Chris Mortensen on Carr in his chat

[infantrycak]

It was against Arizona. Carr had a total of 150 yards passing and zero TD's for the game. He audibled to the offtackle run just about every play in that half. It was by no means an All Pro performance... just another example of evisionist history.

Yeah, nice revisionist history--but by whom. I guess they most have run a hundred or so offensive plays that half so that Carr's 16 of 20 passing qualifies (93 of the yards) as the fraction left over from just about every play. Let's see 20 passing attempts in the 1st half--13 in the second half--nope no difference there.

 

[TwinSisters]

Why people try to attack Carr, I don't fully understand. Obviously, the past 1.5 seasons, he has played poorly. However, most people would also acknowledge that the former coaching staff was an utter failure.
All Mort was saying is that there exists among NFL personnel men a consensus that Carr posesses the QB tools to be a very good QB- he's not saying that he has been or will be a very good QB.

that's fair enough. The thing though is that few attack Carr ( this includes myself ).

When should I? and when should they? That is what I am asking you to educate me on.

Or let me re-state that... When do I have a logically sound reason to think my quarterback isn't going to be able to hack it?

Plummer is a pretty aggressive 'decider'. It took him what 6 or 7 seasons on a bad team, before he started to shine a bit in Denver. But he got a Pro Bowl alt bid in his second season before getting another last season.

Is Carr suppossed to be like that? And the Plummer bowl nod was a fluke bid back then?

 

[HoustonFan]

I'm hoping that Carr lives up to or exceeds what his supporters, myself included, thinks he can do.

The offseaon has been exciting though and I JUST CAN'T WAIT FOR THE SEASON TO START. NFL & COLLEGE!!!!

 

[thunderkyss]

that's fair enough. The thing though is that few attack Carr ( this includes myself ).

When should I? and when should they? That is what I am asking you to educate me on.

Or let me re-state that... When do I have a logically sound reason to think my quarterback isn't going to be able to hack it?

Plummer is a pretty aggressive 'decider'. It took him what 6 or 7 seasons on a bad team, before he started to shine a bit in Denver. But he got a Pro Bowl alt bid in his second season before getting another last season.

Is Carr suppossed to be like that? And the Plummer bowl nod was a fluke bid back then?

Nope, Plummer shined from day one.... it wasn't till his 4th, maybe 5th year that some thought he was ruined. Same with kitna, showed promise, but now........

Yeah, nice revisionist history--but by whom. I guess they most have run a hundred or so offensive plays that half so that Carr's 16 of 20 passing qualifies (93 of the yards) as the fraction left over from just about every play. Let's see 20 passing attempts in the 1st half--13 in the second half--nope no difference there.

I can't see the Wonger's reply....... I don't have him on ignore or anything??

Does he have me on ignore??

 

[Caphorn]

Bush's stats in the Rose bowl werent bad by any stretch of the imagination. And he would have had more than 100 yards rushing if he hadnt made that boneheaded lateral.[/b[

Rushing and Recieving, and considering that he had a spy on him the whole game.. Bush's stats were very good.

Mortenson is my new favorite talking head ..Looks like he actually did some research.

Not to dispute, but it does seem a bit silly to say that I'm underestimating how good Reggie is because I'm not including yardage from a play on which he made very possibly the defining BONEHEADED play of the game. Maybe QBs should be given credit for yardage on intercepted passes while we are at it?

Bush didn't have a horrible game against Texas. But it was the best defense he faced last year and he ran for 83 yards and his receiving yards were nto stellar (the fumbled play was a pass reception). I think people wrongly assume that with more carries he would continue at the same yards per carry. The FACT that USC used him so infrenquently meant you could not focus your D on stopping him. You really had to deal with a balanced attack in situations where the odds heavily favor that the play will NOT be run to Bush. So while Texas spied Bush, the defense was more designed to deal with USC's amazing passing attack. What we couldn't account for was Lendale White's ability to run it up the gut.

I actually like Reggie Bush. But I don't think anyone can easily conclude that he's a more talented runner than a between the tackles guy like DD (just like its not fair to conclude that VY is better than Carr.

 

[trutxn]

David Carr is a good player, but he has never been labeled a "phenom", not even in college. I have followed the Texans since they were only a hat, I loved the Oilers as well. When a team has a chance to draft a hometown hero they need to do it. Vince Young is the face of Houston and he is a real Texan. It would benefit the Texans to draft Vince and sit him a year behind Carr, let Carr prove his value as a number one pick and then trade next year for a top five pick. That would give the Texans two picks in the first round next year. That would also allow Vince to learn the entire playbook. Carr w/ Bush will not get us to the Super Bowl, sure our offense would be explosive, but that didn't help the Colts at all. The two additional picks for next year can be used to draft solid defensive help. One year of patience could turn the Texans into a dynasty, led by a real group of Texans!

