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D. Watsons leadership...

EllisUnit

Trump 2020
IMO Watson's PLAY isn't in question at all. He does more than the offense is otherwise capable of.

LEADERSHIP? Something I've mentioned before is he has Cam Newton's demeanor. Seeming to be quite isolationist ... instead of "rallying the troops" like we saw with Mahomes, he gives off the impression at the end of the bench of "I need some ME time".
That is exactly what I am saying, I am not questioning his ability or play making skills. Only what he is doing when on the sideline and the team is not doing great. And does he ever get mad ? Oline lets him get sacked 7 times, and he is still all smiles with the guys. I don't want a cry baby, but there is nothing wrong with a motivator !
 
I woke up today with something on my mind. As much as we talk about Watson being great (and he is) we just got plastered by the guy the Texans were hoping to get (Mahomes) and were (as usual) outmaneuvered for. We may be all tickled to death that Watson can do magic tricks but he is absolutely our consolation prize from that draft because the front office here is indecisive, slow, and stupid. When he isn't running for his life or building habits that make him look more like EJ Manuel than DeShaun Watson he's great but anyone who could look at their respective careers and say "Yeah, we got a guy who is just as good as Patrick Mahomes in the end so it's all good" must be self medicating.

Even the Texans knew the guy to get was Mahomes. They just failed to go get the guy. "Failed" is sort of a recurring theme where this franchise is concerned.
You're rewriting history, all reports at the time said that OB wanted Mahomes and RS wanted Watson. Since RS was making the call for the Texans by default Watson was the QB the Texans wanted. Watson was not our consolation prize he was RS's championship trophy. You're also forgetting a few very important details in your "Mahomes is better" argument.

1. Mahomes was able to sit his rookie year behind a good QB in Smith. Watson got Tom Savage and was thrown out there within the first 5 games with most fans wanting him to play first snap of game one.

2. Watson has had a paper wall for an O line for 2 of the 3 years he has been here and even this year they are better by far but they still aren't elite of even really good. Mahomes hasn't had a line like Dallas but his blockers at least don't break each others ankles.

3. Mahomes is the perfect QB to do the kind of scheme Reid wants to run. Watson by contrast is the exact opposite of OB's preferred style of QB. That's not to say one is right and the other is wrong its just oil and water. I really believe they like each other on a personal level and they are trying to make it work but OB doesn't like or know how best to use a duel threat QB and Watson can't pocket pass to save his life.

I think RS got Watson because he felt he would be here after OB was gone, everyone knew that was coming to a head and RS had the inside track, and he wanted a star QB there to help entice the kind of HC he wanted. Then the tragedy with his wife happened and suddenly football didn't matter but from the Texan's point of view we have a star QB that, while he maybe great, doesn't work with how we are set up or even how the HC wants the team set up but he's to good to just trade away.
 

Uncle Rico

Ur apology should be as loud as Ur disrespect was
LOLLLLL what do ya'll want Watson to do .. go scream and yell at the bench? That shows you're a true leader? Cuz he was friendly with one other guy on the team, who used to be on this team and who have love for one another - thats what shows bad leadership? Cuz he was smiling at all the cheap **** the Chiefs players were doing in the game? Thats a bad leader? I question if many of you have ever been in true leadership positions. I wonder how many among you truly understand the difference between responsibility and accountability.

Watson led by example. He did all his "rah rah" stuff before the game. for guys to question that with petty grievances is just par for the course around here. I feel great!! Deshaun Watson will be the franchise QB here for at least the next 10 years. We will win plenty along the way.

This was game #40 for Deshaun. (Brady - 285, Brees - 275, Manning - 266)

game related he wasnt sharp. He missed some easy throws. he held the ball at the wrong times. He was still out there trying to make plays. guys were folding up all around him. Nuk with the hurt ribs. The run game was abandoned. I mean the guy had to come to the sidelines to remind OBrien the situation and that going for it might be a better idea (then the genius wastes a timeout to make sure its a good idea lol). He ended the game with a 95.7 Qb rating and a 81.5 QBR didnt turn the ball over and left it out there. Nothing offered underneath. No Coutee as a surprise inclusion. No Carter. No Duke Johnson. No chance.

You cant give Deshaun an empty gun and tell him "go win the war" .. he can only pistol whip so many guys.

... AND he's a bad "leader" .. LMAO. Tell me who the last "good" leader this team has had?
 
