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Byron or Carr
- Thread starter Jagsbch
- Start date
texasguy346
Mod Squad
I've got to go with David. Byron may have to start the year off without Fred, and could be without him all year. Carr has DD, and Morency should provide a little help when DD gets dinged up. Having a good running game will go along way in how well a QB will perform. IMO The Texans still have the edge when it comes to WRs, and any QB that has AJ making catches for him has a good chance of having a very good season. We still have Gaffney, Bradford, and Armstrong. The addition of Mathis only strengthens our WR depth as we still have Starling who performed well at times last year. The Jags WRs will need to become more consistent, and Williams will need to show he was worth a 1st Round pick last year. Jones could be a very good WR, or he could be just another combine champion.
Jagsbch
Waterboy
gwallaia said:
Actually this poll is going just as I expected...
I think that Having Jimmy to throw too, is a better option than AJ, Jimmy proved that much last year, remember the poll I started? How AJ went to the Pro Bowl ahead of Jimmy is beyond me. It made it all too clear in my eye's that performance on the field is not the criteria the NFL uses to send players to the Pro Bowl~!! :brickwall
I think Byron is far and away a better QB than Carr, I will be willing top go as far as saying that Byron will have a better season than Peyaton this year. Byron is just as tough as Carr, having proved that with a broken leg in college.
Just keep the poll rolling, not that I don't have confidence in Carr, it's just that I hold Byron in the highest esteem. I think that our division has the best QB's of any division in this league.
TexanFanInCC
Veteran
Jagsbch said:Actually this poll is going just as I expected...
I think that Having Jimmy to throw too, is a better option than AJ, Jimmy proved that much last year, remember the poll I started? How AJ went to the Pro Bowl ahead of Jimmy is beyond me. It made it all too clear in my eye's that performance on the field is not the criteria the NFL uses to send players to the Pro Bowl~!! :brickwall
I think Byron is far and away a better QB than Carr, I will be willing top go as far as saying that Byron will have a better season than Peyaton this year. Byron is just as tough as Carr, having proved that with a broken leg in college.
Just keep the poll rolling, not that I don't have confidence in Carr, it's just that I hold Byron in the highest esteem. I think that our division has the best QB's of any division in this league.
Jimmy Smith is already near the twighlight at his career. Andre Johnson is clearly a better option to throw to. hes bigger, stronger, proly more athletic, and definitely younger.
TexanFanInCC
Veteran
this is my non-bias opinion....david carr has the edge over byron leftwich. carr has never lost a game to byron. carr is clearly more gifted physically, not to mention, he has waaaaay more mobility than leftwich. carr may also be more durable than leftwich. leftwich is too injury prone, and being a pocket QB like himself doesnt help matters. the only thing that byron has working for him is an established team with a stellar defense that allows him to get more snaps bc they keep the opposing offense off the field. carr's recieving core is also alot better than the jags. your best reciever is already fixing to get to the downhill of his career. he can still be a great performer, but AJ is definitely the better guy at this point and the WR depth of the texans is way better. If our offensive line can actually protect david carr instead of giving up 6 sacks per game (as was the case versus the stinking browns last yr.), then carr should put up some pretty solid numbers.
FILO_girl
I'm not here
ROFLMMAO!Hulk75 said:
They had a thread over at Jag central that Lefty was being traded to the Texans awhile back. *pause for the laughter to subside*
http://www.jaguars.com/mb/default.aspx?f=6&p=1&m=409784 (other thread is gone due to cleanup, and so are my posts on the above thread. THAT is funny!). Wish they still had the original thread.
Anyway, I had told them we didn't need an anchor here, we needed wheels. They believe he has wheels. Funny lot, they are.
Jagsbch
Waterboy
TexanFanInCC said:
How you can say AJ is clearly a better option to throw too is beyond me. Jimmy did more to help the Jags win last season than AJ did for the Texans. The only thing clear is that you were not paying attention. Everything your are saying was said and proved wrong last season, and now that Jimmy has three excellent WR's to help take the heat off of his back, and a OC who is going to untie Byrons hands, the sky is the limmit for both Jimmy and Byron this season.
TexanFanInCC
Veteran
so ur sayin that u would rather have jimmy over AJ??
Jagsbch
Waterboy
ojthecat said:Hey Jagsbch, I have one word for you and both of your Jag lovin friends.