 

[Master Po]

No disrespect Red, but when Bush was faced with a speedy D like Texas he ran off a whopping 83 yards. Against an NFL D, I'm not sure but I'd imagine his numbers are likely lower than that. He's not a between-the-tackles guy like DD. I just think that factor alone gives DD more value from an NFL perspective. So, maybe, for whatever reason, you've equated open-field running ability with NFL RB talent. Not the same though.

Yeah, on just 13 carries. Also had 6 receptions for 95 yds, and 279 total yds against that great Longhorn D.

 

[TwinSisters]

Nope, Plummer shined from day one.... it wasn't till his 4th, maybe 5th year that some thought he was ruined. Same with kitna, showed promise, but now........

mmm I don't know. I am looking over his stats and it looks like he got into trouble the third season. He didn't toss more TDs/INTs until 2001. He didn't start putting up numbers that you want see from a franchise QB until his first year in Denver ( franchise QB meaning somebody that's in the top ten of his position in the league ).

You could make a case that Plummer 'could' be ranked top 10.

Kitna I would kick out. I don't see how he compares to Carr. He has been fighting uphill the whole way. Even when he was winning, he had more people saying he's not worth it to the ones that said he was. Plus I don't believe anybody ever claimed him to be a franchise QB. ( at best a good QB )

The thing about Plummer is that he had national rep for being a good QB without really doing anything special on the field ( that often ). This is how Carr is right now. We expect him to be franchise QB and a killer... not a Dilfer.

That is what Mort is saying. That Carr is worth the franchise QB money.

CHECK THAT:
I expect Carr to be a top5 Qb for #1 over-all draft spot. Not just a journeyman OK QB.
Looks like Plummer was a second rounder

 

[trutxn]

That is were you are wrong. Way wrong. What Carr did with that Fresno team will never be forgoten, he is a King in Fresno and Bakersfield, even the whole state of California.

Carr played only 2 years, compare his 2 year stats to some guys that played 4 years or even compare just 2 years Carr kills.

You must be from Fresno. If Carr was all that in CA, the Texans would be getting a few more offers from the Raiders and Chargers. At least offers! And how come people can use Carr's college performance for support, but try to forget what Vince did? Carr is a good player, not great. I hope he does well, just not with the Texans. We need a player that is not going to run out of bounds behind the line of scrimmage, no matter who is chasing him. I will compare Carr's last four years with the Texans to anyone, O-line or not his numbers should be better with a receiver like Andre Johnson on the field. It took four games for Carr to even throw his way last year, whats up with that?

 

[Carr Bombed]

No disrespect Red, but when Bush was faced with a speedy D like Texas he ran off a whopping 83 yards. Against an NFL D, I'm not sure but I'd imagine his numbers are likely lower than that. He's not a between-the-tackles guy like DD. I just think that factor alone gives DD more value from an NFL perspective. So, maybe, for whatever reason, you've equated open-field running ability with NFL RB talent. Not the same though.

No disrespect Caphorn, but when Bush faced the speedy D that Texas ran he had a whopping 6.3 ypc avg. a higher avg. than Lendale White had in the game that so many people were praising, until his horrible pro day.

Bush wasn't stopped by Texas, he was stopped by Pete Carroll. For some reason Carroll freaked and started playing Capers ball, he went with White, because he thought he could just pound the clock out and it absolutely killed him. I really don't think Texas would of stopped Bush on 4th and 2, I'm a Texas fan and I can honestly say I don't think Texas would of stopped Bush on 4th and 2. When Texas saw Lendale back there they knew all they had to do was clog the middle, with Bush they wouldn't have been able to jam everybody up on the line to plug the middle, Bush could of made one cut and easily picked up about 6 yards or more towards the outide, which Texas left extremely undefended.

 

[mexican_texan]

which Texas left extremely undefended.

Because Mack wasn't worried about White making a six yard cut

 

[Grid]

Not to dispute, but it does seem a bit silly to say that I'm underestimating how good Reggie is because I'm not including yardage from a play on which he made very possibly the defining BONEHEADED play of the game. Maybe QBs should be given credit for yardage on intercepted passes while we are at it?

