Just for the record you hated the BOB hire?
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Hard Knocks: Houston Texans 2015
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Just for the record you hated the BOB hire?
xtruroyaltyx
Hall of Fame
I said last year I didn't like the pick. I could kinda see if he was younger...but I guess OB just really doesn't ever want to play a young qb. Doesn't want to be tied to a guy until one proves it in game.
I don't think he's ever going to actually identify a guy. He'll be jut as surprised as us if one of these guys become a true franchise guy.
He'll hit keep throwing darts at the board. QB competitions every year. Rotating guys during the season if a guy stinks.
If he had taken a qb early in either draft that guy would be expected to be his guy Sooner rather than later.
He could dump any of these qb's in a year. Or more than one. He's not tied to any of them.
Playoffs
Hall of Fame
‘Hard Knocks’: J.J. Watt’s Half-Ton Tire, Vince Wilfork’s Elephant, and the Houston Texans’ Inevitable March to the Super Bowl
Deadspin
The Houston Texans are the subject of this season’s Hard Knocks, HBO’s wonderful mini-documentary series that follows a professional football team for the weeks leading up to the start of the season. There will be five episodes in total. Last night was the first, and it was good. I’m so excited.
I’m so excited to watch J.J. Watt do things and to listen to Coach O’Brien say things and to watch fringe players chase down dreams of becoming NFL players. I’m so excited to see what music they play and I’m so excited for the slow-motion shots of football moments because football moments make for the best slow motion. I’m so excited for the fight scenes (there are always fight scenes) and for the weird ephemera (there’s always weird ephemera) and for the things that are going to make for good talking points in February after the Texans win their first ever Super Bowl. There are so many things to look forward to. It’s all going to be so good. I’m so excited. Did I mention the Houston Texans are my team?
Some things that happened in the first episode:
The Best Contradiction
The show opened with a scene from a coach’s meeting the day before training camp started. The first thing Coach Bill O’Brien said was “Let’s be honest with each other,” and then just a few seconds later in that same speech he began to talk about how the two quarterbacks vying for the starting position, Brian Hoyer and Ryan Mallett, are both quality picks who will do very well when given the chance, which is a thing that a person not being honest would say.
Semi-related: The vigor with which O’Brien delivered his speech is unquestionable. I was super ******* fired up after it. Coach Bill O’Brien drops the f-bomb a lot.
The Most Unfortunate Ironic Moment
Near the 10-minute mark of the show, we get to the Arian Foster intro. It’s a workout scene, and in it Arian talks about how his brother, Abdul Foster, is in charge of his routine. Arian mentions that he chose him over everyone else in the country because Abdul knows Arian’s body type because they have the same body, so Abdul knows what Arian needs to keep him right. Fifteen minutes later, we watch Coach O’Brien learn that Arian has hurt his groin, and that he’ll be out six to 10 weeks because he needs surgery.
I can’t believe my beautiful Texans couldn’t even make it through the first episode of Hard Knocks without losing their best offensive player. I’m used to it, but I can’t understand it.
Who Should Start at Quarterback?
At the moment, it looks like it should be Brian Hoyer, although I freely admit that I arrived at that decision because Hoyer rhymes with words like “Destroyer” and “Lawyer” and “Employer” and, should you find yourself in the south, “Paranoia,” and all of those make for way better nicknames than anything Mallett-related. A mallet is pretty much the least intimidating of all the different types of hammers. It goes:
(1) Thor’s Hammer
(2) Sledgehammer
(3) Omar Epps as Black Hammer
…
(6) Hammerhead Shark
…
(9) Regular Hammer
…
(11) Ball-Peen Hammer
…
(40) Rock Hammer
(41) Rubber Mallet Hammer
The Most Dispiriting Stat
As a franchise, the Texans are 32 games under .500 (88-120) in regular-season games. I hadn’t realized that. I thought we were, at worst, 216-6.
The Most Surprising Thing
Near the end of the show, the Texans travel to Richmond, Virginia, to practice against the Washington Redskins. After the first day of practice there, there’s a dinner at the Governor’s Mansion. Dan Snyder, Redskins owner, was there. It was the first time I’d ever seen him on camera before. I was very impressed with how good he was at hiding his slimy, slimy tentacles.
The Best Unintentional Competition: The FUCKs Competition
This is the best of all the Unintentional Competitions that happened in the first episode. It’s Bill O’Brien versus linebackers coach Mike Vrabel. O’Brien is steady and staid in the delivery of his FUCKs. Sometimes they’re serious, like when he’s delivering a sermon to the team (“The only thing that matters in that ******* locker room is, ‘Are you willing to help?’”). Sometimes they’re exasperated, like when he was told that Arian Foster had hurt his groin (“… Oh ****”). Sometimes they’re fun, like when he said he ******* loved Rick Ross (“I ******* love Rick Ross”). But they’re all fluid and measured and nuanced and beautiful. He offered 12 FUCKs this first episode of Hard Knocks. Mike Vrabel, who received far less camera time, managed to fire out 13 of them, most coming in quick bursts aimed at incompetence like suppression fire. I’m very excited to see who wins. I’m going to keep count.
