other higher rated LB's were asking for the moon.
http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/3437464
ccdude730
Veteran
wow, 10 million to sign and 6 mil avg is alot - sorry ed, too rich for our 'battle red' blood
contrary to dolphins and other people unassociated with the texan org i believe he was a good pickup and hope him and _______ (whoever he will be playing with at ILB) become a strong point for our defense.
contrary to dolphins and other people unassociated with the texan org i believe he was a good pickup and hope him and _______ (whoever he will be playing with at ILB) become a strong point for our defense.
S
SESupergenius
Guest
But is this really an upgrade to Foreman??
cadahnic
Rookie
This is a dumbass move by the Texans. I mean they have the opportunity to grab Derrick Johnson in the draft and the money they spent on Greenwood could have went to Kareem McKenzie the offensive tackle that we desperately need. He can also play guard. Greenwood is small and rangy, but he cannot get away from a block and in four years as a starter only last year did he finally get over 100 tackles. A terrible move and a complete reach by the Texans that is the worst move since drafting Babin instead of a big time saftey or OL.
Reddevil63
Veteran
Your right, ship em outta here. They obviously dont know what they are doing so LA can have its franchise!!!! *note blatant sarcasm*cadahnic said:
Dude, these people get paid lots of money to make these decisions and Im willing to bet they know more than you do on the subject. Let it play out before we start calling it a bad move.
WildBlackBear32
Rookie
Vinny said:
Come on...dose of reality time...you got 3-4 people here who get to watch Miami games all the time(myself included), telling you he's not worth it. You got a group of Fins fans on another BB, telling you he's not worth it.Most of the time when a team loses a good-great player, the fans will say "MANAGEMENT!!!!
", I'm seeing none of this.All those Miami fans have only said that Greenwood is not a playmaker. But the reality is that none of the Miami linebackers are statistically dominant playmakers because the Miami system doesn't ask them to be. Miami asks their LB core to stop the run and tackle. Greenwood did that.WildBlackBear32 said:Come on...dose of reality time...you got 3-4 people here who get to watch Miami games all the time(myself included), telling you he's not worth it. You got a group of Fins fans on another BB, telling you he's not worth it.Most of the time when a team loses a good-great player, the fans will say "MANAGEMENT!!!!
Greenwood brings speed and coverage to the ILB, something that has been missing at the LB position. The guy is a solid tackler, has pursuit speed and can cover. That alone makes him an upgrade over Foreman. On top of that, in Capers scheme, just being fast will make him a legit blitz threat from the inside. So where is the complaint? Let's not be too hasty. Let's just see what else happens this off season. Given the draft, there is ample opportunity to further upgrade the LB core at both/either the inside or the outside.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
cadahnic said:
Horrible move--while we're at it, what were the pro-bowl people thinking. The pro-bowl OLB's this year only had 107, 101, 96, 62, 60 & 53 tackles--bunch of worthless hacks.
Psst--Morlon Greenwood 108 tackles.
WildBlackBear32
Rookie
infantrycak said:
How silly that you left Derrick Brooks off that list...
Pssssst the Pro Bowl OLBs also had 3 Sacks, 5 INTs, 4 FFs and 17 PDs(Spikes)... 10.5 Sacks and 1 FF(Suggs)...7 Sacks, 3 FFs, 12 PDs and 1 INT(Porter)...2.5 Sacks, 2 FF, 3 INTs(Brooking)...I could continue...but the trend is rather obvious...
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
WildBlackBear32 said:
Listed the top 3 from each conference.
Psst, can you say 3-4 vs. 4-3? Can you say $7 mil per year instead of $4 mil. Wasn't saying Greenwood was as good as those guys, just that saying he didn't have enough tackles is dumb. Care to seriously argue that point? Try reading the quote above a post and it will give you a lot better idea on the point being responded to.
cadahnic
Rookie
By the way Dude I have been doing scouting for years, and I get paid a good wage for it. I am just a big fan of the Texans because I am from Houston and played ball at A&M. I want to see them make smart moves not pass on good players and reach on bad ones. I also have waited years for the Houston to get a team and I am dont want to wait and listen to piss ant excuses about why they did not make the playoffs. We are getting rid or restructuring alot of contracts next year so we need to win now.