Because its two completely different scenarios. A closer comparison would be a QB that made a completion, but then the WR fumbled it when he got tackled. The QB did his job and made the play. Bush's boneheaded mistake was just that.. a mistake.. and its not something he has made a habit of doing. The point was that he broke a huge run there, and if he had just held onto the ball instead of trying to make that lateral.. he would have had better stats.

Bush didn't have a horrible game against Texas. But it was the best defense he faced last year and he ran for 83 yards and his receiving yards were nto stellar (the fumbled play was a pass reception). I think people wrongly assume that with more carries he would continue at the same yards per carry. The FACT that USC used him so infrenquently meant you could not focus your D on stopping him. You really had to deal with a balanced attack in situations where the odds heavily favor that the play will NOT be run to Bush. So while Texas spied Bush, the defense was more designed to deal with USC's amazing passing attack.

He would be used in a similar way here. he wouldnt be getting 30 carries per game. As for his stats against Texas, they have already been quoted here. He had a great game.. not an average one.

I actually like Reggie Bush. But I don't think anyone can easily conclude that he's a more talented runner than a between the tackles guy like DD (just like its not fair to conclude that VY is better than Carr.

You cant conclude that any rookie is better than ANY NFL talent. Bush may not be any better than Stacy Mack.. VY may not be any better than Ryan Leaf.. Williams may never be more than a 3rd stringer. Ya dont know. All you can do is make an educated guess, based on potential. Bush has the potential to be one of the best RBs in the NFL..if not THE best.

 

[hollywood_texan]

No disrespect Caphorn, but when Bush faced the speedy D that Texas ran he had a whopping 6.3 ypc avg. a higher avg. than Lendale White had in the game that so many people were praising, until his horrible pro day.

Bush wasn't stopped by Texas, he was stopped by Pete Carroll. For some reason Carroll freaked and started playing Capers ball, he went with White, because he thought he could just pound the clock out and it absolutely killed him. I really don't think Texas would of stopped Bush on 4th and 2, I'm a Texas fan and I can honestly say I don't think Texas would of stopped Bush on 4th and 2. When Texas saw Lendale back there they knew all they had to do was clog the middle, with Bush they wouldn't have been able to jam everybody up on the line to plug the middle, Bush could of made one cut and easily picked up about 6 yards or more towards the outide, which Texas left extremely undefended.

Bush basically made all of his yards on three plays during the game, not including that little catch he made on the second to the last play of the game.

My point is, Bush gets his nice average from 3 touches of his 15. The other 12 he probably doesn't average that high.

As for the 4 and 2 call, that was 2006 Trojan football. They used that play all year in similiar situations and against Texas in that game. Actually, that same play yielded a TD on a fourth down play in the second half.

I live in LA, went to the game, and enjoyed listening Trojan Confidential the next day on 710. Carroll said the 4 and 2 was the right play, all the talk show guys agreed, and most of the fans that called in also agreed. Their point was that play worked 8 of 10 times for them in 2006 and that's how they were in 2006, smash mouth football.

As for Reggie making a cut and picking up 6 yards, you should watch the game again. Reggie was held to bascially zero yardage several times on the play you described. I own the DVD and have watched the game several times. It is so enjoyable, espicially since I went to both of Vince Young's Rose Bowl performances.

LA has some upside from time to time, not taking into account the weather of course.

 

[Trenches]

this isnt meant to bash on Bush at all, but, lets remember that he got away with alot because of his speed. there is a BIG difference in the speed of defenders in the NCAA vs the NFL.

I'm not saying he cant run away from people, just that he wont have as big of an advantage as he had.

 

[Carr Bombed]

Bush basically made all of his yards on three plays during the game, not including that little catch he made on the second to the last play of the game.

My point is, Bush gets his nice average from 3 touches of his 15. The other 12 he probably doesn't average that high.

As for the 4 and 2 call, that was 2006 Trojan football. They used that play all year in similiar situations and against Texas in that game. Actually, that same play yielded a TD on a fourth down play in the second half.

I live in LA, went to the game, and enjoyed listening Trojan Confidential the next day on 710. Carroll said the 4 and 2 was the right play, all the talk show guys agreed, and most of the fans that called in also agreed. Their point was that play worked 8 of 10 times for them in 2006 and that's how they were in 2006, smash mouth football.

As for Reggie making a cut and picking up 6 yards, you should watch the game again. Reggie was held to bascially zero yardage several times on the play you described. I own the DVD and have watched the game several times. It is so enjoyable, espicially since I went to both of Vince Young's Rose Bowl performances.