Series-Long Fuckometer
O’Brien: 12
Vrabel: 13
The Most Creative Way of Demeaning Someone
Mike Vrabel, talking to one of his players whom he felt approached a tackle a little too gingerly: “Throw a marshmallow at ‘em next time.”
A Sentence That Is Weird, With or Without Context, But Also One That Indirectly Asserts Why Hard Knocks Is a Wonderful Television Show
In this first episode, Vince Wilfork played catch with an elephant.
Sidebar: I love Vince Wilfork. I’ve loved him since March, when, a little over a week after it was announced he’d signed with the Texans, his wife posted a video to her Instagram account of him barbecuing and dancing to Lil’ Troy’s “Wanna Be a Baller,” an all-time great Houston rap song.
I respect him so much for that. Let’s do three more Vince Wilfork things:
The Most Accidentally Funny Scene That Involved Vince Wilfork
After the intro music and scene, it cuts to footage shot during a circus at NRG Stadium. During that, the narrator started talking about how the Texans signed a marquee player, veteran and two-time Super Bowl champion Vince Wilfork, and then as soon as he said Vince’s name they cut to a shot of a very large circus elephant. It stayed on it for a few seconds, then panned down and showed Wilfork.
The Most Expectedly Funny Scene That Involved Vince Wilfork
Vince Wilfork was playing pickup basketball. It was the most interesting game of pickup basketball I’ve ever seen. It was five-on-five, and men and women of all sizes and colors were involved. It was incredible. Better still was that during just the minute or so of it being shown, Vince Wilfork referred to himself as Michael Jordan, Vlade Divac, and Tim Duncan, the last of which he shouted while shooting a bank shot that ended up not even touching the rim.
All of the Things J.J. Watt Did This First Episode, Ranked
1. J.J. Watt solo workout montage. (100 football-boners for 100 nights.)
1a. J.J. Watt walking in slow motion over a bridge to the Texans practice field while Young Jeezy’s “Put On” played.
1b. J.J. Watt dismissing confrontational Washington Redskins WR Pierre Garçon by saying, “You’re maybe 112 pounds. You might wanna stay the **** back from the defensive line.”
1c. J.J. Watt flipping a mega tire that weighs 1,000 pounds. He said that in 2013, he was able to flip it one time. By 2014, he was up to 30 times. In 2015, he’s flipped it as many as 65 times.
1d. J.J. Watt shouting “Holding!” while being held during a scrimmage.
1e. J.J. Watt jumping on a table. This one was from a clip of Watt on Jimmy Kimmel Live, while the narrator was talking about how Watt is a scene-stealer on camera. As he jumped up on the table, a sound bite of Watt saying, “There’s no point in getting to the top of the mountain if you don’t enjoy the view every now and then” played. I like when things are literal and figurative at the same time.
1f. J.J. Watt hitting a slap shot while playing ice hockey.
1g. J.J. Watt being announced by Chris Pratt and Andrew Luck as the 2014 AP Defensive Player of the Year.
1h. J.J. Watt playing cornhole with his family.
1i. J.J. Watt being filmed by a lady wearing a J.J. Watt jersey with a cell phone with a J.J. Watt protective cover on it.
1j. J.J. Watt being hit on by a very loud, hoarse woman in the crowd while he practiced.
1k. J.J. Watt making fun of strength coach Sean Hayes while Hayes pretended to be Macho Man Randy Savage.
1l. J.J. Watt accidentally jumping offside in a drill.
1m. J.J. Watt commenting on the straightness of a painted line on the field.
1n. J.J. Watt taking off his shoulder pads and somehow not knocking off the hat he was wearing while he did it.
1o. J.J. Watt saying “Take that personal” after his defense got chewed out by defensive coordinator Romeo Crennel.
1p. J.J. Watt rapping along to Fort Minor’s “Remember the Name.”
The Most Interesting Person on the Periphery of the Show
It has to be rookie CB Kevin Johnson’s dad. Two reasons: (1) He has the longest neck I have ever seen on a human. It’s like Merton Hanks’s neck, but longer, which is a thing I never thought I’d say. (2) Dads who are watching their sons play football are always very interesting. They’re only ever super supportive in a good way or super supportive in an insane-person way. Either case makes for good TV.
All of the Rookies Shown on the First Episode, Ranked
1. Kevin Johnson, CB: He’s the most talented rookie and also, surprisingly, the most fiery. His very hard low hit on Washington Redskins fullback Jordan Campbell incited a team-versus-team fight at the end of the episode.
2. Chandler Worthy, WR: He has a very thick country accent and I always trust and care about people with thick country accents. Plus, he ran the 40-yard dash in 4.38 seconds, so he’s got a good shot at making the team.
3. Christian Covington, DT: Big Game of Thrones fan.
4. Benardrick McKinney, LB: His name is Benardrick.
5-8. Kenny Hilliard, RB; Lynden Trail, LB; Mike McFarland, TE; Dan Pettinato, DE.
The Saddest Moment of the Episode
Rewatching the episode, watching Arian Foster catch a pass and blow past a safety (and then gorgeously bark “Them shits ain’t fast enough” at the safety about his legs as he walked back toward the line of scrimmage after the play), and then realizing it’ll be about three months before you see him do anything like that again.