I do have a question, last week we were all arguing over whether it was Watson's speech or Watt's sack that sparked the Texans with most seeming to think it was Watson's half time speech. So now we are saying he doesn't rally the troops and doesn't show any passion? Are we just so butt hurt that we are completely ignoring anything even approaching logic and lashing out at anything like a wounded animal.
 

Texas Jake

Rookie
I do have a question, last week we were all arguing over whether it was Watson's speech or Watt's sack that sparked the Texans with most seeming to think it was Watson's half time speech. So now we are saying he doesn't rally the troops and doesn't show any passion? Are we just so butt hurt that we are completely ignoring anything even approaching logic and lashing out at anything like a wounded animal.
I think that is the case.
 

TexansBull

Hall of Fame
IMO Watson's PLAY isn't in question at all. He does more than the offense is otherwise capable of.

LEADERSHIP? Something I've mentioned before is he has Cam Newton's demeanor. Seeming to be quite isolationist ... instead of "rallying the troops" like we saw with Mahomes, he gives off the impression at the end of the bench of "I need some ME time".
This.
 

thunderkyss

It's good to be me... again.
Staff member
Contributor's Club
Watson would have won a Super Bowl with KC last season.

We'd be questioning Mahomes leadership if he were here.

I think our offense is hamstrung with BO'b. I think Watson could have & should have tataken over that game & I don't know why he didn't.

He shouldn't have too. But this is where we are.
 

Hervoyel

BUENO!
You're rewriting history, all reports at the time said that OB wanted Mahomes and RS wanted Watson. Since RS was making the call for the Texans by default Watson was the QB the Texans wanted. Watson was not our consolation prize he was RS's championship trophy. You're also forgetting a few very important details in your "Mahomes is better" argument.

1. Mahomes was able to sit his rookie year behind a good QB in Smith. Watson got Tom Savage and was thrown out there within the first 5 games with most fans wanting him to play first snap of game one.

2. Watson has had a paper wall for an O line for 2 of the 3 years he has been here and even this year they are better by far but they still aren't elite of even really good. Mahomes hasn't had a line like Dallas but his blockers at least don't break each others ankles.

3. Mahomes is the perfect QB to do the kind of scheme Reid wants to run. Watson by contrast is the exact opposite of OB's preferred style of QB. That's not to say one is right and the other is wrong its just oil and water. I really believe they like each other on a personal level and they are trying to make it work but OB doesn't like or know how best to use a duel threat QB and Watson can't pocket pass to save his life.

I think RS got Watson because he felt he would be here after OB was gone, everyone knew that was coming to a head and RS had the inside track, and he wanted a star QB there to help entice the kind of HC he wanted. Then the tragedy with his wife happened and suddenly football didn't matter but from the Texan's point of view we have a star QB that, while he maybe great, doesn't work with how we are set up or even how the HC wants the team set up but he's to good to just trade away.
OK, I remember it wrong and concede the point. Whatever became of Rick after he won that trophy? So maybe he wasn't the Texans consolation prize. He was sure as hell Bill O'Brien's consolation prize. Rick's fate shows us all what happens when you cross ol' Butt-Chin too many times I think.

The rest of the list is all valid points but you know that in the NFL you take the cards you're dealt. What we do know is that any "card" that's dealt to Butt-Chin only goes so far. Mahomes is better and if that's the case because he's had a better situation to grow in then so be it. My intent isn't to dismiss Watson out of hand. It was to point out that the guy we were being dissected by was the guy (I thought) the Texans (apparently just O'Brien) actually preferred. I think Watson's great. I just think he'll never reach the kind of ceiling Mahomes already spends most of his time around. Not here.

If the man is smart he'll get out of here once the Texans control of him is done. That is if Butt-Chin is still his boss.
 

Scooter

Funky
LOLLLLL what do ya'll want Watson to do .. go scream and yell at the bench?

... AND he's a bad "leader" .. LMAO. Tell me who the last "good" leader this team has had?
The winningest QB is that a-hole berating his offense on the sideline. Not something I condone or want from Watson. Neither is the other extreme that he seems to exemplify by throwing a pity party for 1 at the end of the bench like Cam Newton is infamous for. There is no wrong, it's just opinion, but in my experience the most effective leader is active and a builder. Someone always working with and part of the group, encouraging, advising ... and that doesn't happen scowling alone at the end of the bench.
 