Zach Thomas, arguably the Fins best LB and perrenial Pro-Bowl player, has not had the "playmaker" numbers that people are saying Greenwood lacks as well.
Zach career numbers (9 seasons/ 133 games):
Sacks: 13.5
FF: 10
FR: 6
INT: 15
Tackles: 1259
Seems to me that either the Dolphins' defensive scheme is centered around LBs making tackles, not "plays", or that Zach is a "tackles-only" kind of LB!
What do you think??
Contrast that with the other highly touted Defensive player on the Dolphins:
Jason Taylor:
(8 seasons/ 124 games)
Sacks: 80.5
FF: 22
FR: 19
INT: 4
Tackles: 461 (342 solo)
And for the size issue, Morlon has 1 inch on Zach and about 8 pounds!!
Zach career numbers (9 seasons/ 133 games):
Sacks: 13.5
FF: 10
FR: 6
INT: 15
Tackles: 1259
Seems to me that either the Dolphins' defensive scheme is centered around LBs making tackles, not "plays", or that Zach is a "tackles-only" kind of LB!
What do you think??
Contrast that with the other highly touted Defensive player on the Dolphins:
Jason Taylor:
(8 seasons/ 124 games)
Sacks: 80.5
FF: 22
FR: 19
INT: 4
Tackles: 461 (342 solo)
And for the size issue, Morlon has 1 inch on Zach and about 8 pounds!!
WildBlackBear32
Rookie
infantrycak said:
Yes, I can say 3-4 vs 4-3, because we are moving a 4-3 linebacker into a 3-4 system. Wanna know something about the majority of those Pro Bowlers?? They also played in 4-3 systems...so if they were able to force turnovers or get sacks, why couldnt Greenwood??
7 mill??? Suggs is going to make a base salary of 380k next year. 3.2 mil for Brooking. That Porter guy?? 3.5 Mil. The only LBs who made the Pro Bowl making more than 4 mil are Spikes and Brooks...
Big freaking deal. So what, the internet scouts can't agree on the value of this move. I don't even think the real NFL team scouts would share a unified opinion. What we know for sure is that the Texans scouts and staff obviously like Greenwood. Since I don't much more about the guy than what I know from NFL2K5, I'll just trust the Texans on this one.cadahnic said:
Here's some reality about free agency: you always overpay. Casserly has repeatedly said it. That is why the Texans try not to break the bank for the (fan) consensus top guys and tend to focus on the draft. This team is in no position to mortgage its future cap space just to win now. Look at NE. They usually don't make exciting offseason moves or throw crazy money at big name players. They usually puzzle people by signing seemingly average and obscure guys. But they win. That is what the Texans are doing. Getting players who fit their team best so they can win.
By the way, ILBs in a 3-4 are looked upon to shore up the run defense first, cover second, make plays third. Athletic/fast LBs succeed in the 3-4 D, so maybe the Texans brass wanted a LB that fits their system, not one that has looked good on paper.....besides, those Pro-Bowl players you mention:
Spikes, Suggs, Porter, and Brooking...they all play OLB! Porter & Suggs play OLB in a 3-4!
As for the ILBs from the Pro-Bowl:
AFC:
Lewis - 147 tkls, 1 sack, 1 FF, 0 INT
Farrior - 95 tkls, 3 sacks, 3 FF, 4 INTs
Bruschi - 120 tkls, 4 sacks, 2 FF, 3 INTs
NFC:
Dan Morgan - 102 tkls, 2 sacks, 1 FF, 2 INTs
Trotter - 61 tkls, 1 sack, 0 FF, 0 Int
So then Farrior is the stud in the bunch: Greenwood would be between Lewis and Trotter! According to numbers.