The Other Saddest Moment of the Episode
Watching talented linebacker Reshard Cliett tear his ACL after a bunch of people said nice things about how good he was going to be for the Texans this season.
The Most Houston Moment on the Episode
DeAndre Hopkins has become the new alpha receiver for the Texans (Andre Johnson, former franchise superhero, left for the Colts). During the scrimmage against the Redskins, he and Redskins CB DeAngelo Hall got into a confrontation after Hall said something to Hopkins about not being able to do against him what he’d been doing against the backup CBs (eating their lunches, basically). Hopkins responded by telling Hall to get away from him, to which Hall responded with aggression, to which Hopkins responded by repeating the phrase “I fear God” over and over and over again, and then abandoning that for a gorgeous “I’ll slap the **** outta you, too.” He went from Joel Osteen to Pimp C at a very impressive rate of speed. That’s a tier-one Houston move.
Note: In the next scene, which is just brilliantly shot and soundtracked, we see Hall and Hopkins square off in a pass play. Hopkins charges at Hall, then cuts out toward the sideline. When Hall tries to move with him, he hurts his ankle and crumples to the floor. Hopkins catches the ball, sees Hall on the ground, then jogs back toward his team. He says, “Damn, first day of pads, I’m already breaking ankles on the route, ****.”
I love you, DeAndre. I love you so much.
Deadspin
The Houston Texans are the subject of this season’s Hard Knocks, HBO’s wonderful mini-documentary series that follows a professional football team for the weeks leading up to the start of the season. There will be five episodes in total. Last night was the first, and it was good. I’m so excited.
I’m so excited to watch J.J. Watt do things and to listen to Coach O’Brien say things and to watch fringe players chase down dreams of becoming NFL players. I’m so excited to see what music they play and I’m so excited for the slow-motion shots of football moments because football moments make for the best slow motion. I’m so excited for the fight scenes (there are always fight scenes) and for the weird ephemera (there’s always weird ephemera) and for the things that are going to make for good talking points in February after the Texans win their first ever Super Bowl. There are so many things to look forward to. It’s all going to be so good. I’m so excited. Did I mention the Houston Texans are my team?
Some things that happened in the first episode:
The Best Contradiction
The show opened with a scene from a coach’s meeting the day before training camp started. The first thing Coach Bill O’Brien said was “Let’s be honest with each other,” and then just a few seconds later in that same speech he began to talk about how the two quarterbacks vying for the starting position, Brian Hoyer and Ryan Mallett, are both quality picks who will do very well when given the chance, which is a thing that a person not being honest would say.
Semi-related: The vigor with which O’Brien delivered his speech is unquestionable. I was super ******* fired up after it. Coach Bill O’Brien drops the f-bomb a lot.
The Most Unfortunate Ironic Moment
Near the 10-minute mark of the show, we get to the Arian Foster intro. It’s a workout scene, and in it Arian talks about how his brother, Abdul Foster, is in charge of his routine. Arian mentions that he chose him over everyone else in the country because Abdul knows Arian’s body type because they have the same body, so Abdul knows what Arian needs to keep him right. Fifteen minutes later, we watch Coach O’Brien learn that Arian has hurt his groin, and that he’ll be out six to 10 weeks because he needs surgery.
I can’t believe my beautiful Texans couldn’t even make it through the first episode of Hard Knocks without losing their best offensive player. I’m used to it, but I can’t understand it.
Who Should Start at Quarterback?
At the moment, it looks like it should be Brian Hoyer, although I freely admit that I arrived at that decision because Hoyer rhymes with words like “Destroyer” and “Lawyer” and “Employer” and, should you find yourself in the south, “Paranoia,” and all of those make for way better nicknames than anything Mallett-related. A mallet is pretty much the least intimidating of all the different types of hammers. It goes:
(1) Thor’s Hammer
(2) Sledgehammer
(3) Omar Epps as Black Hammer
…
(6) Hammerhead Shark
…
(9) Regular Hammer
…
(11) Ball-Peen Hammer
…
(40) Rock Hammer
(41) Rubber Mallet Hammer
The Most Dispiriting Stat
As a franchise, the Texans are 32 games under .500 (88-120) in regular-season games. I hadn’t realized that. I thought we were, at worst, 216-6.
The Most Surprising Thing
Near the end of the show, the Texans travel to Richmond, Virginia, to practice against the Washington Redskins. After the first day of practice there, there’s a dinner at the Governor’s Mansion. Dan Snyder, Redskins owner, was there. It was the first time I’d ever seen him on camera before. I was very impressed with how good he was at hiding his slimy, slimy tentacles.
The Best Unintentional Competition: The FUCKs Competition
This is the best of all the Unintentional Competitions that happened in the first episode. It’s Bill O’Brien versus linebackers coach Mike Vrabel. O’Brien is steady and staid in the delivery of his FUCKs. Sometimes they’re serious, like when he’s delivering a sermon to the team (“The only thing that matters in that ******* locker room is, ‘Are you willing to help?’”). Sometimes they’re exasperated, like when he was told that Arian Foster had hurt his groin (“… Oh ****”). Sometimes they’re fun, like when he said he ******* loved Rick Ross (“I ******* love Rick Ross”). But they’re all fluid and measured and nuanced and beautiful. He offered 12 FUCKs this first episode of Hard Knocks. Mike Vrabel, who received far less camera time, managed to fire out 13 of them, most coming in quick bursts aimed at incompetence like suppression fire. I’m very excited to see who wins. I’m going to keep count.