LA has some upside from time to time, not taking into account the weather of course.

You can slice it any way you want, Bush had more than 3 big runs, he had 3 0f 9 or more a 18 yarder and a 26 yard scamper down the sideline for a td.

As far as the Trojans being a smash mouth football team, that isn't true, they were a high scoring, fast moving team, not smash football.

Its true Reggie was held to zero yards a couple of times, but that has nothing to do with the play I described, both Reggie and White should of been on the field, in the plays where Reggie was stopped they had sideling to sideling defensive coverage, in the play where they denied White they stacked the line and drove straight through the middle plugging the run, that kind of defense would of not stopped Bush cutting to the outside, sorry, it wouldn't.

As far as you calling 4th and 2- the 2006 Trojans, thats not true either, its true they gambled in games, but they gambled with their best players, The Bush Push, the entire Fresno State game, ect. The fact that Bush wasn't put in position to make a difference was a complete brain fart on the coaching staff. Even if he didn't get the ball on that play, just him being on the feild would of forced Texas to draw more coverage to the outside.

I also have the game on tape, I've watched it over 10 times....I love that game.

Also you saying that most people agreed going for it on 4th and 2 is a little misleading, yes most people agreed that it was right to go for it on 4th and 2, but a overwhelming majority agreed it was a bad idea not to have Bush on the field.

Bush isn't percieved as a pounder, the reason why he will be taken with the first ovrl. pick is because he is a gamebreaker, he multiple big runs in that game both passing and receiving. Texas went into the game keyed on Bush, that was evident from the first play of the game and he still walked away with a 6.3 ypc avg. If it wasn't for his bonehead play, we might be celebrating a different champion right now.

 

[Carr Bombed]

this isnt meant to bash on Bush at all, but, lets remember that he got away with alot because of his speed. there is a BIG difference in the speed of defenders in the NCAA vs the NFL.

That can be said for just about every blue chip prospect in this draft, especially VY.

 

[trutxn]

Davis is "average" NFL talent - very good for a fourth round pick, but nothing special. While I agree that Bush has to prove himself at the next level, I would rather start a season with him in the backfield than DD - just my personal preference. However, next year when DD goes down to yet another injury and we have Morency "tearing it up," we very well might regret not taking Bush...

Thank you for opening the door! Dominack Davis (DD) has ran behind the same terrible line that David Carr has. DD has been consistant even with his injuries while Carr has regressed behind the same offensive line as DD. DD has been 50% of the Texan offense each of his years, with the same team as Carr. Not only is DD in the backfield but Verand Morency is a speedy and shify change of pace back that can flourish in Kubiak's system. With the addition of Kub's new staff, it sounds to me like the running game will be fine with the addition of a few linemen.

The proof above would suggest that Carr is just "average" talent. Not any more average than DD, right? The Texans need a proven leader to lead them into battle. Someone who they know will dedicate their heart and soul to the team and city. Everyone in the state of Texas wants it to happen. The Texans should be at Vince's front door letting him know that he is the future of the Texan Organization. Vince Young is the face of Houston, he has roots that run deep in Texas, as do many of the new coaches. With Kub's guidance, Vince could become an unstoppable offensive weapon. Both of them would end up with bronzed statues in front of Reliant and their names on a lot of trophies.

I have season tickets to the Texans' games, and I make every game, no matter how good or bad they play. The stadium may be sold out, but its only half full (better than half empty). The fan support is not in the stadium on Sundays. Sure, Reggie would bring in many fans, although Vince would fill the stadium, the practice bubble, the parking lots, and the rest of Reliant Park. Texans love cheering for other Texans, and many times the rest of the U.S. does not understand. Maybe thats why everyone in Texas is praising Vince, while the rest of the football world has been attacking every aspect of his life. People don't like the truth, and Vince is it!

Real Texan football fans have been astonished by Vince Young's abilities since he was a child in pop warner football. We have followed his career from Madison, to UT, and hopefully finishing with the Texans. Vince is not capable of failing on the football field, no matter how many people insult his abilities. He has been a leader and a winner at every level and he will continue to do so. Reggie is not a Texan savior, Vince is, no matter what team he ends up with.

I would trade 5 more years of Carr's career for 10 more years of Vince's career any day. Carr will get better, and can definatly succeed in the NFL, but the ponding he has taken thus far will definatly shorten his career by a year or two. Ask Troy Aikman. The Texans need to groom Vince for a year, have Carr prove his value, and then trade him for a very high pick next year. Unless they choose to get another pick this year. After a 2-14 season we must face that we are rebuilding. How long we want to wait and how great we want to get is the unanswered question until draft day.

