markn
All Pro
Can't argue with any of that.
Keep Texans Talk Google Ad Free!
Venmo Tip Jar | Paypal Tip Jar
Thanks for your support! 🍺😎👍
Mario Williams
- Thread starter stingray
- Start date
Can't argue with any of that.
markn
All Pro
Indeed. White and Gaffney are two prime examples of players drafted by CC who the coaching staff couldn't get to work out in Houston. Gaffney is now making match winning catches for the best team in NFL history and White is putting up the same kind of numbers as Mario.
Casserly made some huge mistakes, but this assumption that he had an inverse Midas touch (everything he touches turn to s...) simply doesn't stand up to scrutiny.
No one had any trouble pointing the finger at Casserly when it looked like MW was a bust, but now he's putting in good displays people are trying to re-write history.
El cabezon
Practice Squad
I know that CC made mistakes, can name me a GM that has not made any mistakes? Some of you guys are just looking for an excuse to bad mouth anybody, and I mean anybody. You got to stop being so darn negative and need to learn to enjoy life.
dalemurphy
Hall of Fame
Let's see:
Gaffney
C. Pitts
Fred Weary
DFaggins (6th round)
AJohnson
Dom. Davis (4th round)
DRobinson
Travis Johnson
Mario
D.Ryans
Winston
CSpencer
ODaniels (4th round)
Jerome Mathis (4th round)
those are some good picks off the top of my head. One can criticize Casserly without using hyperbole. It just makes you look ignorant.
Reality is that Casserly had a very successful draft working with a good head coach (Kubiak). However, he and Capers were unable to find any success together- moves like the one for Babin and Buchanan were attempts to get the guy that Capers wanted. Personally, I think their communication and understand of one another was part of the problem. Furthermore, I don't think Casserly comprehended the 3-4 defense.
TexansLucky13
53d Signal Batt
To get this discussion back on track....
I
Mario Williams
I
Mario Williams 
Specnatz
Hall of Fame
I am sorry I did not put the sarcsm smiley there, I figured the whole parade might be a give away.
Yeas, I know CC picked more than just two guys who did actually play decent and were not total suckage. But my premis still stands that he did more harm than he did good. I will not include anyone but Daniels from the 2006 draft because he was a lame duck GM.
Now one name I noticed people listing is Travis Johnson, he has gotten called a bost more often than I could possibly count and now he is listed as a good player casserly picked? WTF is up with that.
Murphy you listed Faggins? Do you want anyone to take you seriously?
Yeas, I know CC picked more than just two guys who did actually play decent and were not total suckage. But my premis still stands that he did more harm than he did good. I will not include anyone but Daniels from the 2006 draft because he was a lame duck GM.
Now one name I noticed people listing is Travis Johnson, he has gotten called a bost more often than I could possibly count and now he is listed as a good player casserly picked? WTF is up with that.
Murphy you listed Faggins? Do you want anyone to take you seriously?
Vinny
shiny happy fan
I donno why you would lump me in with pure haters other than the fact that you dog me to your buddies since you are pretty vocal about not liking me (eh, word travels fast). I just post what I see and I don't tell you guys what you want to hear....you don't like that but hey, there isn't any fun in objective observation. I haven't been around much lately but when he has played well I've commented on it. Heck, I got behind the pick early on and was told I wasn't credible...so I stopped posting at HPF. When I post my football observations they are real and I don't sugar coat them and will call a spade a spade. When Mario played poorly early on I said so....but then again, I just comment on what I see and Mario playing well is very important to our sucess. Have you noticed that we lose alot when our top guys don't play well? Mario had a great game and we beat the Bucs last week...two plus two stuff.
Specnatz
Hall of Fame
My exact quote was we do not get along because of my comment regarding VY fans. In fact I have never cussed you or said anything really hateful. In fact I also said I respect your opinion in regards to a lot of football discussions, but some people when they talk forget to say everything and only ad what they want to cause issues on a board. Not sure whom you have been talking to but all you have to do is ask me and I would be honest.
You have trashed Mario very bad and when Kubiak said he was the most consistant defensive lineman you trashed that comment as well. I never said any of the critism was not deserved, but it was like he was singled out. Weaver has been the worst defensive player on the team but it was all Marios fault, at least that is how it appeared to me.