Series-Long Fuckometer
O’Brien: 12
Vrabel: 13
The Most Creative Way of Demeaning Someone
Mike Vrabel, talking to one of his players whom he felt approached a tackle a little too gingerly: “Throw a marshmallow at ‘em next time.”
A Sentence That Is Weird, With or Without Context, But Also One That Indirectly Asserts Why Hard Knocks Is a Wonderful Television Show
In this first episode, Vince Wilfork played catch with an elephant.
Sidebar: I love Vince Wilfork. I’ve loved him since March, when, a little over a week after it was announced he’d signed with the Texans, his wife posted a video to her Instagram account of him barbecuing and dancing to Lil’ Troy’s “Wanna Be a Baller,” an all-time great Houston rap song.
I respect him so much for that. Let’s do three more Vince Wilfork things:
The Most Accidentally Funny Scene That Involved Vince Wilfork
After the intro music and scene, it cuts to footage shot during a circus at NRG Stadium. During that, the narrator started talking about how the Texans signed a marquee player, veteran and two-time Super Bowl champion Vince Wilfork, and then as soon as he said Vince’s name they cut to a shot of a very large circus elephant. It stayed on it for a few seconds, then panned down and showed Wilfork.
The Most Expectedly Funny Scene That Involved Vince Wilfork
Vince Wilfork was playing pickup basketball. It was the most interesting game of pickup basketball I’ve ever seen. It was five-on-five, and men and women of all sizes and colors were involved. It was incredible. Better still was that during just the minute or so of it being shown, Vince Wilfork referred to himself as Michael Jordan, Vlade Divac, and Tim Duncan, the last of which he shouted while shooting a bank shot that ended up not even touching the rim.
All of the Things J.J. Watt Did This First Episode, Ranked
1. J.J. Watt solo workout montage. (100 football-boners for 100 nights.)
1a. J.J. Watt walking in slow motion over a bridge to the Texans practice field while Young Jeezy’s “Put On” played.
1b. J.J. Watt dismissing confrontational Washington Redskins WR Pierre Garçon by saying, “You’re maybe 112 pounds. You might wanna stay the **** back from the defensive line.”
1c. J.J. Watt flipping a mega tire that weighs 1,000 pounds. He said that in 2013, he was able to flip it one time. By 2014, he was up to 30 times. In 2015, he’s flipped it as many as 65 times.
1d. J.J. Watt shouting “Holding!” while being held during a scrimmage.
1e. J.J. Watt jumping on a table. This one was from a clip of Watt on Jimmy Kimmel Live, while the narrator was talking about how Watt is a scene-stealer on camera. As he jumped up on the table, a sound bite of Watt saying, “There’s no point in getting to the top of the mountain if you don’t enjoy the view every now and then” played. I like when things are literal and figurative at the same time.
1f. J.J. Watt hitting a slap shot while playing ice hockey.
1g. J.J. Watt being announced by Chris Pratt and Andrew Luck as the 2014 AP Defensive Player of the Year.
1h. J.J. Watt playing cornhole with his family.
1i. J.J. Watt being filmed by a lady wearing a J.J. Watt jersey with a cell phone with a J.J. Watt protective cover on it.
1j. J.J. Watt being hit on by a very loud, hoarse woman in the crowd while he practiced.
1k. J.J. Watt making fun of strength coach Sean Hayes while Hayes pretended to be Macho Man Randy Savage.
1l. J.J. Watt accidentally jumping offside in a drill.
1m. J.J. Watt commenting on the straightness of a painted line on the field.
1n. J.J. Watt taking off his shoulder pads and somehow not knocking off the hat he was wearing while he did it.
1o. J.J. Watt saying “Take that personal” after his defense got chewed out by defensive coordinator Romeo Crennel.
1p. J.J. Watt rapping along to Fort Minor’s “Remember the Name.”
The Most Interesting Person on the Periphery of the Show
It has to be rookie CB Kevin Johnson’s dad. Two reasons: (1) He has the longest neck I have ever seen on a human. It’s like Merton Hanks’s neck, but longer, which is a thing I never thought I’d say. (2) Dads who are watching their sons play football are always very interesting. They’re only ever super supportive in a good way or super supportive in an insane-person way. Either case makes for good TV.
All of the Rookies Shown on the First Episode, Ranked
1. Kevin Johnson, CB: He’s the most talented rookie and also, surprisingly, the most fiery. His very hard low hit on Washington Redskins fullback Jordan Campbell incited a team-versus-team fight at the end of the episode.
2. Chandler Worthy, WR: He has a very thick country accent and I always trust and care about people with thick country accents. Plus, he ran the 40-yard dash in 4.38 seconds, so he’s got a good shot at making the team.
3. Christian Covington, DT: Big Game of Thrones fan.
4. Benardrick McKinney, LB: His name is Benardrick.
5-8. Kenny Hilliard, RB; Lynden Trail, LB; Mike McFarland, TE; Dan Pettinato, DE.