SCOREBOARD
Look the Jaguars have always been known for their playing down to teams, Texans pretty much proven this Reality. For some reason the Jags have had a rough time getting it up for the Texans, Maybe we feel sorry about how the whoel Tony deal went down, or we just want to make our division look tough, or who knows, but I suspect this reality will be a thing of the past. I just love how you all gloat about us playing down to you, I guess I won't feel bad smacking you all around when we sweep you all this season, but don't feel bad we will be sweeping the entire division.
~!!
TexanFanInCC
Veteran
take a look at AJ's numbers during the last 4 weeks of 2004...
week 14 vs colts...3 rec. 34 yds.
week 15 at bears...2 rec. 31 yds.
week 16 at jags...4 rec. 46 yds.
week 17 vs browns...2 rec. 13 yds.
if david carr would have thrown to him the same amount of times he did in the earlier part of the season, AJ could have finished with 90+ catches and nearly 1500 yds. too bad our o-line stank late last yr.
week 14 vs colts...3 rec. 34 yds.
week 15 at bears...2 rec. 31 yds.
week 16 at jags...4 rec. 46 yds.
week 17 vs browns...2 rec. 13 yds.
if david carr would have thrown to him the same amount of times he did in the earlier part of the season, AJ could have finished with 90+ catches and nearly 1500 yds. too bad our o-line stank late last yr.
TexanFanInCC
Veteran
Jagsbch said:Look the Jaguars have always been known for their playing down to teams, Texans pretty much proven this Reality. For some reason the Jags have had a rough time getting it up for the Texans, Maybe we feel sorry about how the whoel Tony deal went down, or we just want to make our division look tough, or who knows, but I suspect this reality will be a thing of the past. I just love how you all gloat about us playing down to you, I guess I won't feel bad smacking you all around when we sweep you all this season, but don't feel bad we will be sweeping the entire division.
spoken like a true homer....
its not our faults that yall play down to teams....it just means that ur team has some issues.
and theres no way that yall are going to sweep indy.
Jagsbch said:
The numbers between the two are almost equal. Jimmy Smith has been 75-80 catch, 1100 yard machine over his career. That said, I am still looking for the 3 good WRs to help him. Wilford made two exciting catches and nothing else. Matt Jones is a big time project. Reggie Williams had the worse season for any WR who was a clear starter on his team. Smith is descending and AJ assending. Age alone make AJ a more attractive commodity.
Honestly, they would be great compliments to each other (Jimmy Smith and AJ), but that is not possible.
texansfan88
Rookie
I was objective and chose Leftwich.
His O coordinator will let him throw down field
His O coordinator will let him throw down field
Jagsbch said:For some reason the Jags have had a rough time getting it up for the Texans, Maybe we feel sorry about how the whoel Tony deal went down, or we just want to make our division look tough, or who knows, but I suspect this reality will be a thing of the past. I just love how you all gloat about us playing down to you, I guess I won't feel bad smacking you all around when we sweep you all this season, but don't feel bad we will be sweeping the entire division.
That's a pathetic, reaching excuse. The Texans haven't won against the Colts yet so does that mean we're playing down to them? I don't know what this playing down means but I do know what stinking up the place means.
TexanFanInCC
Veteran
Jagsbch said:
If yall have 3 excellent recievers, then jimmy smith shouldnt have been used as much. reggie williams was a disappointment for the jags, and ernest wilford was only made famous bc of his week 1 catch. the reason y jimmy did more to help yall was bc yall HAD to throw to him. we had at least 4 different guys help us significantly in the passing game....jabar gaffney, corey bradford, derrick armstrong, domanick davis...yall didnt really have a recieving threat at the RB position...
TexanFanInCC
Veteran
we didnt have to use AJ as much, but when we HAD to go to AJ (as was the case vs. the vikes), he came up clutch (to say the least) with his 12 catches for 170 yds. and 2 TDs
texasguy346
Mod Squad
Fiddy said:
That's priceless.
Jagsbch
Waterboy
Fiddy said:
I should have said diamonds in the rough
Look when I said excellent I meant what is coming down the pipe, know and understand that our receiving corp is going to be one of the best in the league this season. This revelation will be all too clear when the season starts, this is why I went ahead and drew up yet another sinking sand thread. Jaguars will make the Patriots so-called dynasty look like a fluke, by not just barely winning games week in and week out, but by crushing our opponents offensively as well as defensively~!! Crushing opponents is hardly the Patsies trait, that is why I am hardpressed to consider them a dynasty.