Uncle Rico

Ur apology should be as loud as Ur disrespect was
The winningest QB is that a-hole berating his offense on the sideline. Not something I condone or want from Watson. Neither is the other extreme that he seems to exemplify by throwing a pity party for 1 at the end of the bench like Cam Newton is infamous for. There is no wrong, it's just opinion, but in my experience the most effective leader is active and a builder. Someone always working with and part of the group, encouraging, advising ... and that doesn't happen scowling alone at the end of the bench.
im sure you've played the game. nothing comes across as more disingenuous and forced as a QB speech on the sideline when things are not going well. Watson is never too high and never too low, thats why his makeup is ideal in pressure situations as evidenced with his resume so far as a football player. Yesterday should have been yet another feather in his cap. Instead its being painted as if he was the player responsible for the collapse.

He inspired guys to be great prior to games. He does his "leadership" examples behind closed doors. Those guys that bark for the cameras are just hypebeasts.

You're not sure that what you are saying , is in fact .. not happening due to it not being plastered on SportsCenter. During the Buffalo game reports where that Watson was very vocal in the locker room at halftime. How do we know he didnt do it again yesterday? Oh thats right because the cameras would zoom in when he was just sitting trying to get warm LOL. Smh.

Mountains out of molehills.
 

Double Barrel

Moderator
Staff member
Contributor's Club
Watson is a talent that has the potential to do great things.

But, his career will be handicapped by Bill O'Brien.

No amount of leadership can overcome fundamental flaws in the overall organization of the franchise.

Watson doesn't design the schemes that he's expected to run. He doesn't put together game plans (much less this idiotic "game plan offense" nonsense), and he doesn't call plays or make the halftime adjustments.

Watson, by his lonesome, can only do so much when his talent is clearly weighed down in the mud by his head coach, general manager, and offensive coordinator, which just happens to be the same guy (even more indicative of the failure of the Texans ownership).

Watson, like AJ, Nuk, and JJ, will waste their careers in a backwater football franchise that brags about superficial nonsense (i.e. consecutive home game sellouts and the gameday experience).

Unfortunately, epic playoff chokes are now baked into this franchise and taints everyone involved.

Melt it down, get new blood, and then see what Watson is capable of achieving. Otherwise, yesterday is exactly where expectations should be set for this franchise.
 

Texecutioner

Hall of Fame
IMO Watson's PLAY isn't in question at all. He does more than the offense is otherwise capable of.

LEADERSHIP? Something I've mentioned before is he has Cam Newton's demeanor. Seeming to be quite isolationist ... instead of "rallying the troops" like we saw with Mahomes, he gives off the impression at the end of the bench of "I need some ME time".
That's an interesting theory. Not sure that I agree or disagree with that, but I certainly hope you're wrong. Cam Newton is not a guy you'd want him to be similar to leadership wise. Personally, I think QB"s have to go out there and become vocal at times. They've got to rally an offense at moments when the game can change or is changing. I've heard to many players tell stories about the QB's demeanor in huddles and their energy on the sidelines and the things different guys would say and do that would become effective to inspire confidence.
 

Texecutioner

Hall of Fame
im sure you've played the game. nothing comes across as more disingenuous and forced as a QB speech on the sideline when things are not going well. Watson is never too high and never too low, thats why his makeup is ideal in pressure situations as evidenced with his resume so far as a football player. Yesterday should have been yet another feather in his cap. Instead its being painted as if he was the player responsible for the collapse.

He inspired guys to be great prior to games. He does his "leadership" examples behind closed doors. Those guys that bark for the cameras are just hypebeasts.

You're not sure that what you are saying , is in fact .. not happening due to it not being plastered on SportsCenter. During the Buffalo game reports where that Watson was very vocal in the locker room at halftime. How do we know he didnt do it again yesterday? Oh thats right because the cameras would zoom in when he was just sitting trying to get warm LOL. Smh.

Mountains out of molehills.
There are players all over the league that tell stories who would disagree with you. Tom Brady has done it so many freaking times, and hell Mahomes was doing this just recently on the sidelines against the Patriots in a tight game where they won and he was effective in charging his team up.
 

TripleTap

Dead Wood
Watson is fine, maybe less disciplined than ideal, a little too schoolyard, but still way better than what we’ve had. The problem is the coaching, offensive and defensive. Until McNair takes care of that we’re one and out in playoffs, if we make playoffs. The difference between us and Chiefs yesterday was night and day. One team belonged there the other belonged at home in front of TV.
 