The Saddest Moment of the Episode
Rewatching the episode, watching Arian Foster catch a pass and blow past a safety (and then gorgeously bark “Them shits ain’t fast enough” at the safety about his legs as he walked back toward the line of scrimmage after the play), and then realizing it’ll be about three months before you see him do anything like that again.
The Other Saddest Moment of the Episode
Watching talented linebacker Reshard Cliett tear his ACL after a bunch of people said nice things about how good he was going to be for the Texans this season.
The Most Houston Moment on the Episode
DeAndre Hopkins has become the new alpha receiver for the Texans (Andre Johnson, former franchise superhero, left for the Colts). During the scrimmage against the Redskins, he and Redskins CB DeAngelo Hall got into a confrontation after Hall said something to Hopkins about not being able to do against him what he’d been doing against the backup CBs (eating their lunches, basically). Hopkins responded by telling Hall to get away from him, to which Hall responded with aggression, to which Hopkins responded by repeating the phrase “I fear God” over and over and over again, and then abandoning that for a gorgeous “I’ll slap the **** outta you, too.” He went from Joel Osteen to Pimp C at a very impressive rate of speed. That’s a tier-one Houston move.
Note: In the next scene, which is just brilliantly shot and soundtracked, we see Hall and Hopkins square off in a pass play. Hopkins charges at Hall, then cuts out toward the sideline. When Hall tries to move with him, he hurts his ankle and crumples to the floor. Hopkins catches the ball, sees Hall on the ground, then jogs back toward his team. He says, “Damn, first day of pads, I’m already breaking ankles on the route, ****.”
I love you, DeAndre. I love you so much.
If Mallett isn't the guy, I think BOB will try to talk Rick into trading up for Hack.
stonewhite
Rookie
Anyone got a link to watch the episode?
Bulls on Parade
2017 Astros: Earn It!
Brisco_County
Apples and roadmaps
I only try to limit the F-word because it dilutes language. It's used too much and becomes filler. Like when you use the highlighter on almost the whole page, then nothing is emphasized.
Vance87
All Pro
The **** did you just say?
Patience. We haven't even played one preseason game yet. I don't think OB is counting him out yet. Who's to say that Mallet or Hoyer won't go down with an injury. One of em might even owe 600 bucks to a pissed off LB. Who knows what will happen.
I'd like to see Savage get the starting job, tbh. But even if he doesn't, with the way that injuries hit this team, betting that he doesn't start in any of the games this season would be a sucker's bet.
Last edited:
The Pencil Neck
Hall of Fame
I expected someone else to bring this up by now, but...
I think that the "fights" were more important than the practices for OB, and possibly for Gruden. I think it's part of OB's attempt to build up a "protect your brother"/"it's us against the world" mentality where everyone is looking out for everyone else. I think the coaches hyped everyone up to try to get them to that point where they'd go off on each other, the Redskins to prove that they're tough, the Texans to prove that they've got each other's backs.
I think that the "fights" were more important than the practices for OB, and possibly for Gruden. I think it's part of OB's attempt to build up a "protect your brother"/"it's us against the world" mentality where everyone is looking out for everyone else. I think the coaches hyped everyone up to try to get them to that point where they'd go off on each other, the Redskins to prove that they're tough, the Texans to prove that they've got each other's backs.
kiwitexansfan
Hall of Fame
W
Personally, that's the way it should be. If there isn't a guy out there that you're in love with... punt. It makes no sense to choose a guy because he's the lesser of evils. If he's not what you want, no amount of coaching is going to get him there. If you don't believe the guy is a champion... no amount of coaching is going to get you there & it doesn't matter what all the draftniks say.
The one caveat... he better win. Personally, I'm not too thrilled with last year's 9-7 record. I thought the schedule we had & Arian performing the way we did, 9-7 should have been the minimum. But because of the way OB ran the team... some of those Kubakian calls, sticking with Fitzpatrick, protecting Fitzpatrick.... getting rid of OD, alienating Aj, etc... we did the bare minimum.
I'm not thrilled with it, but he's a rookie HC, I'll let it slide. I do not think it's the major accomplishment some around here think it is.
But the point is, if he can win without that guy, we're better off when he does find the guy he can believe in. & I don't think he's against starting a young guy. I believe him when he said he didn't see much separation between several QBs in the 2014 draft... & frankly, I wasn't too excited about the guys in the 2015 draft.
Personally, that's the way it should be. If there isn't a guy out there that you're in love with... punt. It makes no sense to choose a guy because he's the lesser of evils. If he's not what you want, no amount of coaching is going to get him there. If you don't believe the guy is a champion... no amount of coaching is going to get you there & it doesn't matter what all the draftniks say.
The one caveat... he better win. Personally, I'm not too thrilled with last year's 9-7 record. I thought the schedule we had & Arian performing the way we did, 9-7 should have been the minimum. But because of the way OB ran the team... some of those Kubakian calls, sticking with Fitzpatrick, protecting Fitzpatrick.... getting rid of OD, alienating Aj, etc... we did the bare minimum.
I'm not thrilled with it, but he's a rookie HC, I'll let it slide. I do not think it's the major accomplishment some around here think it is.
