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Mariota

Runner said:
lolo? Filipino word for grandfather or Hawaiian word for crazy?*

I don't think I'm either...


*Urban dictionary
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I thought he was talking about the track star.
Jones_Lolo_OlympicsHurdle12.aspx
 
infantrycak said:
Does this team seem one draft from a high likelihood of a SB to you?

If not you fix the most important position on the field for a decade.
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I think the 2014 Texans were comparable to the Steelers team Roethlisberger was drafted into. If we could get two or three big plays from Fitz in the passing game I think we could have had similar results.
 
thunderkyss said:
I think the 2014 Texans were comparable to the Steelers team Roethlisberger was drafted into. If we could get two or three big plays from Fitz in the passing game I think we could have had similar results.
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Not quite buying the Fitzy thing. Big Ben wasn't asked to do much but he had a 98.6 rating (pre QBR) and led the league in TD% and ypr.

The team Big Ben came into had the #1 D on points and yards and the #2 rushing O.

But you're right, that team is a good look at what you need for a young QB to win...with a lot of luck.
 
Greg Cosell's NFL draft preview: QB Marcus Mariota's pro transition
Greg Cosell | Shutdown Corner

The question about Oregon quarterback Marcus Mariota is how he’ll transition to the NFL.

Mariota, like all quarterbacks from spread college offenses, is a bit more of a complicated projection. The game he played at Oregon will not be the same game he plays in the NFL. There will be a three-step, five-step, seven-step drop foundation he’ll need to learn. Even if the Philadelphia Eagles and former Oregon coach Chip Kelly end up drafting Mariota, it will be a different game for him than he's used to.

Mariota was very comfortable in Oregon offense. He understood and executed the concepts at high efficiency with great confidence. But does he have to run that offense in the NFL to be successful?

Mariota’s mobility and ability to make plays outside of structure will help him early in his career, but he will face the same issue all scheme-based spread quarterbacks ultimately must deal with: Can he become a refined pocket quarterback with the subtle nuanced traits that are demanded to play consistently over time? We don’t know that yet, and neither do the NFL teams studying him. What we can do is look at Mariota’s skills from his college film and see what he does well and what he needs work on.

Everyone knows Mariota has great running ability; his athletic ability really isn’t in question. But let’s look at three areas that will be important to him in his NFL transition, and the things he does well and things he’ll need to work on (and remember, all NFL draft prospects come in with things to work on, Mariota can improve in every area that needs work):

Mechanics

One thing that stood out is an excellent ball position on his drop. He has a quick compact delivery that at times was reminiscent of Dan Marino’s delivery.

He has light feet on his drop and set. He‘s a real quick-twitch athlete, and as such he can extend plays and create.

Mariota is a little bit of a short-armer on intermediate throws. There was not a lot of arm extension. Some deeper intermediate throws lost energy on the back end.

His interception to Stanford’s Alex Carter is a great example. You can see the play at 35 seconds on this clip:
Mariota does not consistently bring his hips through his throws, which makes him more of a touch thrower than a power thrower. Which brings us to …

Arm strength

Mariota’s arm strength must be researched. Within the context of the Oregon offense he’s more of a touch thrower than someone who can drive the ball, although he’s good at touch passes. He showed the ability to make firm touch seam throws that are a staple of NFL passing games. He showed the ability to throw with precise ball location on touch throws; that’s the strength of his game. He also is very good at throwing between the numbers.

Mariota did consistently throw to open receivers, so you could not see much of the anticipation throws or tight window throws that are necessary in the NFL. He does throw with consistent velocity and accuracy at the intermediate levels, with a snap delivery without exerting much energy. He also has an outstanding ability to throw on the move, both to his right and left; while he showed the vision and spatial awareness to locate receivers and make throws off improvised movement. But he was a hitch thrower, meaning he needed to plant and hitch to drive the ball. He did not drive the ball sitting on his back foot. He’ll need to do that at times in the NFL.

Pocket presence

This is hard to evaluate because progression passing is not a true foundation of the Oregon pass game.

Mariota’s poise in the pocket is a question. He is not a naturally comfortable pocket quarterback. He must develop more comfortable and composed pocket movement, to slow down his feet and keep his eyes focused downfield as opposed to seeing and reading the rush. Mariota had a tendency to come off primary read too quickly if he did not see it as clearly defined, and there was also a tendency at times to leave the pocket early and play to his legs. Again, that might be a function of the Oregon pass game. What Mariota is used to is a precisely timed pass game with the ball out quickly to schemed open receivers. In the NFL, he’ll need to work on his progression reading and be patient in the pocket.