Don't be mad world when the Texans become IN-VINCE-IBLE!

 

[Texans_Chick]

this isnt meant to bash on Bush at all, but, lets remember that he got away with alot because of his speed. there is a BIG difference in the speed of defenders in the NCAA vs the NFL.

I'm not saying he cant run away from people, just that he wont have as big of an advantage as he had.

Jerome Mathis.

Small school prospect. Questionable coaching. Not much experience. Not the best hands. Injured for much of the season.

But when he played, in the NFL, for a non-good team, you dint want to be outta of your seat getting beer.

Speed can make a difference in the NFL. That kinda speed. Plus moves. Plus hands. Plus strength. Plus confidence. Let's just say that since it has seemed just about inevitable Reggie Bush will play for the Texans, I've been imagining what is possible. A "Mathis +++++" It could be crazy sick--and that is not an exaggeration.

 

[Texans_Chick]

The Texans need to groom Vince for a year, have Carr prove his value, and then trade him for a very high pick next year. Unless they choose to get another pick this year. After a 2-14 season we must face that we are rebuilding. How long we want to wait and how great we want to get is the unanswered question until draft day.

The problem with your scenario is that if Carr proves his worth, then he should stay. If Carr is sucko, then he has no trade value.

I love VY and agree with many of the points about his ability that you make, but I am guessing that there would be a lot of people wanting to see RB play.

 

[trutxn]

The problem with your scenario is that if Carr proves his worth, then he should stay. If Carr is sucko, then he has no trade value.

I love VY and agree with many of the points about his ability that you make, but I am guessing that there would be a lot of people wanting to see RB play.

Carr doesn't have as many playing years left, he is nearly in the middle of his career. Vince could prove his value over Carr, while Carr does enough to get us another great player to join Vince next year. Carr is not the leader that Vince is if given the same opportunity.

Reggie will be great as well, for about 6-7 years. I'll take Vince's 10.

 

[TwinSisters]

The proof above would suggest that Carr is just "average" talent. Not any more average than DD, right? The Texans need a proven leader to lead them into battle. Someone who they know will dedicate their heart and soul to the team and city. Everyone in the state of Texas wants it to happen. The Texans should be at Vince's front door letting him know that he is the future of the Texan Organization.

Carr has given to the city. And we don't turn our backs on Sam Houston because he was from Virginia and Tennesse. Right?

So the Vince shouldn't have anything to do with the way we should treat Carr.

Carr is our man.

So I will kick it your way too. If Mort says that David Carr is still like Carson Palmer and Peyton Manning... how long are you going to keep him in the saddle before you call for change?

You are going to have to at least give him one season to dispel the bad coaching creedo. So is it 1, 2, or 3 seasons? Why would you go over 1?

 

[mexican_texan]

Carr doesn't have as many playing years left, he is nearly in the middle of his career. Vince could prove his value over Carr, while Carr does enough to get us another great player to join Vince next year. Carr is not the leader that Vince is if given the same opportunity.

Reggie will be great as well, for about 6-7 years. I'll take Vince's 10.

I would say Carr is 1/3 through his career.

 

[trutxn]

Carr has given to the city. And we don't turn our backs on Sam Houston because he was from Virginia and Tennesse. Right?

So the Vince shouldn't have anything to do with the way we should treat Carr.

Carr is our man.

So I will kick it your way too. If Mort says that David Carr is still like Carson Palmer and Peyton Manning... how long are you going to keep him in the saddle before you call for change?

You are going to have to at least give him one season to dispel the bad coaching creedo. So is it 1, 2, or 3 seasons? Why would you go over 1?

As good as Carr can be, Vince can be better. I have watched and played football my entire life. What some sports broadcaster says is not going to change my opinion. Bottom line is Vince's career will overshadow Davids when both of their careers are over. Vince is just better, it is hard for people to face that.

Reggie will be great as well, but the QB position is the most important position on the field. Reggie will touch the ball 10-15 times a game, Vince will touch it every single play. The odds are better with Vince.

 

[trutxn]

I would say Carr is 1/3 through his career.

I'd say Vince is just starting!

 

[Trap_Star]

As good as Carr can be, Vince can be better. I have watched and played football my entire life. What some sports broadcaster says is not going to change my opinion. Bottom line is Vince's career will overshadow Davids when both of their careers are over. Vince is just better, it is hard for people to face that.