Spikes, Suggs, Porter, and Brooking...they all play OLB! Porter & Suggs play OLB in a 3-4!
As for the ILBs from the Pro-Bowl:
AFC:
Lewis - 147 tkls, 1 sack, 1 FF, 0 INT
Farrior - 95 tkls, 3 sacks, 3 FF, 4 INTs
Bruschi - 120 tkls, 4 sacks, 2 FF, 3 INTs
NFC:
Dan Morgan - 102 tkls, 2 sacks, 1 FF, 2 INTs
Trotter - 61 tkls, 1 sack, 0 FF, 0 Int
So then Farrior is the stud in the bunch: Greenwood would be between Lewis and Trotter! According to numbers.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
WildBlackBear32 said:
Funny of the 4 you mentioned, 2 (those with the highest sack totals) play in 3-4 defenses. Ya think, maybe it was because Greenwood played behind Jason Taylor and the system wasn't set up for him to get the sacks (Miami's OLB's combined for 1 sack last year and the team was still a top defense)?
We aren't talking about acquiring those guys as draft choices so their cap numbers are reasonable, we are talking about free agent value. Edgerton Hartwell is asking $6 mil/yr. So call it $6+ for those guys as free agents.
Not all 4-3s are the same. You know that. Were those backs in a 4-3 zone blitz scheme (similar to a 3-4 zone scheme)? Were they cover-2 guys? What were they asked to do? Those questions matter. Greenwood was asked to tackle and be a run-stopper. Miami depended upon their D-line for sacks and their excellent secondary for pass defense. The LBs were dedicated run-stoppers. The stats for the Miami defense bear that out.WildBlackBear32 said:
FYI, Sharper, despite starting all 16 games each season, never got over 100 tackles until his 5th year in the league. He only has 2 career interceptions and his sack numbers have been in decline since he became a Texan.
WildBlackBear32
Rookie
infantrycak said:
Brooking played a 4-3, had some sacks and INTs. Spikes played a 4-3 and had 5 INTs. Both those guys had good Dlines and still made plays.
If 2+ million dollars will add 10 takeaways and a pro-bowler to our defense...I'm in.
WildBlackBear32
Rookie
MojoX said:
Atlanta and Buffalo ran the same type of system..
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
WildBlackBear32 said:
Mojo hit the nail on the head and you can't sign FA pro-bowlers to every position. You try to draft your pro-bowlers and fill in needs with solid FA's. There just isn't enough cap to sign Kendrell Bell, Orlando Pace, Plaxico Burress and keep the guys you are growing like AJ & Dunta.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
bckey said:
He is refering to the Sharper's first 5 seasons in the league while he was with the Ravens.
The question is whether those linebackers were depended on to perform the same duties as Miami's linebackers. Stop skirting the issue just to be argumentative. Bottomline is that none of us know what Greenwood can do beyond what Miami's coaches asked him to do.WildBlackBear32 said:
I've know idea what point you were trying to make, so I checked the LB stats for both Atlanta and Buffalo. Lets just say I wasn't impressed.
WildBlackBear32
Rookie
MojoX said:
Which is why I said, YES, BUFFALO AND ATLANTA RAN THE SAME TYPE OF 4-3.I dont know what's so hard about that... Both teams had solid DLines and used the DBs for pass coverage and used the LBs for run stopping, yet both Brooking and Spikes still made plays.
To your second point...hey, if you'll take a guy with 10 or so more tackles and 10 fewer takeaways/sacks, that's your call....I'm willing to be the even casual football fan would choose otherwise.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
bckey said:
Well gee, sorry don't go all caps on me. If you are talking about his INT and sack numbers going down it is because he moved from OLB to ILB primarily. That is also why his tackle numbers went up dramatically when he got here.