I stand by my comment about calling those that have bashed him out. Now granted, I guess in hindsight, I should have not lumped you in with true haters and that may have appeared as I was calling you a true hater which I did not mean to do.
Vinny
shiny happy fan
I’ve heard what you have said about me. I told you I didn’t like you calling me a jock sniffer and I told you what I thought of you privately. Since you have an axe to grind with me just leave me out of your posts and I'll do the same for you.
Specnatz
Hall of Fame
I never called you a jock sniffer, EVER. When I used the term jocksniffer it was in regards to certain VY fans who thinks he walks on water and was referring to the people here in Austin. I tried to explain that to you. You have for the most part been objective about VY, I know you respect his game and I complimented you on that. As far as axe to grind, nope not at all. Not with anyone.
run-david-run
All Pro
He was fired for a reason. GM is a position with very low turnover, when someone gets the can, its because they did a bad job for an extended period of time. Everyone is going to find some diamonds in the rough and going to draft some high round busts. However, CC got almost nothing from the 2nd and 3rd round picks. 5 years into our existance, about 2/3 of our draft picks were no longer on the team. That is inexcusable and a direct reflection of the coaching staff and GM, as a result they have been replaced. Its pretty simple.
In regards to Mario: why would you let a person who is about to be fired for a history of bad decisions make the biggest decision in your franchise's history? I'm sure he had input, but there is no way that the final decision came down to him.
Texan_Bill
Hall of Fame
But he does!!! He does!!!!
***************************************************
I've supported Mario from the beginning BUT, he has deserved criticism and harsh criticism - at times. He played well at the beginning of the season, and has played well the last couple of games. In between those games he disappeared for a little while.
Specnatz
Hall of Fame
That critism was fine, heck i have critism for some of his play, that is not what I was referring to. It was he does nothing right and the total lambasting him saying the prise Kubiak gave him by saying he was the most consistant player along the line was not warrented when everything showed that priase was. Now that does not mean he did not need to improve.
Okoye has disapeared since about week 9, TJ the most inconsistant player and Weaver is non-exsistant. I guess you could say Weaver is the most consistant because he plays terrible every week.
Texan_Bill
Hall of Fame
Context... Context my man!!
Listen, I like Kubiak and I have supported Mario - but there were times where I had to roll my eyes about Kubes' comments. It was Kubiaks attempt to mitigate some of the negative pub surrounding Mario since the draft. And in doing so, I think he may have overcompensated.
I expected Okoye to dissappear. Not making excuses but rookies hit walls. I will say that I was impressed with how he came out of the gate, and it gives him a lot to build on in his second year.
HoustonFrog
Dallas Frog
Because Kubes was FOS when he was talking about him earlier in the season and was basiically covering for his player because he was taking alot of heat. It is OK to see a player struggle and say.."the guy is horrible" and then appreciate it when he finally gets it. I mean it happens.
Dear Lord, do we really have to go through his drafts and trades again?
Specnatz
Hall of Fame
That I can understand.
Can he also please stop taping the podeum. Geez. I do not think he has ever rematched his press conferance.
HoustonFrog
Dallas Frog
Really, you going to stick with all those guys as legit "good" NFL players? Casserly was a horrible GM that set us back with picks like Ragone. Its funny that he is in this thread because wasn't the rumor that he wanted to announce that Bush was our pick but Reeves had to rein him in so as not to ruin trade value, etc.?How good can a guy be when we have to hire a GM babysitter for him?
Maddict5
Hall of Fame
i have no problem with alot of the stuff you said, but you did go through a phase a couple of weeks back where you used to trash mario just because a team would run to his side... it seemed hyper-critical
Vinny
shiny happy fan
I think "hyper-critical" is a bit of an overstatement. I didn't post much...and most of it centered on my being disappointed in his play. I never called him a bust or droned on and on about him being the wrong pick. I never waxed on and on about how we should have taken Young or anyone else....just made a few comments about how I was really dissapointed in his play at times when I thought we needed our elite players to pick it up a notch. Hell, even Kubiak said as much last week when he stated that he had a talk with his better players stepping up their games in order for this team to improve. In case you haven't noticed, we win games when our elite players play like elite players. When they don't, we tend to lose. Perhaps you just are more ok with losing than I am or you just haven't connected those dots.