Reggie will be great as well, but the QB position is the most important position on the field. Reggie will touch the ball 10-15 times a game, Vince will touch it every single play. The odds are better with Vince.

Does somebody have a man-crush on Vince???

 

[trutxn]

Carr has given to the city. And we don't turn our backs on Sam Houston because he was from Virginia and Tennesse. Right?

It doesn't matter, neither one played Texas football. No disrespect to Sam, because he did a lot for TX. But if you grew up in Texas and played the game, you know what I mean.

 

[TwinSisters]

As good as Carr can be, Vince can be better. I have watched and played football my entire life. What some sports broadcaster says is not going to change my opinion. Bottom line is Vince's career will overshadow Davids when both of their careers are over. Vince is just better, it is hard for people to face that.

I don't pick bones with you at all about those observations...

but we do have Carr. If you are signing the checks, what are you going to say to Carr? I mean if you are there in the stands and Carr is walking by... how are you going to justify in your mind telling him to beat it?

 

[trutxn]

Does somebody have a man-crush on Vince???

Just a true Texan as you can see, I'm not a sell out, I just support people from my state. And if an explanation is needed you wouldn't understand.

 

[Wharton]

It's funny, as I've spoken to these proven talent evaluators in the league, the consensus among them is that there have been only three "true" top-pick quarterback talents since 1998 - Peyton Manning, David Carr and Carson Palmer. Carr was mentioned by almost all of them. They had other issues on offense.

This is the most rediculous statement I've heard in a long time. Just because Carr was a consensus "true" top-pick doesn't mean squat now that he has been in the league for four years. The proof is in the play, and frankly, Carr stunk up the joint last year. I just hope the front office knows what its doing because I have my doubts.

The Broncos' system that Kubiak has brought to the Texans has never called for stud O-linemen. The running game offers the protection; also, the talent on hand is better than most people think.

Another rediculous statement. The Broncos' system calls for a different type of o-lineman. Just because they aren't 350 lbs, doesn't mean they're not studs. Also, the running game doesn't offer protection to the passing game. The Texans actually had a decent run game last year, but it didn't offer any protection to our passing attack. Every team had our number last year by just sending a run blitz covering all the gaps. Our offense line was so porous on pass protection; it effectively shut down our passing game.

"the talent on hand is better then most people think" Must have been an Acid flashback!

 

[TwinSisters]

It doesn't matter, neither one played Texas football. No disrespect to Sam, because he did a lot for TX. But if you grew up in Texas and played the game, you know what I mean.

I did. You won't be getting any mouth from me on that subject.

But you know... we had kids move in from Louisiana and California and places like that growing up. We didn't kick them off the team for how they were born either. I mean if somebody showed up and could play... it was on.

Hell in Houston half the time my team was made up of Vietnamese and Korean dudes!

But if they cried too much or couldn't play... they had to go find something else to do.

Now certainly if a David Carr was your QB, you aren't going to like the idea of the mayor's son taking his role... just because he is the mayor's son.

 

[Trap_Star]

Just a true Texan as you can see, I'm not a sell out, I just support people from my state. And if an explanation is needed you wouldn't understand.

Who's a sell out....

 

[trutxn]

I don't pick bones with you at all about those observations...

but we do have Carr. If you are signing the checks, what are you going to say to Carr? I mean if you are there in the stands and Carr is walking by... how are you going to justify in your mind telling him to beat it?

Carr has been great for Houston, but he hasn't provided, he has regressed. I know he hasn't had a great supporting cast, but he had enough to do more. I was at the games last year, it looked like he gave up at times. With Kubiaks coaching Carr will be good, and Carr knows this. He will benefit from the learning experience alone. Then they can tell him that they'll see him when he comes back to town.

 

[trutxn]

I did. You won't be getting any mouth from me on that subject.

But you know... we had kids move in from Louisiana and California and places like that growing up. We didn't kick them off the team for how they were born either. I mean if somebody showed up and could play... it was on.

Hell in Houston half the time my team was made up of Vietnamese and Korean dudes!

But if they cried too much or couldn't play... they had to go find something else to do.

Now certainly if a David Carr was your QB, you aren't going to like the idea of the mayor's son taking his role... just because he is the mayor's son.

Vietnamese dudes, Korean dudes, and the mayor's son are not Vince.