But the point is, if he can win without that guy, we're better off when he does find the guy he can believe in. & I don't think he's against starting a young guy. I believe him when he said he didn't see much separation between several QBs in the 2014 draft... & frankly, I wasn't too excited about the guys in the 2015 draft.
Before Hard Knocks started, they promo'd the upcoming "Real Sports" with Bryant Gumble (sp?) they mentioned Rex Ryan's record was 46-50. Of course he wasn't happy about that. Including play-offs, his record is 50-52.
So then Hard Knocks comes on & OB mentions we're 96-126 (or something like that). I thought that was way out of wack, 30 games below .500 so I go & look at Kubiak's record as a head coach. He's 63-66, including play offs. Now, I don't care about Gary Kubiak. I'm just using his record as a head coach in relation to how that relates to the Texans for that period. eight seasons, from 2006 to 2013.
So if you add in last year's 9-7, the Texans are 72-73 over the last nine seasons. Which, imo, is more indicative of the Texans than the overall record. A winning record this season would get us above .500 over a 10 year period.
I don't think the fights serve any good purpose what so ever.
I liked what Vrabel said, "We're the nicest team I've ever seen, we're letting them clothsline our RBs & we do nothing." Paraphrasing of course.
When you get to the point of the fight, it's over. You've lost control, & you look like a bunch of kids.
I also like what Gruden had to say about it. The fights prevented them from getting another day of good work in (since they separated the teams & the final day was not Texans vs Redskins). Everything you put into getting the team together & going to Richmond was essentially for two days of practice, instead of three as originally planned.
I understand not getting pushed around. But keep it on the field. They want to clothesline your RB, turn up the physicality in the way you play.
To me, it's like hitting a batter in base ball. If the other team's pitcher hits your guy... everyone in the stadium should know one of their guys is going to get hit with a pitch soon.
Keep it on the field, keep it "part of the game"
xtruroyaltyx
Hall of Fame
Time will tell if that's the way "it should be".
We'll see if any of these qb's he's passed on develop into anything.
xtruroyaltyx
Hall of Fame
We'll see...
Right now savage isn't even running with the two's and OB has openly said one of mallet and hoyer will be starter and the other the back up.
When he goes on his qb rants about them being disrespected he talks about the two top guys. Doesn't mention savage.
We'll see. That would certainly be a surprising development to see savage get a start this year.
sandman
Brexit Advisor
There was no one who was going to pick Bridgewater at 1:1. No one.
eriadoc
Texan-American
All young coaches (young in the profession, not age) have holes in their game. How they overcome those holes and how they gradually eliminate them is one thing that determines success. The bigger thing, however, is what QB you hitch your wagon to. Kubiak improved along the way on things like in-game adjustments, challenges, time management, etc. The one irreversible mistake was hitching his wagon to Matt Schaub. He made lemonade with lemons and showed why he's a very good offensive coach, but in the end, he couldn't finish the job. Making QBs like Plummer, Griese, Schaub, Rosenfels look good (and even Yates and Keenum, relative to what they were) shows how good a QB coach the guy is, but that didn't make him immune to the QB rule in the NFL - get a real one.
All that to say, I'm OK with BO'B developing one until he's in a position to take a guy worth taking. His job and the success of the team is riding on it.
The Pencil Neck
Hall of Fame
Yeah, but he's saying if Smith+OB wanted him, they should have traded back up into the first to nab him before the Vikings did.
Doesn't matter if they do. Well... sort of.
If he doesn't believe in a guy, it doesn't matter, & isn't worth investing his time in him. Like if someone (say the owner) told the organization they will draft Johnny Manziel, or Vince Young. That coach most likely won't be able to help that guy be successful.
Now, if they felt like there was a guy he could win with, but they miscalculated the draft... they missed on a particular guy because they didn't capitalize on an opportunity, then that's different.
I don't care if Teddy Bridgewater goes on to win seven Super Bowls. Doesn't mean he would have won one on a team with a QB who didn't want him.
Nitrofish
Let The Big Fish Eat!
Yeah when he was still there, I was surprised they did not try to move up and get Teddy B. But perhaps O'Brien does not covet the guy so you cannot blame RS. If coach told him he was not interested in TB, then that was that. In my eyes, even though TB played well down the stretch last season. He still has much to prove, and this season there are no excuses. That team is loaded with talent.
Interesting. So you are saying he can try to make Fitz and Hoyer into a winner, but he couldn't have done it with Bridgewater?
I understand what you mean to a certain point, but if he doesn't find a qb he can win with, he might be out sooner than later.
paycheck71
Hall of Fame
The only time they passed on him was at #1. Would you have taken him 1st overall?
sandman
Brexit Advisor
That assumes a willing trade partner and tradable assets. Not quite the foregone conclusion that he is blaming Smith and OB for not making happen.
He won with Fitzpatrick. As long as he wins, it doesn't matter.
If I were a new NFL head coach like O'Brien, I'd rather put my job securtiy in my coordinators to be able to get football players ready to win football games, rather than trying to teach a QB how to play the game. Because that's where you're at if you're drafting one of these guys.