He’s not a late-in-the-down pocket quarterback at this point. Can that be taught at the NFL level or will he leave the pocket and rely on his legs? Does Mariota need throws to be defined to turn it loose? These are questions you need to have an answer for.

Overview

There were three things I didn’t see much of at all from Mariota: Muddied pocket throws (a couple here and there when the pocket was not clean around him), anticipation throws and tight-window throws. How important is that to an evaluator?

These are things that Mariota can work on in the NFL. But you will see designed movement and read option as featured parts of the offense whichever team drafts Mariota. That puts tremendous stress on the defense and plays to Mariota’s strengths. We’ll see through the years if he can progress and become an effective NFL passer.
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JB said:
It's the Filipino word for crazy too... I know, my ex is filipina
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Never heard the Tagalog word "lolo" used for crazy, only grandfather. I've been married to a Filipina for almost 27 years and was stationed at NAS Cubi Point for 5 years. Now my wife's Visayan dialect uses "loco loco" for crazy and maybe if your ex was Visayan and she was saying "loco" and maybe you were hearing "lolo." Just a guess.
 
Insideop said:
Never heard the Tagalog word "lolo" used for crazy, only grandfather. I've been married to a Filipina for almost 27 years and was stationed at NAS Cubi Point for 5 years. Now my wife's Visayan dialect uses "loco loco" for crazy and maybe if your ex was Visayan and she was saying "loco" and maybe you were hearing "lolo." Just a guess.
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Nope definitely not Visayan
 
PHILLYTEXANFAN said:
You'd have to have confidence if you resigned Mallet and brought Hoyer in regardless of contracts
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Having confidence that they were the best most feasible options at the time is not the same as having confidence that they can lead the team in future years

(see Fitz)
 
JB said:
Having confidence that they were the best most feasible options at the time is not the same as having confidence that they can lead the team in future years

(see Fitz)
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I think you weigh that aspect, but look at Mariota and next years crop as well.
 
JB said:
Who else is available? Do I have confidence in Mallett or Hoyer?
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You draft him and play Mallett. Mallett either proves himself incompetent while Mariota is learning a real offense or proves himself good enough that one of the two can be traded.

Who else? - I'd take White if he was still available. But among those commonly projected to be available I'd go Mariota.
 
I'll put this out there, when I see Mariota I think Randal Cunningham, when I see Brett Hundley, young Daunte Culpepper or Steve McNair comes to mind. Quick note this isn't me favoring either I just wouldn't go with either in the first. Maybe if Hundley is there in the second
 
PHILLYTEXANFAN said:
I'll put this out there, when I see Mariota I think Randal Cunningham, when I see Brett Hundley, young Daunte Culpepper or Steve McNair comes to mind. Quick note this isn't me favoring either I just wouldn't go with either in the first. Maybe if Hundley is there in the second
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You just named 3 QBs with 10 pro bowls, 1 all pro and an MVP (plus one in 2nd), any of whom could have led a team to a SB win. Maybe our standards are a tad bit high for a 1st round pick?
 
Uncle Rico said:
If Mariota drops to 16 ... Do you take him?
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:spit: i dont know whats funnier, you hypothesizing Mariota dropping to 16 like it has a snowball's chance in hell of happening, or you actually thinking there'd be a question of whether or not the texans or anyone else on this board would take him at 16....

If it did happen, Ricky boy better be looking like this getting his card to the commish.

anigif_enhanced-buzz-658-1415891095-28.gif
 
PHILLYTEXANFAN said:
I'll put this out there, when I see Mariota I think Randal Cunningham, when I see Brett Hundley, young Daunte Culpepper or Steve McNair comes to mind. Quick note this isn't me favoring either I just wouldn't go with either in the first. Maybe if Hundley is there in the second
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I'd take any of those three over Hoyer or Mallett. All day long. Especially Steve McNair. If Mariota is any where close to the passer - and gameday warrior - that McNair was, I'd trade up to get him in a heartbeat.
 
thunderkyss said:
Why?

In your own words, & not to be snarky, I really want to know. What sets Mariota apart?
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Not sure which words, but...

...what does he not have other than things beyond his control?

OK so he didn't play in an NFL system - not his choice and not an adaptation to him because he was incompetent (cough*VY*cough).