 

[Roughnecks]

Lets face it VY is good but as far as saying he will be all that next year come on. You can sit hear and say RB was good in college because the speed is much slower than in the NFL the same can be said about VY the o-line the coaches and schemes from last year and the new every thing this year VY would have trouble getting away. RB is faster than VY and would get a head start VY would drop back than would have to run do you really think he is going to break a 60 yard run no and please give DC some credit the kid has taking a beating since we sign him and at times would take a hit to get the first down, is he great no not yet but I see him doing great things down the road. Are we a playoff team next year I do not think so and yes I bleed steel blue but I see improvement even with our schedule and next year when everybody has a year of the new Off. and Def. we will be a handful we have good coaches now new Def., a great off season and a really good draft class coming up we have a lot of upside coming but do not be ready to run DC out of town if we do not make it to playoff next year.

 

[Carr Bombed]

It doesn't matter, neither one played Texas football. No disrespect to Sam, because he did a lot for TX. But if you grew up in Texas and played the game, you know what I mean.

What the heck are you talking about. Football is a game played all over America, not just Texas. Most of the greatest players that played the game have absolutely nothing to do with Texas and if you really want to use "Football" states as your argument, California is pumping out the same level of product, as is Florida.

Its these kinda statements that make outsiders think we are dumb hicks. "We can't take him or he can't play on our team, uh because, He don't play Texas' ball".

 

[Runner]

What the heck are you talking about. Football is a game played all over America, not just Texas. Most of the greatest players that played the game have absolutely nothing to do with Texas and if you really want to use "Football" states as your argument, California is pumping out the same level of product, as is Florida.

Its these kinda statements that make outsiders think we are dumb hicks. "We can't take him or he can't play on our team, uh because, He don't play Texas' ball".

Not to mention QB country is Western PA/OH.

 

[trutxn]

What the heck are you talking about. Football is a game played all over America, not just Texas. Most of the greatest players that played the game have absolutely nothing to do with Texas and if you really want to use "Football" states as your argument, California is pumping out the same level of product, as is Florida.

Its these kinda statements that make outsiders think we are dumb hicks. "We can't take him or he can't play on our team, uh because, He don't play Texas' ball".

You show me a 24 hour Super Wal-Mart outside of Texas that will shutdown for a highschool football game.

Enough said.

 

[thunderkyss]

mmm I don't know. I am looking over his stats and it looks like he got into trouble the third season.

Kitna I would kick out. I don't see how he compares to Carr. He has been fighting uphill the whole way. Even when he was winning, he had more people saying he's not worth it to the ones that said he was. Plus I don't believe anybody ever claimed him to be a franchise QB. ( at best a good QB )

Looks like Plummer was a second rounder

Stat wise you're right....... neither were really amazing. Watching them, though was totally different. They both looked like they were ready to break out at anytime. Using their legs, and their arms making plays, carrying their team.....

You'd watch them, and you'd say, "man if they ever get this kid some help" no one was talking about their offensive line. They had the ability to get themselves out of trouble, keep plays alive, and make the play down the field.

Neither were/are however strong leaders.a

Because its two completely different scenarios. A closer comparison would be a QB that made a completion, but then the WR fumbled it when he got tackled. The QB did his job and made the play. Bush's boneheaded mistake was just that.. a mistake.. and its not something he has made a habit of doing. The point was that he broke a huge run there, and if he had just held onto the ball instead of trying to make that lateral.. he would have had better stats.

He was on the one...... why wouldn't he just put his head down, and drive through?? he had 80 yards of momentum built up....

I don't talk much about that play........ it's not the ill advised lateral, Vince did the same thing......... got away with one. But what running back wouldn't push through 1 guy...... 2.... maybe even three, from the one??

Carr has given to the city. And we don't turn our backs on Sam Houston because he was from Virginia and Tennesse. Right?

Carr is our man.

Signing Vince Young, or Reggie Bush, means we've got to get ready to say good bye to either Carr or DD. One of the other is going to go. Yeah, you can play DD & Reggie on the same down, but that wont' happen very long. It will be one or the other.

If either of these two guys earned their keep, it's DD.

 

[trutxn]

Not to mention QB country is Western PA/OH.

Not any more. I do agree that CA and FL are good football states. But football is like religion in Texas.

 

[kbourda]

For once i'd like to see Mr. Bush play where he is the featured back, period. And not sharing time. I hope we all get a chance to see that.

 

[Carr Bombed]

You show me a 24 hour Super Wal-Mart outside of Texas that will shutdown for a highschool football game.

Enough said.

Wow thats a great argument, lets take a player, because his hometown Walmart shuts down on friday nights. What exactly does that have to do with the heart and drive in a football player that lives and plays outside of Texas. There are kids all across America that train, sweet, and bleed just as much as any kid inside this state.