That's where Whisenhunt is. Even though he isn't new, he's out of a job if Mariota can't learn to play this game at a high level, relatively quickly.
I think it's funny how people will say, "We should do like Seattle...." but when we do, we're screwing up. Seattle didn't go out & find their franchise in the first or second year Pete Carroll was head coach. in 2010 he stuck with the incumbents, Hasselbeck & Whitehurst. In year two he went & got Tavaris Jackson. Year three, he brought in another FA vet to be his starting QB, but it just so happens he felt his 3rd round rookie could take his team farther.
I honestly don't know if Mike Munchak is a good head coach or not. He spent his whole career as an NFL Head Coach teaching a kid who can't play how to play.
The Pencil Neck
Hall of Fame
Technically, OB broke even with Fitzy (6-6), and with Mallett (1-1). He won with Keenum.
lol
Good points. I can't stop thinking about that scene on Hard Knocks where it showed OB's disgust at Mallet for throwing that interception. The Hard Knocks people knew about the QB competition going in, and in my view, that scene made it onto the show to give the viewers some insight to his thinking about how he will decide who gets the starting job.
I don't think I'm going out that far on a limb here when I say that the guy who gets it will be the one who makes the fewest mistakes, rather then the one who throws more passes for TDs.
Rookie QBs make lots and lots of mistakes. I know there's a few here that still have chapped cheeks that they didn't trade up to get Bridgewater. I seriously doubt if OB would have taken him even if he was there at 2.
You keep stressing to "keep it on the field" but at the same time recognize that we shouldn't get pushed around and don't want to be identified as the "nicest team". I think there can definately come a time where standing up for yourself will inevitably end up off the field.
In saying this I'm not advocating to start any fights that can throw off a practice like an out of control juvenile, just accepting that it really is just a part of the overall testosterone-fueled process of football and that while there may not be a direct purpose in the act of fighting itself there is a purpose in not backing down at times and sending a clear message to anyone else thinking of squaring off with you that it won't have a good outcome.
xtruroyaltyx
Hall of Fame
I find that logic wacky. But we're all entitled to our opinions.
If he's passing on qb's that go on to be good or great then he's not good at identifying talent.
xtruroyaltyx
Hall of Fame
I don't view kubiaks decision to get schaub as a failure. He identified a guy from afar...and he had the confidence in his eye for talent and his coaching to say that's my guy.
Where I find the mistake regarding qb play was not being able to move on when it was time.
This all started from the savage pick for me. I didn't like that pick. I love to be proved wrong in regards to things my team does that I don't like though. So we'll see.
Before there were any fights, Vrabel already stated the Texans were nice. Inferring the Redskins were tougher. The Redskins didn't need a fight to prove they were "tougher"
At the same time, reports were that the Redskins were upset, because Hilliard was running their guys over & Kevin Johnson was bringing wood. No fights needed.
I agree with you & everyone else, if they hit you (not a swing & miss) hit them back. Defend yourself. I don't know that the Texans didn't just retaliate. I'm not saying they were at fault for the fights.
I just don't think these fights prove anyone is "tough"
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You're making the situation sound far more cut and dry then it actually develops on the practice field. It very rarely goes from run of the mill bringing wood to all out swinging at guys. The escalation in between is where things get wonky and is sometimes very very hard to avoid unless someone were to back down completely.
Tell them in the middle of that escalation with a coach Vrabel (could be any coach) still in their head talking about marshmellows and their teammates watching and what they feel is their manhood being tested, all of which revolves around them staking their claim to even being there and able to earn their substantial paychecks, that it's as simple as "no fight needed". You, I, and anyone else can say that clearly from our comfy keyboards, emotions in check. Different story entirely on that field and in that environment.
Again, I'm not advocating to go out and look for bs confrontations to fight over. Just accepting that a physical, volatile place like an NFL practice field is geared to be at a pretty hot simmer at all times and will inevitably boil over from time to time.
But when Aaron Rodgers goes at 24, Joe Flacco at 18, Drew Brees in the 2nd round, Russell Wilson in the 3rd, Tom Brady in the 6th, & Tony Romo undrafted, we all say.... ah, but that's the exception, not the rule. We don't say several people, teams, organizations aren't good at identifying talent.
If your team sucks & you haven't won in half a dozen years or longer (like the Vikings) then yeah, go get a QB, any QB... whatever it takes, stabs in the dark, try to hit on something to get some wins on the board.
OB is obviously a little more specific & "good enough" isn't good enough.
Look at it this way. We didn't pull the trigger on Aaron Rodgers & Joe Flacco because we already spent our wad on another QB. What I see OB doing, is keeping us out of that situation.
I'm not saying the fights shouldn't have happened. I'm just saying I don't think it proves anybody is tough. Not our team, not their team. Like Gruden, I see a missed opportunity. Maybe some of that was on the coaches, maybe they shouldn't have done three days in pads...
That's all I'm saying.
eriadoc
Texan-American
I don't fault him for going after Schaub either. I wanted it to happen when people were saying no way it happens. But I draw a distinction between going after a guy and hitching your wagon to him. No way he could have predicted the specific injury that happened to Schaub or that it would essentially end his career, but it's not a stretch to predict injury in the NFL in general. I get the feeling O'Brien will have a backup plan that doesn't suck.