He has size, plenty of arm, athleticism without an urge to be a RB. He's smart, dedicated, clean. There are things he hasn't demonstrated he can do but they are largely because he hasn't been asked to rather than fail when called upon.

Maybe if you identified a concern I'd be able to address it. He looks like really high grade putty for a QB guru to me.
 
infantrycak said:
You just named 3 QBs with 10 pro bowls, 1 all pro and an MVP (plus one in 2nd), any of whom could have led a team to a SB win. Maybe our standards are a tad bit high for a 1st round pick?
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Cunningham, McNair, and Culpepper? Yuk, who would want those guys?

I think Mariota is suffering from prospect fatigue. He's been so good for so long, people tire of talking about him in the positive and prefer to dwell on the negatives. Does Mariota have negatives? Yes, all players have some negatives. The process is an exercise in balancing the pros and cons. I just think the pros so overwhelmingly outweigh the cons, that Mariota should be a no brainer #1 overall pick.
 
Lucky said:
About the same amount of time as any other QB. The flipside is when he is developed, you have a QB better than any other in his class.
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Kid hasn't called a play in years, and played in one system his whole college career and your saying he'd take the same amount of time??
 
PHILLYTEXANFAN said:
Kid hasn't called a play in years, and played in one system his whole college career and your saying he'd take the same amount of time??
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Do you think any of the other college QBs are that much different? Here's something to consider: Mariota had to learn the system he ran at Oregon. When he did, Mariota executed at a level higher than any other college QB. Mariota will have to learn a different system in the NFL (just like everyone else will). Once he does, why won't he be able to execute that offense? What is Marcus Mariota lacking that inhibits him?
 
Lucky said:
Do you think any of the other college QBs are that much different? Here's something to consider: Mariota had to learn the system he ran at Oregon. When he did, Mariota executed at a level higher than any other college QB. Mariota will have to learn a different system in the NFL (just like everyone else will). Once he does, why won't he be able to execute that offense? What is Marcus Mariota lacking that inhibits him?
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I'm not saying he can't or won't BUT let's be honest... He's not competing for the job from day 1 , maybe year 2 if he can get the lingo. I'm saying 3 years to compete for the starting job here. I don't know about you but I want my first round pick to start from jump street, not hope he picks up the system. So many other guys in the first round alone can come in and start. Mariota ain't one of them
 
PHILLYTEXANFAN said:
I'm not saying he can't or won't BUT let's be honest... He's not competing for the job from day 1 , maybe year 2 if he can get the lingo. I'm saying 3 years to compete for the starting job here. I don't know about you but I want my first round pick to start from jump street, not hope he picks up the system. So many other guys in the first round alone can come in and start. Mariota ain't one of them
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You have to consider the ceiling tho... do you think Mariota is the guy you could put there and not have to worry about the position for 10-15 years? Can he be a pro bowl franchise guy? If so at the qb position you have to take him when given the opportunity, even if it takes a few years to get there ala Rodgers, McNair and many others.

For quite awhile it was considered stupid to start a rookie at QB, best to let them sit until the game slowed down a bit
 
PHILLYTEXANFAN said:
Kid hasn't called a play in years, and played in one system his whole college career and your saying he'd take the same amount of time??
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Which QB, in today's NFL, actually calls his own plays? Peyton, maybe. Brady, Rodgers, Brees, they audible like nobody's business but they don't call the player combos or the plays.

Mariota will do what all QBs are supposed to do. Make reads, find the open guy, and get the ball to him. His learning process will involve getting used to the speed of the game and reading NFL defenses; just like every other young NFL QB.
 
If Mariota is available at 16 I'd call Chip and see if he wants to swap first and pick up an extra pick or two. If Mariota is the pick for Houston at 16 ( and I know nobody will lose sleep over this). I will log off from TT and boycott the 2015 season.
 
infantrycak said:
Not sure which words, but...

...what does he not have other than things beyond his control?

OK so he didn't play in an NFL system - not his choice and not an adaptation to him because he was incompetent (cough*VY*cough).

He has size, plenty of arm, athleticism without an urge to be a RB. He's smart, dedicated, clean. There are things he hasn't demonstrated he can do but they are largely because he hasn't been asked to rather than fail when called upon.

Maybe if you identified a concern I'd be able to address it. He looks like really high grade putty for a QB guru to me.
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No concerns, just wanting a non-"scout" to tell me what he sees in Mariota.
 