You have to understand that Reggie and Ernest are going into their second season, I also think that Matt is going to come out of the gate firing on all cylinders this season, any one that thinks he will be a project has no idea what they are talking about IMO. Matt is an Awesome football player, he by no means looked like a project WR in the Senior Bowl.
The stats last year do more to reflect just how aweful our OC was than anything else. Bill failed to call a game that utilized his talented on the team, that is why he was firedl, Last years statistal reality on offense is about to do a flip flop. The players are actually coming out and saying how they hated the scheme last season and how much they are looking forward to this seasons scheme.
Blake
MMQB
Jagsbch said:
Just like yall crushed opponents in last years wins?
Sep 12 @Buffalo Won 13-10...............= 3 points.
Sep 19 Denver Won 7-6.....................= 1 point.
Sep 26 @Tennessee Won 15-12..........= 3 points.
Oct 17 Kansas City Won 22-16............= 6 points.
Oct 24 @Indianapolis Won 27-24.........= 3 points.
Nov 14 Detroit Won 23-17..................= 6 points.
Dec 12 Chicago Won 22-3..................= 19 points.
Dec 19 @Green Bay Won 28-25...........= 3 points.
Jan 2 @Oakland Won 13-6..................= 7 points.
rittenhouserobz
Veteran
I geuss we are installing more 3 and 5 step drop passes. I think the offense will thrive this year. The Jags DL is impressive this year. I sure hope the adjustment works. I was really hoping we could have signed Orlando Pace.
WildBlackBear32
Rookie
Your post need more cowbell!
WildBlackBear32
Rookie
"Jimmy is not only still playing in his prime..."
I was rolling on the ground laughing at this statement.
I was rolling on the ground laughing at this statement.
texasguy346
Mod Squad
Jagsbch said:
Just when I thought it couldn't possibly get funnier. Seriously you've got to cut it out. I nearly fell out of my chair after reading this. I'm all for optimism, and you've got to support your team. However, when you're optimism starts to borderline on dillusion then it might be time to consider wearing the game day Jags helmet on a regular basis 24/7.
Jagsbch
Waterboy
WildBlackBear32 said:
How else can you explain Jimmy out playing AJ last season?
Look here is the deal, Jags gave Indy all they could handle when in their transition from Cap hell as well as a New Rookie HC. Now that we are entering another 3-4 year prime mode, I hardly think that they or any one else will be able to match what we bring to the table week in and week out.
Byron has been snuffed the past few years now that he has a OC who will allow him to manange the game, this is a whole new ball game for the Jags. We are so far under the Radar that it is not even funny, this is a team about to unload both a great offense as well as a great defense on the NFL. Yes you heard it right, Great!~!!
We have the fastest tallest WR in the league, the mismatches we will create with all of our huge WR's are going to reak havoc for defenses, and our D-line is one of the best in the league, so you can forget about running the ball on us that is for sure... Man I can't wait till you all see wat is coming down the pipe...
throwANDREtheBALL
Waterboy
There is no way that I could go onto the JAGS board and start a thread about two guys that were obviously pretty close in talent and age and say that the Houston guy was WAY better and then keep backing up my thread with more Drunkenly-Biased points on why I was right.
I have to admire your courage, sir.
The jags are truly lucky to have you as a FAN.
AND since your points have consistenly tickled me with laughter I have to break down and say YES.
BYRON LEFTWICH IS THE BETTER QB.
AND HE WILL OUTPLAY PEYTON MANNING THIS YEAR, YOU ARE SO RIGHT.
THE JAGS WILL OUTPLAY AND DOMINATE EVERYONE ON THE FIELD AND ON THE SCOREBOARD.
Hey man, I'm no dummy, I never let my prescription of STUPID PILLS run out.
I have to admire your courage, sir.
The jags are truly lucky to have you as a FAN.
AND since your points have consistenly tickled me with laughter I have to break down and say YES.
BYRON LEFTWICH IS THE BETTER QB.
AND HE WILL OUTPLAY PEYTON MANNING THIS YEAR, YOU ARE SO RIGHT.