Complete sentences help.WildBlackBear32 said:
But did they do it like Miami? That is the issue here. And it isn't a matter of getting 10+ tackles for -10 takeaways/sacks. So stop exaggerating. Not one linebacker on either team had more than 3.5 sacks. The only outstanding "playmaker" was Spikes with 3 sacks and 5 ints. The rest of the linebackers on either team had under 3 sacks.
My point is the same: even those teams didn't run the scheme like Miami did. Heck, I wouldn't expect the LB that plays behind Jason Taylor to rack up the sacks. You have to compare Greenwood's performance to what he was asked to do. You can't get a sack if the coaches don't blitz you. It is just that simple.
At the very least, Greenwood is an upgrade over Foreman who had no sacks, no ints, and only 79 tackles.
This is what I am trying to demonstrate here. All this stat and playmaker stuff is too one-dimensional. Sharper has been a great defender. To understand his play, you have to understand more about the role he played and the team he was on. Sharper didn't become a worse blitzer. Our Dline was weak. Sharper didn't become a better tackler. His role in the D was to be the primary run stopper. Looking at stats alone one could argue that Sharper is a playmaker in severe decline, but it may not be that simple.infantrycak said:
Its a similar thing with Greenwood. We gotta measure is production in terms of his role as much as we can. I am sure the Texans have done that.
titan hater
Waterboy
MArlon at LIL.
Wong at RIL.
Babin at ROL.
Peek at LOL.
Marlon is fast and can cover. Can any of you remember the SD game. Thier TE killed us. In fact our D made most Opossinf TE look like Pro-bowler.
Speed kills! Although, Peek does get some stupid penalties he still has a tremendous upside. Every time he was in the game he caused the other guys QB to have to move a some. I truley beleive he is the real deal.
Wong is OK on the outside, but he is built like a prototyoical IL. If SHaper goes somewhere else Wong can do the job!
Babin was learning a new position last year. This year he will improve 5 fold!!
I am excited over this signing. It will be even better if we can get a 2nd rounder for Sharper...
Wong at RIL.
Babin at ROL.
Peek at LOL.
Marlon is fast and can cover. Can any of you remember the SD game. Thier TE killed us. In fact our D made most Opossinf TE look like Pro-bowler.
Speed kills! Although, Peek does get some stupid penalties he still has a tremendous upside. Every time he was in the game he caused the other guys QB to have to move a some. I truley beleive he is the real deal.
Wong is OK on the outside, but he is built like a prototyoical IL. If SHaper goes somewhere else Wong can do the job!
Babin was learning a new position last year. This year he will improve 5 fold!!
I am excited over this signing. It will be even better if we can get a 2nd rounder for Sharper...
WildBlackBear32
Rookie
MojoX said:
And are 29 tackles worth 5 years for 22 mil?? Fact of the matter is, Greenwood's production will more than likely go DOWN with Sharper next to him. The only numbers with the probability of going up are his INTs, because if you watched him with Miami the last couple years, he is not a pass rusher because YES, he was asked to blitz on occasion.
I disagree. I think the tackle numbers go up or stay the same (near 100) while Sharpers come down a bit. ILBs in the 3-4 are runstoppers. I am sure Sharper will be happy to have a sure tackler with pursuit speed next to him. Greenwood brings more than 29+ tackles. Don't underestimate his speed and coverage ability. Capers said it as plain as day that Greenwood's attributes will allow the team to further develop the scheme and do things they couldn't do before. Beyond stats, the Texans needed players who would let them unleash the playbook. At the very least, I think this means Sharper (if he stays) will get to blitz more. This signing is about scheme more than it is about stats.WildBlackBear32 said:
There is a difference between blitzing on occassion and having blitzing duties well schemed into your role. If Payne is healthy and playing up to his ability, a fast ILB is gonna have an easy path to the QB (assuming Peek and Babin are playing well). But we'll just have to wait and see how this all plays out.
Remember, you always overpay for FAs. Especially young, promising ones. That's just how the NFL works. As long as his contract doesn't destroy the Texans' cap, then no worries.
michaelm
vox nihili
This issue seems to be blown a bit out of proportion to me.