To think that a prospect is subpar just because where he grew up is extremely close minded and ignorant.

This isn't High School Football, its the NFL

 

[Mr. White]

Man...just to think of all the time I've spent pimping VY while refuting the "Homer argument."....."naw man, it ain't where he's from, it's the wins."

"Texas ball"... I guess it IS where he's from.

 

[kbourda]

That is were you are wrong. Way wrong. What Carr did with that Fresno team will never be forgoten, he is a King in Fresno and Bakersfield, even the whole state of California.

Carr played only 2 years, compare his 2 year stats to some guys that played 4 years or even compare just 2 years Carr kills.

HEY Trap_Star, this is the definition of a man-crush!

 

[kbourda]

For once i'd like to see Mr. Young play a game where he plays under center, and not playing in an option based offense, and playing in an NFL style offense and not scrambling half the time. I hope we all get a chance to see that.

We all will. And you'll love it.

 

[TwinSisters]

of upside coming but do not be ready to run DC out of town if we do not make it to playoff next year.

What does he have to do to not be run out of town? Or deserve to be run out of town?

I am saying he hasn't done anything yet to deserve it ( since we blame it all on the coaching ). If you have a guy telling you to do all the wrong things and you do all the wrong things... well then how can you say the guy is bad?

 

[tulexan]

I must have missed Joe Montana, Jerry Rice, Dan Marino, Lawrence Taylor... being from Texas

 

[thunderkyss]

mmm I don't know. I am looking over his stats and it looks like he got into trouble the third season.

Kitna I would kick out. I don't see how he compares to Carr. He has been fighting uphill the whole way. Even when he was winning, he had more people saying he's not worth it to the ones that said he was. Plus I don't believe anybody ever claimed him to be a franchise QB. ( at best a good QB )

Looks like Plummer was a second rounder

Stat wise you're right....... neither were really amazing. Watching them, though was totally different. They both looked like they were ready to break out at anytime. Using their legs, and their arms making plays, carrying their team.....

You'd watch them, and you'd say, "man if they ever get this kid some help" no one was talking about their offensive line. They had the ability to get themselves out of trouble, keep plays alive, and make the play down the field.

Neither were/are however strong leaders.a

Because its two completely different scenarios. A closer comparison would be a QB that made a completion, but then the WR fumbled it when he got tackled. The QB did his job and made the play. Bush's boneheaded mistake was just that.. a mistake.. and its not something he has made a habit of doing. The point was that he broke a huge run there, and if he had just held onto the ball instead of trying to make that lateral.. he would have had better stats.

He was on the one...... why wouldn't he just put his head down, and drive through?? he had 80 yards of momentum built up....

I don't talk much about that play........ it's not the ill advised lateral, Vince did the same thing......... got away with one. But what running back wouldn't push through 1 guy...... 2.... maybe even three, from the one??

Carr has given to the city. And we don't turn our backs on Sam Houston because he was from Virginia and Tennesse. Right?

Carr is our man.

Signing Vince Young, or Reggie Bush, means we've got to get ready to say good bye to either Carr or DD. One of the other is going to go. Yeah, you can play DD & Reggie on the same down, but that wont' happen very long. It will be one or the other.

If either of these two guys earned their keep, it's DD.

 

[kbourda]

What does he have to do to not be run out of town? Or deserve to be run out of town?

I am saying he hasn't done anything yet to deserve it ( since we blame it all on the coaching ). If you have a guy telling you to do all the wrong things and you do all the wrong things... well then how can you say the guy is bad?

Honestly, I believe Carr is a lifetime QB here. Good or bad. I really hope he does well next year considering the commitment the franchise made to him. I have to see it on the field. You can tell me for so long about this and that. Show me. That's all i'm saying.

 

[kbourda]

Man...just to think of all the time I've spent pimping VY while refuting the "Homer argument."....."naw man, it ain't where he's from, it's the wins."

"Texas ball"... I guess it IS where he's from.

To quote my legendary hip-hop poet..........."It ain't where you're from, It's where you at!"

 

[Roughnecks]

Hey I like VY and I am a Aggies fan but he is not going to be a Texan being from Houston on knowing what that Oiler did to us ( @#$%*&^ Bud Adams) he should try to be a Oiler oops I mean a Titian and just suck it up for him a little pay back for the folks back home. JK I hope he makes it were ever he goes. LETS BRING BACK THE HOUSE OF PAIN DAYS PLEASE!!!!!