PHILLYTEXANFAN said:
If Mariota is available at 16 I'd call Chip and see if he wants to swap first and pick up an extra pick or two. If Mariota is the pick for Houston at 16 ( and I know nobody will lose sleep over this). I will log off from TT and boycott the 2015 season.
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Why? Inquiring minds want to know why you think he's such a bad pick?
 
JB said:
Why? Inquiring minds want to know why you think he's such a bad pick?
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I'm on the wagon with Hoyerand Mallet. That and I just don't see "it" with him. Nothing about him says "Houston Texans franchise QB". I don't think anywhere I have stated that he's a bad player, just don't like him. Put it this way if we didn't invest in Mallet and Hoyer I would maybe entertain the Mariota idea a bit more
 
JB said:
Why? Inquiring minds want to know why you think he's such a bad pick?
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I don't Philly is saying Mariota is a bad pick; he's just saying that a first round pick to be ready to start or at least push the starter for his job. And from that viewpoint, given that we've already signed two QBs with experience in O'Brien's system, Mariota would be swimming up a waterfall to be the starter this year. So it's not that Mariota is bad, it's more that we should spend that pick on someone to replace Brooks Reed or Andre Johnson or Jared Crick.
Am I reading you right?
 
ObsiWan said:
I don't Philly is saying Mariota is a bad pick; he's just saying that a first round pick to be ready to start or at least push the starter for his job. And from that viewpoint, given that we've already signed two QBs with experience in O'Brien's system, Mariota would be swimming up a waterfall to be the starter this year. So it's not that Mariota is bad, it's more that we should spend that pick on someone to replace Brooks Reed or Andre Johnson or Jared Crick.
Am I reading you right?
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You nailed it 100% for me. Thanks
 
WolverineFan said:
Without hesitation.

Perfect scenario for him. With Mallett/Hoyer he can afford to sit for 1-2 years like he needs to.
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My sentiments exactly, no hesitation. IMO, Mariota will never make it to us, he'll be long gone by pick 16. But if some miracle does happen and he falls in our lap, we'd be fools not to take him. We let him learn the system for a year behind Mallett and Hoyer and if we're lucky we have a QB controversy in 2016.
 
PHILLYTEXANFAN said:
Kid hasn't called a play in years, and played in one system his whole college career and your saying he'd take the same amount of time??
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He actually had more responsibility at the line of scrimmage than Winston did, who is getting gobs of bonus points for the "pro style" system in which he played. The only difference is that he did it in a dumbed down college spread offense while Winston did it in a dumbed down, simplistic offense with some pro principles.

When scouting a guy I try to find three comparisons for him. Not because I think they will become one of those guys, but because I am interested to see what guys who mirror his skill set ended up being.

With Mariota, worst case scenario I think you're getting Kaepernick. Best case scenario I think you're getting Cunningham. I think the guy you're most likely to get is Alex Smith. If you don't think that is worth #16 you have to be ready to walk away.
 
IDEXAN said:
The Heisman winner in last years Draft dropped farther than that didn't he ?
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There were some serious "maturity" issues with that guy. His love for football, & his dedication to the game.

Speaking of which, let's just say Mariota has a reputation for being FILO.... what's he doing? If the coaches are reading the defenses & making the adjustments from the sideline, does he really need all that "extra" preparation that QBs asked to do more need?

& as far as being ready to start day 1, that all depends on how much his coach is willing to plan around him. We had Fitzpatrick starting for us day 1 of the 2014 season & he wasn't asked to do much... didn't look like anything a rookie wouldn't have been able to handle (then again, we saw Savage get thrown in the game & look like a bad rookie).
 
thunderkyss said:
There were some serious "maturity" issues with that guy. His love for football, & his dedication to the game.
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And size issues were a topic of much discussion for 6' 207 lb Manziel and 6'2" 214 lb Bridgewater.

That issue doesn't exist with 6'4" 222 lb Mariota.
 
infantrycak said:
And size issues were a topic of much discussion for 6' 207 lb Manziel and 6'2" 214 lb Bridgewater.

That issue doesn't exist with 6'4" 222 lb Mariota.
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With that said I still don't think BOB would take Mariota. But, if he did fall that far I would be thinking trade possibilities with someone, Philly for example, that might be getting nervous and didn't want to take a chance he wouldn't be there for them at #20.
 
Haven't we lived through this scenario once? There are 23 teams including us feeling pretty stupid having passed on system/Tedford QB Aaron Rodgers.
 
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