This is my take, as well. I was on board with picking Mario the night before the 2006 draft, as evidenced in the board's history. Although I tended to be a D'Brick or AJ Hawk fan back then, I was cool with picking a defensive guy, too.
Since then, I've openly expressed being disappointed by certain aspects of his game. I understand the nature of the position is a 2-3 year learning curve, so I've always been patient about it, but losing tends to magnify the frustration. I care about our players and have high expectations for them. It's only human to be down from time to time, especially after six seasons of suck. But that doesn't mean I hate the pick or ever thought he was a 'bust'. Far from it.
I think Vinny comes from the same angle. No homer glasses but still hope for our hometown players, countered with realistic analysis of the product on the field. It doesn't require drinking koolaide or hatorade to be a good football fan.
dalemurphy
Hall of Fame
I'm not crazy. I'm not arguing that Casserly was a good GM. I'm just of the opinion that the GM and Head Coach were too independent. I don't think either had much say on the other's hiring. Further, they never got on the sam page. Also, I think Capers' entire winning formula was highly flawed. I think it's the combination of those two that were the downfall. Casserly, I believe is an adequate talent evaluator and I suggest looking at the '06 draft as evidence of that.
Having said that, he made some horrible decisions, overpaid for almost every free agent, overpaid for trades, was totally uninspiring, and I'm thrilled that Rick Smith is here and he is gone!
Gotta give credit where it's due. Casserly was pushing for Mario from the start, but Kubiak came to the same decision:
http://www.sportingnews.com/exclusives/20060501/734742-p.html
(got the link from another board)
Reading the link you posted, Vinny, you're right. Casserly never looked like he had a plan. Drew Henson in the 6th, OK, but Dave Ragone in the 3rd as well? But some of this may have been on Capers. Casserly said something to the effect that Kubes was excellent at communicating what specific type of player he needed/wanted, implying Capers had not been.
http://www.sportingnews.com/exclusives/20060501/734742-p.html
(got the link from another board)
Reading the link you posted, Vinny, you're right. Casserly never looked like he had a plan. Drew Henson in the 6th, OK, but Dave Ragone in the 3rd as well? But some of this may have been on Capers. Casserly said something to the effect that Kubes was excellent at communicating what specific type of player he needed/wanted, implying Capers had not been.
threetoedpete
Hall of Fame
yeah I'll come out of the closet. You go look at my posts now and I was posting the same thing in 05. I wanted D'brickasaw in the worst way. All the negitive things said bout Mario were true. But what was also true was the guy was a 299 pound, 4.66 speed phenomon. Those guys don't grow on trees either. Took some coaching up and some time but he is getting it. What I have never wavered on was my expecttions for Vincent. Never. He i doing exactly what I thought he would do. Doesn't make him a bad player. But he was far from polished coming out. Might be he will excede Mario we'll see. I'm very copmfortable with how everything has turned out so far.
tulexan
Hall of Fame
Really good read. I think this also dispels a lot of rumors about how the decision was made (i.e. Bush was being unreasonable and McNair was pissed about the scandal).
Maddict5
Hall of Fame
austintexanite
Rookie
That sportingnews article is a great read. Everyone should check it out.
TexansSeminole
Hall of Fame
Possibly the best quote from the article:
A few weeks earlier, an interviewer asked Casserly whether he wanted to be the next Stu Inman, the Trail Blazers' general manager who passed up Michael Jordan for Sam Bowie.
"Who says (Bush) is Michael Jordan?" replied Casserly. Now Casserly leans back in his chair. "People can judge this short term," he says. "But the smart ones will wait a few years. Check back with me then."
wicked_wayz
all blacks
wha he said
kiwitexansfan
Hall of Fame
I think we just saw Mario's coming out party.... Prime TV, all eyes on him, 3.5 sacks.... hope he gets a trip to Honolulu and now only 0.5 sacks off the league lead.
GuerillaBlack
Hall of Fame
Mario is a ****ing beast.