I can't find it now, but I read on these boards where someone figured Greenwood's 2005 cap hit to be in the (I believe) $2.5 mil range.
If that's the case, it ONLY cost us that much to either have him replace Foreman in the line up, which is a pretty good improvement IMO;
or
Repalce Wong, and have Wong move inside to replace Foreman, which is also an improvement (again IMO).
I don't know (and probably none of you do either) the exact details of the contract, but it seems to me that if he doesn't show the produtivity that management expects, he can be unloaded before the big part of the contract kicks in.
2.5mil for a starting OLB (assumed outside) seems to be a pretty fair deal if you ask me.
This is an improvement to me. Not the free agent splash that many of you had hoped for, but the quality of the D has gone up. The level of improvement is all that remains to be seen.
And as said many times, doesn't risk future negotiations with Lucifer regarding salary cap issues!
I can't find it now, but I read on these boards where someone figured Greenwood's 2005 cap hit to be in the (I believe) $2.5 mil range.
If that's the case, it ONLY cost us that much to either have him replace Foreman in the line up, which is a pretty good improvement IMO;
or
Repalce Wong, and have Wong move inside to replace Foreman, which is also an improvement (again IMO).
I don't know (and probably none of you do either) the exact details of the contract, but it seems to me that if he doesn't show the produtivity that management expects, he can be unloaded before the big part of the contract kicks in.
2.5mil for a starting OLB (assumed outside) seems to be a pretty fair deal if you ask me.
This is an improvement to me. Not the free agent splash that many of you had hoped for, but the quality of the D has gone up. The level of improvement is all that remains to be seen.
And as said many times, doesn't risk future negotiations with Lucifer regarding salary cap issues!
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
michaelm said:
Greenwood's prorated bonus is $1.4 mil per year so with the $540k salary this year his cap hit is $1.94 mil.
So your version of "reality" is where internet posters' opinions should be more valued than Charley Casserly and Dom Capers' opinions? Don't you think that the Texans have access to coaching tapes of Dolphin games? Did you know that Miami came into Houston last summer for a series of practices and a scrimmage? Maybe the Texans saw something in Greenwood then that indicated he would be a good fit at ILB in the 34?WildBlackBear32 said:
My version of reality is to give the Texans the benefit of the doubt in player evaluations. They've earned that by bringing in talent like Carr, AJ, Dunta, & Domanick. On the other hand, there are many internet posters around who haven't earned that respect. Yourself included.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
Lucky said:
And to add on that he would be a good fit at ILB in the 3-4 the Texans want to run because those two numbers don't define the whole defense. The Texans clearly believe his range/speed and coverage ability are valuable to the scheme they want to run next year. Players do shrink or thrive depending on the system they are in.
Ex. Mike Vrabel Pittsburgh 3-4 1st four years--56 total tackles in four year, 7 sacks total and 0 INT's. Then goes to New England 3-4 and in four years has 270 tackles, 22.5 sacks and 5 INT's.
The system and the player work together to create stats.
TexansTrueFan
All Pro
i heard someone on here say we overpayed greenwood, because he is average. Well maybe the coaches see some Star potential that other didnt see ! I guess we'll find out come this season, it sounds like a deadly LB core we have IMO !
infantrycak said:
FYI from the Ravens roster:
Lewis 245 lbs
Thomas 270 lbs
Suggs 260 lbs
Hartwell 250 lbs
Green 250 lbs
from the Patriots roster:
McGinest 270 lbs
Johnson 250 lbs
Bruschi 247 lbs
Vrabel 261 lbs
Colvin 250 lbs
Banta-Cain 250 lbs
Chatham 250 lbs
According to ESPN.com
The deal includes a $7 million signing bonus and base salaries as follows: $540,000 (for 2005), $2.56 million (2006), $3.4 million (2007), $4 million (2008) and $5 million (2009).
You're right the Texans didn't pay that kind of money for a situational LB for 2006-2009.