I woke up today with something on my mind. As much as we talk about Watson being great (and he is) we just got plastered by the guy the Texans were hoping to get (Mahomes) and were (as usual) outmaneuvered for. We may be all tickled to death that Watson can do magic tricks but he is absolutely our consolation prize from that draft because the front office here is indecisive, slow, and stupid. When he isn't running for his life or building habits that make him look more like EJ Manuel than DeShaun Watson he's great but anyone who could look at their respective careers and say "Yeah, we got a guy who is just as good as Patrick Mahomes in the end so it's all good" must be self medicating.

Even the Texans knew the guy to get was Mahomes. They just failed to go get the guy. "Failed" is sort of a recurring theme where this franchise is concerned.
Michael Jordan couldn’t win with garbage coaches. You give Watson a legit coach and I guarantee you mahomes will be forgotten.
 

Earl34

Rookie
You're rewriting history, all reports at the time said that OB wanted Mahomes and RS wanted Watson. Since RS was making the call for the Texans by default Watson was the QB the Texans wanted. Watson was not our consolation prize he was RS's championship trophy. You're also forgetting a few very important details in your "Mahomes is better" argument.

1. Mahomes was able to sit his rookie year behind a good QB in Smith. Watson got Tom Savage and was thrown out there within the first 5 games with most fans wanting him to play first snap of game one.

2. Watson has had a paper wall for an O line for 2 of the 3 years he has been here and even this year they are better by far but they still aren't elite of even really good. Mahomes hasn't had a line like Dallas but his blockers at least don't break each others ankles.

3. Mahomes is the perfect QB to do the kind of scheme Reid wants to run. Watson by contrast is the exact opposite of OB's preferred style of QB. That's not to say one is right and the other is wrong its just oil and water. I really believe they like each other on a personal level and they are trying to make it work but OB doesn't like or know how best to use a duel threat QB and Watson can't pocket pass to save his life.

I think RS got Watson because he felt he would be here after OB was gone, everyone knew that was coming to a head and RS had the inside track, and he wanted a star QB there to help entice the kind of HC he wanted. Then the tragedy with his wife happened and suddenly football didn't matter but from the Texan's point of view we have a star QB that, while he maybe great, doesn't work with how we are set up or even how the HC wants the team set up but he's to good to just trade away.
Ian Rappaport who usually reports on the Texans like he is O'Brien's personal PR guy was on the Sean Salisbury show and Salisbury could not get him to criticize O'Brien. Rapport says O'Brien moved up to get Watson. He is winning the division and making the playoffs more than many other teams. The key thing was Rappaport gave O'Brien credit for moving up to draft Watson. Go figure.
 

Texansballer74

Hall of Fame
The winningest QB is that a-hole berating his offense on the sideline. Not something I condone or want from Watson. Neither is the other extreme that he seems to exemplify by throwing a pity party for 1 at the end of the bench like Cam Newton is infamous for. There is no wrong, it's just opinion, but in my experience the most effective leader is active and a builder. Someone always working with and part of the group, encouraging, advising ... and that doesn't happen scowling alone at the end of the bench.
Big dog he’s not progressing whatsoever is what’s been spewed by a couple of members. We don’t need that so let’s get back to the Hoyer type, maybe bring back Fitzpatrick. Shoots Mallet is looking for a job.
 

JB

Old Curmudgeon
Contributor's Club
Here is a mic'd up version of Watson. I want everyone to listen at the :42 second mark. Hear what he is trying to tell O'Brien and Kelly. Watch O'Brien's reaction.

That was last year... why is he talking to Kelly?
 

santo

All Pro
Contributor's Club
Here is an interesting stat that was on the NFL site during their game with the 49ers. I guess we took the 16-0 comeback against the Bills for granted.

View attachment 5459
Prior to that OBs teams were 0-22 when trailing by 16 points or more after halftime and about to be 0-23 if it wasn't for Watson's heroics. Good thing we kept OB as GM so he can't fire himself. :hankpalm:
 

Uncle Rico

Ur apology should be as loud as Ur disrespect was
Here is a mic'd up version of Watson. I want everyone to listen at the :42 second mark. Hear what he is trying to tell O'Brien and Kelly. Watch O'Brien's reaction.

LMAO the student showing the teacher how the curriculum is flawed and the teacher not wanting to hear it. talking about the levels in the passing game and how it creates traffic jams on the field. stupid, STUPID way to deploy receivers. SMH.
 


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