THE JAGS WILL OUTPLAY AND DOMINATE EVERYONE ON THE FIELD AND ON THE SCOREBOARD.
Hey man, I'm no dummy, I never let my prescription of STUPID PILLS run out.
You seem to have a lot of confidence in Carl Smith. Considering that he hasn't been an OC since '96 with that dynamic New Orleans Saints offense. Why did Del Rio hire the USC QB coach when Norm Chow, the USC OC, was available? That's the question I'd be asking if I were a Jags fan (heaven forbid). Oh, and how is Fred Taylor's knee doing?Jagsbch said:
The poll? Based on his career record of 4-1 vs the Jags, I'll have to go with David Carr.
THEFUTURE
Rookie
WHAT! ummm leave the jags and their tendencies back at your own site please, yeah thanks... anyways i am here now to completly obliterate you and any chance you have of winning this arguement, kinda like the Texans verse the Kitties. I just love how you can possibly come up with one of the lamest excuses i have ever heard, sweeping the entire division? yeah good luck, you just got your butts handed to you last year by us, and dont hand me the playing down speech again, its garbage... scoring 6 points in two games is not playing down, hell for the jags i guess you should be proud of scoring 6 points. maybe you and the other 4 jag fans that decide to show up at your own stadium, missed something when the Texans walked all over you. .. Jimmy Smith better than AJ... hmmm maybe when jimmy was like in his twenties and AJ was a teenager... but jimmy smith is a 30 something player, that only gets stats cuz the rest of your WRs cant do anything on the football field... AJ on the other hand is a WR that commands double and triple teams for teams to slow him down. When AJ goes to the pro bowl, it shows that fans, coaches, and players either 2/3 or all of them agree that AJ is better than Jimmy Smith.... Byron better than David, uhhh Carr is more accurate, stronger arm, faster, smarter... doesnt say stupid lines like.."whatchu talking bout willis?"... if Slow Motion Byron Leftwich was behind our line he would have about 250 sacks, instead of davids 170Jagsbch said:Look the Jaguars have always been known for their playing down to teams, Texans pretty much proven this Reality. For some reason the Jags have had a rough time getting it up for the Texans, Maybe we feel sorry about how the whoel Tony deal went down, or we just want to make our division look tough, or who knows, but I suspect this reality will be a thing of the past. I just love how you all gloat about us playing down to you, I guess I won't feel bad smacking you all around when we sweep you all this season, but don't feel bad we will be sweeping the entire division.
Porky
Hall of Fame
Jagsbch said:
I think the word you are looking for is wreak. But, after reading your takes, the word for your posts that comes to mind is more like reek. Since I know you are a Jags fan, I'll excuse you if you don't know the meaning of either of these. If intelligence was money, you would be homeless, and begging for a dime on the side of a road somewhere.
Jimmy-1172, 6TD's
Andre-1142, 6TD's
Here's your other recievers stats:
Wilford: 271 (2TD)
Williams: 268 (1TD)
Now the Texans #2, #3, and #4 recievers:
Bradford: 399 (3TD)
Gaffney: 632 (2TD)
Armstrong: 415 (1TD)
So no wonder Reggie had nice stats, he was the only one worth throwing to.
Andre-1142, 6TD's
Here's your other recievers stats:
Wilford: 271 (2TD)
Williams: 268 (1TD)
Now the Texans #2, #3, and #4 recievers:
Bradford: 399 (3TD)
Gaffney: 632 (2TD)
Armstrong: 415 (1TD)
So no wonder Reggie had nice stats, he was the only one worth throwing to.
Jagsbch
Waterboy
Lucky said:
Fred's knee is coming along according to schedule, but until he shows up there is really no telling...
Now to answer your question regarding Chow...
Remember back in the day when men were men and QB's like Marino called their own plays kind of like how Peyton does with his audibaling abilities? Well Byron used to do that back in college where ran the Fun and Gun. But when he came to the NFL Bill tried to turn him into something he wasn't. Musgrave tried to taske him out of the shot gun, and forced him to run a predictable dink and dunk offense, and offense mind you that didn't allow Byron to Audible. Well we all know what happened after that? It didn't work, then Bill started a make shift offense that was designed to run the WCO out of the Shot Gun, never been done before, and it failed miserably as our offense wound up having the worst scoring offense in Jaguar history.