TexansLucky13
53d Signal Batt
All doubters have been put to shame.
Mario has almost as many sacks as VY has interceptions.... and that is REALLY saying something. Way to go!
Mario has almost as many sacks as VY has interceptions.... and that is REALLY saying something. Way to go!
Nawzer
Alienz
I've said this last year and this year that Mario Williams is not the reason the Texans weren't winning more games. We just weren't a good team. But when we do start winning more games you can bet Mario Williams will be one of the main reasons why. We are witnessing the birth of a superstar right in front of our eyes. Enjoy the ride people it's going to be a blast!
TheIronDuke
All Pro
Mario just jokingly punched Chuck Norris in his arm after the game and Chuck Norris blew up into a thousand pieces.
Then Mario re-constructed the pieces of Chuck Norris and invented a time machine and reversed global warming and killed Osama bin Laden in the process.
Mario Williams is the man.
Then Mario re-constructed the pieces of Chuck Norris and invented a time machine and reversed global warming and killed Osama bin Laden in the process.
Mario Williams is the man.
run-david-run
All Pro
God I love being right about stuff like this, almost as much as seeing Mario tear up opposing offenses. I think the fan vote ended 2 days ago (of course), but I'm sure Mario will get voted in by players/coaches or if someone has an injury.
Too bad AJ was hurt or we could have had 2 Texans as All-Pros, possibly.
Too bad AJ was hurt or we could have had 2 Texans as All-Pros, possibly.
New_Texans
Rookie
Lets put it this way, mario almost has 2 times as many sacks as vince has touchdowns (passing).
Vince who?
HoustonFrog
Dallas Frog
Great play and something that I'm excited to watch. It makes the secondary and everyone else better.
Brandon420tx
Flounder
run-david-run
All Pro
You think so too?
After the 4th one, he had this hillarious exchange with Kalu over who's sack it was. Who knew football could be fun as a fan?
TexansFanatic
Extremist
Did that really just happen? YES!!!
Mario Williams. The best player taken in the 2006 draft. Period.
Mario Williams. The best player taken in the 2006 draft. Period.
TexanSam
Hall of Fame
Honoring Earl 34
Something Witty !
Well...DeMeco might have a say in that
OK ... we now have a monster draft in 2006 .
Mario
Demeco
Hopefully Spencer / Winston
Owens
Walter for a 7th
TexansLucky13
53d Signal Batt
Hell yes.
MEGA SWATT
All Pro
MARIO WILLIAMS IS KING
Hooston Texan
Rookie
And with that, the doubters crawled away.
I say enough about deciding what Casserly did and did not do. Let's look instead at what the Texans (be it Casserly, Smith or Kubes) did with their last two drafts:
2006:
1: Mario--'nuff said.
2: Demeco--An even better pick than Mario
3: Spencer--had a good start to solving LT before the freak injury
3: Winston--looks like a fixture at RT
4: Daniels--fumbling aside, a great value pick
Then Lundy (6) and Anderson (7)--some contributions there, too.
2007:
1: Okoye--hit the wall hard, but what upside
3: Jones--even though he's struggled, we all saw what he's capable of
4: Bennett--looks like we might just have a CB here
Too soon to tell on the others.
Of our last 8 picks in the first four rounds, we've got 5 solid-to-great starters, two with real potential and one who looked lke the answer at LT before his injury. That's a whale of a job drafting.
I say enough about deciding what Casserly did and did not do. Let's look instead at what the Texans (be it Casserly, Smith or Kubes) did with their last two drafts:
2006:
1: Mario--'nuff said.
2: Demeco--An even better pick than Mario
3: Spencer--had a good start to solving LT before the freak injury
3: Winston--looks like a fixture at RT
4: Daniels--fumbling aside, a great value pick
Then Lundy (6) and Anderson (7)--some contributions there, too.
2007:
1: Okoye--hit the wall hard, but what upside
3: Jones--even though he's struggled, we all saw what he's capable of
4: Bennett--looks like we might just have a CB here
Too soon to tell on the others.
Of our last 8 picks in the first four rounds, we've got 5 solid-to-great starters, two with real potential and one who looked lke the answer at LT before his injury. That's a whale of a job drafting.