Like you, I'm in wait and see mode.
I guess I don't know what you mean by prove anybody is tough. Fair enough.
I do know that while I don't want the team to make a habit out of costing themselves practice time, if it takes ditching one practice to tell any other team, and the rest of the league, that we ain't that team to carry any kind of "soft" label then I'm all for it.
xtruroyaltyx
Hall of Fame
Someone gave those guys a shot so someone saw something in them. Maybe not enough at first to automatically make them the franchise from day one (in most of those cases they were), but I'm not ok with waiting for our Brady or romo. I'd settle for a flacco, Wilson, Rodgers, brees type pick. So far we haven't stepped out on that limb.
This discussion for me started with the savage pick. I was just not a fan of the pick.
We'll see how this all shakes out. Will be fun watching.
infantrycak
Hall of Fame
Take the religious stuff to the NSZ, actually anything but the general topic of cussing.
Heath Shuler
SPEED KILLS
"Let's get the f#ck outa Richmond"
I still can't fuckin believe how many are getting their bowels in an uproar over the cussing in Hard Knocks.
It's as if nobody around here has ever watched the show. smfh
How many? I lost count somewhere after 1.
Got to see the show last and loved it!! Much better than I anticipated, and I'm watching it tonight with my son, cuss words and all.
Speaking of which, seriously??!! My son's 7th grade coaches cuss worse than O'Brien. My son understands time and place. This is a chance to be a good parent. Teach instead of hiding them in a closet away from the real world.
And IT'S JUST A WORD, folks. It is a choice to be offended, so save your righteous indignation for something tangible like genocide, rape, child abuse, instead of being so thin f'kn skinned about WORD.
I loved O'Brien's facial animations! He's got that weird ability to make one eyebrow do something different than the other, and he's not doing it on purpose. His face just reacts.
I was going to say music, as well, and not just hard rock. I've been around a lot of different styles over the years, and it is inherent. Same with the transportation industry.
I was getting tired of J.J. the commercial guy selling crap, but I completely bought into J.J. the player on Hard Knocks. That dude is the real deal, and I kept being amazed that he's a HOUSTON TEXAN!!
Swear words originated from the common man many centuries ago. They are the people's words, created by regular folks and embraced by them. Your smug attitude is that of royalty, those who perceive themselves as better than everyone else, arrogance personified in your inability to find common ground and your chosen self-righteous indignation about mere sounds emanating from someone's mouth. That you choose to be offended and most others can accept it places me in good company.
Just glad you put the f'kn after "you" and not before.
Thanks for posting this article! This part cracked me up!!!
Speaking of which, seriously??!! My son's 7th grade coaches cuss worse than O'Brien. My son understands time and place. This is a chance to be a good parent. Teach instead of hiding them in a closet away from the real world.
And IT'S JUST A WORD, folks. It is a choice to be offended, so save your righteous indignation for something tangible like genocide, rape, child abuse, instead of being so thin f'kn skinned about WORD.
I loved O'Brien's facial animations! He's got that weird ability to make one eyebrow do something different than the other, and he's not doing it on purpose. His face just reacts.
I was going to say music, as well, and not just hard rock. I've been around a lot of different styles over the years, and it is inherent. Same with the transportation industry.
I was getting tired of J.J. the commercial guy selling crap, but I completely bought into J.J. the player on Hard Knocks. That dude is the real deal, and I kept being amazed that he's a HOUSTON TEXAN!!
Swear words originated from the common man many centuries ago. They are the people's words, created by regular folks and embraced by them. Your smug attitude is that of royalty, those who perceive themselves as better than everyone else, arrogance personified in your inability to find common ground and your chosen self-righteous indignation about mere sounds emanating from someone's mouth. That you choose to be offended and most others can accept it places me in good company.
Just glad you put the f'kn after "you" and not before.
Thanks for posting this article! This part cracked me up!!!
The Pencil Neck
Hall of Fame
Just glad you put the f'kn after "you" and not before.
Well... now that you bring it up...
& punching women.
When you watch it again, make note of the editing, and how they discover a particular story, and then go back through all the film, and pick out certain film that lays the foundation for the story.
For instance, Reshard Cliett blowing out his knee was a story. So they went back and dug up film of coaches praising his development as player. If he hadn't of gotten hurt, he probably wouldn't even gotten mentioned.
Foster tweaking his groin. They went back and dug up anything they could find that contributed to that story.
OB's disgust with Mallett on that interception. They are laying a HUGE foundation just with that scene.
Then you have J.J Watt, Wiffork, and Johnson's sister. Nationwide eye candy, in between the stories.
JCTexan
Hall of Fame
So is there anything to be taken out of the Hoyer scene where he blamed the Redskin jersey for playing like crap then he immediately fumbles in a Texans jersey?
BigBull
Rookie
El Tejano
Hall of Fame
In fact, you could probably even say that Kubiak hitching his wagon to Schaub hurt Schaub in reality. Kubiak had his wagon hitched so far up Schaubs butt that he didn't take him out of that game vs Tampa in 2011 and it cost us a Schaub that was playing pretty darn good on a team that was playing at a Super Bowl level and pretty much ended Schaub's career.