Well Jack knew he needed to get a guy in here who would help cater to Byron's stle of play rather than bring a guy in who would force byron to be something he is not. Byron is a shot gun style QB, Chow does not operate his offense out of the shot gun, something woulod have to give if we brought Chow in, that is why he was never given an interview in the first place. What we needed was someone with experience and was conservatve enough to know what would and wouldn't work with an offense looking to go wide open.
Jack has a highly intelligent QB who has a rocket for an arm, what he needed was someone who could polish Byron and help him manange the game. Byron is a diamond in the rough, what bill did was cut too deep, Bill proved he had no idea how to utilize the depth of a players talents, or attack teams weakness' with play calling.
Bill never let Byron audible, but Byron managed to sneak a few audibles in regardless, Once backed in our own endzone to wind out breaking the ball out all the way to our opponents side of the field and all the other audibles went for TD's if you can believe that or not, in spite of that Bill refused to let Byron audible and it killed us.
All Jack did by bringing Carl in was to allow Byron to be all he could be, rather than a guy who would try and force Byron into his game plan. I thought it was an excelent move and so do the players who implementing Smiths game plan, they rave about the route tree and how the offensive game plan is designed with scoring on 5-7 plays rathe rathan 10-12. Jimmy went as far to say as scoring on one play~!!
So Byron pretty much dictated how Jack went about choosing an OC, We are building the team around Byron, not Chow~!!
Right now the NFL in general is completely oblivious to waht is about to take place now that Byron is playing Byrons game and not some makeshift scheme from an OC who was fired his 4 week with the Panthers...
jr0ck
Waterboy
i can't believe everyone missed this gem...
all i can say is...
WOW
i mean it's actually easier to put on teal glasses and see the jimmy is better than AJ *cough*LOLOLOLlDlOTLOLOL*cough* right now in jags homer vision than try and see any part of this perspective. note to Jagsbch: WINNING is WINNING. not only is this what the patriots have done to solidify themselves as a dynasty, in the era of free agency mind you, but it's also what the jaguars have lacked doing against the texans in our short history. also, "playing down" to a team is not a trait asscociated with excellence, in fact it's far worse than not having enough talent to win. "playing down" to a team means you have the upper hand/advantage but don't utilize it. it's like forgetting to breathe...your fully capable but just don't. in 1337 speak, YOU PHAIL!!!
dalemurphy
Hall of Fame
Jagsbch said:How else can you explain Jimmy out playing AJ last season?
Look here is the deal, Jags gave Indy all they could handle when in their transition from Cap hell as well as a New Rookie HC. Now that we are entering another 3-4 year prime mode, I hardly think that they or any one else will be able to match what we bring to the table week in and week out.
Byron has been snuffed the past few years now that he has a OC who will allow him to manange the game, this is a whole new ball game for the Jags. We are so far under the Radar that it is not even funny, this is a team about to unload both a great offense as well as a great defense on the NFL. Yes you heard it right, Great!~!!
We have the fastest tallest WR in the league, the mismatches we will create with all of our huge WR's are going to reak havoc for defenses, and our D-line is one of the best in the league, so you can forget about running the ball on us that is for sure... Man I can't wait till you all see wat is coming down the pipe...
I don't know what to expect from the Jags this year... Somewhere between 6 and 11 wins is about the best I can do. I think a lot of Leftwich, though last year he really struggled down the stretch, I thought. However, I wouldn't have so much faith in Reggie Williams. Physical specimens don't always turnout to be dominate football players: Michael Westbrook, David Boston, Tony Mandrich... I thought he was going to be a very good WR, but then I watched him play last year.
fastest WR in the league? who?
I'd put about even odds on one of the Jags/Texans being able to overtake the Colts for the division. It's going to be a fun season. Do us both a favor, though. When you play INDY, make sure those big nasties on your DL cheap shot Manning like they do Carr.
throwANDREtheBALL
Waterboy
Its nice to see a team building around the players rather than forcing them to change how they play the game. I hope for Jagbych sake that the offense does explode under the new OC. And I think that if we had more Texans fans like this that we'd all be able to call ourselves Texansbychez.
throwANDREtheBALL
Waterboy
But why would we want to ?
I'm no ones bee-y-atch.
I'm no ones bee-y-atch.